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View Full Version : Thanks for the memories Cliffy


Save McCuddy's
06-03-2006, 10:31 PM
I have feared it for a while and now am convinced that Politte gave us everything he had left to get that '05 Title.

He's missing crucial velocity on what was a 92-94 mph spotted fastball which is making his slider barely pedestrian. I hate to be negative about a guy who has shown us nothing but character and has pitched so valuably the past two years; but, it almost hurts to watch him go out there seemingly overmatched in every outing. I don't know what other options we can dig up, but he shouldn't be put in another situation with the game on the line.

On the plus side, Jenks is getting better every night. 0-2 to Barajas as I type. Thornton is adequate and potentially alot more in a setup role. Cotts is still a major league left handed specialist and possibly more. McCarthy is as good a long man as there is.

If we could get 7 plus out of our rotation, we wouldn't have any bull pen concerns. But that's a little like saying if "I could just go into the kitchen and grab a couple of churros'.

RowanDye
06-03-2006, 10:35 PM
I have feared it for a while and now am convinced that Politte gave us everything he had left to get that '05 Title.

He's missing crucial velocity on what was a 92-94 mph spotted fastball which is making his slider barely pedestrian. I hate to be negative about a guy who has shown us nothing but character and has pitched so valuably the past two years; but, it almost hurts to watch him go out there seemingly overmatched in every outing. I don't know what other options we can dig up, but he shouldn't be put in another situation with the game on the line.

On the plus side, Jenks is getting better every night. 0-2 to Barajas as I type. Thornton is adequate and potentially alot more in a setup role. Cotts is still a major league left handed specialist and possibly more. McCarthy is as good a long man as there is.

If we could get 7 plus out of our rotation, we wouldn't have any bull pen concerns. But that's a little like saying if "I could just go into the kitchen and grab a couple of churros'.
He's still one of the best options we have if he can turn it around...but I agree his opportunities in meaningful games should be over. Mop-up and blowout role for Cliff from now on, please.

MrRoboto83
06-03-2006, 10:39 PM
I think Cliff will get it all figured out. Jenks has been good this year, but I wouldn't exactly say he has it all together either. He has gotten pounded a few times this season.

Evman5
06-03-2006, 10:40 PM
I want the vulture back!

beckett21
06-03-2006, 10:44 PM
I've been willing to give him the benefit of the doubt up until tonight. He is just plain awful right now. I feel badly for him having to watch him struggle. It's getting uncomfortable to watch.

Makes me wonder if he's healthy.

I sure hope he does get it figured out, whatever the problem is.

SOXSINCE'70
06-03-2006, 10:51 PM
I want the vulture back!
Shouldn't this be in teal????
Barry Jones?? God,he must be almost 50 by now.


:tealpolice:

"1 Adam-12,1 Adam-12,possible teal vioaltion.See the mods".:D: :D:

JB98
06-03-2006, 10:53 PM
I have feared it for a while and now am convinced that Politte gave us everything he had left to get that '05 Title.

He's missing crucial velocity on what was a 92-94 mph spotted fastball which is making his slider barely pedestrian. I hate to be negative about a guy who has shown us nothing but character and has pitched so valuably the past two years; but, it almost hurts to watch him go out there seemingly overmatched in every outing. I don't know what other options we can dig up, but he shouldn't be put in another situation with the game on the line.

On the plus side, Jenks is getting better every night. 0-2 to Barajas as I type. Thornton is adequate and potentially alot more in a setup role. Cotts is still a major league left handed specialist and possibly more. McCarthy is as good a long man as there is.

If we could get 7 plus out of our rotation, we wouldn't have any bull pen concerns. But that's a little like saying if "I could just go into the kitchen and grab a couple of churros'.

I think his velocity is fine. It's his location that is a major, major problem right now.

JB98
06-03-2006, 10:53 PM
I have feared it for a while and now am convinced that Politte gave us everything he had left to get that '05 Title.

