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Lip Man 1
09-12-2006, 12:33 AM
Interesting story on the Tribune web site tonight. Mark Gonzales is reporting that Ozzie told him the only outfielder guaranteed of a starting spot next season is Dye and that the off season priority is going to be 'speed,' since the Sox have a heavy hitting middle of the batting order.

I certainly agree with the notion of the Sox getting two or three guys who can steal 20 bases or so each, maybe more...kind of like the Sox teams of the early 90's which had Johnson, Raines, Ozzie (before his surgery), for a while Sax and Cora.

Lip

slavko
09-12-2006, 12:39 AM
Nothing there we didn't know already. We do have a bunch of station-to-station whales clogging the middle of the lineup. I'm not complaining, they can hit.

kevingrt
09-12-2006, 12:40 AM
Move Mr Fields to outfield in winter ball and have a battle of Owens, Anderson, Fields, Gload, Mackoviawk, Pods, whoever else wants to join in on the fun next season for LF, CF and the leadoff position. And that is if we don't get Soriano, Lee, or someone of the starting caliber.

ND_Sox_Fan
09-12-2006, 12:46 AM
Move Mr Fields to outfield in winter ball and have a battle of Owens, Anderson, Fields, Gload, Mackoviawk, Pods, whoever else wants to join in on the fun next season for LF, CF and the leadoff position. And that is if we don't get Soriano, Lee, or someone of the starting caliber.

Nothing like a little competition.

Soriano is probably the only major FA who fits into the speed qualification here. I really don't want to see Lee back.

I am fine with a Sweeney, Fields, Owens, Mack competition for left. To me, only a player with comparable defense AND a better stick replaces BA in center.

TheOldRoman
09-12-2006, 12:48 AM
Move Mr Fields to outfield in winter ball and have a battle of Owens, Anderson, Fields, Gload, Mackoviawk, Pods, whoever else wants to join in on the fun next season for LF, CF and the leadoff position. And that is if we don't get Soriano, Lee, or someone of the starting caliber.
Are you ****ing kidding me? Didn't we go through that already?
1) Someone will pay him twice what he is worth
2) He was traded for a reason, and not all of it was money. It is a fat, lazy, seflish player who doesn't hustle and has a bad attitude. That is just the guy we DONT need.

As for the rest of it, I think Anderson will still be starting. Ozzie just wants Brian to play winterball, and this is his way of pressuring him to do so. As for left field, we will definately have a new LF, and I don't think he will be from within the organization. Fields might play a little LF in the winter, but the Sox want him to develop his defense as a 3B because Crede is no sure thing based on his health and impending free agency. Either way, we need a new leadoff hitter, and he will either play left or short.

Sox-o-matic
09-12-2006, 03:02 AM
Nothing like a little competition.

Soriano is probably the only major FA who fits into the speed qualification here. I really don't want to see Lee back.

I am fine with a Sweeney, Fields, Owens, Mack competition for left. To me, only a player with comparable defense AND a better stick replaces BA in center.

Screw competition, use a couple of those guys to get Carl Crawford.

Grzegorz
09-12-2006, 05:18 AM
Unless Anderson implodes, I see Anderson and Dye starting in the outfield. I also thought I read that BA was going to play winter ball with Raines managing that team down in Venezuela.

Left field is open and all I care about is that the player in LF be able to hit and run, bunt, steal, and play solid defense.

The "station to station" guys are in the middle of the order: AJ, Konerko, and Thome... I do not see any of those three going anywhere.

I want more base path aggression and bat control from my middle infields too.

Ozzie says many things; it's getting harder to separate the wheat from the chaff.

soxtalker
09-12-2006, 06:49 AM
Interesting article, though I get the impression that may not be the outfield situation that is driving things. Rather, it sounds like the Sox are trying to give themselves options to hang onto Fields (and give him major league experience) while they sort out Crede's back problem.

INSox56
09-12-2006, 11:09 AM
I think it could go a number of ways. We've got two guys in Owens and Fields who could play LEFT....I don't have much confidence in either over BA defensively. The problem then arises between those two in left...we REALLY want Owens' speed, but Fields is looking like a pro. I think their defensive skills out there may be the kicker.

