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Lillian
07-03-2006, 11:37 AM
I haven't seen a thread here addressing the rumor regarding Andruw Jones.
Both Steve Stone, and Mlbtraderumors.com, are talking about this rumor.
What do you think?

bayzbol44
07-03-2006, 11:39 AM
Drug testing should be enforced to baseball analysts.

I read that they want Brian Anderson and young pitching for Jones. Come on, Anderson? Don't they know he is the next Dimaggio?

Brian26
07-03-2006, 11:42 AM
I haven't seen a thread here addressing the rumor regarding Andruw Jones.
Both Steve Stone, and Mlbtraderumors.com, are talking about this rumor.
What do you think?

mlbtraderumors is run by some lemming cub fan who lives in an apartment across from the Yorktown mall in Lombard and gets all of his info from Sports Central on WGN radio.

soxfan13
07-03-2006, 11:47 AM
Steve Stone was talking about it yesterday morning on the Score.

Brian26
07-03-2006, 11:56 AM
Steve Stone was talking about it yesterday morning on the Score.

I like Stone, but that doesn't really mean a whole hell of a lot.

DumpJerry
07-03-2006, 12:01 PM
Minnie Me has a thread about this a week or so ago. I'm too lazy to find it.

Lip Man 1
07-03-2006, 12:05 PM
Kenny Williams said in the newspaper this morning, "I'm not looking for a center fielder, that should tell you something."

Lip

Brian26
07-03-2006, 12:07 PM
Kenny Williams said in the newspaper this morning, "I'm not looking for a center fielder, that should tell you something."

Lip

That's a total under-the-radar quote if there ever was one :D:

bayzbol44
07-03-2006, 12:36 PM
I like Stone, but that doesn't really mean a whole hell of a lot.

I like him also, but to report that rumor is "out there".

Palehose13
07-03-2006, 12:38 PM
Kenny Williams said in the newspaper this morning, "I'm not looking for a center fielder, that should tell you something."

Lip

I think that it is unfortunate unless this is one of his "under the radar" quotes.

DaleJRFan
07-03-2006, 12:39 PM
this rumor was started (MLBtradeRumors.com source) by a poster at the "Bleed Cubbie Blue" site. What's that tell ya??

Ugh. Here we go with the insane trade rumors. It's the MLB silly season!!!

EDIT: Forgot to mention that the same thread mentioned that the Cubs and Yankees were going to swap A-Rod for Aramis Ramirez. Gimme a ****ing break.

southside rocks
07-03-2006, 01:21 PM
EDIT: Forgot to mention that the same thread mentioned that the Cubs and Yankees were going to swap A-Rod for Aramis Ramirez. Gimme a ****ing break.
A-Rod for Aramis Ramirez and the Cubs throw in Wrigley Field -- now that would be a good deal.

DumpJerry
07-03-2006, 02:02 PM
Kenny Williams said in the newspaper this morning, "I'm not looking for a center fielder, that should tell you something."

Lip
Sounds like he's working on a deal. We've seen this before.......

DSpivack
07-03-2006, 02:05 PM
A-Rod for Aramis Ramirez and the Cubs throw in Wrigley Field -- now that would be a good deal.

For the Cubs, yes.

oeo
07-03-2006, 02:07 PM
I think that it is unfortunate unless this is one of his "under the radar" quotes.

I'm one of the biggest Brian supporters there are, but Andruw Jones?! If Kenny got Jones, that would be amazing. I'm not sure that lineup could be stopped.

DumpJerry
07-03-2006, 02:14 PM
I'm thinking any trade would involve a replacement for Politte. I think Cliff is the only real weak link for us right now.

Frater Perdurabo
07-03-2006, 02:24 PM
I'm thinking any trade would involve a replacement for Politte. I think Cliff is the only real weak link for us right now.

I agree.

If KW could get Jones for prospects, then I would not be opposed to it. I would not give up anyone currently on the MLB roster, though, and that includes Brian Anderson.

1917
07-03-2006, 02:40 PM
I admit, I would love to see Jones patroling CF, but lets be honest, do we really need help scoring runs? We need help keeping runners off the base and runs off the scoreboard in the 7th and 8th inning....

