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irish rover
01-29-2002, 12:17 PM
Just heard on the score that chris was traded to BAL for a 2nd baseman prospect who is suppose to be thier best hitting prospect, I think his name is harrison

Huisj
01-29-2002, 12:20 PM
harrison? or was it hairston, as in jerry jr.? if it's him, he still hasn't really hit well in two or three opportunities in the big. hmmm.

fuzzy_patters
01-29-2002, 12:20 PM
He's a second baseman/outfielder named Willie Harrison.

Kilroy
01-29-2002, 12:21 PM
Just got the official press release...

WHITE SOX ACQUIRE 2B/OF WILLIE HARRIS FROM BALTIMORE
IN EXCHANGE FOR CHRIS SINGLETON CHICAGO – The Chicago White Sox have acquired second baseman/outfielder Willie
Harris from the Baltimore Orioles in exchange for outfielder Chris Singleton. The trade was announced this afternoon by
White Sox general manager Ken Williams. Harris, 23, appeared in nine games as a center fielder with the Orioles (.125, 3-24) as a late-season call-up. The left-handed hitter spent most of 2001 at
Class AA Bowie, batting .305 (160-525) with 83 runs, 27 doubles, nine home runs, 49 RBI, 54 stolen bases and a .364 on-base percentage. He played 90 games at second base and 40 in center field for Bowie. The 5-foot-9 Harris was named to the Eastern League postseason All-Star Team and was a Class AA
All-Star. “Willie has the skills to be a top-of-the-order hitter,” Williams said. “He has shown the ability to get on base, steal a base when you need it and spark an offense. Those are rare skills, and our scouts are very optimistic about his potential. They see a line-drive hitter who uses his speed and hits to all
fields. Defensively, Willie has above average range at second base and his arm strength also allows him to play center field.”
Harris was selected as the Top Hitter among Orioles prospects by Baseball Weekly and the eighth-best Baltimore prospect by Baseball America. In three seasons in the Orioles organization, Harris has hit .285 (368-1,293) with 17 home runs, 144 RBI, 110 stolen bases and a .367 on-base percentage.

“While it is always difficult to trade a class individual like Chris Singleton, we liked this opportunity to pick up a top prospect without compromising our competitiveness in 2002,” Williams said. “We feel confident that a combination of Aaron Rowand and Brian Simmons will give us the production we need from
center field, and Harris gives us future production at potentially two possible positions.” Rowand, 24, batted .293 (36-123) with four home runs and 20 RBI in 63 games with the White Sox in 2001, while Simmons, a 28-year-old switch hitter, batted
.178 (19-107) with two home runs and eight RBI in 60 games with Toronto. In three seasons with the White Sox, Singleton, 29, batted .283 (396-1,399) with 35 home runs and 179 RBI. The left-hander hit .298 (117-392) with seven homers and 45 RBI in 119 games with the Sox in 2001.

Seems like the clock on Ray-Ray just started tickin...

voodoochile
01-29-2002, 12:24 PM
Take THAT, CLR...

:D:

Still not impressed with the concept of Rowand in CF everyday, but if that is where we are, so be it. I think it was time for Singleton to move on. Hopefully Borchard tears the cover off the ball the first month in AAA and gets a May call up...

Soxboyrob
01-29-2002, 12:35 PM
I likes it. I likes it goooooood.

It sounds like this guy is a possible CF'er also. They make note of his arm allowing him to play CF. Maybe that's where he's slated to be. Statwise, this is the kind of guy I think this organization needed. I'll miss Chris, but this is the best for the team right now, imo.

duke of dorwood
01-29-2002, 12:37 PM
I do hope that Simmons gets a chance. Does anyone think he can bat lead off?

fuzzy_patters
01-29-2002, 12:37 PM
I'll miss Ray-Ray. I always enjoyed seeing him play, offensively. He was an Indian killer in 2000. Oh well, it looks like our 2003 secondbasemen will be Hummell or Harris. I'm glad to see the Sox being preemptive about this instead of waiting until their desperation would drive up the cost.

czalgosz
01-29-2002, 12:52 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
I do hope that Simmons gets a chance. Does anyone think he can bat lead off?

Well, he's a patient hitter, unlike Singleton, but he doesn't drive the ball, so I doubt that he'll ever bat leadoff.

This looks like a good deal all around - Looks like Brian Simmons will get some PT, and we get a rare infield prospect.

cheeses_h_rice
01-29-2002, 01:05 PM
May I be the first to offer our new Sox a nickname?

Wee Willie Harris.

(Of course, I have no idea how large Mr. Harris is.)

cheeses_h_rice
01-29-2002, 01:06 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice
May I be the first to offer our new Sox a nickname?

Wee Willie Harris.

(Of course, I have no idea how large Mr. Harris is.)

He's 5'9", 175 lbs., so my nickname sticks!

duke of dorwood
01-29-2002, 01:08 PM
From Ray-Ray to Wee-Wee ?

Iwritecode
01-29-2002, 01:28 PM
I like this trade. It does a lot of things all at once. First, it helps free up the log-jam in CF a little bit. Unless Joe B. or Julio has an outstanding spring, we will probably see platoon of Rowand and Simmons. Getting Harris now gives us someone to look forward to taking over the lead-off spot once Ray is gone. Plus he can play both center and 2B. This may provide a little competition for Hummel later on. Or if they decide to put Harris in Center, they may move Joe B. over to left to compete with CLee. This really gives us a number of options for the future. Plus, Chris can be the every day CF'r for the O's. I'm sure he won't mind that a bit. :smile:

fuzzy_patters
01-29-2002, 01:32 PM
:slowswing
"I'm the next Brady Anderson."

