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IronFisk
01-10-2006, 02:19 PM
Woooo hoooo!!! We're 23! This is one list you WANT to be at the bottom of! Nice crack by Capel about Red Cub fans.

Of course, guess who's #1? :redneck

Linky (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=caple/060110_mlb)

Fenway
01-10-2006, 02:27 PM
23. (tie) Chicago White Sox (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=chw)
You know what we admired about the White Sox during all those decades without a championship? Unlike Red Sox fans, they had the decency to keep their suffering to themselves.


The White Sox fans never had the New York media throwing their history back at them 24/7 365 either.

True Red Sox fans did suffer in silence, but the media ran with the Bambino crap. A true Red Sox fan knows what the real "curse" was. The Curse of Jackie Robinson and Willie Mays. Put it this way. The Red Sox tore up Willie Mays contract because they had signed Jimmy Piersall.

DumpJerry
01-10-2006, 02:28 PM
You know what we admired about the White Sox during all those decades without a championship? Unlike Red Sox fans, they had the decency to keep their suffering to themselves.
That pretty much sums it up!:D:

Iwritecode
01-10-2006, 02:48 PM
The White Sox fans never had the New York media throwing their history back at them 24/7 365 either.

Try being taunted by the fans (and media) of a team that has won even less than your team yet still remains the #1 draw in town...


True Red Sox fans did suffer in silence, but the media ran with the Bambino crap. A true Red Sox fan knows what the real "curse" was. The Curse of Jackie Robinson and Willie Mays. Put it this way. The Red Sox tore up Willie Mays contract because they had signed Jimmy Piersall.

Curses. :rolleyes:

Iwritecode
01-10-2006, 02:55 PM
Oh, why couldn't McCovey have hit his line drive a couple feet higher?

There's an old Peanuts strip that mentions this hit. I never understood it until just a few years ago.

25. (tie) Boston Red Sox
Enough already! We get it! You won. Now, can we have a moment of peace? Sheesh, you guys are practically as bad as Yankees fans now.

1. Chicago Cubs
The only thing keeping them out of the top spot in our first ranking was a lot of beer

Great quotes. :D:

I also like the tribute to the story/movie Misery in the cartoon. Kathy Bates played that part well.

IlliniSox
01-10-2006, 02:57 PM
23. (tie) Chicago White Sox (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=chw)
You know what we admired about the White Sox during all those decades without a championship? Unlike Red Sox fans, they had the decency to keep their suffering to themselves.

I like that line.

Dan Mega
01-10-2006, 03:05 PM
The White Sox fans never had the New York media throwing their history back at them 24/7 365 either.


And the Red Sox never had to share a city with another team. No amount of media from another city, another state even, can even begin to compare.

TheOldRoman
01-10-2006, 03:17 PM
And the Red Sox never had to share a city with another team. No amount of media from another city, another state even, can even begin to compare.
Boston Braves?

Fenway
01-10-2006, 03:27 PM
And the Red Sox never had to share a city with another team. No amount of media from another city, another state even, can even begin to compare.

I never could figure out why Cubs fans acted so smug towards the White Sox.

but it is pretty easy to trace where it began. The day Harry quit the Sox and 15 minutes later was hired by the Trib. Until then I think both sides pretty much ignored the other.

Bo Knows
01-10-2006, 03:28 PM
I love this because it shows how red sox fans did nothing but whine about the misery over the years. In fact after they won, they talked more about 1918 then they did about 2004.

Uncle_Patrick
01-10-2006, 03:35 PM
25. (tie) Boston Red Sox (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=bos)
Enough already! We get it! You won. Now, can we have a moment of peace? Sheesh, you guys are practically as bad as Yankees fans now.


:D:

Fred Manrique
01-10-2006, 04:06 PM
I liked that feature, it was funny, somewhat accurate and it's great not being one of the top three most suffering teams anymore!!!!

Fenway
01-10-2006, 04:11 PM
25. (tie) Boston Red Sox (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=bos)
Sheesh, you guys are practically as bad as Yankees fans now.