He's missing crucial velocity on what was a 92-94 mph spotted fastball which is making his slider barely pedestrian. I hate to be negative about a guy who has shown us nothing but character and has pitched so valuably the past two years; but, it almost hurts to watch him go out there seemingly overmatched in every outing. I don't know what other options we can dig up, but he shouldn't be put in another situation with the game on the line.

On the plus side, Jenks is getting better every night. 0-2 to Barajas as I type. Thornton is adequate and potentially alot more in a setup role. Cotts is still a major league left handed specialist and possibly more. McCarthy is as good a long man as there is.

If we could get 7 plus out of our rotation, we wouldn't have any bull pen concerns. But that's a little like saying if "I could just go into the kitchen and grab a couple of churros'.

Sorry, double post.

Frontman
06-03-2006, 10:53 PM
He looks like a nervous wreck on the mound, almost a "Ozzie had to call me out here. Yep, ah hell, this guy at the plate knows how to hit. What the hell should I throw this time?" ready to puke under the pressure look to his face. Granted, many relief pitchers look like they'd rather be anywhere else than to be in the situation they were called into, but its like Polittle can't release that tension the way the others have.

Cotts is the one who is driving me crazy, almost as much as watching CLiff throw.

Front

JB98
06-03-2006, 10:56 PM
He looks like a nervous wreck on the mound, almost a "Ozzie had to call me out here. Yep, ah hell, this guy at the plate knows how to hit. What the hell should I throw this time?" ready to puke under the pressure look to his face. Granted, many relief pitchers look like they'd rather be anywhere else than to be in the situation they were called into, but its like Polittle can't release that tension the way the others have.

Cotts is the one who is driving me crazy, almost as much as watching CLiff throw.

Front

Cotts is the only guy besides Jenks that I trust right now.

beckett21
06-03-2006, 11:13 PM
He looks like a nervous wreck on the mound, almost a "Ozzie had to call me out here. Yep, ah hell, this guy at the plate knows how to hit. What the hell should I throw this time?" ready to puke under the pressure look to his face. Granted, many relief pitchers look like they'd rather be anywhere else than to be in the situation they were called into, but its like Polittle can't release that tension the way the others have.

Cotts is the one who is driving me crazy, almost as much as watching CLiff throw.

Front
Cliff has always had that crapping-his-pants look about him on the mound, IMO. I think that's just the way he looks. :D:

Save McCuddy's
06-03-2006, 11:19 PM
I think his velocity is fine. It's his location that is a major, major problem right now.

I'm pretty sure it's not just me, but his velocity is definitely a problem. He routinely hit 94 last year and now hits the ceiling at 90.

I wouldn't be worried if it was just a matter of location. He's gotten guys out and struck out 2-3 times as many guys as he's walked for 7 years now. You can't tell me that he suddenly can't find the plate. His stuff just isn't there. Consequently, he lacks confidence locating the ball or throwing strikes to get ahead in counts.

JB98
06-03-2006, 11:23 PM
I'm pretty sure it's not just me, but his velocity is definitely a problem. He routinely hit 94 last year and now hits the ceiling at 90.

I wouldn't be worried if it was just a matter of location. He's gotten guys out and struck out 2-3 times as many guys as he's walked for 7 years now. You can't tell me that he suddenly can't find the plate. His stuff just isn't there. Consequently, he lacks confidence locating the ball or throwing strikes to get ahead in counts.

I'm not telling you that he suddenly can't find the plate. The problem is he's throwing the ball right down the middle and getting killed. He doesn't have any command whatsoever. I don't think Politte is injured. That's a Cubune conspiracy theory if you ask me.

ilsox7
06-03-2006, 11:27 PM
I'm pretty sure it's not just me, but his velocity is definitely a problem. He routinely hit 94 last year and now hits the ceiling at 90.

I wouldn't be worried if it was just a matter of location. He's gotten guys out and struck out 2-3 times as many guys as he's walked for 7 years now. You can't tell me that he suddenly can't find the plate. His stuff just isn't there. Consequently, he lacks confidence locating the ball or throwing strikes to get ahead in counts.

