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czalgosz
02-02-2002, 11:57 AM
I was thinking about the Sox bullpen, specifically the lefties therein. Assuming that (1) Parque will be in the rotation and (2) the Sox will want two lefties (why else give extended chances to Bill Pulsipher and Alan Embree last season?) here is the depth chart, as I see it, for lefty relievers -

1. Wunsch
2. Masaoka
3. Jacquez
4. Vining
5. Lee
6. Porzio

Am I forgetting someone? I really think the Sox should go in with Wunsch and Vining, but apparently the Sox don't like Vining, so it'll be Wunsch and either Jacquez or Masaoka, whoever puts together a better spring (assuming everyone's healthy.)

Comments?

AsInWreck
02-02-2002, 12:27 PM
Corwin Malone is another lefty/also wade parrish who according to whitesox.com had a 1.38 era in 16 appearance w/ birmingham-15 in relief - i don't know if either were invited ST

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 12:29 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck
Corwin Malone is another lefty/also wade parrish who according to whitesox.com had a 1.38 era in 16 appearance w/ birmingham-15 in relief

I would be very surprised to see Malone make the team out of Spring Training.

Who was that who was going off about how we have up McKay Christensen for Parrish?

kermittheefrog
02-02-2002, 02:21 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


I would be very surprised to see Malone make the team out of Spring Training.

Who was that who was going off about how we have up McKay Christensen for Parrish?

To AsInWreck: Corwin Malone is a top 40 STARTING pitching prospect. He just 19.3 innings last year for Birmingham (and a bunch for Kannapolis and Winston-Salem) but all as a starter.

btw - It was Rich55 who was interested in Parrish.

longshot7
02-02-2002, 02:27 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
I was thinking about the Sox bullpen, specifically the lefties therein. Assuming that (1) Parque will be in the rotation and (2) the Sox will want two lefties (why else give extended chances to Bill Pulsipher and Alan Embree last season?) here is the depth chart, as I see it, for lefty relievers -

1. Wunsch
2. Masaoka
3. Jacquez
4. Vining
5. Lee
6. Porzio
Comments?

I agree. Having two lefties out there is extremely important. Masaoka pitched pretty well for the Dodgers a few years back - maybe he's ready.

voodoochile
02-02-2002, 02:35 PM
Sox feel that Osuna (I know it's a dirty word) can be effective against lefties - he throws a screwgy...

kermittheefrog
02-02-2002, 04:04 PM
I'd venture a guess that Vining and Porzio are both ahead of Jacquez.

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 04:26 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I'd venture a guess that Vining and Porzio are both ahead of Jacquez.

If you're right, then chances are we'll never see Jacquez in a Sox uniform.

The Baseball Prospectus had it right, I think, when they said that they picked him up so that if they wanted to put someone else on the 40-man roster, they would have someone who they could let go without a second thought.

AsInWreck
02-02-2002, 04:56 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I'd venture a guess that Vining and Porzio are both ahead of Jacquez.

Yeah, but Porzio is a STARTing pitching prospect

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 04:59 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck


Yeah, but Porzio is a STARTing pitching prospect

If Porzio gets a big-league job, it'll be as a long-reliever/mop-up type guy, with the occasional emergency start. He's not good enough to break into a rotation.

AsInWreck
02-02-2002, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


If Porzio gets a big-league job, it'll be as a long-reliever/mop-up type guy, with the occasional emergency start. He's not good enough to break into a rotation.

I was just responding to previous comment/in my opinion any minor leaguer should be considered for bullpen whether he's a starter or not

Chisox_cali
02-02-2002, 05:02 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I'd venture a guess that Vining and Porzio are both ahead of Jacquez.

It would be very interesting to see how Vining would make the team seeing that he's NOT on the 40 man roster and was also NOT invited to spring training

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 05:07 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck


I was just responding to previous comment/in my opinion any minor leaguer should be considered for bullpen whether he's a starter or not

Okay, I see now...

IMO, there's two types of minor league starters - your "A" guys like Rauch and Wright, and "B" guys like Ginter or Guerrier.

"A" guys are groomed for the rotation - those guys you are thinking will be #1 or #2 guys down the road. You don't bury them in the back of the bullpen in long relief - you put them in the rotation in AAA if you don't have room at the big-league level, so they can get regular work, just as if Borchard doesn't start for the Sox, he starts in AAA.

"B" guys are marginal and you can try them in the bullpen to see if they fit in there.

Malone, IMO, is an "A".

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 05:13 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali


It would be very interesting to see how Vining would make the team seeing that he's NOT on the 40 man roster and was also NOT invited to spring training

I just looked it up - you're right. That sucks. He's the best lefty reliever the Sox have outside of Wunsch, and apparently they just don't like him. Oh well, they can still make a move to sign him onto the team.