Excuse me we can read and write and we bathe regularly :tongue:

Palehose13
01-10-2006, 04:14 PM
Excuse me we can read and write and we bathe regularly :tongue:

Methinks someone is getting you for this one. :cool:

TomBradley72
01-10-2006, 04:16 PM
The exposure of the fallacy of all things Cubbie continues....if the beloved north siders are wallowing around .500 in mid summer....should be very interesting to see what the climate at Wrigley is like...

skobabe8
01-10-2006, 04:25 PM
I'm gonna hijack here...

Does anyone have access to ESPN Insider? I'd really like to read Jim Caple's article about "Comiskeyville" in his archives. Thanks!

:smile:

NonetheLoaiza
01-10-2006, 07:54 PM
True Red Sox fans did suffer in silence, but the media ran with the Bambino crap. A true Red Sox fan knows what the real "curse" was..

Hah. Curses.

Great line, though. Very true. Compelling and rich.

1951Campbell
01-10-2006, 10:26 PM
....should be very interesting to see what the climate at Wrigley is like...

The long years of losing, the copius amounts of beer, knowing that the Sox just won it all last year...there's gonna be one of those "incidents" that gets replayed every five minutes on ESPN for two weeks this year.

PKalltheway
01-11-2006, 12:51 AM
30. New York Yankees (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/clubhouse?team=nyy)
You've got to be kidding, right?

Well...I know they have won 26 World Titles, but it's awful hard to shake off the fact that they are the only team in baseball history to blow a 3-0 lead in the playoffs. That would make even the Cubs blush. To make it worse, the Yankees won game 3 in Boston 19-8. After a win like that, the series is supposed to be over and the Red Sox are supposed to be a dead team walking. That wasn't the case though.

dcb56
01-11-2006, 10:34 AM
Woooo hoooo!!! We're 23! This is one list you WANT to be at the bottom of! Nice crack by Stark about Red Cub fans.

Of course, guess who's #1? :redneck

Linky (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=caple/060110_mlb)

Caple ripped Boston fans again in his NFL Misery Index:

31. New England Patriots (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=nwe)
Hopefully with nine NBA titles, three Super Bowl titles, three Stanley Cup championships and now a World Series within the lifetimes of most New Englanders, Boston fans will finally quit plaguing us with their "No One Has Ever Suffered Like Us" bull.
Hey guys. Tell it to Cleveland.

Good stuff!

DenverSock
01-11-2006, 10:51 AM
Excuse me we can read and write and we bathe regularly :tongue:

It's nice you can, please start soon. :D::D:



I never could figure out why Cubs fans acted so smug towards the White Sox.

but it is pretty easy to trace where it began. The day Harry quit the Sox and 15 minutes later was hired by the Trib. Until then I think both sides pretty much ignored the other.

You obviously did not follow the Sox when Harry Caray worked for them. Flubs fans were smug back then too. It just got worse and spread nationally after the Superstation was on cable.

GoSox2K3
01-11-2006, 11:22 AM
Yeah, I remember when Cub fans looked down on Harry as a drunken fool who perfectly reflected the classless Sox fan base. They had Jack Brickhouse who they said outclassed Harry Caray. Then Brickhouse retired, the Cubs hired Harry and two years later Brickhouse was totally forgotten by Cub fans and Cub fans acted like Harry had always been their announcer.

DenverSock
01-11-2006, 11:46 AM
Yeah, I remember when Cub fans looked down on Harry as a drunken fool who perfectly reflected the classless Sox fan base. They had Jack Brickhouse who they said outclassed Harry Caray. Then Brickhouse retired, the Cubs hired Harry and two years later Brickhouse was totally forgotten by Cub fans and Cub fans acted like Harry had always been their announcer.



I'll always remember Brickhouse announcing for the Cubs on WGN when I first arrived in Chicago. It went like this:

A ball. A Strike. Pops up, caught by the third baseman, next batter. A ball. A strike. Another strike. Grounds out to the shortstop. Two out. Next Batter. A ball. ................... And so on and so on.

It was so boring you might have been watching golf. Some people on these boards will disagree with me and maybe prior to my being in Chicago he was a good announcer but I never saw any evidence of it.