I didn't see tonight's game, but the last time I saw Cliff pitch (some time in the last week) they had him consistently at 92-94 on the TV gun. Take it FWIW.

JB98
06-03-2006, 11:28 PM
I didn't see tonight's game, but the last time I saw Cliff pitch (some time in the last week) they had him consistently at 92-94 on the TV gun. Take it FWIW.

I saw the same thing. Of course, those gun readings are hardly reliable. I'm going on what I see, and what I see is Cliff missing his location repeatedly.

ilsox7
06-03-2006, 11:33 PM
I saw the same thing. Of course, those gun readings are hardly reliable. I'm going on what I see, and what I see is Cliff missing his location repeatedly.

Agreed. Most of the staff has been missing location. So hopefully as a whole they get it together and start dominating like they can.

Save McCuddy's
06-03-2006, 11:34 PM
I saw the same thing. Of course, those gun readings are hardly reliable. I'm going on what I see, and what I see is Cliff missing his location repeatedly.

I haven't seen him hit 92-94 this season that I can remember. Tonight's game the tv radar had him at 89-90 with one or two pitches at 91. Just seems to me that if it were location, he'd have fixed it by now.

champagne030
06-03-2006, 11:46 PM
I haven't seen him hit 92-94 this season that I can remember. Tonight's game the tv radar had him at 89-90 with one or two pitches at 91. Just seems to me that if it were location, he'd have fixed it by now.

Maybe they saw him on the Jndians gun that is 2-3 mph faster than reality. He needs to be a legit 92-94 with the fastball because it's straight as an arrow.....

Ol' No. 2
06-04-2006, 01:09 AM
I saw the same thing. Of course, those gun readings are hardly reliable. I'm going on what I see, and what I see is Cliff missing his location repeatedly.Velocity is not Politte's problem. His problem is...he's not that good of a pitcher. Last year he pitched way over his head. He's better than what he's been showing lately, but he's an adequate middle reliever - nothing more. If anyone is expecting the 2005 version, watch the DVD.

Frontman
06-04-2006, 04:26 AM
Cotts is the only guy besides Jenks that I trust right now.

Cotts, like any relief pitcher, sometimes can get it done, other times can't. What drives me nuts about Cotts is when he doesn't get it done, he's out on the mound pissed that Ozzie is on his way to pull him. I wish he'd realize that sometimes he can throw like Zeus tossing thunderbolts, other times he's tossing slow pitch softball. Maybe he'll learn to keep his head and his cool a bit more with time. I realized after posting and reading it again later that I didn't express why Cotts is driving me crazy.

Oh, for Dustin Hermanson to have a medical miracle with his back right now. I strongly believe that if Herm was out there in the bullpen that he's one of those guys that "makes the others around him better players" kind of guy. Sadly, I don't think that he'll ever get back, so hopefully KW can find that type of middle/late relief player who can help the others out.

Front

Lip Man 1
06-04-2006, 01:28 PM
Walks are killing the bullpen right now. And it doesn't seem to be just one pitcher.

Lip

TaylorStSox
06-04-2006, 01:32 PM
I hate to say I told you so, but I've been preachin on here for a long time that Cliff hasn't been the same pitcher since the ASG of 05. Velocity is an issue for him. He has to be able to get his 4 seamer past hitters. His slider's not good enough to be his sole out pitch. Last year, he quit rushing the 4 seamer up there and relied way too heavily on that slider. Now, he's not locating it and he's getting bombed. He's a thrower, not a pitcher. He needs that extra 2-3 MPH on his 4 seamer.

caulfield12
06-04-2006, 04:07 PM
Farmer is absolutely right. Politte doesn't have that nasty edge...he doesn't claim the inside third of the plate as his own. Your big league career is one the ropes....come inside, knock someone down. Do something besides throwing the same pitch over and over again. The Rangers are diving out over the plate and almost getting hit by what are almost inside strikes.

