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Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:12 PM
With all the rumors out there that A Rod might get traded.. I would love to see the Sox go out and get him..

Here would be my deal
Crede
B Mac
C Haeger

Sox would get
A Rod and the yanks would pay half of his salary for the next 4 years

SOecks
07-23-2006, 07:15 PM
I'm not going to get on you and be a jerk, but I really think this is a bad idea. Why would we want to severely hurt our defense and cripple an already "shaky" bullpen to get a guy with great offensive numbers? Hell, I don't know if I'd take ARod straight up for Crede.

Scottiehaswheels
07-23-2006, 07:15 PM
No! Never! Nein!

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:17 PM
A Rod is probably the best ball player of the last 30 years and to put him in our lineup would be so dam amazing...

chaotic8512
07-23-2006, 07:19 PM
Sorry. No freakin' way. Not only are you trading our future, but you're killing our defense... Alex Rodriguez doesn't fit in with the clubhouse either.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:19 PM
I'm not going to get on you and be a jerk, but I really think this is a bad idea. Why would we want to severely hurt our defense and cripple an already "shaky" bullpen to get a guy with great offensive numbers? Hell, I don't know if I'd take ARod straight up for Crede.

plus A Rod is a great defensive player so how would he hurt our defense

Scottiehaswheels
07-23-2006, 07:20 PM
plus A Rod is a great defensive player so how would he hurt our defenseHe as like 16 errors already this year? Sorry make that 18

SOecks
07-23-2006, 07:21 PM
A Rod is probably the best ball player of the last 30 years and to put him in our lineup would be so dam amazing...

Yes, the batting lineup would be better, but that's not where we have any needs right now. The games we have been losing is because of pitching. Yeah we scored little in the last few games, but we have one of the best and most balanced lineups in the league. No way am I going to give up a cheap 3rd baseman with gold glove defense and our best prospect (Brandon is a starting pitcher prospect in my book still) for an expensive, hard hitting, poor defense playing, out of position 3rd baseman. My idea for a wacky trade right now would be something involving Prior and Vazquez which I know I'd be reamed for. That makes a ton more sense to me but what the hell do I know.

rowand33
07-23-2006, 07:26 PM
1) terrible trade.

2) I think that Haeger is greatly overvalued on WSI.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:27 PM
Yes, the batting lineup would be better, but that's not where we have any needs right now. The games we have been losing is because of pitching. Yeah we scored little in the last few games, but we have one of the best and most balanced lineups in the league. No way am I going to give up a cheap 3rd baseman with gold glove defense and our best prospect (Brandon is a starting pitcher prospect in my book still) for an expensive, hard hitting, poor defense playing, out of position 3rd baseman. My idea for a wacky trade right now would be something involving Prior and Vazquez which I know I'd be reamed for. That makes a ton more sense to me but what the hell do I know.

I would have A Rod playing SS in 07 and send Uribe packing and pick up a 3rd baseman.

WMG
07-23-2006, 07:28 PM
Hell, I don't know if I'd take ARod straight up for Crede.

You have to be sipping the Kool Aid today right?:gulp:

I love Joe just as much as the next guy, and I prolly harp on defense twice as much as the next guy.........

But c'mon Arod has a great chance to be the greatest player in baseball history.

Britt Burns
07-23-2006, 07:33 PM
Nooooo! ARod would totally change the complexion of this team, and not for the better. He already is a bit of a sulker, can you imagine how he would react after Ozzie ripped on him for something? Forget the long-term consequences of this deal (no McCarthy, lots of extra payroll, etc.), our problem this year is preventing runs, not scoring them, and Joe is light-years ahead of ARod defensively right now.

kittle42
07-23-2006, 07:38 PM
This is terrible, this idea.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 07:40 PM
You have to be sipping the Kool Aid today right?:gulp:

I love Joe just as much as the next guy, and I prolly harp on defense twice as much as the next guy.........

But c'mon Arod has a great chance to be the greatest player in baseball history.

No Kool Aid at all, seriously. Think of overall VALUE (player cost, offense, defense, personality) and I don't think ARod holds a candle to Crede RIGHT NOW. It sounds like you're thinking historically on ARod and you're right, looking at his past he's been incredible. But look at what he's been recently, his pay, and his defense. Joe is cheap as hell right now which gives us leeway to sign other high paying players. He plays great defense to support our championship model of "Pitching and defense wins". He's clutch and hits for power and now average this year.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:41 PM
Nooooo! ARod would totally change the complexion of this team, and not for the better. He already is a bit of a sulker, can you imagine how he would react after Ozzie ripped on him for something? Forget the long-term consequences of this deal (no McCarthy, lots of extra payroll, etc.), our problem this year is preventing runs, not scoring them, and Joe is light-years ahead of ARod defensively right now.


