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gf2020
12-05-2005, 04:22 PM
I am alwayas highly fearful of redundant threads because everyone is pretty on the ball here, but I haven't seen this posted yet, even in the Garcia thread.

George Offman of the Score is reporting that Mark Buehrle has accepted an invitation to pitch for the United States in the World Baseball Classic. Derek Lee and Michael Barrett will apparently be among his teammates.

I'm glad Mark got the invite. He is without question one of the best pitchers on the planet. It's only right that he be there.

Taliesinrk
12-05-2005, 04:25 PM
I am alwayas highly fearful of redundant threads because everyone is pretty on the ball here, but I haven't seen this posted yet, even in the Garcia thread.

George Offman of the Score is reporting that Mark Buehrle has accepted an invitation to pitch for the United States in the World Baseball Classic. Derek Lee and Michael Barrett will apparently be among his teammates.

I'm glad Mark got the invite. He is without question one of the best pitchers on the planet. It's only right that he be there.

YESS!! That's awesome. I can't wait to be cheering on the USA and Mark at the same time. Perhaps an MB USA jersey is in the future?

Chicken Dinner
12-05-2005, 04:27 PM
So who's going to spring training??

TheOldRoman
12-05-2005, 04:33 PM
DAMNIT!
This isn't even a real ****ing event! This isn't the olympics! It has no relevance! It is a money making scheme thought up by Bud. I am as patriotic as anybody, but c'mon. This thing is about as patriotic as competing in International Jeopardy. I want the US to win, but I wont be gushing with pride if they do.
Buehrle and Garcia really needed the rest. They will probably have to shorten their offseason by a month so they could get in midseason form in them middle of March.

I think Ozzie should go with a six man rotation at least through April to give them more time to rest. Damn you, Selig! Damn you to hell!

Tekijawa
12-05-2005, 04:37 PM
Garcia and Buehrle will pitch 400 innings by the end of the year and their arms still won't fall off... Has Kerry Wood been invited to the Simulated US team?

Baby Fisk
12-05-2005, 04:38 PM
I'm waiting for Hangar to point out that
there are NO Cubs players competing in the WBC
and that this is a PLOT to wear down the White Sox players.
After all, the FACT that the Cubs are not involved
really de-ligitimizes the event. Hell, with all those Sox players
involved, it would be SHOCKING if there was any media pickup.

kittle42
12-05-2005, 04:42 PM
I hate this for the same reasons stated by others above. Pointless, injury-risking garbage.

JUribe1989
12-05-2005, 04:49 PM
Um, they would be pitching 6 or 7 innings in Spring Training anyways. What better way to get ready for the season than playing in real competition. It will be exciting and fun to watch too. I appreciate that these guys are willing to represent their countries. Ya know, the NBA players always play in their olympics and there are no problems other than an embarassing 3rd place finish.

na_na_na_na
12-05-2005, 04:55 PM
I think that having a "World Cup" for baseball is a very good thing for the game.

The more people who watch baseball worldwide the more talent will be developed leading to better Talent at the highest levels.

Also it's great for fans like us who can watch competative baseball during the off season.

Unregistered
12-05-2005, 04:58 PM
I already hate this World Cup horse****. It's only a matter of time (maybe 2-3 games in) before a player injures himself and misses part or all of the '06 season because of this meaningless "showcase."

antitwins13
12-05-2005, 04:59 PM
DAMNIT!
This isn't even a real ****ing event! This isn't the olympics! It has no relevance! It is a money making scheme thought up by Bud. I am as patriotic as anybody, but c'mon. This thing is about as patriotic as competing in International Jeopardy. I want the US to win, but I wont be gushing with pride if they do.
Buehrle and Garcia really needed the rest. They will probably have to shorten their offseason by a month so they could get in midseason form in them middle of March.

I think Ozzie should go with a six man rotation at least through April to give them more time to rest. Damn you, Selig! Damn you to hell!


He has just as good of a chance as getting injured this spring as he does in this tournament. Have some patriotism.

caulfield12
12-05-2005, 04:59 PM
I am alwayas highly fearful of redundant threads because everyone is pretty on the ball here, but I haven't seen this posted yet, even in the Garcia thread.