CubsfansareDRUNK
06-04-2006, 04:22 PM
aaaaaaand Cliff continues to not get it done

Pasqua's Posers
06-04-2006, 04:34 PM
When does the Cliff Politte Appreciation thread start? He's done-stick a fork in him.:angry:

itsnotrequired
06-04-2006, 06:04 PM
I didn't think Politte could continue his slide yet here we are. ERA went up a full run after today's "performance". He has now given up 31 hits in 20.2 IP. Good gravy...

Chips
06-04-2006, 06:09 PM
I didn't think Politte could continue his slide yet here we are. ERA went up a full run after today's "performance". He has now given up 31 hits in 20.2 IP. Good gravy...

Not to mention hia 17 ER in those 20.2 innings, in addition to the 5 jacks, 2 blown saves, and 12 walks.

itsnotrequired
06-04-2006, 06:13 PM
Not to mention hia 17 ER in those 20.2 innings, in addition to the 5 jacks, 2 blown saves, and 12 walks.

Its almost as if you're not a fan of Politte...

:redneck

JohnBasedowYoda
06-04-2006, 07:03 PM
we all thought shingo would turn it around. at least i did.

Chips
06-04-2006, 07:12 PM
we all thought shingo would turn it around. at least i did.

Like Farmio says, pitchers don't go through slumps, they just lose their stuff.

Dan Mega
06-04-2006, 07:15 PM
I'm coming to the realization that my favorite Sox player may be headed to AAA or traded soon.:(:

robiwho
06-04-2006, 07:41 PM
I'm coming to the realization that my favorite Sox player may be headed to AAA or traded soon.:(:

These are both better options than the solution Chips was advocating after last night's game -- which involved a blindfold and final cigarette. :o:

Chips
06-04-2006, 07:45 PM
These are both better options than the solution Chips was advocating after last night's game -- which involved a blindfold and final cigarette. :o:

I like my idea better.

WSox8404
06-04-2006, 10:08 PM
Location, location, location. Thats all I am gonna say about Cliff. I have no idea how you lose that much control over one offseason however. Well we shall see what happens I guess.

The Dude
06-04-2006, 10:12 PM
These are both better options than the solution Chips was advocating after last night's game -- which involved a blindfold and final cigarette. :o:

Personally, I dont mind Chips' idea at all! :tongue:

Seriously, Cliff must go and go quickly!!!!!!!!!

Chisox003
06-04-2006, 10:13 PM
Guy just lost it. It's a shame, but it happens.

I thought he was an automatic in the pen at the beginning of this season.

We'll miss ya Cliff.

SoxFan76
06-04-2006, 11:46 PM
The biggest argument against the Sox last year is that many guys had career years. I argued that point with guys like Jenks, Garland, Cotts, and Crede because they're young and hadn't reached their full potential prior to 2005.

But guys like Hermanson and Politte...they have been around awhile. Breakout years like that are very Loaiza-like. I was skeptical all along. But I hope he can figure it out. He was dominant last year.

digdagdug23
06-04-2006, 11:59 PM
These are both better options than the solution Chips was advocating after last night's game -- which involved a blindfold and final cigarette. :o:


Awww, that's too bad. I like Cliffy, seems like a good guy, yeah, I know he ain't pitching for crap, but do we hafta have a public execution? Why does this seem so Bugs Bunny-esque?

Can't we just send him down to AAA and let him live out the rest of his career grazing the grass-covered fields, watching the pretty rainbows? Cub ond guys, can we, huh, huh, huh? Pretty please?

Chips
06-05-2006, 12:07 AM
Awww, that's too bad. I like Cliffy, seems like a good guy, yeah, I know he ain't pitching for crap, but do we hafta have a public execution? Why does this seem so Bugs Bunny-esque?

Can't we just send him down to AAA and let him live out the rest of his career grazing the grass-covered fields, watching the pretty rainbows? Cub ond guys, can we, huh, huh, huh? Pretty please?

AAA, no way. Trade him for anything.

CubsfansareDRUNK
06-05-2006, 12:11 AM
we all thought shingo would turn it around. at least i did.

I chuckled at that name.

CynicSox
06-05-2006, 12:13 AM
AAA, no way. Trade him for anything.

