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View Full Version : *Official* Bullpen costs us another


gbergman
08-31-2006, 05:17 PM
Our bullpen has cost Vazquez two wins in his last two starts. Way to go.

Need to get rolling again tomorrow

ndgt10
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
2 out of 3 ain't bad.

stl_sox_fan
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
Add another shoulda woulda coulda to their record.

Here's to some momentum starting this weekend.

Bill Naharodny
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
Once again, just when we think it's about time to get on a roll . . .

Actually, we should feel fortunate to have won 2 of 3. My.

1917
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
This one really pissed me off

sox102
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
2 out of 3 ain't bad.

it is when the sox should beat this team silly :angry:

Baby Fisk
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
Well, we didn't win the "must win" game. That does it. This season is soggy toast.

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:18 PM
What is it with these guys and getaway days?

It's like the 5th inning comes up and, "Oh well. I hope we make the flight..."

:angry: :angry:

samram
08-31-2006, 05:19 PM
Golden opportunity wasted there. There were an awful lot of stranded runners the last two days.

SoxFan78
08-31-2006, 05:19 PM
Way to **** the bed and fail to gain ground on the Tigers. This team frustrates me even more then last years.

Somebody answer me this, why is Mack up in the bottom of the 10th??

Just a brutal game.

downstairs
08-31-2006, 05:19 PM
2 out of 3 ain't bad.

Against Tampa and KC it is.

There is no way the Sox, at this point, should lose one game to a Tampa or KC. Not one. Unacceptable.

I don't think it'll kill them... they're not "must win" from that perspective. But they're must win from the perspective of it being completely unacceptable not to sweep both of these series.

BeviBall!
08-31-2006, 05:19 PM
After yesterday's gift... I consider us even with the baseball gods. Win some divisional games this weekend.

ndgt10
08-31-2006, 05:20 PM
Against Tampa and KC it is.

There is no way the Sox, at this point, should lose one game to a Tampa or KC. Not one. Unacceptable.

I don't think it'll kill them... they're not "must win" from that perspective. But they're must win from the perspective of it being completely unacceptable not to sweep both of these series.
Tampa could have easily swept us this series.

DickAllen72
08-31-2006, 05:20 PM
2 out of 3 ain't bad.

Yes it is. The Sox needed the sweep against the last place team and couldn't get it done. They may wind up short because of games like this.

mikesouthside
08-31-2006, 05:20 PM
This is why Pods needs to go and BMac isn't ready. Bull pen is killing me.

RMac you are a pitch hitter......key word is hit. 3-0 then K. C'mon

SpartanSoxFan
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
Is it just me or do we suck really bad in extra innings games at home this year compared to last year???

Oh well, at this point I won't complain anymore about taking 2 of 3. We need to take this next series also.

MrX
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
Nice job pissing that one away.

Why the hell is Pods batting in the 10th?

I think this goes back to Tuesday night. If Cotts and Riske don't **** themselves I think Ozzie goes Thornton in the 7th, Mac in the 8th, and Bobby in the 9th. I don't think they have much confidence in sending Bobby out 3 days in a row. That last time they did was the series in Baltimore and he looked like crap and blew a save in game 3.

BeviBall!
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
Golden opportunity wasted

The Story of the 2006 Chicago White Sox

God, I hope that's not true, but it's sure shaping up like it. Hammel, Hummel, whateverthe****. You've got to put at least 5 on that joker.

QCIASOXFAN
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
This is one that got away. I hate when guys who NEVER hit homers end up hitting game winners against us. At least we got 2 of 3. It could have been worse.

Mohoney
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
What can you do? McCarthy simply didn't have it today.

I'm not too upset about this one. I'ts not like we played all that poorly or didn't show up. In fact, I feel a lot better about Vazquez's chances after today's outing.

ndgt10
08-31-2006, 05:21 PM
This is why Pods needs to go and Fingernails on a blackboard isn't ready. Bull pen is killing me.

RMac you are a pitch hitter......key word is hit. 3-0 then K. C'mon
Why is brandon mccarthy called "fingernails on a blackboard?"

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:23 PM
After yesterday's gift... I consider us even with the baseball gods. Win some divisional games this weekend.

Thats a good way to look at it! Considering how Tampa kills us, 2 out of 3 isn't too bad. I'm more miffed at the plethora of missed scoring opportunities. At least Vazquez is back on the right track.

However, any letdown in KC this weekend would be brutal for the Sox playoff hopes.

downstairs
08-31-2006, 05:23 PM
Why is brandon mccarthy called "fingernails on a blackboard?"

I think you just answered your own question...

TheDarkGundam
08-31-2006, 05:23 PM
Well...that sucked.
We coulda been 3.5 back today. *sigh*
:(:

Dan Mega
08-31-2006, 05:23 PM
A winning streak of more than 2 or 3 games once in a while would be nice.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:25 PM
Against Tampa and KC it is.

There is no way the Sox, at this point, should lose one game to a Tampa or KC. Not one. Unacceptable.

I don't think it'll kill them... they're not "must win" from that perspective. But they're must win from the perspective of it being completely unacceptable not to sweep both of these series.

Ummm...Minnesota could easily have lost today if the Royals wouldn't have left four on in ISP.

You can't expect anything more than 2/3 in KC, especially with the way Contreras and Garcia have been pitching recently.

The Royals have the highest team batting average in the month of AUG.

Remember, the first game easily could have been different if not for D. Young being unfamiliar with the fence and a double play ball that should have been completed.

And Navarro should have scored in the first place on what should have been a sacrifice fly in the 4th, so the double play not turned wasn't the crucial play.

We had a guy out there on the mound with a near 8 ERA to start the game and our offense didn't take care of business.

And Thornton, despite his fastball, can't blow it by MLB hitters with a 3-1 count and them waiting in the weeds...and Brandon, why did you go away from the inside fastball? WHY?

Martinigirl
08-31-2006, 05:27 PM
Why the hell is Pods batting in the 10th?



It makes no sense to take Anderson out for Mack, but leave Pods up to bat. If anyone is in need of being taken out for a pinch hitter these days, it is Pods.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:27 PM
Thats a good way to look at it! Considering how Tampa kills us, 2 out of 3 isn't too bad. I'm more miffed at the plethora of missed scoring opportunities. At least Vazquez is back on the right track.

However, any letdown in KC this weekend would be brutal for the Sox playoff hopes.

The Twins "blew" three games in the standings since Sunday to us.

Their fans were jumping ship right and left. It's baseball, we didn't deserve to win any of these games, the way we've played lackluster baseball.

And with Silva, Baker and Garza pitching, the Twins deserve the pennant if they win 2/3 in Yankee Stadium with those guys on the mound.

getonbckthr
08-31-2006, 05:27 PM
So Jesus Christ himself blew it in the 10th today, he is so untouchable!

Chips
08-31-2006, 05:27 PM
We go into the series 5.5 back, we end the series 4.5 back. :D:

AnkleSox
08-31-2006, 05:28 PM
Mcclung is 4-12 w/ an ERA over 6.

Meanhwile, the Sox pitching staff gave up 9, 4, and 5 runs to the devil rays. Not really acceptable for a playoff team to do that against one of, if not the, lowest scoring teams in the league.

I'm pretty sure McCarthy in the rotation would have pretty similar numbers to Vaz...

batmanZoSo
08-31-2006, 05:29 PM
This bullpen is very disheartening. They get a D on the year.

This loss leaves me crestfallen. My crest is just pathetic right now. Can't stand up for ****.

JB98
08-31-2006, 05:30 PM
We had the lead in the eighth inning at home, against a last-place team that came into today with a 1-19 road record since the All-Star break. These are games you have to lock up. We blew yet another golden opportunity to gain ground and put some heat on the Tigers. Detroit is trying to give us this division, and we refuse to take it. I couldn't be more disappointed in this team than I am today.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:30 PM
Mcclung is 4-12 w/ an ERA over 6.

Meanhwile, the Sox pitching staff gave up 9, 4, and 5 runs to the devil rays. Not really acceptable for a playoff team to do that against one of, if not the, lowest scoring teams in the league.

I'm pretty sure McCarthy in the rotation would have pretty similar numbers to Vaz...

McClung throws hard and is better suited to the bullpen.

You might as well throw those numbers out, because they came from when he started.

We had plenty of chances against Camp and Lugo and did ZIP besides continue to swing for the fences.

Corlose 15
08-31-2006, 05:31 PM
What can you do? McCarthy simply didn't have it today.