George Offman of the Score is reporting that Mark Buehrle has accepted an invitation to pitch for the United States in the World Baseball Classic. Derek Lee and Michael Barrett will apparently be among his teammates.

I'm glad Mark got the invite. He is without question one of the best pitchers on the planet. It's only right that he be there.


With this announcement, itīs almost certain El Duque will break Spring Training with the White Sox as insurance for an injury or down-time in the starting rotation.

infohawk
12-05-2005, 05:05 PM
Has Kerry Wood been invited to the Simulated US team?

:rolling: :rolling: :rolling: :rolling: :rolling: :rolling: :rolling:

RallyBowl
12-05-2005, 05:11 PM
I hate this for the same reasons stated by others above. Pointless, injury-risking garbage.

Um, representing the greatest country on the planet is pointless?:kukoo:

kraut83
12-05-2005, 05:11 PM
Just by looking at the schedule, it seems that the max # of games a team could play over the tournement would be around 8 or 9. I don't know how big the rosters will be, but that would mean 2 starts at most for MB. As mentioned, not much more than spring work. Unless those South African hitters can really work the count.

HotelWhiteSox
12-05-2005, 05:18 PM
Um, they would be pitching 6 or 7 innings in Spring Training anyways. What better way to get ready for the season than playing in real competition. It will be exciting and fun to watch too. I appreciate that these guys are willing to represent their countries. Ya know, the NBA players always play in their olympics and there are no problems other than an embarassing 3rd place finish.

They don't pitch that many innings til the end, and even when they do pitch a lot, they are going all out or they are just working on a new pitch. Now this event comes along and they'll be asked to go all out. This is ****. Buerhle said that he wouldn't have been able to make another World Series start last year because his arm was "hanging by a thread". People get mad when their pitchers are used in the All Star Game, this is even worse.

Exit_Only
12-05-2005, 06:24 PM
Um, they would be pitching 6 or 7 innings in Spring Training anyways. What better way to get ready for the season than playing in real competition. It will be exciting and fun to watch too. I appreciate that these guys are willing to represent their countries. Ya know, the NBA players always play in their olympics and there are no problems other than an embarassing 3rd place finish.

You realize that a number of NBA players declined Olympic participation because they needed rest, right?

Basketball is a different game, anyway. I wouldn't mind if our position players went, but having two-fifths of our rotation go after pitching a career high in innings pitched is not a smart move.

On a different note, who invited Michael Barrett? He can't even call a game. There's a reason Mark Prior's ERA with Barrett catching is over a run more than when anyone else is catching, and why Maddux doesn't want anything to do with him.

Yet this scrub gets to work with Buehrle and Garcia, learn more about them, share information with them, then use it against them and the Sox during 6 regular season games that actually mean something.

:angry:

Exit_Only
12-05-2005, 06:31 PM
Spring Training pitching and competitive international tournament pitching is NOT equal.

ST pitching is relaxed, under the supervision of Don Cooper, and progressed at marginal rates. Competitive international tournament pitching requires all pitchers to start training earlier (shortening their offseason rest time), under no supervision, and at maximum effort, which heightens the chance of injury.

delben91
12-05-2005, 06:31 PM
I'm not thrilled with this from a potential injury standpoint, but I do enjoy the respect sox players are getting by being invited to play for their countries.

And honestly, we can complain here as much as we want, I'm going to go out on a limb and say Freddy and Mark will pitch anyway. That's why it's great to have El Duque, the ultimate insurance policy.

Exit_Only
12-05-2005, 06:37 PM
I'm not thrilled with this from a potential injury standpoint, but I do enjoy the respect sox players are getting by being invited to play for their countries.

And honestly, we can complain here as much as we want, I'm going to go out on a limb and say Freddy and Mark will pitch anyway. That's why it's great to have El Duque, the ultimate insurance policy.

So there's no difference between a Freddy Garcia/Mark Buehrle start and a El Duque start? El Duque gives the Sox the same chance at winning a game that Garcia and Buehrle do?

Just because an acceptable backup is in place, doesn't mean an organization should allow its pitchers to risk injury in a manner that has no benefit to the team.

Unregistered
12-05-2005, 06:38 PM
On a different note, who invited Michael Barrett? He can't even call a game. There's a reason Mark Prior's ERA with Barrett catching is over a run more than when anyone else is catching, and why Maddux doesn't want anything to do with him.