Glad I'm not Kenny, we've got so many good options in our system as well as those that are borderline trade-worthy (uribe, pods, half the bullpen)

102605
09-12-2006, 11:29 AM
How about getting Rocco Baldelli (http://tampabay.devilrays.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/team/player.jsp?player_id=408306) ? He has a huge upside and is finally healthy.

Huisj
09-12-2006, 11:31 AM
didn't fields steal 20-some bases this year at AAA? Is he relatively speedy?

Domeshot17
09-12-2006, 11:31 AM
Im not a big Jerry Owens fan. I hope he proves me wrong, but I think hell be nothing more then you're average nook logan who has blazing speed solid D but cant hit mlb pitching.

The guy im really excited for who could possibly bring enough speed, great D, some power and average is Ryan Sweeney. I know its only been a few at bats, but the kid has such a good looking approach. He is a little hesitant right now, but he doesnt look like hes about to crap his pants (which Brian did). I really could see Sweeney taking over in left, pods staying around as a fourth OF, and the sox picking up orlando cabrera to lead off and play short.

Chicken Dinner
09-12-2006, 11:32 AM
I sure wish Ozzie would stop commenting on next seasons players, this year. He needs to shut his yap and motivate what he has this year. Any comment about next year is distructive at this point.

INSox56
09-12-2006, 11:36 AM
I really like Sweeney. I agree on Owens, he doesn't yet strike me as the type that's gonna really make it big...well, big enough to what we need. Sweeney seems very professional and calm, two good things that you need as a rookie. If he's got some speed, that's a great option down there. I just remember him dominating in ST, talk about impressive.

I also agree with Baldelli. As Kenny has done in the past and others mentioned....he's not afraid to deal the Sweeneys, the Owenses, though doubtfully the fieldses in our system. Too bad Anderson sucked it up somewhat, I love the guy, but there's no way that if Sweeney ends up replacing him, we could trade him...after this year his value is shot till he could either put up good numbers in the minors or something else.

southside rocks
09-12-2006, 11:38 AM
I sure wish Ozzie would stop commenting on next seasons players, this year. He needs to shut his yap and motivate what he has this year. Any comment about next year is distructive at this point.

And if Ozzie is asked about players and positions next year, what should he say?

"I can't talk about that now"?

And then the story gets written "Ozzie refuses to guarantee JD a spot in the lineup next year!! Will the potential MVP be playing in New York in 2007?!?!"

A lot of the stuff that's getting shoveled here comes from the press, not from Ozzie. I am pretty sure Ozzie is not seeking out reporters and saying "want to know what I think about Brian Anderson today?"

The "news media" is trying to build tension and excitement, and so they ask Ozzie questions, and being Ozzie, he replies.

minutia
09-12-2006, 11:40 AM
I have kind of thought it would be cool if we could get Grady Sizemore for center and Hawk and DJ were talking about that very thing, albeit briefly, on Sunday. He would be a great defensive and offensive strength and Hawk and DJ seemed to think that he was not untradable from Cleveland. But this could just be my pipe dream.

Chicken Dinner
09-12-2006, 11:46 AM
And if Ozzie is asked about players and positions next year, what should he say?

"I can't talk about that now"?

And then the story gets written "Ozzie refuses to guarantee JD a spot in the lineup next year!! Will the potential MVP be playing in New York in 2007?!?!"

A lot of the stuff that's getting shoveled here comes from the press, not from Ozzie. I am pretty sure Ozzie is not seeking out reporters and saying "want to know what I think about Brian Anderson today?"

The "news media" is trying to build tension and excitement, and so they ask Ozzie questions, and being Ozzie, he replies.

How about "I'm just focusing on the next 18 games right now". "Ask me when the season is over".

Pretty simple.

Grzegorz
09-12-2006, 11:47 AM
Lets keep Sweeney around; he throws very well. Sweeney is the right fielder of the future on this team.

southside rocks
09-12-2006, 11:48 AM
How about "I'm just focusing on the next 18 games right now". "Ask me when the season is over".

Pretty simple.

For you or me, yes. Not for Ozzie. :cool:

I'm not defending that; I just think that's who he is. Ask him a question and he WILL reply. Often, people wish that he wouldn't.

MadetoOrta
09-12-2006, 01:06 PM
I have kind of thought it would be cool if we could get Grady Sizemore for center and Hawk and DJ were talking about that very thing, albeit briefly, on Sunday. He would be a great defensive and offensive strength and Hawk and DJ seemed to think that he was not untradable from Cleveland. But this could just be my pipe dream.