I'm not too upset about this one. I'ts not like we played all that poorly or didn't show up. In fact, I feel a lot better about Vazquez's chances after today's outing.

Right because you can't expect them to get more than 3 runs off of Jason Hammel.:rolleyes:


This team is maddeningly frustrating. 8th inning lead vs a team 27 some games under .500? You close out the damn game.

Sell Jerry Sell!
08-31-2006, 05:31 PM
Instead of blaming the bullpen, what about Gload? He gets the throw on the double play, we don't even go to extra innings. I hate that guy!!:angry: :angry:

mph32
08-31-2006, 05:31 PM
I was following on the internet, how did Rob M. strikout with a 3-0 count? Did he go down swinging? It showed the count and after my refresh there was one out.. I thought my computer messed up. And how good would Crawford look in left next year? Does anyone know if he is a free agent?

100 Year Itch
08-31-2006, 05:31 PM
one hit -- a two-out hit at that-- in the last twelve at bats. :puking:

batmanZoSo
08-31-2006, 05:33 PM
one hit -- a two-out hit at that-- in the last twelve at bats. :puking:

Amazing. In the GT, I said "don't stop now" after the Crede double. Well, they certainly didn't listen to me.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:33 PM
This bullpen is very disheartening. They get a D on the year.

This loss leaves me crestfallen. My crest is just pathetic right now. Can't stand up for ****.

D is a little harsh. Coming into the season, I expected an F, and it looked that way after the first couple of months.

Politte and Hermanson were injured, and Logan wasn't ready.

Our bullpen is a lot better now than it was then, in some ways, it has been a strength of the team during the last two months, especially compared to the starting pitching, which has been much worse.

Cotts has been a huge disappointment recently, but with the numbers Jenks has overall, it's a C+ or B-.

If we had won this game 3-2, most would give the pen a B/B- on the year.

batmanZoSo
08-31-2006, 05:35 PM
D is a little harsh. Coming into the season, I expected an F, and it looked that way after the first couple of months.

Politte and Hermanson were injured, and Logan wasn't ready.

Our bullpen is a lot better now than it was then, in some ways, it has been a strength of the team during the last two months, especially compared to the starting pitching, which has been much worse.

Cotts has been a huge disappointment recently, but with the numbers Jenks has overall, it's a C+ or B-.

If we had won this game 3-2, most would give the pen a B/B- on the year.
One game is worth two letter grades, eh?

D.

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:35 PM
D is a little harsh. Coming into the season, I expected an F, and it looked that way after the first couple of months.

Politte and Hermanson were injured, and Logan wasn't ready.

Our bullpen is a lot better now than it was then, in some ways, it has been a strength of the team during the last two months, especially compared to the starting pitching, which has been much worse.

Cotts has been a huge disappointment recently, but with the numbers Jenks has overall, it's a C+ or B-.

If we had won this game 3-2, most would give the pen a B/B- on the year.

I just hope all parts of the team get going at the same time before the season ends prematurely on us.

greenpeach
08-31-2006, 05:35 PM
Add another shoulda woulda coulda to their record.

Here's to some momentum starting this weekend.

The bottom line is do to our pitching woes, I highly doubt that this team EVER goes on a roll the rest of the year. Boys, it's just not in the cards this year. The Tigers will win the division because of a deeper, better & more consistent pitching staff. However, the wild card is still up for grabs & once you're in anything can happen (Marlins, Angels).

spiffie
08-31-2006, 05:35 PM
The worst part about this is that this team is very hard to like or love for any other reason than that they are the White Sox. I mean, it was easy to love last year's team. Scrappy underdogs playing their guts out every game and leaving everything on the field. This year, while some guys fit that bill, the overall team just seems very lackadaisical and uninterested. When players talk about not being able to focus because the game isn't big enough, and guys continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly, and there are guys who are always seen as disasters in wait, it takes a lot of the joy from the whole enterprise. When you read about people talking about last year's team, there was a sense of affection from lots of outside observers. Even in books about other things, like "Juicing the Game" or "3 Nights in August" the authors talked about how wonderful it was to watch the 2005 White Sox. Can you imagine anyone saying that about this team? Other than Dye and Jenks and Garland is there anyone who you can say you love to watch playing the game for any reason other than they are White Sox players?

It's disheartening. The whole thing just seems so off-center and off-balance. None of this means they won't win tomorrow, or go to the playoffs, or even win it all. But I wonder how many people here would say they like this team more than last years group.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:36 PM
Right because you can't expect them to get more than 3 runs off of Jason Hammel.:rolleyes:


This team is maddeningly frustrating. 8th inning lead vs a team 27 some games under .500? You close out the damn game.

Yeah, and the hottest team in baseball the 2nd half should do more than barely hang on to win ONE game against the WORST team in baseball with their best pitcher (and maybe the best in the game) right?

We got lucky the first two nights and Delmon Young finally got us for one.

The way that guy played all series long, they deserve one win just for his play.

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:37 PM
The worst part about this is that this team is very hard to like or love for any other reason than that they are the White Sox. I mean, it was easy to love last year's team. Scrappy underdogs playing their guts out every game and leaving everything on the field. This year, while some guys fit that bill, the overall team just seems very lackadaisical and uninterested. When players talk about not being able to focus because the game isn't big enough, and guys continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly, and there are guys who are always seen as disasters in wait, it takes a lot of the joy from the whole enterprise. When you read about people talking about last year's team, there was a sense of affection from lots of outside observers. Even in books about other things, like "Juicing the Game" or "3 Nights in August" the authors talked about how wonderful it was to watch the 2005 White Sox. Can you imagine anyone saying that about this team? Other than Dye and Jenks and Garland is there anyone who you can say you love to watch playing the game for any reason other than they are White Sox players?

It's disheartening. The whole thing just seems so off-center and off-balance. None of this means they won't win tomorrow, or go to the playoffs, or even win it all. But I wonder how many people here would say they like this team more than last years group.

I wouldn't go that far. Obviously they're scuffling.

Did we think the same thing this time last season?

MrX
08-31-2006, 05:37 PM
Pods 1-13 in the series with 6Ks.

Credefan21
08-31-2006, 05:38 PM
No.. Correction.. Bmac has been inconsistent for awhile. This guy is overrated in the bullpen.

Ol' No. 2
08-31-2006, 05:38 PM
D is a little harsh. Coming into the season, I expected an F, and it looked that way after the first couple of months.

Politte and Hermanson were injured, and Logan wasn't ready.

Our bullpen is a lot better now than it was then, in some ways, it has been a strength of the team during the last two months, especially compared to the starting pitching, which has been much worse.

Cotts has been a huge disappointment recently, but with the numbers Jenks has overall, it's a C+ or B-.

If we had won this game 3-2, most would give the pen a B/B- on the year.No!!! They should all have 0.00 ERA's, otherwise they suck!

The bullpen didn't blow this game. The Sox offense couldn't manage but 8 hits against a AAAA pitching staff. AJ was the only one with more than one hit.

infohawk
08-31-2006, 05:39 PM
However, any letdown in KC this weekend would be brutal for the Sox playoff hopes. This sounds like the Twins board after they lost yesterday. They were declaring the season over the and playoffs unlikely. Fans expecting the playoffs are just tense and tend to overvalue every win and loss this time of the year - myself included. A sweep would have been great, but 2 or 3 is fine. We picked up one game on the Tigers and went ahead of the Twins by half a game. There seems to be a sentiment that not running away in either the division or wild card race = done. I still think there is a good chance that Minnesota will fade because of their pitching. It looks like Radke's probably out with his shoulder not responding to the cortisone shot, Silva's terrible and they are relying on the Bonsor, Baker and Garza types for September. Liriano may come back in about two weeks and will perhaps give them 2-3 starts, but who knows how good each of those will be considering he's coming off an injury and may even have a little rust.

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:39 PM
Pods 1-13 in the series with 6Ks.

Yeah, but look what he did Saturday and Sunday against the Twins.

That's my biggest gripe with him right now. Complete inconsistency from one day to the next. Lack of focus?!?

batmanZoSo
08-31-2006, 05:39 PM
Pods 1-13 in the series with 6Ks.

