PDA

View Full Version : Start Of Soxfest, Commence Cubune Negativity - the Frank Comments thread


DrCrawdad
01-27-2006, 01:28 AM
Couldn't the sour Thomas articles have waited?

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/media/thumbnails/story/2006-01/21642782.jpg

ilsox7
01-27-2006, 01:43 AM
<sigh> Unfortunately this seems like the beginning of a lot of animosity. Between Sox fans. Between Thomas and the Sox. I just everyone involved starts to take the high road, recognize Frank's greatness here, applaud him for it, and moves on. Including Frank.

ChiSoxLifer
01-27-2006, 02:09 AM
I'm kind of disappointed in Frank's comments. I was hoping it would be a lot more amicable than it turned out to be. Of course, that will be the headline in tomorrow's Cubune. Compared to the week before the cubs convention, there really hasn't been a whole lot of writeup on the Sox convention. Now that the Sox are mentioned, it turns out to be negative. Can't Reinsdorf buy the Sun-Times?

SOX ADDICT '73
01-27-2006, 02:19 AM
Moronotti expected Frank to lash out at the Sox in his press conference, but so far the worst thing I've heard him say was (referring to Chicago): "Things just aren't the same over there."

That's right Frank, things aren't the same. They're way, WAY better.

Say what you have to say, Big Man, to appease your new fans and to convince yourself this was a better move than just retiring with the White Sox. I hope you get your 550 ABs this season, and 52 HR as well (none of them resulting in a victory against the Sox, of course). Just be sure to hit above .197 when doing so, or your career BA drops below .300. If you don't reach 500 HR, your critics would love to have another reason to not vote you into the HOF on the first ballot, even though every one of them knows you deserve it.

ilsox7
01-27-2006, 02:25 AM
Moronotti expected Frank to lash out at the Sox in his press conference, but so far the worst thing I've heard him say was (referring to Chicago): "Things just aren't the same over there."

That's right Frank, things aren't the same. They're way, WAY better.

Say what you have to say, Big Man, to appease your new fans and to convince yourself this was a better move than just retiring with the White Sox. I hope you get your 550 ABs this season, and 52 HR as well (none of them resulting in a victory against the Sox, of course). Just be sure to hit above .197 when doing so, or your career BA drops below .300. If you don't reach 500 HR, your critics would love to have another reason to not vote you into the HOF on the first ballot, even though every one of them knows you deserve it.

It's impossible to calculate what BA he would have to maintain the rest of his career to stay above .300 if you do not know how many AB's he will have.

SOX ADDICT '73
01-27-2006, 02:57 AM
It's impossible to calculate what BA he would have to maintain the rest of his career to stay above .300 if you do not know how many AB's he will have.
If you read a little higher in my post, you'd see I was using 550 PA (which is one of the incentives in his deal). You are correct, however, about the impossibility of calculating an exact average, given how frequently Thomas draws walks.

My point was that I'd hate to see Frank limp through a few more seasons, hitting well below his career average, in an effort to reach 500 home runs. Though it produced a lot of fireworks, his .219 showing in 2005 continued a trend over the past five years which saw his once Ted Williams-esque career average drop ever closer to the .300 mark. All of those blockhead sportswriters who don't want to vote him in on the first ballot because of the whole DH thing, but would grudgingly do so if he reached the 500 HR plateau, would just love another reason (Frank hitting below .300 for his career) to keep him out initially.

IowaSox1971
01-27-2006, 04:11 AM
Frank has not played a full season since 2003. He has been unable to play even half a baseball season in any year since then. Also, Frank has not hit better than .271 since 2000. I still think he could have a big year in 2006, but recent history shows that he can't be counted on to stay healthy.

crazyozzie02
01-27-2006, 07:54 AM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-060126hurtbrite,1,7801427.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

I will let you guys read it for yourself, but BIG HURT is not a happy A about Thome.

Colin

markopat
01-27-2006, 08:25 AM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-060126hurtbrite,1,7801427.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

I will let you guys read it for yourself, but BIG HURT is not a happy A about Thome.

Colin

Good Luck Frank...Bye Frank.

Go Go SOX...Go Go Thome...prove him wrong!

anti-cub
01-27-2006, 08:25 AM
As much as I liked Thomas, I'm not surprised he said all that. In his years here, he did whine and was unable to keep his mouth shut. At least he signed to a major league contract unlike steroid/cork boy who nobody wants. Except for a minor league contract which he refuses.

rdwj
01-27-2006, 08:26 AM
Hmmm, I thought Frank wised up over the past couple of years - looks like i was wrong.

oeo
01-27-2006, 08:31 AM
Sorry Frank, but your injuries have been re-occurring for a long time now. You haven't had a full season in two years.

I'm sure he's just pissed off that he had to leave, and there's no reason he shouldn't. He wanted to finish his career here, but we had to move on. If he can't play a whole season, we have to try something new.

One quote:
If I'm healthy, they'll be shaking their heads next year.

Yeah, IF you're healthy and IF Thome isn't healthy we will be shaking our heads. You haven't proven that you can stay healthy. If you could stay healthy we wouldn't have had to make this move. That's a real big IF, Frank.

spawn
01-27-2006, 08:41 AM
Wow...a former Sox player ripping on his former team. That never happens here. I saw someone on my train reading that article, and decided I didn't want to read it myself. I've always been a big fan of Frank, and continue to be. I'm not going to let what he says now tarnish his legacy in my eyes.

Good luck Frank. You will be missed.

Jaffar
01-27-2006, 08:49 AM
It's really easy to jump on Frank after reading that but if he was really lead on like that by the organization then that really sucks. I won't say anything bad about Frank I'll let the media take care of that.

Kilroy
01-27-2006, 08:51 AM
KW has outed himself many times in his desire to get rid of Frank. I'm not sure why Frank was surprised.

That said, as much as I love Frank, he needs to move on. That's kinda funny for me to say because many of us still aren't that ok with the idea, and we didn't play for the Sox for 16 years.

HotelWhiteSox
01-27-2006, 08:55 AM
He was replaced. Anybody that gets replaced in any aspect of life will be bitter. This doesn't change my opinion of Frank at all

Frankly Missing
01-27-2006, 09:01 AM
As much as I liked Thomas, I'm not surprised he said all that. In his years here, he did whine and was unable to keep his mouth shut. At least he signed to a major league contract unlike steroid/cork boy who nobody wants. Except for a minor league contract which he refuses.

I don't have a problem with Frank speaking his mind on feeling betrayed.

This scenario was a MAJOR life changing event for him.

Frank left the victory parade and Chicago feeling warm and fuzzy, and waited for a phone call that never came. No one bothered to tell him it was over.

KW needled Frank in the media also. How soon we forget KW ripping Frank a new one when Frank went on the DL instead of sitting on the bench as a decoy.

Which one of KWs revolving joke of a 5th starter was probably on the mound that made him desperate to sit a man who couldn't walk on the bench in an attempt to win a ball game?

Good Luck Frank, enjoy the game you love and made so many of us love. The Sox owe you alot. There are thousands and thousands and thousands of Sox fans as a result of your dedication to the game and Chicago.

PorkChopExpress
01-27-2006, 09:01 AM
I don't blame Frank at all for what he said. I thought exactly the same thing when the Thome deal was done. You could tell from the way Kenny talked about Frank last year (never committing to anything and always dancing around questions as to whether he's coming back) that Kenny was more than considering letting the big guy go. And if he had just told Frank straight up, then Frank's reaction might have been different. But telling him and his agent you were going to work something out and then bringing in a hitter who is no better, only lefty, who has health concerns of his own is a slap in the face (or roundhouse kick).

Don't get me wrong, I'm over it, I will cheer for Frank every chance I get and I wish him luck with his new team. I will cheer wildly for Thome now that he is on the Sox. But I am not one of the greatest hitters of our era signing a deal for $500,000 when guys who couldn't carry my jock are making millions. Tough break Hurt. I feel for you. Go earn your incentives and I'll be there when they announce your admittance into the Hall.

oeo
01-27-2006, 09:06 AM
I don't have a problem with Frank speaking his mind on feeling betrayed.

This scenario was a MAJOR life changing event for him.

Frank left the victory parade and Chicago feeling warm and fuzzy, and waited for a phone call that never came. No one bothered to tell him it was over.

KW needled Frank in the media also. How soon we forget KW ripping Frank a new one when Frank went on the DL instead of sitting on the bench as a decoy.

Which one of KWs revolving joke of a 5th starter was probably on the mound that made him desperate to sit a man who couldn't walk on the bench in an attempt to win a ball game?

Good Luck Frank, enjoy the game you love and made so many of us love. The Sox owe you alot. There are thousands and thousands and thousands of Sox fans as a result of your dedication to the game and Chicago.

I understand it was life-changing and see where he's coming from. But his ultra-ego that he's better than Thome is ridiculous. He says how he's a good friend, then goes ahead and says there is no way he's a better hitter than him. It may be true, but you just don't say that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a Frank fan and wish him the best, but why couldn't he just keep his mouth shut and go away quietly?

alohafri
01-27-2006, 09:08 AM
Regardless of whether he was "misled" by Kenny Williams, or anyone else in the organization, couldn't he have taken the high road? Shut your yap and let your bat do your talking for you and don't be a big 38 year old baby!

Hitmen77
01-27-2006, 09:09 AM
It's really easy to jump on Frank after reading that but if he was really lead on like that by the organization then that really sucks. I won't say anything bad about Frank I'll let the media take care of that.

I don't see how he could be right about the organization "leading him on". Everyone else in the world was figuring they wouldn't bring back Thomas. If Thmas didn't see this coming, then he was just refusing to face reality.

I think it's sad that someone who is as rich as Frank Thomas and who has accomplished so much as Frank Thomas can still be a selfish crybaby. Compare and contrast Thomas's reaction to Aaron Rowand's reaction to being traded.

This makes me more confident that the Sox made the right move in going with Jim Thome.

alohafri
01-27-2006, 09:10 AM
Moronotti expected Frank to lash out at the Sox in his press conference, but so far the worst thing I've heard him say was (referring to Chicago): "Things just aren't the same over there."

That's right Frank, things aren't the same. They're way, WAY better.