I enjoy having B Mac on the Sox but he is not even in the top 20 young pitchers in the game today. Where A Rod is probably the best player to ever play the game..

I can imagine A Rod hitting 50Hr's a year

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 07:43 PM
No Kool Aid at all, seriously. Think of overall VALUE (player cost, offense, defense, personality) and I don't think ARod holds a candle to Crede RIGHT NOW. It sounds like you're thinking historically on ARod and you're right, looking at his past he's been incredible. But look at what he's been recently, his pay, and his defense. Joe is cheap as hell right now which gives us leeway to sign other high paying players. He plays great defense to support our championship model of "Pitching and defense wins". He's clutch and hits for power and now average this year.

Some people dont like playing in NY and their stats drop because of the pressure look at Contreras for example...

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 07:46 PM
Switch Crede with Uribe and move Arod back to short where he was unfreakinbelievable for how many years. Throw in Jerry Owens for the downgrade to Uribe.

MarySwiss
07-23-2006, 07:46 PM
I would have A Rod playing SS in 07 and send Uribe packing and pick up a 3rd baseman.

Way to go. You just made a bad idea worse.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 07:47 PM
Some people dont like playing in NY and their stats drop because of the pressure look at Contreras for example...

I'm not going to argue with that point as it is legitimate. But you haven't addressed any of the other points I've made. Value, defense, Sox need, etc. They don't need more offense. They need quality starting, defense and definately a bullpen arm. ARod solves none of those issues and is expensive even if the Yankees pay half of his salary. He is absolutely not what we need for this team.

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 07:54 PM
In defense of AROD, I dont think adding more O is ever a bad thing. Our 3-4-5 have been VERY hit or miss since the break. He is a major upgrade over everyone not named Konerko or Thome. He is an unreal hitter, and I mean, COMMON this guy was the AL MVP last year. But to say we dont need offense when we went on a big slide of not hitting, there is never too much of a good thing.

Everywhere he goes he fits in well, he has the yankee players defending him, i dont think he will poorly effect the clubhouse.

His defense at short has always been great and at 3rd he is just out of position. I think a move back to short would be great for him.

I also think he would take a ton of pressure off the pitchers and the offense.

He also comes in to an area that has a good deal of people who are hispanic both in the community and the clubhouse, which was important to him when he negotiated his deal.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 07:59 PM
Domeshot, I'm not going to disagree with you on any of that. But none of it takes into consideration what we'd have to give up to get him. Plus the salary burden that would be required in comparison to the low cost players we'd send to NY. It just doesn't make business or baseball sense. I'm not saying he's not a great player, just not a fit for us right now.

viagracat
07-23-2006, 08:04 PM
Tell ya the truth, straight up ARod for Crede; I'd take my chances with Crede right now.

Brian26
07-23-2006, 08:04 PM
A Rod is probably the best ball player of the last 30 years and to put him in our lineup would be so dam amazing...

I want to watch the best team in baseball, not the best player.

voodoochile
07-23-2006, 08:05 PM
Crazy is the right word.

NO!

EDIT: Why would the Yankees do this if ARod is such a force?

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:10 PM
I want to watch the best team in baseball, not the best player.

A Rod would make the Sox a better team. I bet if KW went to the Yanks with this same proposal the Yanks would turn down the deal..

MarySwiss
07-23-2006, 08:19 PM
A Rod would make the Sox a better team. I bet if KW went to the Yanks with this same proposal the Yanks would turn down the deal..

Well, then why the hell did you start this thread? :?:

A. Cavatica
07-23-2006, 08:19 PM
A-Rod is less than meets the eye.

How many rings does he have? Crede has one.

CWSpalehoseCWS
07-23-2006, 08:22 PM
I would rather choose death than see a deal like this go down.

A. Cavatica
07-23-2006, 08:25 PM
I would rather choose death than see a deal like this go down.


Yes, I would also prefer to see A-Rod dead than on the Sox.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:25 PM
If I remember correctly last july about 80% of the people on this board wanted to get rid of Crede...

Chips
07-23-2006, 08:26 PM
Yes, I would also prefer to see A-Rod dead than on the Sox.

:rolleyes: Welcome to my ignore list.

MRM
07-23-2006, 08:31 PM
With all the rumors out there that A Rod might get traded.. I would love to see the Sox go out and get him..

Here would be my deal
Crede
B Mac
C Haeger

Sox would get
A Rod and the yanks would pay half of his salary for the next 4 years

This would be a historically bad trade. You are giving up gold glove quality defense (and a good bat) at third, a quality starting pitcher, and a solid pitching prospect. For what? Absolutely horrid D at 3rd but a solid bat in the 6 hole? ARod is a horrible 3B and is way over priced. Slight upgrade offensively, huge downgrade defensively.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 08:37 PM
Whitesox4ever, you STILL haven't addressed any of the points I have made. Feel free to respond even if it was straight up Crede for ARod. You keep glossing over things talking about hitting. What about everything else? Your posts look to be reaching trolling territory IMO by ignoring legitimate points and continuing to say "he's been a great hitter so far in his career".

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:40 PM
This would be a historically bad trade. You are giving up gold glove quality defense (and a good bat) at third, a quality starting pitcher, and a solid pitching prospect. For what? Absolutely horrid D at 3rd but a solid bat in the 6 hole? ARod is a horrible 3B and is way over priced. Slight upgrade offensively, huge downgrade defensively.


Scott Ruffcorn was also a solid pitching prospect as well as many other players that fans over estimated their value, until they perform in the majors.
I will trade a prospect, a good 3B and potentially a player who might put up good numbers for a future HOF who is still in his prime and would be the best hitter on the Sox..

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:45 PM
Whitesox4ever, you STILL haven't addressed any of the points I have made. Feel free to respond even if it was straight up Crede for ARod. You keep glossing over things talking about hitting. What about everything else? Your posts look to be reaching trolling territory IMO by ignoring legitimate points and continuing to say "he's been a great hitter so far in his career".


Yes Crede is a better defensive player than A Rod is but I would take A Rod over Crede any day.

If the Sox had a great 1b like a player like Nick Johnson and the Sox had the chance to get Pujlos some of you wouldn't want that deal because of great defensive play of Johnson

Chips
07-23-2006, 08:45 PM
Yes Crede is a better defensive player than A Rod is but I would take A Rod over Crede any day.

If the Sox had a great 1b like a player like Nick Johnson and the Sox had the chance to get Pujlos some of you wouldn't want that deal because of great defensive play of Johnson

The Sox have a great firstbaseman named Paul Konerko.

oeo
07-23-2006, 08:47 PM
With all the rumors out there that A Rod might get traded.. I would love to see the Sox go out and get him..

Here would be my deal
Crede
B Mac
C Haeger

Sox would get
A Rod and the yanks would pay half of his salary for the next 4 years
Whenever A-Rod leaves the Yankees, he'll probably head back to shortstop where he should be right now.

BTW...bad idea, this team does not need him.

Yes Crede is a better defensive player than A Rod is but I would take A Rod over Crede any day.

If the Sox had a great 1b like a player like Nick Johnson and the Sox had the chance to get Pujlos some of you wouldn't want that deal because of great defensive play of Johnson

Not for that deal, I wouldn't. At least not now. 1.) They don't need him and 2.) We're already down one righty in the pen...you want to make it two? No thanks, I want to win this year and beyond.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:48 PM
The Sox have a great firstbaseman named Paul Konerko.

Konerko is a great 1B but I dont ever see him winning a gold glove but I would never give up Paulie...

SOecks
07-23-2006, 08:49 PM
Yes Crede is a better defensive player than A Rod is but I would take A Rod over Crede any day.

If the Sox had a great 1b like a player like Nick Johnson and the Sox had the chance to get Pujlos some of you wouldn't want that deal because of great defensive play of Johnson

Again you fail to address my points of the WHOLE package. Your first post of giving up that much is a joke. I also think the straight up deal is a bad one for the Sox and you only reply with your Johnson/Pujols argument whithout talking about MONEY or the fact that the Sox do not need more offense but better relief pitching and more consistent staring pitching. There is no need on this team for more hitting. It's not softball, it's major league baseball.

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:49 PM
Whitesox4ever, you STILL haven't addressed any of the points I have made. Feel free to respond even if it was straight up Crede for ARod. You keep glossing over things talking about hitting. What about everything else? Your posts look to be reaching trolling territory IMO by ignoring legitimate points and continuing to say "he's been a great hitter so far in his career".

Anwser me this did you want to get rid of Crede last year

Whitesox4ever
07-23-2006, 08:52 PM
Again you fail to address my points of the WHOLE package. Your first post of giving up that much is a joke. I also think the straight up deal is a bad one for the Sox and you only reply with your Johnson/Pujols argument whithout talking about MONEY or the fact that the Sox do not need more offense but better relief pitching and more consistent staring pitching. There is no need on this team for more hitting. It's not softball, it's major league baseball.

you dont think Pujlos is going to be one of the highest pay players... If the Sox starting pitchers live up to their potential I dont see going out getting another starter but you're right I would like to see the Sox go out and get 1 or 2 bullpen arms

SOecks
07-23-2006, 08:55 PM
Anwser me this did you want to get rid of Crede last year

Absolutely not, I wanted to keep him the entire time. And what does this have to do with anything in looking at the needs of this years team? Please address my above posts.

Chips
07-23-2006, 08:56 PM
you dont think Pujlos is going to be one of the highest pay players... If the Sox starting pitchers live up to their potential I dont see going out getting another starter but you're right I would like to see the Sox go out and get 1 or 2 bullpen arms

Are you going to respond to any of SOecks points or what?

You don't have to answer this because another one bites the dust.

MRM
07-23-2006, 08:57 PM
Scott Ruffcorn was also a solid pitching prospect as well as many other players that fans over estimated their value, until they perform in the majors.
I will trade a prospect, a good 3B and potentially a player who might put up good numbers for a future HOF who is still in his prime and would be the best hitter on the Sox..

What do his HOF credentials have to do with it? All those HRs in Seattle, Texas, and NY have nothing to do with the Sox.

As for being the best hitter on the team, that would be wrong by a long shot. Right now he'd be behind Konerko, Thome, Dye...oh, and that Crede guy, too.

ARod - .277 21HRs 71RBI .878OPS
Crede- .297 20HRs 64RBI .874OPS

And lets not forget ARod is a #4 hitter while Joe is a #7, more than accounting for the slight difference in RBI.

So you want to make a huge downgrade in defense, and give up two promissing pitchers, for virtually identical numbers and a huge salary addition?

Oh, and ARod will be 31 next week. Hitting the back end of "his prime" while Joe, at 27, is just entering his.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 08:58 PM
you dont think Pujlos is going to be one of the highest pay players... If the Sox starting pitchers live up to their potential I dont see going out getting another starter but you're right I would like to see the Sox go out and get 1 or 2 bullpen arms

This has nothing to do with Pujols, just the trade you proposed. And in that trade you want to give up one of our current bullpen arms (Brandon) and one of the best defensive players in the league (Crede) who is currently on pace for a career year at low cost to the team. Then you agree that you'd like to see us get more bullpen. Why would you give up Brandon in the bullpen when you admit we need bullpen right now anyways? Nothing makes sense to me here. My hair is getting grey by the minute...

SOecks
07-23-2006, 09:01 PM
And lets not forget ARod is a #4 hitter while Joe is a #7, more than accounting for the slight difference in RBI.

Yup. He's batting #7 with two streaky and shaky hitters behind him all year so you know he's not getting meatballs to hit. Not like Uribe and Anderson have been giving him protection in the lineup all year and his numbers are still this good. And lets not forget defense and salary...

chisoxmike
07-23-2006, 09:05 PM
Another bad, stupid, and pointless trade "idea" thread before the deadline.

A lot of people think the MLB trading deadline is like their fantasy team...you may be able to do this there but not in the majors.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 09:15 PM
Another bad, stupid, and pointless trade "idea" thread before the deadline.

A lot of people think the MLB trading deadline is like their fantasy team...you may be able to do this there but not in the majors.

I don't mind reading or posting in threads like this if someone has good arguments to make. I'll also gladly concede if they are right on something. This thread just makes no sense to me though and the original poster keeps thinking up new random analogies to post that have nothing to do with his original trade idea and keeps ignoring everyones points.

SOecks
07-23-2006, 09:26 PM
I'm not going to make my own thread on it, but here's a nutty trade I thought of and I'll back it up with the following...

Sox trade Vazquez to Cubs
Cubs trade Prior to Sox

Throw in a couple of extra guys if you want to sweeten the deal either way, but this makes sense to me for a couple of reasons. First, Vazquez has been awesome to start games but rarely has gotten out of the 5th or 6th inning. He's pretty expensive and has increased the load on our depleated bullpen. Plus he's pitched well in the NL so is attractive to the Cubs in the future.

Sox put McCarthy in the starting rotation to replace Vazquez and make the trade conditionally on Prior accepting a bullpen assignment for this year. Prior is cheap, has a great arm, and IMO has faltered because of the team, system, and coaches he's played for since he's come up to the bigs. A team like the Sox would bring the best out of him. It would also clear up salary space for KW to make other moves this year or next that would require additional salary. If McCarthy falters in any starts, Prior is your long reliever (just like McCarthy is now) and can give you a few innings of relief if necessary. This will also give KW leverage in the off season to unload one of his starting pitchers for whatever is needed at the time. Yes there's holes in this idea but it's a lot more sensible than the points you have made so far.

eastchicagosoxfan
07-23-2006, 09:35 PM
I'm not going to get on you and be a jerk, but I really think this is a bad idea. Why would we want to severely hurt our defense and cripple an already "shaky" bullpen to get a guy with great offensive numbers? Hell, I don't know if I'd take ARod straight up for Crede.
I look back at all those World Titles Cleveland won with that killer line-up in the late 1980's and early 1990's.