Fenway
01-11-2006, 11:50 AM
It's nice you can, please start soon. :D::D:





You obviously did not follow the Sox when Harry Caray worked for them. Flubs fans were smug back then too. It just got worse and spread nationally after the Superstation was on cable.

I seem to recall many afternoons in the 70's when Wrigley would be lucky to have 3,000 unemployed people sitting in the stands.

Fenway
01-11-2006, 12:10 PM
31. New England Patriots (http://sports-att.espn.go.com/nfl/clubhouse?team=nwe)
Hopefully with nine NBA titles, three Super Bowl titles, three Stanley Cup championships and now a World Series within the lifetimes of most New Englanders, Boston fans will finally quit plaguing us with their "No One Has Ever Suffered Like Us" bull.

Caple at least should get the numbers right

THREE STANLEY CUPS? Well we had 1972, 1970 and then 1941

NINE NBA titles? try 16 since 1957

But he a point. The fans that have suffered the most can be found in Philadelphia, not only do they not win championships, they have to live there as well.

DenverSock
01-11-2006, 12:18 PM
I seem to recall many afternoons in the 70's when Wrigley would be lucky to have 3,000 unemployed people sitting in the stands.
I'm sure that's true but so what? In the early '70's Baseball attendance was down nationwide. The Cubs only had day games, a lot of their attendance were school kids who'd show up in summer only and prior to school's out in the spring Cubs attendance would be sparse. Suburban Parents wouldn't let their kids go to day games except in groups during the summer. Some of the Chicagoans who went to U of C were allowed to go to Cubs games and not the Sox because of the neighborhoods the El traversed on the way to the two stadia. This included guys I knew who grew up in southern and southwestern suburbs. When the City Council debated allowing lights at Wrigley Field they discussed this in detail. Much was made of the belief that Mothers would never let their kids go alone at night when they did during the day.

Nevertheless, they consistently outdrew the Sox in those days. I remember going to day Sox games in the spring with attendance under 1,000 and being given free tickets to games when Bill Veeck was embarrassed by his teams' play.

The Cubs for a while tried starting their games at 3:00 PM in order to get the commodities traders out for games.


Sometimes, late in the season when the Cubs were out of it, attendance would drop off.

Yet given all of this, the Cubs were on Channel 9, the Sox were on 32. Clearly Chicago had identified with the Cubs more. Sox were more a team representing the South Side. Sox fans always resented this. Still do. I did and do.

SOXintheBURGH
01-11-2006, 12:23 PM
I seem to recall many afternoons in the 70's when Wrigley would be lucky to have 3,000 unemployed people sitting in the stands.

http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/pics/lee_elia_autograph.jpg

"Ya don't say?"

Fenway
01-11-2006, 12:47 PM
Boston fans will finally quit plaguing us with their "No One Has Ever Suffered Like Us" bull

Rick Patino used to call Boston "The Fellowship of the Miserable" because we tended to whine about things especially on talk radio WEEI.

I am embarrassed to even point this out but as silly as the WIP Philadelphia "Wing Bowl" is WEEI has sunk to a new low in 2006 and they actually expect this event to sell out :o:




2006 Whiney Awards (http://www.weei.com/goout.asp?u=http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/01003C23A146CCBE)

http://images.radcity.net/3152/1268595.jpg (http://www.ticketmaster.com/event/01003C23A146CCBE)
2006 Whiney Awards

TD Banknorth Garden (formerly Fleetcenter) (javascript:gener_seatven('http://www.ticketmaster.com/venueinfo/8337/','eventd')), Boston, MA
Tue, Feb 28, 2006 07:00 PM
WEEI's Glenn Ordway and The Big Show crew will recognize the top whiners from 2005 in the biggest Whiney Awards yet. The Whineys feature the best "whines" recorded on The Big Show's Whiner Line. The Whiner Line, which airs every weekday between 5:45pm and 6pm, is the highest rated 15 minutes of radio on WEEI. Callers use the Whiner Line to vent about Boston's sports teams, athletes, personalities, current events, and more. The Whiney nominees will be honored for their creativity and wit among Boston sports celebrities and of course all your favorite WEEI personalities.