Yeah, it was very wise to bat him in the 10th. Because if he strikes out on a wild pitch, his great speed might get him to second.

spiffie
08-31-2006, 05:39 PM
Pods 1-13 in the series with 6Ks.
Hey, he's not that much worse than other leadoff guys and he runs fast, so what's the problem?!

russ99
08-31-2006, 05:41 PM
This sounds like the Twins board after they lost yesterday. They were declaring the season over the and playoffs unlikely. Fans expecting the playoffs are just tense and tend to overvalue every win and loss this time of the year - myself included. A sweep would have been great, but 2 or 3 is fine. We picked up one game on the Tigers and went ahead of the Twins by half a game. There seems to be a sentiment that not running away in either the division or wild card race = done. I still think there is a good chance that Minnesota will fade because of their pitching. It looks like Radke's probably out with his shoulder not responding to the cortisone shot, Silva's terrible and they are relying on the Bonsor, Baker and Garza types for September. Liriano may come back in about two weeks and will perhaps give them 2-3 starts, and who knows how good each of those will be considering he's coming off an injury and may even have a little rust.

I didn't say losses, I said letdown. KC's gonna be tough and it will be hard to take 2 of 3, but if the Sox just coast in there, KC could sweep em.

Any word as to if Contereras is going to be able to start, or was that just a one-game aberration?

infohawk
08-31-2006, 05:41 PM
No.. Correction.. Fingernails on a blackboard has been inconsistent for awhile. This guy is overrated in the bullpen.
I have a feeling he will be a much better and more consistent pitcher when he is taking the ball every fifth day.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:41 PM
The worst part about this is that this team is very hard to like or love for any other reason than that they are the White Sox. I mean, it was easy to love last year's team. Scrappy underdogs playing their guts out every game and leaving everything on the field. This year, while some guys fit that bill, the overall team just seems very lackadaisical and uninterested. When players talk about not being able to focus because the game isn't big enough, and guys continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly, and there are guys who are always seen as disasters in wait, it takes a lot of the joy from the whole enterprise. When you read about people talking about last year's team, there was a sense of affection from lots of outside observers. Even in books about other things, like "Juicing the Game" or "3 Nights in August" the authors talked about how wonderful it was to watch the 2005 White Sox. Can you imagine anyone saying that about this team? Other than Dye and Jenks and Garland is there anyone who you can say you love to watch playing the game for any reason other than they are White Sox players?

It's disheartening. The whole thing just seems so off-center and off-balance. None of this means they won't win tomorrow, or go to the playoffs, or even win it all. But I wonder how many people here would say they like this team more than last years group.

I don't know about that, if they finished the collapse, we would have remembered them with pain for the rest of our lives, like the 69 Cubs or 64 Phillies.

After what they did, it's easier to remember the positives and not the absolute hell we were subjected to for six weeks. Still, they were a "blue collar," SouthSide, fundamentally-sound team that almost always came up with the clutch hit or the key out when they needed it.

This team doesn't seem to have any sense of urgency, you sensed it the first two games, especially last night and today after we took the lead.

The only time they've looked really into games was the Yankees/Tigers back-to-back series. Other than that, disinterested hitting and pitching from everyone besides Dye, Jenks and Garland.

Just imagine if we'd lost last night how negative things would be around here, especially the Pods bashing. At least he has a reprieve from that. He's proven time and time again that how he goes, the team usually goes. That's why last night was such a miracle IMO.

JB98
08-31-2006, 05:43 PM
No!!! They should all have 0.00 ERA's, otherwise they suck!

The bullpen didn't blow this game. The Sox offense couldn't manage but 8 hits against a AAAA pitching staff. AJ was the only one with more than one hit.

Yes, and the defense blew an easy DP in the sixth inning and cost Vazquez a run. How big was that in a game that ended up going extra innings? The position players deserve their share of the blame.

doctorlecter
08-31-2006, 05:43 PM
Three runs on eight hits? This is not the bullpen's game. There is no excuse not to put up at least six on the D-Rays (when Kazmir isn't starting).

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:44 PM
No!!! They should all have 0.00 ERA's, otherwise they suck!

The bullpen didn't blow this game. The Sox offense couldn't manage but 8 hits against a AAAA pitching staff. AJ was the only one with more than one hit.

This reminds me of the Twins board. Plenty of posters ripping Rincon, Crain, even Nathan. The Twins and the Tigers clearly have better pens that the Sox, yet their fans are just as critical as ours. It's the nature of message boards, especially after unexpected losses.

Iguana775
08-31-2006, 05:45 PM
No!!! They should all have 0.00 ERA's, otherwise they suck!

The bullpen didn't blow this game. The Sox offense couldn't manage but 8 hits against a AAAA pitching staff. AJ was the only one with more than one hit.

That's what I'm more mad at. only scoring 3 runs against a guy with a ERA well above 7? Unacceptable. No reason the Sox shouldnt have score at least 6 runs on him today.

Frankly Missing
08-31-2006, 05:46 PM
On paper, we should be happy. Won the series, gained a game on Detroit, regained the WC lead.

The disappointment as a fan lies in not being able to FEEL some momentum since the All Star break.

For sure we can't call them the Go Go Sox.

Chug a Lug Sox is more fitting.

But they are chugging upwards, I'll take it.

MrX
08-31-2006, 05:46 PM
Yeah, but look what he did Saturday and Sunday against the Twins.

That's my biggest gripe with him right now. Complete inconsistency from one day to the next. Lack of focus?!?
He's been consistently terrible all month.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:47 PM
Yes, and the defense blew an easy DP in the sixth inning and cost Vazquez a run. How big was that in a game that ended up going extra innings? The position players deserve their share of the blame.

Yeah, and Gload made a very good play on what looked to be an errant throw from Crede, not to mention diving for that foul in the 7th.

If Navarro wasn't asleep in the 4th at third base, he would have scored and it would have been 2-0 D-Rays.

This is like saying the Yankees SHOULD have taken advantage of about 20 scoring opportunities with Vazquez on the mound...just like the White Sox almost wasted last night until they gave us one too many second and third chances in that game.

Imagine if you were a D-Rays fan for a moment. Even Dave Wills was disgusted on the post-game. There's almost nothing you can say.

Ol' No. 2
08-31-2006, 05:48 PM
Yes, and the defense blew an easy DP in the sixth inning and cost Vazquez a run. How big was that in a game that ended up going extra innings? The position players deserve their share of the blame.Plenty of blame to go around on this one. Why is it so hard to remember? It's a TEAM GAME. You don't win because of one player and you don't lose because of one player.

JB98
08-31-2006, 05:49 PM
That's what I'm more mad at. only scoring 3 runs against a guy with a ERA well above 7? Unacceptable. No reason the Sox shouldnt have score at least 6 runs on him today.

Nothing against Gload, but I think we missed Thome today. The Tampa Bay starter, whatever the hell is name is, is the sort of right-hander Jim hits well.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 05:50 PM
That's what I'm more mad at. only scoring 3 runs against a guy with a ERA well above 7? Unacceptable. No reason the Sox shouldnt have score at least 6 runs on him today.

In reality, he had three starts, two were quality starts (or very close) and one was bad, against Baltimore.

But he pitched well enough...just like Corcoran last night.

Don't you think every team that faces our starters and sees those ERA's feel they should beat US too?

Corcoran had a better ERA than any of our starters entering the game, did you expect him to win? No, because you're a Sox fan, but we simply didn't deserve to sweep this series.

We've been parked between 21-25 games over .500 for some time, and it will probably stay that way until the final weekend with the state of our starting pitching.

spiffie
08-31-2006, 05:51 PM
Plenty of blame to go around on this one. Why is it so hard to remember? It's a TEAM GAME. You don't win because of one player and you don't lose because of one player.
:pollite:
"That's what I said!"

Frankly Missing
08-31-2006, 05:52 PM
:pollite:
"That's what I said!"

That's funny

mikesouthside
08-31-2006, 05:54 PM
On paper, we should be happy. Won the series, gained a game on Detroit, regained the WC lead.

The disappointment as a fan lies in not being able to FEEL some momentum since the All Star break.

For sure we can't call them the Go Go Sox.

Chug a Lug Sox is more fitting.

But they are chugging upwards, I'll take it.

That's a keeper....ha.

wilburaga
08-31-2006, 05:56 PM
I saw a peanut stand, heard a rubber band,
I saw a needle that winked its eye.
But I think I will have seen everything
When I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.

I saw a front porch swing, heard a diamond ring,
I saw a polka-dot railroad tie.
But I think I will have seen everything
when I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.