BTW, why is Jason Dellaero still on the 40-man roster?

AsInWreck
02-02-2002, 05:15 PM
That's how most teams operate but that doesn't seem to be the case w/ the sox, at least the last 2 years. The sox seem to have their 5 guys pencilled in for the rotation/what if those guys perform and you've got a guy like malone who looks like he's ready to see some action by, say, june, but you need someone in the 'pen-you wouldn't call
him up?

Chisox_cali
02-02-2002, 05:20 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


I just looked it up - you're right. That sucks. He's the best lefty reliever the Sox have outside of Wunsch, and apparently they just don't like him. Oh well, they can still make a move to sign him onto the team.

BTW, why is Jason Dellaero still on the 40-man roster?

Was it his 17.55 ERA last year that makes him so likable? :smile:

doublem23
02-02-2002, 05:25 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali


Was it his 17.55 ERA last year that makes him so likable? :smile:

:jerry
Wait!? ERAs are supposed to be low? Does that mean batting averages are supposed to be high? Why the hell was I playing Clayton everyday then???

:hitless
Damn! I was wondering how long it would be before he figured that out!

czalgosz
02-02-2002, 05:29 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali


Was it his 17.55 ERA last year that makes him so likable? :smile:

How many innings did he pitch last season? 6? That's like saying that if Crede went 1-for-12 in a brief tryout, he should get released.

Chisox_cali
02-02-2002, 05:33 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


How many innings did he pitch last season? 6? That's like saying that if Crede went 1-for-12 in a brief tryout, he should get released.

Yeah I know but that certainly didnt help us last year in those 6 innings

cornball
02-02-2002, 10:15 PM
I think Parque will wind up in the pen. I think KW will get another starter. If thats the case it will be best for the club and strengthen the pen. But we will see.

Huisj
02-02-2002, 10:16 PM
His 6 inning tryout means even less when you consider that he would usually sit days and days and days between appearances. You can't put a guy in who's a rookie and who's not pitched in 2 weeks and expect him to perform.

RichH55
02-03-2002, 04:41 AM
Originally posted by czalgosz


I would be very surprised to see Malone make the team out of Spring Training.

Who was that who was going off about how we have up McKay Christensen for Parrish?



That was me..........if Parrish makes the team out of ST then I will stand corrected, but I have asked quite a bit about Parrish and I generally cant get anything but "career minor leaguer" not exactly the talk of championship pitching...........he's a leftie so he will always have somewhere to pitch(whether that is a major league team or not is still a question)..........On minor league pitching scouting reports tend to mean more than just numbers, so I will keep my reservations about Parrish til I see what both Mckay and Wade do, but I still think it was a trade that didnt need to be made

RichH55
02-03-2002, 04:45 AM
Originally posted by AsInWreck
Corwin Malone is another lefty/also wade parrish who according to whitesox.com had a 1.38 era in 16 appearance w/ birmingham-15 in relief - i don't know if either were invited ST


Does anyone know if Wade was invited to Spring Training or any of the developmental winter stuff that they generally send guys to that they think are the true prospects? I remember someone saying that since Almonte(? IIRC) wasnt sent to Arizona that it meant the Sox dont think all that much of him.............just looking if anyone had any information on Parrish besides 16 appearances in Double A...age? organizational outlook on the kid? Any winter ball/developmental league? Where he is expected to start next year? BB/K Ratio? Anything?

RichH55
02-03-2002, 04:46 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


To AsInWreck: Corwin Malone is a top 40 STARTING pitching prospect. He just 19.3 innings last year for Birmingham (and a bunch for Kannapolis and Winston-Salem) but all as a starter.

btw - It was Rich55 who was interested in Parrish.



Nice to know someone reads my posts!(or at least has glanced at them..........stealing my H from RichH55 you bastard!:)



Cheers :gulp:

CHISOX10
02-03-2002, 10:54 AM
Finally, someone that see's what happened to Vining. You're brilliant! Vining's 17.55 means squat........however, for unknown reasons that Sox have decided that he doesn't fit the bill for them....so therefore has been taken off the 40 man and NOT invited to big league spring training. How does a guy like Porzio get a big league invite over Vining? His last year AAA era was 4.4 and his Venezula era was a bit better at a 4.10. Who cares what a guy did three years ago.....doesn't it make more sense to play who's performing now???? Does a 1.96 era mean NOTHING anymore??? Or a guy who puts up a 0.96 era in the AFL???? SOMEONE...............wake up!!!!!!!! Vining is the man..........give him a better chance.....oh well, doesn't appear that he'll get one.

:vining