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soxfan45
05-06-2006, 01:20 PM
I heard someone at the game yesterday talking about the possibility of Tori Hunter being available and the Twins potentially looking to dump some contracts. Wondering if the Twins (who are going to lose Hunter anyway) would be willing to part for someone like Jerry Owens or one of our other prospects in a couple months. Know that these inter-division trades are not popular but the Twins are going to lose the guy anyway. He certainly would be a nice defensive addition. He has speed and some power. What do you guys think?

santo=dorf
05-06-2006, 01:23 PM
Why? Hunter sucks and makes 30 times the salary Anderson does. He also strikes out as much and has a low average like BA too.

What's the Score?

D. TODD
05-06-2006, 01:26 PM
No way they deal Hunter to the Sox anyway. He will be dealt to someone though.

FedEx227
05-06-2006, 01:27 PM
Exactly what Todd said. Even if we were stupid enough to get Hunter at this point, why would the Twins trade him to a division rival?

goldglovesox
05-06-2006, 01:30 PM
I heard someone at the game yesterday talking about the possibility of Tori Hunter being available and the Twins potentially looking to dump some contracts. Wondering if the Twins (who are going to lose Hunter anyway) would be willing to part for someone like Jerry Owens or one of our other prospects in a couple months. Know that these inter-division trades are not popular but the Twins are going to lose the guy anyway. He certainly would be a nice defensive addition. He has speed and some power. What do you guys think?

I dont think Hunter is that much of an upgrade to Anderson when you consider what we would have to give up and how much money we add to the payroll. Plus it is always scary to give up a guy like Owens and possibly a minor league arm that could come back to bite us in the 19 games a year we see that team in our own division. If an upgrade is needed in CF I would rather them go find a guy like Joey Gathright from Tampa Bay or Luis Matos from Baltimore. Both are inexpensive and will be solid players for us.

cbotnyse
05-06-2006, 01:39 PM
There is no way the Twins are that stupid to dump one of thier best players to a division rival. But like was said, with the huge difference in price, I'll take BA's glove right now.

Soxfest
05-06-2006, 01:43 PM
Hunter will go but not in division...Twins window has officially shut!

DickAllen72
05-06-2006, 02:23 PM
Hunter will go but not in division...Twins window has officially shut!

I agree.

But if the Twins were willing to trade Hunter to the Sox, I'd take him in a heartbeat.

TornLabrum
05-06-2006, 02:48 PM
You misspelled Toriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii iiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii.

gobears1987
05-06-2006, 03:31 PM
Even if the Twinkeis would trade him, there is no way in hell they do it within the division.

santo=dorf
05-06-2006, 03:31 PM
I'd take him in a heartbeat.
Ok I'll bite.

Why are you so willing to trade for a loud mouth, $10 million, light hitting, great defensive center fielder to replace a $330,000 light hitting, rookie, great defensive center fielder? :?:

In case some of you have missed it:
Hunter's 2006 line:
.222/.276/.444 with 24 K's in 108 at bats.
Hunter's career: .266/.319/.458

He's tremendously overpaid.

Bobbo35
05-06-2006, 03:42 PM
Come on, do you actually think the twins are going to give him up to Sox who are their biggest division rival. Anyways, he is not worth the money he makes.

SoxSpeed22
05-06-2006, 03:58 PM
Him and Michael Vick learned how to get ESPN to fall in love with them and become overrated because of it. He's sucking now with hitting and has never been a good average hitter. Grady Sizemore is the best centerfielder in the AL central.
The Twins are finally done for and it's great to see them like this. If he gets traded midseason, good riddance.

bigsoxfan420
05-06-2006, 04:04 PM
Not that I think the trade is necessary or even a possibility, but how on earth can you say he's not an upgrade to Anderson???? Hunter is the BEST center fielder in the game today. He might not be the greatest hitter ever, but he does come through in the clutch. And again his defense is the best I've ever seen in center field. The guy robs hits all day long and make is look easy, no wait effortless.

Tragg
05-06-2006, 04:09 PM
Overpaying for mediocre veterans (in talent and/or in salary) is a sure way to ensure that our time at the top of the mountain is extremely short.

Hunter is good for hrs in the 20s and OBP in the absolutely dismal .320s. His defense, while good, is exaggerated because of his jumps over the outfield baggies to snare a few balls.

Realist
05-06-2006, 04:30 PM
Torii Hunter would fit in fantastic with this Sox team. I think having Hunter on the Sox would make us possibly the best team ever, but it ain't gonna happen.
The Spongecakes won't trade him to us.
His salary it too big for us to even be interested.

