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View Full Version : Oklahoma Lt. Gov. talks with Marlins officials


dcb56
02-17-2006, 09:12 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2332865

Looks like one of their strongest selling points is the reception the Hornets have received, but the $64,000 question is whether or not half a season of strong attendance for an NBA team will translate into lasting support for an MLB franchise.

Of course, I'm sure the degree to which Loria thinks OKC is a viable option depends on how much cash they're willing to fork over to build his half billion dollar dream.

Ol' No. 2
02-17-2006, 11:08 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2332865

Looks like one of their strongest selling points is the reception the Hornets have received, but the $64,000 question is whether or not half a season of strong attendance for an NBA team will translate into lasting support for an MLB franchise.

Of course, I'm sure the degree to which Loria thinks OKC is a viable option depends on how much cash they're willing to fork over to build his half billion dollar dream.Anyone who thinks Oklahoma City is a better baseball venue than Miami should have his head examined. This is a classic squeeze.

Hitmen77
02-17-2006, 11:18 AM
Anyone who thinks Oklahoma City is a better baseball venue than Miami should have his head examined. This is a classic squeeze.

OK City, Norfolk, Vegas.... I think MLB is just running out of legitimate cities to play off each other to get good stadium deals. 15 years ago, teams were able to use serious threats to move elsewhere to get public funding for new ballparks. Now, where are the Nats, Marlins, and Twins seriously all going to move to if they don't get a stadium deal?

MrRoboto83
02-17-2006, 12:03 PM
I'm surprised Nashville or Memphis has shown no interest in a MLB team, not that a team could survive there.


Move the Marlins to Fargo!!!!

MiamiSpartan
02-17-2006, 12:09 PM
It's one thing to sell out an 18,000 seat arena in 40 dates vs a 35,000 seat stadium over 80 days...You would be looking at another Kansas City....Plus OKC summers are like Dallas: VERY hot, and can be very stormy, which is the same problem they have here... They're really starting to scrape the bottom of the barrel now. Las Vegas is the only city that makes any sense from a population and geographic point of view. Possibly Portland, but they've made it clear they are not building a ballpark at taxpayers' expense...

Lip Man 1
02-17-2006, 12:22 PM
There simply aren't enough people in the Oklahoma City area or Oklahoma for that matter to support 81 home games for an extended period of time.

This isn't OU football folks with only seven home games you know!

Lip

SOXPHILE
02-17-2006, 01:12 PM
Move the Marlins to Fargo!!!!

Then, instead of that quircky "Fightin' Fish" alot of use when referring to them, I guess we would just call them the "Frozen Fish". Or maybe the "Fish Sticks", as in Mrs. Paul ?

PKalltheway
02-17-2006, 10:29 PM
Hey, let's put a sixth team in California!:redneck

OkStateSox
02-17-2006, 11:35 PM
OKC and pro sports (ecspecially baseball) is a joke. Little rock would be a better place to put a team. OkCers are the ultimate bandwagoners when it comes to sports, one glimpse of trouble and they would draw worse then their AAA team does now. Honestly Tulsa would be the best place in the region to put a team but we just plain out dont have the numbers. 950,000 people cant support a team.

samram
02-18-2006, 03:06 AM
I'm surprised Nashville or Memphis has shown no interest in a MLB team, not that a team could survive there.


Move the Marlins to Fargo!!!!

Don't be surprised. People in Tennessee most likely have no interest in baseball.

I think the message to MLB should be clear. Baseball failed in south Florida. There is no other market that makes sense to try to exploit. Therefore, contraction is the best solution.