Seriously, if Cleveland were dumb enough to trade Sizemore to anyone, let alone a division rival, then Tribe fans have a right to stay away in droves until there's new ownership. The ONLY player in the Central I would trade Sizemore for is Johan Santana.

goon
09-12-2006, 01:42 PM
Seriously, if Cleveland were dumb enough to trade Sizemore to anyone, let alone a division rival, then Tribe fans have a right to stay away in droves until there's new ownership. The ONLY player in the Central I would trade Sizemore for is Johan Santana.


that's a pretty ****ty trade. then again, i can't think of anyone i would trade for santana, though i can think of a lot of guys comparable in age and talent level, not necessarily the same talents, to sizemore.

soxchick20
09-12-2006, 04:01 PM
Lets keep Sweeney around; he throws very well. Sweeney is the right fielder of the future on this team.

Amen. Totally Agree!

INSox56
09-12-2006, 04:07 PM
Yeah you'd have to be borderline insane to trade Grady Sizemore, for ANYONE. Not only are you losing the player, but you're losing the FRANCHISE player.

PennStater98r
09-12-2006, 04:15 PM
I sure wish Ozzie would stop commenting on next seasons players, this year. He needs to shut his yap and motivate what he has this year. Any comment about next year is distructive at this point.

:thumbsup:

Trav
09-12-2006, 04:16 PM
A few weeks ago Guillen mentioned that Anderson better choose what kind of player he was going be, speed or power. He then said that he thinks Anderson should choose speed. Anderson agreed to play winter ball and I bet he works on that.

I have a feeling that the only position that is really up for grabs is LF. I would like for Sweeney to do well enough to take the job but could the fans handle another slumping rookie OF? Chances are he isn't going to hit .300 right away.

Crawford would be awesome to have, tho.

ElDuque26
09-12-2006, 08:47 PM
i dont understand why sweeney's name wasnt in more posts in this thread...he has looked pretty solid from what we have seen and seems to be a good corner outfielder....i think you give him a big chance to come out of next march as our starter...or else there might need to be a free-agent to plug our left field spot

Huisj
09-14-2006, 09:29 PM
Is sweeney really speedy? A lot of people on here keep mentioning the speed he could bring to the game, but I'm not sure he's got that. He's got hustle, yes, and he seems to have decent range in the outfield as far as attacking flyballs (though he's really hardly played so it's tough to tell for sure), but there's nothing in his history to show that he's a speedy guy on the basepaths. What was he, 7 for 14 in SB this year at AAA?

Don't get me wrong, I still like the kid and think he could be good, but he's not going to come up, hit .300 as a leadoff man and steal 40 bases.

Also, Orlando Cabrera really doesn't seem like a leadoff type guy. He has a career OBP below .320 I think.

CRAW
09-14-2006, 10:03 PM
Screw competition, use a couple of those guys to get Carl Crawford.

Hear, hear!!!

jenn2080
09-14-2006, 10:06 PM
Ill take Sweeney Anderson and Dye in the Outfield with a few good back up real outfielders.

JB98
09-14-2006, 11:54 PM
didn't fields steal 20-some bases this year at AAA? Is he relatively speedy?

Fields stole 28 bags this year. He's an excellent athlete, and definitely not a baseplugger.

BadBobbyJenks
09-15-2006, 12:12 AM
I have kind of thought it would be cool if we could get Grady Sizemore for center and Hawk and DJ were talking about that very thing, albeit briefly, on Sunday. He would be a great defensive and offensive strength and Hawk and DJ seemed to think that he was not untradable from Cleveland. But this could just be my pipe dream.



If you think Sizemore is tradeable, Ill have whatever you are putting in the ol'
:bong:

ondafarm
09-15-2006, 12:18 AM
Cleveland isn't trading Sizemore unless they got something like two proven starting pitchers and a prospect. And I doubt they'd ever trade him to the White Sox, not just same league, same division.

Sizemore is that most valuable of hitters, a proven lead-off guy. Other guys may have more steals, but Sizemore has a solid BA, OBP, SLG% and has decent steals to boot.

If I was Cleveland's GM I build around Sizemore.

minutia
09-15-2006, 10:07 AM
If you think Sizemore is tradeable, Ill have whatever you are putting in the ol'
:bong:
I realize it is a real long shot but Hawk and DJ were talking about it, I swear and it got me thiniking.

