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Whitesox4ever
12-16-2005, 12:25 PM
My brother from NY just called me and said that mad dog russo is talking about a Jon Garland for Cliff Floyd trade..

miker
12-16-2005, 12:26 PM
The first problem is this comes from someone who calls himself "Mad Dog"...

gr8mexico
12-16-2005, 12:29 PM
My brother from NY just called me and said that mad dog russo is talking about a Jon Garland for Cliff Floyd trade.. LOL LOL LOL LOL That will never ever happend

patbooyah
12-16-2005, 12:29 PM
well, he's another hometown boy.

i'd imagine that kenny would want to sign him to an extension...

or at least have a plan on cutting down on his almost 100 k's?

Flight #24
12-16-2005, 12:30 PM
My brother from NY just called me and said that mad dog russo is talking about a Jon Garland for Cliff Floyd trade..He must have forgotten the "+Lastings Milledge" part of that trade. Floyd's a net negative to the Sox because of salary, so sending him over would actually mean the mets give up MORE in prospects.

pearso66
12-16-2005, 12:30 PM
if that was the case, there would have to be a milledge in the deal, along with their top pitching prospect. the Sox do not need Cliff Floyd

1917
12-16-2005, 12:32 PM
yuck

Whitesox4ever
12-16-2005, 12:35 PM
Floyd had a pretty good season last year with 273 Avg 34 Hr's and 98 Rbis .

Palehose13
12-16-2005, 12:38 PM
No way. The Mets are dreaming. Besides...

:hawk
"Where would he play?" :tongue:

HomeFish
12-16-2005, 12:42 PM
Sorry, Mets, you'll have to sign Garland to a $100 million deal next year instead.

spawn
12-16-2005, 12:51 PM
Uh...thanks, but no thanks.

Tekijawa
12-16-2005, 01:01 PM
I know one of his best friends from Highschool and he has told me on numerous occasions that Cliff wouldn't play for the Cubs, Whitesox, or Cardinals because he woudl have to spend his entire salary getting tickets for all of his relatives. This might have changed since I last spoke to the guy, we talked while drunk right after Hernandez stuck out Damon, but I doubt he would come here.

SOXintheBURGH
12-16-2005, 01:02 PM
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/bschalle/www/Baseball%20pics/garcia.jpg

Whitesox4ever
12-16-2005, 01:07 PM
Im still hoping that the Sox ship Garland to Balt for Tejada..

Randar68
12-16-2005, 01:08 PM
https://netfiles.uiuc.edu/bschalle/www/Baseball%20pics/garcia.jpg

Man, I love that pic!

DumpJerry
12-16-2005, 02:24 PM
I know one of his best friends from Highschool and he has told me on numerous occasions that Cliff wouldn't play for the Cubs, Whitesox, or Cardinals because he woudl have to spend his entire salary getting tickets for all of his relatives. This might have changed since I last spoke to the guy, we talked while drunk right after Hernandez stuck out Damon, but I doubt he would come here.
Look, KW's plan is to get as many guys who grew up Sox fans to play for the Sox because they won't ask for top $$$ at negotiation time because they are living their boyhood dream. In about two years, after the whole team is made up of fans like us, the White Sox will be WhiteSoxInteractive.com!:D:

Paulwny
12-16-2005, 02:49 PM
The Mike and The Mad Dog Show is a WFAN/YES net program dealing with interviews and call-ins. Someone may have called and asked who the mets needed to trade to obtain Garland and Russo threw out a possibility. I highly doubt he has/had any insider info.
The strange thing is,I receive this program on YES at 1 pm est, Russo is not there. His partner Mike Francesa, " Chris is off today, he's traveling across the country."

Tragg
12-16-2005, 03:07 PM
He must have forgotten the "+Lastings Milledge" part of that trade. Floyd's a net negative to the Sox because of salary, so sending him over would actually mean the mets give up MORE in prospects.
Oh hell we could do it: Floyd + Cash for Garland.
Let's hope not, though.

Nothing like a little youth and vitality which Anderson and McCarthy will bring.

Goose
12-16-2005, 03:13 PM
Look, KW's plan is to get as many guys who grew up Sox fans to play for the Sox because they won't ask for top $$$ at negotiation time because they are living their boyhood dream. In about two years, after the whole team is made up of fans like us, the White Sox will be WhiteSoxInteractive.com!:D:

Just what I was thinking!

