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View Full Version : Your least favorite Sox


beausox
02-10-2002, 11:18 AM
As we all can read, everyone here loves everyone on the White Sox. Nobody here complains about any of the players or dislikes anyone. With that in mind however, please voteo on your least favorite Sox.

KempersRS
02-10-2002, 11:26 AM
How can you possibly include Graffy on this list? And someone voted for him!? What has Graffy ever done to make him the most hated player on the team? Whoever voted for him, (and I am assuming it was you, beausox, since I have no idea why anyone would even include him on this list in the first place) why???

PaleHoseGeorge
02-10-2002, 11:38 AM
Explain your criteria for "least favorite".

If it's "least favorite" from an organizational standpoint, I might blame a few of the guys that Sox management screwed up by placing on the roster. The player might be blameless but still "least favorite".

If it's "least favorite" from a contribution to the team standpoint, there are several guys who've done nothing for the team who deserve votes. There are others who were trusted to contribute, but didn't.

Finally, if it's "least favorite" from a personality standpoint, I'm not familiar with most of them to feel I should vote. Though several of them have public reputations, I really don't know if they're deserved or not. Assuming their reputations are deserved (a BIG assumption) there are several deserving of votes.

Maybe we need to split this into multiple categories of "least favorite"?

:smile:

KempersRS
02-10-2002, 11:48 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
Explain your criteria for "least favorite".

If it's "least favorite" from an organizational standpoint, I might blame a few of the guys that Sox management screwed up by placing on the roster. The player might be blameless but still "least favorite".

If it's "least favorite" from a contribution to the team standpoint, there are several guys who've done nothing for the team who deserve votes. There are others who were trusted to contribute, but didn't.

Finally, if it's "least favorite" from a personality standpoint, I'm not familiar with most of them to feel I should vote. Though several of them have public reputations, I really don't know if they're deserved or not. Assuming their reputations are deserved (a BIG assumption) there are several deserving of votes.

Maybe we need to split this into multiple categories of "least favorite"?

:smile:

Well thats a good point, I know Graffy doesn't take the first two. Is Graffy some sort of low life outside the park? I don't know, but he sure does contribute and he isn't causing problems in the clubhouse.

Jerry_Manuel
02-10-2002, 12:11 PM
Originally posted by KempersRS
Well thats a good point, I know Graffy doesn't take the first two. Is Graffy some sort of low life outside the park? I don't know, but he sure does contribute and he isn't causing problems in the clubhouse.

Perhaps, someone is still upset at the mental error, Tony made vs. the Cubs. :?:

CubKilla
02-10-2002, 12:27 PM
Least favorite from an organizational, contributory, and personality stand point is Royce Clayton. First off, the organization has tried and cannot trade this bum. His presence is creating and awkward situation where Valentin has to play 3B and prospect Crede has to swallow the bitter pill and, "ride the pine." From a contributory standpoint, Clayton only came through with the occasional big hit. With the atrocious first half he had, JM had no other options than to bench him for a while (albeit somewhat). When Clayton returned to the lineup, he was, in most cases, the number 9 man in the lineup. The number 9 slot is not designed for a player that contributes. And then comes personality. First off, he knows many fans are critical of last seasons performance. And while I realize other players did not make themselves available for SoxFest, this was Clayton's opportunity to face the fans and maybe gain some respect from those most critical of him. Clayton is a no show. I went to some 20+ games last season and never once saw Clayton sign an autograph. He was critical of certain teammates early last season when they voiced displeasure with Clayton and his abominable start, wondering aloud why Clayton was starting everyday at SS and Valentin was playing the OF.

While I give Clayton all the credit in the world for a good finish to last season and his slightly above average defensive ability, the positional flip-flops and prospect benching tactics employed by JM are the result of one person..... Clayton. I know some will say that the flip-flops and prospect benching are the result of the lineup card that JM writes up everyday..... that JM has the ability to sit Clayton if he chooses. All I have to say to that is, if Clayton has a start similar to 2001, bench him immediately JM. Play Valentin at SS and Crede at 3rd.

SoxRulecubsdrool
02-10-2002, 12:29 PM
I voted for Royce but if its based on overall performance I would have voted for Julio Ramirez. He looks like me out there. Well, if he had a beer belly! :gulp:

CubKilla
02-10-2002, 12:31 PM
Even with the mental error, which I gave TG alot of crap for with my friends the following weeks, I still love the guy. Glad he's always willing to play and contribute when called upon. Never complains or moans that he's always the backup. Just does his job when needed and does it well..... wherever JM puts him. In my opinion, Graffanino doesn't belong on that list.