General Admittance tickets are $40. VIP tickets are $250 per ticket, which include a VIP floor seat for the show, admittance to a VIP cocktail reception and dinner at the Legends Club from 5-7pm where you can watch the Big Show live broadcast, and a complimentary copy of the 2005 Best of the Whiner Line CD! A portion of the proceeds from the Whineys will benefit the Boston Bruins Foundation and the Boston Celtics Shamrock Foundation.

[/URL]
That said the "Whiner Line" is often the funniest thing on radio in this market
[URL="http://eod.liquidviewer.com/weei-od/whinerline_0110.wma"]Whiner Line - January 10th (http://eod.liquidviewer.com/weei-od/whinerline_0110.wma)

johnr1note
01-11-2006, 01:22 PM
I'm sure that's true but so what? In the early '70's Baseball attendance was down nationwide. The Cubs only had day games, a lot of their attendance were school kids who'd show up in summer only and prior to school's out in the spring Cubs attendance would be sparse. Suburban Parents wouldn't let their kids go to day games except in groups during the summer. Some of the Chicagoans who went to U of C were allowed to go to Cubs games and not the Sox because of the neighborhoods the El traversed on the way to the two stadia. This included guys I knew who grew up in southern and southwestern suburbs. When the City Council debated allowing lights at Wrigley Field they discussed this in detail. Much was made of the belief that Mothers would never let their kids go alone at night when they did during the day.

Nevertheless, they consistently outdrew the Sox in those days. I remember going to day Sox games in the spring with attendance under 1,000 and being given free tickets to games when Bill Veeck was embarrassed by his teams' play.

The Cubs for a while tried starting their games at 3:00 PM in order to get the commodities traders out for games.


Sometimes, late in the season when the Cubs were out of it, attendance would drop off.

Yet given all of this, the Cubs were on Channel 9, the Sox were on 32. Clearly Chicago had identified with the Cubs more. Sox were more a team representing the South Side. Sox fans always resented this. Still do. I did and do.

The bolded section of the quote above is a bit of a myth. When the Cubs were in contention in the early 70s, and the Sox had really crappy teams, the Cubs drew more fans. When the Sox had better teams a few years later, and then again, in the 80s, the Sox outdrew them. In the other years, when both teams sucked, the Cubs generally outdrew the Sox, but the amount was usually just a few thousand more. You can look it up. Generally speaking, attendance was a wash betweent he two clubs in the 70s and 80s, unless one of them was in contention.

IronFisk
01-11-2006, 01:24 PM
The fans that have suffered the most can be found in Philadelphia, not only do they not win championships, they have to live there as well.

Nope. It's Cleveland - hands down. The city has not won ANY championships since 1948. OUCH! In Philly, the Eagles won titles in the 50's and 60's, and at least made Super Bowls in 1980 & 2005 . Their Flyers won back-to-back Cups in 1974 and 75. Their Phillies won in 1980 . Their Sixers won in 1983. ALL done since Cleveland won ANYTHING...OUCH!!!

That my friend, is one SORRY city! But is this sympathy? HELL NO! Too many bad memories of their "fans" showing up in bushels at Comiskey in the late 90's, acting like they owned the joint (well, their team DID own us).

Oh yeah, this too...

:wh1tesox00

DenverSock
01-11-2006, 01:40 PM
The bolded section of the quote above is a bit of a myth. When the Cubs were in contention in the early 70s, and the Sox had really crappy teams, the Cubs drew more fans. When the Sox had better teams a few years later, and then again, in the 80s, the Sox outdrew them. In the other years, when both teams sucked, the Cubs generally outdrew the Sox, but the amount was usually just a few thousand more. You can look it up. Generally speaking, attendance was a wash betweent he two clubs in the 70s and 80s, unless one of them was in contention.

I'll grant you that the preference for the Cubs was somewhat more muted then, than it was later. But, as you pointed out what mattered was who was in contention. All teams pull more at the gate when they're winning. When both teams were bad the Cubs outdrew as you yourself pointed out.