I seen a clothes horse, he r'ar up and buck
And they tell me that a man made a vegetable truck
I didn't see that, I only heard
But just to be sociable I'll take your word

I heard a fireside chat, I saw a baseball bat
And I just laughed till I thought I'd die
But I'd be done see'n about everything
when I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.


W

100 Year Itch
08-31-2006, 05:57 PM
The most frustrating aspect of this team, beside the penchant for yielding fledging momentum by the pitching staff, is the seeming inability to have more than one dimension of the game clicking simultaneously.

Bats clicking, pitching suffering. Pitching clicking, offense sleepwalking. Stellar defense, poor offensive execution. Solid offensive execution, porous defense.

southsideirish71
08-31-2006, 05:57 PM
Our O was first in baseball in the first half with runs scored. Now in the 2nd half we are 7th in the AL.

It would be nice to see Paulie stop pulling low and away outside pitches to the 3rd baseman or the SS for Double Plays. I know he wants to kill it and all, but if they are going to throw you low and away, you can hit to right center. Right field is not out.

The O lost us this game. A garbage pitcher who will get lit up in his next start came in here and shut us down.

And why does Ozzie pinch hit Mack for Anderson, Anderson mind you who is hitting .297 and has a .347 OBP in the 2nd half, and then allow Pods to swing away with his .230BA and under 300 OBP for the 2nd half.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:02 PM
I saw a peanut stand, heard a rubber band,
I saw a needle that winked its eye.
But I think I will have seen everything
When I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.

I saw a front porch swing, heard a diamond ring,
I saw a polka-dot railroad tie.
But I think I will have seen everything
when I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.

I seen a clothes horse, he r'ar up and buck
And they tell me that a man made a vegetable truck
I didn't see that, I only heard
But just to be sociable I'll take your word

I heard a fireside chat, I saw a baseball bat
And I just laughed till I thought I'd die
But I'd be done see'n about everything
when I see Greg Norton intentionally walked.


W

LOL. I was wondering why the hell they walked Norton intentionally. The hitter after him had three hits today. I know they were setting up the DP, but I might have tried to strike out Norton.

Baby Fisk
08-31-2006, 06:05 PM
The worst part about this is that this team is very hard to like or love for any other reason than that they are the White Sox. I mean, it was easy to love last year's team. Scrappy underdogs playing their guts out every game and leaving everything on the field. This year, while some guys fit that bill, the overall team just seems very lackadaisical and uninterested. When players talk about not being able to focus because the game isn't big enough, and guys continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly, and there are guys who are always seen as disasters in wait, it takes a lot of the joy from the whole enterprise. When you read about people talking about last year's team, there was a sense of affection from lots of outside observers. Even in books about other things, like "Juicing the Game" or "3 Nights in August" the authors talked about how wonderful it was to watch the 2005 White Sox. Can you imagine anyone saying that about this team? Other than Dye and Jenks and Garland is there anyone who you can say you love to watch playing the game for any reason other than they are White Sox players?

It's disheartening. The whole thing just seems so off-center and off-balance. None of this means they won't win tomorrow, or go to the playoffs, or even win it all. But I wonder how many people here would say they like this team more than last years group.

That settles it. We need Aaron Rowand back.

*runs away and hides*

nebraskasox
08-31-2006, 06:06 PM
And why does Ozzie pinch hit Mack for Anderson, Anderson mind you who is hitting .297 and has a .347 OBP in the 2nd half, and then allow Pods to swing away with his .230BA and under 300 OBP for the 2nd half.

Wasn't there a RH pitcher for Tampa? Ozzie is enamored with LR matchups.

Ol' No. 2
08-31-2006, 06:06 PM
LOL. I was wondering why the hell they walked Norton intentionally. The hitter after him had three hits today. I know they were setting up the DP, but I might have tried to strike out Norton.That was brutal. IBB Norton and then walk Navarro on four pitches.

whitesoxfan
08-31-2006, 06:06 PM
Was looking at the game on my phone in film class...needless to say, I wasn't happy to see the 10th inning.

Hopefully this will bring out the fire in the Sox and we will go down to KC and sweep their asses.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:07 PM
That settles it. We need Aaron Rowand back.

*runs away and hides*

LOL. Rowand woud play on his broken ankle and turn this team around.

I personally love to watch Konerko and Thome hit, but apparently, Spiffie disagrees. Crede is a joy to watch defensively as well, hitting aside. We have plenty of players that I enjoy watching, besides Garland, Dye and Jenks.

Ol' No. 2
08-31-2006, 06:07 PM
Wasn't there a RH pitcher for Tampa? Ozzie is enamored with LR matchups.That, and Mackowiak's .397 OBP against RHP. People need to get a grip. Anderson is not god.

White_Sock
08-31-2006, 06:07 PM
Not to get too far into what ifs, BUT

Konerko whould have had that pick on the would-be double play off the low throw by Iguchi had he been playing first. Oh well. All losses are tough at this point.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:09 PM
Not to get too far into what ifs, BUT

Konerko whould have had that pick on the would-be double play off the low throw by Iguchi had he been playing first. Oh well. All losses are tough at this point.

This might be the first "Konerko would have had it" post in the history of WSI. :D:

nebraskasox
08-31-2006, 06:10 PM
Was looking at the game on my phone in film class...needless to say, I wasn't happy to see the 10th inning.

Hopefully this will bring out the fire in the Sox and we will go down to KC and sweep their asses.

We are in a pennant race. I would think that would be enough to light a fire under the Sox.

Lip Man 1
08-31-2006, 06:23 PM
There’s no way to sugar-coat this loss today.

Blow a chance to pick up a game with Detroit and to stay a game and a half up on Minnesota.

Wow.

Once again the ‘schizoid Sox’ show up and piss away a game to a garbage team.

That’s 24 losses now this season to teams currently with losing records.

It’s also the 10th time this year the Sox have lost a game when leading in the 7th inning or later. NINE of those games have come against teams currently with losing records.

Think those wouldn’t come in handy in the final few weeks? and against a garbage, basically ‘minor league’ starter to boot.

Again Wow!

Lip

slobes
08-31-2006, 06:25 PM
Damnit. I really believe that we should start playing Bobby in tie games more often. If we're at home, and the game goes into extras, he won't have a save situation. I'd say he's out most reliable guy in the pen, so why not just put him in and hope for 1 or 2 scoreless innings?

That said, we still won the series. We still lead the WC. Go get em tomorrow.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:28 PM
Damnit. I really believe that we should start playing Bobby in tie games more often. If we're at home, and the game goes into extras, he won't have a save situation. I'd say he's out most reliable guy in the pen, so why not just put him in and hope for 1 or 2 scoreless innings?

That said, we still won the series. We still lead the WC. Go get em tomorrow.

If Bobby hadn't pitched each of the last two games, you might have seen him in a tie game today. That goes back to the first game of this series, where we had a six-run lead in the eighth, and our horse**** middle relief couldn't shut the door. Jenks had to pitch Tuesday, unfortunately, and that might have led to him not being in the game today.

Frankly Missing
08-31-2006, 06:31 PM
Every Sox fan thought we had the game won when the bullpen door opened and the underwear model didn't come running out.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:35 PM
Every Sox fan thought we had the game won when the bullpen door opened and the underwear model didn't come running out.

Jim Palmer?

Frankly Missing
08-31-2006, 06:37 PM
Jim Palmer?

No, but that got a laugh out loud.

Lip Man 1
08-31-2006, 06:37 PM
JB:

That's a great point. I don't know by the way if you saw this in the newspaper today but Cooper was quoted as saying that only way to get Cotts turned around is to keep running him out there. That the team won't give up on him.

Seems like I heard that nonense with Politte before didn't I?

Wonder how many games that costs us?

Lip

Madvora
08-31-2006, 06:39 PM
JB:

That's a great point. I don't know by the way if you saw this in the newspaper today but Cooper was quoted as saying that only way to get Cotts turned around is to keep running him out there. That the team won't give up on him.

Seems like I heard that nonense with Politte before didn't I?

Wonder how many games that costs us?

Lip
Hey, good time for it too. When better to go with a hunch than within the last 30 games of the season and a 1/2 game seperating you and another team for a playoff spot

Frankly Missing
08-31-2006, 06:51 PM
Hey, good time for it too. When better to go with a hunch than within the last 30 games of the season and a 1/2 game seperating you and another team for a playoff spot

Sometime, somewhere, Ozzie must have seen a blind dog find a bone. :rolleyes:

ndgt10
08-31-2006, 06:53 PM
Why is Brandon McCarthy called "fingernails on a blackboard?"