Daver
02-10-2002, 12:52 PM
How do you put Ryan Kohlmeier on that list when he has yet to play a game in a Sox uniform?With the number of pitchers going into ST it is very likley that the Salad Shooter will not make the 25 man roster anyway.

RedPinStripes
02-10-2002, 03:16 PM
Originally posted by daver
How do you put Ryan Kohlmeier on that list when he has yet to play a game in a Sox uniform?With the number of pitchers going into ST it is very likley that the Salad Shooter will not make the 25 man roster anyway.

Remember this is white sox management here daver. Kohlmeirer might get a shot eventhough he should be selling beer.

:nardi
"Like me"


:gun
"Count me in"

:jaime
"Remember me?"

ode to veeck
02-10-2002, 03:17 PM
Choice

"It isn't the high price of stars that is expensive, it's the high price of mediocrity."

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/attachment.php?s=&attachmentid=338

Daver
02-10-2002, 03:25 PM
BTW,why wasn't :nardi on that list?







:firenardi

RedPinStripes
02-10-2002, 03:28 PM
Originally posted by daver
BTW,why wasn't :nardi on that list?







:firenardi


:farmer
"I'll be the damn pitching coach. And I won't wear socks!

MarqSox
02-10-2002, 05:13 PM
:hitless
All right! Finally a popularity contest I can win!

SOXSINCE'70
02-10-2002, 05:27 PM
Originally posted by beausox
As we all can read, everyone here loves everyone on the White Sox. Nobody here complains about any of the players or dislikes anyone. With that in mind however, please voteo on your least favorite Sox.

My vote goes to everyone's favorite clubhouse cancer,"Choice" Clayton.

FarWestChicago
02-10-2002, 05:35 PM
:buddylee

I'm running away with this thing!

bc2k
02-10-2002, 07:16 PM
Durham belongs on this list.

Cheryl
02-10-2002, 09:46 PM
Jerry Reinsdorf.

doublem23
02-10-2002, 10:59 PM
:thechoice

Is there really any doubt about it?

BTW, FWC, I got the poll right this time! http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/images/icons/agree.gif

voodoochile
02-10-2002, 11:07 PM
Originally posted by bc2k
Durham belongs on this list.

Just to be sure, are there ANY veteran players on the Sox you like?

bc2k
02-11-2002, 02:12 AM
Originally posted by voodoochile


Just to be sure, are there ANY veteran players on the Sox you like?

Yes sir Voodoochile. Keith Foulke, Kenny Lofton, and my hero Jose ValentinMVP. Damn, good point Voodoo. Eldred and Lowe were two, but they don't count today. You just opened my eyes Voodoo. I mean that. Sure there are other sox players who I like, but no other veterans. Perhaps I dislike most of our veterans becuase I always hear about the promise of our farm system. Maybe I feel a "grass is always greener" perspective. Harris and Hummell, Crede and Rauch, I put these guys on pedastels, thinking they're the all-star 2b and 3b. The ace of the staff is on his way kind of thinking.
Or perhaps I just expect too much from my White Sox. Maybe I rip on the veterans because they have shown me so much over the years, but aren't playing up to their past performances. Durham booting routine plays, not stealing bases, having a long, slow swing, leaving us venerable without a true leadoff hitter. We depended on you Ray, what happened?

Howry, the days of overpowering men with a fastball ended after little league. Put some movement on that ball. Learn to throw a curve.
Thomas, I never heard of Ted Williams cry like a housewife in a skirt. You're too good to cry.
Clayton, don't get me started on him. Rich sums him up best.
My veterans should produce so much that we never hear of the farm system. They should be so good, we all think, "Hummel who"?

RedPinStripes
02-11-2002, 04:31 AM
Ray might still fall asleep in the field this year, but i think you're going to like him in the 2 spot this year. That's why I stopped bashing him latly. I wanted him out of the leadoff spot so bad last year and now it's going to happen. I think he'll be much better off there and he'll raise is price for someone else to sign him next year. I highly doubt he will be traded since they will most-likley be contending for the division. Unless KW pulls off a magical trade for an ace. I mean a true ace. Not a KW ace.

KempersRS
02-11-2002, 06:22 AM
Pinstripes, your sig is huge, you should probably look for something else.

RedPinStripes
02-11-2002, 07:12 AM
It is a little big. I'm going to see if I can get it shortened up or just change it because it just hawk anyway.

RedPinStripes
02-11-2002, 07:51 AM
Originally posted by KempersRS
Pinstripes, your sig is huge, you should probably look for something else.

Better?