Say what you have to say, Big Man, to appease your new fans and to convince yourself this was a better move than just retiring with the White Sox. I hope you get your 550 ABs this season, and 52 HR as well (none of them resulting in a victory against the Sox, of course). Just be sure to hit above .197 when doing so, or your career BA drops below .300. If you don't reach 500 HR, your critics would love to have another reason to not vote you into the HOF on the first ballot, even though every one of them knows you deserve it.

No one is kissing his ample behind like they did when he was the only show in town.

Frankly Missing
01-27-2006, 09:19 AM
I understand it was life-changing and see where he's coming from. But his ultra-ego that he's better than Thome is ridiculous. He says how he's a good friend, then goes ahead and says there is no way he's a better hitter than him. It may be true, but you just don't say that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a Frank fan and wish him the best, but why couldn't he just keep his mouth shut and go away quietly?

Sure, it makes us fans uncomfortable to hear these things.

On the other hand, if the time spent in Chicago, the Sox and his fans meant nothing to him, he probably wouldn't feel sad and betrayed and say things we really don't want to hear.

So what do we want?

A Frank that doesn't give a **** and frollicks off to Oakland?

Or a Frank that is upset to leave his baseball home and says so?

He might not say it in the way we want, with no hard feelings, but it is what it is.

lumpyspun
01-27-2006, 09:25 AM
I found it interesting he had to throw something in those comments about money. He is mad b/c we gave Thome money and nobody would sign him for more than a guaranteed 500k.

All I know is everytime he had a hit that wasn't a homerun I would cringe watching him make his way around the bases. The guy is an injury waiting to happen.

Madvora
01-27-2006, 09:31 AM
I hope that's the end of it. Let him get his frustrations out and be over with it. Hopefully Frank will have a great year in Oakland and they'll finish in second place, then we'll see Frank back in a few years to have his number retired.

IggyD
01-27-2006, 09:32 AM
He was replaced. Anybody that gets replaced in any aspect of life will be bitter. This doesn't change my opinion of Frank at all
I agree with you 100%.

Let the Big Guy get it all out.

It's like his family disowned him. Chicago and the Sox was all he ever knew.

How would you feel if the Sox told you that they were replacing you with a Cub fan........

Hitmen77
01-27-2006, 09:33 AM
Sure, it makes us fans uncomfortable to hear these things.

On the other hand, if the time spent in Chicago, the Sox and his fans meant nothing to him, he probably wouldn't feel sad and betrayed and say things we really don't want to hear.

You can't be serious that he's thinking about the fans on this one.

This is all about one person. Frank Thomas. He's proved time an again over the years how much of a selfish crybaby he can be. It's sad that someone who has accomplished so much on the field and now has a WS ring still has to be in constant pout mode.

So what do we want?
A Frank that doesn't give a **** and frollicks off to Oakland?
Or a Frank that is upset to leave his baseball home and says so?
He might not say it in the way we want, with no hard feelings, but it is what it is.

Um, I believe that Frank Thomas is not the first person in the history of baseball who was traded or not re-signed by his team. I just don't get your logic that if Thomas took this with even an ounce of class, that would have meant he "doesn't give a **** and frollicks off to Oakland".

If clubhouse chemistry is really so important to this team, then we're better off with Thome than Pouting Thomas.

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2006, 09:35 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.

Hitmen77
01-27-2006, 09:35 AM
I agree with you 100%.

Let the Big Guy get it all out.

It's like his family disowned him. Chicago and the Sox was all he ever knew.

How would you feel if the Sox told you that they were replacing you with a Cub fan........

If they did so after

a) letting me throw out the first pitch in a playoff game,
b) making sure I was a big part of the WS victory celebration and parade, and
c) paid me $3.5million to buyout my contract

I would keep my big selfish mouth shut and only worry about the season ahead with my new team.

IggyD
01-27-2006, 09:40 AM
If they did so after

a) letting me throw out the first pitch in a playoff game,
b) making sure I was a big part of the WS victory celebration and parade, and
c) paid me $3.5million to buyout my contract

I would keep my big selfish mouth shut and only worry about the season ahead with my new team.
forget about it.....
:supernana:Hey...lets have FUN..."Its SOXFEST BABY"..see ya all tonight at the bar.:supernana:

Hangar18
01-27-2006, 09:55 AM
Frank Thomas choking up and nearly coming to tears .......... after the WOrld Series, and at the Parade .............is all that I need to know about his Dedication and his Desire to stay a White Sox for the rest of his career.
He'll always be a SOX in my eyes, and looking forward to him coming back to us in another capacity soon.

Hangar18
01-27-2006, 09:57 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.


Good Point ............the Chicago Media never liked him because he didnt wear flubby blue. Cheers Frank

itsnotrequired
01-27-2006, 10:00 AM
Frank Thomas choking up and nearly coming to tears .......... after the WOrld Series, and at the Parade .............is all that I need to know about his Dedication and his Desire to stay a White Sox for the rest of his career.
He'll always be a SOX in my eyes, and looking forward to him coming back to us in another capacity soon.

Right on. I mean, it isn't like KW was twirling his moustache with evil plans to throw Frank off the team. It was pretty much a no-brainer from the Sox perspective. Sox would have had to pay Thomas $10 million if they wanted him in 2006. No way you pay that kind of money to an aging, injured player.

kevin57
01-27-2006, 10:01 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.

I have no illusions about the media. Basically, they set their targets on their "foes" and use what they can to prove their point.

But this sort of thing has happened over and over and over with Frank. He's a big player with a mighty big bat...and all too big of a mouth.

Hitmen77
01-27-2006, 10:03 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.

He must really have had ALOT to say if the follow only accounted for 0.5% of what he said:

"I think people [in Chicago], after awhile, I did so much, start expecting more and expecting more and at some point what can you do?" Thomas said. "I really didn't know what more positive I could [have done]. If I didn't lead the league in something, it was like I had a bad year. It's good to go somewhere and people can really respect what you do."
So, that's all that happened to him over the last few years? He just didn't lead the league in every offensive category?:?:

"If that team last year hadn't jumped out early with the big lead and showed signs of being a World Series champion, I probably would have waited a little bit longer," Thomas said. "Last year was all about winning and I wanted to get back." So, he rushed back because the Sox had a huge lead in the standings? :?:

"At the end of the playoffs last year, I felt if I wanted to be some type of superhero I could have tried to play and probably had some effect, but I was told not to do it," Thomas said. "I really wanted to, but Kenny shut that down. That's when I got a feeling that I wouldn't be back. I was ready to take that cast off going into October [but I was already on the] 60-day DL. That's when I knew something was going on." Wow, I thought that thing in October was all about the Sox trying to win the World Series. I didn't realize it should have been about giving a roster spot to someone who just had a cast taken off.

"They have an unbelievable pitching staff but the core of that team has changed," Thomas said. "I know people are talking about a repeat, but they lost nine players off that team and some key pitchers." Yes, I think the unanimous concensus is that the Sox have lost a ton of key players which will make it hard for them to repeat.

"I don't know where they went with that or what the logic was behind that. He had two major injuries last year. "I love Jim. Jim's a good friend. But the bottom line is he's never done anything I haven't done on the baseball field." Nice positive things to say about his "friend" Jim Thome.

And to round out this 0.5% of his negative comments he said:

- He never would have thrown out the first pitch at the ALDS and
- He never would have accepted the WS trophy at the victory parade

if he knew the Sox were letting him go.

Yeah, the Sox really have alot of nerve letting throw out the first pitch at the ALDS. And what a tactless move on the Sox part in having Thomas a part of the victory parade and giving him a chance to hold the trophy. Two things that everyone just dreams about getting the chance to do and Thomas is bitter about it. That's just really sad.

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 10:09 AM
I'm pretty disappointed after reading Frank's comments. Not at him, because as noted, he seemed mostly positive, and not slamming the organization or talking bad about them. And I'm not upset at the decision, I think that was the way it had to be because he's not reliable due to multiple injuries in the same location (which is different from reinjuring the same break, that's not what I understood happened, so his "I came back at 70%" thing is rationalization). Thome's had 2 separate injuries, but is on a completely different level in terms of reinjury than Frank at this point.

What I'm disappointed at is that from some very specific, apparently fact-based comments, the organization does not seem to have even considered retaining Frank. If these are true:
- They never took a physical at the end of the season to gauge healing
- JR never called Frank before or after he was cut loose

Then it's clear that Kenny had in mind replacing him the moment he went down. And they never had any discussions with him to at least notify the greatest player in franchise history that they were going to move on. At the very least, that's disrespectful to a guy who gave the org his all. At most, it's somewhat unprofessional to not even consider whether or not he'd even be a fallback option (i.e. by gauging the degree of healing).

That's what upsets me. It seems to me that Kenny let his personal feelings enter the decision on this one, which is not a good thing.

Good luck big guy. You'll always be my favorite player in baseball history, and in my mind, the greatest hitter of our generation.

Chisox1500
01-27-2006, 10:11 AM
Frank's negative comments are 100 percent correct. Thome has not accomplished anything more than Thomas, and Thome did suffer a major injury last year. He is also a more expensive question mark than Frank. I hope both do well next year. But Thomas wasn't saying anything out of line.

Baby Fisk
01-27-2006, 10:16 AM
Diamonds lie, nothing lasts forever.

Harry Chappas
01-27-2006, 10:18 AM
Let me preface this by saying that I'm a huge Frank Thomas fan and that will never change. However, it never ceases to amaze me the lengths to which some of you will go to defend his ridiculous utterances, of which there have been many during his career. You act as if an amicable parting of ways was impossible. Not so. Look at Rowand. He was the epitome of class when he learned of his trade to Philly. Thomas has always been a petulant star that demanded to be pampered. It's a shame he had to take a few more shots on his way out of town because it reduces the liklihood of him one day being part of the organization (ala Baines, Guillen, Walker, Cora, etc.).

Edit: I realize Guillen didn't go quietly, but I think the organization dismissed this as "Ozzie being Ozzie." I think Thomas' parting shots are going to leave deeper wounds.

infohawk
01-27-2006, 10:23 AM
I'll always love Frank Thomas and consider him a White Sox hero and the greatest player in franchise history. That said, this is the side of Frank I will not miss. For a guy who has accomplished what he has in this game, he makes himself sound so small and insecure. In this respect, Jim Thome is a huge upgrade. Still, if I'm ever at a game where he is an opposing player, he will get nothing but thunderous applause from me.