Let's get Marte back. He does have a championship ring....

Jjav829
06-05-2006, 12:24 AM
It's really a shame what has become of Cliff Politte. Last year, he was our best reliever. There was never an outing where I didn't think he would shut down the opposing hitters. This year, it's the complete opposite. :(:

Chips
06-05-2006, 12:27 AM
Let's get Marte back. He does have a championship ring....

I'd take a bag of balls for Cliff.

The Dude
06-05-2006, 12:29 AM
I'd take a bag of balls for Cliff.

I'd take another Sharp's beer for Cliff!

spiffie
06-05-2006, 12:58 AM
Just as no one expects Anderson and Uribe to continue to struggle, or Garland not to get himself right, I think we should give Cliff more time and patience to get himself right. He's still the same guy who helped us to a World Series title. Let's all just step back, not boo the hell out of the guy when he makes a mistake, and let him find his form. He'll find it in time to be a huge piece in the World Series pen for us this October if we all stop being such pants-pissing dark clouds and have faith that things will work out fine. It's like someone set the wayback machine to August 2005 and the rats are scurrying off the boat. The guy's had a rough patch, and he's trying so damn hard to right himself that he's making it worse. Maybe a few days off away from the team might help to get his head right.

ilsox7
06-05-2006, 01:16 AM
Just as no one expects Anderson and Uribe to continue to struggle, or Garland not to get himself right, I think we should give Cliff more time and patience to get himself right. He's still the same guy who helped us to a World Series title. Let's all just step back, not boo the hell out of the guy when he makes a mistake, and let him find his form. He'll find it in time to be a huge piece in the World Series pen for us this October if we all stop being such pants-pissing dark clouds and have faith that things will work out fine. It's like someone set the wayback machine to August 2005 and the rats are scurrying off the boat. The guy's had a rough patch, and he's trying so damn hard to right himself that he's making it worse. Maybe a few days off away from the team might help to get his head right.

The problem here is Cliff has absolutely nothing to build off of. BA has his defense and the fact that he is making contact lately. Jon has his last outting which was very good. Cliff, well, he came in today and served up an 0-2 meatball then imploded. And that's basically what he has done every time out there. Combine that with the track record he had pre-2005 and I can see the frustration and anger with his performance.

And sadly, Cliff looks like he has no confidence whatsoever in himself. Once that goes, you've got big, big problems.

RadioheadRocks
06-05-2006, 01:46 AM
The problem here is Cliff has absolutely nothing to build off of. BA has his defense and the fact that he is making contact lately. Jon has his last outting which was very good. Cliff, well, he came in today and served up an 0-2 meatball then imploded. And that's basically what he has done every time out there. Combine that with the track record he had pre-2005 and I can see the frustration and anger with his performance.

And sadly, Cliff looks like he has no confidence whatsoever in himself. Once that goes, you've got big, big problems.


Bingo... couldn't have said it better myself.

JB98
06-05-2006, 01:55 AM
The problem here is Cliff has absolutely nothing to build off of. BA has his defense and the fact that he is making contact lately. Jon has his last outting which was very good. Cliff, well, he came in today and served up an 0-2 meatball then imploded. And that's basically what he has done every time out there. Combine that with the track record he had pre-2005 and I can see the frustration and anger with his performance.

And sadly, Cliff looks like he has no confidence whatsoever in himself. Once that goes, you've got big, big problems.

Cliff was hitting 92-94 on the scoreboard gun today, which once again defeats the people in this thread who think velocity is the issue. Location, once again, was terrible. That 0-2 pitch to Laird was ridiculous. I noticed Cliff was working from the wind-up with nobody on base. At least he tried something different, although it didn't work.

There were some people booing Cliff as he left the mound today, which I took exception to. This guy's confidence is shot, and our boos are of no help whatsoever. We have a gaping hole in the right-handed set-up role right now. Cliff is the guy we need to step up and fill that, but he just doesn't seem capable at the moment. I feel terribly for the guy. Hopefully, Coop can come up with something to help the situation.:(:

IlliniSox4Life
06-05-2006, 02:40 AM
I am unveiling my new signature just for this thread...