MattSharp
01-29-2002, 02:07 PM
WSI members rejoice! Singleton is gone! I love this trade, IMO Singleton would be worth a Cal Ripken autographed jersey, so the fact that they got who they got is fine with me.

My only worry is this. Its seems like the Orioles gave up something good here, so they must think highly of Singleton. In two previous cases the Sox traded a couple of OFs who sucked and they became good (sosa, cameron) Lets hope Singleton isn't that good

wulfy
01-29-2002, 02:13 PM
I think this trade is an example of KW preparing for Ray's f/a departure after this season.

http://www.theshorebirds.com/bbcards/willie_harris.jpg

Does anyone know if Harris is considered "major league" ready?

voodoochile
01-29-2002, 02:48 PM
Just my imagination or does that picture look like Ray in a different uniform? I know it isn't but look at that stance, the thin mustache, the black helmet, the gloves...

RedPinStripes
01-29-2002, 02:51 PM
KW impredded me here. This move won't hurt us at all. As most of you know, I'm excited about Rowand getting his chance. I'm glad Simmons will get some pt too.

I told ya CLR!!!!! Now he's gone. hehe :whiner:

bjmarte
01-29-2002, 02:52 PM
I'm glad Singleton is gone, and I think it does look like a very positive move. But I aint gonna start dancin till I see Wee-Wee play.

RedPinStripes
01-29-2002, 02:54 PM
Harris stole 54 bases in AA last year and hit .305. I like the way that sounds! Possible leadoff man in 2003? I'll bet he is treated just like Rameirez. He'll make the team weather he is ready or not. Hopefully he won't hit .080

RedPinStripes
01-29-2002, 02:58 PM
:rowand
"Wanna see me crash?"





:flameswing
"I'm gonna swing bunt my way all the way to .260 this year in Baltamore"

bjmarte
01-29-2002, 02:59 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes
Harris stole 54 bases in AA last year and hit .305. I like the way that sounds!
You are right, it does sound good :)

RedPinStripes
01-29-2002, 03:02 PM
Originally posted by wulfy
I think this trade is an example of KW preparing for Ray's f/a departure after this season.

http://www.theshorebirds.com/bbcards/willie_harris.jpg

Does anyone know if Harris is considered "major league" ready?

Wonder if they'll trade him at the half or just let him go for nothing?

voodoochile
01-29-2002, 03:09 PM
Wonder if they'll trade him at the half or just let him go for nothing?

I don't see Ray getting traded this year, because I think the Sox will be in the playoff hunt. You just don't trade veteran lead-off men team leaders in the middle of a playoff hunt.

Whether they get compensation for him or not will depend on what the new CBA looks like. Under the current system at least they can get some sandwich picks by offering him arbitration

czalgosz
01-29-2002, 03:09 PM
Originally posted by RedPinStripes


Wonder if they'll trade him at the half or just let him go for nothing?

The worst possible scenario is that they package him for someone like Erstad, who will be gone at the end of the season.

Harris was considered a pretty big prospect in the Orioles organization, but he was the victim of a numbers game - squeezed out at second base by a prospect that they liked better. I think they were hoping that he'd become a CF to replace Anderson, but now I guess they have their answer in CF, at least in the short run. The Orioles continue to make their team older, not better.

RedPinStripes
01-29-2002, 03:12 PM
I honestly doubt they'll trade him at the half.

OfficerKarkovice
01-29-2002, 03:17 PM
I really like this trade...Chris was a solid player and I think he will help the O's but this free's up room in a crowded OF and gives us what appears to be a good prospect. Good job KW on this one.

Iwritecode
01-29-2002, 03:23 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
Harris was considered a pretty big prospect in the Orioles organization, but he was the victim of a numbers game - squeezed out at second base by a prospect that they liked better. I think they were hoping that he'd become a CF to replace Anderson, but now I guess they have their answer in CF, at least in the short run. The Orioles continue to make their team older, not better.

I was checking out the O's board. They have Chris has the starting CF/lead-off man. I told them that he'll give them defense, but lead-off may be asking a little too much.

"Then again what the hell do I know?"

Your check is in the mail Daver. :cool:

Randar68
01-29-2002, 03:25 PM
Willie was Baltimore's #8 prospect, here is what BA said about him...



8. Willie Harris, 2b/of

Age: 23. B-T: L-R. Ht.: 5-9. Wt.: 175. Drafted: Kennesaw State (Ga.), 1999 (24th round). Signed by:Lamar North.

Background:A late-round pick who has gone from organizational player to legitimate prospect through strength of will, Harris is the nephew of former big leaguer Ernest Riles. He was born in Cairo, Ga., and became just the second big leaguer from the town–following Jackie Robinson.

Strengths:Harris’ biggest strength is his drive, which allows him to play above his tools. He has solid skills and his makeup is off the charts. He’s determined to be a major leaguer and doesn’t get discouraged by setbacks. His speed is a tick above average, allowing him to play second base or center field, and his bat is his best tool.

Weaknesses:Harris has just enough pop in his bat to get himself in trouble when he starts swinging from his heels. Because his tools aren’t overwhelming and he’s just 5-foot-9, he’ll have to prove himself every year and at every level.

The Future:The Orioles started comparing Harris to Tony Phillips last year, and he continues to fulfill those expectations. He’ll start 2002 in Triple-A and should be in Baltimore by the end of the year.