Unregistered
01-27-2006, 10:41 AM
Regardless of the other things he said, which are a product of Frank feeling scorned, he is quoted as saying his agent was told that the Sox were going to try to work something out and bring hiim back. Instead of just cutting ties, saying "thanks for the memories, Frank," it seems like the organization stalled until the deadline came and went and it was impossible for Frank to come back unless he waiting for May.

It's like going out with a girl for a year and then all of the sudden not calling her anymore. "I thought it was obvious I was going in a different direction," you could tell mutual friends.

That's a pretty ****ty way to do things, and a pretty good way to tell a White Sox legend to go **** himself without actually saying anything.

Now this may be a "he said, she said" kinda thing, if KW is saying that Frank knew what was coming, but truth be told, Frank wouldn't be the first former Sox with this same exact complaint - and really, Frank has no reason to make up the scenario. Ultimately, I just wish the Sox could find a way to not burn bridges with every single fan favorite who leaves the team.

brewcrew/chisox
01-27-2006, 10:48 AM
Let me preface this by saying that I'm a huge Frank Thomas fan and that will never change. However, it never ceases to amaze me the lengths to which some of you will go to defend his ridiculous utterances, of which there have been many during his career. You act as if an amicable parting of ways was impossible. Not so. Look at Rowand. He was the epitome of class when he learned of his trade to Philly. Thomas has always been a petulant star that demanded to be pampered. It's a shame he had to take a few more shots on his way out of town because it reduces the liklihood of him one day being part of the organization (ala Baines, Guillen, Walker, Cora, etc.).


Guillen is a bad example, as he was extremely bitter when the Sox let him go, and he let everyone in the Northern Hemisphere know it.

I don't know Frank, except from what I've read in the papers. I know he's complained about his job, but who here hasn't? To me that's all this is.

Like Ozzie, I think he'll come around after he's had some time on his own. Heck, who knows? Frank's contract is only for 1 year and we could see him again here in Chicago in some capacity.

MisterB
01-27-2006, 10:50 AM
For those who are throwing out Rowand's name in all this - there's no comparison. Thomas was a HoF-caliber player, the best hitter on this team and the face of the franchise for most of the last 16 years. Rowand's career so far is a steaming pile of dog**** by comparison. Rowand was a small and fairly easily replacable cog in the organization and he knew it - franchise players are used to being 'the man' and when they aren't anymore, there's going to be some emotion involved. There's nothing untrue in what Frank said, and it's no worse than Ozzie's comments when he was let go years back.

mccoydp
01-27-2006, 10:51 AM
:maggs

"See, I'm not the only one who complains. *******s!"

As much as I admire Frank as a player, he needs to come to a realization that his body is breaking down, and that he is probably going to be prone to serious injury from now on due to his ankle. I seriously doubt that he was ready to play last October, but, only he and his doctor really know.

wilburaga
01-27-2006, 10:52 AM
Just Frank being Frank.


W

Jerko
01-27-2006, 10:53 AM
The only thing I got mad about reading that article was when Frank said he wouldn't have thrown out the first pitch for game 1 and that he wouldn't have come to the rally. You were on the team THEN Frank, and the fans were glad (at least I was) that you were at that rally. Should the Sox "take back" the ring they're gonna give you because you're not on the team anymore? What would the Sox have had to pay him, 10 mil to stay? I love Thomas the player but he hasn't been healthy going on 3 seasons now.

Baby Fisk
01-27-2006, 10:54 AM
Has anyone ever had the experience of working in the same place for 15 years, then suddenly finding themselves on the outs, even though you didn't really want to leave? None of us will know who said what or who did what, but who among us wouldn't be pissed off and saying nasty things if we were in that situation? As soon as it was clear Frank was leaving, it was going to be an ugly parting. :(:

mccoydp
01-27-2006, 10:56 AM
Has anyone ever had the experience of working in the same place for 15 years, then suddenly finding themselves on the outs, even though you didn't really want to leave? None of us will know who said what or who did what, but who among us wouldn't be pissed off and saying nasty things if we were in that situation? As soon as it was clear Frank was leaving, it was going to be an ugly parting. :(:

I agree with you here...it's kind of like being married to someone for 30+ years, and then getting divorced. You know it's going to be a nasty parting.

Jenks4Pres
01-27-2006, 11:01 AM
Say it ain't so Frank!!!!
:(:

I still love you big man!

ChiSoxLifer
01-27-2006, 11:01 AM
I understand Frank's feelings but this just gives the Cubune another opportunity to take a negative event and run with it. Soxfest is this weekend and I basically have to read the other dailies before I see anything positive about the White Sox. Oh well.

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 11:04 AM
He was replaced. Anybody that gets replaced in any aspect of life will be bitter. This doesn't change my opinion of Frank at all

Thank you and if what he says about the way they handled it is true, he has a point.

If you gave 90% of your useful career to a company and they didn't even bother to tell you that they had replaced you before not renewing your contract after telling you they would find a way to make it work how would you feel?

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 11:07 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.

Exactly. They also went out of their way to interview him on this exact topic right before Soxfest. Yes, he just signed his contract, but it was obvious he wasn't coming back after they signed Thome.

The Cubune went looking for sour grapes and they found them.

soxfan26
01-27-2006, 11:08 AM
In the words of the prophet Fred Durst

"It's all about the he said she said bull****."

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 11:11 AM
No one is kissing his ample behind like they did when he was the only show in town.

When did anyone in the media EVER kiss Frank's ass?

Mickster
01-27-2006, 11:17 AM
Jeez, people. Where have you been for the last 20 years? Did any of you listen to ALL of what Frank said? It was 99.5% positive. But surprisingly enough, the sportswriters took a few snippets out of context that would make it sound like everything he said was sour grapes.

Shocking.

Exactly! I listened to the XM interview of Frank after the A's press conference announcing the signing last night and this is a complete 180 from the direct questions that they asked him about being bitter. He stated that he was not bitter, that he understands that this is a business and that there is no loyalty in professional sports. He did not say it in a negative way, just that he understood the decisions of the Sox.

This article reeks of the Tailgunner Joe article after CLee was traded last year when suddenly CLee was painted as a bad guy. Crappy journalism.

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 11:18 AM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

Mickster
01-27-2006, 11:20 AM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

:thumbsup:

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 11:25 AM
Only one healthy season in the last four....sorry Frank....but we dodged a bullett in 2005 after counting on your health to be our full time DH....did you really expect us to do that again?

The fact that the best offer you could get was a $500K base offered a few weeks before spring training justifies the White Sox decision.

tebman
01-27-2006, 11:33 AM
I understand it was life-changing and see where he's coming from. But his ultra-ego that he's better than Thome is ridiculous. He says how he's a good friend, then goes ahead and says there is no way he's a better hitter than him. It may be true, but you just don't say that.

Don't get me wrong, I'm still a Frank fan and wish him the best, but why couldn't he just keep his mouth shut and go away quietly?
It's sad, but any of us who've been following Frank for the last 15 years know the drill. He wants to be in the game; he has justifiable confidence in his ability; and when he isn't out there the way he thinks he should be, he says so.

Frank is one of those guys who's a genuinely nice fellow, but has never mastered tact or official public relations. He wears his emotions on his sleeve, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it comes across as whiny because of a poor choice of words.

It reminds me of the stories about Babe Ruth when he was released by the Yankees after the 1934 season. Ruth thought he still had it and also thought he should be the Yankees' manager. He popped off and was quoted by every sportswriter and radio reporter. Ruth couldn't face reality either, but the only reality he'd ever known had been his success and his superior abilities. To suggest that he didn't measure up just did not compute in his mind.

Frank looks like he's going through the same thing. I hope he reaches his personal goals, but I'm afraid he's going to go limping out of the game instead of taking the triumphant final bow that he really deserves.

GoSox2K3
01-27-2006, 11:42 AM
Has anyone ever had the experience of working in the same place for 15 years, then suddenly finding themselves on the outs even though you didn't really want to leave, and then being given special recognition by letting you throw out the 1st pitch at a playoff game, and then letting you hold the WS trophy in front of over a million fans, and then being given a $3.5 million contract buyout? None of us will know who said what or who did what, but who among us wouldn't be pissed off and saying nasty things if we were in that situation? As soon as it was clear Frank was leaving, it was going to be an ugly parting. :(:

Adjusted your question for you. :tongue:

alohafri
01-27-2006, 11:45 AM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

Frank is arguably the greatest player to ever wear a White Sox uniform. But his whining has gotten old. Did Babe Ruth moan at a press conference when he was traded from the Yankees? Again, the best thing for Frank to have done would be to let his bat do the talking. Hit .320 with 50 home runs and 130 RBIs for a big "how do you like that Kenny?" If he plays 35 games this season, Kenny was right. I would love to see the former to cement his Hall of Fame election...and he won't go in wearing "wedding gown white."

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 11:46 AM
Adjusted your question for you. :tongue:

Puh-leez.

- Frank's buyout was contractually obligated, not a "sign of respect" or anything.
- His issue is that they had apparently made up their minds early on (as evidenced by not even giving him a physical), but didn't share that with him. In fact, there are some indications that they told himor his agent that they wanted to work things out, but it was apparently just lip service since they never even took the first steps towards attempting that.

He repeatedly said they made a business deicsion, as was their right. And IMO it was definitely the right one. But it's a poor way to handle the situation with your franchise icon, which reflects poorly on the organization.

Yes, Frank goes overboard a bit with the "I wouldn't have thrown out the first pitch", etc. But he's hurt and generally a bit emotional, and he has every right to be.

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2006, 11:47 AM
It's sad, but any of us who've been following Frank for the last 15 years know the drill. He wants to be in the game; he has justifiable confidence in his ability; and when he isn't out there the way he thinks he should be, he says so.

Frank is one of those guys who's a genuinely nice fellow, but has never mastered tact or official public relations. He wears his emotions on his sleeve, which isn't necessarily a bad thing, but it comes across as whiny because of a poor choice of words.

It reminds me of the stories about Babe Ruth when he was released by the Yankees after the 1934 season. Ruth thought he still had it and also thought he should be the Yankees' manager. He popped off and was quoted by every sportswriter and radio reporter. Ruth couldn't face reality either, but the only reality he'd ever known had been his success and his superior abilities. To suggest that he didn't measure up just did not compute in his mind.

