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View Full Version : Ortiz/Ramirez v. Thome/Konerko


balke
04-18-2006, 04:37 PM
Taking into account the defensive ability as well, who is the sickest combo in baseball out of these? Manny is a better hitter than all of them, granted. I think I'd rather have Thome than Ortiz if he's going to hit like this all season though.

I'd rather have Manny's bat on the team than Paulie, but Paulie's glove makes him perhaps more valuable. What do you think?

MUsoxfan
04-18-2006, 04:47 PM
That's a really tough question. They're both really good combos. Based on numbers alone, I'll have to go with the two guys out in Boston. Paulie and Jim are really close though, especially if they keep it up

Fenway
04-18-2006, 04:58 PM
That's a really tough question. They're both really good combos. Based on numbers alone, I'll have to go with the two guys out in Boston. Paulie and Jim are really close though, especially if they keep it up

The Manny-Papi show is entering year 4. Not knocking the White Sox combo but it's been 2 1/2 weeks.

Ortiz has already found his groove

batmanZoSo
04-18-2006, 05:00 PM
Konerko's just not in the same league as the other three. He's very close, but I don't see him carrying a .420 on-base or driving in 140 in his career any time. I go with the Boston guys. But we have a better team, so I don't care. :cool:

SouthSideHitman
04-18-2006, 05:00 PM
Given career histories, ya gotta take Papi and Manny. I would argue that Ortiz is the second best hitter in the game (after Pujols).

QCIASOXFAN
04-18-2006, 05:04 PM
Why is Manny hitting .239 with 3 rbis and zero homeruns? Oh ya because hes on my fantasy team this year!

CanBuehrleWait
04-18-2006, 05:07 PM
Why is Manny hitting .239 with 3 rbis and zero homeruns? Oh ya because hes on my fantasy team this year!
Oh So its your fault he's dragging my team into the drink :whiner::whiner:

:smile:

Oh I voted Paulie/Thome cause I'm a homer. That and Manny makes Carlos Lee look like Willie Mays with the glove work.

gbergman
04-18-2006, 05:11 PM
they are very good. this should have been done mid season, but based on the last couple years stats manny and david are the best 3-4 combo out there

PAPChiSox729
04-18-2006, 05:14 PM
Manny and Ortiz have been amazing for a few years now; Konerko and Thome have only been in the same lineup for 3 weeks. They have a lot of catching up to do... That said, they still can be gosh darn good!

oeo
04-18-2006, 05:16 PM
Manny/Ortiz is definately better, but I'll take the next best thing. I'm more happy with Konerko/Thome's presence on the field as well as the clubhouse though (see Manny). Actually I'm quite happy with our duo, they're a close second behind Manny/Ortiz.

santo=dorf
04-18-2006, 10:26 PM
The Manny-Papi show is entering year 4. Not knocking the White Sox combo but it's been 2 1/2 weeks.

Ortiz has already found his groove

...and he's still not as good as Thome. Ortiz's career high OBP doesn't crack .400 whereas Thome's career OBP is .409.

Manny is much better than Konerko hitting wise, but if we're including defense, I say it's a push.

Palehose13
04-18-2006, 10:38 PM
Kong? ick...

Anyway, I voted for the Ortiz/Manny because I looked at it from purely a hitting standpoint...statistically they are the best 3-4 out there. However, if you throw in defense and other intangibles, I would rather have Thome/Konerko on my team.

JohnBasedowYoda
04-18-2006, 10:46 PM
thome = Thor, not kong.

I'd vote on this if it weren't for that glaring mistake:cool:

Palehose13
04-18-2006, 10:53 PM
thome = Thor, not kong.

I'd vote on this if it weren't for that glaring mistake:cool:

He is calling Konerko Kong, not Thome.

JohnBasedowYoda
04-18-2006, 10:58 PM
Another classic tale of me not reading what I'm responding to. This happens all the time, usually everyone looks the other way.
Thanks Palehose13:redneck

Palehose13
04-18-2006, 10:59 PM
Another classic tale of me not reading what I'm responding to. This happens all the time, usually everyone looks the other way.
Thanks Palehose13

LOL...eh, whatever I can do to help. Besides, I think there are a few people on here that call Konerko "Kong" and it annoys the **** out of me.

*EDIT: ahhhhh...fixed it.