SouthSide_HitMen
02-18-2006, 04:08 AM
Top 50 TV Markets Ranked by Households, 2004

1 New York 7,375,530 (Mets, Yankees)
2 Los Angeles 5,536,430 (Dodgers, Angels)
3 Chicago 3,430,790 (White Sox, Acme)
4 Philadelphia 2,925,560 (Phillies)
5 Boston (Manchester) 2,375,310 (Red Sox)
6 San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose 2,355,740 (Giants, Big Hurts)
7 Dallas-Ft. Worth 2,336,140 (Rangers)
8 Washington, DC (Hagerstown) 2,252,550 (Nationals)
9 Atlanta 2,097,220 (Braves)
10 Houston 1,938,670 (Astros)
11 Detroit 1,936,350 (Tigers)
12 Tampa-St. Pete (Sarasota) 1,710,400 (Devil Rays)
13 Seattle-Tacoma 1,701,950 (Mariners)
14 Phoenix (Prescott) 1,660,430 (Diamondbacks)
15 Minneapolis-St. Paul 1,652,940 (Twins)
16 Cleveland-Akron 1,541,780 (Indians)
17 Miami-Ft. Lauderdale 1,522,960 (Marlins)
18 Denver 1,415,180 1.284 (Rockies)
19 Sacramento-Stockton-Modesto 1,345,820 (Giants, A's)
20 Orlando-Daytona Beach-Melbourne 1,345,700 (Devil Rays)
21 St. Louis 1,222,380 (Rooneys)
22 Pittsburgh 1,169,800 (Pirates)
23 Portland, OR 1,099,890 (Portland to Selig - **** You)
24 Baltimore 1,089,220 (Orioles)
25 Indianapolis 1,053,750 (?)
26 San Diego 1,026,160 (Padres)
27 Charlotte 1,020,130 (?)
28 Hartford & New Haven 1,013,350 (Red Sox Nation - Never)
29 Raleigh-Durham (Fayetteville) 985,200 (Sorry)
30 Nashville 927,500 (Sorry)
31 Kansas City 903,540 (Dead Man Walking)
32 Columbus, OH 890,770 (Pass)
33 Milwaukee 880,390 (No Bud - Looking Good for Brewers Fans)
34 Cincinnati 880,190 (Reds)

DOA
35 Greenville-Spartanburg-Asheville-Anderson 815,460
36 Salt Lake City 810,830
37 San Antonio 760,410
38 West Palm Beach-Ft. Pierce 751,930 (Marlins)
39 Grand Rapids-Kalamazoo-B.Creek 731,630
40 Birmingham (Anniston and Tuscaloosa Roll Tide!!!) 716,520
41 Harrisburg-Lancaster-Lebanon-York 707,010
42 Norfolk-Portsmith-Newport News 704,810
43 New Orleans 672,150
44 Memphis 657,670
45 Oklahoma City 655,400 (ROFLMAO)
46 Albuquerque-Santa Fe 653,680
47 Greensboro-High Point-Winston Salem 652,020
48 Las Vegas 651,110 (Selig to Vegas - **** you)
49 Buffalo 644,430
50 Louisville 643,290

MLB is down to four options:

1. Stay the course 3-5 - MLB fields a few ****ty teams, continues the welfare (i.e. revenue sharing) and whine, beg, demand, threaten for more taxpayer money.

2. Contraction 6-1 (Two teams - MLB hates this because it will cost the $ made on the Nationals if they don't screw that up).

3. Charlotte or Indianapolis - 20-1 - Taxpayers have had enough of Bud's extortion racket.

4. Tokyo, Mexico City - 40-1 - Unless you get two or more cities aboard close by, logistics make this nearly impossible (but then again if you consider the Expos travel in the Montreal / Puerto Rico phase (with no September call ups mind you in the thick of the playoff race) Bud Selig is capable of an infinite amount of BS if the $ is right).

Vegas' population will not give a crap about baseball - the betting is light (and would be prohibited). Vegas is an NFL & NBA town because they like to bet on it.

Oklahoma City is too small. Ditto Norfolk. The two other Southern Cities (Nashville & Raleigh) will not support a MLB team and Columbus cares about dotting the i and little else.

