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View Full Version : Garland signs for 3/29 million


mikesouthside
12-28-2005, 11:57 AM
Sweet!!!!

twsoxfan5
12-28-2005, 11:57 AM
Per Espn 1000 Jon Garland has signed a 3 year 29 million dollar deal. I wonder who is going to be trade bait now.

buehrle4cy05
12-28-2005, 11:57 AM
Source?

Kogs35
12-28-2005, 11:58 AM
levine just said it on espn1000

Rocky Soprano
12-28-2005, 11:58 AM
Awesome!

Well it is Wednesday so we should of expected something!

DVsoxfan
12-28-2005, 11:59 AM
Wahoooooooooo

SoXPriDe33
12-28-2005, 11:59 AM
Yes!

Jaffar
12-28-2005, 11:59 AM
:supernana::supernana::supernana:WOO HOO!!!

Norberto7
12-28-2005, 12:01 PM
Obviously Jon fell down some stairs this morning and broke his right arm in three places.

Wow, that's pretty cheap, and not really expected. Kudos for pulling off this deal!

Brian26
12-28-2005, 12:02 PM
I'm absolutely stunned. This is unbelievable. 3 years for less than 10 million a year.

The pessimist in me, or maybe the realist, still thinks that a trade may be looming. This has to be the highest budget the Sox have ever had.

Jjav829
12-28-2005, 12:02 PM
Wow! Well, this really complicates things. It seemed like it was going to be Garland that was traded to move McCarthy into the rotation. Now what? Does Kenny trade Contreras? Do we actually keep McCarthy in the pen?

Good signing, I guess. It's a bit more than I would have liked, but when you have A.J. Burnett signing for what he signed for, that kind of sets the bar high for a guy like Garland.

Very interesting...

dakuda
12-28-2005, 12:04 PM
This kind of changes the dynamic a little bit. I had pretty much resigned myself to Garland being gone by the AS break next year....

josh152535
12-28-2005, 12:05 PM
$7M Year One
$10M Year Two
$12M Year Three

Brian26
12-28-2005, 12:05 PM
$7M Year One
$10M Year Two
$12M Year Three

Unbelievable is all I can say.

SoxFan78
12-28-2005, 12:06 PM
Didnt see that one coming...now who do we get rid of? I really dont want to see Contreas go.

Norberto7
12-28-2005, 12:06 PM
Well, if Garland still is to be traded, I guess this ups his value exponentially, right? Now instead of just a potential one year rental, he's signed cheap (for the market) for three. I'd guess he'd know something if there's a sign and trade in the works.

Either keeping or trading him, this looks like a good move.

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
When do we start the Contreras Appreciation threads?

Great NEWS! Awesome YOUNG STAFF! We'll be SCARRY for years to come!:bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance:

lumpyspun
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
I say keep all of the starters for now in case (god forbid) something happens to one of them during spring training or the WBC.

I guess the real Jon Garland stood up!

twsoxfan5
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
[quote=Brian26]I'm absolutely stunned. This is unbelievable. 3 years for less than 10 million a year.

The pessimist in me, or maybe the realist, still thinks that a trade may be looming. This has to be the highest budget the Sox have ever had.[/quote

Per Bruce Levine apparently the Sox are already over budget. As of last week it was reported that they were around 95-100 million and that was before this Garland signing.

monkeypants
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
Fantastic move!

spiffie
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
Let the Jose Contreras trade speculation begin!

Contreras/Vazquez for Tejada/Bedard?

IUPeterman
12-28-2005, 12:07 PM
Way to go, Jon. I am very happy for him. Thanks for re-upping with the good guys!

Having said that, who else is waiting for the other shoe to drop with the pitching staff? So many people speculated Jon being trade bait. Does this deal send McCarthy to the pen? Is this the beginning of a sign and trade? I just can't see us having 6 starters.

I'll just wait and see.

Go Sox!

JGarlandrules20
12-28-2005, 12:08 PM
I'm sooo happy! Pretty solid deal, too. :D:

White Sox Wednesday? :?:

Black Sox
12-28-2005, 12:09 PM
I'm really happy to hear about this signing for one reason, the Sox are showing they are not cheap. Reinsdorf also gets the short term deal he loves to give his pitchers. Seems to workout for both sides.

Jjav829
12-28-2005, 12:11 PM
Didnt see that one coming...now who do we get rid of? I really dont want to see Contreas go.

If one of the pitchers goes, I would have to think it would be Contreras. He only has one year remaining and is at least 34 years old. Coming off the 2nd half and postseason that he had, his stock will never be higher than it is right now.

I can't wait for next Wednesday to find out where Contreras goes. :D:

IggyD
12-28-2005, 12:11 PM
This just goes to prove how players are not all about the money. How they can be dedicated to a City/Team. That is the 3rd person to take less than the market would bear.

Props to Jon, Paulie and A.J.

I am so proud to have a group of guys like this!!! I feel like :whiner:

Mohoney
12-28-2005, 12:11 PM
This signing is the icing on the cake. KW has officially given the rest of the AL Central a swirlie this offseason.

Thank you, JR, for letting the best GM in the business go for the jugular.

mweflen
12-28-2005, 12:12 PM
Awesome YOUNG STAFF! We'll be SCARRY for years to come!

I hope that scar tissue doesn't affect performance...:tongue:

If we're set on keeping Garland, we ought to trade Contreras. DEspite his second half, he's only ever been incosistent, and he's OLD. WE should unload him now at the peak of his value and restock the system or something.

TDog
12-28-2005, 12:12 PM
This kind of changes the dynamic a little bit. I had pretty much resigned myself to Garland being gone by the AS break next year....

Or maybe you'll have to readjust your thinking of the way the White Sox do business. I hope that's the case anyway.

I would much rather see the Sox increase their payroll through astute trades and re-signing their own quality players (unless they the quality is an illusion as was the case with Julio Cruz) than to see them sign overpriced free agents.

I hope the Sox trade none of their pitching. I believe they're going to need it.

Uncle_Patrick
12-28-2005, 12:12 PM
Just heard about this on the Score. Awesome!

:supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana:

Hitmen77
12-28-2005, 12:13 PM
Damn! I was looking forward to hearing more crazy Garland trade scenarios on WSI throughtout the winter!!

Whitesox029
12-28-2005, 12:14 PM
:hawk
You can PUT IT ON THE BOARD
YYYYYYES!

I am SO relieved right now.

jshanahanjr
12-28-2005, 12:15 PM
Way to go Jon & Mr. Reinsdorf! The Sox are first class!

RoobarbPie
12-28-2005, 12:15 PM
Would anyone be upset with Contreras for two of Baltimores good prospects like Penn and Loewen and maybe another mid-level prospect? It sounds like Bedard might be hard to get from Baltimore.

Also, might Angelos remember the spanking that Contreras gave the O's when they went to Cuba more than some of the outings that he had with NYY? I hope so...


Personally, I wouldn't mind seeing all 6 starters come to ST as insurance for the WBC or one pitcher going down early. You can never have too much pitching.

Hitmen77
12-28-2005, 12:16 PM
Per Bruce Levine apparently the Sox are already over budget. As of last week it was reported that they were around 95-100 million and that was before this Garland signing.

How does Bruce figure? Someone has been posting a Sox salary chart here on WSI which I believe showed the Sox at 88 million - and that was with an assumption that JG would get 6 mil in arbitration. Now he's getting 7 mil for 2006. That still sounds like under 90 million to me.

ChiSoxPatF
12-28-2005, 12:19 PM
I've been saying Jon should make this deal for the last few weeks. Its perfect for both him AND the Sox. The Sox get to keep Garland for 3 more years and get a little more out of their investment all these years. Garland gets some security - $29 mil - and this is in case, God forbid, something happens to him this year and he never gets to cash in big. Plus now he is optimizing his free agent value by becoming a free agent when he is 29. Its a win-win as I see it.

I'm starting to believe what Kenny has been saying the last few weeks - maybe he actually IS going into this season with 6 starters! Maybe he wants some reassurance with that damn World Baseball Classic that could injury/wear out Buehrle, Garcia, and Vazquez.

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:19 PM
This also shows how "under the radar" the Sox still are... I hadn't heard anything other than Garland being out the door until this... If they can keep this under raps for this long from the great Levine I can't imagine what else is or isn't going on behind that Magic Curtain that Kenny is sitting behind!

daveeym
12-28-2005, 12:20 PM
I'm absolutely stunned. This is unbelievable. 3 years for less than 10 million a year.

The pessimist in me, or maybe the realist, still thinks that a trade may be looming. This has to be the highest budget the Sox have ever had. So basically it's the 7 mil assumed arb award and 22 over the next two years. Wow. When does the sox whirlwind 2005 tour end. I'm worn out.

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:22 PM
So basically it's the 7 mil assumed arb award and 22 over the next two years. Wow. When does the sox whirlwind 2005 tour end. I'm worn out.

:hawk

"But where will he PLAY?"

mweflen
12-28-2005, 12:22 PM
Would anyone be upset with Contreras for two of Baltimores good prospects like Penn and Loewen and maybe another mid-level prospect? It sounds like Bedard might be hard to get from Baltimore.

I would not be upset with Contreras for two top prospects AND one MLB-ready reliever.

IggyD
12-28-2005, 12:24 PM
I can't imagine what else is or isn't going on behind that Magic Curtain that Kenny is sitting behind!

Pay no attention to the man behide the curtains.....:D:

Lip Man 1
12-28-2005, 12:24 PM
Welcome to playing the game the way 'big market' clubs do!

Very good news. Looks like Contreras is the 'odd man out' right now. Much as I appreciate what Jose has done he's at least in his mid 30's (who knows for sure) and won't be around much longer.

If the Sox want to deal him for a prospect and some bullpen help I wouldn't have any objections. You can't ask for the same thing for a mid 30's pitcher that you could for a pitcher who is 28.

Lip

tebman
12-28-2005, 12:25 PM
How does Bruce figure? Someone has been posting a Sox salary chart here on WSI which I believe showed the Sox at 88 million - and that was with an assumption that JG would get 6 mil in arbitration. Now he's getting 7 mil for 2006. That still sounds like under 90 million to me.
Maybe Bruce is figuring in the cost of all those green seats.

KW has already proven himself to be a sharp baseball guy with a great business head. I can't imagine he'd break the Sox' budget on this -- JR wouldn't go along with it if that was the case. Levine is probably pulling numbers out of his...er...hat.

Apart from that, this is great news! Now KW can elect to keep Garland, or make him more attractive trade bait without the looming concern of free-agency.

So, how about Tejada?

WhiteSoxFan84
12-28-2005, 12:27 PM
I posted this under the "Will the real Jon Garland please stand up?" thread, but it relates to this as well........


I'm damn proud of him. Annual salary of just under $10 mill, I like it. It will raise Buehrle, Garcia, and Contreras' values (as if the market outside Chicago hasn't yet), but at least he didn't lead us on and then left us (Carlos Beltran with Houston).

Jon, be the man you were last year and dominate. Chicago loves you.

Baby Fisk
12-28-2005, 12:28 PM
WEDNESDAY!
WEDNESDAY!
WEDNESDAY!

Thanks for staying Jon. :bandance:

daveeym
12-28-2005, 12:28 PM
Welcome to playing the game the way 'big market' clubs do! Kenny's redefining the game here. This is way above and beyond throwing money around at names, like the 'big market' clubs do. Kenny's making the yanks, scrubs and others look like chumps here. Everything's coming up MILHOUSE!

Baby Fisk
12-28-2005, 12:29 PM
Kenny's redefining the game here. This is way above and beyond throwing money around at names, like the 'big market' clubs do. Kenny's making the yanks, scrubs and others look like chumps here.
Moneyball, meet Kennyball.

JGarlandrules20
12-28-2005, 12:30 PM
or make him more attractive trade bait without the looming concern of free-agency.
No.

Lip Man 1
12-28-2005, 12:32 PM
Daveey:

"Big market' clubs have 'big' payrolls and are proactive. The White Sox have now finally decided to join those ranks and it's high time too! :smile:

Lip

DenverSock
12-28-2005, 12:33 PM
I say keep all of the starters for now in case (god forbid) something happens to one of them during spring training or the WBC.

I guess the real Jon Garland stood up!


Yes and I think this is great news. Keep Bmac! Middle relief and spot starting.

:supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana:

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:34 PM
link:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines)

soxfan13
12-28-2005, 12:34 PM
Crazy trade rumors might increase with this signing. 3 yrs 29 mil I think is very cheap for a pitcher who is young, pitches 200 innings a year , and is in double digits for victories a year. Knowing that he is locked up for 3 years and relatively cheap (with the way pitching is going for right now) will make him much more attractive trade material. Dont get me wrong I love the signing I think its great, but I also think it wont stop the rumors.

bafiarocks03
12-28-2005, 12:34 PM
WOOOOOOOOOOOHOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!! Yay Jon!!!!!!!!!!:D:

daveeym
12-28-2005, 12:36 PM
Daveey:

"Big market' clubs have 'big' payrolls and are proactive. The White Sox have now finally decided to join those ranks and it's high time too! :smile:

Lip I disagree. I'd consider the Braves, Oakland, St. Louis and Houston and maybe the othe Sox as proactive over the last decade. Hardly big market clubs. The Yankees, Cubs, Mets, Dodgers, O's, or the big market clubs, just throw money around and are rarely thinking beyond the next season. They throw money at holes because they can rather than being proactive.

Flight #24
12-28-2005, 12:37 PM
Simply amazing news. LevineLine reported Jon didn't even want to consider anything south of $10M, looks like he was willing to do just that, and on a relatively short deal to boot! Outstanding decision, Jon to take "enough" and stick around with a team that ought to contend through the whole deal.

Or on the flipside, KW just increased Jon's value exponentially. And his flexibility is now virtually limitless. He's signed Garland at market rate for '07 & 08, which means that you can keep him to contend in '06, then if you CAN resign Jose, you can trade a market rate, short-contract Garland for a pretty huge haul. Or you trade a cheap ($6M) Jose on a 1-yr deal for relief help and/or prospects (although you won't get a ton given his age and 1 good year). Or you let Jose walk after '06, take the picks, and slot McCarthy in his spot. Or you can potentially even resign Jose and trade Garcia in his walk year.

This puts payroll at IIRC right about $91M per the salary thread. Now KW just needs an extra 2-3M to nab a couple of veteran arms.

Hangar18
12-28-2005, 12:41 PM
I'm absolutely stunned. This is unbelievable. 3 years for less than 10 million a year.

The pessimist in me, or maybe the realist, still thinks that a trade may be looming. This has to be the highest budget the Sox have ever had.

SAME HERE. FREAKING AWESOME. Yes, the eternal pessismist in me says the SOX are probably going to move do dump someone ....fast. However ....
times are different. Maybe just maybe they go with this payroll. People who havnt gotten on board and gotten season tickets of some sort, shame on you. This team is spending the money and TRYING to win.....
i feel faint ....

Fake Chet Lemon
12-28-2005, 12:41 PM
Is there anything Kenny Williams cannot do? Should we have him try to cure cancer, send him to the MiddleEast to work on peace? Well......being our GM is more important! :D:

Lip Man 1
12-28-2005, 12:42 PM
Daveey:

The Braves payroll for the last fifteen years has been higher then the league average and has at times topped 95 million.

The Cardinals payroll has averaged in the 90 million dollar range.

The Astros have had a sizable payroll for years above the 85 million dollar mark.

Until the past two years what was the Sox payroll again???

You are looking at the definition of 'big market' only in terms of population size. There's a lot more to it then how many folks live in your area, (and by that definition San Francisco - Oakland is a huge market!).

Attitude is a large factor is how you are perceived as an organization.

For the White Sox, as Williams had said and hoped 'winning' something of substance has changed EVERYTHING. Welcome to the 'big leagues' White Sox and God love ya for it.

Lip

DenverSock
12-28-2005, 12:44 PM
SAME HERE. FREAKING AWESOME. Yes, the eternal pessismist in me says the SOX are probably going to move do dump someone ....fast. However ....
times are different. Maybe just maybe they go with this payroll. People who havnt gotten on board and gotten season tickets of some sort, shame on you. This team is spending the money and TRYING to win.....
i feel faint ....


Who stole our Hangar?
:D: :D:

tebman
12-28-2005, 12:45 PM
Is there anything Kenny Williams cannot do? Should we have him try to cure cancer, send him to the MiddleEast to work on peace? Well......being our GM is more important! :D:

A message to the rest of MLB from Ken Williams:

http://members.aol.com/essobmcc/brakbook/tees/t-m-powr.jpg

mdep524
12-28-2005, 12:45 PM
Wow, what unexpected great news!! Very reasonable contract, and it gives the Sox so much leverage... welcome back to the fold Jonny boy! :bandance:


:hawk
I loooove White Sox Wednesday

34 Inch Stick
12-28-2005, 12:45 PM
Looks like Contrearas and his agent lost the game of chicken. KW has absolutely mastered this off season.

I would love to see this scenario play out where Contrearas signs for three years at approximately the same numbers and then Vazquez is dealt.

DVsoxfan
12-28-2005, 12:46 PM
i would love to get hayden penn from the o's....along with maybe rodrigo lopez for the bullpen??

batmanZoSo
12-28-2005, 12:46 PM
Wow. KW is the man, that's all I can say.

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:46 PM
Who stole our Hangar?
:D: :D:

I agree... someone check that IP adress, somethings wrong!

Exit_Only
12-28-2005, 12:47 PM
$7M Year One
$10M Year Two
$12M Year Three

Interesting. From what I've read, Garland was projected to receive close to $7 million in arbitration this year. On top of that, we have him signed for $11 million per year over the next two years. That's below market value for a pitcher of his quality.

Good signing for both parties.

Now what happens to our rotation? I was of the assumption that McCarthy would fill the #5 spot because of his league minimum salary and talent combination. Does this mean Contreras will be traded to open a spot for McCarthy?

daveeym
12-28-2005, 12:48 PM
Daveey:

The Braves payroll for the last fifteen years has been higher then the league average and has at times topped 95 million.

The Cardinals payroll has averaged in the 90 million dollar range.

The Astros have had a sizable payroll for years above the 85 million dollar mark.

Until the past two years what was the Sox payroll again???

You are looking at the definition of 'big market' only in terms of population size. There's a lot more to it then how many folks live in your area, (and by that definition San Francisco - Oakland is a huge market!).

Attitude is a large factor is how you are perceived as an organization.

For the White Sox, as Williams had said and hoped 'winning' something of substance has changed EVERYTHING. Welcome to the 'big leagues' White Sox and God love ya for it.

Lip So now it's how much you spend that determines your market rather than the actual market? Kind of flies in the face of many arguments made against Reinsy pre '05. I agree with the attitude though. And the right attitude squeezes every penny, fan and corporation out of a team's market and makes that team's games destination events.

PaleHoseGeorge
12-28-2005, 12:49 PM
So the rotation for the beginning of 2006 figures to be:

Buehrle
Contreras
Garland
Garcia
Vazquez

McCarthy starts in the bullpen ready to step in for any injured or sub-par performers. That's as solid a starting rotation as you'll ever see. Kenny has improved the offense this winter, too.

The 2005 Sox would have a tough time handling this new 2006 version of the team.

:thumbsup:

Kogs35
12-28-2005, 12:49 PM
Everything's coming up MILHOUSE!

http://www.simpsonspark.com/images/caracters/milhouse.jpg
sorry couldnt resist :tongue:

duke of dorwood
12-28-2005, 12:49 PM
I think I'll get that Garland jersey now :D:

mdep524
12-28-2005, 12:49 PM
The Sox official site now has the news press release (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20051228&content_id=1287583&vkey=pr_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws) up.

DenverSock
12-28-2005, 12:51 PM
Daveey:

"Big market' clubs have 'big' payrolls and are proactive. The White Sox have now finally decided to join those ranks and it's high time too! :smile:

Lip

The Lip has spoken!


I would love to see this scenario play out where Contrearas signs for three years at approximately the same numbers and then Vazquez is dealt.

Only for an All-Star center fielder! Nobody ever had too much pitching.

:cool: :D:

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 12:51 PM
So the rotation for the beginning of 2006 figures to be:

Buehrle
Contreras
Garland
Garcia
Vazquez

McCarthy starts in the bullpen ready to step in for any injured or sub-par performers. That's as solid a starting rotation as you'll ever see. Kenny has improved the offense this winter, too.

The 2005 Sox would have a tough time handling this new 2006 version of the team.

:thumbsup:

I say we throw all 6 to start out the year then unload someone at the deadline to fill any injuries or down year related holes.... we are in the Drivers seat right now and we have the fastest car out there!

itsnotrequired
12-28-2005, 12:52 PM
Crazy trade rumors might increase with this signing. 3 yrs 29 mil I think is very cheap for a pitcher who is young, pitches 200 innings a year , and is in double digits for victories a year. Knowing that he is locked up for 3 years and relatively cheap (with the way pitching is going for right now) will make him much more attractive trade material. Dont get me wrong I love the signing I think its great, but I also think it wont stop the rumors.

I agree. I was pretty surprised (and of course, excited) when I heard the news. Trade rumors should decrease a bit but there will still be plenty of them.

How locked in is this team for the future? It is insane. They now have Buehrle, Garcia, Garland and Vazquez locked in through 2007 (through contract or club options). How many other teams have the core of their staff locked in for the next two seasons? Throw in a vetran catcher for another three years and this is one damn fine staff. Sox also have the two big sluggers (Konerko and Thome), second baseman, shortstop and right fielder locked up through 2007 (contracts or club options).

That is one niffty organization operating on the south side...

Fake Chet Lemon
12-28-2005, 12:53 PM
Looks like Contrearas and his agent lost the game of chicken. KW has absolutely mastered this off season.

I would love to see this scenario play out where Contrearas signs for three years at approximately the same numbers and then Vazquez is dealt.


Better sign soon Jose or Kenny may have you pitching in Cincinnati or some other god-awful place this season. Can you say Jose = Ken Griffey Jr?

MsSoxVixen22
12-28-2005, 12:53 PM
:bandance: White Sox Wednesday at it again! Glad you're sticking around Jon!

JGarlandrules20
12-28-2005, 12:54 PM
Better sign soon Jose or Kenny may have you pitching in Cincinnati or some other god-awful place this season. Can you say Jose = Ken Griffey Jr?
Where would he play? :tongue:

beckett21
12-28-2005, 12:55 PM
I'd like to take this opportunity to issue a public apology to Jon Garland.

Honestly I didn't think there was any way he was going to re-up without testing free agency. I was in favor of trading him away for this very reason. He just proved me wrong.

Great signing by KW. I really hope this doesn't mean the end of Jose Contreras's days here in Chicago, but I'm very happy to have Garland in the fold for another 3 years.

Cheers Jon! :gulp:

gf2020
12-28-2005, 12:57 PM
I might be in the minority here, but I'd like to see us keep Jose for this season even at the expense of not adding to our bullpen. I am completely comfortable with the notion of Brandon toughing it out in the bullpen for a year, which would more than sufficiently replace the Viz. I don't believe we have anyone else in our system that can be a spot fifth starter if necessary due to injury and don't trust in Javier yet. I'd rather keep our depth.

I never would have thought that JG would sign an extension before JC. I wonder if that means the club's offer to Jose is off the table. Whatever the case, this move means we have the best five man rotation in all of baseball for the next two years for a very affordable rate.

1917
12-28-2005, 01:05 PM
Throw some seasoning salt on B-Mac for a season in the BP and start the 5 horses...and B-Mac is excellent insurance if, God Forbid, we have an injury....We got our team, lets play ball!

batmanZoSo
12-28-2005, 01:06 PM
I might be in the minority here, but I'd like to see us keep Jose for this season even at the expense of not adding to our bullpen. I am completely comfortable with the notion of Brandon toughing it out in the bullpen for a year, which would more than sufficiently replace the Viz. I don't believe we have anyone else in our system that can be a spot fifth starter if necessary due to injury and don't trust in Javier yet. I'd rather keep our depth.

I never would have thought that JG would sign an extension before JC. I wonder if that means the club's offer to Jose is off the table. Whatever the case, this move means we have the best five man rotation in all of baseball for the next two years for a very affordable rate.

Good god, with a starting five this solid we're really questioning the need for a bullpen. Honestly. We already have the closer and the bridge to. We don't really need a workhorse 5-7th inning guy like Vizcaino because the starters are going to be pushing into the 7th virtually every single day provided all 5 are healthy.

Hitmen77
12-28-2005, 01:08 PM
How locked in is this team for the future? It is insane. They now have Buehrle, Garcia, Garland and Vazquez locked in through 2007 (through contract or club options)....

Don't forget McCarthy! :cool: That's a solid 5 man rotation (barring injury of course) locked in for the next 2 years)

itsnotrequired
12-28-2005, 01:10 PM
Don't forget McCarthy! :cool: That's a solid 5 man rotation (barring injury of course) locked in for the next 2 years)

I was only including the big guns. Sox also have Jenks, Anderson, Hermanson, etc. locked up.

PaleHoseGeorge
12-28-2005, 01:11 PM
I might be in the minority here, but I'd like to see us keep Jose for this season even at the expense of not adding to our bullpen. I am completely comfortable with the notion of Brandon toughing it out in the bullpen for a year, which would more than sufficiently replace the Viz. I don't believe we have anyone else in our system that can be a spot fifth starter if necessary due to injury and don't trust in Javier yet. I'd rather keep our depth.

Yep. The Sox just won a world championship. The notion that we still have five healthy arms in the rotation is a bit far-fetched. I'll take my chances with five arms plus one extra one just in case. There are a lot of innings to be pitched in 2006. McCarthy will get his chance. Book it.

I'm guessing Kenny sees it the same way, too.

:cool:

gr8mexico
12-28-2005, 01:12 PM
We have a very expensive rotation but what a great rotation it is.:bandance: :bandance: Let's celebrate:gulp:

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 01:12 PM
I was only including the big guns. Sox also have Jenks, Anderson, Hermanson, etc. locked up.

Konerko, AJ, Thome, Iguchi...

Hitmen77
12-28-2005, 01:12 PM
I was only including the big guns. Sox also have Jenks, Anderson, Hermanson, etc. locked up.

Sounds good. :thumbsup:

Hendu
12-28-2005, 01:16 PM
Awesome. Very reasonable deal for a young pitcher who is going to keep getting better. Once again, KW comes through.

Can't wait to go to What's the Score and read all the new trade angles after the signing..

KRS1
12-28-2005, 01:21 PM
Looks like all this 'real Jon G," crap can stop now, thank you Kdubs and Jon we wont regret this signing one bit.

Qdiddy
12-28-2005, 01:23 PM
I want to start off by saying I'm very happy with the signing of Garland, but does anyone else think a possible sign & trade is in the works? I just have that feeling that this gives KW more barginning power now that he can tell teams that Garland is going to be locked up for them for 3yrs for under 30mil.

Anyone else have that feeling too or am I way off here?

CPditka
12-28-2005, 01:24 PM
How long is Buehrle locked up for? Hes the key to this rotation.

KRS1
12-28-2005, 01:25 PM
I want to start off by saying I'm very happy with the signing of Garland, but does anyone else think a possible sign & trade is in the works? I just have that feeling that this gives KW more barginning power now that he can tell teams that Garland is going to be locked up for them for 3yrs for under 30mil.

Anyone else have that feeling too or am I way off here?

Oh great, here we go.

THE_HOOTER
12-28-2005, 01:25 PM
So the rotation for the beginning of 2006 figures to be:

Buehrle
Contreras
Garland
Garcia
Vazquez

McCarthy starts in the bullpen ready to step in for any injured or sub-par performers. That's as solid a starting rotation as you'll ever see. Kenny has improved the offense this winter, too.

The 2005 Sox would have a tough time handling this new 2006 version of the team.

:thumbsup:


Putting McCarthy in the bullpen strengthens the pen, and gives us insurance.

I dont think letting Contreras go is a good idea---I would keep him and let hi walk.

Dan Mega
12-28-2005, 01:26 PM
Awesome signing. Not only does this give the Sox a 6 man rotation with McCarthy floating between starting and the bullpen, other starters can do it as well.

Say Garcia or Buerhle is getting tired, move them to the bullpen for a week or two. What other major league team can do that?

Fake Chet Lemon
12-28-2005, 01:27 PM
Glad I did pony up for my Ozzie plan! There aren't going to be any tickets left once they go on sale, especially if Contreras gets dealt in another KW blockbuster. I think Kenny for once is going to enjoy being chased, instead of being the one always doing the chasing. He can sit back like the godfather with all that pitching and let everyone grovel at his feet to make a deal. So for once he may not be in a hurry, although that isn't his nature.

"Please godfather Kenny, can I have a pitcher?".......Jim Hendry
"STOP CRYING, ACT LIKE A MAN (slap)- Mr. Hendry!"............Kenny Williams

dugwood31
12-28-2005, 01:28 PM
I don't think this adds much to next year's budget because Garland would have got $9m in arbitration, I'd think. The issue is years 2 and 3. On one hand, he's never been bad, and never been hurt. On the other hand, he's had one good year (albeit at 26, which is a common age for pitchers to break out.) I hope this isn't irrational exuberance a la Baltimore, the Dodgers or the Mets. You could argue that in a few years we'll be cursing the long term contracts that we gave to him and Paulie...

Hagan
12-28-2005, 01:28 PM
I am so happy!

gf2020
12-28-2005, 01:29 PM
I want to start off by saying I'm very happy with the signing of Garland, but does anyone else think a possible sign & trade is in the works? I just have that feeling that this gives KW more barginning power now that he can tell teams that Garland is going to be locked up for them for 3yrs for under 30mil.

Anyone else have that feeling too or am I way off here?

As I said in another thread, it's highly unlikely that the Sox turn around and trade JG this season. While he doesn't have a no trade clause, it is very likely that JG signed with the understanding that he would be here at least this season. To trade him now or in the coming months would send an awful signal to agents and players and hamper our own ability to sign FAs and resign our own players at fair prices without no trade clauses.

Fake Chet Lemon
12-28-2005, 01:29 PM
How long is Buehrle locked up for? Hes the key to this rotation.

I beleieve the Sox have a club option at around $10M in 2007. So two years.

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 01:31 PM
Let the Jose Contreras trade speculation begin!

Contreras/Vazquez for Tejada/Bedard?

interesting.... very interesting.....

gr8mexico
12-28-2005, 01:31 PM
Awesome signing. Not only does this give the Sox a 6 man rotation with McCarthy floating between starting and the bullpen, other starters can do it as well.

Say Garcia or Buerhle is getting tired, move them to the bullpen for a week or two. What other major league team can do that? The only thing I can see Ozzie doing is skipping them but not sending them to the bullpen for 2 weeks that's crazy. Next year the pitching staff is going to be great they should be competing against each other to see who is the best pitcher in the team. Just like they step up in the playoffs against the Angels.

mweflen
12-28-2005, 01:32 PM
:tomatoawardLinkies:

http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051228&content_id=1287597&vkey=news_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

Dolanski
12-28-2005, 01:32 PM
Love this signing. Solidifies the rotation for the next few years. I honestly think we go into the season with 6 starters, McCarthy out of the bp and spot starting. It protects us in case of injury or fatigue, etc. If we aren't injured or fatigued, this probably means a deadline deal for Contreras.

TornLabrum
12-28-2005, 01:32 PM
Great signing. Looks like Garland read my warning about arbitration.

I wonder if he heard from any other players reminding him that if he left, he would be leaving a World Series Champion...for what?

IUPeterman
12-28-2005, 01:33 PM
:tomatoaward

Dan Mega
12-28-2005, 01:35 PM
"Please godfather Kenny, can I have a pitcher?".......Jim Hendry
"STOP CRYING, ACT LIKE A MAN (slap)- Mr. Hendry!"............Kenny Williams

Oh God please get the Kerry Wood since he's the best pitcher ever! Remember the 20k game he had last decade? Oh and get Corey "5-Tool" Patterson too, he is the next Willie Mays!

scottjanssens
12-28-2005, 01:36 PM
Moneyball, meet Kennyball.

KW signs a Cy Young contending pitcher for slightly below market value... sounds like moneyball to me.

lostletters
12-28-2005, 01:38 PM
I don't think this adds much to next year's budget because Garland would have got $9m in arbitration, I'd think. The issue is years 2 and 3. On one hand, he's never been bad, and never been hurt. On the other hand, he's had one good year (albeit at 26, which is a common age for pitchers to break out.) I hope this isn't irrational exuberance a la Baltimore, the Dodgers or the Mets. You could argue that in a few years we'll be cursing the long term contracts that we gave to him and Paulie...

That is exactly the point.
Plus Garland is a young pitcher, he is just STARTING to develop. Considering the current market for pitchers, we got him at a relative deal. It is another win-win situation for KW. The man is becoming a genius GM. He has FOUR of his starting pitchers locked up until 2007 and he has a very talented youngster waiting in the wings. The pitching rotation is the envy of major league baseball.

KRS1
12-28-2005, 01:40 PM
Love this signing. Solidifies the rotation for the next few years. I honestly think we go into the season with 6 starters, McCarthy out of the bp and spot starting. It protects us in case of injury or fatigue, etc. If we aren't injured or fatigued, this probably means a deadline deal for Contreras.

I have to think keeping him all year, hopefully at the same level he performed the second half`last year, and leting him walk might be beneficial in a way. We would almost assuredly get two first rounders outta him leaving which helps us stockpile the arms again.

Daver
12-28-2005, 01:42 PM
I have to think keeping him all year, hopefully at the same level he performed the second half`last year, and leting him walk might be beneficial in a way. We would almost assuredly get two first rounders outta him leaving which helps us stockpile the arms again.

You don't get two first round picks, you get two sandwich picks, I after the first round and one after the second round.

KRS1
12-28-2005, 01:43 PM
Payroll update, we currently sit at around 83mil.

KRS1
12-28-2005, 01:44 PM
You don't get two first round picks, you get two sandwich picks, I after the first round and one after the second round.

My bad, one for all intensive purposes 1st rounder, and a second.

SOXintheBURGH
12-28-2005, 01:51 PM
Whoa..

Whoa...

Whoa......

I come home from getting a sandwich and Garland is signed for 3 years!?


Boo-ya!

chisoxmike
12-28-2005, 01:52 PM
I'm going to eat my words here and say that I thought Garland was going to walk after 2006 and land some fat contract somewhere else. Kudos Jon!

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 01:54 PM
I'm going to eat my words here and say that I thought Garland was going to walk after 2006 and land some fat contract somewhere else. Kudos Jon!

Why go somewhere else when you can get a fat contract here... this isn't exactly a home down discount by any means!

JUribe1989
12-28-2005, 01:56 PM
Unbelievable, now I think we should definitely go with B Mac in the pen and also use Contreras. I don't believe Jose will be traded because B Mac will benefit from a year in the pen IMO.

AnkleSox
12-28-2005, 01:57 PM
Anyone else think management is not only looking to repeat, but to create a dynasty?

Maybe winning the series reminded Jerry of how it felt to win with the bulls. I'll take 6 World Series titles in the next 8 years.

Realist
12-28-2005, 01:59 PM
I was sure Garland was gone until we signed Pierzynski. During an interview after he was signed, A.J. said he talked to Garland and Garland told him that he wanted to stay with the White Sox. He did and I'm glad.

There's no doubt this team needed a ground ball pitcher. This is a very good day.

As for the budget, all the Sox stuff our loved bought us for Christmas and all the Sox stuff we bought for our loved ones prolly kicked the budget up 10 million alone.

The fact that we're probably gonna average 32k per game in 2006 can't hurt either.

PAPChiSox729
12-28-2005, 01:59 PM
I cannot begin to describe how shocked I am. I was sure that JG would be gone come ST. Amazing job, KW! I am glad to have Jon here!!

ilsox7
12-28-2005, 01:59 PM
This is one of those rare deals that makes perfect sense for all involved. Good job by KW and especially Jon and his advisors. His family is set for life and if he is the real deal, he'll get another big contract for $50MM+.

SOXSINCE'70
12-28-2005, 02:00 PM
This kind of changes the dynamic a little bit. I had pretty much resigned myself to Garland being gone by the AS break next year....

That makes 2 of us.Actually,I wondered if he'd be traded by
ST.The Sox still need another LHP in the 'pen.Glad for Garland,
but I could have sworn he'd hold out for Millwood/Burnett type
money.Now,the question becomes what to do with Contreras.
The Sox can't break camp with a rotation of Beuhrle,Garcia,
Garland,Contreras,Vazquez and McCarthy.
Or can they?? As the narrator on the old "Batman" TV show
used to say, "Tune in tomorrow,same bat time,same bat channel"
(but substitute "Sox" for "bat").:D: :D:

Baby Fisk
12-28-2005, 02:01 PM
Anyone else think management is not only looking to repeat, but to create a dynasty?

Maybe winning the series reminded Jerry of how it felt to win with the bulls. I'll take 6 World Series titles in the next 8 years.
Jerry certainly likes his three-peats.

TheKittle
12-28-2005, 02:02 PM
Sure looks as though Garland didn't want to be with the White Sox.

Daver
12-28-2005, 02:02 PM
As for the budget, all the Sox stuff our loved bought us for Christmas and all the Sox stuff we bought for our loved ones prolly kicked the budget up 10 million alone.



That is shared revenue, doled out equally to all thirty teams.

TornLabrum
12-28-2005, 02:07 PM
My bad, one for all intensive purposes...

That's "intents and purposes."

SOXit2EM
12-28-2005, 02:08 PM
If one of the pitchers goes, I would have to think it would be Contreras. He only has one year remaining and is at least 34 years old. Coming off the 2nd half and postseason that he had, his stock will never be higher than it is right now.

I can't wait for next Wednesday to find out where Contreras goes. :D:I agree. As much as I'd hate to unload JC, his stock is PROBABLY as high as it ever will be...........Great move by KW locking up JG, and I do have a feeling he might stick with this rotation for next year in hopes of winning another title, w/ McCarthy as insurance :D:

34 Inch Stick
12-28-2005, 02:08 PM
Sure looks as though Garland didn't want to be with the White Sox.

I don't know what green is for, but as one of the proponents of that viewpoint I can admit my mistake (although good deals change people's attitudes toward their work situations in every walk of life).

mweflen
12-28-2005, 02:09 PM
Anyone else think management is not only looking to repeat, but to create a dynasty?

Maybe winning the series reminded Jerry of how it felt to win with the bulls. I'll take 6 World Series titles in the next 8 years.

Too bad it couldn't have happened when we had our own Baseball Michael Jordan (i.e. Big Hurt).

mweflen
12-28-2005, 02:10 PM
:tealpolice:Sure looks as though Garland didn't want to be with the White Sox.

34 Inch Stick
12-28-2005, 02:10 PM
I hope all press releases mention that he was acquired via trade from the Cubs for Matt Karchner.

kevingrt
12-28-2005, 02:13 PM
I agree. As much as I'd hate to unload JC, his stock is PROBABLY as high as it ever will be...........Great move by KW locking up JG, and I do have a feeling he might stick with this rotation for next year in hopes of winning another title, w/ McCarthy as insurance :D:

I agree with you. I have always felt Jose is at his highest value right now but no one wants him gone. I think a starting staff of Buehrle, Garcia, McCarthy, Vazquez, and Garland would be sick with major youth. They are all relatively young minus Garcia who isn't old by any means. I feel we could add so much with trading Contreras too.

scottjanssens
12-28-2005, 02:14 PM
That's "intents and purposes."

Thank you!

Tekijawa
12-28-2005, 02:26 PM
Too bad it couldn't have happened when we had our own Baseball Michael Jordan (i.e. Big Hurt).

I loved Frank... but that compairsion is a HUGE Stretch... maybe if he Never had any of those down years, but Jordan is the greatest Baskeball Player EVER... I don't think Frank woud even be close to the Top 50 ever...

dickallen15
12-28-2005, 02:29 PM
Why would anyone trade Contreras just because his "stock is high." He was the White Sox ace at the end of last season. He was better than Buerhle, better than Garcia, better than Garland. If it weren't for his second half brilliance last year it is very possible the White Sox do not make the playoffs. Trading him just because his "stock" is high would be foolish. Sign him to a deserved extension or let him play the year out. Ace pitchers help win world championships. Trading them, lets you think about next year.

hawkjt
12-28-2005, 02:36 PM
Obviously this is yet another great day to be a sox fan and to be JG,also. More clear evidence that Kenny is going for a repeat. Keep all six and ensure continuity if injury crops up. If you can extend Jose you do it -otherwise you have a valuable asset to trade at the deadline when teams would give you their own offspring for a good starter or just win it all with Jose and let him walk at year end.

I commend Gar and his agent for recognizing that this is a fair deal that allows Gar to play with a winner where he is comfortable and hang with his buddy Burls. Money isn't everything and he will get another chance to cash in at age 29. Even this deal sets him up for life. Nice job Kenny, Gar,. Jerry. ect.

California Sox
12-28-2005, 02:40 PM
Makes me wonder what else is up. McCarthy is ready and not well-suited to relief (due to prep issues. He's a starter) Seems to me KW is not the type to let assets gather dust. I predict we'll be hearing from him on another Wednesday soon. If they keep all 6, I wouldn't be surprised if Bmac starts season in Charlotte.

Of course there is one nightmare scenario for us FOCY, and that's Bmac beating Vazquez out in the spring. Don't tell me it can't happen. Their stuff is very similar and Bmac has much larger cojones.

Flight #24
12-28-2005, 02:42 PM
Stolen from another messag board, but IMO priceless......

In a related story, Matt Karcher recently signed a new three year contract with Sprint for wireless service using some of the money he stole from the Cubs.

RetireWoodys28
12-28-2005, 02:47 PM
This is amazing. I really didn't give JG much credit when it came to loyalty, and figured he'd want to test the FA waters. But for the umpteenth time this year, Garland totally surprises me.

Don't get me wrong, winning the WS is the greatest feeling I've ever gotten from being a fan of this game. But just having guys like PK, AJ, and JG to cheer for is a pretty good feeling, as well. All 3 could have probably made more cash elsewhere, but all three re-upped here. We have a team full of guys who play hard, and who enjoy playing here, for us (rather than just considering the $$$ bottom line when choosing where to play). Not many pro franchises is any of the 4 majors can say that. Obviously, this must be some sort of divine retribution for all the Wells/Navarro-type human toliets who we've had to tolerate thru the years.

I've been a White Sox fan for 30+ years now, and I've never loved a team as much as the group of guys we had out there on the diamond in '05.

WELCOME HOME, JON!
:bandance: :bandance: :bandance:

Theanticub
12-28-2005, 02:58 PM
Hmm, very interesting...but good news. Someone will be traded...question is who? For what? Thanks Kenny for making even the offseason interesting.

Dolanski
12-28-2005, 03:00 PM
Stolen from another messag board, but IMO priceless......

In a related story, Matt Karcher recently signed a new three year contract with Sprint for wireless service using some of the money he stole from the Cubs.

So is it time for the Matt Karchner Appreciation Thread now?

soxinem1
12-28-2005, 03:00 PM
Wow, this is a shock! I suppose this now puts the pressure on Contreras, and actually puts the Sox in the drivers seat. They definitely can offer the same type deal and if he does not bite, out he goes.

But if he does stay, I could see Vasquez being sent to the Mets or Baltimore. They both had a major want for him, and I'm sure he wouldn't mind it either. Plus, either team would have him for three years.

KW can keep the cash the D-backs sent with him, and save it for Buherle's next contract!!

Dolanski
12-28-2005, 03:01 PM
Hmm, very interesting...but good news. Someone will be traded...question is who? For what? Thanks Kenny for making even the offseason interesting.

I agree, but I say Kenny will wait until June or the trading deadline. Player's values are much higher in season and it lets them wait it out for injuries, fatigue, kryptonite, etc.

BainesHOF
12-28-2005, 03:04 PM
What a nice surprise.

It's all good, especially if we re-sign Contreras, our best pitcher even if he's not our most popular one.

SouthSide_HitMen
12-28-2005, 03:08 PM
WEDNESDAY!
WEDNESDAY!
WEDNESDAY!

Thanks for staying Jon. :bandance:

Kenny Williams works only one day a week to let the other 29 teams think they have a chance.

IronFisk
12-28-2005, 03:15 PM
Yes, agreed, another fine move. Folks, we very well could be in the midst of a mini-dynasty. Although, they DID say that about the Bears after 85.

Anyways, great to retain a young pitcher, to go along with a pretty young staff. Contreras looks ripe for the dealing - considering his age, but then again, it looks like he finally turned the corner consistency wise. I like the idea of keeping the six, and having one hang in the bullpen based on spring training results. We do need another arm or two in there as it is.

Otherwise, I'm outright giddy at our lineup! LET'S ROLL!!! :moonwalk:

HomeFish
12-28-2005, 03:17 PM
Contreras has a lower trade value than Garland, due to his age and past history (though I'd argue that Contreras has far better stuff). Hopefully that quiets the movement to trade away one of our starters.

chisoxfanatic
12-28-2005, 03:20 PM
This team is destined to be a dynasty! Garland's performance last year is not just smokescreen; he's just getting into the type of pitcher he will be for the bulk of his career. This is a great move by the Sox, as Jon is one of the key ingredients to our awesome start last year.

RockyMtnSoxFan
12-28-2005, 03:20 PM
I could see Vasquez being sent to the Mets or Baltimore. They both had a major want for him, and I'm sure he wouldn't mind it either. Plus, either team would have him for three years.

KW can keep the cash the D-backs sent with him, and save it for Buherle's next contract!!

This is my favorite scenario. In my opinion, Vazquez is the weakest of the six. I guess we don't really know enough about BMac, but he seems to have the stuff and the composure. I talked to a friend who is a Yankee fan recently, and he had good things to say about Vazquez, at least in terms of ability. That made me feel a little better about the deal with Arizona, but I still feel like it was a bad move.

Flight #24
12-28-2005, 03:23 PM
The game---------------------------------------->Kenny Williams


:KW "I'm so far ahead most of these clown can't even see my dust!"

Frater Perdurabo
12-28-2005, 03:26 PM
Great move! Thanks Jon! Thanks Kenny! Thanks Jerry!

Now the Sox can ship Vasquez plus prospects to the Devil Rays for Carl Crawford!

