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View Full Version : Buehrle the Starter?


Gregory Pratt
07-02-2006, 08:47 PM
Did I hear right, or was ESPN wrong, or what?

Is it official that Mark Buehrle, not Jose Contreras, will start the ASG?

IlliniSox4Life
07-02-2006, 08:48 PM
Did I hear right, or was ESPN wrong, or what?

Is it official that Mark Buehrle, not Jose Contreras, will start the ASG?

Yup

ShoelessJoeS
07-02-2006, 08:49 PM
Interesting...

Gregory Pratt
07-02-2006, 08:50 PM
That's ****ing bull****

ShoelessJoeS
07-02-2006, 08:52 PM
That's ****ing bull****He may not be the most deserving but....:?:

IlliniSox4Life
07-02-2006, 08:55 PM
That's ****ing bull****

Ozzie is the one who appoints the starter. I'm sure he has his reasons. Probably because it's better for our team.

DSpivack
07-02-2006, 09:03 PM
Ozzie is the one who appoints the starter. I'm sure he has his reasons. Probably because it's better for our team.

Better for our team b/c Jose is starting next sunday? Makes sense, I guess.

TheOldRoman
07-02-2006, 09:05 PM
Better for our team b/c Jose is starting next sunday? Makes sense, I guess.
Bingo

Pierzynski 12
07-02-2006, 09:08 PM
Buehrle doesn't deserve to be there after today.

littlesully23
07-02-2006, 09:10 PM
It was my understanding, while watching ESPN, that the official starter has not been selected yet. I believe they said the AL and NL All Star game starters would be announced within the next couple of days. They were just making a big deal that Mark made it on the list of AL starters over the likes of Schilling and Beckett. That's when they put up the comparison of Buehrle's numbers to Schillings. He's not THE starter of the All Star game (yet?), but he is A starter (which is wording that they probably shouldn't use unless they are purposely trying to confuse everyone that watched the horrible hour long east coast lovefest of a program - it's how they referred to every pitcher selected for the teams with the exception of the closers). But, I could be wrong.

ShoelessJoeS
07-02-2006, 09:11 PM
Buehrle doesn't deserve to be there after today.Even though I believe there were more deserving White Sox than Buehrle, you have to remember that Ozzie made the lineup days before today's game.

Pierzynski 12
07-02-2006, 09:17 PM
Even though I believe there were more deserving White Sox than Buehrle, you have to remember that Ozzie made the lineup days before today's game.

Treu, but i've been hearing complaints about Buehrle making it. So and so didn't make it over him. It's stupid. I tell ya.

oeo
07-02-2006, 09:47 PM
I thought this wasn't announced until Monday. Sounds like bull**** to me.

littlesully23
07-02-2006, 09:51 PM
I thought this wasn't announced until Monday.

That was my understanding.

CanBuehrleWait
07-02-2006, 09:52 PM
I thought this wasn't announced until Monday. Sounds like bull**** to me.
Agreed. However, in Buehrle's defense before today's debacle Buehrle was 5th in the AL with a 3.22 ERA. That's not deserving of a roster spot? (Remember the teams were chosen before today's game)

IlliniSox4Life
07-02-2006, 09:56 PM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-060702allstar,1,4203788.story?coll=cs-home-headlines


On the same day both pitchers got shelled facing off in the finale of the Crosstown series, White Sox lefty Mark Buehrle and Cubs righty Carlos Zambrano were each named to their respective league's All-Star team. Buehrle, named as the American League starter by manager Ozzie Guillen, heads six White Sox on the squad.

FoulkeFan
07-02-2006, 09:57 PM
Agreed. However, in Buehrle's defense before today's debacle Buehrle was 5th in the AL with a 3.22 ERA. That's not deserving of a roster spot? (Remember the teams were chosen before today's game)

He also has 9 wins. Most in the league is 10.

StatHead21
07-02-2006, 10:01 PM
Santana should start if Contreras can't go...

Grzegorz
07-02-2006, 10:27 PM
Santana or Verlander; get Coop to check 'em out up close and personal.

"Keep your friends close but your enemies closer." - Vito Corleone

hawkjt
07-03-2006, 12:36 AM
For once the sox are in position to help themselves like the yanks and boston always do and I for one say to ozzie; more power to you!!

Burls may not have the best numbers but he deserves to start cuz he is a world champion and he is having a solid year.

Lets enjoy this a little- sox earned it.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 02:26 AM
So let me get this straight...

Ozzie has the option of starting Johan Santana and he goes with Mark? Nothing against Mark, but doesn't Ozzie want to win this game? I can already see NL hitters taking him out to right field in the first inning.

Blueprint1
07-03-2006, 02:40 AM
So let me get this straight...

Ozzie has the option of starting Johan Santana and he goes with Mark? Nothing against Mark, but doesn't Ozzie want to win this game? I can already see NL hitters taking him out to right field in the first inning.