I call 2nd base!

akingamongstmen
12-16-2005, 03:22 PM
Just what I was thinking!

I call 2nd base!

Catcher!

WhiteSoxFan84
12-16-2005, 03:31 PM
Garland for Tejada
Garland for Floyd
Garland for Blalock
Garland for Queen Elizabeth

These are some of the worst "rumors" I've heard in my life.

Stick to the facts guys and use common sense in deciding whether the trade has ANY chance of happening. Here are the facts...
- Kenny Williams has reached his budget, thus he can no more add salary.
- The White Sox needs are a # 2 hitter that preferably plays the OF and bullpen
- Jon Garland's value is not that high because he's viewed as a one-year rental


That being said, only one trade makes sense, Jon Garland for Bobby Abreu. :D:

miker
12-16-2005, 05:10 PM
That being said, only one trade makes sense, Jon Garland for Bobby Abreu. :D:
Yep. You can base a whole career on that meaningless homerun contest!

pythons007
12-16-2005, 05:11 PM
Im still hoping that the Sox ship Garland to Balt for Tejada..

Actually just something I heard from a friend, a.k.a. skobabe8, that their is a RUMOR of a potentional trade of Miggy for Vazquez and a prospect. I would like to know if this is even an actual rumor.

Ol' No. 2
12-16-2005, 05:14 PM
Actually just something I heard from a friend, a.k.a. skobabe8, that their is a RUMOR of a potentional trade of Miggy for Vazquez and a prospect. I would like to know if this is even an actual rumor.Yes, it's an actual RUMOR. There's also a Garland for Queen Elizabeth rumor here somewhere.

spiffie
12-16-2005, 05:16 PM
Yes, it's an actual RUMOR. There's also a Garland for Queen Elizabeth rumor here somewhere.
If we can get Prince William I'm sure we can get the Bafiarocks seal of approval for this deal.

miker
12-16-2005, 05:27 PM
Yes, it's an actual RUMOR. There's also a Garland for Queen Elizabeth rumor here somewhere.
Only if she's left-handed, still has good control and the Royal Family picks up most of her salary.

SOXSINCE'70
12-16-2005, 05:31 PM
Look, KW's plan is to get as many guys who grew up Sox fans to play for the Sox because they won't ask for top $$$ at negotiation time because they are living their boyhood dream. In about two years, after the whole team is made up of fans like us, the White Sox will be WhiteSoxInteractive.com!:D:

I call play by play.I can screw up a game with the best of 'em. :D: :D:

WhiteSoxFan84
12-16-2005, 06:06 PM
Yes, it's an actual RUMOR. There's also a Garland for Queen Elizabeth rumor here somewhere.

................... you're just full of **** you know that? You and you're baseless rumors! Who the hell even gave you that idea! :rolleyes:

Brian26
12-16-2005, 09:08 PM
I liked Cliff Floyd's potential a lot more about three years ago. He seems a bit brittle with all of the injuries...not sure I'd want to take a chance on him with his already large contract.

Tragg
12-17-2005, 12:07 AM
- Jon Garland's value is not that high because he's viewed as a one-year rental Funny how that always seems to be the case (the player has no value) when the player in question is a Sox; AJ Burnett's value was extremely high for a 2 month rental, as I recall. A combination of Fla's greed, and because they were still in the playoff hunt and didn't want to give up, is why that didn't go through. I also recall, when the Sox were 3 month renters, we gave up a starting catcher and 2 top prospects (although the Sox considered one counterfeit, which he was).

nodiggity59
12-17-2005, 12:11 AM
Funny how that always seems to be the case (the player has no value) when the player in question is a Sox; AJ Burnett's value was extremely high for a 2 month rental, as I recall. A combination of Fla's greed, and because they were still in the playoff hunt and didn't want to give up, is why that didn't go through. And Vasquez himself isn't exactly a long-term contract - 2 years, I think, only 1 more than Garland.

2 years with 1 additional arb controlled season, so 3.

Tragg
12-17-2005, 12:14 AM
2 years with 1 additional arb controlled season, so 3.That's good - it puts two of our starters, I think, in the 3 year range -Garcia and Vasquez - right?

nodiggity59
12-17-2005, 12:20 AM
That's good - it puts two of our starters, I think, in the 3 year range -Garcia and Vasquez - right?
Nah. We lose control of our guys in this way:

JG and Contreras- after 06
MB and Freddy- after 07
Vazquez- after 08
BMac- after 10

The game plan seems to be resign Freddy and MB, trade Garland, and resign Contreras if he's willing to be reasonable. If not, you keep him for an 06 run. If Jose plays ball, then we wouldn't need to acquire another starter till after the 08 season b/c KW will do whatever it takes to bring back MB and Freddy - book it. MB's a face of the franchise and Freddy has ties to Ozzie.