DickAllen72
05-06-2006, 04:36 PM
Ok I'll bite.

Why are you so willing to trade for a loud mouth, $10 million, light hitting, great defensive center fielder to replace a $330,000 light hitting, rookie, great defensive center fielder? :?:

In case some of you have missed it:
Hunter's 2006 line:
.222/.276/.444 with 24 K's in 108 at bats.
Hunter's career: .266/.319/.458

He's tremendously overpaid.

Does he really make $10M??? I didn't know that. I assumed he made closer to $4-5M. Unless the Twins would pick up more than half of the salary, I doubt the Sox would be willing to trade for him.

Salary issue aside, Torii is a great defensive CF, and is a winner. He is a clutch player, plays the game right and plays the game hard. A guy like that can play for my team any day.

Again, this ain't gonna happen anyway, but just speaking hypothetically.

itsnotrequired
05-06-2006, 04:41 PM
Does he really make $10M??? I didn't know that. I assumed he made closer to $4-5M. Unless the Twins would pick up more than half of the salary, I doubt the Sox would be willing to trade for him.

Hunter is making $10.75 million this season, the last year of his contract. There is a $12 million club option for 2007 ($2 million buyout).

DickAllen72
05-06-2006, 04:43 PM
Hunter is making $10.75 million this season, the last year of his contract. There is a $12 million club option for 2007 ($2 million buyout).

Wow. I never thought the Twins overpaid for anyone like that. I'm surprised they didn't trade him before signing him to that kind of contract, considering their financial track record. Was that a heavily back-loaded multi year contract?

Epark84
05-06-2006, 04:45 PM
Ok I'll bite.

Why are you so willing to trade for a loud mouth, $10 million, light hitting, great defensive center fielder to replace a $330,000 light hitting, rookie, great defensive center fielder? :?:

In case some of you have missed it:
Hunter's 2006 line:
.222/.276/.444 with 24 K's in 108 at bats.
Hunter's career: .266/.319/.458

He's tremendously overpaid.

Hes overpaid I agree, but he is a better defensive player than anderson. I dont really want him, but hes better than anderson obviously offensively and defensively

beckett21
05-06-2006, 05:07 PM
Hunter is probably the best defensive centerfielder in the game this side of Andruw Jones. I sometimes wonder what would have happened had that alleged Magglio for Andruw trade gone through, but that's neither here nor there now.

Hunter would be an overall upgrade over BA right now, but not enough to warrant a move when the salary discrepancy is taken into consideration.

I'm content to stick with BA for now at approximately 1/25th of the cost. Hunter is not 25 times better than BA. :redneck

Chisox003
05-06-2006, 05:34 PM
Hes overpaid I agree, but he is a better defensive player than anderson. I dont really want him, but hes better than anderson obviously offensively and defensively Anderson's 23 years old.

JorgeFabregas
05-06-2006, 06:39 PM
Anderson has a higher range factor and zone rating this year. In fact, Anderson has the highest range factor for major league CFers.

Craig Grebeck
05-06-2006, 07:24 PM
Not that I think the trade is necessary or even a possibility, but how on earth can you say he's not an upgrade to Anderson???? Hunter is the BEST center fielder in the game today. He might not be the greatest hitter ever, but he does come through in the clutch. And again his defense is the best I've ever seen in center field. The guy robs hits all day long and make is look easy, no wait effortless.
That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

And I don't care if he plays the game right, or anything like that. Lots of guys play the game right, and lots of them get on base and slug at a much better percentage. He's aging, hurting, and will most likely go to the NL (Astros? Taveras is horrible).

SOXSINCE'70
05-06-2006, 11:36 PM
if the Twins were willing to trade Hunter to the Sox, I'd take him in a heartbeat.

Yes,but would they trade the Sox Johan Santana????:roflmao: :roflmao:

Ol' No. 2
05-07-2006, 12:25 AM
Hunter is probably the best defensive centerfielder in the game this side of Andruw Jones. I sometimes wonder what would have happened had that alleged Magglio for Andruw trade gone through, but that's neither here nor there now.

Hunter would be an overall upgrade over BA right now, but not enough to warrant a move when the salary discrepancy is taken into consideration.

I'm content to stick with BA for now at approximately 1/25th of the cost. Hunter is not 25 times better than BA. :redneckExactly. There are a lot better uses for $10+ million dollars. Some perspective: Toriiii Hunter makes more than Brian Anderson and Jose Contreras COMBINED.