2001 Club (Class) AVG AB R H 2B 3B HR RBI BB SO SB
Bowie (AA) .305 525 83 160 27 4 9 49 46 71 54
Baltimore .125 24 3 3 1 0 0 0 0 7 0

DrCrawdad
01-29-2002, 03:29 PM
I like this trade!

Originally posted by duke of dorwood
I do hope that Simmons gets a chance. Does anyone think he can bat lead off?

I was disappointed that Simmons was sent off to Toronto last year. So I'm glad that he's back - and it didn't cost the Sox anything on Simmons return.

I don't remember where Simmons batted in the lineup with the Sox in 98 or 99. But I don't think he led off.

Defensively, Singleton is a top quality outfielder. Simmons is as good or better than Singleton in the outfield.

I don't expect Simmons to start in CF, but I didn't expect Julio to start in CF either. No doubt Simmons will get an occasional start but I expect him to be a late inning defensive replacement.

I'd like to be at the first Oriole vs. WS game this season. I'll cheer for Singleton when he jogs out to CF. Except for occasional moaning about playing time last year, Singleton seems like a good guy. Best wishes to Chris. But I'm happy with this deal.

Pete_SSAC
01-29-2002, 03:31 PM
Well, I'm a little sad to see Chris gone, seemed like a nice guy and came through a few thimes, but quite frankly, we are choked with outfielders as it is. I prefer Rowand to Singleton.

This new guy looks pretty good too, the only thing that concerns me are those Major League stats, but that's really not long enough to make a judgement. Ray's days are numbered with him and Hummel nipping at his heels.

- Pete

bjmarte
01-29-2002, 03:36 PM
Another MLB article here (http://whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/cws/news/cws_news_story.jsp?article_id=mlb_20020129_singlet ontrade_news&team_id=mlb) :

Foulke You
01-29-2002, 03:46 PM
I know I'm in the minority, but I'll miss Chris. He had a great glove and started showing improvement at the bat last year. He'll be much better for the O's in CF than crusty old Brady Anderson. That said, I'm looking forward to seeing Rowand play a lot. He really impressed me last year with his defensive hustle and his bat. Simmons should only be a backup and used sparingly. Simmons is a younger, nicer version of Darren Lewis. Good glove, good speed, and no bat. Rowand showed me last year that he can hit MLB pitching. It'll be interesting to see how he handles being the everyday CF.

Fisk Fan
01-29-2002, 03:53 PM
I'm glad to see him go, but I hope he doesn't become the next Mike Cameron.... Only time will tell!

czalgosz
01-29-2002, 03:56 PM
Everything I've read about Harris is about his drive and determination, which is something that is lacking in the Sox clubhouse, it seems.

So, who will be the Sox's new player rep. now?

nut_stock
01-29-2002, 04:00 PM
I knew this would happen as soon as I won an autographed photo of Singleton. That ill just get placed in the closet now.

cheeses_h_rice
01-29-2002, 04:03 PM
Originally posted by Fisk Fan
I'm glad to see him go, but I hope he doesn't become the next Mike Cameron.... Only time will tell!

100 quatloos says he won't.

Still, I'll remember some of his great grabs in CF...robbing someone on the Yankees (Bernie Williams, I think) of a homer way over the wall, and several great dives. His glove will be missed.

Fisk Fan
01-29-2002, 04:06 PM
What the hell is a quatloo?

keywestwillie
01-29-2002, 04:12 PM
The kid we got from the Os for Singleton has some fairly impressive minor league offense numbers.
Looks like the White Sox may be preparing for the diminishing returns that Ray Durham will be furnishing during the next year or two.

cheeses_h_rice
01-29-2002, 04:25 PM
Originally posted by Fisk Fan
What the hell is a quatloo?

It's a made-up currency for exaggerated Internet bets, used to illustrate a point.

http://www.quatloos.com

Fisk Fan
01-29-2002, 04:29 PM
It's a made-up currency for exaggerated Internet bets, used to illustrate a point.

Got it!

FarWestChicago
01-29-2002, 04:48 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
Everything I've read about Harris is about his drive and determination, which is something that is lacking in the Sox clubhouse, it seems.:manos

Not around my locker.

KempersRS
01-29-2002, 05:06 PM
Ray Ray should put up big numbers this year. Correct me if I am wrong, but I believe Ray is on the final year of his contract, so if he wants to make some bucks, he'd better put on a show. Also, a little heat for future starting job could be some motivation.

Chisox_cali
01-29-2002, 05:15 PM
I'm liking this trade, Rowand deserves the everyday spot in CF and I'm glad he will get the opprotunity. And this is something I just thought of...for the future if both Harris and Hummel turn out to be gold we could move Hummel to short because I know he played Short in the minors before switching to second and have Harris play second 'course that's if something happens to Manos just thinking outloud because if both Harris and Hummel work out than we got ourselfs another positional log jam

Daver
01-29-2002, 05:23 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali
I'm liking this trade, Rowand deserves the everyday spot in CF and I'm glad he will get the opprotunity. And this is something I just thought of...for the future if both Harris and Hummel turn out to be gold we could move Hummel to short because I know he played Short in the minors before switching to second and have Harris play second 'course that's if something happens to Manos just thinking outloud because if both Harris and Hummel work out than we got ourselfs another positional log jam

Hummell was moved to second cause he could,t play SS very well.

Chisox_cali
01-29-2002, 05:28 PM
Originally posted by daver


Hummell was moved to second cause he could,t play SS very well.

Damn I thought I read in someones Prospect Report that they said he would make a better major league SS.