MrX
08-31-2006, 06:54 PM
For those that wanted to see Jenks, here are are his numbers in the 3rd game when he pitches 3 days in a row

Apr 12 DET: 1IP, 2H, 2ER, 1HR, 1 K

Apr 29 LAA: 1/3IP, 0ER, 0H

May 5 KC:2/3IP, 3ER, 2H, 2BB, 0K Blown Save #1

June 23 Hou: 1IP, 0ER, 0H, 0BB, 0K

June 28 Pit: 1IP, 0ER, 2H, 0BB, 1K

Jul 30 Bal: 1/3IP, 3H, 2ER, 1BB, 0K Blown Save #2

That adds up to 4&1/3IP, 9H, 7ER, 3BBs, 2Ks, and both of his blown saves. His only good performances were against the NL.

JB98
08-31-2006, 06:57 PM
JB:

That's a great point. I don't know by the way if you saw this in the newspaper today but Cooper was quoted as saying that only way to get Cotts turned around is to keep running him out there. That the team won't give up on him.

Seems like I heard that nonense with Politte before didn't I?

Wonder how many games that costs us?

Lip

Riske is costing us too. Cotts left the opening game of this series with the score 11-7 and five outs left to get. Even a mediocre reliever like Riske should be able to close that out. As it turned out, we had to use Jenks to secure that win, and I think Bobby being possibly unavailable today was the result of that.

Patrick134
08-31-2006, 06:59 PM
Riske is costing us too. Cotts left the opening game of this series with the score 11-7 and five outs left to get. Even a mediocre reliever like Riske should be able to close that out. As it turned out, we had to use Jenks to secure that win, and I think Bobby being possibly unavailable today was the result of that.


bobby being unavailable was irrelevant to the game getting tied, he wouldn't have been in yet. And they wouldn't have rushed him out in a tie game today.

MadetoOrta
08-31-2006, 06:59 PM
3 in a row in KC is a must. 5 of 6 is the minimum against these guys. Frustrating. One way or another it'll be over in a month [or two]. It's these getaway games that are going to hurt when we have to win in the Twinkiedome at the end of the season.

MrX
08-31-2006, 07:01 PM
bobby being unavailable was irrelevant to the game getting tied, he wouldn't have been in yet. And they wouldn't have rushed him out in a tie game today.
If Bobby is available MacDougal probably pitches the 8th

JB98
08-31-2006, 07:05 PM
bobby being unavailable was irrelevant to the game getting tied, he wouldn't have been in yet. And they wouldn't have rushed him out in a tie game today.

Are you sure? Let's say Jenks hadn't pitched Tuesday. Does he come out for the 10th today instead of McCarthy? Possibly. Could Bobby have gotten through the 10th unscored upon? We'll never know.

wassagstdu
08-31-2006, 07:06 PM
one hit -- a two-out hit at that-- in the last twelve at bats. "Great pitching" will shut down great hitting ... especially if they all decide it is time to fatten up their power numbers. I didn't see the game. Just a theory.

.

JB98
08-31-2006, 07:10 PM
"Great pitching" will shut down great hitting ... especially if they all decide it is time to fatten up their power numbers. I didn't see the game. Just a theory.

.

Way more ground-ball outs today than pop-outs for the Sox. I don't think they were swinging for the fences.

Foulke You
08-31-2006, 07:11 PM
That was brutal. IBB Norton and then walk Navarro on four pitches.
I'm glad I wasn't the only one scratching my head there. I remember thinking "we're intentionally walking Greg Norton???!!" It didn't even present a righty righty matchup. It just made no sense to me considering Navarro was 3 for 4 on the day and Norton was 1 for 4.

Jerko
08-31-2006, 07:13 PM
I know mccarthy took the loss today, but if the Sox have a lead after 7 innings, I want mccarthy to start the 8th, Jenks the 9th from now on. As for people wanting Jenks in the 10th..... No. I don't like closers being brought into tie games. RARELY does it work out. Maybe if people quit getting thrown out at the plate, or at 2nd, it would have been a different outcome. Gload tossed at home; next guy gets a hit. Pods thrown out stealing? Next guy gets a hit. Just one of those days today. :angry:

Foulke You
08-31-2006, 07:15 PM
3 in a row in KC is a must. 5 of 6 is the minimum against these guys. Frustrating. One way or another it'll be over in a month [or two]. It's these getaway games that are going to hurt when we have to win in the Twinkiedome at the end of the season.
I'm thinking a sweep in KC is going to be tough to do considering they play better at home than they do on the road. Plus, we've had fits with KC all year so this series isn't going to be a cakewalk. My hope is for the Sox to take 2 out of 3 and for the Twins to lose 2 of 3 or get swept in New York. At the very least 2 of 3 in KC is a must because there is no way the Twins will sweep at Yankee Stadium so it will ensure maintaining that Wild Card lead.

Foulke You
08-31-2006, 07:21 PM
I know mccarthy took the loss today, but if the Sox have a lead after 7 innings, I want mccarthy to start the 8th, Jenks the 9th from now on.
I actually prefer MacDougal in the 8th and Jenks in the 9th. That is essentially like having 2 closers finish the game out. There is no doubt in my mind that MacDougal is a better option to setup Jenks. However, I do believe McCarthy has been underutilized in the long/middle relief role between the 5th-7th innings. The Friday game against the Twins last week and the Tuesday game against Tampa were two instances I thought Ozzie should have gone to McCarthy after the starter left early but in both instances he opted for the Cotts/Riske combo which I haven't been able to figure out.:?:

Overall, they've been using McCarthy pretty sparingly which could explain some of Brandon's control problems this afternoon. If you don't pitch a lot, you are more likely to lose your arm slot or angle and it takes you a little bit to find it again. By the time Brandon found it this afternoon, it was too late.

bryPt
08-31-2006, 07:23 PM
someone get me off this rollercoaster ride, I am starting to get dizzy.

JB98
08-31-2006, 07:23 PM
I'm thinking a sweep in KC is going to be tough to do considering they play better at home than they do on the road. Plus, we've had fits with KC all year so this series isn't going to be a cakewalk. My hope is for the Sox to take 2 out of 3 and for the Twins to lose 2 of 3 or get swept in New York. At the very least 2 of 3 in KC is a must because there is no way the Twins will sweep at Yankee Stadium so it will ensure maintaining that Wild Card lead.

Santana pitched today, so he won't appear at Yankee Stadium. New York should win that series. I doubt we'll sweep KC. They are playing much better in the second half. In recent weeks, they've swept Boston, split with us in Chicago and taken two of three in Minnesota. We will face Hernandez and Redman, both of whom threw shutouts in their last outings. This series will be tough. No one should fool themselves into thinking otherwise. I'll be happy with two out of three.

bluestar
08-31-2006, 07:26 PM
I'm thinking a sweep in KC is going to be tough to do considering they play better at home than they do on the road. Plus, we've had fits with KC all year so this series isn't going to be a cakewalk.

KC is playing as well as anyone else in this division right now. This series is not only not going to be a cakewalk, if the Sox don't show up with their best effort, they risk getting swept.

Foulke You
08-31-2006, 07:37 PM
KC is playing as well as anyone else in this division right now. This series is not only not going to be a cakewalk, if the Sox don't show up with their best effort, they risk getting swept.
I think the key for the Sox pitching wise is to keep Mark Teahan and Emil Brown in the ballpark and for crissakes stop Mark Grudzielanak from running rampant. I'm so tired of seeing that guy stroke base hits at will! They need to watch some video tape and figure out a new technique against him because what they are doing now ain't working.

caulfield12
08-31-2006, 07:52 PM
Teahen hasn't been hitting well recently. Let's not wake him up again.

The most dangerous Royals have been DeJesus, Brown and Shealy.

The way we're going, we'll light up Hernandez and Redman, sandwiched by a shutout against us by Odalis Perez.

viagracat
08-31-2006, 08:12 PM
We go into the series 5.5 back, we end the series 4.5 back. :D:

Yeah, we took 2 of 3 and gained a game on both Detroit and Minnesota, and Boston---gone!

Overall not bad. Sure, a sweep would've been nice, but you can't complain about gaining on EVERYONE that was competing for the playoffs the last three days.

spiffie
08-31-2006, 08:16 PM
LOL. Rowand woud play on his broken ankle and turn this team around.