Yet this scrub gets to work with Buehrle and Garcia, learn more about them, share information with them, then use it against them and the Sox during 6 regular season games that actually mean something.

:angry:Lay off the pipe. Seriously.

ilsox7
12-05-2005, 06:42 PM
What most people overlook about the WBC is that it is not actually baseball. I am serious. First, there will be stringent pitch count limitations on each pitcher. Is that baseball? Only if it's Little League. Also, word is that position players will only be allowed to play a certain number of innings each game. Again, if this is true, is that baseball?

Finally, representing a country is quite simple. So much so that Mike Piazza can play for Italy. Do you see the World Cup (soccer/football) forcing teams to substitute at half time? Or limit the amount of saves each Keepr can make before being pulled?

This event is a farce. It has been created solely for Unclue Bud to ad revenues to the game of American Baseball.

delben91
12-05-2005, 06:43 PM
So there's no difference between a Freddy Garcia/Mark Buehrle start and a El Duque start? El Duque gives the Sox the same chance at winning a game that Garcia and Buehrle do?

Just because an acceptable backup is in place, doesn't mean an organization should allow its pitchers to risk injury in a manner that has no benefit to the team.

No, of course they aren't equal. But if this is an MLB sanctioned event, I don't know if the Sox can actually prevent Mark or Freddy from participating. Maybe they can, I'm not sure. I do know that my complaints sure as hell won't stop them from playing, so why should I complain about it?

But I'd much prefer an El Duque start to an Arnie Munoz start. That's all I was saying with that "ultimate insurance policy" statement.

Unregistered
12-05-2005, 06:44 PM
This event is a farce. It has been created solely for Unclue Bud to ad revenues to the game of American Baseball.Exactly. Which is why I can't help but roll my eyes when I read "Have some patriotism!" or "Represent your country!"

This isn't the Olympics. It's not even the Pan American Games.

Exit_Only
12-05-2005, 06:51 PM
No, of course they aren't equal. But if this is an MLB sanctioned event, I don't know if the Sox can actually prevent Mark or Freddy from participating. Maybe they can, I'm not sure. I do know that my complaints sure as hell won't stop them from playing, so why should I complain about it?

But I'd much prefer an El Duque start to an Arnie Munoz start. That's all I was saying with that "ultimate insurance policy" statement.

I understood what your point was, I was just trying to get you to look at it from a different POV.

You have a good point about wondering if the Sox can prevent Freddy and Mark from participating. I don't know either, though I do know that David Stern couldn't even get his big guns to play in an Olympic tournament and he has more power than Selig. I'm guessing if Selig's buddy Reinsdorf tells him that he can't send any pitchers this year because of the extra postseason work, Selig wouldn't force JR's hand.

Exit_Only
12-05-2005, 06:52 PM
Lay off the pipe. Seriously.

Seems like a reasonable response.

koch44
12-05-2005, 06:53 PM
Spring Training pitching and competitive international tournament pitching is NOT equal.

ST pitching is relaxed, under the supervision of Don Cooper, and progressed at marginal rates. Competitive international tournament pitching requires all pitchers to start training earlier (shortening their offseason rest time), under no supervision, and at maximum effort, which heightens the chance of injury.

Who really knows if the pitchers are going to give maximum effort? I don't think they will, and they'll start the season just fine.

delben91
12-05-2005, 06:54 PM
Who really knows if the pitchers are going to give maximum effort? I don't think they will, and they'll start the season just fine.

And maybe Buehrle won't have to shag flies this year! :wink:

Unregistered
12-05-2005, 06:57 PM
Seems like a reasonable response.It seemed reasonable at the time... :redneck

Optipessimism
12-05-2005, 06:59 PM
This thing is about as patriotic as competing in International Jeopardy.

I couldn't agree with you more.

delben91
12-05-2005, 07:01 PM
Also of note, at first glance I saw that Sabathia, Johan Santana and Carlos Silva are also playing. Ronnie Belliard too. so it won't just be the Sox, and not just the Sox pitchers either.

NorthSideSox72
12-05-2005, 07:34 PM
I think it's great that our country is willing to at least give a little bit of meaning to the phrase "World Champion" in this or any other sport.