AsInWreck
01-29-2002, 05:39 PM
Sounds like just the kind of guy jm and kw were hoping to turn valentin into last year/maybe that will help reduce their desire to move jose around/not suprising they'd go after a guy like that -- he sounds like a good bench player at the least, hopefully could be the answer at lead-off-someone stated it didn't sound like he had enough pop to bat leadoff- i disagree--i don't thick thats so important if you have great speed all you need to do is get on base as far as i'm concerned-seems like a good trade to me

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 06:03 PM
I like the trade but I really wanna know what this does to Tim Hummel. I really like Hummel and I think he's a better prospect than Harris. Hummel was just as good at AA and a year younger. I'm so glad to have Singleton gone, this is a step in the right direction. I see a lot of you guys are expecting this means Rowand or Simmons gets the CF job but I think it means Borchard gets the CF job. Remember the Sox aren't afraid to bring guys they like straight from AA to the majors. Dan Wright and Mark Buehlre came to the majors from AA and I think Frank Thomas did too. In my head I'm pencilling Borchard in at CF.

cheeses_h_rice
01-29-2002, 06:05 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I like the trade but I really wanna know what this does to Tim Hummel. I really like Hummel and I think he's a better prospect than Harris. Hummel was just as good at AA and a year younger. I'm so glad to have Singleton gone, this is a step in the right direction. I see a lot of you guys are expecting this means Rowand or Simmons gets the CF job but I think it means Borchard gets the CF job. Remember the Sox aren't afraid to bring guys they like straight from AA to the majors. Dan Wright and Mark Buehlre came to the majors from AA and I think Frank Thomas did too. In my head I'm pencilling Borchard in at CF.

I think it gives the Sox more options all around.

Also, anyone think this could lead to Rowand going to LF, either Simmons/Borchard/Harris to CF, and C. Lee being dealt?

Chisox_cali
01-29-2002, 06:08 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice


I think it gives the Sox more options all around.

Also, anyone think this could lead to Rowand going to LF, either Simmons/Borchard/Harris to CF, and C. Lee being dealt?

If CLEE is gonna be dealt and we call up LTP...put Joe in Right Rowand in Center and Maggs in Left

delben91
01-29-2002, 06:09 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice

Still, I'll remember some of his great grabs in CF...robbing someone on the Yankees (Bernie Williams, I think) of a homer way over the wall, and several great dives. His glove will be missed.

Yeah, it will to a point, but I remember rowand smashing into a few fences to take away some doubles. His glove may not be naturally as good, but he makes up for at least part of that with effort.

My opinion...here's to you KW, nice move :gulp:

Now, if only we can find a taker for royce......

Randar68
01-29-2002, 06:15 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
I like the trade but I really wanna know what this does to Tim Hummel. I really like Hummel and I think he's a better prospect than Harris. Hummel was just as good at AA and a year younger. I'm so glad to have Singleton gone, this is a step in the right direction. I see a lot of you guys are expecting this means Rowand or Simmons gets the CF job but I think it means Borchard gets the CF job. Remember the Sox aren't afraid to bring guys they like straight from AA to the majors. Dan Wright and Mark Buehlre came to the majors from AA and I think Frank Thomas did too. In my head I'm pencilling Borchard in at CF.

Kermit, I'm with you 100% about Borchard. If has a spring comparable to whoever they are planning on playing in the OF, then Borchard gets the job.

Here is the scenario I see falling out of this:

The 2003 Lineup KW was envisioning in making this deal is:

1: Harris CF
2: Hummel 2B
3: Frank DH/1B
4: Maggs LF
5: Borchard RF
6: Konerko LF
7: Valentin SS
8: Crede 3B
9: Olivo/MJ/Evans C


Pretty damn solid if you ask me and all these guys pan out...IF!

CerberusWG
01-29-2002, 06:15 PM
Finally, Slow-Swing is gone. Sure he hits 300, but his OBP is retchid. Around .333 this year which is too low for a guy of his speed.

Sounds like this prospect should create a plethora of options for the team.

KempersRS
01-29-2002, 06:18 PM
Originally posted by Randar68


Kermit, I'm with you 100% about Borchard. If has a spring comparable to whoever they are planning on playing in the OF, then Borchard gets the job.

Here is the scenario I see falling out of this:

The 2003 Lineup KW was envisioning in making this deal is:

1: Harris CF
2: Hummel 2B
3: Frank DH/1B
4: Maggs LF
5: Borchard RF
6: Konerko LF
7: Valentin SS
8: Crede 3B
9: Olivo/MJ/Evans C


Pretty damn solid if you ask me and all these guys pan out...IF!

I assume you meant 1B/DH for Konerko, but I get the point. By putting this lineup out there, you say we trade Lee? I would assume Ray would be dealt or not signed by your theory as well. If we could deal both Ray and Lee, we could snag a very solid catcher or 3rd baseman (I think Crede is a bust.)

JoeBatters
01-29-2002, 06:25 PM
What beeeeeutiful News .... I'm a happy SOX fan , yup . As a Rowand fan this is a great day ! For singleton fans that i've gone round and round with on this board , take a lude and drink a beer you'll see that it was a smart move in the end ........

AsInWreck
01-29-2002, 06:27 PM
Originally posted by Fisk Fan
I'm glad to see him go, but I hope he doesn't become the next Mike Cameron.... Only time will tell!

There is no way! He has nowhere near the natural tools that cameron or sosa displayed-besides singleton is older than cameron to begin w/-if was going to he already would have/i wouldn't be suprised if he has a season like '99 in the year or 2 though

Randar68
01-29-2002, 06:31 PM
Originally posted by KempersRS


I assume you meant 1B/DH for Konerko, but I get the point. By putting this lineup out there, you say we trade Lee? I would assume Ray would be dealt or not signed by your theory as well. If we could deal both Ray and Lee, we could snag a very solid catcher or 3rd baseman (I think Crede is a bust.)

There is a reason why even 3B with a .250 average find ways to stick around if they have GG quality defense. Even in a bad year, I think Crede could put up .275-20-75.....with that defense, those are absolutely solid #'s...

He hasn't failed at any level he's been at when healthy, what makes people think Crede will fail but Rowand will succeed?

Trading Ray this year if Hummel is tearing the cover off the ball may be smart. If not, we just lose him, so that's a pretty poor option. Lee? I don't know. I think he still has the potential to be one of the best hitters in the game but his defense is below average, and he's losing that time in which I would expect him to blossom...

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 06:39 PM
Originally posted by Randar68

Trading Ray this year if Hummel is tearing the cover off the ball may be smart. If not, we just lose him, so that's a pretty poor option. Lee? I don't know. I think he still has the potential to be one of the best hitters in the game but his defense is below average, and he's losing that time in which I would expect him to blossom...

Well if the CBA stays the same or similar we'd get a first round draft pick for Durham which would be nice and possibly better than what prospect(s) we could get.

czalgosz
01-29-2002, 06:43 PM
Originally posted by Randar68


There is a reason why even 3B with a .250 average find ways to stick around if they have GG quality defense. Even in a bad year, I think Crede could put up .275-20-75.....with that defense, those are absolutely solid #'s...

He hasn't failed at any level he's been at when healthy, what makes people think Crede will fail but Rowand will succeed?



I don't think either one will succeed... I hadn't heard that Crede is a gold-glove caliber 3b. Is that true?

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 06:46 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


I don't think either one will succeed... I hadn't heard that Crede is a gold-glove caliber 3b. Is that true?

That's about what I've heard.

KempersRS
01-29-2002, 06:48 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


I don't think either one will succeed... I hadn't heard that Crede is a gold-glove caliber 3b. Is that true?

Well, as most of the posters know, my biggest gripe was with Manuel last season for not playing Crede and Rowand. He has months to play them and he just never did it. Now that Singleton and Perry are gone, those games seem like an ever bigger waste. This season could have a bit clearer of an outlook if Manuel would have learned a little about Rowand and Crede on the field.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:09 PM
Wow a little late jumping into this thread....but I see it as a positive move....Singleton wasn't the answer and was gone next year....Willie gives you options and pretty good value which is more than I hoped for.....Another note is that Hummel can probably play 3B, so you have options up the ying-yang should anyone of our guys fail to reach their potential....Rowand will make a good 4th OF next year is my guess, and if I recall he is still aways from FA so he can be productive in that role relatively cheaply

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:10 PM
ESPN's Hot Stove Take
Willie Harris, 2B/CF: Excellent work ethic. Runs well, swiped 54 in Double-A last year while hitting .305. Decent with the glove, but will need to take advantage of a brief window before Fontenot is ready.


When he was still slated to be an O

DrCrawdad
01-29-2002, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by Huisj
harrison? or was it hairston, as in jerry jr.? if it's him, he still hasn't really hit well in two or three opportunities in the big. hmmm.

I like the Singleton for Harris, but Singleton for Jerry Hairston Jr. would have been cool with me.

Jerry Hairston Jr. is an excellent defensive 2nd baseman. Jerry's BA was low last year .233 but his OBP was .305 - Singleton's was .331 while hitting .298.

I wish the Sox had drafted Jerry's younger brother - Justin - who was drafted by the D-Backs.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


Well if the CBA stays the same or similar we'd get a first round draft pick for Durham which would be nice and possibly better than what prospect(s) we could get.


Exactly what I was thinking Kermit.....Also Ray is making like 5.5 this year and Singleton was slated to get 1.4 or so....thats almost 7 million off the JR Cap next year.....That can be used in some many ways and Simmons or Rowand as 4th OF costs you next to nothing and Super Joe gets his money in Double A or at Cominsky so you are looking at options from all sorts of standpoints

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:14 PM
As much as I like that bash Kenny thread, I really like what he did here. Instead of letting Singleton walk he realized there was some interest and capitalized. Harris was too old last year to be a great prospect but he's solid.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:14 PM
Another thought(this time from a pessimistic view)...if the Sox fade this year...how much is Ray worth in a trade? Especially assuming he is playing like its a contract year? Eric Young just signed a nice deal and Ray is another level over EY, so its looks like getting a 1st for him as a FA compensation is the worst case scenario.........Lee and Ray will have some value out there if it coms to that

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:17 PM
Originally posted by RichH55
Another thought(this time from a pessimistic view)...if the Sox fade this year...how much is Ray worth in a trade? Especially assuming he is playing like its a contract year? Eric Young just signed a nice deal and Ray is another level over EY, so its looks like getting a 1st for him as a FA compensation is the worst case scenario.........Lee and Ray will have some value out there if it coms to that

I think Lee still isn't a guy to trade, even if we fade.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:18 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog
As much as I like that bash Kenny thread, I really like what he did here. Instead of letting Singleton walk he realized there was some interest and capitalized. Harris was too old last year to be a great prospect but he's solid.
Kenny seems to do better in the smaller deals(and over time)...the go for the juggular deals is where he is questionable...arguablly his best deal was a small one with Eyre for Glover

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:23 PM
Originally posted by RichH55

Kenny seems to do better in the smaller deals(and over time)...the go for the juggular deals is where he is questionable...arguablly his best deal was a small one with Eyre for Glover

I wouldn't even give him that much credit after Jeff Abbott for Julio.

hold2dibber
01-29-2002, 07:24 PM
Originally posted by RichH55

Kenny seems to do better in the smaller deals(and over time)...the go for the juggular deals is where he is questionable...arguablly his best deal was a small one with Eyre for Glover

I agree - I think Bradford for Olivo will turn out to be a real good one as well (do I have that right?)

Daver
01-29-2002, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber


I agree - I think Bradford for Olivo will turn out to be a real good one as well (do I have that right?)

Yes you do.

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:34 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber


I agree - I think Bradford for Olivo will turn out to be a real good one as well (do I have that right?)

hmmmmm, I do like that one.

AsInWreck
01-29-2002, 07:48 PM
Originally posted by hold2dibber


I agree - I think Bradford for Olivo will turn out to be a real good one as well (do I have that right?)

Well,that trade kind of hurt last year, what with the bullpen getting torched regularly, the sox could have used a decent middle man

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:52 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck


Well,that trade kind of hurt last year, what with the bullpen getting torched regularly, the sox could have used a decent middle man

Bradford really isn't a middle man though, he's a setup guy. I think Josh Fogg could have been called up and used as an effective middleman.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:52 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck


Well,that trade kind of hurt last year, what with the bullpen getting torched regularly, the sox could have used a decent middle man Have you seen the catching situation here? And when we dealt Bradford we have a myriad of pitchers for the bullpen...counting on the whole staff to get hurt isnt something I expect the GM to plan heartily for...plus how many innings did Bradford have? 30+? Hardly Mariano Riveria here

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 07:54 PM
Originally posted by RichH55
Have you seen the catching situation here? And when we dealt Bradford we have a myriad of pitchers for the bullpen...counting on the whole staff to get hurt isnt something I expect the GM to plan heartily for...plus how many innings did Bradford have? 30+? Hardly Mariano Riveria here

Yeah and Olivo could be our starting catcher next year. He's certainly more talented than the guys doing the job right now.

RichH55
01-29-2002, 07:57 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


Yeah and Olivo could be our starting catcher next year. He's certainly more talented than the guys doing the job right now.
Exactly my point....I like the deal...no use crying over Bradford

Vsahajpal
01-29-2002, 08:08 PM
T1 report on Willie Harris:

Harris was a late draft (24th round) in 1999, and the Orioles have to be pleasantly surprised with his development. He received a September promotion and played some second base with the big club at the end.

Harris’s best tool is his speed. He stole 54 bases last year and is a weapon on the basepaths. That alone will make him useful, but Harris is also showing a pesky bat from the left side. He had his best season yet for Double-A Bowie, hitting .305-9-49 in 525 at-bats. It’s not out of the question for him to eventually repeat those kinds of numbers in the big leagues and ideally, he will become a top-of-the-order guy.

Harris has the agility, hands, and actions to be a solid defensive second baseman, as well as the speed and arm to play in the outfield. The Orioles have played him in both spots and the versatility only helps his odds of sticking with the big club.

The Orioles have candidates, but no clear favorite for the major league second base job with Brian Roberts and Jerry Hairston also in the big leagues. Harris just might leapfrog both of them and start on opening day. At worst, he’s a solid utility player who can play for long stretches.

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 08:17 PM
Originally posted by Vsahajpal
T1 report on Willie Harris:

Harris was a late draft (24th round) in 1999, and the Orioles have to be pleasantly surprised with his development. He received a September promotion and played some second base with the big club at the end.

Harris’s best tool is his speed. He stole 54 bases last year and is a weapon on the basepaths. That alone will make him useful, but Harris is also showing a pesky bat from the left side. He had his best season yet for Double-A Bowie, hitting .305-9-49 in 525 at-bats. It’s not out of the question for him to eventually repeat those kinds of numbers in the big leagues and ideally, he will become a top-of-the-order guy.

Harris has the agility, hands, and actions to be a solid defensive second baseman, as well as the speed and arm to play in the outfield. The Orioles have played him in both spots and the versatility only helps his odds of sticking with the big club.

The Orioles have candidates, but no clear favorite for the major league second base job with Brian Roberts and Jerry Hairston also in the big leagues. Harris just might leapfrog both of them and start on opening day. At worst, he’s a solid utility player who can play for long stretches.

Who're these T1 guys you're always giving us reports from Vic?

CLR01
01-29-2002, 09:17 PM
Originally posted by cheeses_h_rice


100 quatloos says he won't.

Still, I'll remember some of his great grabs in CF...robbing someone on the Yankees (Bernie Williams, I think) of a homer way over the wall, and several great dives. His glove will be missed.


It was Paul O'neil. he ended up hitting one to almost the exact same place but a little deeper. I remember it well, as i was sitting on the glass in the stadium club watching, excuse me im getting alittle choked up. :whiner:

kermittheefrog
01-29-2002, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by CLR01



It was Paul O'neil. he ended up hitting one to almost the exact same place but a little deeper. I remember it well, as i was sitting on the glass in the stadium club watching, excuse me im getting alittle choked up. :whiner:

Damn I thought Paul O'Neil was too old to hit balls that far by now.

CLR01
01-29-2002, 09:38 PM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


Damn I thought Paul O'Neil was too old to hit balls that far by now.


Well it was in '99, so he was a little younger.

GASHWOUND
01-29-2002, 10:15 PM
Originally posted by CLR01



It was Paul O'neil. he ended up hitting one to almost the exact same place but a little deeper. I remember it well, as i was sitting on the glass in the stadium club watching, excuse me im getting alittle choked up. :whiner:

So I should expect you to have an Orioles sig in the coming week? :smile:

Look how a simple Singleton trade cause so much conversation, I wonder what would happen if Big Frank or Lee was traded. Mayhem would occur. I liked Singleton as a 4th outfielder, his D was excellent and had a decent bat. Oh well, at least we got something decent for him from what i read.

CLR01
01-30-2002, 01:16 AM
Originally posted by GASHWOUND


So I should expect you to have an Orioles sig in the coming week? :smile:

Look how a simple Singleton trade cause so much conversation, I wonder what would happen if Big Frank or Lee was traded. Mayhem would occur. I liked Singleton as a 4th outfielder, his D was excellent and had a decent bat. Oh well, at least we got something decent for him from what i read.


I already have the o's sig. This trade got so much attention because deep down everyone feels te same way about singleton as i do, they just dont want to admit it. IF Rowand was traded tomorrow the thread wouldnt even reach double digits.

FarWestChicago
01-30-2002, 01:18 AM
Originally posted by CLR01



I already have the o's sig. This trade got so much attention because deep down everyone feels te same way about singleton as i do, they just dont want to admit it. IF Rowand was traded tomorrow the thread wouldnt even reach double digits. If it's any consolation, this thread blasted into the all time top ten for views and replies in a matter of hours. Very impressive.

bc2k
01-30-2002, 01:30 AM
Nice job kw. One down, two to go. Clayton and durham are next.

Vsahajpal
01-30-2002, 01:39 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


Who're these T1 guys you're always giving us reports from Vic?

http://www.teamonebaseball.com

:gulp:

CLR01
01-30-2002, 01:42 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
Nice job kw. One down, two to go. Clayton and durham are next.

C.Lee, Rowand, Clayton, and Manos. Theres a solid left side.


"This trade is going to be a building block for our quest for a World Series ring. Mark your calendar sox fans, 2019 will be the year of the White Sox, and you will all look back at this trade as the key."


:KW:reinsy

Vsahajpal
01-30-2002, 01:44 AM
You like Singleton that much, CLR?

CLR01
01-30-2002, 01:53 AM
Whos our new player rep. for the CBA?

kermittheefrog
01-30-2002, 02:16 AM
Originally posted by CLR01
Whos our new player rep. for the CBA?

I think it's something the Sox players will have to decide during spring or maybe by a postal ballot or something. And CLR, I love the new sig.

CLR01
01-30-2002, 02:29 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


I think it's something the Sox players will have to decide during spring or maybe by a postal ballot or something. And CLR, I love the new sig.



Perhaps i will ask JM to make me a different one.

dugwood31
01-30-2002, 03:24 AM
I can see the logic of the trade, but I submit this: our outfield defense, with Lee and Maggs at the corners, necessitates a speedy centerfielder. I hope I'm wrong, but with Rowand in center this could be the worst defensive outfield we've seen in a long, long time. That's not good for a young pitching staff.

RedPinStripes
01-30-2002, 03:32 AM
Originally posted by bc2k
Nice job kw. One down, two to go. Clayton and durham are next.

Got that right.

RedPinStripes
01-30-2002, 03:35 AM
Originally posted by dugwood31
I can see the logic of the trade, but I submit this: our outfield defense, with Lee and Maggs at the corners, necessitates a speedy centerfielder. I hope I'm wrong, but with Rowand in center this could be the worst defensive outfield we've seen in a long, long time. That's not good for a young pitching staff.

Rowand is not bad in cf at all. What did he do so wrong last year? He's only going to get better. The only negative I saw was him getting a bad reading off the bat and he had to tear ass to catch up to it. He just started playing CF last year. I'm sure Singleton was not a Natural at judging his first year in CF.

fuzzy_patters
01-30-2002, 02:33 PM
Weaknesses:Harris has just enough pop in his bat to get himself in trouble when he starts swinging from his heels.

:ray
"Hey, sounds like me."

Jerry_Manuel
01-30-2002, 05:22 PM
Originally posted by CLR01
Perhaps i will ask JM to make me a different one.

Hello.

dugwood31
01-30-2002, 05:50 PM
Rowand...What did he do so wrong last year?
I like Rowand, but he's not going to hunt down as many balls as Singleton. He's not as fast and doesn't get the same jumps. Don't you see this as a defensive downgrade, even if just for one year?

AsInWreck
01-30-2002, 06:59 PM
Originally posted by CLR01
Whos our new player rep. for the CBA?

I read in the AZ republic today that Josh Paul was
among a handful of player reps present at the collective bargaining meeting w/ owners in scottsdale on Tuesday.

Jerry_Manuel
01-30-2002, 07:02 PM
Originally posted by AsInWreck
I read in the AZ republic today that Josh Paul was
among a handful of player reps present at the collective bargaining meeting w/ owners in scottsdale on Tuesday.

:versatile
I'm the man.

Paulwny
01-30-2002, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


:versatile
I'm the man.

After st and he's back in AAA the sox will be electing a new rep.

Jerry_Manuel
01-30-2002, 07:16 PM
Originally posted by Paulwny
After st and he's back in AAA the sox will be electing a new rep.

Unless they piss on MJ again. I don't know what that guy did, but either Williams or Manuel hates him.