The Marlins world tour is BS unless some city / state does something dramatically stupid like DC did promising $500 mil (make that $610 mil). The punch bowl is just about dry. The Marlins are grasping at straws. Yet you can never underestimate the stupidity (and malice) of an elected "representative" so I expect this song and dance to continue until some local town ponies up enough money in Southern Florida (most likely) or the more drastic course of Bud Selig and the other 28 owners (Twins or Royals look like the other match) put them out of their misery.

Lip Man 1
02-18-2006, 12:37 PM
Based on their 2002 comments I could easily see contraction. Minnesota and Florida still do not have extorted stadiums on line (and those local/state governments aren't going to give them one...)

Lip

SouthSide_HitMen
02-18-2006, 01:11 PM
Based on their 2002 comments I could easily see contraction. Minnesota and Florida still do not have extorted stadiums on line (and those local/state governments aren't going to give them one...)

Lip

Except for the fact it will cost $400 mil + (or over $13 mil per team). Hence my odds above.

bigfoot
02-18-2006, 06:26 PM
Top 50 TV Markets Ranked by Households, 2004

1 New York 7,375,530 (Mets, Yankees)
2 Los Angeles 5,536,430 (Dodgers, Angels)
3 Chicago 3,430,790 (White Sox, Acme)
4 Philadelphia 2,925,560 (Phillies)
5 Boston (Manchester) 2,375,310 (Red Sox)
6 San Francisco-Oakland-San Jose 2,355,740 (Giants, Big Hurts)
7 Dallas-Ft. Worth 2,336,140 (Rangers)
8 Washington, DC (Hagerstown) 2,252,550 (Nationals)
9 Atlanta 2,097,220 (Braves)
10 Houston 1,938,670 (Astros)
11 Detroit 1,936,350 (Tigers)
12 Tampa-St. Pete (Sarasota) 1,710,400 (Devil Rays)
13 Seattle-Tacoma 1,701,950 (Mariners)
14 Phoenix (Prescott) 1,660,430 (Diamondbacks)
15 Minneapolis-St. Paul 1,652,940 (Twins)
16 Cleveland-Akron 1,541,780 (Indians)
17 Miami-Ft. Lauderdale 1,522,960 (Marlins)
18 Denver 1,415,180 1.284 (Rockies)
19 Sacramento-Stockton-Modesto 1,345,820 (Giants, A's)
20 Orlando-Daytona Beach-Melbourne 1,345,700 (Devil Rays)
21 St. Louis 1,222,380 (Rooneys)
22 Pittsburgh 1,169,800 (Pirates)
23 Portland, OR 1,099,890 (Portland to Selig - **** You)
24 Baltimore 1,089,220 (Orioles)
25 Indianapolis 1,053,750 (?)
26 San Diego 1,026,160 (Padres)
27 Charlotte 1,020,130 (?)
28 Hartford & New Haven 1,013,350 (Red Sox Nation - Never)
29 Raleigh-Durham (Fayetteville) 985,200 (Sorry)
30 Nashville 927,500 (Sorry)
31 Kansas City 903,540 (Dead Man Walking)
32 Columbus, OH 890,770 (Pass)
33 Milwaukee 880,390 (No Bud - Looking Good for Brewers Fans)
34 Cincinnati 880,190 (Reds)

DOA
35 Greenville-Spartanburg-Asheville-Anderson 815,460
36 Salt Lake City 810,830
37 San Antonio 760,410
38 West Palm Beach-Ft. Pierce 751,930 (Marlins)
39 Grand Rapids-Kalamazoo-B.Creek 731,630
40 Birmingham (Anniston and Tuscaloosa Roll Tide!!!) 716,520
41 Harrisburg-Lancaster-Lebanon-York 707,010
42 Norfolk-Portsmith-Newport News 704,810
43 New Orleans 672,150
44 Memphis 657,670
45 Oklahoma City 655,400 (ROFLMAO)
46 Albuquerque-Santa Fe 653,680
47 Greensboro-High Point-Winston Salem 652,020
48 Las Vegas 651,110 (Selig to Vegas - **** you)
49 Buffalo 644,430
50 Louisville 643,290

MLB is down to four options:

1. Stay the course 3-5 - MLB fields a few ****ty teams, continues the welfare (i.e. revenue sharing) and whine, beg, demand, threaten for more taxpayer money.