Frank looks like he's going through the same thing. I hope he reaches his personal goals, but I'm afraid he's going to go limping out of the game instead of taking the triumphant final bow that he really deserves.And it doesn't help any when the sportswriters focus on the few negative things he says to the exclusion of everything else. Same old same old. It's not as if this was the first time. Are people's memories that short?

Dick Allen
01-27-2006, 11:48 AM
Sorry, but I have a little bit of trouble believing that Frank couldn't see this one coming. If they intended to bring him back, I don't think that they would have honored him in the postseason and parade the way they did. Either way, it was a decision that had to be made, and his 500K contract more or less substantiates the Sox' worries about him.

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 11:48 AM
Frank is arguably the greatest player to ever wear a White Sox uniform. But his whining has gotten old. Did Babe Ruth moan at a press conference when he was traded from the Yankees? Again, the best thing for Frank to have done would be to let his bat do the talking. Hit .320 with 50 home runs and 130 RBIs for a big "how do you like that Kenny?" If he plays 35 games this season, Kenny was right. I would love to see the former to cement his Hall of Fame election...and he won't go in wearing "wedding gown white."

It reminds me of the stories about Babe Ruth when he was released by the Yankees after the 1934 season. Ruth thought he still had it and also thought he should be the Yankees' manager. He popped off and was quoted by every sportswriter and radio reporter. Ruth couldn't face reality either, but the only reality he'd ever known had been his success and his superior abilities. To suggest that he didn't measure up just did not compute in his mind.

I wasn't there, but apparently Ruth DID complain. The bastage.

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 11:51 AM
Frank's negative comments are 100 percent correct. Thome has not accomplished anything more than Thomas, and Thome did suffer a major injury last year. He is also a more expensive question mark than Frank. I hope both do well next year. But Thomas wasn't saying anything out of line.

Really? So Frank was 100% willing to play the field like Thome has been? I recall Frank pretty much saying I'm a DH...no interest in playing the field. Frank ever hit 50+ dingers? Frank ever known as one of the best teamates in baseball? Thome ever hold out during spring training because he wanted to renegotiate a deal he signed?

I have a ton of respect for everything he's meant to the White Sox but it's an annual event for Frank to shoot his mouth off and taking on Thome is just another example of how is career has continually been "one step forward...two steps back".

GoSox2K3
01-27-2006, 11:54 AM
Puh-leez.

- Frank's buyout was contractually obligated, not a "sign of respect" or anything.

So?

Yes, I agree that since his 3.5 million was obligated that it "doesn't count" and he has every right to publically be a crybaby out his situation.

kobo
01-27-2006, 11:58 AM
Nice to see that some things never change. I always thought Thomas was one of the best baseball players to ever wear a White Sox uniform, and will probably go down as the greatest White Sox ever. However, he has always been a crybaby, someone who whines and complains because of the way he is treated. it's always about himself, never about the team, the organization, always ME ME ME. While I respect what he did as a player for the White Sox, I think as a person he is a piece of ****. I will not miss Thomas because he has been a non factor for 2 years now. Good bye Frank, and good luck in Oakland. Maybe one day you will learn what respect means.

RallyBowl
01-27-2006, 11:59 AM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

You said it. No one should be talking **** about Frank right now. No one here has ever been in his shoes. He is a human, and is entitlted to feel the way he does. And, really, what has he said that is so bad? IMO almost everything coming out of his mouth is truth. He wanted to stay. His ego is wounded. It's Okay.

alohafri
01-27-2006, 12:02 PM
I wasn't there, but apparently Ruth DID complain. The bastage.

I stand corrected.

Did Magglio Ordonez complain?

I will give Frank this. He isn't holding out for a huge guaranteed contract like another former Chicago baseball player is.

Baby Fisk
01-27-2006, 12:03 PM
Everyone stop fighting about Frank! *bursts into tears and runs away* :whiner:

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 12:07 PM
You said it. No one should be talking **** about Frank right now. No one here has ever been in his shoes. He is a human, and is entitlted to feel the way he does. And, really, what has he said that is so bad? IMO almost everything coming out of his mouth is truth. He wanted to stay. His ego is wounded. It's Okay.

Sorry....he made about $30MM over the three years (of the last four) when he was a non factor to the team due to his health. His whining vs. keeping his mouth shut and taking the high road is consistent with the "self inflicted wounds" he had created with his mouth throughout his career.

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 12:33 PM
Frank is arguably the greatest player to ever wear a White Sox uniform. But his whining has gotten old. Did Babe Ruth moan at a press conference when he was traded from the Yankees? Again, the best thing for Frank to have done would be to let his bat do the talking. Hit .320 with 50 home runs and 130 RBIs for a big "how do you like that Kenny?" If he plays 35 games this season, Kenny was right. I would love to see the former to cement his Hall of Fame election...and he won't go in wearing "wedding gown white."


Apparently Babe did mouth off according to one of the other posters in this thread a few posts after my last one.

Take any person not happy about the way things ended who really wanted to stay and poke them and prod them and print their comments - 90% of them say the exact same thing.

Then the haters come climbing back out of the woodwork looking for any excuse to dump on the big man. "I told you Frank was an idiot. I told you he was a baby. I told you he was all about Frank." :rolleyes:

It's jumping on the pile. It's kicking a guy when he is down. It's beneath Sox fans to do this to the greatest player to ever wear the uniform.

But of course, the way they treated Fisk was horrible...:rolleyes:

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 12:34 PM
Really? So Frank was 100% willing to play the field like Thome has been? I recall Frank pretty much saying I'm a DH...no interest in playing the field. Frank ever hit 50+ dingers? Frank ever known as one of the best teamates in baseball? Thome ever hold out during spring training because he wanted to renegotiate a deal he signed?

I have a ton of respect for everything he's meant to the White Sox but it's an annual event for Frank to shoot his mouth off and taking on Thome is just another example of how is career has continually been "one step forward...two steps back".

Let's ask the guys who played with Frank what kind of a teammate he was. Let's ask Aaron Rowand.

50 dingers? That the best you got? This post is garbage.

:whoflungpoo:

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 12:37 PM
Nice to see that some things never change. I always thought Thomas was one of the best baseball players to ever wear a White Sox uniform, and will probably go down as the greatest White Sox ever. However, he has always been a crybaby, someone who whines and complains because of the way he is treated. it's always about himself, never about the team, the organization, always ME ME ME. While I respect what he did as a player for the White Sox, I think as a person he is a piece of ****. I will not miss Thomas because he has been a non factor for 2 years now. Good bye Frank, and good luck in Oakland. Maybe one day you will learn what respect means.

More unadulaterated bull****...

You know Frank personally? You speak like someone who has done more than read a few negative articles.

Maybe you will one day learn what respect means, but I doubt it, you don't seem to be able to tell facts from smear jobs...

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 12:38 PM
Sorry....he made about $30MM over the three years (of the last four) when he was a non factor to the team due to his health. His whining vs. keeping his mouth shut and taking the high road is consistent with the "self inflicted wounds" he had created with his mouth throughout his career.

All of which is his fault because what, exactly? Again - if you take the time to actually read what he said, he's not slamming the organization for letting him go, in fact he says it was their decision and they did what they though best. He might disagree because he thinks he's healthy, but he's not knocking them for it. However, if the facts that there was no physical, and no communication (or worse - misleading communications) are true, then there's no disputing that it's a poor way to treat your franchise icon as departs.

Your argument that they paid him his contract and therefore he should be happy doesn't hold water. The organization has no choice of behaviour in terms of honoring contracts. The organization absolutely has a choice when it decides to treat the best player in team history as if he was a non roster invitee.

Let's recap:
- Frank Thomas has been arguably the greatest hitter of our time when healthy. He's also been clean. And his injuries aren't related to poor work ethic, lifestyle, or anything he had any control over.
- Frank Thomas has been pretty much universally acknowledged as being great to the fans. I have never heard any stories about him being anything but overly gracious and accomodating with fans
- The "incidents" are pretty much BS. The "holdout" - he threatened, but reported on time. The "shuttle run" - he WAS recovering and ran the drill later in ST. The "Wells/Konerko incident" & "Manuel" criticism - he had major injuries.
- The "poor clubhouse" behaviour amounts to him not being a vocal leader, not him being a bad teammate/cancer. Ask Uribe & Rowand about him working with younger players. The negative comments are pretty much that he's focused on his stats & performance, which as a hitter is actually important.

He's the greatest player in team history. He's one of the greatest in baseball history. And it sticks in my craw that my favorite team didn't even have the decency to tell him "hey, we don't think we can rely on you so we're going another way", or that the owner after the decision was made didn't have the decency to call him up and say "Frank, it sucks, but it's a move we have to make. You'll always be part of the White Sox family and hopefully return to the organization.".

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 12:39 PM
Sorry....he made about $30MM over the three years (of the last four) when he was a non factor to the team due to his health. His whining vs. keeping his mouth shut and taking the high road is consistent with the "self inflicted wounds" he had created with his mouth throughout his career.

self-inflicted wounds.

Hope you never get interviewed on a subject you are royally ticked off about right at the moment it hurts the most.

Oh that's right, no one wants to interview you...:rolleyes:

voodoochile
01-27-2006, 12:41 PM
Your argument that they paid him his contract and therefore he should be happy doesn't hold water. The organization has no choice of behaviour in terms of honoring contracts. The organization absolutely has a choice when it decides to treat the best player in team history as if he was a non roster invitee.
Thank you...

Read it again all you haters, read it again...

Hangar18
01-27-2006, 12:47 PM
It's jumping on the pile. It's kicking a guy when he is down. It's beneath Sox fans to do this to the greatest player to ever wear the uniform.

But of course, the way they treated Fisk was horrible...:rolleyes:


I hate when people pile-on !

cheeses_h_rice
01-27-2006, 12:59 PM
The thing I'm most disappointed about with this whole Frank situation is that Kenny couldn't have been more forthcoming and straight with Frank about his future with the team, which I'm sure was pre-determined even before the 2005 season started.

I realize that Kenny plays things very close to his vest, and that there were a lot of pieces to the puzzle that had to be sorted out first (Konerko & Thome, especially), but it would have been nice to read that Kenny and Jerry made a personal call on Frank to talk things over once the major offseason moves had been made.