I will feel no worse about a WBC injury than a ST injury. In fact, I'll feel better about something happening in WBC, since it was for a worthy cause.

And frankly, I don't think the players will be any less "relaxed" in these games than they would be in ST.

I love the Sox, but I also love baseball, THE SPORT. Therefore, anything that brings more of the world to the table... so much the better.
:cool:

kittle42
12-05-2005, 07:41 PM
Um, representing the greatest country on the planet is pointless?:kukoo:

It is my opinion that this Cup idea is bogus, so I would say that representing any country is pointless.

kevin57
12-05-2005, 07:56 PM
I've seen in print where Ozzie says that he doesn't like the fact that FG is pitching. I heard Coop say he was "very concerned" about it. Basically, Freddy ran out of gas late last season.

I haven't heard any comments from either on MB. Should be interesting if they have a different take on him.

TheVulture
12-05-2005, 08:08 PM
Um, representing the greatest country on the planet is pointless?:kukoo:

This World Cup really is pointless if Buerhle is pitching for Canada.

kittle42
12-05-2005, 08:22 PM
This World Cup really is pointless if Buerhle is pitching for Canada.

Thanks. This was part of the point I was trying to make.

TheOldRoman
12-05-2005, 10:56 PM
He has just as good of a chance as getting injured this spring as he does in this tournament. Have some patriotism.
****. This is the second time you have shouted "it's patriotic" about the WBC. It has nothing to do with Patriotism.
I work with a girl from Mexico and a guy from Palestine. Am I "showing patriotism" if I beat them in a game of bowling? Am I bringing shame to my country if either one of them can throw a lawn dart further than me or beats me at a game of pool? I would be representing my country, right?

No! This BS is just as trivial. It is not a real event. It isn't the Olympics. It is another money making scheme by Selig. I guess he figured it was either this or have another round of expansion.

TheOldRoman
12-05-2005, 10:57 PM
Um, representing the greatest country on the planet is pointless?:kukoo:
See my post above.

Taliesinrk
12-05-2005, 11:18 PM
****. This is the second time you have shouted "it's patriotic" about the WBC. It has nothing to do with Patriotism.
I work with a girl from Mexico and a guy from Palestine. Am I "showing patriotism" if I beat them in a game of bowling? Am I bringing shame to my country if either one of them can throw a lawn dart further than me or beats me at a game of pool? I would be representing my country, right?

No! This BS is just as trivial. It is not a real event. It isn't the Olympics. It is another money making scheme by Selig. I guess he figured it was either this or have another round of expansion.


Good Post...:rolleyes:

Lip Man 1
12-05-2005, 11:54 PM
Not good news. And I agree 100%. This is a 'made for TV' championship. Garbage.

Lip

brewcrew/chisox
12-06-2005, 12:04 AM
****. This is the second time you have shouted "it's patriotic" about the WBC. It has nothing to do with Patriotism.
I work with a girl from Mexico and a guy from Palestine. Am I "showing patriotism" if I beat them in a game of bowling? Am I bringing shame to my country if either one of them can throw a lawn dart further than me or beats me at a game of pool? I would be representing my country, right?

No! This BS is just as trivial. It is not a real event. It isn't the Olympics. It is another money making scheme by Selig. I guess he figured it was either this or have another round of expansion.


The World Cup (soccer) is a "money making scheme", a multibillion dollar "scheme" which provides clubs, leagues, host countries (and their cities), and players huge amounts of money in endorsments and revenue from advertising and tourism.

And if anyone here thinks that the Olympics isn't one of the biggest "money making schemes" around, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you too...how's that for a money making scheme?

WSI, your official web site of the WBC, or the Olympics, or the World Cup

To trash an event on the grounds that it makes money isn't a realistic argument. There are no "pure" events anymore...heck, even little league baseball has become one huge revenue producing event...ask ESPN. Should I stop watching Little League now too?

lostletters
12-06-2005, 12:22 AM
First I will say some of you are being selfish. Just because MB and FG are pitching in this thing. You do realize ALL of the premier pitchers in baseball are pitching in this thing.

Secondly, MLB on a whole is a money making scheme. So is the world cup of soccer, the superbowl, and every other sporting event.

