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duke of dorwood
12-26-2001, 08:03 PM
Heard on ESPN that he has signed with the Angels. If that is true, may be a good time to reopen the Erstad talks, without Garland.

duke of dorwood
12-26-2001, 08:05 PM
TEXT FROM ESPN

The Anaheim Angels on Wednesday strengthened their starting rotation -- and took a bite of out a division opponent at the same time -- by reaching agreement with free agent Aaron Sele, a right-handed starter with the Seattle Mariners.

Aaron Sele
Starting pitcher
Anaheim Angels
Profile


2001 SEASON STATISTICS
GM W L K BB ERA
34 15 5 114 51 3.60




The agreement is for a three-year contract worth between $20 million and $22 million.

The acquisition of Sele came as the Angels were still attempting to finalize a trade that would send first baseman Mo Vaughn to the New York Mets for starter Kevin Appier.

Daver
12-26-2001, 08:45 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
Heard on ESPN that he has signed with the Angels. If that is true, may be a good time to reopen the Erstad talks, without Garland.

Garland was the main player in the trade,the Sox replace his name with ?

duke of dorwood
12-26-2001, 08:56 PM
Well, with Appier on the way, Sele already signed. maybe a pitcher is not that priority now. With Vaughn gone, a first baseman or that type has to be on their list.

RichH55
12-26-2001, 08:59 PM
You mean :slowswing wasn't the man there??!?!?! NOOOO!!! And next you'll be telling me there is no Santa Claus

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:01 PM
Though on Erstad...IF...and that is a decent sized if, with the pitching the Angels just added, and the hitting they would be losing...C. Lee along with Singleton might help...and probably some minor league pitching as well...though its anyone guess

Chisox_cali
12-26-2001, 09:01 PM
Cant we give them Chris some minor leaguers and a minor league 1st baseman.

Daver
12-26-2001, 09:02 PM
Originally posted by duke of dorwood
Well, with Appier on the way, Sele already signed. maybe a pitcher is not that priority now. With Vaughn gone, a first baseman or that type has to be on their list.

Garland and Singleton were not a big enough "name",so are you suggesting Frank Thomas?

Other than him we have no "name" player to deal at that position,unless we can sell them a bill of goods that Carlos Lee is a misplaced place first baseman.

But then again what the hell do I know?

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:03 PM
WAIT....so the Angels can't deal Erstad because he's a name but they can trade Mo Vaughn? I'm not saying dealing Mo isn't an incredibly smart decesion, but that being said, isn't he a bigger name than Erstad.......I think that dealing Mo means they hold onto Erstad even harder, but the logic that led me to that could go either way, but I would still like to have a better CF than the debate that is Rowand-Singelton by Opening Day

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali
Cant we give them Chris some minor leaguers and a minor league 1st baseman.


I'm thinking thats way low....Garland was definitely the main part of the last package, not Chris, though that being said the minor league pitchers the Angels wanted are presumably still wanted and still tradeable...and KW and the Angels are obviously still talking(as per the recent deal they made)

Daver
12-26-2001, 09:05 PM
Originally posted by RichH55
WAIT....so the Angels can't deal Erstad because he's a name but they can trade Mo Vaughn? I'm not saying dealing Mo isn't an incredibly smart decesion, but that being said, isn't he a bigger name than Erstad.......I think that dealing Mo means they hold onto Erstad even harder, but the logic that led me to that could go either way, but I would still like to have a better CF than the debate that is Rowand-Singelton by Opening Day

Getting rid of Mo gains fans,not loses them,he has had a really bad career in Anaheim.

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:10 PM
Originally posted by daver


Getting rid of Mo gains fans,not loses them,he has had a really bad career in Anaheim.


Oh I'm not saying it wasn't a good deal baseball wise....dealing Mo..especially for a viable starting pitcher is a real nice move, but Mo is still a name was my point, and the reputation is that Angels fans are more name oriented rather than stats people(ala Cubs fans: Mark Grace is a Hall of Famer! BULL).....but that Erstad deal was a pretty good deal for the Angels from a baseball standpoint as well, but they nixed it on this mythical name reconigntion...granted MO makes a ton more, but Erstad isn't coming off a Hall of Fame year either

Daver
12-26-2001, 09:19 PM
Originally posted by RichH55



Oh I'm not saying it wasn't a good deal baseball wise....dealing Mo..especially for a viable starting pitcher is a real nice move, but Mo is still a name was my point, and the reputation is that Angels fans are more name oriented rather than stats people(ala Cubs fans: Mark Grace is a Hall of Famer! BULL).....but that Erstad deal was a pretty good deal for the Angels from a baseball standpoint as well, but they nixed it on this mythical name reconigntion...granted MO makes a ton more, but Erstad isn't coming off a Hall of Fame year either

It is not the fact that Erstad is a "name" player per se,but the fact that he is a fan favorite,and Angels fans are not as dumb as they are perceived to be,at least not the few that I know on the left coast.