I wasn't in Chicago for the '83 season, but I assume that he Sox outdrew the Cubs that year.

In addition, prior to my arrival in Chicago for school, I'd have to say that the national baseball audience considered Chicago's team to be the Cubs. It was an unfair impression, but it was the case back then.

DenverSock
01-11-2006, 01:42 PM
Nope. It's Cleveland - hands down. The city has not won ANY championships since 1948. OUCH! In Philly, the Eagles won titles in the 50's and 60's, and at least made Super Bowls in 1980 & 2005 . Their Flyers won back-to-back Cups in 1974 and 75. Their Phillies won in 1980 . Their Sixers won in 1983. ALL done since Cleveland won ANYTHING...OUCH!!!

That my friend, is one SORRY city! But is this sympathy? HELL NO! Too many bad memories of their "fans" showing up in bushels at Comiskey in the late 90's, acting like they owned the joint (well, their team DID own us).

Oh yeah, this too...

:wh1tesox00

It's also ugly, dirty, and broken down.

SoxSpeed22
01-11-2006, 01:43 PM
Nope. It's Cleveland - hands down. The city has not won ANY championships since 1948. OUCH! In Philly, the Eagles won titles in the 50's and 60's, and at least made Super Bowls in 1980 & 2005 . Their Flyers won back-to-back Cups in 1974 and 75. Their Phillies won in 1980 . Their Sixers won in 1983. ALL done since Cleveland won ANYTHING...OUCH!!!

That my friend, is one SORRY city! But is this sympathy? HELL NO! Too many bad memories of their "fans" showing up in bushels at Comiskey in the late 90's, acting like they owned the joint (well, their team DID own us).

Oh yeah, this too...

:wh1tesox00Cleveland's last title was when the Browns won the NFL Championship in 1964. And who could forget
http://www.jandlsinballard.com/mesagame2.jpg

TommyJohn
01-11-2006, 02:25 PM
Nope. It's Cleveland - hands down. The city has not won ANY championships since 1948. OUCH! In Philly, the Eagles won titles in the 50's and 60's, and at least made Super Bowls in 1980 & 2005 . Their Flyers won back-to-back Cups in 1974 and 75. Their Phillies won in 1980 . Their Sixers won in 1983. ALL done since Cleveland won ANYTHING...OUCH!!!

That my friend, is one SORRY city! But is this sympathy? HELL NO! Too many bad memories of their "fans" showing up in bushels at Comiskey in the late 90's, acting like they owned the joint (well, their team DID own us).

Oh yeah, this too...

:wh1tesox00

Actually, the Browns did quite well for a while. Cleveland's last title
actually came in 1964, when the Browns won the NFL title.

IronFisk
01-11-2006, 02:29 PM
Actually, the Browns did quite well for a while. Cleveland's last title
actually came in 1964, when the Browns won the NFL title.

Yes, missed that one. I repeat - ONE. Still, since 1964 - not much of an improvement, eh?

To be honest, probably two - since Ohio State is really "Ohio's team".

johnr1note
01-11-2006, 04:21 PM
I'll grant you that the preference for the Cubs was somewhat more muted then, than it was later. But, as you pointed out what mattered was who was in contention. All teams pull more at the gate when they're winning. When both teams were bad the Cubs outdrew as you yourself pointed out.

I wasn't in Chicago for the '83 season, but I assume that he Sox outdrew the Cubs that year.

In addition, prior to my arrival in Chicago for school, I'd have to say that the national baseball audience considered Chicago's team to be the Cubs. It was an unfair impression, but it was the case back then.

Again, when I say the Cubs outdrew the Sox during those days, it wasn't like Wrigley Field was packed and there was no one at Old Comiskey. The raw data shows that for the 10 year period from 1969 to 1979, the Cubs outdrew the Sox by the grand total of 1.06 million fans. On a percentage basis, that's 8% more. (the Sox drew 12.7 million, the Cubs 13.7 million). For the 80s, the Cubs dre 19.4 million, the Sox 17.3 -- a difference of about 11%. To make a note, Harry crossed over from the southside in about 82 or 83, so the marketing strategy of "Wrigley Shrine" plus Harry on the superstation started to pay off. From 1990 to the present, the difference has grown to a staggering 27%. But the attendance in both parks is exponentially higher in the last 10 years than in the previous 20.