Third, I am supporting this because it is good for the sport of BASEBALL. The entire sport. While the White Sox are my favorite team, I realize that without some international competition with PROFESSIONALS baseball will never be able to reach the next level in worldwide popularity. If baseball becomes more popular worldwide, so do the white sox, because of our teams international makeup. While many talk about the domestic ratings being very low, the international ratings for this world series were high, because of the makeup of our team. But I think for the sport to grow more popular, and the white sox, there needs to be international events. Without the international competition baseball remains stagnant or grows slowly. You may hate it, dismiss it, or think this is rediculas. But baseball needs a signiture international event. It is now an international sport.

While we may be concerned about our players, I still support the concept, not because of my love for the game, but for my love of the sport of baseball. I am not being greedy. The guys who are accepting to participate in this are probably doing this for the same reason. They are spreading love of the game to the world, and maybe one day baseball will surpass soccer in popularity worldwide.

JUribe1989
12-06-2005, 12:24 AM
I honestly do not see the problem with this. What's the most someone could get hurt anyways? It only lasts about 10 games, right? It is going to be exciting competitive baseball to watch in March. I CAN'T WAIT! I wish some other people could embrace the event. :smile:

TheOldRoman
12-06-2005, 12:30 AM
The World Cup (soccer) is a "money making scheme", a multibillion dollar "scheme" which provides clubs, leagues, host countries (and their cities), and players huge amounts of money in endorsments and revenue from advertising and tourism.

And if anyone here thinks that the Olympics isn't one of the biggest "money making schemes" around, I have a bridge in Brooklyn to sell you too...how's that for a money making scheme?

WSI, your official web site of the WBC, or the Olympics, or the World Cup

To trash an event on the grounds that it makes money isn't a realistic argument. There are no "pure" events anymore...heck, even little league baseball has become one huge revenue producing event...ask ESPN. Should I stop watching Little League now too?
The olympics started as a "pure" event. Not just the original olympics, but the modern olympics. That is why we like the olympics. We make national heros of people who do well in the olympics, turning the biggest victors into instant millionaires with all the endorcements they will get. A lot of it is about the money, but not all of it. Most olympians dont do it for the money, they do it for the glory. People who win gold medals in judo, wrestling, curling, and other lower profile sports get nothing.

The olympics are an established institution. That is the biggest difference. The WBC is a brainchild of Selig. He did it not because he wanted a "real world series" he spoke of, but because he wanted $$$. They will make millions off of it. The players are roped in with the same knee-jerk patriotism shown by others in this thread "You aren't patriotic if you dont take part". The players wont get paid to do this, to my knowledge. This means nothing.
If Selig cared about the players, he would have done it in November. It would have made much more sense to do it while the players were still kinda warm from the season. By having it in the beginning of March, the players have to reduce their offseason by a month. Instead of getting necesary rest, Mark and Freddy will start throwing in January just so they are in midseason form by March 1. Why didn't it happen in November? College and professional football are huge, and they recieve nonstop hype even throughout the work week. The WBC would not have gotten the same press as it would in March. As I said before, Selig would sell his own children if he got the right deal. He is a two-bit crook. He will be laughing all the way to the bank. With the owners get from this, they should be able to delay another round of expansion by a few years. After that, they will cry broke again and split the expansion fees; further diluting the talent pool.

HotelWhiteSox
12-06-2005, 01:03 AM
I guess this is good news for Buerhle. Quote I found from Buck Martinez, US manager, while browsing the WBC site:

Strict pitch counts will be incorporated in the tournament games and there will be suggested limitations on the use of position players, conforming to the usual playing time expended by most Major Leaguers during Spring Training. But those rules are still to be determined, Archey said.

"I don't see how any pitcher can go more than two innings that time of the year," Martinez said.

I don't know if the foreign managers will be so kind though. I know we have international posters, Is the rest of the world taking this seriously, or do they realize this is for the dollars?

elrod
12-06-2005, 01:32 AM
I'm a huge supporter of the WBC, not because of "patriotism" but because it's just good for the game of baseball. It's a great statement that 16 countries can contribute world class calibur talent to an international tournament. And there is no greater chance of injury in this event than during Spring Training.

ilsox7
12-06-2005, 01:34 AM
It still amazes me how many people are still considering the WBC baseball. Have you read the rules? It is not baseball. Geeze.