PaleHoseGeorge
02-11-2002, 09:09 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
Thomas, I never heard of Ted Williams cry like a housewife in a skirt. You're too good to cry.

This is where your facts aren't straight. Ted Williams was loved practically everywhere EXCEPT Boston. His feud with the fans and media in his own town are well known. To their thinking, he was arrogant, selfish, unaccommodating, and downright mean. Williams was so resentful of the fans, when he hit his last homerun (on his last career at-bat), he refused to acknowledge the applause of the fans. He didn't even doff his cap or return to the field for a curtain call.

Now certainly, you've got room on your roster for Ted Williams, right?

MarqSox
02-11-2002, 09:49 AM
Originally posted by bc2k


Yes sir Voodoochile. Keith Foulke, Kenny Lofton, and my hero Jose ValentinMVP. Damn, good point Voodoo. Eldred and Lowe were two, but they don't count today. You just opened my eyes Voodoo. I mean that. Sure there are other sox players who I like, but no other veterans. Perhaps I dislike most of our veterans becuase I always hear about the promise of our farm system. Maybe I feel a "grass is always greener" perspective. Harris and Hummell, Crede and Rauch, I put these guys on pedastels, thinking they're the all-star 2b and 3b. The ace of the staff is on his way kind of thinking.
Or perhaps I just expect too much from my White Sox. Maybe I rip on the veterans because they have shown me so much over the years, but aren't playing up to their past performances. Durham booting routine plays, not stealing bases, having a long, slow swing, leaving us venerable without a true leadoff hitter. We depended on you Ray, what happened?

Howry, the days of overpowering men with a fastball ended after little league. Put some movement on that ball. Learn to throw a curve.
Thomas, I never heard of Ted Williams cry like a housewife in a skirt. You're too good to cry.
Clayton, don't get me started on him. Rich sums him up best.
My veterans should produce so much that we never hear of the farm system. They should be so good, we all think, "Hummel who"?

Does this strike anyone else as sounding like an Oscar-winning dramatic monologue? :smile:

Meatpants
02-11-2002, 10:45 AM
:ray

Paulwny
02-11-2002, 11:11 AM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


This is where your facts aren't straight. Ted Williams was loved practically everywhere EXCEPT Boston. His feud with the fans and media in his own town are well known. To their thinking, he was arrogant, selfish, unaccommodating, and downright mean. Williams was so resentful of the fans, when he hit his last homerun (on his last career at-bat), he refused to acknowledge the applause of the fans. He didn't even doff his cap or return to the field for a curtain call.

Now certainly, you've got room on your roster for Ted Williams, right?

Absolutely correct PHG.
Back in the late 50's the Boston crowd was getting on Williams for some lack luster fielding. After hitting a hr the crowd rose to it's feet with applause, as Williams rounded 3rd he spit toward the fans.
The people in Boston may love him now but, there were mixed feelings when he played.

voodoochile
02-11-2002, 01:20 PM
Originally posted by bc2k


Yes sir Voodoochile. Keith Foulke, Kenny Lofton, and my hero Jose ValentinMVP. Damn, good point Voodoo. Eldred and Lowe were two, but they don't count today. You just opened my eyes Voodoo. I mean that. Sure there are other sox players who I like, but no other veterans. Perhaps I dislike most of our veterans becuase I always hear about the promise of our farm system. Maybe I feel a "grass is always greener" perspective. Harris and Hummell, Crede and Rauch, I put these guys on pedastels, thinking they're the all-star 2b and 3b. The ace of the staff is on his way kind of thinking.
Or perhaps I just expect too much from my White Sox. Maybe I rip on the veterans because they have shown me so much over the years, but aren't playing up to their past performances. Durham booting routine plays, not stealing bases, having a long, slow swing, leaving us venerable without a true leadoff hitter. We depended on you Ray, what happened?

Howry, the days of overpowering men with a fastball ended after little league. Put some movement on that ball. Learn to throw a curve.
Thomas, I never heard of Ted Williams cry like a housewife in a skirt. You're too good to cry.
Clayton, don't get me started on him. Rich sums him up best.
My veterans should produce so much that we never hear of the farm system. They should be so good, we all think, "Hummel who"?

If the Sox are going to get to the next level soon, the veterans will have to step up and play better. The rookies and kids will not take us there in the next few years. I have said all along that I think 2003 is going to be the Sox first serious shot at a title if they can keep the talent producing they should have a legitimate 4 year window at that point in time. Some kids are going to HAVE to contribute, BUT, veterans win titles. It's just a fact. KL and RayRay at the top of the lineup should give the Sox 2 guys with obp's over .350 this year. That means they will regularly be reaching KoneHead and Jose in the first inning (If Frank can post his usual .420+ OBP that is). All this talk about Hummell and Harris and their great OBP has to be temepered by the fact that they have not faced much or any major league pitching. That obviously changes everything. They are strictly an unknown commodity at this point in time. I hope they both play so well when they come up that they make the AS squad as rookies, but there are no guarantees.