I just bring this out to say that the concept of Chicago being a "hands down" Cubs town is a very recent phenomenon.

russ99
01-11-2006, 04:35 PM
http://www.baseball-almanac.com/players/pics/lee_elia_autograph.jpg

"Ya don't say?"

:D:

That's still my favorite baseball related sound clip ever! (Ed Lynch's "Without you I don't have a job?!?!" is a close second)

---

"They %&#* don't even work. That's why they're out at the %&#* game. They oughta go out and get a %&#* job and find out what it's like to go out and earn a %&#* living. Eighty-five percent of the %&#*' world is working. The other fifteen percent come out here."

DenverSock
01-12-2006, 12:35 PM
Again, when I say the Cubs outdrew the Sox during those days, it wasn't like Wrigley Field was packed and there was no one at Old Comiskey. The raw data shows that for the 10 year period from 1969 to 1979, the Cubs outdrew the Sox by the grand total of 1.06 million fans. On a percentage basis, that's 8% more. (the Sox drew 12.7 million, the Cubs 13.7 million). For the 80s, the Cubs dre 19.4 million, the Sox 17.3 -- a difference of about 11%. To make a note, Harry crossed over from the southside in about 82 or 83, so the marketing strategy of "Wrigley Shrine" plus Harry on the superstation started to pay off. From 1990 to the present, the difference has grown to a staggering 27%. But the attendance in both parks is exponentially higher in the last 10 years than in the previous 20.

I just bring this out to say that the concept of Chicago being a "hands down" Cubs town is a very recent phenomenon.

We are discussing nuances here. In addition to attendance you need to take into account TV viewership, general fan affiliation, radio listenership, etc. Don't forget that at the time the Cubs were on WGN Channel 9, Chicago's flagship local station. The Sox were on Channel 32, a minor UHF station, with the call letters IIRC WFLD. They were not on as often, their station didn't reach as far so fans in the suburbs often didn't get their games at all.

The Cubs had every game televised. It was not like today when you can pretty much follow whatever sport interests you. Few people had cable and they tended to be rural. (Cable was first installed in places which did not warrant broadcast due to market or topographical conditions, usually in small town in the Mountain West.) The Cubs simply were followed more closely by more Chicagoans.

Nationally, what counted was the "Game of the Week" broadcast on NBC every Saturday. At first there really was only one game of the week. Only football showcased different games regionally, baseball only did later. I saw the Cubs several times in those years, usually against the Cards. I don't believe I ever saw the Sox on the "Game of the Week" . I watched every Saturday quite religously for a period of many years. If you asked the casual fan outside of Chicago to name Chicago's baseball team, I'm sure 80% (at least) would have named the Cubs. Of course serious baseball fans would have been aware of the Sox. But to most fans the "Sox" would have meant only Boston. It's not unusual for outside perceptions to be different from inside. If you rely only on attendance figures you would be misled.

miker
02-08-2006, 06:29 PM
Wow! Now Cub fans can put their #1 Misery Rating next to their Attendance Trophy!

soxinem1
02-08-2006, 06:46 PM
Woooo hoooo!!! We're 23! This is one list you WANT to be at the bottom of! Nice crack by Capel about Red Cub fans.

Of course, guess who's #1? :redneck

Linky (http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/page2/story?page=caple/060110_mlb)

We'll have to take the hint of the link. If a Roosevelt was President when the cub were both in/won a World Series, then there is only one thing to do:

NEVER ELECT A ROOSEVELT AGAIN!!!!!!:tongue:

Hopefully, Roosevelt Brown will never run for the top spot.