At the same time, I wish Frank could do the smart media thing and just say great things about the Sox, express his sadness that he couldn't retire a White Sox, and move on, but a tiger can't change his stripes.

I wish Frank all the best with the A's. He's the greatest player to ever wear a White Sox uniform, and nothing he can do or say will change my opinion of that.

TheOldRoman
01-27-2006, 01:07 PM
Good Point ............the Chicago Media never liked him because he didnt wear flubby blue. Cheers Frank The media never liked him, but they will LOVE him now. The Cubune will come out with dozens of stories this year about Frank. They will use him now to show the Sox in a bad light. Predictable Cubune bull****. They crapped on Frank his entire career, but now they will run stories they should have been running for the past 10 years. "Frank is the best ever, and the Sox are horrible for treating him like that. You should not give money to such a horrible franchise. Oh yeah, their ballpark sucks, too."

It is very sad to see people piling on Frank like this. I am not saying they are wrong for feeling that way, but it is sad that is came to this. Frank is the greatest White Sox player of all time, and the last taste he leaves in many here's mouth is the bitter comments from yesterday. I can't do it, I can't pile on the greatest Sox player of all time.

The only comment I really didn't like was him ripping on Thome. I understand his bitterness, but you don't crap on supposed friends like that. You don't throw someone else under the bus to prove a point. He is absolutely wrong here, Thome is much less of a risk than Thome. The other comments I understand.

When I think of Frank Thomas years from now, yesterday's venom will not be on my mind. He was upset about the situation, and we all know how much the media loves to prod Frank to say certain things. I just hope that from this point on both Frank and the Sox take the high road. I would hate for this to escalate into Frank not wanting to come back to have his jersey retired and statue unveiled.

spiffie
01-27-2006, 01:13 PM
Frank is hurt, and no matter how confident he is in public, part of him has to wonder if he can ever play consistently again. The guy vented about what sounds like a situation that could have been handled better than it was. So what?

I just hope that in the next few years Frank, just like all the other folks who have returned to the fold the last few years (McDowell, Fisk, Ventura, Ozzie), will mellow out and come back to be with the one team he belongs with in some capacity, even just as legend-in-residence.

mccoydp
01-27-2006, 01:30 PM
What really sucks about all of this is that I'm not going to have enough hours in the day to track both the Sox and Big Frank swatting hits for Oakland. Thank goodness for MLB-TV and highlights!

Best of luck, Frank, and here's to an injury-free, productively monstrous season!

:thumbsup:

mccoydp
01-27-2006, 01:32 PM
The media never liked him, but they will LOVE him now. The Cubune will come out with dozens of stories this year about Frank. They will use him now to show the Sox in a bad light. Predictable Cubune bull****. They crapped on Frank his entire career, but now they will run stories they should have been running for the past 10 years. "Frank is the best ever, and the Sox are horrible for treating him like that. You should not give money to such a horrible franchise. Oh yeah, their ballpark sucks, too."

It is very sad to see people piling on Frank like this. I am not saying they are wrong for feeling that way, but it is sad that is came to this. Frank is the greatest White Sox player of all time, and the last taste he leaves in many here's mouth is the bitter comments from yesterday. I can't do it, I can't pile on the greatest Sox player of all time.

The only comment I really didn't like was him ripping on Thome. I understand his bitterness, but you don't crap on supposed friends like that. You don't throw someone else under the bus to prove a point. He is absolutely wrong here, Thome is much less of a risk than Thome. The other comments I understand.

When I think of Frank Thomas years from now, yesterday's venom will not be on my mind. He was upset about the situation, and we all know how much the media loves to prod Frank to say certain things. I just hope that from this point on both Frank and the Sox take the high road. I would hate for this to escalate into Frank not wanting to come back to have his jersey retired and statue unveiled.
We'll probably hear the Cubune talk about how Frank was robbed of the 2000 A.L. MVP as well!

I guess the above statement is more of a pipe dream than anything...

Hitmen77
01-27-2006, 01:37 PM
After reading his comments yesterday, if anything I just sort of feel sorry for Big Frank for always feeling so bitter about everything. Yesterday's comments were typical Frank and came as no surprise - he's had the same attitude for many years here. I don't think this makes him a jerk, but I do pity a man who has accomplished so much and yet is in this perpetual put-upon, pouting mode.

I will always fondly remember him as the greatest hitter in Sox history. I'm confident that those memories will outlive the memories of his being a nonstop malcontent - which I'm glad to say will quickly fade.

I think he should be a first-ballot hall of famer and I hope someday there is a statue at the Cell honoring him. But, at this point, I'm glad the Sox are moving on. I won't miss the nonstop "Frank's feelings are hurt again" soap opera and I agree with KW that we have a better chance to repeat with Thome than hoping for a resurgent Thomas. If Frank Thomas proves us wrong, more power to him.

Good luck Frank, thanks for the wonderful memories, and I hope you find some inner peace in your life that has apparently not been there during your Sox career.

TheOldRoman
01-27-2006, 01:38 PM
We'll probably hear the Cubune talk about how Frank was robbed of the 2000 A.L. MVP as well!

I guess the above statement is more of a pipe dream than anything...


I wouldn't doubt it. It helps build Frank's case for the mindless clowns who know nothing of the situation but will say "hey, the Sox are wrong. I hate them. I am never going to another game after the way they treated Frank."

longshot7
01-27-2006, 01:41 PM
Thank you Frank for everything. I miss you already.



Simply the greatest White Sox that ever lived.

Hangar18
01-27-2006, 01:45 PM
The media never liked him, but they will LOVE him now. The Cubune will come out with dozens of stories this year about Frank. They will use him now to show the Sox in a bad light. Predictable Cubune bull****. They crapped on Frank his entire career, but now they will run stories they should have been running for the past 10 years. "Frank is the best ever, and the Sox are horrible for treating him like that.

It is very sad to see people piling on Frank like this.... I can't do it, I can't pile on the greatest Sox player of all time.



YES. A friend of mine was asked by a reporter what he thought of the trade, buddy said he mainly asked was he sour on him being let go and was Frank a complainer. Typical Chicago Media/Cubune BULL is right.
as for piling on ......your one of the main culprits, heh heh

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2006, 01:48 PM
After reading his comments yesterday, if anything I just sort of feel sorry for Big Frank for always feeling so bitter about everything. Yesterday's comments were typical Frank and came as no surprise - he's had the same attitude for many years here. I don't think this makes him a jerk, but I do pity a man who has accomplished so much and yet is in this perpetual put-upon, pouting mode.

I will always fondly remember him as the greatest hitter in Sox history. I'm confident that those memories will outlive the memories of his being a nonstop malcontent - which I'm glad to say will quickly fade.

I think he should be a first-ballot hall of famer and I hope someday there is a statue at the Cell honoring him. But, at this point, I'm glad the Sox are moving on. I won't miss the nonstop "Frank's feelings are hurt again" soap opera and I agree with KW that we have a better chance to repeat with Thome than hoping for a resurgent Thomas. If Frank Thomas proves us wrong, more power to him.

Good luck Frank, thanks for the wonderful memories, and I hope you find some inner peace in your life that has apparently not been there during your Sox career.If Frank has one failing in dealing with the public it's his inability to prevent reporters from putting words in his mouth. And reporters take full advantage of the situation. They know just how to get him to say things he really doesn't mean to say. They've been doing it for years.

kobo
01-27-2006, 01:51 PM
More unadulaterated bull****...

You know Frank personally? You speak like someone who has done more than read a few negative articles.

Maybe you will one day learn what respect means, but I doubt it, you don't seem to be able to tell facts from smear jobs...
I do know what respect means, and I repsect what he did on the field, but as far as him as a person I do not have respect for him. It's my opinion of the man, I don't need to know him personally to form an opinion on the guy. I have based my opinion on him from what I have read and the interviews he has given over the years on TV. I'm sorry, but he has always come across as a whiner, a guy who is more interested in himself than anything else.

And do you honestly believe that the media is trying to smear Thomas? Why? He doesn't play in this town anymore, he's not a member of the White Sox, I don't see the point in the media trying to smear him. He made his comments, he has voiced his opinion on what has happened and how he was treated, I don't see how this is a smear job. Not everything is a conspiracy against the White Sox.

TheOldRoman
01-27-2006, 01:54 PM
And do you honestly believe that the media is trying to smear Thomas? Why? He doesn't play in this town anymore, he's not a member of the White Sox, I don't see the point in the media trying to smear him. He made his comments, he has voiced his opinion on what has happened and how he was treated, I don't see how this is a smear job. Not everything is a conspiracy against the White Sox. The media isn't trying to smear Thomas anymore. They are just trying to get him to say bad things about the Sox so they get more negative front page material.

Fake Chet Lemon
01-27-2006, 01:59 PM
Frank got pushed out the door and he's a little upset. So what! It's really to be expected. For all he has accomplished, his comments were small potato's. Let's let it go and wish him well.

The Tribune did nothing wrong either on this one. Frank is the greatest player in this town most of us have ever seen. To NOT cover this story would have been more of a slight to all things White Sox.

hawkjt
01-27-2006, 02:41 PM
I hate to hear any ammo out of Franks mouth for the media that loves that garbage. Like murph, who has predictably hammered Frank his whole show and has successfully gotten him named Tool of the week...

Murph says that Franks selfishness is demonstrated by his desire to play in june when the sox had the lead. Well, when frank played the sox pushed that lead from like 5 game to 15 I believe. That was the stretch that really put them over the top.

Frank is obviously a sensitive guy but he never hurt the team or the fans. He is emotional about this big event in his life and altho I wished he had not said one thing ,it is not surprising. He is human. he knows the sox have a good chance to be back in the playoffs and it has to hurt to know he will not be part of it.

Time will heal and Frank will be back in the fold before he goes into the HOF and his number will be retired and a statue erected out in the outfield. Bank on it. We will miss ya, big fella. good luck this year.

alohafri
01-27-2006, 02:45 PM
If Frank has one failing in dealing with the public it's his inability to prevent reporters from putting words in his mouth. And reporters take full advantage of the situation. They know just how to get him to say things he really doesn't mean to say. They've been doing it for years.