I hear you about the frustration level, but these guys have performed for years. Frank never cried, no matter how much you want to paint it that way. He got upset. He made a statement. He still made it into camp by the players deadline. He went ahead and played first base - he got injured. He is coming back. You need to give him a chance. He has been there for years for this team. Where would the Sox have been in 2000 without his bat?

Not everything is going to fit perfectly all the time. This is baseball. Sometimes Casey strikes out when the winning run is at 2nd...

Jerry_Manuel
02-11-2002, 05:18 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge
Now certainly, you've got room on your roster for Ted Williams, right?

I do.

That's the kind of player I like.

thepaulbowski
02-11-2002, 09:35 PM
If we want a horrible left fielder, we should just re-sign Jose Canseco, maybe he could see a ball in Minnesota. At least we know he can still hit.

Daver
02-11-2002, 09:45 PM
Originally posted by thepaulbowski
If we want a horrible left fielder, we should just re-sign Jose Canseco, maybe he could see a ball in Minnesota. At least we know he can still hit.

He can still strikeout in three consecutive AB's too.
Another guy that should wear his glove on his head,but in Jose's case it might work.

RichH55
02-11-2002, 10:59 PM
Originally posted by daver


He can still strikeout in three consecutive AB's too.
Another guy that should wear his glove on his head,but in Jose's case it might work.


Still isn't a motivated Jose at the league minimum better than a guy like Michael Tucker for the Royals? Or a plethora of other rumdumbs out there? He should have a major league job and I'm surprised he doesn't

Daver
02-11-2002, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by RichH55



Still isn't a motivated Jose at the league minimum better than a guy like Michael Tucker for the Royals? Or a plethora of other rumdumbs out there? He should have a major league job and I'm surprised he doesn't

I don't care if he gets a major league job,as long as it isn't with the White Sox.

dugwood31
02-11-2002, 11:17 PM
I vote for Josh Paul. He can run, too bad he can't catch or hit.

foulkesfan11
02-13-2002, 06:05 PM
There aren't many players I don't like, but I'll say this. I think that as far as personalities go, Kelly Wunsch is the nicest on the team. I've had run in's with many players, and Kelly is the coolest!!!

:kelly

longshot7
02-13-2002, 06:26 PM
that's just for now.

What about all-time Sox?

I vote for Tony Castillo.

bringbackrobin
02-13-2002, 09:02 PM
Why Tony when you could have Carlos Castillo?

PaleHoseGeorge
02-13-2002, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by dugwood31
I vote for Josh Paul. He can run, too bad he can't catch or hit.

Yeah, the pinch-running catcher is a concept that has come and gone--assuming you ever believed it in the first place.

:versatile
"You mean calling me 'Versatile" is just sarcasm?"

BTW, welcome to the board, dug.

ode to veeck
02-13-2002, 09:07 PM
yeah, I guess cathers are for giving signs not for reading them ... even from waving wally :o:

bc2k
02-13-2002, 11:42 PM
I think it would be interesting to do this poll again but this time leaving off royce clayton. Most here dislike clayton, but I would like to see where those other 18 or so votes go.

voodoochile
02-14-2002, 12:59 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
I think it would be interesting to do this poll again but this time leaving off royce clayton. Most here dislike clayton, but I would like to see where those other 18 or so votes go.

You know that is a damn fine idea... but I am an idiot at polls...

Someone set that up, please...

duke of dorwood
02-14-2002, 09:00 AM
For his faults, the Choice at least came over and talked to us and signed a banner for us last year. Osuna was totally indifferent to the fans when he was there.

longshot7
02-14-2002, 02:25 PM
Originally posted by bringbackrobin
Why Tony when you could have Carlos Castillo?

Carlos didn't lose the single best game I have ever seen - against the Flubbies in the bottom of the 12th to Brant Brown.

Tony did.

guillen4life13
02-14-2002, 06:32 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


Perhaps, someone is still upset at the mental error, Tony made vs. the Cubs. :?:

and he redeemed himself against, correct me if i'm wrong, the royals w/ that gw hit.

He's a clubhouse leader who doesn't complain, and I feel he's deserving of a starting role, but unfortunately if he gets one, it won't be in a Sox uniform.