Frater Perdurabo
07-03-2006, 03:07 PM
I admit, I would love to see Jones patroling CF, but lets be honest, do we really need help scoring runs? We need help keeping runners off the base and runs off the scoreboard in the 7th and 8th inning....

I agree with the general sentiment that the Sox offense would benefit from having a better hitter at the bottom of the order to turn the lineup over and extend rallies. In a monstrously long thread that had to be continued after exceeding 500 replies, Ol' No. 2 said that the need for better hitting in the 9-hole was so great that Mackowiak would be better CF option than Anderson. I disagreed because Mack would be such a downgrade defensively. Ol' No. 2 said that the Anderson's superior defense did not make up for his poor hitting. I concluded by saying that if Anderson did not improve, I would support acquiring a good hitting, good fielding CF. Jones would appear to fit the bill. I just do not want the Sox to give up Anderson in the process; he's their CF of the future.

The bottom line is that Anderson is a better defensive CF than Jones, but Jones still is one of the better defensive CFs in the majors (far better than Mackowiak) and is a better hitter than both Anderson and Mackowiak.

Again, I'm OK with acquiring Jones as long as no one on the current 25-man roster has to go to Atlanta in return.

Still, bullpen help has to be the #1 priority.

getonbckthr
07-03-2006, 03:15 PM
I'm thinking any trade would involve a replacement for Politte. I think Cliff is the only real weak link for us right now.
We have a replacement for Politte his name is Dustin Hermanson and he will be back by the deadline.

oeo
07-03-2006, 03:32 PM
We have a replacement for Politte his name is Dustin Hermanson and he will be back by the deadline.

I'm not banking on that, and I'm sure Kenny isn't either. Even if he does come back, you don't know that he will be able to do what he did last year.

Foulke You
07-03-2006, 04:38 PM
We have a replacement for Politte his name is Dustin Hermanson and he will be back by the deadline.
You can't expect Dustin Hermanson to be a reliable option that can be depended on in the 2nd half. I like the guy, but you have to be realistic here. He rehabbed like mad for an entire offseason last year to heal that chronic back problem. He purposely lost 10lbs to take pressure off the lower back to improve his stamina for the season and after all this precautionary work, Dustin STILL went down with the same back injury in his FIRST appearance in Tucson this year. It doesn't bode well that this injury won't show up again even if he does manage to come back.

Brian26
07-03-2006, 07:41 PM
We have a replacement for Politte his name is Dustin Hermanson and he will be back by the deadline.

Don't put your eggs in that basket. He was supposed to be back to 100% this spring after working on his core all winter, and that came to a screeching hault.

Thome25
07-04-2006, 08:58 AM
Still, bullpen help has to be the #1 priority.

Not to sound uninformed or greedy or anything but, I don't see why KW can't go out and get another bullpen pitcher AND Andruw Jones.

Why not both?

Frater Perdurabo
07-04-2006, 12:52 PM
Why not both?

If KW could get both bullpen help and Jones from Atlanta in one deal, that would be ideal (or engineer a three team deal where he sends out prospects and gets Jones and bullpen help back).

But Atlanta would begin by demanding McCarthy, Fields and Sweeney just for Jones. They will ask for far more than any sane person should be willing to surrender. KW will counter with two Fields and a minor league pitcher. The Braves will think about it and entertain other offers. This will be a seller's market, and the Braves are sitting in the catbird's seat and rightfully will expect a king's ransom for any of their stars. If KW unloads most of his top prospects to get Jones, he may not have enough left to fill the more urgent need in the bullpen.

If KW somehow manages to get Jones, it's an ironclad guarantee that half the WSI population will believe he overpaid.

Still, I put the chances of the Sox getting Jones at about 5%, mostly because KW has said he's not looking for a CF.