I have always said that the reason SamMe was so loved and Frank was (hated is too strong of a word, so let's just say) taken with such indifference was that SamMe had better handlers. Put Frank in front of a microphone, and you can just see his foot headed to his mouth.

santo=dorf
01-27-2006, 02:52 PM
Really? So Frank was 100% willing to play the field like Thome has been? I recall Frank pretty much saying I'm a DH...no interest in playing the field. Frank ever hit 50+ dingers? Frank ever known as one of the best teamates in baseball? Thome ever hold out during spring training because he wanted to renegotiate a deal he signed?

I have a ton of respect for everything he's meant to the White Sox but it's an annual event for Frank to shoot his mouth off and taking on Thome is just another example of how is career has continually been "one step forward...two steps back".

I feel the same way with the first part of your post, but I never thought of Frank having a career that was "one step forward...two steps back."

I'm willing to bet Thome plays more games, has a higher BA, higher OBP, more HR, and more RBI's than Frank next season. Any takers?

Kilroy
01-27-2006, 03:02 PM
Yeah, the Sox really have alot of nerve letting throw out the first pitch at the ALDS. And what a tactless move on the Sox part in having Thomas a part of the victory parade and giving him a chance to hold the trophy.

Uh hold on. Don't act like the Sox did him some big ****ing favor. Unless my memory is failing, he was on the ****ing team last year. Would there be a reason he wouldn't hold the trophy that made it such a great 'gesture' on the part of the Sox to let him? And correct me if I'm wrong but a whole lot of people were included in that parade and spoke on that podium that did a whole lot less for the Sox in this city than Thomas did. As a member of the ****ing team, Thomas damn well better be involved in the victory parade.

jehosaphat
01-27-2006, 03:15 PM
Wow...a former Sox player ripping on his former team. That never happens here. I saw someone on my train reading that article, and decided I didn't want to read it myself. I've always been a big fan of Frank, and continue to be. I'm not going to let what he says now tarnish his legacy in my eyes.

Good luck Frank. You will be missed.

Perhaps we should all bury our head in the sand. But for those who did read it, the only conclusion to be reached is that it is what it is. The bottom line. Frank was a great player who didn't take steriods in an era when many did. He deserves to be in the HOF and deserves his picture on the wall of the outfield and a statue in the ballpark. But, he was also always a bit of a whiner.

GoSox2K3
01-27-2006, 03:18 PM
Uh hold on. Don't act like the Sox did him some big ****ing favor. Unless my memory is failing, he was on the ****ing team last year. Would there be a reason he wouldn't hold the trophy that made it such a great 'gesture' on the part of the Sox to let him? And correct me if I'm wrong but a whole lot of people were included in that parade and spoke on that podium that did a whole lot less for the Sox in this city than Thomas did. As a member of the ****ing team, Thomas damn well better be involved in the victory parade.

Wow, 3 ****ings! I guess that proves you are right.

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 03:22 PM
I just realized this:

Maintaining their startlingly parallel careers, both Frank Thomas and Jeff Bagwell have been dismissed rather rudely by the teams for whom they were the franchise icons. Both dismissals due to injuries. This after said teams met in the World Series, a series in which neither was really able to contribute.

Truth is indeed, stranger than fiction.

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 03:24 PM
The media isn't trying to smear Thomas anymore. They are just trying to get him to say bad things about the Sox so they get more negative front page material.

and unfortunately...Frank has always been very cooperative at providing the quotes for them to go negative. If just once he would just keep his mouth shut and take the hight road....

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2006, 03:27 PM
The media isn't trying to smear Thomas anymore. They are just trying to get him to say bad things about the Sox so they get more negative front page material.Choice #1: Get a real story (Involves a lot of work.:(:)
Choice #2: Bait a player into saying something controversial. (Spend the rest of the afternoon in the bar.:smile:)

It's not like we haven't seen this stuff over and over again.

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 03:27 PM
Let's ask the guys who played with Frank what kind of a teammate he was. Let's ask Aaron Rowand.

50 dingers? That the best you got? This post is garbage.

:whoflungpoo:


I have spoken to several of his teammates....one in particular that played with him 1990-1994...that's where I'm coming from.

santo=dorf
01-27-2006, 03:34 PM
and unfortunately...Frank has always been very cooperative at providing the quotes for them to go negative. If just once he would just keep his mouth shut and take the hight road....

Oh come on, it's just the sports writers taking everything out of context.

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 03:38 PM
self-inflicted wounds.

Hope you never get interviewed on a subject you are royally ticked off about right at the moment it hurts the most.

Oh that's right, no one wants to interview you...:rolleyes:

Geez dude....we're just debating quotes of a former great player in the paper...no need to get personal. In the real world....my company is restructuring....I see good hard working people who are being affected...and they are handling it all with more grace and class then I think Frank is....and they have not earned $100M+ over their careers. No one will ever interview me I'm sure...

JKryl
01-27-2006, 03:42 PM
Frank has shown a lack of class for a number of years now. Each time I think he's coming around, he uses his mouth instead of his brain. I think both Frank and the Sox are better off this way. The Sox lose a lot of baggage, and Frank gets a fresh start. I hope he does better than Sammy. But, it still would have been better for him just to retire at home where he belongs.

churlish
01-27-2006, 03:52 PM
Wow! Things sure change quickly. A few days ago, people were talking about how incredible Frank Thomas was and wishing him the best of luck. Now, he's a moron who has no class. Did I forget to mention he's made millions and millions of dollars and bashes the organization that gave him the money? Or that the hard-working fans who have paid his salary would never have any hard feelings over being let go by their employer and would have nothing negative to say if given the chance?

The Frank-bashers need to take a step back and view the big picture. Frank Thomas was the best player on the White Sox for many years, and no one can doubt his work ethic. He may not have been the smartest person with the media, but you can't question his desire. How many people who have met Frank Thomas personally have anything bad to say about him?

SouthSide_HitMen
01-27-2006, 04:02 PM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

Couldn't have said it better VooDoo. I like to see what these punks at the Cubune and Cub Times have to say when their newspaper lays them off after 15 years (or less). Judge not that ye be not judged (Matthew 7:1).

Kilroy
01-27-2006, 04:49 PM
Wow, 3 ****ings! I guess that proves you are right.

You ****ing know it!

Lip Man 1
01-27-2006, 04:50 PM
I was concerned about some of Frank's comments but it's not like he's never put his foot in his mouth before.

The two areas that Frank seems to be overlooking are as follows.

1.) He is confident that he'll be healthy but the fact is that his foot/ankle have had four major issues since it first happened in the middle of the 1996 season including the past two years. That's a track record in my mind and a major gamble the Sox simply could not afford to take. That's the nature of the business Frank...nothing personal.

2.) Frank himself (and deservedly so) feels that he is entitled to play every day. The reality is Frank is 37 and with his health issues probably can not play every day anymore, even as a DH. If he came back to the Sox and only played two or three times a week would he accept that? And would he accept it and not start popping off to the media about it? There's no way to know for sure but history has shown Frank has gotten upset over lesser things in the past hasn't he?

The bottom line is that Frank's injuries and circumstances conspired to force a divorce. It happens...it wasn't deliberate and it's not personal. Frank needs to stop taking it personally.

I wish him nothing but the best but it wouldn't surprise me if he breaks the ankle or foot again in June and is forced to retire. If he gets 350 at bats this season he'll be fortunate.

Lip

Jjav829
01-27-2006, 04:54 PM
Here's my problem with what Frank said.

First off, I guess I should say I have no problem with Frank being upset. I'm sure he is disappointed at the way his White Sox career ended. But he is the reason that his White Sox career ended like that. Now I'm not blaming Frank for getting injured. It's not like he did it on purpose. But the two ankles injures happened and forced the Sox hand.

What pisses me off is some of the unnecessary **** that he said. It's one thing to express a disappointment in leaving. It's another to say something like:

''I thought it would be more of a phone call,'' Thomas said. ''Kenny is probably going to say, 'Hey, I acknowledged him in the World Series parade and we had him throw out the first pitch.' But I never would have done that stuff if I knew I was leaving.''

So what if Kenny would have gone to Frank in September and said, "Sorry Frank, but I just want to tell you in advance that we're probably not going to bring you back?" Then Frank would have decided not to throw out the first pitch or come to the parade? That's a bull**** comment.



''He had two major injuries last year. Nothing against him. I love Jimmy. Jimmy's a good friend, but bottom line, he's never done anything that I haven't done on a baseball field. ''But he's a big left-handed presence; maybe that's what they wanted, just a big left-handed hitter. It wasn't a better hitter, I'm gonna tell you that right now.''

Once again, why does he feel the need to bring Thome into this? As I have said ever since Frank was placed on the DL, it's a decision on whether to bring Frank back or to let him go. Thome has nothing to do with it. If it wasn't Thome it would have been Overbay, Delgado, etc. The decision wasn't Frank or Thome, it was Frank or someone else. The Sox decided the latter was the better choice. Leave Thome out of it.


''Not to toot my own horn, there are a lot of great players over there, a great pitching staff -- an unbelievable pitching staff -- but the core of that team has changed,'' Thomas said. ''I know people are talking about a repeat, but they lost nine players off that team.''

Sorry Frank, but Willie Harris, Damaso Marte, Luis Vizcaino, Geoff Blum, Timo Perez, El Duque and yourself were hardly core players of the team. Only Rowand and Everett can be considered a core part of the team. The true core of the Sox last year consisted of guys like Buehrle, Garland, Garcia, Contreras, Konerko, Crede, Pierzynski and Dye.

I know Frank has never been great with expressing himself to the media. I guess I just hoped that this one time things would be different. That Frank would come out and say, "It's a shame that I can't finish my career with the Sox, but I thank the organization for 16 great years and for helping me get a World Series ring." I guess I shouldn't have expected that...

FWIW, Kenny was on The Score earlier and claimed that he called Frank the day the Thome trade was made and never received a call back. Kenny says he ran into Frank at a fight a little while later and Frank said that he would give Kenny a call. Kenny said that at that time he thought everything was fine.

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 05:13 PM
The bottom line is that Frank's injuries and circumstances conspired to force a divorce. It happens...it wasn't deliberate and it's not personal. Frank needs to stop taking it personally.


My take on his comments were that while he disagrees that he's not healthy, he understood the Sox' position on that and didn't have a problem with it. His problem was with the way it was handled.