2. Contraction 6-1 (Two teams - MLB hates this because it will cost the $ made on the Nationals if they don't screw that up).

3. Charlotte or Indianapolis - 20-1 - Taxpayers have had enough of Bud's extortion racket.

4. Tokyo, Mexico City - 40-1 - Unless you get two or more cities aboard close by, logistics make this nearly impossible (but then again if you consider the Expos travel in the Montreal / Puerto Rico phase (with no September call ups mind you in the thick of the playoff race) Bud Selig is capable of an infinite amount of BS if the $ is right).

Vegas' population will not give a crap about baseball - the betting is light (and would be prohibited). Vegas is an NFL & NBA town because they like to bet on it.

Oklahoma City is too small. Ditto Norfolk. The two other Southern Cities (Nashville & Raleigh) will not support a MLB team and Columbus cares about dotting the i and little else.

The Marlins world tour is BS unless some city / state does something dramatically stupid like DC did promising $500 mil (make that $610 mil). The punch bowl is just about dry. The Marlins are grasping at straws. Yet you can never underestimate the stupidity (and malice) of an elected "representative" so I expect this song and dance to continue until some local town ponies up enough money in Southern Florida (most likely) or the more drastic course of Bud Selig and the other 28 owners (Twins or Royals look like the other match) put them out of their misery.

Would not the most viable option for a Marlin move be to Northern New Jersey/Brooklyn, with repatriations paid to Yankmees/Mets? This is in terms of population, disposable entertainment $ and satisfies the NE Corridor bias for sports programming, too.
Why would a group from TN/NC/OK want to bear the burden of promoting a sport seen as so East Coast dominated, into an area that prides itself with ALL THINGS not NE related?

samram
02-18-2006, 08:48 PM
Would not the most viable option for a Marlin move be to Northern New Jersey/Brooklyn, with repatriations paid to Yankmees/Mets? This is in terms of population, disposable entertainment $ and satisfies the NE Corridor bias for sports programming, too.
Why would a group from TN/NC/OK want to bear the burden of promoting a sport seen as so East Coast dominated, into an area that prides itself with ALL THINGS not NE related?

Except they love NY-style pizza. I don't know why.

Ol' No. 2
02-18-2006, 10:12 PM
Would not the most viable option for a Marlin move be to Northern New Jersey/Brooklyn, with repatriations paid to Yankmees/Mets? This is in terms of population, disposable entertainment $ and satisfies the NE Corridor bias for sports programming, too.
Why would a group from TN/NC/OK want to bear the burden of promoting a sport seen as so East Coast dominated, into an area that prides itself with ALL THINGS not NE related?Except for one detail: The Yankees and Mets would never allow it. There's no way any team could afford to pay them enough.

Tragg
02-19-2006, 09:21 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2332865

Looks like one of their strongest selling points is the reception the Hornets have received, but the $64,000 question is whether or not half a season of strong attendance for an NBA team will translate into lasting support for an MLB franchise.
Achieved via a 30% discount on tickets, and thousands of tickets given away for each game.

OkStateSox
02-19-2006, 09:40 PM
Achieved via a 30% discount on tickets, and thousands of tickets given away for each game.
Oh no, the now infamous OKC/New Orleans hatefest knows no bounds, I thought I would at least be safe from it at a Sox forum. Dont worry NO will get there team back, but it might not be for long if they can't handle it (honestly I dont think they can). OKC will (unforunatly) get a different team in a few years, thats pretty much a given now. Also, the hornets have to compete with something that doesnt exist to a large extent in la, college basketball. OSU mens, OU women and OU men all draw very good crowds during the season. This isnt the biggest state, they pretty much had to discount prices slightly and give away the occasional ticket to compete, especially with a team that doesnt even truly belong to the city and state.

buehrle4cy05
02-19-2006, 10:20 PM
Based on their 2002 comments I could easily see contraction. Minnesota and Florida still do not have extorted stadiums on line (and those local/state governments aren't going to give them one...)