TheOldRoman
12-06-2005, 01:42 AM
And there is no greater chance of injury in this event than during Spring Training.
Yes. There is.
WBC is a competition. Spring training is only a competition for young players and fringe players trying to make the team. For all other players, pitchers in particular, it is a time to ease into their roles. They work on certain aspects of their game (new pitches, using a certain pitch more effectively, locating), and try things they wouldn't be able to do in real games.
Buehrle wont go into a WBC with the intent on throwing nothing but fastballs like he may do in a spring training game. He will go into it intending on throwing every pitch in his arsenal to get out some of the best hitters in the world. Pitchers will not go into the WBC with the intent of getting their breaking ball ready for April. They will go into it to win. Big difference.

Exit_Only
12-06-2005, 07:55 AM
****. This is the second time you have shouted "it's patriotic" about the WBC. It has nothing to do with Patriotism.
I work with a girl from Mexico and a guy from Palestine. Am I "showing patriotism" if I beat them in a game of bowling? Am I bringing shame to my country if either one of them can throw a lawn dart further than me or beats me at a game of pool? I would be representing my country, right?

No! This BS is just as trivial. It is not a real event. It isn't the Olympics. It is another money making scheme by Selig. I guess he figured it was either this or have another round of expansion.

You make some good points disagreeing with antitwins, but there's no reason to tell him to "****." He never personally insulted you.

MsSoxVixen22
12-06-2005, 09:09 AM
Here's my 2 cents-I'm proud Mark & Freddy got invited but I just hope they get thru it healthy and they have enough "gas" for the regular season.

soxfanatlanta
12-06-2005, 09:24 AM
Here's my 2 cents-I'm proud Mark & Freddy got invited but I just hope they get thru it healthy and they have enough "gas" for the regular season.

+1

I have a feeling that the Sox coaching staff will be watching them like a hawk; if they see either of them going too hard, you can be assured that they will hear from somebody. My .02$

Overall, I like the potential of the WBC - could be some very entertaining baseball.

bobowhite
12-06-2005, 09:37 AM
I hear a lot of grumbling that MLB invented the WBC just to line their pockets. It is another television event but I don't think it will be a serious financial windfall by any stretch of the imagination. What I believe it will be is good publicity and good at spreading the game internationally, especially without the exceptional Euro-centric focus of the Olympics.

As for burning out Buehrle and Garcia, I seriously doubt any damage to either one. With strict pitch counts, and I hear they are batter limited as in they will yank you mid-inning, but not mid-batter, when you reach your limit, and judging from the quality (or lack thereof) of much of the early competition, it does not look much more stressful than ST. As for the field players, they'd be doing the same work in ST so for them this is just a change of pace.

kobo
12-06-2005, 09:44 AM
If Mark and Freddy did not want to be a part of this, all they had to say was no. But they decided to be a part of this and represent their countries, I see no problem with that. We all want these 2 guys to be healthy and ready to go for the season, but this is their decision to play in this tournament.

harwar
12-06-2005, 09:52 AM
If anyone needs extra rest this year it Buehrle and Garcia.They always pitch a lot of innings but they don't normally pitch for so long(thru Oct.).
They may plan on taking it easy but when the juices get flowing they will go all out.
Maybe we should play a round robin tournament when there are serious disputes,throw baseballs instead of dur's.

kittle42
12-06-2005, 10:19 AM
Uh, oh. I guess Kenny's unpatriotic, too.http://www.suntimes.com/output/sox/cst-spt-sox06.html

brewcrew/chisox
12-06-2005, 12:32 PM
The olympics started as a "pure" event. Not just the original olympics, but the modern olympics. That is why we like the olympics. We make national heros of people who do well in the olympics, turning the biggest victors into instant millionaires with all the endorcements they will get. A lot of it is about the money, but not all of it. Most olympians dont do it for the money, they do it for the glory. People who win gold medals in judo, wrestling, curling, and other lower profile sports get nothing.

The olympics are an established institution. That is the biggest difference. The WBC is a brainchild of Selig. He did it not because he wanted a "real world series" he spoke of, but because he wanted $$$. They will make millions off of it. The players are roped in with the same knee-jerk patriotism shown by others in this thread "You aren't patriotic if you dont take part". The players wont get paid to do this, to my knowledge. This means nothing.