I personally love to watch Konerko and Thome hit, but apparently, Spiffie disagrees. Crede is a joy to watch defensively as well, hitting aside. We have plenty of players that I enjoy watching, besides Garland, Dye and Jenks.
I forgot Crede, as he is someone is wonderful to watch. Thome I don't mind, but honestly, a DH can only do so much for me. Konerko I have not enjoyed this year since he has fallen into such a pull at call costs mindset seemingly. Today was the perfect example, as people were posting the "GIDPK" when he stepped to the plate, and voila, topped it into an easy grounder for the DP. Watching the seemingly inevitable groundout into a DP or pop-up followed by pained expression as he trots towards first has ceased to be something I get much entertainment from.

JB98
08-31-2006, 08:25 PM
I forgot Crede, as he is someone is wonderful to watch. Thome I don't mind, but honestly, a DH can only do so much for me. Konerko I have not enjoyed this year since he has fallen into such a pull at call costs mindset seemingly. Today was the perfect example, as people were posting the "GIDPK" when he stepped to the plate, and voila, topped it into an easy grounder for the DP. Watching the seemingly inevitable groundout into a DP or pop-up followed by pained expression as he trots towards first has ceased to be something I get much entertainment from.

I've been listening to people complain for years about Paulie swinging for the fences and popping out. The last month, he's hitting .340 with only three home runs. He's been hitting for average and swinging for singles. Unfortunately, some of his line drives/grounders are going to go straight to infielders and result in double plays.

You Konerko critics can't have it both ways. If you want Paulie to swing for singles, you are going to have to live with some DPs. If you want him to swing for power, you are going to have to live with pop-ups. Personally, I'd like to see Konerko scrap the hitting-for-average crap and start producing more power. I'll live with the pop-ups.

If you think Konerko has been pull-happy as of late, you haven't been watching. I'd swear to God you'd never know Konerko is a .300 hitter with almost 100 RBIs given the heat he takes on WSI.

CubsfansareDRUNK
08-31-2006, 08:30 PM
I've been listening to people complain for years about Paulie swinging for the fences and popping out. The last month, he's hitting .340 with only three home runs. He's been hitting for average and swinging for singles. Unfortunately, some of his line drives/grounders are going to go straight to infielders and result in double plays.

You Konerko critics can't have it both ways. If you want Paulie to swing for singles, you are going to have to live with some DPs. If you want him to swing for power, you are going to have to live with pop-ups. Personally, I'd like to see Konerko scrap the hitting-for-average crap and start producing more power. I'll live with the pop-ups.

If you think Konerko has been pull-happy as of late, you haven't been watching. I'd swear to God you'd never know Konerko is a .300 hitter with almost 100 RBIs given the heat he takes on WSI.

Took the words right out of my keyboard. POTD! :bandance:

spiffie
08-31-2006, 08:39 PM
I've been listening to people complain for years about Paulie swinging for the fences and popping out. The last month, he's hitting .340 with only three home runs. He's been hitting for average and swinging for singles. Unfortunately, some of his line drives/grounders are going to go straight to infielders and result in double plays.

You Konerko critics can't have it both ways. If you want Paulie to swing for singles, you are going to have to live with some DPs. If you want him to swing for power, you are going to have to live with pop-ups. Personally, I'd like to see Konerko scrap the hitting-for-average crap and start producing more power. I'll live with the pop-ups.

If you think Konerko has been pull-happy as of late, you haven't been watching. I'd swear to God you'd never know Konerko is a .300 hitter with almost 100 RBIs given the heat he takes on WSI.
I know all the numbers quite well. But for once I'm going to go the opposite approach, the one that says "who cares about numbers except for FOBB's and computer geeks?" Last night, when that game was on the line, did you want Konerko at the plate? If the Sox are in that final weekend needing 1 more win, and its the 9th inning, 1 out, bases loaded, and you can pick anyone in that lineup to be up there who is it going to be? For me, this year, PK would not crack that top 5. I know he has huge numbers, but at this point there is no one outside of Uribe and Podsednik I would be less happy to see up in that situation. I'm sure it's probably because of his barely .250 BA with RISP/2 outs. The fact that he has a low average in situations where the inning ends with men on base has probably done quite a number on me and my suppositions when he comes to bat. Perhaps it is the fact he has now hit into more than twice as many DP's as last year. I know that rationally in a perfectly averaged out world Konerko is the third best guy to have at the plate in a big moment. But it sure hasn't felt like it lately. And that is what I was saying about him. I gladly admit the whole thing is based in emotionalism and not rationality. But no, I feel dread when Paulie comes up in the clutch. If you don't, I'm glad. I want to feel like I did last year when I felt sure he would deliver. But I don't. And I can read a thousand splits about his .380 with men on 2nd and 3rd with 1 out or whatever. This isn't the brain, this is the gut at work.

BadBobbyJenks
08-31-2006, 08:44 PM
we won 2/3, twins lose 2/3...Success

and those of you who want to panic have at it

JB98
08-31-2006, 08:45 PM
I know all the numbers quite well. But for once I'm going to go the opposite approach, the one that says "who cares about numbers except for FOBB's and computer geeks?" Last night, when that game was on the line, did you want Konerko at the plate? If the Sox are in that final weekend needing 1 more win, and its the 9th inning, 1 out, bases loaded, and you can pick anyone in that lineup to be up there who is it going to be? For me, this year, PK would not crack that top 5. I know he has huge numbers, but at this point there is no one outside of Uribe and Podsednik I would be less happy to see up in that situation. I'm sure it's probably because of his barely .250 BA with RISP/2 outs. The fact that he has a low average in situations where the inning ends with men on base has probably done quite a number on me and my suppositions when he comes to bat. Perhaps it is the fact he has now hit into more than twice as many DP's as last year. I know that rationally in a perfectly averaged out world Konerko is the third best guy to have at the plate in a big moment. But it sure hasn't felt like it lately. And that is what I was saying about him. I gladly admit the whole thing is based in emotionalism and not rationality. But no, I feel dread when Paulie comes up in the clutch. If you don't, I'm glad. I want to feel like I did last year when I felt sure he would deliver. But I don't. And I can read a thousand splits about his .380 with men on 2nd and 3rd with 1 out or whatever. This isn't the brain, this is the gut at work.

I read posts like this all last season, and what did Konerko do in the playoffs? He came through with regularity.

As I indicated, everyone has always wanted Konerko to hit for more average. To do that, he's got to hit the ball on the ground, or hit more line drives. He's been doing that lately, and he has hit into more DPs as a result. I would like him to go back to his power approach. If he does, he will pop up more, and people like you will bitch and moan about that as well.

Another reason Konerko is hitting into more DPs this year: Thome is on first base a helluva lot more than Hot Carl ever was.

Sorry, but I'm OK with Konerko at the plate in the clutch. I'd rank him fourth behind Dye, Thome and Crede.

JB98
08-31-2006, 08:47 PM
we won 2/3, twins lose 2/3...Success

and those of you who want to panic have at it

Who is panicking? I'm disappointed, very disappointed in fact, but not panicked.

russ99
08-31-2006, 08:47 PM
LOL. Rowand woud play on his broken ankle and turn this team around.

Do ya think Philly would give him injury leave for the rest of the season so he can hang around with the other two stooges?

JB98
08-31-2006, 08:48 PM
Do ya think Philly would give him injury leave for the rest of the season so he can hang around with the other two stooges?

:D:

LongLiveFisk
08-31-2006, 09:09 PM
Instead of blaming the bullpen, what about Gload? He gets the throw on the double play, we don't even go to extra innings. I hate that guy!!:angry: :angry:

Yes it was a bad play, but to say you "hate" Gload? You're being a little too harsh.

ShoelessJoeS
08-31-2006, 09:14 PM
Poor Vazquez takes soooo much heat, and when he finally does well (last 2 outings), the bullpen blows it for him. I ALMOST feel bad for him. We really needed this one today with Detroit losing....again!

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 09:16 PM
Hopefully this will bring out the fire in the Sox and we will go down to KC and sweep their asses.

Ha. I stopped thinking that way a while ago. I'm sure they'll be fine with 2 out of 3 anyway. :rolleyes:

Lip Man 1
08-31-2006, 09:20 PM
Viagra:

Normally I'd say you're right. But with 29 games to go, trailing the leader by 4 1/2 games and just a razor edge lead in the wild card PLUS a tough schedule including a West Coast trip and finishing in Minnesota, two out of three against garbage minor league clubs pretending to be major league ones simply will not get it done.