Tragg
07-04-2006, 07:02 PM
But Atlanta would begin by demanding McCarthy, Fields and Sweeney just for Jones. They will ask for far more than any sane person should be willing to surrender. KW will counter with two Fields and a minor league pitcher. The Braves will think about it and entertain other offers. This will be a seller's market, and the Braves are sitting in the catbird's seat and rightfully will expect a king's ransom for any of their stars. If KW unloads most of his top prospects to get Jones, he may not have enough left to fill the more urgent need in the bullpen.
Jones would be nice to have for 1/2 a season....it would be a lot better if Jones were a FA to be and would command maybe 1 good prospect. But that's it. CF is just not that big of a problem.

Trading McCarthy is just stupid.

I'm all for finding another bullpen arm...but, by definition, middle relievers are inconsistent so you just as likely will get another POlitte.

there's a reason teams want Anderson and McCarthy...they are young. talented and can play. Holding onto players like this is how you either build a team or maintain one.

Three cheers for KW: "Our plan is that [Anderson] is part of the infusion of keeping our club young and energetic and a guy we have in our long-range goals, as well as our short-term goals"

Britt Burns
07-04-2006, 08:27 PM
I wouldn't mind KW picking up Brady Clark of the Brewers if Anderson continues to struggle. He played over his head last year, but he has a decent bat, is good on D, and should come cheap. As much as I'd like to see A. Jones in center for the Sox, if we are going to make that kind of blockbuster deal (i.e. give up top-flight prospects) it needs to be for bullpen help.

Frater Perdurabo
07-04-2006, 09:56 PM
Jones would be nice to have for 1/2 a season....it would be a lot better if Jones were a FA to be and would command maybe 1 good prospect. But that's it. CF is just not that big of a problem.

Trading McCarthy is just stupid.

I'm all for finding another bullpen arm...but, by definition, middle relievers are inconsistent so you just as likely will get another POlitte.

there's a reason teams want Anderson and McCarthy...they are young. talented and can play. Holding onto players like this is how you either build a team or maintain one.

Three cheers for KW: "Our plan is that [Anderson] is part of the infusion of keeping our club young and energetic and a guy we have in our long-range goals, as well as our short-term goals"

I agree that Jones is not a necessity or a priority, especially considering what the Braves would demand in return and given that Anderson is showing signs of becoming a productive hitter.

chisoxmike
07-04-2006, 10:17 PM
:anderson:
"I play centerfield pretty well."

Chips
07-04-2006, 10:19 PM
:anderson:
"I play centerfield pretty well."

By pretty well, you mean ****ing awesome.:cool:

Palehose13
07-04-2006, 10:22 PM
:anderson:
"I play centerfield pretty well."

Too bad you can't hit your way out of a paper bag. :tongue:

Dancin' Homer
07-04-2006, 11:25 PM
Kenny Williams said in the newspaper this morning, "I'm not looking for a center fielder, that should tell you something."

Lip

If Kenny were looking for a center fielder, the intensity of his gaze would cause all center fielders from little league on up to burst into flame.

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 11:11 AM
I agree with the general sentiment that the Sox offense would benefit from having a better hitter at the bottom of the order to turn the lineup over and extend rallies. In a monstrously long thread that had to be continued after exceeding 500 replies, Ol' No. 2 said that the need for better hitting in the 9-hole was so great that Mackowiak would be better CF option than Anderson. I disagreed because Mack would be such a downgrade defensively. Ol' No. 2 said that the Anderson's superior defense did not make up for his poor hitting. I concluded by saying that if Anderson did not improve, I would support acquiring a good hitting, good fielding CF. Jones would appear to fit the bill. I just do not want the Sox to give up Anderson in the process; he's their CF of the future.

The bottom line is that Anderson is a better defensive CF than Jones, but Jones still is one of the better defensive CFs in the majors (far better than Mackowiak) and is a better hitter than both Anderson and Mackowiak.

Again, I'm OK with acquiring Jones as long as no one on the current 25-man roster has to go to Atlanta in return.

Still, bullpen help has to be the #1 priority.Jones is signed through 2007 at $13M+ per year. If they were to get Jones, they'd almost certainly give Anderson as part of the deal. He'd be out of a job with the Sox until 2008 anyway.