FWIW, Kenny was on The Score earlier and claimed that he called Frank the day the Thome trade was made and never received a call back. Kenny says he ran into Frank at a fight a little while later and Frank said that he would give Kenny a call. Kenny said that at that time he thought everything was fine.
If true, that makes me feel a bit better. But when they publicly say they're keeping the lines open and may bring him back if healthy, but they don't even give him a physical at the end of the year, it seems a bit inconsistent. Plus, for all that Jerry's supposed to be a Frank fan and such a loyal guy, I'm extremely surprised and disappointed that he didn't talk to Frank after the fact.

TomBradley72
01-27-2006, 05:24 PM
...but they don't even give him a physical at the end of the year, it seems a bit inconsistent.

I'm not sure what a physical would have demonstrated 3 months ago..even with the rave reviews from the physical the A's gave him...they still are only willing to gamble $500K guaranteed...think of that...half of what Timo Perez made last year....and that was the best he could do on the open market.

swanson24
01-27-2006, 05:50 PM
It is unfortunate that it had to end this way but the White Sox made the right move. Frank's health has been a concern over the past two seasons that is why they brought in Carl Everett and that is why they are now bringing in Jim Thome. I love Frank Thomas and appreciate everything he has done for this franchise. He is arguably the best power hitter in White Sox history and at times one of the most dominating players in the game. I hope things go well for him in Oakland and he finishes his career by hitting 500 home runs so that one day he gets enshrined in Cooperstown. I would hope that most Sox fans remember all the great things Frank brought to this city and this franchise and not let this interview effect the way they view the Big Hurt.

IowaSox1971
01-27-2006, 06:26 PM
What Frank and his backers seem to forget is that there was a lot of uncertainty surrounding the team right after we won the World Series. We couldn't give have given Frank a totally honest answer at the time, because we were not sure what was going to happen. The way the dominoes fell, Frank was the odd man out. If we hadn't re-signed Paulie, Frank probably would have been offered a deal. If we hadn't been able to acquire Thome for a relatively reasonable price, then that would have been another opportunity for Frank to come back. But with Frank and Thome in the fold, that left no spot for Frank, whose health situation was a big question mark.

I don't think anyone was being dishonest, we just didn't know. And keep in mind that Konerko highly endorsed the Thome trade. Perhaps that was why Paulie came back.

DickAllen72
01-27-2006, 07:47 PM
''I thought it would be more of a phone call,'' Thomas said. ''Kenny is probably going to say, 'Hey, I acknowledged him in the World Series parade and we had him throw out the first pitch.' But I never would have done that stuff if I knew I was leaving.''

The Sox would have never let you do "that stuff" if they knew you were going to be such a big baby.

Shut up, Frank, and try to limp off into the sunset with a little class.

Soxfanspcu11
01-27-2006, 09:10 PM
I'm 22 years old and Frank Thomas IS the reason I'm a Sox fan. I will always love him, no matter what.

He's obviously pissed right now, and people tend to say things they don't mean A LOT when their pissed. Give him some time to cool off and see what he says.

Anyway, like others have said in this thread, it's time to move on. 16 great years with the Sox, but now it's time to move in another direction. It hurts to see him in an Oakland uniform but you can't live in the past, just move forward!:smile:

RadioheadRocks
01-27-2006, 10:26 PM
I have always said that the reason SamMe was so loved and Frank was (hated is too strong of a word, so let's just say) taken with such indifference was that SamMe had better handlers. Put Frank in front of a microphone, and you can just see his foot headed to his mouth.

At least Frank never pretended he couldn't speak English and deferred everything to an interpreter.

Flight #24
01-27-2006, 11:03 PM
I'm not sure what a physical would have demonstrated 3 months ago..even with the rave reviews from the physical the A's gave him...they still are only willing to gamble $500K guaranteed...think of that...half of what Timo Perez made last year....and that was the best he could do on the open market.

Easy to say that now. But if you were ever even giving keeping him the slightest bit of a chance, you'd have done a physical at the end of the year. If nothing else, to judge what could happen as a fallback if Philly played REAL hardball on the Thome trade.

That they didn't even do that says only that they didn't care how fast or slow he was healing. They were moving on. Only they didn't have the balls to say that to the man's face, instead gave lip service to keeping him, then acted like he meant no more to the franchise in moving on than say, Willie Harris.

Guys like Frank deserve better. The right thing to do would have been to check him out, then tell him "It looks like it's not healing fast enough for us to rely on you" or "Frank, it's healing, but we just can't take the chance". Or hell - at the VERY least, to have JR call him after and say "Frank - you'll always be a White Sox and we hope to bring you back into the org in the future.".

DrCrawdad
01-28-2006, 01:01 AM
I was concerned about some of Frank's comments but it's not like he's never put his foot in his mouth before.

The two areas that Frank seems to be overlooking are as follows.

1.) He is confident that he'll be healthy but the fact is that his foot/ankle have had four major issues since it first happened in the middle of the 1996 season including the past two years. That's a track record in my mind and a major gamble the Sox simply could not afford to take. That's the nature of the business frank...nothing personal.

2.) Frank himself (and deservedly so) feels that he is entitled to play every day. The reality is Frank is 37 and with his health issues probably can not play every day anymore, even as a DH. If he came back to the Sox and only played two or three times a week would he accept that? And would he accept it and not start popping off to the media about it? There's no way to know for sure but history has shown Frank has gotten upset over lesser things in the past hasn't he?

The bottom line is that Frank's injuries and circumstances conspired to force a divorce. It happens...it wasn't deliberate and it's not personal. Frank needs to stop taking it personally.

I wish him nothing but the best but it wouldn't surprise me if he breaks the ankle or foot again in June and is forced to retire. If he gets 350 at bats this season he'll be fortunate.

Lip

I agree.

ilsox7
01-28-2006, 01:03 AM
Easy to say that now. But if you were ever even giving keeping him the slightest bit of a chance, you'd have done a physical at the end of the year. If nothing else, to judge what could happen as a fallback if Philly played REAL hardball on the Thome trade.

That they didn't even do that says only that they didn't care how fast or slow he was healing. They were moving on. Only they didn't have the balls to say that to the man's face, instead gave lip service to keeping him, then acted like he meant no more to the franchise in moving on than say, Willie Harris.

Guys like Frank deserve better. The right thing to do would have been to check him out, then tell him "It looks like it's not healing fast enough for us to rely on you" or "Frank, it's healing, but we just can't take the chance". Or hell - at the VERY least, to have JR call him after and say "Frank - you'll always be a White Sox and we hope to bring you back into the org in the future.".

With all due respect, you're taking Frank's word at 100%. There are already reports that KW called Frank and never got a call back. No one really knows what happened except those involved. That is why everyone needs to just take the high road here, appreciate what he did as a Sox, and move on.

Lip Man 1
01-28-2006, 02:48 AM
In Mark Gonzales' story tonight in the Tribune he quotes Williams directly as saying he placed a call to Frank and it was never returned.

I don't know what more he could have done if this is true. Remember this isn't the first time Frank has refused to talk to his employers, it happened two seasons ago I believe when the Sox were trying to contract Frank all off season and he never returned their messages after his first foot injury.

Lip

tadscout
01-28-2006, 08:49 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2309202 :o::(: (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/news/story?id=2309202)

kevin57
01-28-2006, 09:15 AM
A thread along this line appeared yesterday when Frank first made his comments in Oakland

Frank's bat was huge; Frank's place on this team is huge. Frank's mouth has also been all too huge.

That said, he deserves a retired number (when he actually does retire), a place in the HOF, and whatever other honors the Sox organization can bestow on him.

I can say I am happy and proud with the way KW and Thome and others responded to Frank's comments at Sox Fest. They've shown more class than he, unfortunately.

soxinem1
01-28-2006, 09:50 AM
You know I am still disappointed in some of the posters in this thread.

Frank has always worn his heart on his sleeve.

Frank has proven time and time again that he had only one desire - to finish his career as a Sox player.

Frank believes he can be healthy and when healthy he is a force.

Frank believes he was mislead about the direction the team was going to take with him.

Frank got interviewed and his heart opened up with all of the pain and rejection he felt. Pain of leaving his team. Pain of leaving his home. Pain of not being part of the season the Sox are champions.

So here come the haters...:?:

We're going to miss you too, Frank. Sorry you have to go somewhere else to keep playing. Good Luck...

A lot of you are doing exactly what the cubune wants you to do, be divisive among ourselves.

I'd like to take a little trip down Memory Lane if I may, and then let's see how many people harbor ill will against The Big Hurt.

The Big Hurt. Think about that. What player in this teams history, with the length of time Thomas spent here, would even be a close second. Most of my life, and definitely in this teams history, the collective offensive 'highs' in most categories were quite ordinary, to put it kindly. Other than a small handful of players, this guy went out there for the better part of 16 years, several of them in nagging pain, and displayed offensive talents that compare to Cobb, Mantle, Ruth, Mays, Clemente, and the rest of MLB elite. And no one will come close to doing this again.

And Frank will never had anywhere near the baggage Cobb, Mantle, and Ruth did. Frank never let his private life interfere with his on-filed play. His love for this sport was obvious from the first time he put the uniform on.

For example, before Frank came up, Carlton Fisk was the All- Time HR leader with LESS than 200. Frank has 448. The following categories of offense, Frank ranks #1 in team history:

OBP, SLG, OPS, runs, total bases, 2B, HR, RBI, BB, extra base hits, sac flies, and intentional BB. He's easily in the top seven in all other categories except 3B and SB.

Then to top it off, he's been falsely accused by his Manager of being a loaf (Manuel) and baited by another (Guillen), called out by a beached whale who would collapse himself (Wells), have numerous articles written by ignorant supposed-journalists chastising his contributions to not only White Sox but Chicago baseball. I remember both the Times and cubune asking last year why Thomas was not in the dugout after he was hurt. Those idiots must have been told he broke a finger or something, I thought he had a serious stress fracture and was supposed to stay off the foot, not walk a round the dugout and fly around the country.

So after accomplishing all this for this organization, he gets this kind of acknowledgment? Geez, I thought Reinsdorf was known for being loyal to his employees.

This guy is an ICON, not some water boy.

Plus, they would have probably accused him of not being a team player when he stayed in the dugout during home plate celebrations because he had to nurse a 'tweaked' knee.