Lip

Contraction would leave an odd number of teams in each league (AL-13, NL-15), which would likely mean Milwaukee switching back to the AL Central. Or MLB could even move Texas to the AL Central and Arizona to the AL West. It would be interesting to see what MLB would do with that scenario.

A division with the Sox, Indians, and Brewers in say, 2008, would be scary good.

itsnotrequired
02-19-2006, 11:20 PM
Contraction would leave an odd number of teams in each league (AL-13, NL-15), which would likely mean Milwaukee switching back to the AL Central. Or MLB could even move Texas to the AL Central and Arizona to the AL West. It would be interesting to see what MLB would do with that scenario.

A division with the Sox, Indians, and Brewers in say, 2008, would be scary good.

Seeing as how Bud fought tooth and nail to move the Brewers to the NL, I don't see him lying down and moving them back.

SouthSide_HitMen
02-19-2006, 11:23 PM
Seeing as how Bud fought tooth and nail to move the Brewers to the NL, I don't see him lying down and moving them back.

He doesn't own them anymore - he has no vested interest.

I read an article about proposed realignment / contraction and Milwaukee was not mentioned (and I personally doubt they change again). MLB should have four 7 team divisions and a LCS and World Series but when did they make a change for the good of the game (instead of the good of their bottom line).

Tragg
02-19-2006, 11:53 PM
Oh no, the now infamous OKC/New Orleans hatefest knows no bounds, I thought I would at least be safe from it at a Sox forum. Dont worry NO will get there team back, but it might not be for long if they can't handle it (honestly I dont think they can). OKC will (unforunatly) get a different team in a few years, thats pretty much a given now. Also, the hornets have to compete with something that doesnt exist to a large extent in la, college basketball. OSU mens, OU women and OU men all draw very good crowds during the season. This isnt the biggest state, they pretty much had to discount prices slightly and give away the occasional ticket to compete, especially with a team that doesnt even truly belong to the city and state.Sorry, just inserting facts into the discussion.
And the HOrnets in La had to compete with something non-existent in Oklahoma - good winter weather and a ton of things to do. The discounts were more than "Slight" and the give aways are voluminous not "occasional". There are 7 division 1 college basketball teams within a 2 hour drive of New Orleans (8 if you go to Mississippi) and 6 colleges that play some sort of college basketball within New Orleans itself. It's also college baseball season, and all 7 teams play college baseball, with LSU leading the nation in attendance, and Tulane in the top 15. Not that it helps the argument for keeping the Hornets in N.O. (it doesn't), but there is no comparison between the volume of entertainment choices in OKC or Oklahoma versus New Orleans, sports or otherwise.

Oh,and the Hornets were horrible last year, and this year they have a competitive team and the rookie of the year.

Yes, N.O. will get the team back - whether we get a fair chance to keep it is in question.

I have nothing against OKC. They've supported the HOrnets extremely well. In contrast to San Antonio, they haven't tried to steal our team.

OkStateSox
02-20-2006, 12:16 AM
I have nothing against OKC. They've supported the HOrnets extremely well. In contrast to San Antonio, they haven't tried to steal our team.
Ok good your not one of those NOLA fanatics. There have been huge posting wars going on between 2 rival Hornets fan forums (one OKC and one NOLA). Its gotten pretty nasty, both sides are pretty dilusional if you ask me. And la obviously has more things to do in the winter, but Oklahoma is a college basketball crazy state. It is hard for any new sporting program to compete with two Universities with such good recent histories. On one hand you have OSU who boasts one of the best and loudest college arenas in the country (the best according to CBS and ESPN) and a team that has made the big dance in 13 out of last 15 years. On the other hand you have OU who sells 10 dollar tickets that come with a free shirt and hot dog to all nonconference games. I guarentee you the Hornets never had to activiely compete with college teams in New Orleans. They will, and have had to in OKC.