DickAllen72
05-07-2006, 12:27 AM
Yes,but would they trade the Sox Johan Santana????:roflmao: :roflmao:

Where would he pitch? :tongue:

SOX ADDICT '73
05-07-2006, 12:37 AM
Hunter's so good it only took him 98 games worth of overrated defense and mediocre offense to STEAL the 2005 Gold Glove from Aaron Rowand.

Nellie_Fox
05-07-2006, 02:11 AM
Hunter is extremely overpaid for what he brings to the table. He's a weak hitter who strikes out too much.

As for his defensive prowess, he's pretty good, but his reputation has been built on jumping over fences to bring back homeruns. The reason he's able to do this so often is that he plays a very deep centerfield so that he can get back to the fence before the ball gets there. He's stated several times that he'd rather "rob a homerun than hit one."

Flashy, over the fence catches make Sportscenter. Letting singles drop in front of you because of how deep you play doesn't.

itsnotrequired
05-07-2006, 02:13 AM
Exactly. There are a lot better uses for $10+ million dollars. Some perspective: Toriiii Hunter makes more than Brian Anderson and Jose Contreras COMBINED.

Sometimes it takes statements like this to put things in perspective.

:thumbsup:

DSpivack
05-07-2006, 03:00 AM
That is the dumbest thing I have ever heard.

And I don't care if he plays the game right, or anything like that. Lots of guys play the game right, and lots of them get on base and slug at a much better percentage. He's aging, hurting, and will most likely go to the NL (Astros? Taveras is horrible).

Well, they do have Preston Wilson. :tongue:'

I don't know how he is defensively, but Taveras isn't a bad leadoff-type hitter.

TDog
05-07-2006, 04:54 AM
When you acquire a player, you don't acquire what he was but what he will be. Obviously. What a player has done can be a clue to what he will do in the future, but Loaiza for Contreras (or going back more than 35 years, San McDowell for Gaylord Perry or Rick Wise for Steve Carlton) should illustrate that it's more complicated than it looks.

The fact is, offensively, Torii Hunter isn't even providing what the Twins expected when they signed him to his current contract. Looking for what a team would get for what acquiring Torii would cost in talent and money, I don't think he would be worth it. Defensively, after what happened last year, I'm not sure he isn't more concerned with getting through this season uninjured than justifying the Gold Glove that already has his name on it.

bigfoot
05-07-2006, 08:40 AM
Where would he pitch? :tongue:

As Boone Logan's replacement????? But just until Boone can get a little more seasoning.

santo=dorf
05-07-2006, 09:58 AM
but Taveras isn't a bad leadoff-type hitter.

No he isn't. He can't draw a walk to save his life and strikes out a ton.

Tragg
05-07-2006, 10:12 AM
The Sox always figure out ways to get the trader to pick up 1/2 of ridiculous salaries, so the money isn' t the issue, imo. The issue is why would you want to give away signficant talent to get a mediocre hitter who isn't a big defensive upgrade (since the incumbent is also extremely adept defensively)? Oh, and it would be a rent as well. This would be a terrible move.

santo=dorf
05-07-2006, 10:26 AM
The Sox always figure out ways to get the trader to pick up 1/2 of ridiculous salaries, so the money isn' t the issue, imo. The issue is why would you want to give away signficant talent to get a mediocre hitter who isn't a big defensive upgrade (since the incumbent is also extremely adept defensively)? Oh, and it would be a rent as well. This would be a terrible move.

You honestly expect the cheapest owner in the American League to pick up half the salary of his franchise player to help out one of the team's biggest rivals? :o:

JUribe1989
05-07-2006, 12:04 PM
I would be too mad if the Sox got Torii Hunter. That being said, there is no way the Sox will get him. They have their future invested in Anderson.

slavko
05-07-2006, 12:33 PM
This thread falls under the heading "Other People's Bozos Always Seem Better Than Our Bozos." Even if it is a stretch to say Toriiii has descended to Bozo level, he's oldish, expensive, and we have guys who play the same position. Pass.

DickAllen72
05-07-2006, 09:54 PM
The Sox always figure out ways to get the trader to pick up 1/2 of ridiculous salaries, so the money isn' t the issue, imo. The issue is why would you want to give away signficant talent to get a mediocre hitter who isn't a big defensive upgrade (since the incumbent is also extremely adept defensively)? Oh, and it would be a rent as well. This would be a terrible move.

This ain't gonna happen anyway, but just to keep this thread in context...

The original poster hypothetically suggested Jerry Owens for Hunter in a couple of months. If the Twins were willing to make that trade plus pick up half of his salary, and if in a couple of months BA is still hitting below the Mendoza line, the Sox should make that trade in a heartbeat.