Speak for yourself when you say, "this is why we like the olympics". People like the Olympics for a variety of reasons, one being that they fool themselves about it being about something more than money, the same reason you so coldly chastized people on this board for supporting the WBC.

Again, to criticize other people for denying the moneymaking aspect of the WBC and then praise the OLYMPICS of all things, is just wrong. How do you think the olympics became "an established institution?"....hmm, how about advertising and cooporate backing, lined palms in back rooms, all under the guize of........you guessed it, patriotism.

You only need to go back as far as 2002 and Salt Lake city Utah to see what really the olympics are about.

The Olympics hasn't been "pure" since guys were beating each other with bare hands dressed in loin cloths.

I don't hate the Olympics, but I won't bury my head in the sand. Instead, I'll enjoy the sport for what it is: people competing at some of the highest levels in the world. I'm going to do the same for the WBC, except this will mbe of greater intrest to me because it's a sport that I have a deep passion for; it's a sport I enjoy.

In short,

Baseball>judo, fencing, biathalon and water polo.

Taliesinrk
12-06-2005, 02:35 PM
Uh, oh. I guess Kenny's unpatriotic, too.http://www.suntimes.com/output/sox/cst-spt-sox06.html

No.. you've got to be kidding..

1. besides your comment.. I'd like to say that I like to see KEnny continuing to fly "UNDER THE RADAR".

2. Kenny never came out and said the event was complete stupidity, based purely on money, and not patriotic one bit. Kenny was concerned about his players, their health, and the exact rules and the fact that the other teams woudl perhaps not suffer as greatly as the Sox do. None of that is "unpatriotic". In fact, while I support the WBC, I have the exact same concerns. I, unlike some including yourself, however, believe that the advantage of developing a potential truly global tournament and expanding baseball to every continent on the globe outweighs these concerns. Perhaps there could/should be revisions to how the rules are set-up, but I'm sure they're doing their best.

It would be my hope and wish that someday, perhaps when I grow old, I will be able to only every 4 years, mind you, be able to root harder for the U.S. than for the White Sox. That day, is far away, however, and may never reach us... but I don't think it's not worth trying for.

P.S. If you feel the need for further argument/comment, please refer to my other posts in this same thread as well as the Contreras post.

kittle42
12-06-2005, 03:14 PM
2. Kenny never came out and said the event was complete stupidity, based purely on money, and not patriotic one bit. Kenny was concerned about his players, their health, and the exact rules and the fact that the other teams woudl perhaps not suffer as greatly as the Sox do. None of that is "unpatriotic". In fact, while I support the WBC, I have the exact same concerns.

If you will look back to my comments in this thread, my major concern is with player health, too. I did call the whole thing "bogus" as well - in the sense I don't think it's worth risking injury for. yet, I was immediately called "unpatriotic."

Also, I think you missed my use of teal.

Fred Manrique
12-06-2005, 03:30 PM
I don't understand the need to freak out. If there is an injury, yes that could be terrible for our season, but can't we just be happy that we just won the World Series? Can't we just be happy two of our starters will play an integral role for the countries they live in?

Let's not call the whole thing a farce till we see how it shakes out once or twice. I for one, am excited to see it and would be excited if more Sox got the opportunity to play.

kittle42
12-06-2005, 03:44 PM
I don't understand the need to freak out. If there is an injury, yes that could be terrible for our season, but can't we just be happy that we just won the World Series? Can't we just be happy two of our starters will play an integral role for the countries they live in?

Let's not call the whole thing a farce till we see how it shakes out once or twice. I for one, am excited to see it and would be excited if more Sox got the opportunity to play.

I guess we should all just agree to disagree. No one's right or wrong here.

Gavin
12-06-2005, 04:06 PM
The WBC is out there to make $$$, no doubt.
But why the heck do you think professional sports exist? I don't think Reinsdorf is running a charity for the city of Chicago.

Taliesinrk
12-06-2005, 04:38 PM
No one's right or wrong here.

That's your opinion.. No.. in all seriousness though, I have doubts about the tournament as well, but have personally been waiting for the day that baseball truly goes international. That way i don't have to listen to all the soccer dicks tell me how their sport is so much better and you don't need to be an athlete to play baseball.