Frater Perdurabo
07-05-2006, 11:43 AM
Jones is signed through 2007 at $13M+ per year. If they were to get Jones, they'd almost certainly give Anderson as part of the deal. He'd be out of a job with the Sox until 2008 anyway.

Then I hope that KW's rumoured "interest" is only an effort to drive up the price another American League team would have to pay to get Jones.

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 12:07 PM
Then I hope that KW's rumoured "interest" is only an effort to drive up the price another American League team would have to pay to get Jones.The Sox have a lot of key players who are going to be in their option years in 2007, and quite a few others who are FA after 2007. That means hefty extensions next year. Some others not yet FA-eligible will get healthy raises. That makes cheap players like Anderson all the more important. I don't see them taking on a big contract this year unless it's just a rental for 2006.

Frater Perdurabo
07-05-2006, 12:16 PM
The Sox have a lot of key players who are going to be in their option years in 2007, and quite a few others who are FA after 2007. That means hefty extensions next year. Some others not yet FA-eligible will get healthy raises. That makes cheap players like Anderson all the more important. I don't see them taking on a big contract this year unless it's just a rental for 2006.

Agreed, and that's why I think Anderson needs to be allowed to grow "on the job" this year so that he can step into a more promient role in 2007 and 2008, when the Sox will need to have more young position players assume starting roles (Valido, Sweeney, etc.).

Don't look now, but Anderson hasn't struck out in his last 22 ABs, and his last three hits have been doubles. He's making contact and hitting the ball hard, but it's going right at people. Even Ozzie said he likes Anderson's approach at the plate right now.

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 03:12 PM
Agreed, and that's why I think Anderson needs to be allowed to grow "on the job" this year so that he can step into a more promient role in 2007 and 2008, when the Sox will need to have more young position players assume starting roles (Valido, Sweeney, etc.).

Don't look now, but Anderson hasn't struck out in his last 22 ABs, and his last three hits have been doubles. He's making contact and hitting the ball hard, but it's going right at people. Even Ozzie said he likes Anderson's approach at the plate right now.As much as we've disagreed on Anderson, the one thing we both agree on is that Anderson is the CF of the future. I just don't think he's the CF of the present. He's hitting the ball hard, all right, but usually not at somebody as much as at the ground. His occasional hits look like accidents - he has only 7 multi-hit games all year. I still don't see any consistency there.

Palehose13
07-05-2006, 03:34 PM
As much as we've disagreed on Anderson, the one thing we both agree on is that Anderson is the CF of the future. I just don't think he's the CF of the present. He's hitting the ball hard, all right, but usually not at somebody as much as at the ground. His occasional hits look like accidents - he has only 7 multi-hit games all year. I still don't see any consistency there.

Thank you! What I put in bold is exactly what I believe also. I think KW should be looking at a rent-a-centerfielder for the rest of this year.

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 06:09 PM
Thank you! What I put in bold is exactly what I believe also. I think KW should be looking at a rent-a-centerfielder for the rest of this year.Unfortunately, there aren't many that don't fall into one or more of these categories:

1. Would cost way too much in trade.
2. Aren't an appreciable upgrade.
3. Are young and cheap and thus aren't going to be traded.
4. Are signed to big $$$ and/or long-term contracts.
5. Are playing on a contending team that will be buyers, not sellers.

Edit: What might it take to get Gary Matthews, Jr. from the Rangers if they nosedive? He's in the last year of his contract and is a FA after 2006.

Tragg
07-05-2006, 06:26 PM
Edit: What might it take to get Gary Matthews, Jr. from the Rangers if they nosedive? He's in the last year of his contract and is a FA after 2006.
He's about the only one I can think of in the last year of his contract. But I don't see them falling out of their race. But the price will be high..remember the price to rent Burnett (Jose/McCarthy and Crede and take Lowell's salary)
There are just a lot more buyers than sellers...we don't have to get involved to increase the price, becausae prices will be high.

Who are the sellers?
Atlanta
Washington
Pirates
Cubs
Orioles
Rays
Royals

YOu can add a few tinkerers:
Phillies
Brewers
Indians

And then there is Florida who already traded everything.

that's pretty much it; I don't see that list changing much before 7/31. That means sellers market; let more desparate teams pay the high price. And last year when it wasn't this much a sellers market, prices were enormous.

zmz723
07-05-2006, 07:00 PM
Thank you! What I put in bold is exactly what I believe also. I think KW should be looking at a rent-a-centerfielder for the rest of this year.

Juan Pierre? his average is up to .270 now. not bad for a #9 hitter

The Critic
07-05-2006, 07:55 PM
Juan Pierre? his average is up to .270 now. not bad for a #9 hitter
I'd assume that the Sox would have to wildly overpay for the Cubs to trade their "key offseason acquisition" to the team on the other side of town.

soxwon
07-05-2006, 07:56 PM
I'm one of the biggest Brian supporters there are, but Andruw Jones?! If Kenny got Jones, that would be amazing. I'm not sure that lineup could be stopped.

we will get tejada for uribe
dont need jones

PushnThaEscalade
07-05-2006, 08:31 PM
Something tells me that Kenny will pull a deal for someone and it will be a surprise, someone who isn't named Tejada or Jones.

Chisox003
07-05-2006, 09:08 PM
Something tells me that Kenny will pull a deal for someone and it will be a surprise, someone who isn't named Tejada or Jones.
I'm betting on either Burnett, Griffey or Schmidt

getonbckthr
07-05-2006, 09:14 PM
Personally I think if KW is gonna make a huge move for a huge name it will be Tejada. Especially how Juan has played the last 2 weeks, if KW is even interested in that path, Uribe is building quite a case for Baltimore to look. Obviously i'm not assuming a Tejada-Uribe straight up deal but throw prospects in their (something from the collection of Sweeney, Haegar, Liotta, Mccarthy etc etc etc).

Tragg
07-05-2006, 09:32 PM
Personally I think if KW is gonna make a huge move for a huge name it will be Tejada. Especially how Juan has played the last 2 weeks, if KW is even interested in that path, Uribe is building quite a case for Baltimore to look. Obviously i'm not assuming a Tejada-Uribe straight up deal but throw prospects in their (something from the collection of Sweeney, Haegar, Liotta, Mccarthy etc etc etc). So you end up with a defensive downgrade an offensive upgrade and lose some combinations of top prospects including pitchers when we need pitchers? I don't see the point.

Palehose13
07-05-2006, 09:39 PM
So you end up with a defensive downgrade an offensive upgrade and lose some combinations of top prospects including pitchers when we need pitchers? I don't see the point.

I'm not questioning you, but seriously asking...Would Tejada really be much of a defensive downgrade? I was always under the impression that he was a pretty good defensive SS.

Chisox003
07-05-2006, 09:42 PM
I'm not questioning you, but seriously asking...Would Tejada really be much of a defensive downgrade? I was always under the impression that he was a pretty good defensive SS.
Right as you posted this he bobbled a grounder hit by.....yup, Uribe.

Coincedence, I think not :cool:

Palehose13
07-05-2006, 09:55 PM
Right as you posted this he bobbled a grounder hit by.....yup, Uribe.

Coincedence, I think not :cool:

LOL

getonbckthr
07-05-2006, 09:57 PM
So you end up with a defensive downgrade an offensive upgrade and lose some combinations of top prospects including pitchers when we need pitchers? I don't see the point.
I never said that I wanted KW to make the move right now. Look at the post again. That is what I think KW would do if was gonna make a big time move.

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 11:06 PM
He's about the only one I can think of in the last year of his contract. But I don't see them falling out of their race. But the price will be high..remember the price to rent Burnett (Jose/McCarthy and Crede and take Lowell's salary)
There are just a lot more buyers than sellers...we don't have to get involved to increase the price, becausae prices will be high.