Dick Allen
02-08-2006, 06:57 PM
I'll always remember Brickhouse announcing for the Cubs on WGN when I first arrived in Chicago. It went like this:

A ball. A Strike. Pops up, caught by the third baseman, next batter. A ball. A strike. Another strike. Grounds out to the shortstop. Two out. Next Batter. A ball. ................... And so on and so on.

It was so boring you might have been watching golf. Some people on these boards will disagree with me and maybe prior to my being in Chicago he was a good announcer but I never saw any evidence of it.No, Brickhouse spent most of his time telling stories, many of which had nothing to do with baseball. But he was a big part of my childhood memories of baseball when he did both Sox and Cubs games.

Realist
02-08-2006, 08:32 PM
We'll have to take the hint of the link. If a Roosevelt was President when the cub were both in/won a World Series, then there is only one thing to do:

NEVER ELECT A ROOSEVELT AGAIN!!!!!!:tongue:

Hopefully, Roosevelt Brown will never run for the top spot.

Sorry, but if Roosevelt Franklin is running, he's getting my vote.

http://www.muppetcentral.com/_images/sesame/roosevelt_franklin.jpg

soxinem1
02-08-2006, 08:49 PM
Sorry, but if Roosevelt Franklin is running, he's getting my vote.

http://www.muppetcentral.com/_images/sesame/roosevelt_franklin.jpg

http://images.google.com/images?q=tbn:XuqaXELjOha_QM:www.muppetcentral.com/_images/sesame/roosevelt_franklin.jpg (http://images.google.com/imgres?imgurl=http://www.muppetcentral.com/_images/sesame/roosevelt_franklin.jpg&imgrefurl=http://www.muppetcentral.com/news/2002/080602.shtml&h=300&w=175&sz=13&tbnid=XuqaXELjOha_QM:&tbnh=111&tbnw=64&hl=en&start=1&prev=/images%3Fq%3DRoosevelt%2BFranklin%26svnum%3D10%26h l%3Den%26lr%3D%26rls%3DGGLG,GGLG:2005-46,GGLG:en%26sa%3DN)

'Give me your losers. Give me your championless'...... The only thing we have to fear is, beer itself!'

TDog
02-09-2006, 11:42 AM
I never could figure out why Cubs fans acted so smug towards the White Sox.

but it is pretty easy to trace where it began. The day Harry quit the Sox and 15 minutes later was hired by the Trib. Until then I think both sides pretty much ignored the other.

That's not true. Sox fans were persecuted by smug Cubs fans in the late '60s. I was one of them. In the early '70s, Cubs fans openly hated Harry Caray, who became the most hated symbol of the Sox. Many Cubs fans protested their team hiring him.

But with Harry Caray's Cubs contract, he agreed to become a company stooge. That made all the difference.

What stepped up the Cubs-Sox fan conflict was the Cubs winning the division in 1984, when the team became fashionable and drew 2 million for the first time, in the same year that the Sox drew 2 million for the second time.

That and the Tribune's acquisition of the Cubs not long before.

TommyJohn
02-09-2006, 12:29 PM
That's not true. Sox fans were persecuted by smug Cubs fans in the late '60s. I was one of them. In the early '70s, Cubs fans openly hated Harry Caray, who became the most hated symbol of the Sox. Many Cubs fans protested their team hiring him.

But with Harry Caray's Cubs contract, he agreed to become a company stooge. That made all the difference.

What stepped up the Cubs-Sox fan conflict was the Cubs winning the division in 1984, when the team became fashionable and drew 2 million for the first time, in the same year that the Sox drew 2 million for the second time.

That and the Tribune's acquisition of the Cubs not long before.

Rick Schwab, in his book "Stuck On the Cubs," which was written in the
'70's, devoted a chapter to his hatred of Harry Caray, saying that dumb
Sox fans didn't realize that "Harry is as much a man of the people as
Machiavelli was."

I also remember that Cub fans very slowly warmed up to the 7th inning
stretch rendition of Take Me Out to the Ballgame. It was considered
clownish and lowbrow, part of the overall circus atmosphere of Comiskey
Park. It wasn't until 1984 that fans started getting into it and idiots like
Boob Costas started bleating that it was part of what baseball was all
about.