I'm sorry but it won't.

It would if you had 50 games to go... but not 29. The Sox let the Tigers off the hook today.

Pray it doesn't wind up costing them more then just another day off a long schedule.

Lip

Hitmen77
08-31-2006, 09:23 PM
I'm not so quick to lay all the blame for today's game on the bullpen. I think defense and offense were more to blame today. If we can turn that double play, the game ends with a 3-2 Sox victory. Then there was that bloop hit that someone should have caught, but fell between Crede, Uribe, and Pods. And where was our mighty offense against crap pitching? Once again, we make some nobody with a high ERA look like a Cy Young candidate.:angry:

I suppose expecting Tampa Bay's lousy defense to bail us out for 3 games in a row is just too much to ask for.

The good news is that Detroit looks like they're on the ropes (though they still hold a 4.5 game lead) and Minnesota just dropped 2 of 3 at home to KC.:o: Also, Vazquez hasn't been horrible the last couple of starts. He's has had hot and cold streaks in recent years. If September turns out to be one of his "good" months, that would be a big plus.

NoShoesJoe
08-31-2006, 09:27 PM
It time to for Pods to either:
a) wallk the plank on the Palehose Six
b) be keelhauled under the Palehose Six

either way, Captain Hand has GOT to do something. Scotty was a complete buzz kill this series, after the great game on Sunday. 1 for 13? Holy crap! How many times did he get caught looking?

It's not only Scotty, I realize, but man, watching him at bat is painful. The bullpen blew it, the defense didn't help, and PK has GIDP way too many times. Ugh!

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 09:31 PM
I read posts like this all last season, and what did Konerko do in the playoffs? He came through with regularity.

Sorry, but this means nothing. If we're not comparing this team to last year's, then we're not comparing individuals either. This certainly does not mean that he will come through with regularity again.

Konerko's numbers are impressive, sure. But as Spiffie said, it's more of a gut feeling. Right now, I would feel much better with someone like BA up there in a clutch situation than Konerko.

Grzegorz
08-31-2006, 09:32 PM
Yes, and the defense blew an easy DP in the sixth inning and cost Vazquez a run. How big was that in a game that ended up going extra innings? The position players deserve their share of the blame.

Extremely big; gotta play defense to win games, pennants, and World Series.

NoShoesJoe
08-31-2006, 09:33 PM
Sorry, but this means nothing. If we're not comparing this team to last year's, then we're not comparing individuals either. This certainly does not mean that he will come through with regularity again.

Konerko's numbers are impressive, sure. But as Spiffie said, it's more of a gut feeling. Right now, I would feel much better with someone like BA up there in a clutch situation than Konerko.

One way to solve the regularity problem...
http://www.homegrocer.com/images/products/metamucil-contain.gif

rookie
08-31-2006, 09:57 PM
Tampa could have easily swept us this series.

Yep, and we also should have won the series againist the Twins this past weekend. So everything's kinda even. I know it's too much to ask that we keep gaining ground each series, but wouldn't that be nice?

JB98
08-31-2006, 09:59 PM
Sorry, but this means nothing. If we're not comparing this team to last year's, then we're not comparing individuals either. This certainly does not mean that he will come through with regularity again.

Konerko's numbers are impressive, sure. But as Spiffie said, it's more of a gut feeling. Right now, I would feel much better with someone like BA up there in a clutch situation than Konerko.

I'm sure opposing pitchers around the league would much rather face Konerko than BA.

Honestly, do you people think before you post?

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 10:04 PM
I'm sure opposing pitchers around the league would much rather face Konerko than BA.

Honestly, do you people think before you post?

How many times do you have to read a post before you understand it? Both Spiffie and I said it was what's described as a "gut feeling." Unreal.

JB98
08-31-2006, 10:06 PM
How many times do you have to read a post before you understand it? Both Spiffie and I said it was what's described as a "gut feeling." Unreal.

And I'm telling you that your gut feeling is unfounded and stupid.

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 10:07 PM
And I'm telling you that your gut feeling is unfounded and stupid.

Hahaha. Thanks for the best/worst post ever. You're telling me my gut feeling is wrong. :roflmao:

JB98
08-31-2006, 10:11 PM
Hahaha. Thanks for the best/worst post ever. You're telling me my gut feeling is wrong. :roflmao:

I didn't say it was wrong. I said it was unfounded and stupid. Call me when Brian Anderson hits a game-tying home run off Mariano Rivera in the bottom of the ninth, and then we'll talk.

thomas35forever
08-31-2006, 10:12 PM
It wasn't just the bullpen. The offense couldn't get anything together in the later innings. Oh well. We better get a Royal Flush over the weekend.

Ol' No. 2
08-31-2006, 10:13 PM
Hahaha. Thanks for the best/worst post ever. You're telling me my gut feeling is wrong. :roflmao:Gotta agree with JB on this one. If your gut is telling you you'd rather have Anderson at the plate than Konerko, it must be something you ate. Take some Ex-Lax. It will pass.

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 10:14 PM
I didn't say it was wrong. I said it was unfounded and stupid. Call me when Brian Anderson hits a game-tying home run off Mariano Rivera in the bottom of the ninth, and then we'll talk.

Right, I know about the past. Obviously Konerko has had HUGE hits in the past. All I'm saying is that right now, I have a better feeling about BA being at the plate than Konerko. There's really nothing to debate.

JB98
08-31-2006, 10:15 PM
Gotta agree with JB on this one. If your gut is telling you you'd rather have Anderson at the plate than Konerko, it must be something you ate. Take some Ex-Lax. It will pass.

Thanks for the support, No. 2. You and I do generally agree, unless the topic is what to do with Javier Vazquez. :rolleyes:

CubsfansareDRUNK
08-31-2006, 10:21 PM
Thanks for the support, No. 2. You and I do generally agree, unless the topic is what to do with Javier Vazquez. :rolleyes:

I agree with you too JB, i'm a big Paulholic as well. BA>Konerko :?:

Grzegorz
08-31-2006, 10:24 PM
Right, I know about the past. Obviously Konerko has had HUGE hits in the past. All I'm saying is that right now, I have a better feeling about BA being at the plate than Konerko. There's really nothing to debate.
I love the upside of BA, but between the two PK is who I'd rather have up in the clutch. Yep it's PK; his body of work is greater.

Anyway, we're getting off topic here. Pitching and defense are a winning combination. That combination eluded the White Sox today.

On to KC where I expect them to give us hell.

JB98
08-31-2006, 10:24 PM
I agree with you too JB, i'm a big Paulholic as well. BA>Konerko :?:

People around here should know by now that I'm protective of our power hitters. The thing I like best about the 2006 Sox is Thome, Konerko and Dye. We are NEVER out of a game because of those three.

0o0o0
08-31-2006, 10:29 PM
I agree with you too JB, i'm a big Paulholic as well. BA>Konerko :?:

Jeez, who knew it would be so hard to explain something so simple. I, not you guys, but me, I have a better feeling with Anderson batting in a clutch situation than Konerko right now. Why? I have no idea, I just do. That does not mean that I think BA is a better player than Konerko. It's just a feeling. That's it. I don't see how this can cause an argument. :?:

Brian26
09-01-2006, 12:11 AM
The worst part about this is that this team is very hard to like or love for any other reason than that they are the White Sox. I mean, it was easy to love last year's team. Scrappy underdogs playing their guts out every game and leaving everything on the field. This year, while some guys fit that bill, the overall team just seems very lackadaisical and uninterested. When players talk about not being able to focus because the game isn't big enough, and guys continue to make the same mistakes repeatedly, and there are guys who are always seen as disasters in wait, it takes a lot of the joy from the whole enterprise. When you read about people talking about last year's team, there was a sense of affection from lots of outside observers. Even in books about other things, like "Juicing the Game" or "3 Nights in August" the authors talked about how wonderful it was to watch the 2005 White Sox. Can you imagine anyone saying that about this team? Other than Dye and Jenks and Garland is there anyone who you can say you love to watch playing the game for any reason other than they are White Sox players?

It's disheartening. The whole thing just seems so off-center and off-balance. None of this means they won't win tomorrow, or go to the playoffs, or even win it all. But I wonder how many people here would say they like this team more than last years group.

Two problems with what you write (which I'll explain shortly), but I respect your feelings and the thought you put into it.

