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Whitesox4ever
12-31-2005, 06:55 AM
from mlbtraderumors.com
the player the Sox are considering for Contreras is Willy Taveras. The additional prospects are unknown. Given the massive salary gap between Jose Contreras and Taveras, this deal would free up cash to be used for reinforcements at the trading deadline. As mentioned before, the White Sox are willing to go up to a $105MM payroll.

nodiggity59
12-31-2005, 07:46 AM
If we trade w/ Houston, Tavares (sp) is a must (unless they ahve uber prospects I don't know about). He'd be a perfect 34rd/4th outfielder and potential Pods replacement down the line.

Whitesox4ever
12-31-2005, 07:49 AM
Willie would be a very nice pickup. and if somehow we can also get Dan Wheeler than I will love this move..

SOXSINCE'70
12-31-2005, 08:06 AM
At least the White Sox wouldn't have to worry
about getting Taveras out anymore. :D: :D:

beck72
12-31-2005, 08:07 AM
The sox do not need Willy Taveras. They have Anderson and Owens

Whitesox4ever
12-31-2005, 08:13 AM
the article also mentions that the Sox have no interest in Brad Lidge..

Tragg
12-31-2005, 08:31 AM
Taveras has no power and rarely walks, and unless he seriously improves his plate discipline, which is doubtful, he'll never be a sufficient offensive player to start in this league (much less replace Podesednik at lead-off). What's the point?

KyWhiSoxFan
12-31-2005, 09:26 AM
I can't see this trade at all. The net effect is Contreras and Anderson (he's out of the lineup) for Taveras. How could that possibly result in more wins?

TornLabrum
12-31-2005, 09:50 AM
Sometimes I think some of these guys just throw a bunch of names into a hat, pull them out, and write that there are "rumors" of trades involving them.

FarWestChicago
12-31-2005, 09:54 AM
Sometimes I think some of these guys just throw a bunch of names into a hat, pull them out, and write that there are "rumors" of trades involving them.If you think about it, it's not the worst strategy. You generate a lot of noise and you have built in plausible deniability, "I always said it was a rumor." :redneck

TornLabrum
12-31-2005, 10:05 AM
If you think about it, it's not the worst strategy. You generate a lot of noise and you have built in plausible deniability, "I always said it was a rumor." :redneck

If that's what they do, I can't wait for somebody to make a mistake and have two guys from the same team being traded for each other. :D:

samram
12-31-2005, 10:29 AM
Taveras has no power and rarely walks, and unless he seriously improves his plate discipline, which is doubtful, he'll never be a sufficient offensive player to start in this league (much less replace Podesednik at lead-off). What's the point?

I don't like this "trade" either, but how can you say Taveras will most likely never improve his plate discipline? He was a rookie. Is your contention that no one has improved their game after their first full season?

FarWestChicago
12-31-2005, 10:34 AM
If that's what they do, I can't wait for somebody to make a mistake and have two guys from the same team being traded for each other. :D:Ouch. That would mess up that plausible deniability thing. :D:

beck72
12-31-2005, 10:38 AM
I don't like this "trade" either, but how can you say Taveras will most likely never improve his plate discipline? He was a rookie. Is your contention that no one has improved their game after their first full season?
He didn't have much plate discipline in the minors either

Chitown Hitmen
12-31-2005, 10:40 AM
The sox do not need Willy Taveras. They have Anderson and Owens

Wow, we have two rookies who have never had a full season, and from what they have shown us in the major league level, Brian is an awful player, and Jerry Owens hasn't even played in a game in 2005. Willie did just really good in 2005, one of the best rookies in the NL. Willie will be a hell of alot better than Brian Anderson and Jerry Owens put together.

Crede_Fan
12-31-2005, 10:42 AM
Wow, we have two rookies who have never had a full season, and from what they have shown us in the major league level, Brian is an awful player,

:o:
Where did you get that from? Did you even watch him play?
:mad:

Chitown Hitmen
12-31-2005, 10:43 AM
:o:
Where did you get that from? Did you even watch him play?
:mad:

Yea he hit .176. But all I'm saying is Willie will be more valuable.

MeanFish
12-31-2005, 10:47 AM
He hit .176 in not a lot of at bats, as a rookie. That's happened to many, many players in history, and many of them have done just fine.

Robin Ventura went like 0-for-36 or something like that to start his major league career, and he worked out just fine.

Through his history in the minors, it has taken Anderson a little bit of time to adapt and grow into each level. There is no doubt in my mind that he will do that at the major league level also.