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 03:34 PM
This is my favorite scenario. In my opinion, Vazquez is the weakest of the six. I guess we don't really know enough about BMac, but he seems to have the stuff and the composure. I talked to a friend who is a Yankee fan recently, and he had good things to say about Vazquez, at least in terms of ability. That made me feel a little better about the deal with Arizona, but I still feel like it was a bad move.

vasquez had awesome stuff in montreal and with the yankees. the expos were just bad so it didnt reflect well in his stats. as for the yankees... he pitched very well but nothing is ever good enough for the new york media, fans, or management. in arizona he had an awesome second half.... like the expos, the team was bad. this guy is a workhorse and is a great acquisition. so feel good about that trade, because it was a great one for the sox.

bmac i would say is the weakest of the six, basically because he doesn't have much experience at the major league level compared to the rest. personally i would like to see bmac in the pen for the year/half a year and see how buerhle, garland, garcia,contreras, and vasquez do.... because i think these 5 guys will be the best rotation in the league this year... maybe of all time??? (quite possibly)

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 03:35 PM
Great move! Thanks Jon! Thanks Kenny! Thanks Jerry!

Now the Sox can ship Vasquez plus prospects to the Devil Rays for Carl Crawford!

i really like that trade idea!!!!:bandance:

EastCoastSoxFan
12-28-2005, 03:40 PM
KW signs a Cy Young contending pitcher for slightly below market value... sounds like moneyball to me.
From what I have read, the moneyball treatment of pitchers usually involves letting them play out their 3-year cheapo rookie contracts, MAYBE offering them arbitration for one more year, and then either trading them or letting them walk for draft picks to avoid having to pay them anything close to market value.
Kennyball, from what we have seen, means planning 2-3 years ahead at all times and paying your key players as close to market value as you can without breaking the bank.

WSoxFanForever
12-28-2005, 03:44 PM
I was so excited when I heard this. Can we say REPEAT??????????????????????????????


GOOOOOOO WHITE SOXXXXXXXXX!!!

kwolf68
12-28-2005, 03:49 PM
Winning breeds winners. Funny now everyone is flocking to play (or return) to the Sox when in years past players tried to get out.

That's what winning a ring does for you. Glad Jon opted to stick it out and I am more happy that we kept him, because he is on the cusp of really becomming a great pitcher.

Garland is such a pitcher that he can do well when tired (helps the sinker) or he can morph into a power pitcher if rested (see Angels series where he was throwing 92-94 mile per hour fastballs all night, I believe he hit 95 at least one time).

Great freaking deal for the Sox. Kudos to KW and JG. :gulp:

Palehose13
12-28-2005, 03:50 PM
I'd like to take this opportunity to issue a public apology to Jon Garland.

Honestly I didn't think there was any way he was going to re-up without testing free agency. I was in favor of trading him away for this very reason. He just proved me wrong.

Great signing by KW. I really hope this doesn't mean the end of Jose Contreras's days here in Chicago, but I'm very happy to have Garland in the fold for another 3 years.

Cheers Jon! :gulp:

I'd like to echo your post, beckett. I was on the exact same wavelength as you. Jon, you can prove me wrong anyday. Welcome back!

Hitmen77
12-28-2005, 03:52 PM
Stolen from another messag board, but IMO priceless......

In a related story, Matt Karcher recently signed a new three year contract with Sprint for wireless service using some of the money he stole from the Cubs.

Ha ha!! I read that too. Admit it, you saw that on northsideball.com. That was my first peek at that site (honest!) because I was curious to see their reaction to the Garland deal.

Interestingly, a majority of the clowns there were saying the Sox paid way too much for Garland, Garland is just a mediocre pitcher, etc. :kukoo: A few people there were smart enough to admit that this was a great deal for the Sox - especially in light of what Burnett, Millwood, etc. recently got.

MasQbellesa
12-28-2005, 03:53 PM
Now the Sox can ship Vasquez plus prospects to the Devil Rays for Carl Crawford!
i really like that trade idea!!!!:bandance:

Wasn't Vasquez crying that he wanted to be traded to be closer to his family in Puerto Rico??? Tampa Bay is way closer than Chicago! Besides...11-15 last year for Vasquez... keep Contreras!

DickAllen72
12-28-2005, 03:57 PM
Per Espn 1000 Jon Garland has signed a 3 year 29 million dollar deal. I wonder who is going to be trade bait now.

Vazquez for Andruw Jones. :tongue:

StepsInSC
12-28-2005, 03:59 PM
Good....freaking....crap....I.....am....blindsided ..!!

Didn't see this coming! I'm not used to this happiness caused by being a Sox fan. Please don't let the world end anytime soon!!!

lostletters
12-28-2005, 03:59 PM
Now the Sox can ship Vasquez plus prospects to the Devil Rays for Carl Crawford!


Wasn't Vasquez crying that he wanted to be traded to be closer to his family in Puerto Rico??? Tampa Bay is way closer than Chicago! Besides...11-15 last year for Vasquez... keep Contreras!

Vasquez had 21 quality starts last year, nothing to sneeze at by any means. He is probably the best number 5 pitcher in the bigs. Plus Chicago is a city with direct flights to nearly everywhere in the America's, so it is beneficial that he stay here.

I say let BMac throw in the bullpen for a year and get the experience and learn additional pitches. Put him in the rotation next year or in case of an injury. He is a great insurance policy to have around.

Optipessimism
12-28-2005, 04:01 PM
Now the Sox can ship Vasquez plus prospects to the Devil Rays for Carl Crawford!


Wasn't Vasquez crying that he wanted to be traded to be closer to his family in Puerto Rico??? Tampa Bay is way closer than Chicago! Besides...11-15 last year for Vasquez... keep Contreras!

If the choice was Contreras for 3 years or Vazquez for 3 years, it would be a tough decision to make but I think I'd have to go with Jose.

That said, Crawford would be a great addition but I'd rather not see another speedy contact hitter in our OF. I'd rather see the Sox have a couple guys with power out there and instead get another speedy contact hitter that could play the infield. There aren't too many of those available, but give me Jimmy Rollins and I'll be happy.

Lprof
12-28-2005, 04:26 PM
I'm absolutely stunned. This is unbelievable. 3 years for less than 10 million a year.

The pessimist in me, or maybe the realist, still thinks that a trade may be looming. This has to be the highest budget the Sox have ever had.Apparently there is a no-trade clause for the first year.

Lprof
12-28-2005, 04:29 PM
I don't think this adds much to next year's budget because Garland would have got $9m in arbitration, I'd think. The issue is years 2 and 3. On one hand, he's never been bad, and never been hurt. On the other hand, he's had one good year (albeit at 26, which is a common age for pitchers to break out.) I hope this isn't irrational exuberance a la Baltimore, the Dodgers or the Mets. You could argue that in a few years we'll be cursing the long term contracts that we gave to him and Paulie...But that's just the point: For Garland, it ISN'T a long term contract. It is amazing to get an 18 game winner signed for only three years.

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 04:31 PM
That said, Crawford would be a great addition but I'd rather not see another speedy contact hitter in our OF. I'd rather see the Sox have a couple guys with power out there and instead get another speedy contact hitter that could play the infield. There aren't too many of those available, but give me Jimmy Rollins and I'll be happy.

but didnt ozzie say he wanted to get another speedy contact hitter???? thats how all the speculation of pierre to the sox got started. and now that we didnt offer harris a contract, thats one less speedy player. speed and base stealing was huge for the sox last year. as having slow guys like aj, paulie, and thome for example... we'll need to pinch run for them late in games if we have a chance to score.

i would definitely like to keep vasquez and if needed trade contreras... makes the most sense because he is the oldest of the 6 starters. but if we could get crawford for vasquez.... man that would be cool.

pod, crawford, konerko, thome, dye, aj, iguchi, crede, uribe.... WOW!

Lprof
12-28-2005, 04:35 PM
Makes me wonder what else is up. McCarthy is ready and not well-suited to relief (due to prep issues. He's a starter) Seems to me KW is not the type to let assets gather dust. I predict we'll be hearing from him on another Wednesday soon. If they keep all 6, I wouldn't be surprised if Bmac starts season in Charlotte.

Of course there is one nightmare scenario for us FOCY, and that's Bmac beating Vazquez out in the spring. Don't tell me it can't happen. Their stuff is very similar and Bmac has much larger cojones.I wouldn't call that a nightmare scenario; couldn't you simply then trade Vasquez in spring training or early season?

Lprof
12-28-2005, 04:42 PM
I would not be upset with Contreras for two top prospects AND one MLB-ready reliever.I'm not so sure about any of this; we shouldn't quickly forget how totally dominant he was in the second half, and his impressive post-season performance. That could leave a big hole in the rotation that BMac may not be ready to fill. He was lights out at the end of the year, but simply awful when he first came up (remember the Tampa Bay game?). Perhaps he finally "got it," and I certainly hope that's true, but I would hate to get rid of a dominant pitcher like Contreras (at least last year--who knows for next year?) for a middle reliever or prospects. If you can't get an impact player for him (and I have no idea if you can), I am now of the view that we should keep him. I haven't looked at other American League starting staffs, but I have to believe that none is all that close to the Sox (anyone have any thoughts on this one?). When, before New Years, all KW has to worry about is a backup outfielder and middle relievers (most or all of whom may well come from within), that is pretty impressive.:gulp: :supernana:

HotelWhiteSox
12-28-2005, 04:55 PM
This news sure surprised me earlier today, everyone waiting for him to be traded and then he resigns.

So, I'm guessing either Contreras or Vasquez will be gone soon. If I would bet, I'd say they're going to ship Jose, but that's too bad because he became an ace in the 2nd half. Damn Yankees and the contract they signed him too

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 05:03 PM
Looks like Contreras will be the one out if someone gives the sox an overwhelming offer......

"Our ultimate desire ... was to keep this team intact," Williams said. "It may turn out that someone overwhelms us with an offer for Jose." - KW

White Sox sign Garland to three-year, $29-million contract (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AiseA.CXYqpQd8vDCHxIzI45nYcB?slug=ap-whitesox-garland&prov=ap&type=lgns) (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AiseA.CXYqpQd8vDCHxIzI45nYcB?slug=ap-whitesox-garland&prov=ap&type=lgns)By ANDREW SELIGMAN, AP Sports Writer
December 28, 2005 (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AiseA.CXYqpQd8vDCHxIzI45nYcB?slug=ap-whitesox-garland&prov=ap&type=lgns)

that quote is from this AP article on yahoo sports.

soxfanatlanta
12-28-2005, 05:13 PM
Looks like Contreras will be the one out if someone gives the sox an overwhelming offer......

"Our ultimate desire ... was to keep this team intact," Williams said. "It may turn out that someone overwhelms us with an offer for Jose." - KW

White Sox sign Garland to three-year, $29-million contract (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AiseA.CXYqpQd8vDCHxIzI45nYcB?slug=ap-whitesox-garland&prov=ap&type=lgns)By ANDREW SELIGMAN, AP Sports Writer
December 28, 2005 (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news;_ylt=AiseA.CXYqpQd8vDCHxIzI45nYcB?slug=ap-whitesox-garland&prov=ap&type=lgns)

that quote is from this AP article on yahoo sports.

I can see why KW chose to sign JG to a 3 year gig, his prime years are ahead of him. It pains me to see Contreras be on the block though; he came up big time towards the end of the regular season. Perhaps there is something percitating already with another team.

Then again, who knows what is in the heart of KW...

http://www.serialexperience.com/image_gallery/Shadow.JPG

salty99
12-28-2005, 05:14 PM
I wonder what an "overwhelming" offer might be? We still need to find at least 1 maybe 2 relief pitchers to round out the club. Oh yeah and get Crede locked up for 3 more years as well.

ilsox7
12-28-2005, 05:15 PM
I wonder what an "overwhelming" offer might be? We still need to find at least 1 maybe 2 relief pitchers to round out the club. Oh yeah and get Crede locked up for 3 more years as well.

Crede is locked up via arbitration.

The Racehorse
12-28-2005, 05:39 PM
Well, looks like the real Jon Garland just stood up! :cool:

:bandance:

jabrch
12-28-2005, 05:44 PM
I am stunned. I totally had him pegged for gone.

Let's assume he'd have gotten 7mm in arbitration this year anyhow, so it is a 2 year, 11mm per extension. Meanwhile, Toronto and Texas had to give 5 years to Burnett and Milwood.

I just wonder what is next. I totally Garland was going to be traded.

Any chance BM stays in the minors a bit to start the year?

chisox77
12-28-2005, 05:46 PM
This has been an excellent offseason.

The Garland re-signing is great news, and allows the White Sox to have a strong hand in the pitching department for another two to three years.

Another thing: I love the idea of having six starters going into the 2006 season. The deal for Javier Vasquez was smart, very smart, since he is signed through another two years. Look at the age of the White Sox rotation - all going into their late 20s (Vasquez turning 29 or 30), except Contreras (34???).

As for Contreras, I would be inclined to keep him through his last year (even if a contract agreement can't be reached), because I believe his greatest value to the Sox would be keep him for another year - no trade - you never know about pitching health from year to year. It is always good to have options with quality starting pitchers, and if a trade is a possibility, it may be better to wait until the midseason point, where the price for pitching goes even higher, and if the Sox figure that they can promote McCarthy at that point and deal Contreras, they could ask for more in return, and even get it. But for now, it's best to keep the starters - all six of them!

:cool:

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 05:53 PM
Notes: Success brings payroll increase (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/content/printer_friendly/cws/y2005/m12/d28/c1287639.jsp)


"As these players were added to the roster, the White Sox payroll also quietly but steadily escalated. During a conference call announcing Jon Garland's new three-year, $27 million deal, Williams estimated that the 2006 payroll for his team will come in at $95 million. Even with this jump of $20 million from 2005, Williams stated that chairman Jerry Reinsdorf gave him only one edict in regard to the upcoming season.
Reinsdorf wants to win the World Series title once again."

"We must win again and then possibly win again after that to change the culture. Jerry has taken on a huge financial gamble to try to win it again. I'm hoping I'm right or someone will have a lot of answering to do, and that someone will be me."


I LIKE!!!!! I LIKE!!!!! :)

SOecks
12-28-2005, 05:58 PM
Awesome quotes by KW there. If I could use one word to describe this man it is COJONES. What a badass.

KyWhiSoxFan
12-28-2005, 05:59 PM
I have one word to say: Wow. I never expected Garland to sign with the Sox. I'm sure glad he did, but thought he would be traded before the season started. I figured JR would never pay that kind of money for another pitcher, with so much already on the books.

Clearly:
A) JR is still drinking champagne and when KW calls to ask, "Hey, Jerry, can we sign John to a three-year contract for almost $10-million per year," JR says, "Sure. It's only money."
or
B) JR got a whole lot more in revenues from the playoffs and is getting a lot more in revenues from season ticket sales than we ever could imagine.

JR is doing what he did with the Bulls: When he got a champion he put it all back into keeping the team intact. This is also the Sox's chance to win back the city, which is an opportunity that does not come around very often.

Brian26
12-28-2005, 06:02 PM
Yep. The Sox just won a world championship. The notion that we still have five healthy arms in the rotation is a bit far-fetched. I'll take my chances with five arms plus one extra one just in case. There are a lot of innings to be pitched in 2006. McCarthy will get his chance. Book it.

I'm guessing Kenny sees it the same way, too.



I'm with you 100% on this one, PHG. There's no reason to go out and give Contreras away now just because we might have an extra SP. Nothing on paper ever seems to turn out the way it was intended to anyway. Let's go out with all of the guns blazing and see what happens.

Lprof
12-28-2005, 06:03 PM
This has been an excellent offseason.

The Garland re-signing is great news, and allows the White Sox to have a strong hand in the pitching department for another two to three years.

Another thing: I love the idea of having six starters going into the 2006 season. The deal for Javier Vasquez was smart, very smart, since he is signed through another two years. Look at the age of the White Sox rotation - all going into their late 20s (Vasquez turning 29 or 30), except Contreras (34???).

As for Contreras, I would be inclined to keep him through his last year (even if a contract agreement can't be reached), because I believe his greatest value to the Sox would be keep him for another year - no trade - you never know about pitching health from year to year. It is always good to have options with quality starting pitchers, and if a trade is a possibility, it may be better to wait until the midseason point, where the price for pitching goes even higher, and if the Sox figure that they can promote McCarthy at that point and deal Contreras, they could ask for more in return, and even get it. But for now, it's best to keep the starters - all six of them!

:cool:Keep in mind that KW is worried about this crazy world baseball thing--insurance is even more important this year than in the past. This guy is an amazing GM--and I remember the crap that JR got for naming him over Dan Evans (I think that was his name; I may be drawing a blank, since it was a long time ago). By the way, how DID Evans' tenure as GM of the Dodgers work out?:gulp:

chisox77
12-28-2005, 06:04 PM
Good post, SoxFan83, because this payroll reflects the willingness to spend money, yet at the same time (in relative terms) reveals a sane approach to salaries and budgets.

I believe that in an earlier post, someone estimated that the White Sox will average at least 32,000 per game in 06. That is a conservative estimate (and it's always smart to estimate figures on the conservative side). Just from my recent experience of renewing my partial plan, and the seats that were available, as opposed to what is available now (even before single game tickets go on sale - only ticket plans can be bought right now), my guess would be around 35,000 to 36,000 per game, AT THIS POINT.

The point is, the White Sox front office has allowed the payroll to increase because they know from the ticket sales that they will be able to afford it. The cycle of success has allowed the Sox to operate from a position of strength.

Beauty35thStreet
12-28-2005, 06:06 PM
Good move by Kenny. Realistically, the odds are that keeping Garland is a better move than keeping Jose if it comes down to that, even if I personally don't like that. For this year, I ideally would rather have Jose than Garland, but realize with age/money, Garland is probably the better gamble. Who knows, maybe Vasquez will be on the block. When someone says, "overwhelming offer" I think that pretty much says that Jose is gone. BMac definately won't be in Charlotte, there's been too much stock put into him by everyone. Plus Ozzie keeps talking about bullpen whenevery BMac is mentioned. He'd sooner be traded than in Charlotte.

I have one word to say: Wow. I never expected Garland to sign with the Sox. I'm sure glad he did, but thought he would be traded before the season started. I figured JR would never pay that kind of money for another pitcher, with so much already on the books.

Clearly:
A) JR is still drinking champagne and when KW calls to ask, "Hey, Jerry, can we sign John to a three-year contract for almost $10-million per year," JR says, "Sure. It's only money."
or
B) JR got a whole lot more in revenues from the playoffs and is getting a lot more in revenues from season ticket sales than we ever could imagine.

JR is doing what he did with the Bulls: When he got a champion he put it all back into keeping the team intact. This is also the Sox's chance to win back the city, which is an opportunity that does not come around very often.

slavko
12-28-2005, 06:12 PM
It hasn't been mentioned, but I think KW would pull the trigger on Freddy Garcia if the right offer came along. I'm not looking to stir the pot here, but JG is my idea of the foundation of the staff. I'm still convinced some one of the Big Six will be traded.

Brian26
12-28-2005, 06:16 PM
This team is destined to be a dynasty!

I'm not sure there's such a thing as a "dynasty" in baseball. Other than the Yankees machine of '96-'01, the only other team to repeat a World Series win in the last 25 years was the Blue Jays. Hopefully the Sox can do it. Everything on paper looks good so far.

Wsoxmike59
12-28-2005, 06:18 PM
You don't get two first round picks, you get two sandwich picks, I after the first round and one after the second round.


Mmmmmm 2 Sandwich picks!!!

http://www.bugio.org/crisviegas/HomerEatingSub.jpg

KRS1
12-28-2005, 06:19 PM
Makes me wonder what else is up. McCarthy is ready and not well-suited to relief (due to prep issues. He's a starter) Seems to me KW is not the type to let assets gather dust. I predict we'll be hearing from him on another Wednesday soon. If they keep all 6, I wouldn't be surprised if Bmac starts season in Charlotte.

Of course there is one nightmare scenario for us FOCY, and that's Bmac beating Vazquez out in the spring. Don't tell me it can't happen. Their stuff is very similar and Bmac has much larger cojones.

Their stuff is really not similar at all. Vaz throws a 95mph 4-seamer, a 3-6 91-93 2 seamer, 72-78 curve, 80-83 change-up, and an 83-85 slider. Bmac last year threw a 92(at his very best) 4-seamer, a 2-7 88 mph 2-seamer, a curve at about 75, and a screw/change at 78. Other than the fact that both of their curves are wicked and their changes go left to right how is that similar stuff?

Palehose13
12-28-2005, 06:19 PM
Notes: Success brings payroll increase (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/content/printer_friendly/cws/y2005/m12/d28/c1287639.jsp)


"As these players were added to the roster, the White Sox payroll also quietly but steadily escalated. During a conference call announcing Jon Garland's new three-year, $27 million deal, Williams estimated that the 2006 payroll for his team will come in at $95 million. Even with this jump of $20 million from 2005, Williams stated that chairman Jerry Reinsdorf gave him only one edict in regard to the upcoming season.
Reinsdorf wants to win the World Series title once again."

"We must win again and then possibly win again after that to change the culture. Jerry has taken on a huge financial gamble to try to win it again. I'm hoping I'm right or someone will have a lot of answering to do, and that someone will be me."


I LIKE!!!!! I LIKE!!!!! :)

Wow. I love Kenny Williams! :D:

Brian26
12-28-2005, 06:20 PM
If the choice was Contreras for 3 years or Vazquez for 3 years, it would be a tough decision to make but I think I'd have to go with Jose.

Vazquez isn't going anywhere. He's been on KW's wishlist for 3 years now, and Ozzie was salivating over the guy in 2004 after he shut us down with the Yankees.

Brian26
12-28-2005, 06:26 PM
Even with this jump of $20 million from 2005, Williams stated that chairman Jerry Reinsdorf gave him only one edict in regard to the upcoming season.
Reinsdorf wants to win the World Series title once again."

Everyone is giving props to Kenny for this signing, but maybe the true credit deserves to go to JR for ponying up the money for this. JR has always said if the Sox win and the fans come out, he would spend the money. Now he's making due on his promise.

rookie
12-28-2005, 06:27 PM
Notes: Success brings payroll increase (http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/content/printer_friendly/cws/y2005/m12/d28/c1287639.jsp)


"As these players were added to the roster, the White Sox payroll also quietly but steadily escalated. During a conference call announcing Jon Garland's new three-year, $27 million deal, Williams estimated that the 2006 payroll for his team will come in at $95 million. Even with this jump of $20 million from 2005, Williams stated that chairman Jerry Reinsdorf gave him only one edict in regard to the upcoming season.
Reinsdorf wants to win the World Series title once again."

"We must win again and then possibly win again after that to change the culture. Jerry has taken on a huge financial gamble to try to win it again. I'm hoping I'm right or someone will have a lot of answering to do, and that someone will be me."


I LIKE!!!!! I LIKE!!!!! :)
Welcome back Jon, way to go Kenny, IMO start the season with 6 pitchers, and Jerry if you want another ring, I'm not gonna argue!:smile:

batmanZoSo
12-28-2005, 06:31 PM
Vazquez isn't going anywhere. He's been on KW's wishlist for 3 years now, and Ozzie was salivating over the guy in 2004 after he shut us down with the Yankees. edit: meant to reply to this post /\


Given the choice, I'd go with Vazquez. I have a lot of faith in this team's coaching staff, and with good reason I think, that they'll get Vazquez to pitch like he's capable in Chicago. Coop does an excellent job, as does Pierzynski, and Vazquez is no longer under the NY microscope nor on a god-awful team. Both of which have been hallmarks of his career. This is the environment where he can really succeed. And he's still pretty young, at least 5 years younger than Contreras (?).

ShoelessJoeS
12-28-2005, 06:42 PM
Wow, I didn't see this coming...:bandance:

We now have Buehrle, Garcia, Garland and Vazquez locked up through the '07 season, given that the Sox will exercise their option for Mark after '06. Along with Dye, Paulie and Thome locked up through '07 as well as Pierzynski to comand the pitching staff, I agree with chisoxfanatic in that we could be seeing Chicago's first baseball dynasty!!!

Here's to a great balance of pitching and power for years to come :gulp:

rmusacch
12-28-2005, 07:05 PM
Wow, I didn't see this coming...:bandance:

We now have Buehrle, Garcia, Garland and Vazquez locked up through the '07 season, given that the Sox will exercise their option for Mark after '06. Along with Dye, Paulie and Thome locked up through '07 as well as Pierzynski to comand the pitching staff, I agree with chisoxfanatic in that we could be seeing Chicago's first baseball dynasty!!!

Here's to a great balance of pitching and power for years to come :gulp:

I hope you are right but I also thought that the Bears were going to be a dynasty in the 80's.

ShoelessJoeS
12-28-2005, 07:07 PM
I hope you are right but I also thought that the Bears were going to be a dynasty in the 80's.
In Kenny We Trust!

TaylorStSox
12-28-2005, 07:08 PM
I'd like to take this opportunity to issue a public apology to Jon Garland.

Honestly I didn't think there was any way he was going to re-up without testing free agency. I was in favor of trading him away for this very reason. He just proved me wrong.

Great signing by KW. I really hope this doesn't mean the end of Jose Contreras's days here in Chicago, but I'm very happy to have Garland in the fold for another 3 years.

Cheers Jon! :gulp:


Alot of Sox fans owe Garland an apology. Right now, we have 5 starters who have been considered number 1's at one point in the last 3 years. I dig it.

Daver
12-28-2005, 07:09 PM
Alot of Sox fans owe Garland an apology. Right now, we have 5 starters who have been considered number 1's at one point in the last 3 years. I dig it.

I don't owe Jon Garland an apology.

TaylorStSox
12-28-2005, 07:17 PM
I don't owe Jon Garland an apology.

Maybe you misread the word, "alot."

Brian26
12-28-2005, 07:24 PM
Maybe you misread the word, "alot."

"Alot" is not a word.

TaylorStSox
12-28-2005, 07:25 PM
"Alot" is not a word. :D:

A wordsmith, I am not. :redneck

Lprof
12-28-2005, 07:53 PM
Wow, I didn't see this coming...:bandance:

We now have Buehrle, Garcia, Garland and Vazquez locked up through the '07 season, given that the Sox will exercise their option for Mark after '06. Along with Dye, Paulie and Thome locked up through '07 as well as Pierzynski to comand the pitching staff, I agree with chisoxfanatic in that we could be seeing Chicago's first baseball dynasty!!!

Here's to a great balance of pitching and power for years to come :gulp: And with Veeck adding power hitter Roy Sievers, we're a cinch to repeat in 1960!:smile: And with Reinsdorf and Einhorn adding Tom Seaver, how can we not repeat in 1984?! :smile: Oh well, right now,I'm having a lot (alot?)of fun; to hell with the past! This is a new era! :gulp:

ShoelessJoeS
12-28-2005, 08:07 PM
And with Veeck adding power hitter Roy Sievers, we're a cinch to repeat in 1960!:smile: And with Reinsdorf and Einhorn adding Tom Seaver, how can we not repeat in 1984?!
Thanks for ruining the moment :redneck

ode to veeck
12-28-2005, 08:09 PM
I want to start off by saying I'm very happy with the signing of Garland, but does anyone else think a possible sign & trade is in the works? I just have that feeling that this gives KW more barginning power now that he can tell teams that Garland is going to be locked up for them for 3yrs for under 30mil.

Anyone else have that feeling too or am I way off here?


you're way off, we're going with the horses that got us here

ode to veeck
12-28-2005, 08:12 PM
KW signs a Cy Young contending pitcher for slightly below market value... sounds like moneyball to me.

Bull**** , there ain't no FOBBs nor ****ing moneyball around here

Lprof
12-28-2005, 08:13 PM
Thanks for ruining the moment :redneck Sorry; just a little gallows humor. The difference between now and then, of course, is that THIS time, WE WON IT ALL! I frankly think that, of course barring injuries, next year should be pretty exciting. But whatever happens next year, we won the whole thing in 05; no one can ever take that away from me.:smile:

ChiSoxlukes
12-28-2005, 08:14 PM
There is no sign and trade in the works. KW isn't going to mistreat JG like that. Sounds like Jose may be the one who is dealt if anybody.

ShoelessJoeS
12-28-2005, 08:19 PM
Sorry; just a little gallows humor. The difference between now and then, of course, is that THIS time, WE WON IT ALL! I frankly think that, of course barring injuries, next year should be pretty exciting. But whatever happens next year, we won the whole thing in 05; no one can ever take that away from me.:smile:I conisder myself lucky that I only had to wait 21 years for this. I was also spoiled at a young age with the 6 Bulls championships, but who's complaining....:D:

ode to veeck
12-28-2005, 08:25 PM
:tomatoaward: :tomatoaward:

pretty good day for an offseason, the mound studs are still in the stable

Jjav829
12-28-2005, 08:31 PM
What a nice surprise.

It's all good, especially if we re-sign Contreras, our best pitcher even if he's not our most popular one.
Player A:
2001: 16-8, 3.29 ERA, 221.1 innings
2002: 19-12, 3.58 ERA, 239 innings
2003: 14-14, 4,14 ERA, 230.1 innings
2004: 16-10, 3.89 ERA, 245.1 innings
2005: 16-8, 3.12 ERA, 237.2 innings

Player B:
2003: 7-2, 3.30 ERA, 71 innings
2004: 13-9, 5.50 ERA, 170.1 innings
2005: 15-7, 3.61 ERA, 205.2 innings

Care to guess which Sox player is Player A and which is Player B? B is Jose Contreras. A is Mark Buehrle. Mark Buehrle is our best pitcher. Please don't insult him by saying that Jose Contreras is better. Contreras had a nice 2nd half in 2005 and a nice postseason run. When he strings together five years in a row like Buehrle, then you can compare the two. Until then, saying that Contreras is better than Buehrle is a huge insult to our true ace.

soxfan1983
12-28-2005, 08:42 PM
I conisder myself lucky that I only had to wait 21 years for this. I was also spoiled at a young age with the 6 Bulls championships, but who's complaining....:D:

same here man. now if the bears can win the super bowl.... that would be awesome. i was only 2 when they won it in 85

DickAllen72
12-28-2005, 08:42 PM
Mmmmmm 2 Sandwich picks!!!

http://www.bugio.org/crisviegas/HomerEatingSub.jpg

Post of the week!!! :D:

CubKilla
12-28-2005, 09:08 PM
Makes me wonder how many here would be blasting this deal if Garland signed elsewhere for, in essence, 3/$30 million after 1 good season with posts such as, "overpaid" and "one good season does not make a career."

soxlover
12-28-2005, 09:58 PM
I am pretty happy with the deal. I do believe that Contreas is a goner:(:

Lprof
12-28-2005, 10:12 PM
Makes me wonder how many here would be blasting this deal if Garland signed elsewhere for, in essence, 3/$30 million after 1 good season with posts such as, "overpaid" and "one good season does not make a career." And they would be wrong.

SouthSidein05
12-28-2005, 10:30 PM
I am pretty happy with the deal. I do believe that Contreas is a goner:(:

That's what I'm afraid of. I'd much rather sign Contreras long-term than Garland.

TornLabrum
12-28-2005, 10:38 PM
I think Contreras will be back.

SouthSidein05
12-28-2005, 10:40 PM
With Buehrle and Garcia in the WBC, Kenny might decide that a 6-man rotation is necissary. Our starters(except McCarthy) each pitched at least 200 innings last season, and they might want to make it a 6-man rotation, stretch things out a bit.

TheVulture
12-28-2005, 10:46 PM
I agree with you. I have always felt Jose is at his highest value right now but no one wants him gone. I think a starting staff of Buehrle, Garcia, McCarthy, Vazquez, and Garland would be sick with major youth. They are all relatively young minus Garcia who isn't old by any means. I feel we could add so much with trading Contreras too.

That's because, despite age, contract status and longterm value, Contreras is one of the sox two best pitchers as of right now. He was the one who stepped up the most under pressure, carrying the Sox staff during the teams swoon and pitching brilliantly in the post season. If I had to bet on a Sox to be CY next year, I'd put my money on Contreras. Maybe he's too old to project 3 or 4 years, but as of right now he is just nasty and I'll give him through at least August to prove me wrong. And then we'll have McCarthy, beautiful.

SouthSidein05
12-28-2005, 10:49 PM
The only probalem with dealing Contreras is we wouldn't be acquiring any big name players. The Sox don't have the payroll flexibility anymore to acquire a MLB Ready star. If anything they'll trade Contreras for a relief pitcher and a top-tier prospect, which wouldn't be all that bad. I'm just a big supporter of Jose and I don't want to see him leave becuase I believe something clicked last season. Nonetheless, a stud-reliever along with a pitching prospect could do us good right now.

FielderJones
12-28-2005, 10:51 PM
I hope you are right but I also thought that the Bears were going to be a dynasty in the 80's.

The Bears of the 80s were being run by Michael McCaskey. Need I say more?

GoSox2K3
12-28-2005, 10:58 PM
I think Contreras will be back.

I Agree. I don't see JC going anywhere anytime soon. The way he's pitched since the all-star break, I'd hate to see the Sox trade him away and not have the benefit of having him for '06. Remember, this guy earned the 1st game start in each of our playoff series over our ace Buehrle. Unless we think that 2nd half run of his was a fluke, I think it's unlikely that trading Contreras will improve the Sox chances for repeating in 2006.

With 5 starters locked up for 2007, the Sox can afford to stick with Contreras for '06 even without an extension and even if he becomes a free agent. If he helps us win another WS in 2006 and then leaves as a free agent, then so be it. We get a 2nd championship and we still have an outstanding starting 5 for 2007.

It's just like KW said in that interview that's quoted here - unless they get an "overwhelming" offer, they're not looking to trade JC.

Jjav829
12-28-2005, 11:24 PM
Interesting quote from KW.

"I gave both Jon and Jose the same phone call after the [Javier] Vazquez trade was done: 'We love you and we want you back,'" Williams said. "But we have some grand plans here and we're not going to go forward without securing the future of our starting pitching. If you want be part of it, it's wise to cut to the chase and tell us what you want, and if not, we respect that as a personal and business decision. You move on and we'll move down the road to explore our options.

"Jon was the one who responded to that."
KW went on to say that he wants Contreras back and would like McCarthy to get more experience, add on some weight and act as insurance for the other five. This doesn't sound promising though.

The Sox and Contreras have sent proposals back and forth for a contract extension but don't appear to be close. Contreras, 34, is believed to want three guaranteed years at between $11 million and $12 million per year, while the White Sox are short on both sides of that.

"We have talked; we have not gotten too far," agent Jaime Torres said Wednesday. "Jose is interested in staying in Chicago, but the market has been set [this winter]. Jose wants to stay, but it's a business, and we have to make sure his next contract is a good one."
$11-$12 million per year over 3 years? No thanks. Also, at some point we're going to have to go cheap with one starting pitcher. I doubt this team will have a $50 million rotation.

Link (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-home-headlines)

Tragg
12-28-2005, 11:27 PM
$11-$12 million per year over 3 years? No thanks. Also, at some point we're going to have to go cheap with one starting pitcher. I doubt this team will have a $50 million rotation.

Link (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-home-headlines) Agreed

And while I am the eternal optimist in what the Sox can get for their players in trade, I do think Contreras on a 1 year contract is more attractive than Garland on the one year contract. Contreras, at his best, is a top of the rotation pitcher; Garland really isn't. Maybe a decent reliever and a few prospects.

Ward Hershberger
12-28-2005, 11:51 PM
I'm very encouraged by the JG signing as it shows how strong the Sox commitment is to starting pitching.
From here I hope this means KW will try to keep everyone we stil have, thru at least 2006. I don't want to see anyone else from the '05 team leave. Otherwise, we'll have guys wearing 20 different uniforms at the ring ceremony.
The everyday line up will already be stronger overall with Thome, and if Anderson can't do an adequate job in CF, Mackowiak can.
With 6 starters all capable of pitching complete games, we don't need a real deep pen, but probably need one more releiver.
Also add a true, quality defensive shotstop to the bench, and at that point KW can consider it the 7th day.

balke
12-28-2005, 11:52 PM
Not a bad contract in my opinion. You give Jon 1 year to prove he can do it again for what he's now worth (7 Mil) and if he can indeed do it again or better then he is worth the 10 mil the next season. If not, you trade him to someone who's willing to take a chance. I like this pitching staff going into next season, I hope the Sox stick with the plan. 5 stud pitchers, it would take possibly 3 big injuries to the staff to stop the Sox from winning steadily. Then you have some good offense behind those pitchers theoretically. I'm excited for next season, and contending with the Red Sox new team and whoever else steps up.

soxfanreggie
12-29-2005, 12:04 AM
I agree with this next year proving himself. I don't know about Contreras getting 11-12 mil per year. He did have a great run in the second half, but I don't think we have room in the budget. Especially when you have Burls and Garcia up for new contracts soon.

FarWestChicago
12-29-2005, 12:08 AM
Makes me wonder how many here would be blasting this deal if Garland signed elsewhere for, in essence, 3/$30 million after 1 good season with posts such as, "overpaid" and "one good season does not make a career."Yes, there is still one true Cloud. :cool:

:darkcloud:

:darkclouds:

samram
12-29-2005, 01:16 AM
Interesting quote from KW.

"I gave both Jon and Jose the same phone call after the [Javier] Vazquez trade was done: 'We love you and we want you back,'" Williams said. "But we have some grand plans here and we're not going to go forward without securing the future of our starting pitching. If you want be part of it, it's wise to cut to the chase and tell us what you want, and if not, we respect that as a personal and business decision. You move on and we'll move down the road to explore our options.

"Jon was the one who responded to that."


KW went on to say that he wants Contreras back and would like McCarthy to get more experience, add on some weight and act as insurance for the other five. This doesn't sound promising though.


$11-$12 million per year over 3 years? No thanks. Also, at some point we're going to have to go cheap with one starting pitcher. I doubt this team will have a $50 million rotation.

Link (http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-051228soxgarland,1,5169643.story?coll=cs-home-headlines)

Huh. Interesting. This was my post from back on 12/20 in regards to Contreras's situation:

Eh, big deal. I was posting last week that this wasn't as close to getting done as a lot of people think. I wonder if KW can play JC and JG off one another- basically whoever wants to stay gets the money- and then trade the other.

TheOldRoman
12-29-2005, 01:58 AM
Agreed

And while I am the eternal optimist in what the Sox can get for their players in trade, I do think Contreras on a 1 year contract is more attractive than Garland on the one year contract. Contreras, at his best, is a top of the rotation pitcher; Garland really isn't. Maybe a decent reliever and a few prospects.
I somewhat agree with that. On a one year basis only, Contreras can give you more than Garland. However, very few teams would go into a season with a specific desire to acquire a big money player for only one season and then let him go. That happens at midseason when a team is in contention. However, if a team puts together a big package for a player in the offseason, they usually plan on resigning him. Garland would have had more value than Jose because he is young. Most teams would trade for Garland in the offseason with full intentions of resigning him. If we traded Garland to the Orioles for Tejada and they immediately signed him to a 4-5 year deal, it is a good trade for them. Nobody in their right mind will sign Contreras to that long of a deal.

That is why Garland had more trade value before this deal. He may not be the #1 for a given team next year, but he will be a stud for them for the next decade as long as they keep on re-upping him. Contreras is a really good pitcher, but he is at least 32 years old, and he throws hard. Any team would love to have him in their rotation, but I just don't see teams putting together huge packages to get him like the would have with Garland.

That being said, I am pretty confident that KW will keep all six starters in 06 and let Jose leave in 07. Another possibility is KW resinging Jose to a 2 year deal with an option for a third year. The Orioles, who have showed interest in Vazquez several times in the past, would then ship us Tejada for three years of him.

Hoffdaddydmb
12-29-2005, 03:13 AM
Remember when General Disarray was thinking about a 4 man rotation? We now have 6 QUALITY starters to chose from! I love the possibilities.!
P.S. I had my picture with the World Series Trophy today! :D::bandance::yup:

doublem23
12-29-2005, 07:45 AM
:o:

I am literally stunned.

bighurt2719
12-29-2005, 08:36 AM
great move, KW. i never trusted that stupid rumor about a 4 team trade involving the flubs, O's, and yanks, was it?

Hitmen77
12-29-2005, 08:50 AM
Agreed

And while I am the eternal optimist in what the Sox can get for their players in trade, I do think Contreras on a 1 year contract is more attractive than Garland on the one year contract. Contreras, at his best, is a top of the rotation pitcher; Garland really isn't. Maybe a decent reliever and a few prospects.

I hope the Sox don't make this trade. I'm not convinced that both McCarthy and Vazquez will have stellar seasons next year as starters. I'd rather the Sox kept Jose for '06 and let him help us win another World Series. Trading him for a middle reliever and prospects will not improve our chance to repeat in '06.

Lprof
12-29-2005, 08:57 AM
I hope the Sox don't make this trade. I'm not convinced that both McCarthy and Vazquez will have stellar seasons next year as starters. I'd rather the Sox kept Jose for '06 and let him help us win another World Series. Trading him for a middle reliever and prospects will not improve our chance to repeat in '06. My sentiments exactly; if you somehow cannot package Jose for Tejada (and it certainly doesn't sound like you can), let's keep him, and have (going into the season, at least) the best rotation in the league, if not on the planet. And it sounds from his quotes that Kenny is pretty much thinking the same thing. It is highly likely that Jose is a lot more important to us than anything he could bring in trade.

SOecks
12-29-2005, 08:58 AM
If you haven't already, go to mlb.com and let that Fastcast video start playing. It leads off with a nice montage and some love for Garland. I normally hate those things but this one is really good. Talks a lot about the Sox.

Lprof
12-29-2005, 09:04 AM
With Buehrle and Garcia in the WBC, Kenny might decide that a 6-man rotation is necissary. Our starters(except McCarthy) each pitched at least 200 innings last season, and they might want to make it a 6-man rotation, stretch things out a bit.The trouble with this plan is that there are so many off days and rainouts early in the season that they wouldn't get much of a chance to get their rhythm going.

Fenway
12-29-2005, 04:42 PM
They talking White Sox on the Yankees board

White Sox sign Garland to 3 year extension (http://forums.nyyfans.com/showthread.php?t=92123)

Saddlebags05
12-29-2005, 04:58 PM
Kenny does it again. I think having 6 starters is brilliant. McCarthy will be fine coming out of the pen, and then as soon as someone goes down he can be plugged right in there. This is the best pitching staff top to bottom that I've ever seen. And putting Thome in there makes this a team that will have the abillity to beat you any number of ways. I think you go to spring training with this team the way it is now, and wait until things aren't going so well, and then flip Contreras for whatever holes you need to plug. The White Sox have a shot at being a very good team for the next 2-3 years, and that's because they have 6 pitchers that every team would want. This also gives us enough starters, where someone can step up in 2 years and assume Buehrle's role, because as we all know he will be a Cardinal.

itsnotrequired
12-29-2005, 05:41 PM
They talking White Sox on the Yankees board

White Sox sign Garland to 3 year extension (http://forums.nyyfans.com/showthread.php?t=92123)

Pretty funny read. "JeffWeaverFan" isn't feeling the deal at all and one of the reasons he uses is that, surprise, surprise, Jon doesn't get a ton of Ks. To wit:

I think that a pitcher wants the K because that is the best thing a pitcher can do. If he K's a guy, there is no chance of a bloop hit falling. Your trying to make great pitches and those great pitches will result in K's.

Garland will not revert back to his old form because he decreased his walks. Other than that (and not to take away from that because that's huge) he is still the same pitcher from what I can see.

So, to answer the question, why would his ERA decrease if he is getting guys to groundout instead of strikeout? Well, firstly, they don't always groundout with Garland. The G/F ratio was only 1.44 last season and for his career it's 1.33. Anyways, the point is that when you strike a guy out, there's no chance he gets on base (except for a past ball but that is very, very rare). A groundball can find a hole. A flyball won't always go to a fielder. Garland was lucky last year that his grounders and flyballs found fielders more often than the norm. Next year it will probably be closer to the average. And some other years, when you aren't striking guys out, you might get unlucky.

I wonder what his take on MB is? Must think he has been lucky for the last four years.

:rolleyes:

I'm of the opinion that based upon the market and Jon's age, this is a good deal for the Sox. With a guy like BJ Ryan getting 5/$55 million, 3/$29 for Garland is a steal.

Fenway
12-29-2005, 05:45 PM
Pretty funny read. "JeffWeaverFan" isn't feeling the deal at all and one of the reasons he uses is that, surprise, surprise, Jon doesn't get a ton of Ks. To wit:



How would a fan of Jeff Weaver know good pitching?

Chisox003
12-29-2005, 05:50 PM
How would a fan of Jeff Weaver know good pitching?
Ya, but he backs it up:

Last year he had an ERA of 3.50 which is quite good. But his DIPS was 4.39 - not so good.

His LD% was 17% or 2% below average. He K'd a guy 13% of the time which is 3% below average.
:?: :o:

Huh??

Is this for real?

TheDarkGundam
12-29-2005, 06:25 PM
I love how I can get Sox news from here before I get the official e-mail about it from Whitesox.com.
Good Work Kenny! :bandance:

thomas35forever
12-29-2005, 08:18 PM
Kenny never fails to disappoint us, does he?

samram
12-29-2005, 10:17 PM
Kenny never fails to disappoint us, does he?

What did he do to disappoint us?

KRS1
12-29-2005, 10:32 PM
Kenny never fails to disappoint us, does he?


I hope you meant for this to be in teal, I know people here were talking trade but that was only b/c they thought Jon was going to command 12mil per in a 5 year deal. Either way I'm calling this one in
911 operator: Yes sir what is your emergency
Me: Yes, someone just slandered Kenny I need the Teal Police, immediately!!!!!!!!!!!!!

Lprof
12-29-2005, 10:44 PM
I hope you meant for this to be in teal, I know people here were talking trade but that was only b/c they thought Jon was going to command 12mil per in a 5 year deal. Either way I'm calling this one in
911 operator: Yes sir what is your emergency
Me: Yes, someone just slandered Kenny I need the Teal Police, immediately!!!!!!!!!!!!!I suppose his team could have won the series in fewer games.:redneck

Lprof
12-29-2005, 10:45 PM
I suppose his team could have won the series in fewer games.:redneckThat was supposed to be in teal, but I blew it.

Tragg
12-29-2005, 10:45 PM
"Garland was lucky last year that his grounders and flyballs found fielders more often than the norm. Next year it will probably be closer to the average. And some other years, when you aren't striking guys out, you might get unlucky."

That's BP logic 101 - just like winning 1 run games is all luck.