Tragg
12-17-2005, 12:23 AM
Nah. We lose control of our guys in this way:

JG and Contreras- after 06
MB and Freddy- after 07
Vazquez- after 08
BMac- after 10

The game plan seems to be resign Freddy and MB, trade Garland, and resign Contreras if he's willing to be reasonable. If not, you keep him for an 06 run. If Jose plays ball, then we wouldn't need to acquire another starter till after the 08 season b/c KW will do whatever it takes to bring back MB and Freddy.
Signing Freddie and MB won't be easy. Things will change but we'll probably need a LF, RF, 3B and maybe a C and 2nd baseman around that time too. I see why he's doing stuff like considering Blalock (reasonable contract) - just wish it wasn't Blalock. Anderson and another outfielder making the club in the next year or 2 would help as well.

nodiggity59
12-17-2005, 12:26 AM
Signing Freddie and MB won't be easy. Things will change but we'll probably need a LF, RF, 3B and maybe a C and 2nd baseman around that time too. I see why he's doing stuff like considering Blalock (reasonable contract) - just wish it wasn't Blalock. Anderson and another outfielder making the club in the next year or 2 would help as well.
I agree that we'll probably overpay for MB and Freddy, and it will hurt us in other areas, but I don't see KW letting those two walk away. I see him starting rookies in RF and 3rd base before he lets those guys walk. I predict both of them being resigned next offseason for $12-13mil per.

Given their unbelievable consistency and proven track record, they are the rocks upon which this team is founded. A lot may change two years from now (unproven guys like Jerry Owens, Josh Fields, etc. wil probably start then) but dollars to donuts Freddy and MB will be our #1-2 starters on opening day 08. That fits with KW's mantra of pitching first.

Tragg
12-17-2005, 12:33 AM
I agree that we'll probably overpay for MB and Freddy, and it will hurt us in other areas, but I don't see KW letting those two walk away. I see him starting rookies in RF and 3rd base before he lets those guys walk. I predict both of them being resigned next offseason for $12-13mil per.

Given their unbelievable consistency and proven track record, they are the rocks upon which this team is founded. I see them the same way. Like everyone else, I'm a big MB fan. I see him as the face of the Sox, like others see Konerko.
And we're going to have 3 more years left of Konerko's 12 Mill when we have to sign MB and FG. That will be 36 mill in 3 players.
How easy is it going to be to sign Contreras. He makes, what, 8.5 now? Off his best season (really 1/2 season) ever?

nodiggity59
12-17-2005, 12:44 AM
I see them the same way. Like everyone else, I'm a big MB fan. I see him as the face of the Sox, like others see Konerko.
And we're going to have 3 more years left of Konerko's 12 Mill when we have to sign MB and FG. That will be 36 mill in 3 players.
How easy is it going to be to sign Contreras. He makes, what, 8.5 now? Off his best season (really 1/2 season) ever?
I agree about JC. He will not be signed for market value by us given his age, inconsistency, and most importanatly the budget constraints you spoke of. KW is trying to put pressure on him now ("get serious") to sign for what he makes now.

Our 08 rotation will have MB, Freddy, Vazquez, and BMac for $35-40mil dollars. He cannot afford a 3rd pitcher making $13mil for 5 years.

So, KW will try to sign one of Jose or Jon to a 3 year $25mil dollar deal now. If they refuse, he'll trade one and keep the other for an 06 run, hoping to fill out the 08 rotation with a marginal guy or a prospect and keep one of our position players.

If the payroll stays at $90mil, then a $40-45mil rotation necessitates league minimum players at certain positions. KW seems comfortable with that so long as the rotation is anchored.

Tragg
12-17-2005, 01:06 AM
If the payroll stays at $90mil, then a $40-45mil rotation necessitates league minimum players at certain positions. KW seems comfortable with that so long as the rotation is anchored. I think the positional player challenge will be finding a real lead-off hitter in 2 years or so. Pods has done an admirable job, but I figure he'll be about cooked then. And it would be nice to have one in that .380-.400 OBP range, but they are scarce.

mdep524
12-17-2005, 03:14 AM
Cliff Floyd = not a chance. There's no way the Sox would be even remotely interested in him. Carlos Beltran on the other hand...