I wasn't personally calling you unpatriotic. I know, however, that I am strongly patriotic, be it good or bad.
The way I look at it is that any event that allows our nation to showcase talent in a national spotlight, when the whole, or a certain/large part of the world is watching is an event to pull for our country hardcore; to show that we're the best (arrogant or not).

Right or wrong, we can't change that the WBC will take place, and therefore, I want the best players to play and represent our country. Therefore, I want White Sox to play and represent our country because they clearly are the best :D: . I also encourage other White Sox who are not playing for the U.S. to play, because it means that when the U.S. does win, it will prove our superiority.

bobowhite
12-06-2005, 04:49 PM
A few things:

a) opposing the WBC is not unpatriotic

b) the tournament has good points and bad points

c) I am tired of hearing that:
i) baseball is not an international sport
ii) baseball players are not athletes

d) I am definately looking forward to the contrasting styles of the different regions being displayed an contrast on a larger stage

e) March is the only practical time to run this tournament, it gives a modicum of advantage to players from the southern hemisphere and Latin American nations

f) I'm proud that Buehrle, Garcia and Iguchi have all been selected to play for their respective teams.

Taliesinrk
12-06-2005, 04:56 PM
A few things:

a) opposing the WBC is not unpatriotic

b) the tournament has good points and bad points

c) I am tired of hearing that:
i) baseball is not an international sport
ii) baseball players are not athletes

d) I am definately looking forward to the contrasting styles of the different regions being displayed an contrast on a larger stage

e) March is the only practical time to run this tournament, it gives a modicum of advantage to players from the southern hemisphere and Latin American nations

f) I'm proud that Buehrle, Garcia and Iguchi have all been selected to play for their respective teams.

alright.. you can take this thread.. we keep posting the same things LOL

Unregistered
12-06-2005, 05:08 PM
I have doubts about the tournament as well, but have personally been waiting for the day that baseball truly goes international. That way i don't have to listen to all the soccer dicks tell me how their sport is so much better and you don't need to be an athlete to play baseball...That's fine in theory, but in reality, the 16 teams that are in the tournament are already big baseball countries, for the most part. There's no Argentinian team, no German team, no English team, etc. It's not like all these countries are going to watch or be interested in baseball because Japan is playing Australia.

Taliesinrk
12-06-2005, 05:12 PM
That's fine in theory, but in reality, the 16 teams that are in the tournament are already big baseball countries, for the most part. There's no Argentinian team, no German team, no English team, etc. It's not like all these countries are going to watch or be interested in baseball because Japan is playing Australia.

Ok, I lied.. I'm still here..

I agree with you that the 16 teams already have baseball very well to moderately established w/ in their countries. However, I'm sure Europe gets some (perhaps little) coverage of the event. Anyhow, it's a start. You can't begin by playing Germany when they don't know how many balls are in a walk. Slowly but surely.

There certainly won't be immediate results.. but in time..

Unregistered
12-06-2005, 05:18 PM
Ok, I lied.. I'm still here..

I agree with you that the 16 teams already have baseball very well to moderately established w/ in their countries. However, I'm sure Europe gets some (perhaps little) coverage of the event. Anyhow, it's a start. You can't begin by playing Germany when they don't know how many balls are in a walk. Slowly but surely.

There certainly won't be immediate results.. but in time..Fair enough. We'll talk again in 2075 and see if you're right. :D: Somehow, I'm sure that wasn't too far from selig's proposal:

:tool
"Gentlemen, give me 70 years - baseball will be HUGE in Germany! If I'm wrong, you can totally call me out on it."

hose
12-06-2005, 05:19 PM
This whole WBC is a dumb idea to begin with.

I wish NO White Sox players were involved , but since they are I'm pulling for Venezuela.

If Uribe made the D.R. team then I would be pulling for the Domincans.

kittle42
12-06-2005, 05:23 PM
This whole WBC is a dumb idea to begin with.

I wish NO White Sox players were involved , but since they are I'm pulling for Venezuela.

If Uribe made the D.R. team then I would be pulling for the Domincans.

I'm pulling for the team with the fewest MLB players, just like basketball in the Olympics.

Exit_Only
12-06-2005, 05:57 PM
This tournament loses validity as the world's best with Brad Lidge on the roster.

http://mlb.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/article.jsp?ymd=20051205&content_id=1275997&vkey=news_mlb&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlbl