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Daver
02-14-2002, 06:43 PM
Looks like public sentiment may be changing in Minnesota.


http://www.sportingnews.com/baseball/articles/20020214/382941.html

PaleHoseGeorge
02-14-2002, 07:06 PM
Originally posted by daver
Looks like public sentiment may be changing in Minnesota.


Boy, this sets an ugly precedent. If an owner can't extort a new baseball stadium out of the local market, he only needs MLB to threaten contraction to change the public's mood. This could get way out of hand in years to come.

I'm not begrudging Minnesotans a team. To the contrary, I feel sorry for them being placed in such a awkward position. I'm simply worried about how this will embolden the owners in the future threatening fans inorder to enrich themselves.

czalgosz
02-14-2002, 07:13 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


Boy, this sets an ugly precedent. If an owner can't extort a new baseball stadium out of the local market, he only needs MLB to threaten contraction to change the public's mood. This could get way out of hand in years to come.

I'm not begrudging Minnesotans a team. To the contrary, I feel sorry for them being placed in such a awkward position. I'm simply worried about how this will embolden the owners in the future threatening fans inorder to enrich themselves.

The funny thing is, tht studies have shown that having a major sports franchise in a city doesn't significantly increase city revenues. The economic argument simply doesn't work.

What does work, however, is that sports fans make up a large percentage of the voting public. Politicians do not want to be seen as the guy who let the local team go.

You're right on, George. I'm against taxpayer-funded sports stadia to begin with. Since Selig made it clear that he wouldn't even consider contracting any team with a new ballpark (for instance, the Pirates definitely should have been ahead of the Twins on the contraction list, IMO), he's really put municipalities in a bind.

Cheryl
02-14-2002, 08:01 PM
This is a shame. Somebody has to make a stand someday about the tax-funded stadia thing, I was hoping this would be it.

Daver
02-14-2002, 08:08 PM
Originally posted by Cheryl
This is a shame. Somebody has to make a stand someday about the tax-funded stadia thing, I was hoping this would be it.

In this case I don't think the tax is to fund the stadium per se,but the infrastructure nescasary to build one,roads,traffic lights,storm sewers,et al.there is a lot more to building a large structure than most people think.It cost the City of Joliet 18 mil in infrastructure changes to put the Harrah's Casino in downtown Joliet,not a single cent of that money was used inside the border that is Harrah's property.

Nellie_Fox
02-14-2002, 08:45 PM
No, the taxes they are talking about would be used to retire the bonds to finance the stadium itself. A big difference from past plans is that it's not the whole state of Minnesota that would be financing it, just St. Paul. The attitude of most of Minnesota's voters hasn't changed.

I don't know why they don't just let Donald Watkins build the ballpark with private financing like he says he will.

Daver
02-14-2002, 08:51 PM
Originally posted by Nellie_Fox
No, the taxes they are talking about would be used to retire the bonds to finance the stadium itself. A big difference from past plans is that it's not the whole state of Minnesota that would be financing it, just St. Paul. The attitude of most of Minnesota's voters hasn't changed.

I don't know why they don't just let Donald Watkins build the ballpark with private financing like he says he will.

This may have something to do with it.


http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?s=&threadid=7506

Nellie_Fox
02-14-2002, 08:57 PM
No, the St. Paul dinner and booze tax was getting underway well before the D.C. move was discussed.

By the way, don't kid yourself, this is just a ploy by Bud to try to get the Senate off his back: "oh, look, we'll move to team to D.C." One of Watkins friends says that just a week ago that Bud told Watkins a move of the Expos to D.C. was out of the question.

Daver
02-14-2002, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by Nellie_Fox
No, the St. Paul dinner and booze tax was getting underway well before the D.C. move was discussed.

By the way, don't kid yourself, this is just a ploy by Bud to try to get the Senate off his back: "oh, look, we'll move to team to D.C." One of Watkins friends says that just a week ago that Bud told Watkins a move of the Expos to D.C. was out of the question.

I am quite sure that the announcement of Washington D.C. being the "prime candidate"for a move was Bud covering his perjuring ass,but I have my doubts about Watkins being serious about buying the Twins.

Nellie_Fox
02-14-2002, 09:05 PM
He has tendered an offer sheet, with a bid of $125-$150 million depending on what he sees in the way of debts and encumberances when he gets into their books. The story is here. (http://www.twincities.com/mld/pioneerpress/sports/baseball/mlb/minnesota_twins/2666168.htm)

Daver
02-14-2002, 09:09 PM
Originally posted by Nellie_Fox
He has tendered an offer sheet, with a bid of $125-$150 million depending on what he sees in the way of debts and encumberances when he gets into their books. The story is here. (http://www.twincities.com/mld/pioneerpress/sports/baseball/mlb/minnesota_twins/2666168.htm)

Good stuff Nellie,thanx for the link.

Nellie_Fox
02-14-2002, 09:11 PM
The story does say he is also interested in moving the Expos to D.C., but deeper into the story he says if the Pohlads accept his offer, he's buying the Twins.

ma-gaga
02-15-2002, 12:20 PM
Nellie pretty much covered it all. The only reason he's even talked about moving the Expos is because a bunch of Washington politicians and sportswriters want a team.