JohnBasedowYoda
04-18-2006, 11:03 PM
LOL...eh, whatever I can do to help. Besides, I think there are a few people on here that call Konerko "Kong" and it annoys the **** out of me.

*EDIT: ahhhhh...fixed it.


My mom admitted to hating the "Paulie Paulie" chant. I was shocked. :o:

balke
04-18-2006, 11:05 PM
I never heard of Kong until I got on this website, I think the Tag for his picture is even :Kong or was for some time. I might be wrong. I wouldn't say "Ick" to it though. I don't use the nickname in real life. So suck it up and vote internet kids.

peeonwrigley
04-18-2006, 11:10 PM
I'm going with the boys in Boston. They've got a track record and a ring together. Paulie and Thome are just getting started. Ortiz and Thome are a wash, IMO, and Manny is a better hitter than Paulie.

The major plus that goes to PK and Thome is they're good clubhouse guys. Manny might not be a bad guy, but he is certainly a distraction.

PKalltheway
04-18-2006, 11:12 PM
My Signature says it all:

illinisox1
04-18-2006, 11:27 PM
not even close, gotta be Manny and Papi.....but good to see that we're stickin up for our own:gulp:

fquaye149
04-19-2006, 02:06 AM
I'm so excited at our 3/4 spot but until Konerko establishes himself as a game changing hitter I don't know that I can vote him and Thome over the best 3/4 in the game.

Like someone said: Konerko can't touch the other three. I don't know that that will always be the case, but the way it looks now, Konerko is a very very good power hitter whereas the other three are bonafide superstars (among the best hitters in the game). Then when you consider the uncertainty that Thome will play a full season this year (I think he will, but coming off an injury...)...well I'm sorry, but if you would HONESTLY rather have Thome/Konerko than Manny/Ortiz, I'm just a little skeptical about how much your hometown bias is skewing your vision of reality

Bobbo35
04-19-2006, 06:50 AM
Konerko's just not in the same league as the other three. He's very close, but I don't see him carrying a .420 on-base or driving in 140 in his career any time. I go with the Boston guys. But we have a better team, so I don't care. :cool:

Ya, all I care about is the team aspect. Thome and Konerko are a great combo that when hot are going to produce a lot of runs and make opposing pitchers crazy.

RSN33
04-19-2006, 07:18 AM
Taking into account the defensive ability as well, who is the sickest combo in baseball out of these? Manny is a better hitter than all of them, granted. I think I'd rather have Thome than Ortiz if he's going to hit like this all season though.

I'd rather have Manny's bat on the team than Paulie, but Paulie's glove makes him perhaps more valuable. What do you think?

So the poll title is "Best hitting combo in baseball" and then you say "taking defensive ability as well"??? Was that just to get more votes for the home side?
:rolleyes:

Fenway said it best; Manny/Ortiz have done this now for 4 years - Konerko Thome have had a scorching two weeks as being a 'combo'. Let it go for a bit.

samram
04-19-2006, 08:45 AM
It's Manny/Papi. Honestly, Konerko/Thome is arguably third or fourth since (I hate saying this) Arod/Sheffield is also pretty nasty. Pujols and Rolen are also really strong. The most important thing is the Konerko and Thome play on a better team than any of those other guys.:cool:

miker
04-19-2006, 10:42 AM
I'm leaning toward Thome/Konerko because:

I'm a White Sox fan, and...
Ramirez and Ortiz are great hitters, but they're both a little loopy. Is there a place for that? Maybe, but I'm more comfortable with Thome/Konerko's attitude and mental makeup.
Defensively, I also have to give the edge to Thome/Konerko as well, and I know what you are saying: "You're an idiot, Thome is a DH". Well, when Jim was playing 1B regularly he was way better than Ortiz and if he had to step in for Konerko, I wouldn't panic. On a bad night, Ramirez can let in as many runs as he drives in. Ortiz is a DH specifically to keep him out of the field.

Railsplitter
04-19-2006, 02:05 PM
Paulie and JT, of course.

fquaye149
04-19-2006, 07:43 PM
On a bad night, Ramirez can let in as many runs as he drives in. Ortiz is a DH specifically to keep him out of the field.

Or he can be among league leaders in outfield assists. Don't act like all Ramirez ever does is let the ball drop in front of him. He's not a GREAT outfielder, perhaps not even a good one, and yes most of his outfield assists come from playing in Fenway, but it's also not particularly easy to play outfield in Fenway and he does it with an amount of confidence that many other outfielders wouldn't be able to muster.