First off, you have to remember how you people felt about the team last year at this time (before the playoffs). There was a lot of angst, and nobody knew how it was going to turn out. Which leads into my second point...you seem to be romanticizing the 2005 team after the fact. That was by no means a perfect team, and a lot of the imperfections of that team have been forgotten since they won it all. If the Sox can just get into the playoffs, they easily have a team that could go all the way. And after another run of playoffs, everyone will feel just as happy about this year's team as last year's.

CaptainBallz
09-01-2006, 12:14 AM
I've reached a point of solace where I expect nothing more than a completely unnecessary loss during crunch time, knowing full well that they'll pull disgusting wins out of their asses later.

Tigers got served by the Yanks and continue to squeeze that golden horseshoe out while the Twinks lose 2 of 3 to KC. Sox are in the driver's seat, as crazy as it might seem.

batmanZoSo
09-01-2006, 12:14 AM
Sorry, but this means nothing. If we're not comparing this team to last year's, then we're not comparing individuals either. This certainly does not mean that he will come through with regularity again.

Konerko's numbers are impressive, sure. But as Spiffie said, it's more of a gut feeling. Right now, I would feel much better with someone like BA up there in a clutch situation than Konerko.

Ask me today? I would rather have BA, too. Of course Ozzie would rather have Mackowiak and let Pods hit. :rolleyes:

JB98
09-01-2006, 12:28 AM
Ask me today? I would rather have BA, too. Of course Ozzie would rather have Mackowiak and let Pods hit. :rolleyes:

Everyone talks about how great BA has been in August. And he has been solid. That said, Paulie's average is still 40 points higher than BA's over the course of the last month. I truthfully don't understand why everyone suddenly has more faith in BA than Konerko. :?:

Konerko in August: .336 avg., 3 HRs, 19 RBIs
BA in August: .296 avg., 1 HR, 7 RBIs

BA's home run gave the Sox a 9-0 lead in a game they won 12-2. Two of Konerko's three home runs came in late-inning pressure situations; one tied the game in the bottom of the ninth. The third home run gave the Sox a lead in the first inning.

Yeah, I get it. You're all talking about gut feelings. That doesn't mean it makes any sense to me.

itsnotrequired
09-01-2006, 09:20 AM
I hate it when the bullpen does this.

Sig update time...

SOXSINCE'70
09-01-2006, 09:24 AM
I hate it when the bullpen does this.

That makes 2 of us. SERENITY NOW!!!!:angry: :angry:

digdagdug23
09-01-2006, 09:29 AM
Two problems with what you write (which I'll explain shortly), but I respect your feelings and the thought you put into it.

First off, you have to remember how you people felt about the team last year at this time (before the playoffs). There was a lot of angst, and nobody knew how it was going to turn out. Which leads into my second point...you seem to be romanticizing the 2005 team after the fact. That was by no means a perfect team, and a lot of the imperfections of that team have been forgotten since they won it all. If the Sox can just get into the playoffs, they easily have a team that could go all the way. And after another run of playoffs, everyone will feel just as happy about this year's team as last year's.

:Rocker:

Couldn't agree more.

HerzogVon
09-01-2006, 10:01 AM
That settles it. We need Aaron Rowand back.

*runs away and hides*

No need to run or hide. We've missed Aaron all year. Breaking up the Three Stooges is a move KW is living to regret. Baseball is a game of chemistry. When Aaron was traded, the center of this team's gravity shifted from him, AJ and Crede to Konerko and his personal acquisition, Thome. The team has never been the same.

You can quote all the stats you want about Thome's production, but it will never offset what we lost. That's why they call them intangibles.

PITCH / FIELD / RUN / HIT ( In that order ) = CHAMPS!!!

itsnotrequired
09-01-2006, 10:03 AM
No need to run or hide. We've missed Aaron all year. Breaking up the Three Stooges is a move KW is living to regret. Baseball is a game of chemistry. When Aaron was traded, the center of this team's gravity shifted from him, AJ and Crede to Konerko and his personal acquisition, Thome. The team has never been the same.

You can quote all the stats you want about Thome's production, but it will never offset what we lost. That's why they call them intangibles.

PITCH / FIELD / RUN / HIT ( In that order ) = CHAMPS!!!

Rowand can't pitch either.

Jerko
09-01-2006, 10:08 AM
Yes it was a bad play, but to say you "hate" Gload? You're being a little too harsh.

I was also bitching about Gload on that non-DP, but he made a great play later in the game on that foul popup that he caught. That said, it would be nice for the STARTING first baseman to start at first more than once a week.

Hitmen77
09-01-2006, 10:17 AM
I've reached a point of solace where I expect nothing more than a completely unnecessary loss during crunch time, knowing full well that they'll pull disgusting wins out of their asses later.

Tigers got served by the Yanks and continue to squeeze that golden horseshoe out while the Twinks lose 2 of 3 to KC. Sox are in the driver's seat, as crazy as it might seem.

I don't think the Sox are in the drivers seat. That distinction belongs to the team that has a 4.5 game lead on Sept. 1 - the Tigers. I wouldn't even argue that the Sox are in the drivers seat over the Twins right now. Given our problems with winning at the Metrodome, I say the Sox have to take at least a 2 game lead into that final series - so we have, in a sense, ground to make up with the Twins too.

I am encouraged by the fact that both the Tigers and the Twins are sputtering of late. But, then again the Sox have been sputtering too.

Foulke You
09-01-2006, 02:08 PM
Rowand can't pitch either.
Amen to that. Rowand doesn't add that missing 4 mph to Freddy's fastball, Rowand doesn't correct the control problems of Jose Contreras, Rowand doesn't fix the problems with the front end of our bullpen (Cotts, Riske, etc), Rowand doesn't stop Javier Vazquez from wetting the bed every 6th inning, Rowand didn't make Mark Buehrle suck for 7 straight starts, etc. etc. etc.

Good lord, I haven't seen this much angst from a traded Sox player since...well, never really.:D:

southside rocks
09-01-2006, 02:24 PM
No need to run or hide. We've missed Aaron all year. Breaking up the Three Stooges is a move KW is living to regret. Baseball is a game of chemistry. When Aaron was traded, the center of this team's gravity shifted from him, AJ and Crede to Konerko and his personal acquisition, Thome. The team has never been the same.


IMO that's just silly, and sounds a lot like the thinking among fans of the north side ballclub: oooh, Bartman cost us the World Series; oooh, the curse of the goat; oooh, we can't win without D-Lee.

For all the people who think that the absence of Aaron Rowand has taken away any chance the White Sox have to win now or in the future: what about the fact that the very act of winning the World Series changes the chemistry of ANY team? No longer are they the underestimated underdogs, predicted to finish third at best, surprising everyone -- including themselves -- with their season. Now they're the World Champion Chicago White Sox. More than a few of the players grew up, as baseball players, in the post-season last year. Joe Crede is light-years ahead of the player he was last year. Bobby Jenks gained about a decade of confidence and experience in one month last fall. AJ Pierzynski added a layer of maturity and responsibility to his Dennis the Menace character. Paul Konerko became the team captain that he is today.

These aren't the same guys they were in August 2005. And if you bring Aaron Rowand back, it won't be the same group it was last year.

We can't live 2005 over again. Aaron Rowand will forever be the poster boy for 2005, but bringing him back won't magically transport the team to that amazing year.

TomBradley72
09-01-2006, 03:23 PM
I don't understand Ozzie's use of Brandon yesterday...if he was warming up in the 4th inning and you doin't bring him in...I think you sit him for the day vs. bring him in 5 innings later. I would have gone with MacDougal there.

JB98
09-01-2006, 03:48 PM
Rowand can't pitch either.

Bingo. We've needed Thome's offense to offset the fact that our pitching staff blows. If Rowand hadn't been traded for Thome, we'd be below .500 right now. Intangibles don't win games. Talent and execution win games. The pitching staff hasn't executed, and Rowand's presence would have done nothing to change that.

The Immigrant
09-01-2006, 04:07 PM
If Rowand hadn't been traded for Thome, we'd be below .500 right now.

I wasn't aware that Jim Thome single-handedly won 23 games for us.

JB98
09-01-2006, 06:46 PM
I wasn't aware that Jim Thome single-handedly won 23 games for us.

Maybe not, but I'll bet he's been a determining factor in about 12 wins. Take 12 wins off our ledger, and we are 66-67. Remember, Thome carried this offense the first six weeks of the season.

We've been about .500 in games that Jim has not started this year, including 2-3 in the last week.