So is todays sox game the only one you watched all year? I might not say i think that MB should be starting. I dont htink i can see the NL hitters taking him out to right filed in the first inning.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 02:49 AM
So is todays sox game the only one you watched all year? I might not say i think that MB should be starting. I dont htink i can see the NL hitters taking him out to right filed in the first inning.

Mark gives up hits very often and usually has to work himself out of serious trouble in every good game he pitches. Also, today wasn't the first time this season that he's given up 7+ runs early, it just so happens that the last time he did they were called unearned, even though Mark failed and failed again to stop the bleeding.

Mark works the outside part of the plate and up in the zone more than anything else. Is it really so hard to imagine the NL all-star lineup, which offensively IMO is just as strong if not stronger than the AL starting lineup, taking advantage of this at the start, especially with a guy behind the plate who has never caught Mark before?

I'm not saying Mark is or isn't going to definitely get killed, but when the game decides home field advantage in the World Series, and when you are the favorites in your league to get there, you have to start the best guy available. Mark isn't that person.

BadBobbyJenks
07-03-2006, 03:08 AM
I'm not saying Mark is or isn't going to definitely get killed, but when the game decides home field advantage in the World Series, and when you are the favorites in your league to get there, you have to start the best guy available. Mark isn't that person.


Yeah Mark has not been in an all star game before and faced the fearsome nl lineup before....That has never happened, mark has never been in that position.....i got your teal police right here

rowand33
07-03-2006, 03:14 AM
I don't really know how I feel about one of our guys throwing to Pudge.

Chisox003
07-03-2006, 03:15 AM
I'm not saying Mark is or isn't going to definitely get killed, but when the game decides home field advantage in the World Series, and when you are the favorites in your league to get there, you have to start the best guy available. Mark isn't that person.
He seemed to fair OK last year. Only 2 scoreless innings.

I wonder how many people would be questioning Mark if 1) He didn't get rocked today and 2) If he DID get rocked, but it wasn't against the Cubs.

I'm gonna go ahead and guess not very many.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 03:20 AM
Yeah Mark has not been in an all star game before and faced the fearsome nl lineup before....That has never happened, mark has never been in that position.....i got your teal police right here

didn't tejada or someone bail out mark last year?

tell me, you would honesly choose buehrle, a guy who relies on double plays and plus defense, over someone like santana who is just filthy?

if the allstar game didn't mean anything i'd be thrilled with it. but i just don't see why you wouldn't start the best pitcher when the game probably affects your own team's postseason.

SABRSox
07-03-2006, 03:21 AM
Trade Mark Buerhle!

Guess what, Ozzie earned the right to stack the AS team with White Sox by winning the World Series last season. If Gardenhire won last year, Santana would be starting. If Torre won last season, Mussina would be starting. I don't want to hear that Santana or Verlander should be starting. **** that.

And I hope somebody gets injured so Crede gets on the team, and maybe another guy so Iguchi gets in too. Hell, Pablo Ozuna can have a spot, for all I care. The AL White Sox would still beat the tar out of the NL all-stars.

BadBobbyJenks
07-03-2006, 03:24 AM
Um the al has won what 8 or 9 in a row? It doesnt matter who we send out there the al is better. Yeah I would send buehrle out there and any big game we ever need because the majority of the time mark is going to keep u in the game. Sorry the guy doesnt have the sexy 95+ fastball like santana but to say this guy doesnt have what it takes to start the game is ridiculous......Mark was so awful in the playoffs for us last year, I wanted to trade his worthless ass, I would send anyone else out there before him in any game that mattered.... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 03:24 AM
He seemed to fair OK last year. Only 2 scoreless innings.

I wonder how many people would be questioning Mark if 1) He didn't get rocked today and 2) If he DID get rocked, but it wasn't against the Cubs.

I'm gonna go ahead and guess not very many.

every pitcher has bad games and mark's start vs. the cubs doesn't make him any less of a pitcher. the fact is that its easier to stack up a few hits against mark than it is against santana. santana is better than mark, period. that's all im saying. so why is mark starting? because of loyalty on Ozzie's part to his players, which is great, but not the best decision IMO when the game means something.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 03:29 AM
Trade Mark Buerhle!

Guess what, Ozzie earned the right to stack the AS team with White Sox by winning the World Series last season. If Gardenhire won last year, Santana would be starting. If Torre won last season, Mussina would be starting. I don't want to hear that Santana or Verlander should be starting. **** that.

And I hope somebody gets injured so Crede gets on the team, and maybe another guy so Iguchi gets in too. Hell, Pablo Ozuna can have a spot, for all I care. The AL White Sox would still beat the tar out of the NL all-stars.