Paulwny
01-30-2002, 07:20 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


Unless they piss on MJ again. I don't know what that guy did, but either Williams or Manuel hates him.

Yea, somehow MJ is in the Lowe dog house.

FarWestChicago
01-30-2002, 07:25 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


Unless they piss on MJ again. I don't know what that guy did, but either Williams or Manuel hates him. :sean

I know the feeling.

Jerry_Manuel
01-30-2002, 07:28 PM
Originally posted by FarWestChicago
(Sean Lowe)
I know the feeling.

There's another interesting case.

I think Williams disliked Lowe, and Manuel dislikes MJ.

PaleHoseGeorge
01-30-2002, 07:41 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


There's another interesting case.

I think Williams disliked Lowe, and Manuel dislikes MJ.

And naturally, neither is justified. Me thinks our braintrust is missing some brain power.

:reinsy
"They're loyal and they work cheap--my two biggest hiring criteria."

mike squires
01-30-2002, 09:43 PM
hopefully this harris guy works out. as solid as the sox are offensivly there are alot of question marks and we seem to be cluttered in the outlfield. i realize they are young but where are we going to put them all? let's see...we got lee, rowand, borchard, harris, simmons and of course ordonez. i hate the idea of platooning guys every other day. it would be nice to get somebody in there consistent and reliable...then you got the valentin/clayton fiasco...if crede has a good spring and is ready to come up, what do you do? valentin is too good to play 3 or 4 times a week. and i really think clayton can have a good year. o.k maybe i'm reaching. they will also probably platoon paul and johnson again, again, i'd rather depend on one guy, oh wait, we have alomar too?! there has to be another trade in the works. i hate to be so pessimistic but we still have alot of questions. it should be an interesting spring. i can't wait either way. michael penny

guillen4life13
01-31-2002, 07:16 PM
This trade is going to be vital. If Harris busts, we pretty much have given up a top notch defensive, and better than average offensive CF.

kermittheefrog
01-31-2002, 07:19 PM
Originally posted by guillen4life13
This trade is going to be vital. If Harris busts, we pretty much have given up a top notch defensive, and better than average offensive CF.

HA! I already made a post about Singleton being mediocre, replacable talent but really if Singleton is above average offensively in center then why did he have so much trouble keeping his job? He has no power and never walks, guys with hollow .300 averages don't go anywhere, Mike Caruso was one of these types. Singleton sucks at the plate and there are guys out there just like him who can be had for less that his new arbittration salary.

czalgosz
01-31-2002, 07:59 PM
Hey, Ruben Rivera is looking for work... and we already have Brian Simmons and Julio Ramirez if we ever need a good field, no-hit outfielder.

RichH55
02-01-2002, 03:01 AM
Originally posted by kermittheefrog


HA! I already made a post about Singleton being mediocre, replacable talent but really if Singleton is above average offensively in center then why did he have so much trouble keeping his job? He has no power and never walks, guys with hollow .300 averages don't go anywhere, Mike Caruso was one of these types. Singleton sucks at the plate and there are guys out there just like him who can be had for less that his new arbittration salary.


:slowswing
Proud member of the Rey Sanchez .300 hitters!

RichH55
02-01-2002, 03:07 AM
Originally posted by guillen4life13
This trade is going to be vital. If Harris busts, we pretty much have given up a top notch defensive, and better than average offensive CF.


Do explain how Singleton is not only average, but better than average offensively? .300 Hitter: yes Good Walk Ratio:No Power Numbers: NO Speed: Yes Natural Instinct to Steal Bases:Doesnt seem to have it......I also remember him having issues for awhile laying down the bunt(could do it in practice, but had issues in the game, for awhile at the least) As far as good defensively: Yes, but so are Brian Simmons and a guy like Mckay Christensen who was had at the low low price of Wade Parrish....Unless you are expected Chris to both learn all sorts of new facets to his game and get the chance to display this ephiphony(sic) instead of having Rowand out there, than you have a case.....I dont think you do........even if Harris busts I wont hold this against KW...this is the kind of deal you make

AsInWreck
02-01-2002, 03:05 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
Hey, Ruben Rivera is looking for work... and we already have Brian Simmons and Julio Ramirez if we ever need a good field, no-hit outfielder.

You're going a little far there comparing Ramirez to Singleton. singleton is no mantle, that's for sure, but he is at least a bona fide major leaguer, you can;t say the same for ramirez or maybe even simmons.

Spiff
02-01-2002, 03:29 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz
Hey, Ruben Rivera is looking for work... and we already have Brian Simmons and Julio Ramirez if we ever need a good field, no-hit outfielder.

Singleton hit .298 last year, second highest on the team.

KempersRS
02-01-2002, 03:39 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Singleton hit .298 last year, second highest on the team.

4th highest on the team if you want to include players who didn't have enough ABs to qualify, and Singleton is one of those guys without enough ABs.

czalgosz
02-01-2002, 03:50 PM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00


Singleton hit .298 last year, second highest on the team.

Batting average is a terrible indication of how good of a hitter you are. Singleton's OPS was only .762, wedged right in between Tony Graffanino (.777) and Josh Paul (.737).

When you're an outfielder who's hitting like a utility infielder or a backup catcher, you've got problems.

Spiff
02-01-2002, 08:15 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


Batting average is a terrible indication of how good of a hitter you are. Singleton's OPS was only .762, wedged right in between Tony Graffanino (.777) and Josh Paul (.737).

When you're an outfielder who's hitting like a utility infielder or a backup catcher, you've got problems.

Oh yeah well Ruben Rivera signed with the Yankees so hmpf.