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 09:40 PM
I look back at all those World Titles Cleveland won with that killer line-up in the late 1980's and early 1990's.
quick whats the number for 911

rowand33
07-23-2006, 09:43 PM
I don't know how this thread is still going.

whitesox4ever: not only would your idea never happen, it's genuinely a terrible idea. If you think it's great, call into a sports radio show with it. You'll get blasted.

Crede is a gold glove caliber 3B that is on pace to hti .300 and have 30 HR and 100 RBI batting 7th.

B.Mac (if he isn't traded at the deadline, and I'll be shocked if he is) is set to be a fixture in our rotation for years. You say he isn't even one of the top young pitchers... when has he had a chance to pitch to even prove that? The closest thing we have is the second half of last season, when he went 3-1 with a 1.69 ERA. The kid is going to be a star.

Thus...

B.Mac + Crede > ARod.

ARod would provide 10 more HR and 30 more RBI per season. That's not worth the defensive downgrade and losing a good young picher.

how this thread has went on for this long, I can not understand.

MRM
07-23-2006, 09:43 PM
I'm not going to make my own thread on it, but here's a nutty trade I thought of and I'll back it up with the following...

Sox trade Vazquez to Cubs
Cubs trade Prior to Sox

Throw in a couple of extra guys if you want to sweeten the deal either way, but this makes sense to me for a couple of reasons. First, Vazquez has been awesome to start games but rarely has gotten out of the 5th or 6th inning. He's pretty expensive and has increased the load on our depleated bullpen. Plus he's pitched well in the NL so is attractive to the Cubs in the future.

Sox put McCarthy in the starting rotation to replace Vazquez and make the trade conditionally on Prior accepting a bullpen assignment for this year. Prior is cheap, has a great arm, and IMO has faltered because of the team, system, and coaches he's played for since he's come up to the bigs. A team like the Sox would bring the best out of him. It would also clear up salary space for KW to make other moves this year or next that would require additional salary. If McCarthy falters in any starts, Prior is your long reliever (just like McCarthy is now) and can give you a few innings of relief if necessary. This will also give KW leverage in the off season to unload one of his starting pitchers for whatever is needed at the time. Yes there's holes in this idea but it's a lot more sensible than the points you have made so far.

A Sox fan would have to be a fool not to love the idea of Vazques for Prior :D:. No way on earth the Cubs would ever consider it. Javy just turned 30, has a huge salary, and is a career .500 pitcher with a career ERA approaching 4.5. Prior, when healthy (I know, I know) is one of the best pitchers in the game, is only 25, and makes a third of what Vazquez does.

But hey, if the Cubs are dumb enough to do a deal like that, lets get Zambrano for Freddie while we're at it.:D:

y2j2785
07-23-2006, 09:52 PM
Another bad, stupid, and pointless trade "idea" thread before the deadline.

A lot of people think the MLB trading deadline is like their fantasy team...you may be able to do this there but not in the majors.

I agree with you here. Just go to the message boards on Whitesox.com. They got a guy who wants to trade Thome for Carlos Lee. They also got anothey guy who wants to trade Crede for Mike Cameron. How much stupider can these ideas get?

SOecks
07-23-2006, 09:56 PM
A Sox fan would have to be a fool not to love the idea of Vazques for Prior :D:. No way on earth the Cubs would ever consider it. Javy just turned 30, has a huge salary, and is a career .500 pitcher with a career ERA approaching 4.5. Prior, when healthy (I know, I know) is one of the best pitchers in the game, is only 25, and makes a third of what Vazquez does.

But hey, if the Cubs are dumb enough to do a deal like that, lets get Zambrano for Freddie while we're at it.:D:

I don't know about everyone loving the idea because of the injury and "soft player" issues Prior has. Javy has been and would project to be a very solid NL pitcher. He also will start every 5th day, unlike Prior's track record. The Cubs will then have Zambrano, Vazquez, Marshall, ???, ??? in 2007 instead of dealing with the constant Prior soap opera and subsequent media fallout. The Sox dump a bunch of salary and take on a guy with risk and questionable history. However when you look at Thornton, Jenks, Loaiza, etc the Sox have a history of bringing guys to their potential. Sox scouting would need to weigh in obviously but I don't think the idea is that outlandish for either side and benefits both equally overall.

MRM
07-23-2006, 09:59 PM
How much stupider can these ideas get?

Don't ask, we still have a week to go. :D:

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 10:01 PM
heres a good trade idea

os get
sweeney
heager
Rich Hill
Uribe

Sox get
Prior
Tejada

Cubs get
Widger
Matt Karchner

Chips
07-23-2006, 10:05 PM
heres a good trade idea

os get
sweeney
heager
Rich Hill
Uribe

Sox get
Prior
Tejada

Cubs get
Widger
Matt Karchner
:rolleyes: What is your definition of good?

Frater Perdurabo
07-23-2006, 10:13 PM
Cubs get
Widger
Matt Karchner

:)

MRM
07-23-2006, 10:17 PM
I don't know about everyone loving the idea because of the injury and "soft player" issues Prior has. Javy has been and would project to be a very solid NL pitcher. He also will start every 5th day, unlike Prior's track record. The Cubs will then have Zambrano, Vazquez, Marshall, ???, ??? in 2007 instead of dealing with the constant Prior soap opera and subsequent media fallout. The Sox dump a bunch of salary and take on a guy with risk and questionable history. However when you look at Thornton, Jenks, Loaiza, etc the Sox have a history of bringing guys to their potential. Sox scouting would need to weigh in obviously but I don't think the idea is that outlandish for either side and benefits both equally overall.

I don't see any "benefit" to the Cubs at all, and certainly not equal value. We don't have to project what Vazquez would do in the NL, he pitched there for a full season last year. Went 11-15 with a 4.42ERA...not real impressive. He had a three year stretch in Montreal where he was pretty good, but that was 3 years ago. Prior hasn't hit his prime yet, while Javy has backslid pretty badly over the last three years. The trend certainly doesn't favor him turning back into the pitcher he was in Montreal.

I'm all for fleecing the Cubs, but not a chance they are dumb enough to do this deal. I doubt they'd do it for Garland, but certainly not for Javy or Freddie. I mean your talking about taking a bottom of the rotation guy in exchange for a potential ace and then paying the new guy 3 times the salary. I can't see the Cubs even considering trading Prior since they couldn't get any where near full value for him right now, anyhow.

bigfoot
07-23-2006, 10:18 PM
[
Cubs get
Widger
Matt Karchner[/quote]

....and Jaime Navarro!!!!:supernana:

Tragg
07-23-2006, 10:53 PM
With all the rumors out there that A Rod might get traded.. I would love to see the Sox go out and get him..

Here would be my deal
Crede
B Mac
C Haeger

Sox would get
A Rod and the yanks would pay half of his salary for the next 4 years
That would be one horrible trade for the Sox.
We need pitching, so let's trade our best young pitcher.

FWIW, the people in Seattle said the same thing abut A Rod that the Yanks fan say.

kittle42
07-23-2006, 10:58 PM
Konerko is a great 1B but I dont ever see him winning a gold glove but I would never give up Paulie...

Not even for Rodriguez?

santo=dorf
07-23-2006, 11:03 PM
A-Rod is less than meets the eye.

How many rings does he have? Crede has one.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

The Sox just released Ex-World Champion Chris Widger today. Bad move?

Anyone who wouldn't take A-Rod over Crede needs to really look over the numbers. A-Rod is going to be a hall of famer, one of the greats in the game and will finish with around 800 homers.


This trade idea is beyond silly as it makes no sense for the Yankees to pay that much money.

santo=dorf
07-23-2006, 11:06 PM
What do his HOF credentials have to do with it? All those HRs in Seattle, Texas, and NY have nothing to do with the Sox.

As for being the best hitter on the team, that would be wrong by a long shot. Right now he'd be behind Konerko, Thome, Dye...oh, and that Crede guy, too.

ARod - .277 21HRs 71RBI .878OPS
Crede- .297 20HRs 64RBI .874OPS

And lets not forget ARod is a #4 hitter while Joe is a #7, more than accounting for the slight difference in RBI.

So you want to make a huge downgrade in defense, and give up two promissing pitchers, for virtually identical numbers and a huge salary addition?

Oh, and ARod will be 31 next week. Hitting the back end of "his prime" while Joe, at 27, is just entering his.
A-Rod in his prime>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Crede in his prime
A-Rod leaving his prime>>>>>>>Crede in his prime
A-Rod "washed up" (for him)>Crede in his prime
Crede in his prime> A-Rod coming out of the nursing home to become the backup catcher for the White Sox.

Tragg
07-23-2006, 11:06 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

The Sox just released Ex-World Champion Chris Widger today. Bad move?