***?

The Marlins beat the Yanks in the WS and guess who Torre started? The Sox' own Esteban Loaiza. The Red Sox beat the Cards in the WS and guess who Francona started? The Sox' own Mark Buehrle. Both of those times Esteban and Mark could be called the best pitcher in the AL at the time of the AS game. Now is different. I'd say right now Contreras, Liriano, Santana, and Halladay are all better than Mark but he's still starting.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 03:33 AM
Um the al has won what 8 or 9 in a row? It doesnt matter who we send out there the al is better. Yeah I would send buehrle out there and any big game we ever need because the majority of the time mark is going to keep u in the game. Sorry the guy doesnt have the sexy 95+ fastball like santana but to say this guy doesnt have what it takes to start the game is ridiculous......Mark was so awful in the playoffs for us last year, I wanted to trade his worthless ass, I would send anyone else out there before him in any game that mattered.... :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

go back and read...

when did i ever say mark wasn't a very good pitcher? when did i say he was incapable of starting an allstar game? i never said anything like that. i said mark isn't the best pitcher in the AL right now. there are better and more deserving pitchers who, so far, have shown to provide a better chance of winning a game than mark. to say mark is the ace of this staff and is an excellent pitcher who will go on to have a great career is one thing. to even imply that he's the best there is right now is assinine.

TDog
07-03-2006, 03:44 AM
I know a lot of you disagree with me, but don't believe any Sox pitcher should be on the All-Star team.

I don't believe Mark Redman should be on the team either, but that's another story.

Sox-o-matic
07-03-2006, 03:48 AM
I know a lot of you disagree with me, but don't believe any Sox pitcher should be on the All-Star team.

I don't believe Mark Redman should be on the team either, but that's another story.

You will have a ton of disagreement. I can't even convince anyone that Buerhle isn't the best pitcher in the AL.

Jenks I think really deserves it though. He has been a rock in a mostly shaky bullpen and has proven, at least so far, to be everything we could have hoped for plus some.

Redman has no buisness being on that team at all, especially at the expense of someone like Travis Hafner, but that's what happens you have a commisioner who wants to be 'fair' to teams who have done nothing improve the image or competitiveness of the game.

TDog
07-03-2006, 04:00 AM
You will have a ton of disagreement. I can't even convince anyone that Buerhle isn't the best pitcher in the AL.

Jenks I think really deserves it though. He has been a rock in a mostly shaky bullpen and has proven, at least so far, to be everything we could have hoped for plus some.

Redman has no buisness being on that team at all, especially at the expense of someone like Travis Hafner, but that's what happens you have a commisioner who wants to be 'fair' to teams who have done nothing improve the image or competitiveness of the game.

I don't care if the Sox have better pitchers. I don't want to see Sox pitchers waste innings in the All-Star Game. I waited decades to see the Sox field a World Series team, but I'm still selfish.

Grzegorz
07-03-2006, 05:40 AM
every pitcher has bad games and mark's start vs. the cubs doesn't make him any less of a pitcher. the fact is that its easier to stack up a few hits against mark than it is against santana. santana is better than mark, period. that's all im saying. so why is mark starting? because of loyalty on Ozzie's part to his players, which is great, but not the best decision IMO when the game means something.

For what it is worth, I am right there with you on this one. Buehrle does not deserve this start. He's had a couple of bad games where he's been lit up in the first inning. Starting Santana would be the smart move in this case.

Deuce
07-03-2006, 08:11 AM
Buehrle doesn't deserve to be there after today.:rolleyes:

If having one horrible game was enough to deprive a player of an All-Star slot, I doubt there would be anyone there. I'm not thrilled about yesterday's game either, but lets not get silly here.

bigsqwert
07-03-2006, 09:12 AM
:rolleyes:

If having one horrible game was enough to deprive a player of an All-Star slot, I doubt there would be anyone there. I'm not thrilled about yesterday's game either, but lets not get silly here.
It's not about one game. He hasn't had as good of a first half as several other pitchers. He wouldn't even be in the Cy Young debate this year whereas guys like Schilling, Verlander, Mussina and Liriano will be and have better numbers.

EDIT: And just what we need....to give the best pitching staff a reason to feel slighted by only getting one of their pitchers in when maybe 3 or 4 of them deserved to be there.

ChiSoxIn06
07-03-2006, 09:13 AM
As much as i hate to say it none of our pitchers deserve to start. its got to be santana without a question.

Boondock Saint
07-03-2006, 09:36 AM
I know everyone here has an opinion on the matter and wants to voice it, but we can't honestly be worried about us losing, can we? Last time I checked, the all star game was still the AL versus the NL. Sure, it's the best that the NL has to offer, but if their best was good enough, the AL wouldn't be mopping the floor with them in interleague play this year. And it's not like Buehrle is gonna pitch eight innings. The best guys are gonna pitch, I promise. And furthermore, I don't think the backlash to Buehrle starting would be HALF as bad if the announcement hadn't come right after an ugly game. Just take a deep breath and realize that this is one of the guys that got us where we are today, on the top of the mountain as the defending world champions of baseball.

ChicagoHoosier
07-03-2006, 01:06 PM
I know everyone here has an opinion on the matter and wants to voice it, but we can't honestly be worried about us losing, can we? Last time I checked, the all star game was still the AL versus the NL. Sure, it's the best that the NL has to offer, but if their best was good enough, the AL wouldn't be mopping the floor with them in interleague play this year. And it's not like Buehrle is gonna pitch eight innings. The best guys are gonna pitch, I promise. And furthermore, I don't think the backlash to Buehrle starting would be HALF as bad if the announcement hadn't come right after an ugly game. Just take a deep breath and realize that this is one of the guys that got us where we are today, on the top of the mountain as the defending world champions of baseball.

I don't care if we win or lose the All Star game. If we lose, then that will allow us to clinch at home in Game 4 of the WS this year!

OzzyTrain
07-03-2006, 02:05 PM
Ozzie is the one who appoints the starter. I'm sure he has his reasons. Probably because it's better for our team.

Thats how I see it

I thought Contreras would get it also, but think about this for a something. An all-star start is going to boost any ones confidence, right now Contreras is going pretty well, if anyone needs a boost of confidence it could be Buehrle, as much as Ozzie wants to win the all-star game, I really think he is looking out for his team as well.

Gregory Pratt
07-03-2006, 02:57 PM
Buehrle is probably getting the start over Contreras because Guillen is looking out for Jose's regular starting schedule.

That's about all there is to it.

CHISOXFAN13
07-03-2006, 03:06 PM
I know a lot of you disagree with me, but don't believe any Sox pitcher should be on the All-Star team.

I don't believe Mark Redman should be on the team either, but that's another story.

Contreras has not lost a regular season game since last August. Despite struggling in his last few outings, he is deserving.

Have you seen Jenks pitch?

BeviBall!
07-03-2006, 03:10 PM
Johan should be the starter... hands down. As much as I like to see us finally getting the opportunity to load the roster with our guys, no way does Burls deserve to go over Schilling, Verlander or Liriano. Jenks and Jose are the only deserving pitchers.

oeo
07-03-2006, 03:14 PM
every pitcher has bad games and mark's start vs. the cubs doesn't make him any less of a pitcher. the fact is that its easier to stack up a few hits against mark than it is against santana. santana is better than mark, period. that's all im saying. so why is mark starting? because of loyalty on Ozzie's part to his players, which is great, but not the best decision IMO when the game means something.

Mark is not an overpowering pitcher. He uses his defense, and he's not going to strike a lot of guys out like Santana. But, when he's on his game, he can be just as effective as Santana, and he showed that earlier in the year when they faced off.

hi im skot
07-03-2006, 03:48 PM
I don't care if we win or lose the All Star game. If we lose, then that will allow us to clinch at home in Game 4 of the WS this year!

Teal?

How about pink?

:cool:

batmanZoSo
07-03-2006, 04:20 PM
Mark gives up hits very often and usually has to work himself out of serious trouble in every good game he pitches. Also, today wasn't the first time this season that he's given up 7+ runs early, it just so happens that the last time he did they were called unearned, even though Mark failed and failed again to stop the bleeding.

Mark works the outside part of the plate and up in the zone more than anything else. Is it really so hard to imagine the NL all-star lineup, which offensively IMO is just as strong if not stronger than the AL starting lineup, taking advantage of this at the start, especially with a guy behind the plate who has never caught Mark before?

I'm not saying Mark is or isn't going to definitely get killed, but when the game decides home field advantage in the World Series, and when you are the favorites in your league to get there, you have to start the best guy available. Mark isn't that person.

Buehrle has a great record year after year for a reason, and even after yesterday he has a 3.86 ERA, which is very good in this league in this year. And on top of that, he's faced the NL lineup before with success. Does it really matter who starts the game? I say it's better to have guys like Santana available for relief in a game. And in my opinion the World Champions should always be represented with a starter on the field.

Shoeless_Jim
07-03-2006, 04:45 PM
isnt Contreras scheduled to pitch a couple of days before the ASG. Buehrle will have some rest coming in and he wont want to hurt Contreras' arm or risk injury. Maybe?

IlliniSoxFan
07-03-2006, 05:03 PM
I have to tell you, for as much as people complain about the lack of respect for the Sox, I never thought I would see so many White Sox fans objecting so vehemently to the idea of a White Sox pitcher starting the All Star game. That's fine if you think he doesn't have the numbers to justify it, but I'm shocked to see so many fans tearing a member of our favorite team down for receiving such an honor.

As for how it looks to other teams, let their fans worry about that.