So what, he's put his foot in his mouth a few times. Big ****ing deal. He always acknowledged the fans, from the time he was a rookie in 1990 up to winning the World Series.

And he NEVER cursed up a storm or embarrassed the team like Barry Bonds, Ron Artest, Latrell Spewell, or Allen Iverson. He has always held a pretty cool demeanor. I'm not even going to mention the steroid junkies!

After accomplishing all this, wouldn't you think a more proper farewell would have been appropriate? I hate to say this, but this is not the first time this organization has cast off a popular player in a questionable way. JR, Himes, Scheuler, and KW have handled a lot of situations in a questionable manner. Even though Frank is known for not returning calls, so what? As the owner JR should have stepped and nipped this one quickly and not let this type of situation develop.

So if Frank wants to complain that it could have been handled differently AND the validity of paying a new player a ton of money with the same kind of health questions, I stand right next to him. He didn't say anything none of us are not thinking ourselves.

We should all acknowledge the honor and privilege of being able to witness such greatness. We may never see such a long term sustained effort again.

We should only be arguing about when his uniform gets retired, his biggest hit(s), best game(s), and what position he gets when he's ready for life after being the Best Player in White Sox History.
</IMG>

oldcomiskey
01-28-2006, 10:49 AM
Not taking up for Frank but if what he said was true, he deserved at least a courtesy call. But thats Kenny. He seems to have a knack of knowing when its time to move a player. Frank is maybe the most important offensive player in the history of the franchise, and it hurts to see him go, BUT I said two years ago I dont care if they get rid of everybody as long as they win a championship. I wish Frank the best, even when he plays the Sox. He has always been a bit.....maybe petulant is too strong a word, but certainly hard to manage from time to time. Now we must press on without him. But in reality, exept for one month, we won without him last year, and theres no reason to think that we cant do it again. So to Frank I say, in the words of Bob Hope..."Thanks for the memories, big guy".

kevin57
01-28-2006, 10:53 AM
It seems to me that "both sides" in this argument about Frank need to acknowledge a couple of things:

1) Frank's place as a player on the Sox is indisputable. Nothing he has said (or may have said) should detract one iota from those accomplishments. Even this past year, in the few games he was able to play, his HRs helped us win more than a couple of games.As has been noted, Guillen trashed the Sox when he left as a player. Others have done so in the twilight of their careers. FT had better have his number retired and other honors from the organization when he does retire, no matter what he has said or will say.

2) Frank's mouth has gotten him in trouble. To blame it 100% on media coverage is just denial. In these last comments, one can understand, even justify perhaps, his anger towards how KW and JR treated him, but was there any reason to diss Thome? And to have said he wouldn't have thrown out the first pitch in the ALCS or been in the parade...that's just wrong. No way to spin that, folks...and calling him out on that does not make one a Frank-hater.

Sox35th
01-28-2006, 11:13 AM
"I just think I deserved better, some closure, in Chicago," Thomas said. "If they'd just said they were going in a different direction, it would be fine, but no one gave me any heads up about what was going on."

Well, I hope big Frank has the full understanding that many Sox fans have great respect for what he did here is Chicago over 16 season. Also, that he will be known as one of the all-time greatest Sox players in history. It's sad that it had to end the way that it did......but he did get the ring!!

Good luck getting 500 Frank!!

TomBradley72
01-28-2006, 11:40 AM
Easy to say that now.

No...easy to say that then.

His cast had been off for less than a week or two...what's that really going to tell you about a guy that has missed nearly two full seasons due to the same injury?...and the clock is ticking on resigning PK and going after Thome. The current reports say Frank's physical regimen is now riding a bike for 20 minutes each day in a sauna. If we had committed to him...these boards would be filled with "spring training is 4 weeks away...how will we cover DH if Frank doesn't get healthy?".

TomBradley72
01-28-2006, 11:43 AM
It seems to me that "both sides" in this argument about Frank need to acknowledge a couple of things:

1) Frank's place as a player on the Sox is indisputable. Nothing he has said (or may have said) should detract one iota from those accomplishments. Even this past year, in the few games he was able to play, his HRs helped us win more than a couple of games.As has been noted, Guillen trashed the Sox when he left as a player. Others have done so in the twilight of their careers. FT had better have his number retired and other honors from the organization when he does retire, no matter what he has said or will say.

2) Frank's mouth has gotten him in trouble. To blame it 100% on media coverage is just denial. In these last comments, one can understand, even justify perhaps, his anger towards how KW and JR treated him, but was there any reason to diss Thome? And to have said he wouldn't have thrown out the first pitch in the ALCS or been in the parade...that's just wrong. No way to spin that, folks...and calling him out on that does not make one a Frank-hater.

Perfectly said.

SouthSide_HitMen
01-28-2006, 12:37 PM
And he NEVER cursed up a storm or embarrassed the team like Barry Bonds, Ron Artest, Latrell Spewell, or Allen Iverson. He has always held a pretty cool demeanor. I'm not even going to mention the steroid junkies!

You did two sentences ago. :tongue:

Agree with your post 100%.

Martinigirl
01-28-2006, 12:57 PM
What Frank did as a player for the White Sox should always be appreciated by not just Sox fans, but all of baseball. But the fact of the matter is he is his own worst enemy. Be mad at the organization, at the fact he is no longer here, but why would he say he wouldn't have participated in throwing out the first pitch of the ALDS? Why say he wouldn't have acted the way he did at the parade? Those are things that are about the fans, not the organization. And when he did those things, he was giving nothing by love from the White Sox fans.

Frank has always needed a good publicist, and he has never gotten one. As a person who speaks to the media, he should to have an internal filter when speaking in public, (as should everyone, but particularly if you are speaking to reporters). He doesn't need to share every thought he has with a room full of reporters.

Some people just have the ability to play the media, look at Konerko. He knows exactly what to say, and how to say it to portray himself, and his team, in the best light. I am sure there were times he wanted to go off on reporters, but he knows not to. He knows what to say and what not to say. And the same was true with Michael Jordan. And if a public figure doesn't innately have that ability, they hire a publicist and media consultant to teach them how to do it. Frank either never did, or didn't listen, because he has always had the problem of putting his foot in his mouth, which is a shame, because it ends up taking away from the tremendous baseball player he was, and maybe still is.

soxinem1
01-28-2006, 05:38 PM
You did two sentences ago. :tongue:

Agree with your post 100%.

You're right. I was actually thinking of Giambi and Palmeiro, but I guess Barry is a two-time ****ole!

tick53
01-31-2006, 12:46 AM
Farewell Big Man...God Be with You.

IowaSox1971
01-31-2006, 03:33 AM
A lot of you are doing exactly what the cubune wants you to do, be divisive among ourselves.

I'd like to take a little trip down Memory Lane if I may, and then let's see how many people harbor ill will against The Big Hurt.

The Big Hurt. Think about that. What player in this teams history, with the length of time Thomas spent here, would even be a close second. Most of my life, and definitely in this teams history, the collective offensive 'highs' in most categories were quite ordinary, to put it kindly. Other than a small handful of players, this guy went out there for the better part of 16 years, several of them in nagging pain, and displayed offensive talents that compare to Cobb, Mantle, Ruth, Mays, Clemente, and the rest of MLB elite. And no one will come close to doing this again.

And Frank will never had anywhere near the baggage Cobb, Mantle, and Ruth did. Frank never let his private life interfere with his on-filed play. His love for this sport was obvious from the first time he put the uniform on.

For example, before Frank came up, Carlton Fisk was the All- Time HR leader with LESS than 200. Frank has 448. The following categories of offense, Frank ranks #1 in team history:

OBP, SLG, OPS, runs, total bases, 2B, HR, RBI, BB, extra base hits, sac flies, and intentional BB. He's easily in the top seven in all other categories except 3B and SB.

Then to top it off, he's been falsely accused by his Manager of being a loaf (Manuel) and baited by another (Guillen), called out by a beached whale who would collapse himself (Wells), have numerous articles written by ignorant supposed-journalists chastising his contributions to not only White Sox but Chicago baseball. I remember both the Times and cubune asking last year why Thomas was not in the dugout after he was hurt. Those idiots must have been told he broke a finger or something, I thought he had a serious stress fracture and was supposed to stay off the foot, not walk a round the dugout and fly around the country.

So after accomplishing all this for this organization, he gets this kind of acknowledgment? Geez, I thought Reinsdorf was known for being loyal to his employees.

This guy is an ICON, not some water boy.

Plus, they would have probably accused him of not being a team player when he stayed in the dugout during home plate celebrations because he had to nurse a 'tweaked' knee.

So what, he's put his foot in his mouth a few times. Big ****ing deal. He always acknowledged the fans, from the time he was a rookie in 1990 up to winning the World Series.

And he NEVER cursed up a storm or embarrassed the team like Barry Bonds, Ron Artest, Latrell Spewell, or Allen Iverson. He has always held a pretty cool demeanor. I'm not even going to mention the steroid junkies!

After accomplishing all this, wouldn't you think a more proper farewell would have been appropriate? I hate to say this, but this is not the first time this organization has cast off a popular player in a questionable way. JR, Himes, Scheuler, and KW have handled a lot of situations in a questionable manner. Even though Frank is known for not returning calls, so what? As the owner JR should have stepped and nipped this one quickly and not let this type of situation develop.

So if Frank wants to complain that it could have been handled differently AND the validity of paying a new player a ton of money with the same kind of health questions, I stand right next to him. He didn't say anything none of us are not thinking ourselves.

We should all acknowledge the honor and privilege of being able to witness such greatness. We may never see such a long term sustained effort again.

We should only be arguing about when his uniform gets retired, his biggest hit(s), best game(s), and what position he gets when he's ready for life after being the Best Player in White Sox History.
</IMG>



They gave him a chance to throw out the first ball, they let him have a prominent speaking role at the victory parade and they paid him millions over the past few years, even though he spent most of the time on the disabled list and we basically won the World Series without him. What else should they have done for him? Have a royal carriage pick him up each day at his house?

Frank acted like a baby when he said he wouldn't have thrown out the first ball or gone to the parade and thanked the fans if he knew wouldn't be back with the team. That proves right then and there that his motives for being at the parade were not genuine. He can rip the organization for not bringing him back, but he's basically dissing the fans by saying what he said about the parade. A parade is a time to accept the adulation from the fans and thank them for their support. Period.