Chitown Hitmen
12-31-2005, 10:53 AM
He hit .176 in not a lot of at bats, as a rookie. That's happened to many, many players in history, and many of them have done just fine.

Robin Ventura went like 0-for-36 or something like that to start his major league career, and he worked out just fine.

Through his history in the minors, it has taken Anderson a little bit of time to adapt and grow into each level. There is no doubt in my mind that he will do that at the major league level also.

I know, but I said what he has shown us he has been awful. I'm not saying he is going to be an awful player in his career. It may be in about five years that BA will be an awful player, but I doubt it.

santo=dorf
12-31-2005, 11:18 AM
Wow, we have two rookies who have never had a full season, and from what they have shown us in the major league level, Brian is an awful player, and Jerry Owens hasn't even played in a game in 2005. Willie did just really good in 2005, one of the best rookies in the NL. Willie will be a hell of alot better than Brian Anderson and Jerry Owens put together.

Tell me what's so impressive about his .325 OBP and 100+ K's. The only thing the guy has going for him is that he's fast yet he only stol 34 bases in 45 attempts. BTW, Taveras hit .000 in hit first season. I can play with samples sizes too.

Chitown Hitmen
12-31-2005, 11:34 AM
Tell me what's so impressive about his .325 OBP and 100+ K's. The only thing the guy has going for him is that he's fast yet he only stol 34 bases in 45 attempts. BTW, Taveras hit .000 in hit first season. I can play with samples sizes too.
Yea.....but Willie Taveras is better than Brian. Also, Brian will probably have no bigger than a .310 OBP and have 100+ SO's also.

santo=dorf
12-31-2005, 11:40 AM
Yea.....but Willie Taveras is better than Brian. Also, Brian will probably have no bigger than a .310 OBP and have 100+ SO's also.
:cleo
"Don't quit your day job."

I dare you to post to Taveras' numbers outside of the juice box from last season and tell us how he would fit in with the Sox.

A. Cavatica
12-31-2005, 11:56 AM
If that's what they do, I can't wait for somebody to make a mistake and have two guys from the same team being traded for each other. :D:

Contreras to the White Sox for Vazquez!

The Dude
12-31-2005, 12:06 PM
Willie will be a hell of alot better than Brian Anderson and Jerry Owens put together.
Ok I'll be much nicer considering your age......... but this has got to be one of the worst analysis of players I've ever seen!

Chitown Hitmen
12-31-2005, 12:09 PM
Ok I'll be much nicer considering your age......... but this has got to be one of the worst assetments of players I've ever seen!

Oh, please don't hold back just because of my age lol. I guess I was crazy while saying that. But I think Willy will be a better player than Brian and Jerry. Maybe not put together......but.........YOU SAW NOTHING!!!

Ron Karkovice
12-31-2005, 12:18 PM
I wouldnt mind a trade for Tejada. But I think my problem is that I love seeing new sox players in uniform. I remember I was excited to see Roberto Alomar in sox pinstrimes, charles johnson, etc. So I need to get my priorities straight.:cool:

chisoxmike
12-31-2005, 12:33 PM
Sounds like some people have started the New Years drinking already.:gulp:

The Deacon
12-31-2005, 12:40 PM
We'd need alot more than Taveras for Contreras. I'm not a big fan of Taveras, I'd rather take my chances with our own rookies than with someone elses. As the offseason goes on, I'm looking forward to see what Brian Anderson can do, I have a feeling he is going to be excellent.

Wille Harris > Wille Taveras

jerrykrause4pres
12-31-2005, 01:04 PM
Chris De Luca of the Sun-Times was jsut on XM satellite radio talking about the Sox and the flubs, and he mentioned the same Contreras for Taveras trade. He said Taveras would be the perfect number two hitter that Ozzie wants. But De Luca is the same guy that said the Sox should trade for Luis Castillo earlier in he offseason, which I was mind-boggled at. And he also said during his little interview that Contreras makes about 8 million and Uribe makes about 2 million when talking about a possible Tejada deal...so in short this guy has no baseball knowledge, but somehow maintains his profession as being a "baseball insider" for the Sun-Times.

HotelWhiteSox
12-31-2005, 01:51 PM
:cleo
"Don't quit your day job."

I dare you to post to Taveras' numbers outside of the juice box from last season and tell us how he would fit in with the Sox.

Yeah, but the Cell aint a bad place to hit either. From watching the WS, the guy that impressed me the most was Taveras. I like Brian, but I wouldn't mind if they could get Taveras and some others, depending on if prospects or relievers would be any good

KRS1
12-31-2005, 02:08 PM
Yea.....but Willie Taveras is better than Brian. Also, Brian will probably have no bigger than a .310 OBP and have 100+ SO's also.

Where did you buy your crystal ball, the Alsip Swap meet? You have absolutely no credibility behind what you are saying, and probably dont like BA just because he isnt another speed-burner playing center. I mean yeah he really showed us nothing, his only claim to fame was taking a fenom deep twice in one game at the same time that noone else on our roster(let alone the majors) could touch his stuff. I dont use small sample sizes to show a player's potential but if thats what you want tot do then let have at it. BA showed me more in the few games he played last season than I was expecting from a guy who had ZERO major league AB's, like someone said Robin23 went 0-32 his first stint in the majors, now imagine if we had wrote him off and picked up someone else. This could be the absolute dumbest thing I have ever heard from a so-called Sox fan, please dont quite your day job.

santo=dorf
12-31-2005, 02:50 PM
Yeah, but the Cell aint a bad place to hit either. From watching the WS, the guy that impressed me the most was Taveras. I like Brian, but I wouldn't mind if they could get Taveras and some others, depending on if prospects or relievers would be any good

I don't get this argument at all. It always came up with Blalock, Konerko and other guys who padded their stats at a home ballpark.

It's true that USCF is a great place to hit, but if a guy absolutely sucks on the road, why would you want him knowing he plays like **** for 50% of the season? :?:

jerrykrause4pres
12-31-2005, 02:51 PM
The kid is only 12 years old, and even though he likes to express his opinions in a very illogical way, we have to remember his age. But check out the kids post per day rate. If he continues at this pace, he'll be on his way to a High Priest in no time.

MarySwiss
12-31-2005, 04:10 PM
The kid is only 12 years old, and even though he likes to express his opinions in a very illogical way, we have to remember his age. But check out the kids post per day rate. If he continues at this pace, he'll be on his way to a High Priest in no time.

Exactly! We need to cut him some slack. He's obviously WAYYYY more intelligent than the average 20-something Flubs fan. And look at his posts. Excellent grammar, punctuation, etc. Kid gets an "A" from me, and I'm a rough critic.

But listen up, Chitown Hitmen. The next time I catch you saying the "h" word, I'm going to go ahead and wash your mouth out with soap! :cool:

Daver
12-31-2005, 04:26 PM
This is the stupidest trade rumor of the offseason.

Chicken Dinner
12-31-2005, 04:29 PM
Didn't we just get rid of a Willie???

RallyBowl
12-31-2005, 04:39 PM
This is the stupidest trade rumor of the offseason.


Are you sure about that?

http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=63964

lumpyspun
12-31-2005, 05:05 PM
Anderson had 34 at bats and 2 homers. So if we are using that test sample then he is about 40 homers a year. Fact is, nobody really knows how this kid will turn out, but if ozzie and KW seem to think he is our starting CF then why can't people just give him a chance. I've said it once, and I'll say it again, I was at the M's game when he hit two homers off "King Felix". The guy will be fine in a full major league season....

I can't believe I just contributed (at least I like to think I contributed) to this awful thread.

buehrle4cy05
12-31-2005, 05:41 PM
Getting Taveras would allow us to move Tadahito down in the order, but I worry about him making consistent contact after Podsednik. He is going to have to become an extremely proficient bunter if he would fit in with the team...

Tragg
12-31-2005, 06:45 PM
I don't like this "trade" either, but how can you say Taveras will most likely never improve his plate discipline? He was a rookie. Is your contention that no one has improved their game after their first full season?
Yes - that is one area in which improvement is rare; and, face it, I love our manager, but a proponent of plate discipline he isn't, so he's not going to get much help there.

Tragg
12-31-2005, 06:47 PM
Yea.....but Willie Taveras is better than Brian. Also, Brian will probably have no bigger than a .310 OBP and have 100+ SO's also. And about 5 times as many home runs.
Even though I do find it hard to believe that Anderson won't out-offense Taveras, is Taveras Contreras better than Anderson?

SOXSINCE'70
01-01-2006, 02:17 AM
Chris De Luca of the Sun-Times was jsut on XM satellite radio talking about the Sox and the flubs, and he mentioned the same Contreras for Taveras trade. so in short this guy has no baseball knowledge, but somehow maintains his profession as being a "baseball insider" for the Sun-Times.

He fits the bill of journalistic blowhard perfectly.:D: :D:

(no teal required)

Chitown Hitmen
01-01-2006, 09:26 AM
And about 5 times as many home runs.
Even though I do find it hard to believe that Anderson won't out-offense Taveras, is Taveras Contreras better than Anderson?

Yea, 8 more homers is a real big difference. We don't need a home-run guy, we just need a guy who will come in every day, perform really good, and if you take away his HR count, SO's, and OBP, he did pretty good. I just am saying that IMO Willy will be a better player than Brian Anderson and Jerry Owens. I mean, atleast willy has had some experience.

ilsox7
01-01-2006, 09:35 AM
Yea, 8 more homers is a real big difference. We don't need a home-run guy, we just need a guy who will come in every day, perform really good, and if you take away his HR count, SO's, and OBP, he did pretty good. I just am saying that IMO Willy will be a better player than Brian Anderson and Jerry Owens. I mean, atleast willy has had some experience.

Willy hit 3 HR's last year. BA projects to hit 15-20 next year. Where you got 8, I have no idea.

Also, saying that you have to look past HR, K's, and OBP to see a player in a good light is not the best statement to make. Maybe Willy will be better than BA, but there is not much evidence that supports that, IMO.

Chitown Hitmen
01-01-2006, 09:46 AM
Willy hit 3 HR's last year. BA projects to hit 15-20 next year. Where you got 8, I have no idea.

Also, saying that you have to look past HR, K's, and OBP to see a player in a good light is not the best statement to make. Maybe Willy will be better than BA, but there is not much evidence that supports that, IMO.

Did you even read what I was replying to about HR's? I guess not. Tragg says that Brian will have about 5 times the HR's Willy will, and I thought he had 2 so I said 10, not 8, and plus I'm just using the info Traggs gave me. And why isn't it good to look past OBP, HR's, and SO's? Ok, I agree with OBP, that you really shouldn't look past that stat, but why not HR's and SO's? He could hit 0 HR's and be the best player out there. You are just saying that you need high HR's to do good, if we can't look past HR's. SO's are what usually make people bad, and thats the biggest thing you need to look past to see Willy is a real good player.

TornLabrum
01-01-2006, 09:57 AM
Did you even read what I was replying to about HR's? I guess not. Tragg says that Brian will have about 5 times the HR's Willy will, and I thought he had 2 so I said 10, not 8, and plus I'm just using the info Traggs gave me. And why isn't it good to look past OBP, HR's, and SO's? Ok, I agree with OBP, that you really shouldn't look past that stat, but why not HR's and SO's? He could hit 0 HR's and be the best player out there. You are just saying that you need high HR's to do good, if we can't look past HR's. SO's are what usually make people bad, and thats the biggest thing you need to look past to see Willy is a real good player.

Why isn't it a good thing to look beyond OBP, HR, and SO? Well, for one thing, it's like saying, "Aside from all of these things that make him a *****y player, he's really good!" Kind of like Mrs. Lincoln saying, "Other than my husband being murdered, the night went well."

soxinem1
01-01-2006, 10:03 AM
Chris De Luca of the Sun-Times was jsut on XM satellite radio talking about the Sox and the flubs, and he mentioned the same Contreras for Taveras trade. He said Taveras would be the perfect number two hitter that Ozzie wants. But De Luca is the same guy that said the Sox should trade for Luis Castillo earlier in he offseason, which I was mind-boggled at. And he also said during his little interview that Contreras makes about 8 million and Uribe makes about 2 million when talking about a possible Tejada deal...so in short this guy has no baseball knowledge, but somehow maintains his profession as being a "baseball insider" for the Sun-Times.

De Luca has made some boneheaded trade prposals, but he did do a nice pro-Sox article after the World Series that provoked the ire of many cub fans. He noted how Sox, Sox, Sox was everywhere, North, South, East, West and that the 'second team' insignia was in danger.

But we should all realize that rumors are rumors, and I doubt KW would pull the trigger on that one without a little more, like Chad Qualls or Dan Wheeler, involved just to consider it. Me, I'll save my analysis once a trade, if at all, is made.

Chitown Hitmen
01-01-2006, 10:55 AM
Why isn't it a good thing to look beyond OBP, HR, and SO? Well, for one thing, it's like saying, "Aside from all of these things that make him a *****y player, he's really good!" Kind of like Mrs. Lincoln saying, "Other than my husband being murdered, the night went well."

Well, for one thing, I never said it was a bad thing, so I don't know where you got that from...

CPditka
01-04-2006, 09:03 AM
Preston Wilson signed w/ the Stros... They now have too many OF's...hmm... let the speculation begin.