EMachine10
09-15-2006, 10:40 AM
i don't see why owens is in this discussion...IMO, he's the outfield version of willie harris. LF Sweeney, CF Anderson, RF Dye will work just fine for me.

35th&Shields
09-15-2006, 11:02 AM
Screw competition, use a couple of those guys to get Carl Crawford.

Amen. I know it's a dream world, but imagine if we could get Crawford and Young? Either one would be an uprgrade, and toghether it'd be absolutely unbelievable.

soxinem1
09-15-2006, 01:07 PM
I sure wish Ozzie would stop commenting on next seasons players, this year. He needs to shut his yap and motivate what he has this year. Any comment about next year is distructive at this point.

Really. You should be getting ready for a stretch run, not talking like you are 60-80 and out of contention.

soxfan13
09-15-2006, 01:34 PM
Soriano, Crawford and Dye:tongue:

DaleJRFan
09-15-2006, 01:36 PM
Is Ryan Sweeney really going to be able to produce better than Pods in LF next year - for sure?? Who is going to be the leadoff hitter? What if he has a Brian Anderson type of start and can't turn it around like BA has? All the scout types are saying that he might need another year of AAA seasoning before he'll be ready.

So you will have two unproven rookies in LF and CF, figuring in Uribe, that is 3 potential holes in the lineup. What would be so bad about bringing Podsednik back for another one-year deal at a cheap rate? If he sucks, DFA him and then give Sweeney the job mid-season.

INSox56
09-15-2006, 01:39 PM
Really. You should be getting ready for a stretch run, not talking like you are 60-80 and out of contention.

I don't get arguments like these in this and other threads. YES we know we're still in the hunt and still care greatly. What else are we supposed to be talking about, how we'll win the next game? Predicting the rest of the season's wins? I don't get why we're "not supposed to talk about such things" just because the season is still going and possible to extend...

Hitmen77
09-15-2006, 03:47 PM
Ill take Sweeney Anderson and Dye in the Outfield with a few good back up real outfielders.

I think this is the most likely scenario for '07. If the Sox do go with Sweeney, I hope they are prepared for a repeat of this year's growing pains that Anderson has experienced.

Lip Man 1
09-15-2006, 04:04 PM
I'd prefer Ichiro, Anderson and Dye myself.

Lip

palehozenychicty
09-15-2006, 04:07 PM
I'd prefer Ichiro, Anderson and Dye myself.

Lip

If Nintendo didn't own the Mariners, we'd have a chance. But Ichiro will retire as a Mariner.

TomBradley72
09-15-2006, 04:10 PM
LF- Sweeney/Fields Platoon
CF-Anderson
RF- Dye
Solid 4th OF in case of Dye injury or problem in LF
Let Pods go...since the All Star break of 2005...he's been very inconsistent (but he did have a great post season).
Replace Uribe at SS with a guy who can be your new lead off hitter.

Sox-o-matic
09-15-2006, 05:36 PM
I really like Sweeney. I agree on Owens, he doesn't yet strike me as the type that's gonna really make it big...well, big enough to what we need. Sweeney seems very professional and calm, two good things that you need as a rookie. If he's got some speed, that's a great option down there. I just remember him dominating in ST, talk about impressive.

I also agree with Baldelli. As Kenny has done in the past and others mentioned....he's not afraid to deal the Sweeneys, the Owenses, though doubtfully the fieldses in our system. Too bad Anderson sucked it up somewhat, I love the guy, but there's no way that if Sweeney ends up replacing him, we could trade him...after this year his value is shot till he could either put up good numbers in the minors or something else.

What are you talking about? The entire Major Leagues have had the chance to watch him play terrific defense.

Not all hitters break into the big leagues and hit .300 right off the bat. In fact, some of them do indeed struggle, especially those ones who move through the minors as quickly as Brian did. Brian rebounded nicely and was putting up some good numbers before cooling off in September. It is not uncommon for hitters to cool off in September.

IMO, if Brian has done anything to his trade value this year he has only raised it. He was never expected to be an offensive powerhouse and was made the opening day starter because the Sox knew he could play defense. Because his glove is so valuable, because the Sox now know he can hit major league pitching, and because he still has a real chance of hitting .300 with 20+ HR's in a season, he will not be traded. It would be very very stupid to trade Brian.

Just think about this: how much money does Torii Hunter make? How many teams would love to have Torii Hunter in their centerfield? Well, Brian will likely become a better centerfielder than Torii as well as a better hitter than Torii (higher average, more home runs, probably higher OBP too) and it may happen as soon as next year.

If people here miss Rowand as much as they do, they'd hate to miss Brian two or three years from now when he's all over the highlight reels and we have Rob Mackowiaks and Jerry Owens' patrolling center.

Lip Man 1
09-15-2006, 05:40 PM
Pale:

If the published reports are true money isn't the issue with Ichiro. He's tired of losing and tired of the direction of the franchise.

He's a free agent after 2007 so if the M's are going to sign him they better do it soon. If not he'll be gone in July at the trade deadlinje.

Lip

palehozenychicty
09-15-2006, 06:21 PM
Pale:

If the published reports are true money isn't the issue with Ichiro. He's tired of losing and tired of the direction of the franchise.

He's a free agent after 2007 so if the M's are going to sign him they better do it soon. If not he'll be gone in July at the trade deadlinje.

Lip

I've heard this as well, but he would command a ransom in a trade. There seems to be an air of uncertainty about the Seattle front office with Bavasi having a horrible tenure and Grover as good as gone in the offseason. Now Ichiro as a FA? Wow, can't imagine the offers he'd get from left coast teams like the Angels and Dodgers.

Craig Grebeck
09-16-2006, 06:33 AM
Ichiro would command a ransom and a) We do not have the prospects b) He is not worth it. Look at his numbers, they're good and all, but he's now had two seasons with sub .800 OPS and doesn't look to be improving all that much.

Lip Man 1
09-16-2006, 11:19 AM
Craig:

Would you rather have Posednik's numbers?

:rolleyes:

Lip

greektortoise
09-16-2006, 11:59 AM
craig,

i have to respectfully disagree with you and take sides with lip.
my logic
a. whatever salary he commands, he more than pays for itself. he brings another tv station with population base of 125 million viewers. there are only a handful of whitesox games broadcast in japan this year for gooch, whereas mariners and yankees(matsui) are almost on half the games. he also brings big corporate advertisers. if you noticed a few japanese language ads behind home plate this year, there will be some every game for ichiro. there is also a 'ichiro tour' organized by japanese travel agencies that fly people in from japan. if you include all the merchandise and other interest he is basically a gold mine that brings revenue to the club far in excess of his salary. you may not notice the increase in japanese fans at the park this year due to iguchi, but it will be obvious with ichiro.
b. no current prospect needed, he's a FA.
c. ops is probably not the best measue for a lead off guy. he will get his 200 hits. he is also hitting 354 against lefties, whichi will help sox's woes against lefty pitching. he's a 2-way player, unlike soriano mentioned inthis thread, and one of only few outfielders in the league we can say is better defensively than brian (arm, range,and read on the ball). he has also swiped 38 bags this year in 40 attempts(yep, 2 cs).
also, career average against the best pitchers in our league (source:yahoo sports)
vs.
santana 10-26 .385
liriano 4- 7 .571
sabathia 15-35 .429
verlander 1- 3 .333

conclusion
he's an equivalent to jordan in japan,so money is not the issue. he's still one of the premier players inthe league, if wecan get him, we go grab him.

caulfield12
09-16-2006, 01:27 PM
Ummm...Ichiro is signed through 2007.

We can make the huge blockbuster trade of Anderson/Fields/McCarthy/Broadway/Owens (pick 2 or 3) and go with Sweeney in LF and Ichiro in CF, with whoever's left fighting for LF among Mackowiak/Anderson/Ozuna/Fields/Sweeney/Owens.

The only other options to get anything comparable to Ichiro are Crede or Konerko. They already have Beltre and Sexson, so that obviously wouldn't work.

The M's need to get younger and cheaper.

Of course, there's a danger this team suddenly gets old and injury prone at $105 million and we have to completely rebuild with all of our key players in the "aging" category...

Konerko
Thome
Dye
Ichiro
Contreras
Iguchi
AJ

Our only core younger players would be Crede, Buehrle and Anderson, plus whatever prospects are not dealt for Ichiro.

I don't think the M's have any interest in a Vazquez or Garcia...unless we gave them additional prospects.