FielderJones
05-07-2006, 10:02 PM
This ain't gonna happen anyway, but just to keep this thread in context...

The original poster hypothetically suggested Jerry Owens for Hunter in a couple of months. If the Twins were willing to make that trade plus pick up half of his salary, and if in a couple of months BA is still hitting below the Mendoza line, the Sox should make that trade in a heartbeat.

All I can say is, I'm glad Kenny Williams is in charge of obtaining talent for the White Sox and not all these undiscovered baseball executive geniuses :rolleyes: who just haven't caught on with some MLB organization.

DickAllen72
05-07-2006, 10:09 PM
All I can say is, I'm glad Kenny Williams is in charge of obtaining talent for the White Sox and not all these undiscovered baseball executive geniuses :rolleyes: who just haven't caught on with some MLB organization.

Kenny Williams is probably the best GM in baseball.

Frater Perdurabo
05-07-2006, 10:19 PM
As for his defensive prowess, he's pretty good, but his reputation has been built on jumping over fences to bring back homeruns. The reason he's able to do this so often is that he plays a very deep centerfield so that he can get back to the fence before the ball gets there. He's stated several times that he'd rather "rob a homerun than hit one."

Flashy, over the fence catches make Sportscenter. Letting singles drop in front of you because of how deep you play doesn't.

This is the kind of insight that keeps me coming back to WSI again and again. Thanks, Nellie, for the scouting report! With this info, let some other team overpay for him.

TheOldRoman
05-07-2006, 10:48 PM
Hunter is extremely overpaid for what he brings to the table. He's a weak hitter who strikes out too much.

As for his defensive prowess, he's pretty good, but his reputation has been built on jumping over fences to bring back homeruns. The reason he's able to do this so often is that he plays a very deep centerfield so that he can get back to the fence before the ball gets there. He's stated several times that he'd rather "rob a homerun than hit one."

Flashy, over the fence catches make Sportscenter. Letting singles drop in front of you because of how deep you play doesn't.
I agree, 100%.
And as I said in a previous thread, he has been lucky to have countless balls hit to within a foot of the wall. I can only remember Sox pitching serving up a handful of balls that landed withing "robbing" range (2 feet over the wall) in the past few years. Twins' pitching gives up seemingly one a game. Him making those "spectacular" catches so often gave him the reputation of being the "bestest centerfielder of all-time!", at least in the minds of ESPN.

I am not confident that Hunter is any better than Anderson defensively. If he is, it is minimal, and the tables will turn soon (Hunter is getting older and BA is getting more experience). Not only that, but Anderson has a MUCH bigger upside than Hunter as a hitter. Anderson might be able to match Hunter's career year this year, but within the next couple of years Anderson will be lightyears ahead of Hunter with the bat.

Just say no to Torrrriiiiiiiiiiiiiiiiii

Tragg
05-08-2006, 09:59 AM
You honestly expect the cheapest owner in the American League to pick up half the salary of his franchise player to help out one of the team's biggest rivals? :o: No. But for such a cheap owner, he sure pays non-all stars like Radke and Hunter a hell of a lot of money. (Hunter makes almost as much as Konerko...egads). Maybe that's why they haven't gotten better, despite a rich farm system.

ma-gaga
05-08-2006, 02:20 PM
The reason he's able to do this so often is that he plays a very deep centerfield so that he can get back to the fence before the ball gets there.

I don't think you can generalize him this way. He positions himself according to the hitter. Deep on power guys, mid to shallow on everyone else.

If you watch THE highlight from yesterday, he comes from across the field to rob Maggs of a hit. I don't know if he was playing shallow, but he covered a ton of ground to save the no-hitter. Actually I think he WAS playing Maggs shallow. Watch the highlight and see where he came from to make that catch.

That was an insanely good play.

I agree that he's wildly overpaid, and overrated offensively. But his defense is solid.

Nellie_Fox
05-08-2006, 03:02 PM
I don't think you can generalize him this way. He positions himself according to the hitter. Deep on power guys, mid to shallow on everyone else. Of course he makes adjustments according to the hitter; all outfielders do. I'm just saying he plays deeper than most good defensive centerfielders, and I stand by that. I know he has good speed and usually gets a good jump on the ball. I didn't say he was not a good defensive player; I just said he gets somewhat overrated because of his deep play prevents balls from getting over his head very often, and people tend not to notice little singles that fall in front of the outfield (unless they are of the walkoff variety like Uribe had the other day.)