Ol' No. 2
12-17-2005, 12:02 PM
Signing Freddie and MB won't be easy. Things will change but we'll probably need a LF, RF, 3B and maybe a C and 2nd baseman around that time too. I see why he's doing stuff like considering Blalock (reasonable contract) - just wish it wasn't Blalock. Anderson and another outfielder making the club in the next year or 2 would help as well.If they can sign Contreras to an extension, they'll have 5 starters locked up for at least 2 more years. After that....a lot can happen. Broadway will probably be ready by then, and it's possible they'll get a stud pitching prospect for Garland who will be ready by then. I think two years out is about as far as one can reasonably plan.

wdelaney72
12-17-2005, 01:34 PM
Is stupid as this trade sounds, at least the thread is entertaining.

Cliff Floyd? No thanks.

WhiteSoxFan84
12-17-2005, 07:08 PM
AJ Burnett's value was extremely high for a 2 month rental, as I recall.

That's funny, what did Florida get for AJ Burnett? OH, that's right, NOTHING! They didn't trade him because they THOUGHT he was worth a lot more. But guess what? Teams wouldn't give up much for him unless he signed an extension because they knew he would test the market. And now, the league looks at Garland the same exact way.

I'd rather get 2 solid prospects for Garland now and have Brandon McCarthy probably pitch just as effective as Garland would have, rather than have Garland walk away for free next offseason.

White Sox, Yankee, Cub, or a member of the X-Men, if they only have 1 year left on their contracts and are being shopped around, they won't be worth as much unless they sign extensions.

Well, there is an exception; Wolverine's value is always low because he's not a "team player". That term is so overrated. Just ask Terrell and Ron.

Stroker Ace
12-17-2005, 09:06 PM
My brother from NY just called me and said that mad dog russo is talking about a Jon Garland for Cliff Floyd trade..Chris Russo is a ****ing idiot.

cws05champ
12-17-2005, 10:23 PM
I agree that we'll probably overpay for MB and Freddy, and it will hurt us in other areas, but I don't see KW letting those two walk away. I see him starting rookies in RF and 3rd base before he lets those guys walk. I predict both of them being resigned next offseason for $12-13mil per.

Given their unbelievable consistency and proven track record, they are the rocks upon which this team is founded. A lot may change two years from now (unproven guys like Jerry Owens, Josh Fields, etc. wil probably start then) but dollars to donuts Freddy and MB will be our #1-2 starters on opening day 08. That fits with KW's mantra of pitching first.

You never know what the market for picthing may do in the next year or so. If a pitcher like Burnett flops, this may make GM's really hesitant in the future. The top line $$ for a SP may stay flat or even go down. We'll see

chisoxmike
12-18-2005, 12:14 AM
My brother from NY just called me and said that mad dog russo is talking about a Jon Garland for Cliff Floyd trade..


:rolling:

These are getting dumber by the day!:bandance:

Tragg
12-18-2005, 01:30 AM
That's funny, what did Florida get for AJ Burnett? OH, that's right, NOTHING! They didn't trade him because they THOUGHT he was worth a lot more. But guess what? Teams wouldn't give up much for him unless he signed an extension because they knew he would test the market. And now, the league looks at Garland the same exact way.

I'd rather get 2 solid prospects for Garland now and have Brandon McCarthy probably pitch just as effective as Garland would have, rather than have Garland walk away for free next offseason.


Well first, most of this board (of those who discuss trades) thought Contreras plus McCarthy for a 2 month Burnett rental was a steal. So I'm just asking for a little consistency here.

Second, the reason they didn't trade him was because a)they insisted on tying him to Lowell and 2)they were still in the race, so they wanted an exceptional package to deal him. They didn't get the exceptional.

Third, this offseason free agent market for pitchers has gone out of this world. The same should apply to trades (Vasquez didn't come cheap, after all). Garland makes about 50-60% of the market value for his level of pitcher. To someone who thinks they can contend with an arm, and they're out there, he's worth more than "little value".

No one's asking for an exceptional with Garland. Just a fair package.

cburns
12-18-2005, 02:08 AM
Well first, most of this board (of those who discuss trades) thought Contreras plus McCarthy for a 2 month Burnett rental was a steal.

I don't think anybody thought that Jose plus McCarthy for a 2 month Burnett rental was a steal. At least not the majority.