Anyone who wouldn't take A-Rod over Crede needs to really look over the numbers. A-Rod is going to be a hall of famer, one of the greats in the game and will finish with around 800 homers.


This trade idea is beyond silly as it makes no sense for the Yankees to pay that much money. Well, sure, Crede for A Rod; but as proposed on here, it would make a lot of sense for NY (younger, cheaper, more pitching) and exactly none for us (older, more expensive, bye bye good young pitchers).

santo=dorf
07-23-2006, 11:09 PM
Well, sure, Crede for A Rod; but as proposed on here, it would make a lot of sense for NY (younger, cheaper, more pitching) and exactly none for us (older, more expensive, bye bye good young pitchers).
Don't you think New York could get more, better, young pitchers for A-Rod and not give up as much money?

At this point I really don't think Haeger effects the White Sox, so I will not be concerned if/when he traded this July.

MRM
07-23-2006, 11:16 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

The Sox just released Ex-World Champion Chris Widger today. Bad move?

Anyone who wouldn't take A-Rod over Crede needs to really look over the numbers. A-Rod is going to be a hall of famer, one of the greats in the game and will finish with around 800 homers.


This trade idea is beyond silly as it makes no sense for the Yankees to pay that much money.

This proposal wasn't ARod for Crede straight up. And, again, the numbers he put up in Seattle, Texas, and NY have nothing to do with the Sox.

As far as 800 homers, highly unlikely. He's 31. To get to 800 he'd have to average 35/yr for another decade. I seriously doubt he plays until he's 41 so you are more likely looking at hitting 50/yr for the next 7 years, or so. Not a chance he does that.

MRM
07-23-2006, 11:17 PM
A-Rod in his prime>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>>Crede in his prime
A-Rod leaving his prime>>>>>>>Crede in his prime
A-Rod "washed up" (for him)>Crede in his prime
Crede in his prime> A-Rod coming out of the nursing home to become the backup catcher for the White Sox.

Except the numbers say you are wrong.

whitesoxfan1986
07-23-2006, 11:23 PM
I've always wanted to see what Prior could do on some other team than the Flubs. There have been times when I have wanted him on the Sox.:o: I drool over Prior's potential and I think that if he was on the Sox then he would win multiple Cy Youngs. My only fear if the Sox actually picked him up would be that his arm is so ****ed up from overuse by Crusty Baker that he is done(which may be the case due to his current outings) It is so sad to see talent like he and Kerry Wood has/had(Wood was pretty talented too) wasted not because of drugs, alcohol, or trouble with the law,or other personal issues, but because of the incompetence of the team that they play for.

MRM
07-23-2006, 11:28 PM
Don't you think New York could get more, better, young pitchers for A-Rod and not give up as much money?

Not AND a Joe Crede they couldn't, no. ARod is a SS, not a 3B. If you are looking for a SS do you take on ARod and his $25mil/contract AND give up a ton of talent or do you go get Tejada for half the price and half the talent? If you are looking for a 3B and are willing to part with a lot of talent do you go after ARod and his inflated salary or do you go after Miguel Cabrera?

ARod was worth these kind of deals 5 years ago. Now there are simply better, cheaper, younger options out there. ARod isn't getting younger and his offensive numbers right now are slightly worse than Crede's. His defense at 3rd is far worse than Crede's.

santo=dorf
07-23-2006, 11:29 PM
As far as 800 homers, highly unlikely. He's 31. To get to 800 he'd have to average 35/yr for another decade. I seriously doubt he plays until he's 41 so you are more likely looking at hitting 50/yr for the next 7 years, or so. Not a chance he does that.

Why don't you think he'll play until he's 40? :?:

Except the numbers say you are wrong.
Feel free to get back to me when Crede wins a gold glove, is the MVP, hits 50+ homers, 140+ RBI's, 46 SB's in a season some point in his career. A-Rod's career low in OPS is .846 (9 years ago) and Crede's career high is .826 (2002.)

I really don't get what's the point in comparing Crede in his peak to A-Rod going through a tough stretch.

I also don't know what makes people think (namely cub fans) that A-Rod is on the block because a bunch of obnoxious New Yorkers don't like him striking out with a runner on first.

MRM
07-23-2006, 11:33 PM
I've always wanted to see what Prior could do on some other team than the Flubs. There have been times when I have wanted him on the Sox.:o: I drool over Prior's potential and I think that if he was on the Sox then he would win multiple Cy Youngs. My only fear if the Sox actually picked him up would be that his arm is so ****ed up from overuse by Crusty Baker that he is done(which may be the case due to his current outings) It is so sad to see talent like he and Kerry Wood has/had(Wood was pretty talented too) wasted not because of drugs, alcohol, or trouble with the law,or other personal issues, but because of the incompetence of the team that they play for.