But then again what the hell do I know?

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:27 PM
Originally posted by daver


It is not the fact that Erstad is a "name" player per se,but the fact that he is a fan favorite,and Angels fans are not as dumb as they are perceived to be,at least not the few that I know on the left coast.


But then again what the hell do I know?


Ok Daver those words finally got through my thick skull:) Gotta be tough to love baseball and be run by Disney....At least they aren't calling that team the Mighty Ducks...so it could be worse

Daver
12-26-2001, 09:31 PM
Originally posted by RichH55



Ok Daver those words finally got through my thick skull Gotta be tough to love baseball and be run by Disney....At least they aren't calling that team the Mighty Ducks...so it could be worse

I think they are waiting till after the CBA is in place to announce the name change.

:)

RichH55
12-26-2001, 09:35 PM
Originally posted by daver


I think they are waiting till after the CBA is in place to announce the name change.

:)


If I was the Players Union I would fight that alot harder than contraction:)

Daver
12-26-2001, 10:13 PM
Originally posted by RichH55



If I was the Players Union I would fight that alot harder than contraction:)

No reason to,it has nothing to do with making sure that baseball players remain the highest paid pro athletes on the planet.


But then again what the hell do I know?

SOXSINCE'70
12-26-2001, 10:42 PM
You could have fooled me.I thought Sele was going back to Texas to play with Paywad and the Gang.If the Halos get Appier,they should have a nice pitching rotation.
Me personally,I'd rather have Mulder,Hudson,Zito.

But,in the words of Daver himself,"What the Hell do I know?".

Foulke You
12-27-2001, 12:50 PM
I was really surprised that the M's let Sele get away. The Angels should be improved next year, especially if they get Appier too. Sele sure would've looked nice in a Sox uniform...



:reinsy
$27 million for a pitcher? Outrageous! How can I compete in a small market like Chicago? If only I was in Anaheim...

hold2dibber
12-27-2001, 01:05 PM
I think Sele was overvalued; he's had a nice little run over the last four or five years, but he's put in a ton of innings (suggesting to me that a break down is on the horizon), his Ws have decreased in each of the last four years (including last year, despite being on a team that won something like 160 games), and has been lousy in the playoffs. I would have loved to sign D. Wells to an incentive laden deal. I was really hoping the Mets would go into rebuilding mode and make Al Leiter available (I know, I'm living in fantasy land). But as things stand now, I still think they need to grab another proven starter. Jeff Suppan wouldn't be a bad option (and I'm guessing he could be had for maybe Jeff Liefer, Corwin Malone and a second tier minor leaguer). I hear a lot of people talking about the division being there for the Sox taking, but if you ask me, Minnesota, with Radke, Mays and Milton, is the favorite. The Sox need another pitcher to get it done.

Foulke You
12-27-2001, 02:04 PM
I think Joe Mays was a flash in the pan. Before last year, the only team that Mays dominated was the White Sox. He had several unproductive years previous to last year. Surprisingly the Sox have hit Radke rather well recently. I think the Twins were playing over their head last year as evidence to their 2nd half. You don't have Tom Kelly to guide the youngsters anymore. These things combined with all the bad karma associated with contraction. The players will be caught up in "Where will I play next year?" to concentrate on a pennant. will add up to a disappointing year for the Twinks in my opinion. The division is ours to lose and as I said before, that is what worries me...

czalgosz
12-27-2001, 02:28 PM
There's no way the Twins are serious contenders for the division in 2002. They fell apart for the same reason the Cubs did - they leaned too heavily on three pitchers. As the Cubs depended on Lieber and Wood to win for them, the Twins depended on Milton, Mays, and Radke. In modern baseball, you can't do that. A good rotation is very very nice, but in this day and age, even more important is a good bullpen. The Twins didn't have one, and Tom Kelly knew it. So by August, when Milton, Mays, and Radke were falling apart from exhaustion, the team fell apart.

Which makes me chuckle - what will Cub fans do when Tom Gordon falls back to his normal crappiness and starts blowing leads?

Huisj
12-27-2001, 03:30 PM
I think goodwin blowing leads isn't the only thing the cubs should worry about. How about blowing his elbow?

hold2dibber
12-27-2001, 04:16 PM
I agree that the Twins are flawed, but I think if you stack up our rotation against their's, you'd have to give them the nod at this point (I'm confident Buehrle will be good and Ritchie will be decent, but other than that it is nothing but question marks; and the loss of K. Wells and Lowe leaves the bullpen way too dependent upon guys with recently repaired labrums, rotator cuffs and elbows). That said, the Sox will have a much more potent offense than the Twins and the Indians, and I believe (foolish optimist that I am) that Clayton will be better this year and Valentin will be better simply because he will have a set position to play all year. One more solid starter should get us to the 88-92 win level, which should be enough to take the Division.