Who are the sellers?
Atlanta
Washington
Pirates
Cubs
Orioles
Rays
Royals

YOu can add a few tinkerers:
Phillies
Brewers
Indians

And then there is Florida who already traded everything.

that's pretty much it; I don't see that list changing much before 7/31. That means sellers market; let more desparate teams pay the high price. And last year when it wasn't this much a sellers market, prices were enormous.But how many buyers are going to be looking for a CF? Teams are always looking for pitching, but barring injury, I can't think of a single contending team that needs a CF besides the Sox.

getonbckthr
07-05-2006, 11:17 PM
But how many buyers are going to be looking for a CF? Teams are always looking for pitching, but barring injury, I can't think of a single contending team that needs a CF besides the Sox.
Well from the list provided here are the CF's:
Who are the sellers?
Atlanta - Andruw Jones
Washington Damian Jackson, Marlon Byrd, Soriano (Pods to CF)
Pirates - Nate Mclouth (No Pirate youngster)
Cubs - Pierre
Orioles - Patterson
Rays - Baldelli, Hollins, Crawford
Royals - Dejesus

YOu can add a few tinkerers:
Phillies - Rowand (not a chance), Abreu, Delucci
Brewers - Brady Clark, Carlos Lee ( Pods to CF)
Indians - they wont help us.

Tragg
07-05-2006, 11:24 PM
But how many buyers are going to be looking for a CF? Teams are always looking for pitching, but barring injury, I can't think of a single contending team that needs a CF besides the Sox.
Who's playing CF for the Yankees?
Look at Texas' situation: they are IN the race; they'd like to deal him so they don't end up with the empty sack, BUT a)they don't HAVE to; and b)because they are in the race, they want TALENT in return. I don't see him (or anyone) cheap.
It's sort of like C Lee and the Brewers; now Mil isn't in the race as much as Texas is, but if they deal Lee, they will get something for him.
And I guess I can't forget that Durham debacle and ask why the hell can't we get a rent for an "organizational minor leaguer"

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 11:27 PM
Well from the list provided here are the CF's:
Who are the sellers?
Atlanta - Andruw Jones Too expensive
Washington Damian Jackson, Marlon Byrd, Soriano (Pods to CF) Yuck
Pirates - Nate Mclouth (No Pirate youngster) Yuck
Cubs - Pierre Pass
Orioles - Patterson Not going anywhere
Rays - Baldelli, Hollins, Crawford Not enough pink in the world for these guys
Royals - Dejesus Signed cheaply through 2010; Not going anywhere

YOu can add a few tinkerers:
Phillies - Rowand (not a chance), Abreu, Delucci Expensive in both $$ and prospects.
Brewers - Brady Clark, Carlos Lee ( Pods to CF) Not likely
Indians - they wont help us.



My comments in blue. They're all either too expensive for a half-year rental or not significantly better than what we have now.

Tragg
07-05-2006, 11:27 PM
I'm not questioning you, but seriously asking...Would Tejada really be much of a defensive downgrade? I was always under the impression that he was a pretty good defensive SS. Obviously I'm no expert but from what I've seen Tejada is like Clayton...no errors, no range. Also note that he's been playing a good bit of DH lately....that might mean something. He's a very good player, but not a star player. SS is not a weakness on the team; so what's the point of trading away a lot of talent for a very good player that we don't need?

Ol' No. 2
07-05-2006, 11:34 PM
Who's playing CF for the Yankees?Didn't they sign some FA from Boston?:wink:
Look at Texas' situation: they are IN the race; they'd like to deal him so they don't end up with the empty sack, BUT a)they don't HAVE to; and b)because they are in the race, they want TALENT in return. I don't see him (or anyone) cheap.
It's sort of like C Lee and the Brewers; now Mil isn't in the race as much as Texas is, but if they deal Lee, they will get something for him.
And I guess I can't forget that Durham debacle and ask why the hell can't we get a rent for an "organizational minor leaguer"I don't see Matthews going anywhere unless they nosedive severely between now and July 31. They're only 1.5 games behind Oakland right now.

How much you get depends on the laws of supply and demand. There wasn't much demand for Durham. That was also a situation in which the new CBA that was being negotiated eliminated the awarding of draft picks for lost FA. That provision got scrapped before the CBA was agreed on, but when teams thought it was going to be incorporated, it had the effect of reducing the trade values of potential free agents. The Sox sort of got screwed on that deal.

Right now, I don't see any other contending teams in the market for a CF, so the price might not be all that high.