Chisox003
04-19-2006, 07:54 PM
Wow, 73 votes for PK and Thome? :?:

Look, they're an excellent combo, top 5 in baseball, but noone compares to Manny and Papi. That's going to go down as one of the best 3-4 combo in history when it's all said and done.

It's Ortiz and Manny, no amount of White Sox koolaid could change that

Edit: Didn't take into account defense, but it's still Manny and Ortiz.

santo=dorf
04-19-2006, 07:55 PM
Or he can be among league leaders in outfield assists.
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

How many of those assists are due to him throwing out the runner at second because the hitter misjudged a hit off that stupid giant wall? How many of his assists were due to him throwing out a runner trying to stretch a single into a double because Manny got his cleats caught in the ground and the ball fell in front of him? I have to say I have never seen a LF cutoff a CF's throw until Manny started patrolling Fenway.


In case some of you didn't know already, Thome>>>Ortiz.

buehrle4cy05
04-19-2006, 07:55 PM
Damn, that's tough. I went with Konerko/Thome just because Konerko's defense is better than Manny's. All four of them are extremely slow and they all can come up with big hits in big spots (see Ortiz in 2004 ALCS and Konerko in 2005 ALCS and World Series). I think that most of those RBI's garnered by Ortiz and Ramirez in previous years were the product of having Johnny Damon's .300+ average ahead of them, but now without that, their stats will probably dip.

Look at the votes right now...73 for Ortiz/Ramirez, 73 for Thome/Konerko. Basically, you can't go wrong.

fquaye149
04-19-2006, 08:25 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

How many of those assists are due to him throwing out the runner at second because the hitter misjudged a hit off that stupid giant wall? How many of his assists were due to him throwing out a runner trying to stretch a single into a double because Manny got his cleats caught in the ground and the ball fell in front of him? I have to say I have never seen a LF cutoff a CF's throw until Manny started patrolling Fenway.


In case some of you didn't know already, Thome>>>Ortiz.

You could try reading my post. That would be a start. All I was trying to say is to pretend like Manny COSTS as many runs as he creates would be a ridiculous claim even if he DIDN'T contribute with his glove (i.e. creating outs with outfield assists). The fact is is that he is NOT a great outfielder. Like a certain other leftfielder (let's not beat around the bush: Carlos Lee) Manny is a great hitter who has his lapses in the field. But to act like he's costing his team games with the glove is a little much.

champagne030
04-19-2006, 08:55 PM
Taking into account the defensive ability as well, who is the sickest combo in baseball out of these? Manny is a better hitter than all of them, granted. I think I'd rather have Thome than Ortiz if he's going to hit like this all season though.

I'd rather have Manny's bat on the team than Paulie, but Paulie's glove makes him perhaps more valuable. What do you think?

Manny and Fat Papi are a better combo with the bat, but this is a really tough question and depends what team they play for and where they're playing.

Fat Papi cannot even bend over to grab a ground ball and Manny makes Dunn look like a gold glover in left. The Sox are better with the Pods, PK and Thome combo than they would be with Pods, Fat Papi and Manny.

DaleJRFan
04-20-2006, 10:46 AM
http://sportsmed.starwave.com/i/magazine/new/chris_berman.jpg

"Everyone knows about Big Papi and Manny here in Boston... but over there in Chicago, they have their own 40 home run club..."

TaylorStSox
04-20-2006, 04:48 PM
As much as I love our 3/4, it's not even close, seriously.

Chicago
04-20-2006, 07:42 PM
Ramirez/Konerko: KONERKO
6 more AB -
9 more R +
7 more H +
4 more 2B +
5 more HR +
10 more RBI +
26 more TB +
5 less walks -
11 less SO +
.018 more OBP +
.427 more SLG +
.096 more AVG +

KONERKO +10 / RAMIREZ +2

Ortiz/Thome:THOME
12 less AB +
7 more R +
3 less H -
2 less 2B -
1 more HR +
2 more RBI +
2 less TB -
7 more BB +
5 less SO +
.112 more OBP +
.148 more SLG +
.017 more AVG +

THOME +9 / ORTIZ +3

We can not vote based on the past since the Paulie/Thome combo is new, so based on this year (early as it is)... My vote... hands down... 14/25