Dan Mega
06-05-2006, 09:52 AM
I am unveiling my new signature just for this thread...

I like it:thumbsup:

Frontman
06-06-2006, 07:30 AM
I am unveiling my new signature just for this thread...

AH! It's the photo I've been looking for! Where did you find it?

The Fatal Four with their sage-like boss!

:)

Front

Jaffar
06-07-2006, 01:23 PM
He is heading to the DL according to ESPN radio 1000. It was on the update at 12:20. Apparently due to shoulder soreness......

Minnie Me
06-07-2006, 01:30 PM
Just as no one expects Anderson and Uribe to continue to struggle, or Garland not to get himself right, I think we should give Cliff more time and patience to get himself right. He's still the same guy who helped us to a World Series title. Let's all just step back, not boo the hell out of the guy when he makes a mistake, and let him find his form. He'll find it in time to be a huge piece in the World Series pen for us this October if we all stop being such pants-pissing dark clouds and have faith that things will work out fine. It's like someone set the wayback machine to August 2005 and the rats are scurrying off the boat. The guy's had a rough patch, and he's trying so damn hard to right himself that he's making it worse. Maybe a few days off away from the team might help to get his head right.

Wrong-Wrong and Wrong
Last year is history. Pitchers cannot be compared to position players. This is not about "feelings" and "last year"
This is about an exploding bullpen and how to fix it. One solution is bye-bye to Mr. Cliff.

The Dude
06-07-2006, 01:45 PM
He is heading to the DL according to ESPN radio 1000. It was on the update at 12:20. Apparently due to shoulder soreness......

Yes! GREAT NEWS! Hopefully he stays away for some time and gets his stuff together.

itsnotrequired
06-07-2006, 01:47 PM
He is heading to the DL according to ESPN radio 1000. It was on the update at 12:20. Apparently due to shoulder soreness......

Interesting...

DaleJRFan
06-07-2006, 01:54 PM
He is heading to the DL according to ESPN radio 1000. It was on the update at 12:20. Apparently due to shoulder soreness......

Does this signal the return of the allmighty Boone Logan??? :cool:

SoxFan76
06-07-2006, 01:55 PM
Maybe now another one of those Charlotte relivers with their negative ERAs will be called up.

I swear something's in the water down there. Talk about a dominant pitching staff...

Lip Man 1
06-07-2006, 02:14 PM
Too bad when they get to the Sox somehow, something happens and they are no longer 'dominant.'

:cool:

Lip

Ol' No. 2
06-07-2006, 02:23 PM
Too bad when they get to the Sox somehow, something happens and they are no longer 'dominant.'

:cool:

LipYou mean like Bobby Jenks?

yesenia
06-07-2006, 02:26 PM
I love how as soon as everyone sees Bobby coming out of the bull pen, everyone stands up. With Cliff everyone just sighed or looked down thinking...did we just give up? Ofcourse thats a recent account of what I saw

The Immigrant
06-07-2006, 02:30 PM
You mean like Bobby Jenks?

Bobby was never in Charlotte.

Just sayin'.

Lip Man 1
06-07-2006, 04:03 PM
No. 2:

Actually I was thinking along the lines of Logan, Montero and the other 'distinguished' cast of characters who pitched so 'well' during spring training.

:cool:

Lip

slowlearner
06-07-2006, 11:08 PM
Velocity is not Politte's problem. His problem is...he's not that good of a pitcher. Last year he pitched way over his head. He's better than what he's been showing lately, but he's an adequate middle reliever - nothing more. If anyone is expecting the 2005 version, watch the DVD.

Unfortunately, I agree 100%. Cliff had a career year and has since regressed to his norm. The chances of him having another season even close to 2005 are very slim. I'm obviously hoping he does, but he cannot be relied on anymore. It's too bad, but it's a pretty much a fact. He's had above average years before, but 2005 was an extreme anomaly.