Prior hasn't been over used. He's only pitched more than 166 innings in a year once. His injuries have been more of the freak accident type. And, I can't say this enough, he's only 25 years old.

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 11:47 PM
the numbers dont say he is wrong. Crede is a very good, 2nd tier of 3b. He is not in that top 3 or 4 elite, but hes in the next 3 or 4. He has done it for 1 post season and 1 season. I love crede, he is one of my fav players on the sox, but Arod was the mvp last year the fastest player ever to 450 home runs, 7th fastest to 2000 hits. Maybe dollar for dollar they even out but Arod is the best player to put on a jersey in a long, long time. And By all accounts, that is even more impressive because he seems to be steroid free.

MRM
07-23-2006, 11:50 PM
Why don't you think he'll play until he's 40? :?:


Feel free to get back to me when Crede wins a gold glove, is the MVP, hits 50+ homers, 140+ RBI's, 46 SB's in a season some point in his career. A-Rod's career low in OPS is .846 (9 years ago) and Crede's career high is .826 (2002.)

I really don't get what's the point in comparing Crede in his peak to A-Rod going through a tough stretch.

I also don't know what makes people think (namely cub fans) that A-Rod is on the block because a bunch of obnoxious New Yorkers don't like him striking out with a runner on first.

What ARod did in the past is IN THE PAST. It doesn't make the least bit of difference to what he's doing NOW, nor is a 50hr 140rbi season 4 years ago indicative of the future. Right NOW his numbers are slightly lower than Crede's.

As far as Crede being at his "peak", that's just silly. Joe just turned 27, the age when MOST players are just reaching their prime. ARod will be 31 next week, an age when MOST players start declining. ARod isn't likely going to have anymore 57HR 142RBI seasons, nor is he ever going to steal 46 bases again so those numbers are meaningless for purposes of trade discussions.

I"m not predicting ARod is about to fall off the map or that Crede will ever reach such lofty numbers. My point is this trade proposal is ridiculous for numerous reasons, one of which is that ARod is no better offensively than Crede is RIGHT NOW and is a liability defensively. Oh, and Crede is $22million cheaper.

Domeshot17
07-23-2006, 11:55 PM
you get Arod out of new york, and I would bet the farm he wins atleast 2 more MVP. The guys is flat out the best player in baseball. You watch him move, he is a very young 30-31.Barring Injuries, he will break Hank Aarons home run record, which means hes got a good 300-350 more home runs in him. He is a good base runner, and has a great glove. He is mentally worn out in New York. anyone who has played the game knows what its like to go bad for a few weeks, and you try so hard not to mess up you do even worse. Doesnt help you get boo'd by 50,000 people a day and read how bad you suck in the papers and hear it on the radio. Look what Contreras did out of new york. If Thome can bring his career back at his age, then Arod could BLOW UP.

kittle42
07-24-2006, 01:25 AM
What ARod did in the past is IN THE PAST....

Yes, apparently a history of past nothing but completely ****ing awesome performance is no indication that a 31 year-old player is any good. :?:

I would go as far as to say that if you forwarded your Crede = to or better than Rodriguez to 100 baseball fans, 99 of them would get quite a kick out of it.

Kub_Killer_15
07-24-2006, 01:54 AM
No way I would want this to happen we are really solid in the infield already. Maybe if A-Rod can switch to center for us...LOL but i still would never get rid of crede. Also Juan Uribe is staying at short stop he is awesome! What we need is pitching right now that is where we have most holes in.

russ99
07-24-2006, 02:16 PM
You're forgetting the worst part about A.Rod.

The problem of everyone in the clubhouse who is playing better than him (there's quite a few on the Yanks) has to defer to the mighty ego of "Mr. Largest Salary in MLB History".

No thanks. Way to poison our team-oriented clubhouse and handcuff the salary budget for the next 7? years. Look what happened to Texas, they're only now starting to recover from that debacle. The Yankees can keep him.

I'd prefer the inexpensive, steady, clutch, soon-to-be-gold-glover we already have in Crede.

SoxxoS
07-24-2006, 03:46 PM
What about Flipping Soriano for AROD with these current trade rumors...???

SOXfnNlansing
07-24-2006, 05:46 PM
heres a good trade idea

os get
sweeney
heager
Rich Hill
Uribe

Sox get
Prior
Tejada

Cubs get
Widger
Matt Karchner

:bandance: :bandance: I luv that!!!

SOXfnNlansing
07-24-2006, 05:54 PM
if we got AROD we'd be guaranteed a starting player in next year's All Star game, but Ozzie wouldn't be the manager:(: