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ElDuque26
11-23-2005, 04:47 PM
so we now have a hole in center field...does joe borchard get a shot?Anderson?is jerry owens ready? chris young? so many possibilities within the orginization or do we trade for someone? whats ur thoughts on the future of our CF position?

hold2dibber
11-23-2005, 04:49 PM
It will be Anderson, no doubt in my mind whatsoever.

mdep524
11-23-2005, 04:52 PM
It will be Anderson, no doubt in my mind whatsoever....unless KW turns around and gets Juan Pierre. Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively, but Ozzie likes him and might want him as a number 2 hitter.

Chisox003
11-23-2005, 04:54 PM
...unless KW turns around and gets Juan Pierre. Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively, but Ozzie likes him and might want him as a number 2 hitter.
Agreed.

The only reason I see him as a better option in '06 is not because of Anderson's ability, but I honestly don't know if he can play a good CF and hit consistently on an everday basis as a major league player...

I dunno about you, but I really don't like the idea of trying to repeat with a rookie in CF, but IF another move is not made, it's not exactly a bad option to have.

Whoever is put out there better play some D

bobowhite
11-23-2005, 04:54 PM
Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively, .

I don't think so. Pierre is faster and has been playing in a cavernous park. USCF CF is not huge, he would cover a lot of ground.

SOXSINCE'70
11-23-2005, 04:56 PM
I don't think so. Pierre is faster and has been playing in a cavernous park. USCF CF is not huge, he would cover a lot of ground.

This is true,but what about the criticism that he has a weak
arm?? If (and I do mean IF) this is true,runners will be tagging
up at second or third base and advancing with less than 2 outs.

ChiSoxIn06
11-23-2005, 05:03 PM
so we now have a hole in center field...does joe borchard get a shot?Anderson?is jerry owens ready? chris young? so many possibilities within the orginization or do we trade for someone? whats ur thoughts on the future of our CF position?

for the love of god no more joe borchard talk..he is a lifer in the minors and will never be an established major leaguer

BRDSR
11-23-2005, 05:04 PM
This is true,but what about the criticism that he has a weak
arm?? If (and I do mean IF) this is true,runners will be tagging
up at second or third base and advancing with less than 2 outs.

Eh, Rowand didn't have a cannon either. Rarely are you going to see a man on second tag on a ball hit to center, unless the CF is running towards to wall when he makes the catch, and no amount of arm is going to solve that problem, thats all momentum.

FloridaSox
11-23-2005, 05:08 PM
This is true,but what about the criticism that he has a weak
arm?? If (and I do mean IF) this is true,runners will be tagging
up at second or third base and advancing with less than 2 outs.

Juan Pierre--weak arm--that does an injustice to players with real weak arms.. I go to Marlin games in So Florida and other teams start a track meet anytime the ball goes to center.

It's Time
11-23-2005, 05:11 PM
Juan Pierre--weak arm--that does an injustice to players with real weak arms.. I go to Marlin games in So Flordia and other teams start a track meet anytime the ball goes to center.

Agreed. Although I would take Pierre for his speed and gap coverage alone. That said, Anderson will get the job and Podsednik stays in left. Besides, Offman just reported that the Cubs are very close to landing Pierre for 3 minor leaguers.

Fine.

getonbckthr
11-23-2005, 05:16 PM
pierre and mota for anderson, marte and vizcaino.

Chips
11-23-2005, 05:17 PM
Brian Anderson will be the starting centerfielder for the White Sox for many years to come.

ShoelessJoeS
11-23-2005, 05:19 PM
Brian Anderson will start in center next year. Pierre has a weak arm and cannot make the plays that BA can. Pierre is quick, but we need to replace Aaron's great D with great D.

Vernam
11-23-2005, 05:19 PM
for the love of god no more joe borchard talk..he is a lifer in the minors and will never be an established major leaguerI think that's probably true, but I wouldn't write him off. The Sox have no options left on him, so they have to keep him on the roster or lose him for nothing. Unless he goes back to the minors and tanks completely there, I guarantee some MLB team -- maybe even the Sox -- will give him the chance to prove definitively he can't hit big-league pitching. A guy with 29 homers in AAA doesn't just shuffle off to obscurity overnight.

Main thing working against Borchard here is that Ozzie saw too much of him in 2004 and apparently told Kenny no mas.

Vernam

HotelWhiteSox
11-23-2005, 05:21 PM
I say Anderson (unless KW has more up his sleeve), which is a very suitable replacement IMO. In my book, you're losing Everett for Thome, with Aaron and Anderson being very similar.

soxlover
11-23-2005, 05:43 PM
What is wrong with putting Pods in CF and Anderson in LF?

Jjav829
11-23-2005, 05:45 PM
What is wrong with putting Pods in CF and Anderson in LF?

Anderson is a better CF.

Tragg
11-23-2005, 05:47 PM
pierre and mota for anderson, marte and vizcaino.
No thank you

IggyD
11-23-2005, 05:50 PM
I don't think so. Pierre is faster and has been playing in a cavernous park. USCF CF is not huge, he would cover a lot of ground.

He is fast yes...but he has a limp noodle arm and cannot get the ball back into play fast enough

MrRoboto83
11-23-2005, 05:52 PM
I like the thought of Pierre playing Center next year and in the 2 hole. Iguchi could bat 6th or 7th and perhaps hit twice as many homeruns.

Lip Man 1
11-23-2005, 05:55 PM
The next move will be getting Juan Pierre from Florida. He'll play center, bat second, steal 60 bases.

In other words EXACTLY what Ozzie has already stated that he wants this off season.

Lip

Tragg
11-23-2005, 05:59 PM
Quality up the middle defense is a foundation of great baseball. The Manuel years were plagued with poor fundamental baseball. There have got to be other ways to get some speed, if that's what we want, than sacrificing our up the middle defense.

STealing a bunch of bases in the 1 and 2 holes seems inconsistent with having 2 home run hitters on your team. Makes more sense if you have gap hitters at 3 and 4.

It's Time
11-23-2005, 06:02 PM
The next move will be getting Juan Pierre from Florida. He'll play center, bat second, steal 60 bases.

In other words EXACTLY what Ozzie has already stated that he wants this off season.

Lip

Lip:

Don't hold your breath on Pierre. George Offman repored the Cubs are "close" to finalizing a deal with Florida. TIFWIW.

broker3d
11-23-2005, 06:13 PM
I too believe Anderson will be our centerfielder but I think Anderson will eventually become our RF, probably in 2007.

seanpmurphy
11-23-2005, 06:20 PM
Comcast was reporting Podsednik will be the starter in CF, but I don't know how much value I should put in that, just throwing it out there.

Hagan
11-23-2005, 06:22 PM
its anderson above all of our prospects right now. He will get the job unless we get pierre.

VivaOzzie
11-23-2005, 06:27 PM
I've heard over and over that Brian Anderson is an upgrade defensively over Rowand. I have yet to hear any reason why. I'm not saying I don't believe it...I just don't know a whole lot about Anderson.

What kind of speed does he have, comparable to who? Hows his arm? How does he read the ball off the bat? Hows his aggression (ie Crash-ness)? If anybody could give me a scouting report on this guy, maybe comparing his aspects to current major leaguers...I'd really appreciate it! (cause I really WANT to like this trade)

broker3d
11-23-2005, 06:31 PM
I've heard over and over that Brian Anderson is an ungrade defensively over Rowand. I have yet to hear any reason why. I'm not saying I don't believe it...I just don't know a whole lot about Anderson.



Anderson is NOT a defensive upgrade over Rowand in center. Rowand has more speed and better defense. Anderson will hit for more power. I think Anderson will eventually become a RF.

Red Barchetta
11-23-2005, 06:35 PM
With Anderson ready, this is basically a deal to swap Thome's offense for Rowand's offense. Add the fact that Thome is LH and it provides the balance we need in the lineup.

As much as enjoyed Aaron play and how he came into his own in 2004, I don't think the SOX brass was ever that high on him. They traded for Lofton once and then floated his name in other deals.

The Yankees love him, so I would not be surprised if the Phillies turn around and trade him to the Yankees.

If the SOX re-sign Konerko, we can kiss Frank goodbye. If the SOX don't sign Konerko, we have Thome at 1B and we resign Frank. I like the idea of a DH who can play a position and that's Frank's biggest liability.

Oh well, no one ever said winning is easy. Good luck Aaron!

WagMan
11-23-2005, 06:44 PM
Anderson is a better CF.

How So? I think Pods would have better range in center than Anderson. I think Pod's speed can make up for his below average arm, just like it does in left. I don't think Anderson is destined for center. I think his calling is one of the corners.

NorthSideSox72
11-23-2005, 06:45 PM
I'm going to put my neck out on this one, but I think the answer may not be Anderson. How about a guy who:

--Is fast, probably a 30+ steals guy.

--Hit well over .300 last year in the minors and is hitting .400+ in winter ball, and can hit to all fields.

--Plays excellent defense in the outfield
--Who Ozzie (the man who specifically requested a new 2-hole hitter) specifically mentioned in an interview earlier this month as wanting to see him with the club soon.

His name is Jerry Owens. And my money says he will get an invite to Spring Training, and will have a shot at the CF job, just as much as Anderson will. They'll duke it out for the job, and I think Owens might win.

antitwins13
11-23-2005, 06:48 PM
Podsednik in center with Anderson in right.

JermaineDye05
11-23-2005, 06:51 PM
I'm going to put my neck out on this one, but I think the answer may not be Anderson. How about a guy who:

--Is fast, probably a 30+ steals guy.

--Hit well over .300 last year in the minors and is hitting .400+ in winter ball, and can hit to all fields.

--Plays excellent defense in the outfield
--Who Ozzie (the man who specifically requested a new 2-hole hitter) specifically mentioned in an interview earlier this month as wanting to see him with the club soon.

His name is Jerry Owens. And my money says he will get an invite to Spring Training, and will have a shot at the CF job, just as much as Anderson will. They'll duke it out for the job, and I think Owens might win.

Don't forgot about Chris Young, that kids got some potential, he can do it all

veeter
11-23-2005, 06:51 PM
Lip:

Don't hold your breath on Pierre. George Offman repored the Cubs are "close" to finalizing a deal with Florida. TIFWIW. This may be true but Ozzie said he wants more speed. Thome can't run and Anderson, I believe, has avg. speed. So, a move will probably be made. As far as Anderson's defense: I think he's great. Rowand was a self made, hard worker. Anderson is a smooth, natural and graceful fielder. Sun or wind don't bother him. Simply put I think he's a natural fielder. With the Sox GREAT pitching his hitting doesn't have to be great. I think, if given the job, he'd go something like: .256 17 62. But again. Ozzie wants speed, so I'd be surprised if a move wasn't made. But please don't over pay.

Palehose13
11-23-2005, 06:52 PM
http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/pr/subs/siexclusive/05/18/bb0524/p1_griffey.jpg

"Hey Hawk, now I got a place to play!"

JermaineDye05
11-23-2005, 06:53 PM
http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/pr/subs/siexclusive/05/18/bb0524/p1_griffey.jpg

"Hey Hawk, now I got a place to play!"

lol I needed a laugh, that's great, the pics perfect

SoxSpeed22
11-23-2005, 06:56 PM
http://i.a.cnn.net/si/2004/pr/subs/siexclusive/05/18/bb0524/p1_griffey.jpg

"Hey Hawk, now I got a place to play!"Unfortunately, we already have our lefty power hitter. Good day. I know you're joking, it's funny. I expect Owens to show up for spring training. It should be a good competition for the job next year.

veeter
11-23-2005, 06:57 PM
I'm going to put my neck out on this one, but I think the answer may not be Anderson. How about a guy who:

--Is fast, probably a 30+ steals guy.

--Hit well over .300 last year in the minors and is hitting .400+ in winter ball, and can hit to all fields.

--Plays excellent defense in the outfield
--Who Ozzie (the man who specifically requested a new 2-hole hitter) specifically mentioned in an interview earlier this month as wanting to see him with the club soon.

His name is Jerry Owens. And my money says he will get an invite to Spring Training, and will have a shot at the CF job, just as much as Anderson will. They'll duke it out for the job, and I think Owens might win. This is interesting. Watching all those spring training games last year, I thought Owens carried himself like a major leaguer. And for whatever reason, out of the Anderson, Young, Owens, Sweeney quartet, Owens is my favorite. Ozzie watched him play In Venezuela and loves him. He's very fast, too. Things that make you go hmmmm.

Soxfanspcu11
11-23-2005, 06:58 PM
Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively

Where do you get this from?? Now granted I don't follow the national league in the same manner that I do the American League but from what I have seen, Pierre is a very good defensive outfielder. He has incredible speed and can certainly get to balls in the gap. I think without a doubt that Anderson has a better arm then Pierre but I would much rather have a guy that can track down line shots over a guy that may have a few more assists.

That being said, I think Anderson is a pretty good defensive outfielder. In the Cleveland series at the end of the year he showed some of his potential, but let's not forget that he is a very young and hasn't really proven anything.

In my book, Pierre is better all around, and if KW can bring him in, for a reasonable price, we are much better having him as a starter. Anderson can come off the bench and be quite productive.

But then again all of this is pure speculation, until I hear that Pierre is a member of the Sox, I am still quite confident in Anderson. And on top of that, I am COMPLETELY confident in KW!

NorthSideSox72
11-23-2005, 07:00 PM
Don't forgot about Chris Young, that kids got some potential, he can do it all

He'll probably also be in the mix in ST, though I think Owens fits the 2-hole hitter mold better. That's why I lean towards him. But in any case, I don't think Anderson is a given by an stretch.

The Dude
11-23-2005, 07:34 PM
...unless KW turns around and gets Juan Pierre. Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively, but Ozzie likes him and might want him as a number 2 hitter.

Well from the looks of what the Marlins are trading for....wed just have to give up a few mid level guys to get him. Id rather see Anderson get a shot at a full time position like we did with Aaron a few years back. Anderson has much more potential than Rowand though. I'll miss ya aaron but not your GIDP's!

getonbckthr
11-23-2005, 07:43 PM
I know he is a jackass, but he plays a darn good outfield, and I think Ozzie can straighten him out. MILTON BRADLEY.

JB98
11-23-2005, 08:11 PM
Anderson is the guy. They wouldn't have traded A-Row unless they felt confident Brian could handle the job. And Chris Young is ahead of Owens on the organizational depth chart too. I wouldn't be surprised to see Young in the big leagues by the end of 2006.

Juan Pierre? Who needs him? He's a poor man's Podsednik.

Pods LF
Iguchi 2B
Dye RF
Thome DH
Paulie 1B
AJ C
Crede 3B
Anderson CF
Uribe SS

bafiarocks03
11-23-2005, 09:22 PM
Brian Anderson for sure!!! I love that guy! Haha we made him a sign last here, so ya! Now we can use it! but still i'd so rather have A-Row out it Center over anyone in the majors!

Ol' No. 2
11-23-2005, 09:28 PM
Anderson is the guy. They wouldn't have traded A-Row unless they felt confident Brian could handle the job. And Chris Young is ahead of Owens on the organizational depth chart too. I wouldn't be surprised to see Young in the big leagues by the end of 2006.

Juan Pierre? Who needs him? He's a poor man's Podsednik.

Pods LF
Iguchi 2B
Dye RF
Thome DH
Paulie 1B
AJ C
Crede 3B
Anderson CF
Uribe SSI agree. I don't get the Pierre-love. There's no way his speed could make up for the defensive downgrade. He has a noodle for an arm, which, combined with Podsednik's below-average arm, is not a good combination.

But why would you put your best OPB power hitter 4th?

Podsednik
Iguchi
Thome
Konerko
Dye
Pierzynski
Crede
Anderson
Uribe

You could switch Dye and Pierzynski, but mainly I like Thome hitting 3rd.

ShoelessJoeS
11-23-2005, 09:30 PM
I agree. I don't get the Pierre-love. There's no way his speed could make up for the defensive downgrade. He has a noodle for an arm, which, combined with Podsednik's below-average arm, is not a good combination.

But why would you put your best OPB power hitter 4th?

Podsednik
Iguchi
Thome
Konerko
Dye
Pierzynski
Crede
Anderson
Uribe

You could switch Dye and Pierzynski, but mainly I like Thome hitting 3rd.
This lineup looks much better, although, I do see Ozzie giving Owens and Young a valid chance of making the CF job ala Widger last Spring at the catcher spot.

JB98
11-23-2005, 09:33 PM
I agree. I don't get the Pierre-love. There's no way his speed could make up for the defensive downgrade. He has a noodle for an arm, which, combined with Podsednik's below-average arm, is not a good combination.

But why would you put your best OPB power hitter 4th?

Podsednik
Iguchi
Thome
Konerko
Dye
Pierzynski
Crede
Anderson
Uribe

You could switch Dye and Pierzynski, but mainly I like Thome hitting 3rd.

Reasonable argument. I'm one of those guys who likes to alternate righty-lefty-righty-lefty. I think it screws up the managers who like to play batter-by-batter with their relief pitchers in the late innings. You can get the same effect by putting AJ fifth and JD sixth. I just prefer not to have AJ protecting Konerko in the lineup.

Also, I like a little speed in the third spot, and Dye is the only one of our power guys capable of stealing a base, or going first to third effectively.

Ol' No. 2
11-23-2005, 09:33 PM
This lineup looks much better, although, I do see Ozzie giving Owens and Young a valid chance of making the CF job ala Widger last Spring at the catcher spot.Yep. All these guys are going to get invited to camp and it's going to be fun watching them battle it out. There could be room for two of them, depending on who else they keep.

alohafri
11-23-2005, 09:35 PM
...unless KW turns around and gets Juan Pierre. Pierre would be a downgrade from Anderson defensively, but Ozzie likes him and might want him as a number 2 hitter.

I'd rather go after Johnny Damon than Juan Pierre.

jerry myers
11-23-2005, 09:47 PM
I trust KW

JB98
11-23-2005, 10:01 PM
I'd rather go after Johnny Damon than Juan Pierre.

Damon wants way too much money.

Domeshot17
11-23-2005, 10:45 PM
I for one am with those that does not want this job handed to Anderson. The kid had 1 big game and looked over matched ( which is not uncommon for first call up) at the plate. If he wins it through Good Healthy Competition in ST cool, but This kid should not be a lock.

Bring in Anderson Owens and Young, let them try out, whoever wins wins, and Borchard either ends up the 4th OF or gets dealt to a team looking for cheap OF with a big upside.

My prediction: Chris Young

batmanZoSo
11-23-2005, 11:00 PM
I'd still go for Pierre in center field rather than letting the rookie Anderson start. I don't like the idea of a rookie coming into a season pretty much knowing he's got a starting job. He's either too nervous or not nervous enough in that situation. Anderson would be a valuable fourth outfielder especially given Dye's health history, and everyone for that matter--you never know. He'd get good experience and enough playing time to get situated to MLB pitching. By '07, then you can look at a more polished Anderson ready to play right field every day or center, whichever is available.

Fake Chet Lemon
11-23-2005, 11:09 PM
its anderson above all of our prospects right now. He will get the job unless we get pierre.

Agree 100%. I think Anderson will get traded for Pierre.

Ozzie wants another speedster badly. When the offense slumped with Pods out that scared the Hell out of Ozzie. And Ozzie said he wants to move Iguchi down. That mandates another move by Kenny then, as Aaron was our other #2 hitter option.

JB98
11-23-2005, 11:11 PM
Agree 100%. I think Anderson will get traded for Pierre.

Ozzie wants another speedster badly. When the offense slumped with Pods out that scared the Hell out of Ozzie. And Ozzie said he wants to move Iguchi down. That mandates another move by Kenny then, as Aaron was our other #2 hitter option.

If Anderson gets traded for Pierre, I'm going to be pissed off.

KRS1
11-23-2005, 11:38 PM
I agree with the Owens for center group, and one thing really makes me think so. Every level the guy has played in he has succeeded, and if I might add he even excelled. When pushed up for low A to AA he stood up under fire. I have no reason to believe he can't have the success at the major league level that he has everywhere else he's gone. Sometimes players who get pushed to excell collapse and some times they respond, he seems to be the guy who pushes himself and wants to be pushed in order to be at his best.

Flight #24
11-24-2005, 12:09 AM
Well from the looks of what the Marlins are trading for....wed just have to give up a few mid level guys to get him. Id rather see Anderson get a shot at a full time position like we did with Aaron a few years back. Anderson has much more potential than Rowand though. I'll miss ya aaron but not your GIDP's!

:?:
Marlins got Petit, a top 20 in all of baseball prospect entering 2005, got another decent one, and didn't have to eat much salary for Delgado.

They also got another top 20-30 in all of baseball prospect in Hanley Ramirez, another very good prospect in Anibal Sanchez, and dumped all of the formerly untradeable Mike Lowell contract in the Beckett deal.

In terms of major league talent, yeah they didn't get a lot. But they got some very very good prospects and didn't have to pay to get them, which is usually the case.

FWIW - The White Sox actually traded by far the worst prospects dealt this week. And got the most cash for a guy 1 year removed from 4 straight 40+HR years.

Slats
11-24-2005, 12:12 AM
My gut says they've got a deal already worked out for Pierre. You don't get rid of a guy like Aaron without a plan in place.

ChiSoxRowand
11-24-2005, 12:14 AM
:?:
Marlins got Petit, a top 20 in all of baseball prospect entering 2005, got another decent one, and didn't have to eat much salary for Delgado.

They also got another top 20-30 in all of baseball prospect in Hanley Ramirez, another very good prospect in Anibal Sanchez, and dumped all of the formerly untradeable Mike Lowell contract in the Beckett deal.

In terms of major league talent, yeah they didn't get a lot. But they got some very very good prospects and didn't have to pay to get them, which is usually the case.

FWIW - The White Sox actually traded by far the worst prospects dealt this week. And got the most cash for a guy 1 year removed from 4 straight 40+HR years.

The Marlins have gotten some very good prospects in return like you said. Hanley ramirez was the top prospect in the Red Sox farm system last year and Petit is supposed to be a stud.

JB98
11-24-2005, 12:37 AM
My gut says they've got a deal already worked out for Pierre. You don't get rid of a guy like Aaron without a plan in place.

There is a plan: Letting Anderson, Young and maybe Owens fight it out for the spot.

We have a glut of outfielders. That's why Aaron was expendable. We don't need noodle-armed, weak-hitting Juan Pierre.

batmanZoSo
11-24-2005, 12:46 AM
There is a plan: Letting Anderson, Young and maybe Owens fight it out for the spot.

We have a glut of outfielders. That's why Aaron was expendable. We don't need noodle-armed, weak-hitting Juan Pierre.

The guy is like a career .305 hitter and good on base. He's like Podsednik only a little better in all aspects. His worst year in a while--last, where he batted .270 something--was still as good as Pods. The year prior he hit .326. He would elevate us to another level.

filmnews
11-24-2005, 12:46 AM
Frank Thomas would be a great in center. He has a good arm.





Just kidding! I think that they will get Pierre.

KRS1
11-24-2005, 12:48 AM
Frank Thomas would be a great in center. He has a good arm.





Just kidding! I think that they will get Pierre.

We use teal here for sarcasm, but welcome.

guillen4life13
11-24-2005, 12:49 AM
Brace yourself:

I think that Willie Harris may be in the mix also. The speed is there, as we all know. If he can get his head together, the average could show up as well. He has performed well at all minor league levels--only the majors have stumped him. If he can get things together, I think he could be really good. There's that 60 steal lefty bat they want. I think it's only fair they give him a chance in ST. He's played CF before. Hit him 9th to keep the rhb/lhb alternation going.

Pods
Uribe
Thome
Konerko
Dye
Iguchi
Pierzynski
Crede
Harris


Again, I'm not saying it will be Harris, but I think that he deserves a shot.

KRS1
11-24-2005, 12:53 AM
Brace yourself:

I think that Willie Harris may be in the mix also. The speed is there, as we all know. If he can get his head together, the average could show up as well. He has performed well at all minor league levels--only the majors have stumped him. If he can get things together, I think he could be really good. There's that 60 steal lefty bat they want. I think it's only fair they give him a chance in ST. He's played CF before. Hit him 9th to keep the rhb/lhb alternation going.

Pods
Uribe
Thome
Konerko
Dye
Iguchi
Pierzynski
Crede
Harris


Again, I'm not saying it will be Harris, but I think that he deserves a shot.

The thought of seeing Willie in Center again makes me shutter, but I do agree he does deserve a 3rd chance to show his stuff. He seemed to be a different player after he came back from the minors last year. Hey maybe if we don't sign PK Gooch can play 1b, did u see the hops he had on a couple of those line drive snags, I bet he could get up higher flat-footed than Paulie running from half-court.

filmnews
11-24-2005, 12:58 AM
I like Willie. I talked to him in the bar at the Hyatt t years ago at Soxfest. But, I think that Wille would have to play every day in order to develop in the majors. I think this is why he did so good in the minors. But, the team is looking to put somebody in the line up every day that can get the job done. If it was the year 1999 or 2000, yeah Willie would be our center fielder. But, the team is looking to win the World Series again and they can't do that with a non-producing number 9 hitter.

Tragg
11-24-2005, 12:58 AM
The guy is like a career .305 hitter and good on base. He's like Podsednik only a little better in all aspects. His worst year in a while--last, where he batted .270 something--was still as good as Pods. The year prior he hit .326. He would elevate us to another level.
One thing offensively he does a lot better than Pods is that he doesn't strike out nearly as often. (At lead-off, it maynot make much difference how Pods gets his outs.) But that bad arm scares me - a bad CF arm just gives runs away.

filmnews
11-24-2005, 01:05 AM
I think that Dye would be a great in center field. He has a great arm and pretty quick. But, we will see if Konerko returns. Then put Pierre in right.

MHOUSE
11-24-2005, 01:08 AM
I think Aaron had a very underrated arm. He always got the ball back in quickly, and made some strong throws to the plate on sac flies and even got a few guys IIRC. He also made pretty accurate throws even being carried toward the wall offbalance from a run deep into the gaps.

By adding Thome, Anderson would only have to hit for a mediocre (.240-.250) average and knock in 50-60 runs to suffice in the 8 or 9 hole as long as he played STUD DEFENSE!

KRS1
11-24-2005, 01:08 AM
I think that Dye would be a great in center field. He has a great arm and pretty quick. But, we will see if Konerko returns. Then, put Pierre in right.

5 years ago maybe, but now it would prolly look something like Bernie Williams trying to run down the tough ones. PLus I don't wanna see our second best slugger as of now getting hurt straining himself to get those balls.

filmnews
11-24-2005, 01:21 AM
Yeah, just put Pierre in center. Arm will not give up too many runs.

Banix12
11-24-2005, 02:20 AM
Comcast was reporting Podsednik will be the starter in CF, but I don't know how much value I should put in that, just throwing it out there.

I think they ended up saying the same thing last year and Aaron ended up getting it anyway. I could be wrong though.

Reasonable argument. I'm one of those guys who likes to alternate righty-lefty-righty-lefty. I think it screws up the managers who like to play batter-by-batter with their relief pitchers in the late innings. You can get the same effect by putting AJ fifth and JD sixth. I just prefer not to have AJ protecting Konerko in the lineup.

Also, I like a little speed in the third spot, and Dye is the only one of our power guys capable of stealing a base, or going first to third effectively.

If you look at the Pods, Iguchi, Thome, Konerko lineup you'll see you actually get the lefty, righty, lefty combo, just not right down the center of the lineup, you get it at the top. And I actually think that it could be more effective at the top of the lineup than the center. I don't totally subscribe to the lefty righty lefty theory, certainly it helps to mix it up, but as you can see the sox would still be mixing it up enough in a similar way.

On the other topic of the day. If the sox got Pierre I wouldn't be angry however I wouldn't have a problem if they played one of the minor leaguers either. I certainly like the white sox situation better than say the cubs who basically have to get a CF because they don't have any decent ones. For the sox Pierre would be a great bonus but if he doesn't come they have so many options, some with higher ceilings than Pierre had coming up. I've learned to trust Ozzie and his ability to evaluate talent. If the sox trade for Pierre I'll know that Ozzie just wasn't positive that Anderson or the other rookies were ready for the full time job yet.

Though I must say part of me wonders if his poor season last year was just Pierre starting to wear down. The guy has played in every marlins game, regular season and playoffs, for the last three years. And he logged 150 games in each of the previous two seasons, as well as 162 the year before at three organizational levels. That's a lot of innings logged at his age, but I guess that means you can at least say he is durable.

Also, on worthless information side note, if the sox acquire Pierre, that would mean 4 of the 6 players from the Mike Hampton to Marlins trade a couple of years ago would have played for the sox (other three were Charles Johnson, Vic Darensborg, and Pablo Ozuna).

ChiSoxLifer
11-24-2005, 03:52 AM
I know he is a jackass, but he plays a darn good outfield, and I think Ozzie can straighten him out. MILTON BRADLEY.

I'm not so sure about that. I can see Bradley accusing Ozzie of not being able to relate to minorities (kekeke) . He's Barry Bonds without the talent and the juice.

Canadian_SoxFan
11-24-2005, 04:05 AM
I'm not so sure about that. I can see Bradley accusing Ozzie of not being able to relate to minorities (kekeke) . He's Barry Bonds without the talent and the juice. IIRC he was caught using steroids after the playoffs.

ChiSoxLifer
11-24-2005, 04:10 AM
IIRC he was caught using steroids after the playoffs.

Really? So he's Barry Bonds without the talent.

Canadian_SoxFan
11-24-2005, 04:13 AM
Really? So he's Barry Bonds without the talent. Sorry, I was mistaken. I was thinking of Matt Lawton of the Yankees. He was suspended for using steroids. Sorry for the mistake.

cubkilla#1soxfan
11-24-2005, 04:41 AM
until last year podsednik was an everyday centerfielder. Instead pos to center and put anderson in left or sign a left handed batting left fielder in Jacque Jones who oh by the way would fit the grinder ball playing exceptional left and right field for those scrubs called the twins.

socko82
11-24-2005, 06:38 AM
As KW has shown he likes to operate under the radar let me throw another name out there. Tampa Bay currently has 6 outfielders on their roster who could play every day. You're not going to get Crawford..but what about Joey Gathwright? He's lefthanded so if nothing else he could platoon with Anderson until one of them shows they are ready to play everyday. On top of that he's cheap and fits Ozzie's request for more speed. I've heard some analysts say Gathwright is the fastest player in MLB and he stole 20 bases last year in less than half a season. Not sure what you would have to give up to get him but Tampa finally has a new GM who might be willing to deal.

Whitesox4ever
11-24-2005, 06:42 AM
I would like to see the Sox make a trade for Vernon Wells..

Lip Man 1
11-24-2005, 01:01 PM
I don't think this has been mentioned enough so let me state that who says the Sox are in the market for a center fielder?

There are a lot more potential left fielders available in trade or as free agents then center fielders. The Sox could replace Rowand by moving Posednik to center and getting a left fielder with some speed and pop in his bat couldn't they?

Lip

CluelessJoe1919
11-24-2005, 01:05 PM
for the love of god no more joe borchard talk..he is a lifer in the minors and will never be an established major leaguer
Borchard looked great last season in his short stint with the Sox. I'm not saying he should be the CF, but don't give up on him just yet. He's got a big-time swing and appears to have a lot of heart as well as defensive capabilities.

Randar68
11-24-2005, 01:12 PM
I don't think this has been mentioned enough so let me state that who says the Sox are in the market for a center fielder?

There are a lot more potential left fielders available in trade or as free agents then center fielders. The Sox could replace Rowand by moving Posednik to center and getting a left fielder with some speed and pop in his bat couldn't they?

Lip

Anderson and Borchard will compete for the CF spot in spring training with Anderson being the likely winner, Borchard COULD be a 4th OF'er and defensive replacement. Can play all 3 OF spots and has switch-hitting power off the bench (although making contact is always an issue, LOL)

Podsednik will not be the CF'er of this team, pure and simple. He's a hack in LF, let alone CF. Either Borch or Anderson are far superior CF'ers.

CluelessJoe1919
11-24-2005, 01:26 PM
Jerry Owens...
I'll take him and the points.

Randar68
11-24-2005, 01:42 PM
Jerry Owens...
I'll take him and the points.

I think Jerry Owens is Pods' replacement in 2007. He's still not terribly refined in his base stealing, although I do think he will continue to improve. I think he needs one year in AAA playing against better catchers/pitchers and learning to play in a small ballpark like USCF. He's a good example of the kind of player that will benefit given the similarity between Knights' Stadium and USCF.

Rounding_Third
11-24-2005, 03:53 PM
Jerry Owens...
I'll take him and the points.

Agreed! The Sox farm is loaded with outstanding OF'ers. I don't think we'll be trading for anyone here. It will be a battle between Owens & Anderson and both may make the team - sorry Timo. Owens may be the speed that Ozzie is looking for. He's 6'3", a lefty bat, hit .331 in Birmingham, and stole 38 bases. Oh, and he's hitting .370 in winter ball in Venezuela.

Meninho
11-24-2005, 03:59 PM
If not a prospect then how about Garcia or Garland for Crawford + prospects from TB? Carl Crawford has a lot of success coming his way.

Palehose13
11-24-2005, 06:44 PM
If not a prospect then how about Garcia or Garland for Crawford + prospects from TB? Carl Crawford has a lot of success coming his way.

I was just going to post that I would LOVE to see Carl Crawford in a Sox uni next year.

KyWhiSoxFan
11-24-2005, 07:37 PM
If not a prospect then how about Garcia or Garland for Crawford + prospects from TB? Carl Crawford has a lot of success coming his way.

Garcia will make $10-million. They're not going to take on that contract, and it would be foolhardy to trade Garland. Getting Crawford that way is not going to happen.

Bucky F. Dent
11-24-2005, 08:41 PM
...unless KW turns around and gets Juan Pierre.

Yep! And don't underestimate the Ozzie connection as the trump card in getting this deal done.

NorthSideSox72
11-24-2005, 09:38 PM
I think Jerry Owens is Pods' replacement in 2007. He's still not terribly refined in his base stealing, although I do think he will continue to improve. I think he needs one year in AAA playing against better catchers/pitchers and learning to play in a small ballpark like USCF. He's a good example of the kind of player that will benefit given the similarity between Knights' Stadium and USCF.

As I noted earlier, Owens has the OZ-wants-him factor, the ideal 2-hole hitter factor, and the speed and defense factors. The one argument against him is the one above.

But as we all probably know, the thing about personnel promotion in any business is: reality trumps idealism. Meaning, in this scenario, you right now have the business situation dictatingthe need for an Owens type player - but he's not quite ready, because he hasn't done the ideal time in the minors. Guess which force wins? Business need today or following the ideal training regimen for the player?

Business need wins. Pretty much always. Unless we get a killer deal on someone, Owens/Anderson/Young will compete for the slot in ST. And Owens seems the best of that bunch, for the 2-hole in the lineup.

JB98
11-25-2005, 12:09 AM
I was just going to post that I would LOVE to see Carl Crawford in a Sox uni next year.

I like Crawford as well, although I wouldn't be willing to part with Garcia or Garland, as someone suggested in this thread. I prefer to keep our pitching staff together.

Of course, this thread no longer became reasonable once someone suggested we acquire Pierre and put him in RF. God help us. Not to beat a dead horse, but we have players already in the organization who are better choices than Pierre for the Rowand's spot in the lineup. Crawford, however, would be a step up over Anderson, Borch or Chris Young at this point.

Lastly, I don't want to see Pods in CF. The Sox moved him to LF with good reason.

CluelessJoe1919
11-25-2005, 12:19 AM
Garcia will make $10-million. They're not going to take on that contract, and it would be foolhardy to trade Garland. Getting Crawford that way is not going to happen.
Garcia is worth every penny...
Keep the pitchers!

mdep524
11-25-2005, 02:16 AM
I don't think this has been mentioned enough so let me state that who says the Sox are in the market for a center fielder?

There are a lot more potential left fielders available in trade or as free agents then center fielders. The Sox could replace Rowand by moving Posednik to center and getting a left fielder with some speed and pop in his bat couldn't they?

Lip My hunch is the Sox aren't really looking for another thumper, especially if Paulie comes back. I would bet it'll be Anderson or Pierre, with Gathright and Owens in as long shots.

But...if the Sox were looking for another big bat, and decided to just let the OF defense go to hell...what about bringing in Nomar to play LF? It's very late at night (LOL), and I don't even support this idea, but its interesting to look at. There's a chance Nomar could become a good LF'er, as it's not the most challenging position for someone who made a career at SS. Though he's injury prone, his bat could be worth the risk almost anywhere in the line up. Imagine something like this:

Podsednik CF
Iguchi 2B
Thome DH
Konerko 1B
Dye RF
Garciaparra LF
Pierzynski C
Crede 3B
Uribe SS

We know KW likes Nomar....and Nomar likes Chicago.... and he may end up being severely overlooked this offseason...and he is rumored to be open to learning a new position if there is no demand for him as a SS..... and the Sox may have an open OF spot...




...and it goes against most of what the Sox are looking for (speed and defense), and it's time for mdep to go to bed!

Chisox003
11-25-2005, 02:19 AM
...and it goes against most of what the Sox are looking for (speed and defense), and it's time for mdep to go to bed!
Not only does it go against what the Sox are looking for, it completely goes against what we just won a championship with.

Sign Paulie, Thome to DH, Anderson in CF, Pods in LF, and it's all good....

Opening day is right around the corner! :gulp:

DaleJRFan
11-25-2005, 04:49 AM
Podsednik CF
Iguchi 2B
Thome DH
Konerko 1B
Dye RF
Garciaparra LF
Pierzynski C
Crede 3B
Uribe SS



GREAT IDEA! UGH... :?:

DaleJRFan
11-25-2005, 05:06 AM
speaking of centerfielders, did anyone notice that Brian Anderson had surgery to remove the screws and plate in his wrist? I didn't see it posted anywhere... but it was reported in the Tribune and RotoWorld

Brian Anderson underwent successful surgery last week to remove a plate and seven screws from his right wrist from an operation two years ago.
This was first announced back in September. Anderson will need about five weeks of rehab and should be fine for the beginning of spring training.

cubkilla#1soxfan
11-25-2005, 05:17 AM
If not a prospect then how about Garcia or Garland for Crawford + prospects from TB? Carl Crawford has a lot of success coming his way.

Did people already forget what propelled them to their first world series title in 88 years?

Contreras
Buerlhe
Garland
Garcia

Garland or Garcia for Carl Crawford, that's just retarted?

Also I hate the fact they gave up rowand and two good pitching prospects for a washed up jim thome, couldn't they have faith in ross gload or rogowski.

DaleJRFan
11-25-2005, 05:37 AM
Contreras
Buerlhe
Garland
Garcia

B U E H R L E

couldn't they have faith in ross gload or rogowski.

:o: NO? Yes, the answer is no.

MILTMAY5
11-25-2005, 06:21 AM
for the love of god no more joe borchard talk..he is a lifer in the minors and will never be an established major leaguerIf I had to watch Borchard taking AB's every day I'd probably kill myself!

KRS1
11-25-2005, 12:27 PM
speaking of centerfielders, did anyone notice that Brian Anderson had surgery to remove the screws and plate in his wrist? I didn't see it posted anywhere... but it was reported in the Tribune and RotoWorld

Yeah I saw that a few weeks ago, it should only make him better to have that thing out.

California Sox
11-25-2005, 12:49 PM
There is no way the Sox are trading for a veteran CF. KW loves BA! He traded Reed because he loves Anderson. He traded Rowand. He offered Chris Young in trade to the Reds for Griffey. In KW's mind Anderson is going to be a great player. Personally, I prefer CYoung, but I'm not the GM. I hope Anderson is as great as the Sox seem to think he'll be. (But I also hope CYoung is as great as I think he'll be. :wink: )

Palehose13
11-25-2005, 12:57 PM
I like Crawford as well, although I wouldn't be willing to part with Garcia or Garland, as someone suggested in this thread. I prefer to keep our pitching staff together.

Of course, this thread no longer became reasonable once someone suggested we acquire Pierre and put him in RF. God help us. Not to beat a dead horse, but we have players already in the organization who are better choices than Pierre for the Rowand's spot in the lineup. Crawford, however, would be a step up over Anderson, Borch or Chris Young at this point.

Lastly, I don't want to see Pods in CF. The Sox moved him to LF with good reason.

I don't want to break up the starting rotation either. I'm not sure what it would take to get Crawford, but I would love to find out. In regards to Anderson, I don't think he's ready to be an every day player yet and I think KW thinks along the same lines. BA may be ready in 2007 or 2008, but I think Kenny is lookng to repeat in 2006 and is looking at other options.

bafiarocks03
11-25-2005, 03:02 PM
Willie Harris!:D:

Palehose13
11-25-2005, 06:47 PM
Willie Harris!:D:

:cower:

bafiarocks03
11-25-2005, 08:23 PM
:cower:

That's mean! Com' on now, you know Willie plays a good center field!

vafan
11-25-2005, 09:50 PM
I don't get all the love for Brian Anderson. So far, he's proved nothing. 12 K's in 34 ABs doesn't give me any confidence that he should be trusted to fill an outfield spot next year. And his AAA numbers were okay, but not overwhelming. As I recall, he was neck and neck with Joe Borchard, and we KNOW Borchard is a bust.

I also fail to understand any of the love for Juan Pierre. The guy has no arm, and no power. Don't we have a Pierre clone on the roster in Willie Harris? Why pay millions for something we already have that costs thousands?

The guy I think the Sox should add is Brian Giles. Move Pods to CF until Anderson/Owens/Young are ready to replace him. Giles was the 12th best player in MLB in Runs Created, and 13th in RC27. In other words, he produced more runs than Paul Konerko. And he's quite a bit cheaper.

Adding Giles would allow the Sox to sign Frank Thomas if he's healthy. They could still keep Anderson on the roster (instead of Timo) and give him ABs against lefties in place of Pods. They could let Owens and Young battle it out in the minors to see who would be a late season call up.

This would give the Sox tremendous flexibility without having to count on an unproven rookie taking on a major role. Brian Anderson might turn into a decent ballplayer. He might also be no better than Joe Borchard.

If the Sox want to repeat in 2006, they would be wise not to take that risk.

KRS1
11-25-2005, 10:12 PM
I don't get all the love for Brian Anderson. So far, he's proved nothing. 12 K's in 34 ABs doesn't give me any confidence that he should be trusted to fill an outfield spot next year. And his AAA numbers were okay, but not overwhelming. As I recall, he was neck and neck with Joe Borchard, and we KNOW Borchard is a bust.

I also fail to understand any of the love for Juan Pierre. The guy has no arm, and no power. Don't we have a Pierre clone on the roster in Willie Harris? Why pay millions for something we already have that costs thousands?

The guy I think the Sox should add is Brian Giles. Move Pods to CF until Anderson/Owens/Young are ready to replace him. Giles was the 12th best player in MLB in Runs Created, and 13th in RC27. In other words, he produced more runs than Paul Konerko. And he's quite a bit cheaper.

Adding Giles would allow the Sox to sign Frank Thomas if he's healthy. They could still keep Anderson on the roster (instead of Timo) and give him ABs against lefties in place of Pods. They could let Owens and Young battle it out in the minors to see who would be a late season call up.

This would give the Sox tremendous flexibility without having to count on an unproven rookie taking on a major role. Brian Anderson might turn into a decent ballplayer. He might also be no better than Joe Borchard.

If the Sox want to repeat in 2006, they would be wise not to take that risk.

U know what I dont get? All this love for Brian Giles, he's 34, is a one year power threat, and he's not as good in the field as he used to be.

JB98
11-25-2005, 10:42 PM
I don't get all the love for Brian Anderson. So far, he's proved nothing. 12 K's in 34 ABs doesn't give me any confidence that he should be trusted to fill an outfield spot next year. And his AAA numbers were okay, but not overwhelming. As I recall, he was neck and neck with Joe Borchard, and we KNOW Borchard is a bust.

I also fail to understand any of the love for Juan Pierre. The guy has no arm, and no power. Don't we have a Pierre clone on the roster in Willie Harris? Why pay millions for something we already have that costs thousands?

The guy I think the Sox should add is Brian Giles. Move Pods to CF until Anderson/Owens/Young are ready to replace him. Giles was the 12th best player in MLB in Runs Created, and 13th in RC27. In other words, he produced more runs than Paul Konerko. And he's quite a bit cheaper.

Adding Giles would allow the Sox to sign Frank Thomas if he's healthy. They could still keep Anderson on the roster (instead of Timo) and give him ABs against lefties in place of Pods. They could let Owens and Young battle it out in the minors to see who would be a late season call up.

This would give the Sox tremendous flexibility without having to count on an unproven rookie taking on a major role. Brian Anderson might turn into a decent ballplayer. He might also be no better than Joe Borchard.

If the Sox want to repeat in 2006, they would be wise not to take that risk.

You must come from the Dusty Baker school of thought: Don't trust young players. To me, at some point, you have to give your young guys an opportunity to play at the big-league level. If Anderson bombs the first couple months of the year, KW will adjust.

Man Soo Lee
11-26-2005, 12:16 AM
I don't get all the love for Brian Anderson. So far, he's proved nothing. 12 K's in 34 ABs doesn't give me any confidence that he should be trusted to fill an outfield spot next year.

Five of Anderson's seven starts (and 8 of his Ks) came against Brad Radke, Johan Santana, Randy Johnson, Felix Hernandez, and Kevin Millwood. In those games, the opposing pitchers (starters and relievers) struck out 12, 11, 8, 13, and 15. Anderson wasn't the only one overmatched.

I think expecting him to match Rowand's 2005 numbers as a rookie might be overly optimistic, but he's not going to hit .176 and strike out 200 times.

kitekrazy
11-26-2005, 01:13 AM
Five of Anderson's seven starts (and 8 of his Ks) came against Brad Radke, Johan Santana, Randy Johnson, Felix Hernandez, and Kevin Millwood. In those games, the opposing pitchers (starters and relievers) struck out 12, 11, 8, 13, and 15. Anderson wasn't the only one overmatched.

I think expecting him to match Rowand's 2005 numbers as a rookie might be overly optimistic, but he's not going to hit .176 and strike out 200 times.

Great research!

mdep524
11-26-2005, 03:15 AM
That's mean! Com' on now, you know Willie plays a good center field! He played a little out there in '03, but I don't remember how good he was defensively. Does anyone remember?

I can't believe I would ever consider saying this... but thinking about Willie Harris platooning in CF is not a terrible idea. Ozzie says he wants more speed in the line up and a new number 2 hitter- Pierre, Ichiro, Gathright, Crawford and Furcal all seem like unrealistic and overly expensive pipedreams. If Ozzie really wants that extra speed, it may have to come from within the organization. If Jerry Owens continues his torrid hitting through spring training, he may force his way into the picture earlier than expected. (Scouts, would he be a passable defensive CF? Or is he a LF only?)

Otherwise Willie Harris might be the guy with the tools Ozzie is looking for. This first occurred to me in this (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=62678) thread, when I realized Gathright, and to some extent Pierre, really aren't that much better than Harris that they're worth the cost salary and trade wise. When he's on, Willie shows good patience, puts up a solid OBP, can bunt, can run like mad, and is improving on stealing bases. All qualities that could make him a number 2 hitter, if he's starting to "turn the corner" in his career.

Maybe he could spell Anderson in CF against tough righties? This of course is all contingent on Willie earning the spot by having a great spring training. It might not work, but it's not a terrible idea.

caulfield12
11-26-2005, 07:43 AM
so we now have a hole in center field...does joe borchard get a shot?Anderson?is jerry owens ready? chris young? so many possibilities within the orginization or do we trade for someone? whats ur thoughts on the future of our CF position?

Borchard probably only has a shot if PK and Thomas do not return.

Obviously, Timo Perez is gone.

However, they still might look at Gload-Rogowski, but it seems obvious they need a 4th outfielder, either Gload or Borchard, unless they are still counting Willie Harris, but he is no defensive replacement. They also have Ozuna that can play a little LF.

Everything in the paper today points to Anderson or Jerry Owens and NOT Chris Young as the leading candidate for CF. Of course, that very well could be a smoke screen for another move.

Of course, a trade could be made for a one year rental like Pierre while the Sox make sure Anderson, Owens and Young are ready for full-time play in the minors.

caulfield12
11-26-2005, 07:51 AM
He played a little out there in '03, but I don't remember how good he was defensively. Does anyone remember?

I can't believe I would ever consider saying this... but thinking about Willie Harris platooning in CF is not a terrible idea. Ozzie says he wants more speed in the line up and a new number 2 hitter- Pierre, Ichiro, Gathright, Crawford and Furcal all seem like unrealistic and overly expensive pipedreams. If Ozzie really wants that extra speed, it may have to come from within the organization. If Jerry Owens continues his torrid hitting through spring training, he may force his way into the picture earlier than expected. (Scouts, would he be a passable defensive CF? Or is he a LF only?)

Otherwise Willie Harris might be the guy with the tools Ozzie is looking for. This first occurred to me in this (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=62678) thread, when I realized Gathright, and to some extent Pierre, really aren't that much better than Harris that they're worth the cost salary and trade wise. When he's on, Willie shows good patience, puts up a solid OBP, can bunt, can run like mad, and is improving on stealing bases. All qualities that could make him a number 2 hitter, if he's starting to "turn the corner" in his career.

Maybe he could spell Anderson in CF against tough righties? This of course is all contingent on Willie earning the spot by having a great spring training. It might not work, but it's not a terrible idea.

Gathright isnīt going anywhere. The best out there that would be available might be Nook Logan, if the Tigers give the job to Curtis Granderson. Craig Monroe is also available, but he was part of the Yankees-Tigers-Sox three way deal involving Rowand, so thatīs off the table.

Ichiro, Crawford and Furcal are no longer options, because that money has to be saved for DH and-or Konerko.

Owens is a natural athlete, but considered a better LF because of his weaker arm. Not Pierre-like, but not the greatest. We lived with Lance Johnson for half a decade, and he made Carlos Lee look like Roberto Clemente. Chris Young is still probably the long-term solution, as he was playing CF over Owens in AA and has a slightly stronger arm, though weaker than Rowand (who didnīt impress me with his throwing this season either).

Willie Harris is not a natural CF, and his play in that position proved you cannot just stick a good athlete out there. I remember he played about 10 feet in front of the wall, because he was afraid to go back on balls, instead preferring to make up ground coming forward. He is a plus arm for 2B, but is only average for CF. I just donīt think he will ever get the bunting and stolen base thing down, and he is not an instinctive number 2 hitter like Iguchi in terms of executing. He strikes out way too much for this slot. I also remember he made one of the most atrocious errors in Oakland while Buehrle was pitching...I think DAngelo Jimenez was the only one to make a worse error that I saw that season, in that same game or series in Oakland.

Optipessimism
11-26-2005, 09:04 AM
Everything in the paper today points to Anderson or Jerry Owens and NOT Chris Young as the leading candidate for CF. Of course, that very well could be a smoke screen for another move.

Of course, a trade could be made for a one year rental like Pierre while the Sox make sure Anderson, Owens and Young are ready for full-time play in the minors.

I'm not convinced Ozzie has any idea what the CF situation will be right now. I would imagine that he probably has Anderson pencilled in, but that could change in a heartbeat. As we know, Ozzie uses ST to decide who belongs where, so I think that the competition will be Anderson, Willie, Borchard, Owens, and Young. Whoever of that group looks the best out there and looks the best at the plate will get the job. With Ozzie I wouldn't be surprised to see any one of those guys patrolling CF because you never really know what he is thinking. I do think that if whoever lands that spot fails in the first half KW will look at a trade immediately, unless for some reason the Sox are out of contention (which is unlikely with our pitching IMO). I sure don't see the Sox pulling a Mariners and starting like 7 different players out there.

EDIT: You are right about the smokescreen though, but I just don't see any trades being made for a CF. Outside of Beltran, I don't know of any other CF that would be worth drastically overpaying for. I would imagine even guys like Gathright and Pierre will probably end up commanding quite a bit more than they're worth at this moment, and both will have almost as many questions surrounding them as Anderson or Willie would.

bafiarocks03
11-26-2005, 12:32 PM
He played a little out there in '03, but I don't remember how good he was defensively. Does anyone remember?

I can't believe I would ever consider saying this... but thinking about Willie Harris platooning in CF is not a terrible idea. Ozzie says he wants more speed in the line up and a new number 2 hitter- Pierre, Ichiro, Gathright, Crawford and Furcal all seem like unrealistic and overly expensive pipedreams. If Ozzie really wants that extra speed, it may have to come from within the organization. If Jerry Owens continues his torrid hitting through spring training, he may force his way into the picture earlier than expected. (Scouts, would he be a passable defensive CF? Or is he a LF only?)

Otherwise Willie Harris might be the guy with the tools Ozzie is looking for. This first occurred to me in this (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/vbulletin/showthread.php?t=62678) thread, when I realized Gathright, and to some extent Pierre, really aren't that much better than Harris that they're worth the cost salary and trade wise. When he's on, Willie shows good patience, puts up a solid OBP, can bunt, can run like mad, and is improving on stealing bases. All qualities that could make him a number 2 hitter, if he's starting to "turn the corner" in his career.

Maybe he could spell Anderson in CF against tough righties? This of course is all contingent on Willie earning the spot by having a great spring training. It might not work, but it's not a terrible idea.

WOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO!!!!: D:

Palehose13
11-26-2005, 03:01 PM
I'm not suggesting anything, but merely inquiring:

What's the status of Jacque Jones? I know he's a FAand his average has dipped the last two years, but this is the kind of guy KW likes to take a chance on. Can he play CF? If not can he play left and Pods move back to CF?

Before you flame, I'm asking...not suggesting.

Banix12
11-26-2005, 03:40 PM
I'm not suggesting anything, but merely inquiring:

What's the status of Jacque Jones? I know he's a FAand his average has dipped the last two years, but this is the kind of guy KW likes to take a chance on. Can he play CF? If not can he play left and Pods move back to CF?

Before you flame, I'm asking...not suggesting.

Ok, he is probably looking for a small pay raise from the $5 million he got last season and seems like he would like a multiyear contract in the 2-3 year range i would suspect. He can play CF and has done well out there in the past, though i would imagine it would be likely that Pods would go back to CF in the scenario where he would come here.

As I have said in earlier discussions about him, his bat decline kind of scares me but basically he would would probably be a Carl Everett type of hitter except with better legs and the ability to play solid defense. Nice player but not sure he is worth the cost.

Lprof
11-27-2005, 08:15 AM
Why not sign Lofton as insurance for the kids, as a fourth outfielder, and as a pinch runner? I don't know how much he would cost now, so that could be a barrier, and I would be a little nervous about clubhouse chemistry (though Ozzie handled most of our past problem children pretty well). But the advantage of Lofton over Pierre is that he leaves room for one of the kids to develop (and, I gather, there are really three of them, not just BA), while Pierre would pretty much have to start, but Lofton can fill in if they don't do the job. Also, unlike Pierre, he won't cost us prospects, and (now that I think about it) his salaray would probably be no more or less than Pierre's. (Just brainstorming; I'm not sure this is a good idea myself).

Tragg
11-27-2005, 09:06 AM
We lived with Lance Johnson for half a decade, and he made Carlos Lee look like Roberto Clemente.

But those teams had offensive weapons like Frank in his prime, Ventura and Tim Raines, the best lead-off hitter we've probably ever had. We could live with downgraded D with a better offense. I don't see any names that remind me of Tim Raines.

As for Jones, we can't afford to spend $3-5 million on a "chance." There's a chance Anderson hits ML pitching and he won't cost $5 million. For 500K and little chance he doesn't play D, leave Anderson alone and improve offensively in other areas, like the bench. Plus, Jones has never had a good OBP, even in his best years. I don't recall Kenny ever investing serious money on players off bad years without an attached explanation (like an injury).

Put Anderson back there, and sign a hitter or two: Konerko, Mueller, Nomar---->all those guys can hit. Players like Dye, POds, and Crede are going to need rest. Add two hitters, and everyone can have a day off and a day at DH each week.

caulfield12
11-27-2005, 10:46 AM
Why not sign Lofton as insurance for the kids, as a fourth outfielder, and as a pinch runner? I don't know how much he would cost now, so that could be a barrier, and I would be a little nervous about clubhouse chemistry (though Ozzie handled most of our past problem children pretty well). But the advantage of Lofton over Pierre is that he leaves room for one of the kids to develop (and, I gather, there are really three of them, not just BA), while Pierre would pretty much have to start, but Lofton can fill in if they don't do the job. Also, unlike Pierre, he won't cost us prospects, and (now that I think about it) his salaray would probably be no more or less than Pierre's. (Just brainstorming; I'm not sure this is a good idea myself).

We are more likely to start 2006 with Chris Singleton, Julio Ramirez and Lyle Mouton as our starting outfield.

Lofton, after his first six months of hitting .400 with the Sox, became a clubhouse cancer along with Royce Clayton and also negatively influenced Carlos Lee.

In the last ten years, the only one who might be considered worse as a teammate is DAngelo Jimenez.

No thanks. Stats donīt tell the whole story...there is a reason Lofton has not found a permanent home for the last five or six seasons.

caulfield12
11-27-2005, 10:50 AM
But those teams had offensive weapons like Frank in his prime, Ventura and Tim Raines, the best lead-off hitter we've probably ever had. We could live with downgraded D with a better offense. I don't see any names that remind me of Tim Raines.

As for Jones, we can't afford to spend $3-5 million on a "chance." There's a chance Anderson hits ML pitching and he won't cost $5 million. For 500K and little chance he doesn't play D, leave Anderson alone and improve offensively in other areas, like the bench. Plus, Jones has never had a good OBP, even in his best years. I don't recall Kenny ever investing serious money on players off bad years without an attached explanation (like an injury).

Put Anderson back there, and sign a hitter or two: Konerko, Mueller, Nomar---->all those guys can hit. Players like Dye, POds, and Crede are going to need rest. Add two hitters, and everyone can have a day off and a day at DH each week.

Not sure if this response was directed to me or not....by the way, any comparison with Carlos Lee and One-Dog was arm strength, because Lance was a pretty darned good little CFer for us.

The only Jones scenario is a one year deal to play RF, with Dye at 1B. Thatīs very unlikely because it is the last option for KW now with Thome in the fold.

Jones probably could play CF, he has a decent enough arm and is still a good athlete, but he wouldnīt sign a one year deal (probably), which would block Anderson-Young-Owens, not to mention the fact that he might cost more than the World Series MVP (Dye), a player that led all MLB RFers in homers. Not going to happen.

MVP
11-28-2005, 09:46 AM
Let Brian Anderson, Chris Young and Jerry Owens fight it out in spring training. The way I see it, I'd rather see one of them start the year off as our centerfielder than to have KW acquire a free agent like Jones or to trade away good prospects for Pierre.

Hangar18
11-28-2005, 10:06 AM
Brian Anderson will start in center next year. Pierre has a weak arm and cannot make the plays that BA can. Pierre is quick, but we need to replace Aaron's great D with great D.


Pierre intrigues me with his speed, but if all this is true (weak arm, wont make plays that Anderson will make) than im all for Anderson being there .....

cwsdeepsouth
11-30-2005, 06:35 PM
In a couple of years or so it will be Owens in left, Young in center and Anderson in right and everyone will be talking about the White Sox having one of the best young outfields in the game.

With Thome and Konerko in the fold it is time to start breaking these guys in this year. Anderson can hold his own defensively and offensively in the #6 or #7 hole in 2006. Owens is not far behind. Young needs another year or so in the minors, then watch out.

These guys can play and are cheap. Truly great organizations trust their talent and give them a chance - see the 2005 Braves.

I hope they do get a chance in 2006, and not some overpriced free agent retread.

Rounding_Third
11-30-2005, 07:43 PM
Platoon Anderson & Owens.

KRS1
11-30-2005, 07:49 PM
Platoon Anderson & Owens.

I dont know why this needs to keep being explained to some people but there is no way that we have 2 prospects platooning when they r in a crucial point in their career in terms of getting ABs. It would be a bad move let one guy stew away on the bench when he could be gaining valuable experience in the minors.

Rounding_Third
11-30-2005, 07:58 PM
I dont know why this needs to keep being explained to some people but there is no way that we have 2 prospects platooning when they r in a crucial point in their career in terms of getting ABs. It would be a bad move let one guy stew away on the bench when he could be gaining valuable experience in the minors.

I don't know why this has to be explained either but Anderson will most likely be on the team no matter what and Owens, being a lefty, would play every 3 of 4/5 games with starting pitching being righty dominating. Both would get at least one AB in nearly every game, excluding CG's. That's hardly stewing on the bench. Owens is getting plenty of experience in Venezuela right now, batting .370, I hear, as of Sunday, and IS ready for the Show.

KRS1
11-30-2005, 08:03 PM
I don't know why this has to be explained either but Anderson will most likely be on the team no matter what and Owens, being a lefty, would play every 3 of 4/5 games with starting pitching being righty dominating. Both would get at least one AB in nearly every game, excluding CG's. That's hardly stewing on the bench. Owens is getting plenty of experience in Venezuela right now, batting .370, I hear, as of Sunday, and IS ready for the Show.

Sorry to say we dont play in the National league where players hop in and out every day. Yes Ozzie manages like an NL coach would but hardly if ever pulls a guy late in the game for batting matchups unless the game is a wash. There is no way this happens thats all I'm saying, and while I dont like to put words in others mouths I'm sure the majority here would agree with that.

Rounding_Third
11-30-2005, 09:19 PM
Sorry to say we dont play in the National league where players hop in and out every day. Yes Ozzie manages like an NL coach would but hardly if ever pulls a guy late in the game for batting matchups unless the game is a wash. There is no way this happens thats all I'm saying, and while I dont like to put words in others mouths I'm sure the majority here would agree with that.

Unless they get a CF elsewhere, Owens and his speed probably gets a good look in AZ. If he impresses, he's got a shot at coming north. Ozzie wants more speed and he could be an answer. That's definitely a big plus for him in Ozzie's eyes. As a lefty, he could get 300 AB's in a platooning system. That's plenty to justify playing MLB. He needs a little work in SB and I'd bet he's doing just that in Ven. and Rock could work with him in AZ.

KRS1
11-30-2005, 11:43 PM
Unless they get a CF elsewhere, Owens and his speed probably gets a good look in AZ. If he impresses, he's got a shot at coming north. Ozzie wants more speed and he could be an answer. That's definitely a big plus for him in Ozzie's eyes. As a lefty, he could get 300 AB's in a platooning system. That's plenty to justify playing MLB. He needs a little work in SB and I'd bet he's doing just that in Ven. and Rock could work with him in AZ.

The way u suggest it him getting 300 ABs, Anderson would get virtuslly no ABs v. rightys and Owens wouldnt bat v. lefties, that would be the biggest mistake we could make when trying to help these guys succeed.

Rounding_Third
12-01-2005, 08:09 PM
The way u suggest it him getting 300 ABs, Anderson would get virtuslly no ABs v. rightys and Owens wouldnt bat v. lefties, that would be the biggest mistake we could make when trying to help these guys succeed.

No, you'd mix it up from time to time but the number still come out the same. If this franchise is to stay on top for awhile, the biggest mistake would be to throw them out there in a year or two with no veteran help and no MLB experience. We don't know how long Pods and Dye will be here after this year. The best thing is to blend these young kids in now so that they have some seasoning when its their turn to lead.

ChiSoxLifer
12-03-2005, 02:03 PM
The Florida Marlins just traded Luis Castillo to the Twins. This means the Marlins do not have a second baseman. Willie Mayes Harris wants to start somewhere and doesn't make a lot of money. I see a match made in Miami and wouldn't be surprised if KW was thinking of a package deal.

caulfield12
12-03-2005, 03:06 PM
No, you'd mix it up from time to time but the number still come out the same. If this franchise is to stay on top for awhile, the biggest mistake would be to throw them out there in a year or two with no veteran help and no MLB experience. We don't know how long Pods and Dye will be here after this year. The best thing is to blend these young kids in now so that they have some seasoning when its their turn to lead.

Including next year, the White Sox will have Pods for two more seasons. I am not 100% sure about 2008 and if he would qualify with service time before that season.

Dye will probably be gone...but it will be expensive to replace that production externally ($5 million doesnt go far these days)....so we will have to look to our four young outfielders to fill that slot, most likely either Anderson or Sweeney.

Anderson needs to be the everyday CF or go to Tucson. It makes no sense for anyone to say that he would benefit from inconsistent playing time against mostly LH pitching. Either he is your CF or not. If they need a back-up, keep Borchard on the bench instead of releasing him. Of course, we cannot be 100% certain Timo wont be back.

Its different when you are trying to get favorable match-ups for Miguel Olivo to build his confidence offensively VIS A VIS defending your WS Championship every game against teams that want desperately to knock you off the pedestal. Ask the Red Sox.

nodiggity59
12-03-2005, 03:19 PM
IF IF IF we get Pierre, how many people would like to see us deal Pods? I think I would if we could get a nice player for him. Can't wait for the winter meetings!

Frater Perdurabo
12-03-2005, 03:26 PM
Anderson needs to be the everyday CF or go to Tucson.

All the Sox will be in Tuscon for spring training, yes? Perhaps you meant to write "Charlotte?"

:wink:

caulfield12
12-03-2005, 03:27 PM
IF IF IF we get Pierre, how many people would like to see us deal Pods? I think I would if we could get a nice player for him. Can't wait for the winter meetings!

Why would we trade the much cheaper Pods for Pierre? How does that benefit us? Pods is perfect for this team and this line-up...now we want to tinker again? Pierre is a wash defensively and both guys do not throw well. What is Pierre going to give you that Pods doesnt at a cheaper price? Other GMs are going to ignore the KW success and attempt to prove they can do it their own way without mimicking the White Sox blueprint.

When Pods is making $4-6 million per season and he is past 30, then we start to think about trading him. But not going into this upcoming season.

nodiggity59
12-03-2005, 03:35 PM
Why would we trade the much cheaper Pods for Pierre? How does that benefit us? Pods is perfect for this team and this line-up...now we want to tinker again? Pierre is a wash defensively and both guys do not throw well. What is Pierre going to give you that Pods doesnt at a cheaper price? Other GMs are going to ignore the KW success and attempt to prove they can do it their own way without mimicking the White Sox blueprint.

When Pods is making $4-6 million per season and he is past 30, then we start to think about trading him. But not going into this upcoming season.

Then forget about Pierre. Our outfield defense would be atrocious.

Chisox003
12-03-2005, 03:39 PM
Then forget about Pierre. Our outfield defense would be atrocious.
Exactly, forget about Pierre. Why the hell would you want to trade Podsednik?

I can't wait until the winter meetings, hell the entire offseason, is over so we just know what the team looks like and can get ready for the season. I'll guarantee you Scott Podsednik is in LF either way, anyway

caulfield12
12-03-2005, 03:41 PM
Then forget about Pierre. Our outfield defense would be atrocious.

I will say only one thing more...Pierre is probably a better defensive CFer than Pods. If we played Pierre in CF and Anderson in LF, we would slightly upgrade our defense (from what we have now). However, it (outfield defense) would still be a step or two behind our defense in the 2005 season.

As I said, for salary reasons, we will hold onto Scott for a few more reasons, then age (diminishing stolen bases) or his salary will force a move.

ChiSoxLifer
12-03-2005, 03:51 PM
Here's a copy of the scouting report on Pods from Stats, Inc.

"Speed is Podsednik's game-he's among the fastest guys in baseball. He's a reliable, and sometimes spectacular, center fielder, covering the considerable gap between Jenkins in left and the team's 2004 right-field combo of Brady Clark and Ben Grieve. Podsednik also throws well."

Here's the scouting report for Juan Pierre.

"His defense remains a huge plus at spacious Pro Player Stadium. His range allowed the Marlins to get by with Miguel Cabrera and Jeff Conine flanking him for the first four months. Pierre's arm probably precludes him from Gold Glove consideration, but he never gives up on balls in the gap and makes his share of highlight catches. His resemblance to a young Mickey Rivers remains eerie."
Granted these reports are from 2004 but I don't think their defense fell off the table in 2005. What happened that makes everyone think putting these two in the outfield together in 2006 would make the defense so horrible? The Cell has a smaller outfield than wherever the Marlins play so their speed would get them to a heck of a lot of balls hit there. It appears that neither of them have strong arms but I would think a majority of their throws would go to the cut-off man.
Offensively you know what you're getting with Pods. Pierre has a career ba of .305 and obp of .355. He's had over 200 hits three times, he's young, and hasn't broken the bank yet. I've heard he's a good clubhouse guy and Ozzie loves him. If Ozzie loves him, I don't see why he wouldn't be a good addition. So, why not Pierre?

RetireWoodys28
12-03-2005, 04:09 PM
Sorry if this rambles off-topic a bit, but I honestly believe that any talk of a trade for a center fielder has consequences beyond the CF position itself. You have to also consider what you're giving up elsewhere, and how that affects your pitching as well as your potential to develop what could be an amazing crop of young outfielders.

Unless some GM is willing to give up an everyday center fielder who can hit #2 for a Joe Borchard-type (should this be in teal?), I really hope we don't make any move in center. Any and all talk of a trade for a center fielder involving the names Cotts or Marte make me queasy. We have an abundance of outfield talent in the minors right now, to go along with TWO lefties coming out of the bullpen with world series rings. Say what you will about Damaso, but after game 3 I think he proved that he's worth having around. His bi-polar-like sense of self-confidence has its peaks and its valleys, but lefties are always at a premium, and Marte just might have gotten something from Ozzie sticking with him this Fall. Don't trade anymore lefties!

If any of the pitchers are traded before opening day, my guess is Contreras. He's at the end of a contract next year, and KW has established a nice little tradition of moving starting pitchers we can't afford to re-sign while they're still a hot commodity, thereby maximizing his returns. This is how we got Contreras to begin with. I think McCarthy's shown he's ready, and in the Garland vs. Contreras reality check I can't see how you let JG walk for a guy who claims to be 30-something. But if Williams stays true to form, he's not going to trade a SP for a CF. He'll want a starter in return, and if a Contreras trade did ever happen, I would expect we're more likely to give up an outfielder, not get one, if we're going to get a #4 or #5 SP in return.

Following this logic, Anderson seems the odds-on favorite next season, especially if he shows some plate discipline in the Spring. A less likely-- though very intriguing-- possibilty would be either Young or Owens. The speed from either one would fit nicely in the #9 spot. With speed at #9 and #1, you're going to manufacture a lot of the same opportunities you make for yourself with speed at #1 and #2. As I see it, the biggest drawback to making no move is that we still have Iguchi batting #2. But we won a world series with him batting #2 (still getting used to saying that!), I honestly don't think we need him to hit 30+ homers a year (esp. now w/ Thome), and I'd much rather see us use this opportunity to develop some young talent.

Owens will be 25 years old next season. He's one heck of an athelete. If he shows he can hit in AAA, it wouldn't surprise me to see him called up somewhere around the midway point next season, ala Anderson in '05. I've heard talk about Young being a 5-tool outfielder, though I've also heard he has an "average" arm, and it seems he spent the majority of last season retooling his swing. The adjustments payed off, but I'm guessing that the Sox will want him to solidify his swing for another year or so in the minors. My hunch is that if either of the two comes up next season, it will be Owens.

On a semi-related topic, does anyone see any kind of future left for Gload? People have speculated about shifting Pods to CF for whoever in LF, is there any chance Gload could see some time in the OF, even if it's just done on a platooning basis? Or in addition to Frank Thomas and Carl Everett, is Ross Gload is another guy left without a job in the Thome era? Does anyone know how much Gload is costing us? Does anyone see any trade potential in a left-handed hitter who has shown he can hit major league pitching and play 2 positions?

ilsox7
12-03-2005, 04:13 PM
Here's a copy of the scouting report on Pods from Stats, Inc.

"Speed is Podsednik's game-he's among the fastest guys in baseball. He's a reliable, and sometimes spectacular, center fielder, covering the considerable gap between Jenkins in left and the team's 2004 right-field combo of Brady Clark and Ben Grieve. Podsednik also throws well."

Here's the scouting report for Juan Pierre.

"His defense remains a huge plus at spacious Pro Player Stadium. His range allowed the Marlins to get by with Miguel Cabrera and Jeff Conine flanking him for the first four months. Pierre's arm probably precludes him from Gold Glove consideration, but he never gives up on balls in the gap and makes his share of highlight catches. His resemblance to a young Mickey Rivers remains eerie."
Granted these reports are from 2004 but I don't think their defense fell off the table in 2005. What happened that makes everyone think putting these two in the outfield together in 2006 would make the defense so horrible? The Cell has a smaller outfield than wherever the Marlins play so their speed would get them to a heck of a lot of balls hit there. It appears that neither of them have strong arms but I would think a majority of their throws would go to the cut-off man.
Offensively you know what you're getting with Pods. Pierre has a career ba of .305 and obp of .355. He's had over 200 hits three times, he's young, and hasn't broken the bank yet. I've heard he's a good clubhouse guy and Ozzie loves him. If Ozzie loves him, I don't see why he wouldn't be a good addition. So, why not Pierre?

Scott does not throw well. His arm is below average. That alone makes these scouting reports skeptical at best. Speed certainly helps make an outfielder good. But reading the ball off the bat and taking proper routes is more important.

ChiSoxLifer
12-03-2005, 09:14 PM
Scott does not throw well. His arm is below average. That alone makes these scouting reports skeptical at best. Speed certainly helps make an outfielder good. But reading the ball off the bat and taking proper routes is more important.

Living in L.A., I don't get to watch the Sox on an everyday basis so I'll acquiesce to those who do (regarding his throwing arm). IMO it's much more important to be able to cover a lot of ground than to have a strong arm. With that said, I've heard the outfield prospects are able to cover a lot of ground without a large dropoff in offensive production. From observations of the recent Marlins fire sale, they're going to want way too much in return for Pierre. Unless the Sox are able to sign him to a contract extension, I wouldn't want to give up the prospects it'll take to get him.

Lprof
12-03-2005, 11:21 PM
From what I have been reading about Owens, it seems to me that he should at least be considered the equal of Anderson. I don't see why we have to assume he needs to be at Triple A; as already mentioned by someone else, he is no kid; he will be 25 this season. Lots of players (Indeed, most of the top ones) jump straight from Double A; triple A is rapidly becoming the haven for suspects rather than prospects. He gives us the speed near the top of the lineup Ozzie wants, and led the Southern League in hitting. He also has burned up winter ball with his hitting. I am not sure exactly what it is Anderson brings to the table. He is supposed to be a great offensive prospect, but his minor league numbers are just a little better than ok. He isn't fast, and Ozzie has openly questioned his defense. In any event, I am extremely uncomfortable without having a veteran plan B available. I understand the problems Lofton has had with chemistry (though I put in his favor his challenge to Sosa when he was with the Cubs). But if Pierre is considered beyond our reach, I think we need a fourth outfielder/centerfield backup plan. If not Lofton, does anyone else have any other feasible suggestions?

soxinem1
12-04-2005, 08:27 AM
I say Borchard, Anderson, Owens, and the like should battle it out.

Watching Pierre play CF is not going to be fun. Oh yeah, he catches anything he can run down and moves side to side as good as anyone. But his tentative nature playing the walls is maddening. If Rowand's false breaks drove Ozzie nuts he surely will not appreiciate how he plays the walls.

What's our other options, Hunter and Lofton? Twins won't trade in the division and KL's through as a regular.

Let the guys play and battle it out.

Plus, if we do fill it from within, Chris Berman can tell the audience 200 times that the Sox have five players on the roster developed from within!

caulfield12
12-04-2005, 09:09 AM
From what I have been reading about Owens, it seems to me that he should at least be considered the equal of Anderson. I don't see why we have to assume he needs to be at Triple A; as already mentioned by someone else, he is no kid; he will be 25 this season. Lots of players (Indeed, most of the top ones) jump straight from Double A; triple A is rapidly becoming the haven for suspects rather than prospects. He gives us the speed near the top of the lineup Ozzie wants, and led the Southern League in hitting. He also has burned up winter ball with his hitting. I am not sure exactly what it is Anderson brings to the table. He is supposed to be a great offensive prospect, but his minor league numbers are just a little better than ok. He isn't fast, and Ozzie has openly questioned his defense. In any event, I am extremely uncomfortable without having a veteran plan B available. I understand the problems Lofton has had with chemistry (though I put in his favor his challenge to Sosa when he was with the Cubs). But if Pierre is considered beyond our reach, I think we need a fourth outfielder/centerfield backup plan. If not Lofton, does anyone else have any other feasible suggestions?

Milton Bradley
Dave Roberts
Randy Winn
Nook Logan
Justin Gathwright
Jacque Jones

Optipessimism
12-04-2005, 09:45 AM
Does anyone know how much Gload is costing us? Does anyone see any trade potential in a left-handed hitter who has shown he can hit major league pitching and play 2 positions?

I think Ross is at the league minimum but I doubt he makes a team with 2 everyday first baseman. He'll probably be traded, but it's a shame considering we could have probably asked more for him after his 2004 season.

Lip Man 1
12-04-2005, 01:08 PM
For what it's worth in the Sunday Sun-Times, Chris DeLuca has a story previewing the Winter Meetings and continues to speculate that the Sox have interest in Juan Pierre.

Lip

delben91
12-04-2005, 01:13 PM
For what it's worth in the Sunday Sun-Times, Chris DeLuca has a story previewing the Winter Meetings and continues to speculate that the Sox have interest in Juan Pierre.

Lip

All this speculation really makes me wonder. However, I still don't think the Sox have a need for Pierre, and when it comes down to it, I think there are many more "desperate" teams out there that will be bidding on Pierre.

Doesn't make sense to me to give something up for a player who isn't a clear upgrade over what the Sox already have. Trading players/prospects to run in place? I'll pass.

Lprof
12-04-2005, 01:41 PM
All this speculation really makes me wonder. However, I still don't think the Sox have a need for Pierre, and when it comes down to it, I think there are many more "desperate" teams out there that will be bidding on Pierre.

Doesn't make sense to me to give something up for a player who isn't a clear upgrade over what the Sox already have. Trading players/prospects to run in place? I'll pass.

When you say "for a player who isn't a clear upgrade...", you ignore one key fact: absent acquiring Pierre (or some reasonable facsimile), we will be defending our championship with a totally unproven rookie in centerfield; that may work out ok, but it may not. It's the "Clint Eastwood" approach: "You feeling lucky, punk?" I would rather have some veteran presence, especially one that can give you an incredible one-two speed punch at the top of the order, allowing you to drop Iguchi down (something Anderson doesn't really do, since he has no speed; and for the idea of Uribe, well PULEESE!). Also, Pierre gives you insurance at the top of the order for Pods going down. When he went down last year our offense--tenuous as it was to begin with--went totally down the toilet.

ilsox7
12-04-2005, 01:43 PM
When you say "for a player who isn't a clear upgrade...", you ignore one key fact: absent acquiring Pierre (or some reasonable facsimile), we will be defending our championship with a totally unproven rookie in centerfield; that may work out ok, but it may not. It's the "Clint Eastwood" approach: "You feeling lucky, punk?" I would rather have some veteran presence, especially one that can give you an incredible one-two speed punch at the top of the order, allowing you to drop Iguchi down (something Anderson doesn't really do, since he has no speed; and for the idea of Uribe, well PULEESE!). Also, Pierre gives you insurance at the top of the order for Pods going down. When he went down last year our offense--tenuous as it was to begin with--went totally down the toilet.

Every team has question marks. The nice thing about our "question mark" in CF is that he plays great defense and will be hitting 9th, replacing a weak link in our offense from last year. Oh, and he has incredible potential to be great. Works for me.

delben91
12-04-2005, 02:08 PM
When you say "for a player who isn't a clear upgrade...", you ignore one key fact: absent acquiring Pierre (or some reasonable facsimile), we will be defending our championship with a totally unproven rookie in centerfield; that may work out ok, but it may not. It's the "Clint Eastwood" approach: "You feeling lucky, punk?" I would rather have some veteran presence, especially one that can give you an incredible one-two speed punch at the top of the order, allowing you to drop Iguchi down (something Anderson doesn't really do, since he has no speed; and for the idea of Uribe, well PULEESE!). Also, Pierre gives you insurance at the top of the order for Pods going down. When he went down last year our offense--tenuous as it was to begin with--went totally down the toilet.

I see what you're saying, and it makes a certain amount of sense. What I keep coming back to though (and I said this in another thread) is that it also doesn't make sense why everyone is so afraid of rookies? Every player was a rookie at some point. Even the Yankees couldn't afford veterans at every position (Cano), so you're going to need to infuse some young players for monetary purposes if nothing else. But beyond that, Anderson sounds like he has a ton of talent, and if he's the "weak" link, that's not a bad weak link in my mind.

If the Sox never trusted rookies, McCarthy would be toiling in AAA, and Jenks would be the Southern League saves leader. Every once in a while you just have to take a chance on a young player.

Lprof
12-04-2005, 07:51 PM
I see what you're saying, and it makes a certain amount of sense. What I keep coming back to though (and I said this in another thread) is that it also doesn't make sense why everyone is so afraid of rookies? Every player was a rookie at some point. Even the Yankees couldn't afford veterans at every position (Cano), so you're going to need to infuse some young players for monetary purposes if nothing else. But beyond that, Anderson sounds like he has a ton of talent, and if he's the "weak" link, that's not a bad weak link in my mind.

If the Sox never trusted rookies, McCarthy would be toiling in AAA, and Jenks would be the Southern League saves leader. Every once in a while you just have to take a chance on a young player.

Actually, I think McCarthy proves my point: as high as everyone was on him in the spring, he stunk up the joint so badly that he had to be sent down; thank goodness we had Hernandez there. Maybe Pierre isn't the answer (though all other things being equal, I think he is; the only issue is his cost in players and impact on the budget). But what I am saying is that we need to have a "plan B" in place in case our rookies do what McCarthy did at the beginning of the year. Most years, it probably wouldn't be that big a thing. But Kenny just traded three pretty solid players for a 35 year old DH; he obviously wants to win again, and is willing to sacrifice to do so. Given that, it makes absolutely no sense to go into the season counting on unproven rookies with no veteran in place as a failsafe. Certainly, Anderson's brief performance with the team last year didn't build my confidence in him (by way of analogy, the way Merton's rookie performance did for the Cubs).I seriously doubt Kenny will allow that to happen. The question, then, is what to do? We could trade for Pierre, we could sign Jones and put Pods in center, we could sign Lofton.But we have to do something. I like this winning stuff; I want to do it again; I don't know why we didn't do it sooner.

ilsox7
12-04-2005, 07:56 PM
Actually, I think McCarthy proves my point: as high as everyone was on him in the spring, he stunk up the joint so badly that he had to be sent down; thank goodness we had Hernandez there. Maybe Pierre isn't the answer (though all other things being equal, I think he is; the only issue is his cost in players and impact on the budget). But what I am saying is that we need to have a "plan B" in place in case our rookies do what McCarthy did at the beginning of the year. Most years, it probably wouldn't be that big a thing. But Kenny just traded three pretty solid players for a 35 year old DH; he obviously wants to win again, and is willing to sacrifice to do so. Given that, it makes absolutely no sense to go into the season counting on unproven rookies with no veteran in place as a failsafe. Certainly, Anderson's brief performance with the team last year didn't build my confidence in him (by way of analogy, the way Merton's rookie performance did for the Cubs).I seriously doubt Kenny will allow that to happen. The question, then, is what to do? We could trade for Pierre, we could sign Jones and put Pods in center, we could sign Lofton.But we have to do something. I like this winning stuff; I want to do it again; I don't know why we didn't do it sooner.

Just curious, but under this theory, when is it acceptable to allow a rookie to play?

Optipessimism
12-04-2005, 08:03 PM
Actually, I think McCarthy proves my point: as high as everyone was on him in the spring, he stunk up the joint so badly that he had to be sent down; thank goodness we had Hernandez there.

McCarthy wasn't using his change and he was tipping his pitches. That type of thing can happen to any pitcher at any given time, see: Jose Contreras. This can be fixed and should be fixed, and when it happens to a MLB starter like it did with Jose you don't send him back to the minors. You fix the problem at the Major League level and be done with it, but fortunately as was the case in 2005, we had El Duque right there. Not too many ML teams have four quality starters, much less six. I think we'll be fine with 5.

(by way of analogy, the way Merton's rookie performance did for the Cubs).I seriously doubt Kenny will allow that to happen.

The Cubs suck.

The question, then, is what to do? We could trade for Pierre, we could sign Jones and put Pods in center, we could sign Lofton.But we have to do something. I like this winning stuff; I want to do it again; I don't know why we didn't do it sooner.

Well, we damn sure don't want to take a giant step backwards which is exactly what any of those acquistions would make us do. Now, if there were health questions involved for say two of our projected starting OFs it might make sense to bring in another bat to rotate in, but we already had Carl Everett and we denied his option. So, this isn't happening.

If Anderson doesn't work out at all, which I think isn't even a question considering his D, then KW can explore a trade at the deadline. While a GM has to be prepared for failure, he can't be expected to count on it and have replacements ready for every position. Baseball economics simply doesn't permit that.

Lip Man 1
12-04-2005, 09:28 PM
Ilsox 7:

Good question.

My personal opinion has always been the rookies play when the team is no longer in contention or isn't in contention in the first place. I realize there are degrees to this and it's basically a judgement call by the team's front office.

For example, Tampa Bay, Colorado and Kansas City play NOTHING BUT rookies. They have no chance to win anything. Teams like the Yanks, White Sox, Red Sox, Cards, Astros and so forth play experienced veterans because they have a very good chance of making the post season.

The tough part comes for teams like the Twins, Blue Jays, Cubs and so forth because you don't know if they have a chance or not.

Lip

ilsox7
12-04-2005, 09:34 PM
Ilsox 7:

Good question.

My personal opinion has always been the rookies play when the team is no longer in contention or isn't in contention in the first place. I realize there are degrees to this and it's basically a judgement call by the team's front office.

For example, Tampa Bay, Colorado and Kansas City play NOTHING BUT rookies. They have no chance to win anything. Teams like the Yanks, White Sox, Red Sox, Cards, Astros and so forth play experienced veterans because they have a very good chance of making the post season.

The tough part comes for teams like the Twins, Blue Jays, Cubs and so forth because you don't know if they have a chance or not.

Lip

Interesting points. I really think the set-up for BA starting next year is pretty good though. His instruction from Ozzie will be to play defense and anything else is gravy. I guess I just am surprised at all of the anti-rookie talk going on around here when Bobby Jenks, a rookie, was a big part of our team down the stretch run and in October.

The Deacon
12-04-2005, 09:35 PM
Ilsox 7:

Good question.

My personal opinion has always been the rookies play when the team is no longer in contention or isn't in contention in the first place. I realize there are degrees to this and it's basically a judgement call by the team's front office.

For example, Tampa Bay, Colorado and Kansas City play NOTHING BUT rookies. They have no chance to win anything. Teams like the Yanks, White Sox, Red Sox, Cards, Astros and so forth play experienced veterans because they have a very good chance of making the post season.

The tough part comes for teams like the Twins, Blue Jays, Cubs and so forth because you don't know if they have a chance or not.

Lip

2005 Rookies on above mentioned teams.
Yankees - Robinson Cano (2B), Chien-Ming Wang (P)
Red Sox - Jonathon Papelbon (P)
Cards - Yadier Molina (C), John Rodriguez (OF)
Astros - Wily Taveras (OF), Chris Burke (OF)

All made SIGNIFICANT contrbutions as starters to their respective teams.

Tragg
12-04-2005, 09:40 PM
Certainly, Anderson's brief performance with the team last year didn't build my confidence in him (by way of analogy, the way Merton's rookie performance did for the Cubs).I seriously doubt Kenny will allow that to happen. The question, then, is what to do? We could trade for Pierre, we could sign Jones and put Pods in center, we could sign Lofton.But we have to do something. I like this winning stuff; I want to do it again; I don't know why we didn't do it sooner.
You just demonstrated why we DON'T have to do anything. Because both of the alternatives - put Pierre or Pods in center - destory our up the middle defense (pods can barely play left; Pierre is one of the worst defensive center fielders in the majors). The risk with Anderson is that he doesn't hit - that's similar to the risk with a pitcher. But, batting 9th, so what? There is very little risk that he doesn't field. If we weren't willing to stomach no offense from Anderson, then we shouldn't have traded Rowand, without a back-up plan already in place. It was a good move by Kenny: Thome + Anderson > Rowand + Everett.

Our minors are loaded with OF prospects with great potential. No reason to actually give up ballplayers for mediocre veterans at these positions.

Tragg
12-04-2005, 09:55 PM
Ilsox 7:

Good question.

My personal opinion has always been the rookies play when the team is no longer in contention or isn't in contention in the first place. I realize there are degrees to this and it's basically a judgement call by the team's front office.

For example, Tampa Bay, Colorado and Kansas City play NOTHING BUT rookies. They have no chance to win anything. Teams like the Yanks, White Sox, Red Sox, Cards, Astros and so forth play experienced veterans because they have a very good chance of making the post season.

Lip

??????

Yankees (Cano)
Astros (Taveras, Wandy Rodrieguez, Chad Qualls -although Qualls may not have been an offical rookie)
Braves (Franceur, Johnston, Davies, Boyer - LaRoche the prior year)
Near playoff teams like the Phillies and As also played rookies.

We're talking about ONE rookie, not a team full of them like the Royals.

MisterB
12-05-2005, 03:09 AM
??????

Yankees (Cano)
Astros (Taveras, Wandy Rodrieguez, Chad Qualls -although Qualls may not have been an offical rookie)
Braves (Franceur, Johnston, Davies, Boyer - LaRoche the prior year)
Near playoff teams like the Phillies and As also played rookies.

We're talking about ONE rookie, not a team full of them like the Royals.

And the Braves have made the postseason for over a decade while managing to work in rookies like Marcus Giles, Rafael Furcal, Ryan Klesko, Andruw Jones, Chipper Jones, Javy Lopez, etc. I have no problem with ONE rookie in the lineup that's batting at the bottom of the order, so he can concentrate on defense and fundamental, advance-the-runner type hitting.

IlliniSox4Life
12-05-2005, 04:14 AM
Interesting points. I really think the set-up for BA starting next year is pretty good though. His instruction from Ozzie will be to play defense and anything else is gravy. I guess I just am surprised at all of the anti-rookie talk going on around here when Bobby Jenks, a rookie, was a big part of our team down the stretch run and in October.

Exactly, and even further, I'm not sure on the rules about this, but since he was a late season call up, isn't he technically not even a rookie until next year when he gets more time? Wouldn't he still be in contention next year for ROY?

And that said, if we can trust a closer to close the World Series before he's even a rookie when we seemingly had other options (move Cotts/Politte to closer, give Hermie more opportunities, or just go to closer by committee because the whole pen had been good), why can't we trust a guy to play center field when none of the other options seem that great? We'd have to give up something in a trade for anyone else, and none of the options strengthen our CF significantly without weakening some other part.

Also, everyone forgets Iguchi was a rookie last year. Sure he came from Japan, but is the talent he's playing against there better than the minors? And if it is why aren't we getting more players from over there? He put up good numbers in the #2 slot, and we leaned on him to do that a lot. Surely if the same guys who saw Iguchi could play see that Anderson can play, why not trust them to put him in a less critical roll than the one Iguchi is playing?

getonbckthr
12-05-2005, 04:29 AM
I would just feel alot more confortable easing Anderson as a starter opposed to here your the starter now make plays. I would rather a platoon. If we could get someone somewhat cheap for this season. Jenks didn't just come up to the big leagues and start closing games. He was a regular relief pitcher at first then when Hermy hurt his back he was forced into closing. Bmac was brought up cause El Duque got hurt. Bmac got hit around, then snt back down. They found his problem, he fixed it mechanically and now he is ready to go.

California Sox
12-05-2005, 07:11 AM
I've said it before: The Sox have three centerfielders very close (Owens, Anderson, and Young). To fill the position all they need is one of them (or a combination, say BA and Owens) to hit .270 and play decent defense. Juan Pierre's market value is sooooo much higher than his actual value right now it's ridiculous. Be patient we'll be fine in CF.

Tragg
12-05-2005, 08:29 AM
I've said it before: The Sox have three centerfielders very close (Owens, Anderson, and Young). To fill the position all they need is one of them (or a combination, say BA and Owens) to hit .270 and play decent defense. Juan Pierre's market value is sooooo much higher than his actual value right now it's ridiculous. Be patient we'll be fine in CF.

Well said.

It will be nice if 3 pan out, because Pods and Dye will have to be replaced in the next few years, too.

And, indeed, the Braves judicuiously using rookies has a lot to do with their long term success (along with keeping Glavine, Maddux and Smoltz around).

Randar68
12-05-2005, 09:49 AM
I would just feel alot more confortable easing Anderson as a starter opposed to here your the starter now make plays. I would rather a platoon. If we could get someone somewhat cheap for this season. Jenks didn't just come up to the big leagues and start closing games. He was a regular relief pitcher at first then when Hermy hurt his back he was forced into closing. Bmac was brought up cause El Duque got hurt. Bmac got hit around, then snt back down. They found his problem, he fixed it mechanically and now he is ready to go.

You don't platoon rookies who need regular AB's. Anderson is nto some guy with 5000 minor league AB's. He went draft to the majors in 2 and a quarter years. He needs to play every day.

BMac got hit around because he refused to use his change-up and supposedly had a mechanical flaw that developed in the offseason, not due to just being a minor leaguer.

Lip has always had this inane aversion to rookies of young players, always preferring we trade for some washed-up, over-payed has-been than using rookies. Any discussion with him on the value of developing your own players is useless form the get-go.

The key factor with player development is to know them mentally/emotionally. BMac and Jenks both were very strong mentally. Anderson is as well. There have been guys in the past who we know have not been. Kip Wells, Jon Garland of the past, Borch, etc... If they aren't prepared to struggle, to get hit-around, have never had prolonged failure in the past, how they will handle it on the MLB level is something you can't measure with numbers, scouting...

caulfield12
12-05-2005, 12:20 PM
You don't platoon rookies who need regular AB's. Anderson is nto some guy with 5000 minor league AB's. He went draft to the majors in 2 and a quarter years. He needs to play every day.

BMac got hit around because he refused to use his change-up and supposedly had a mechanical flaw that developed in the offseason, not due to just being a minor leaguer.

Lip has always had this inane aversion to rookies of young players, always preferring we trade for some washed-up, over-payed has-been than using rookies. Any discussion with him on the value of developing your own players is useless form the get-go.

The key factor with player development is to know them mentally/emotionally. BMac and Jenks both were very strong mentally. Anderson is as well. There have been guys in the past who we know have not been. Kip Wells, Jon Garland of the past, Borch, etc... If they aren't prepared to struggle, to get hit-around, have never had prolonged failure in the past, how they will handle it on the MLB level is something you can't measure with numbers, scouting...

Olivo and Rauch were also very suspect in terms of make-up for the big leagues. Ginter, not sure what happened with him. Danny Wright, a combination of mental and physical issues.

Lprof
12-05-2005, 02:11 PM
Just curious, but under this theory, when is it acceptable to allow a rookie to play?
It's certainly ok to take a chance when you don't think you are a contender, or when you are in a rebuilding stage. But note that I am not saying you shouldn't play rookies; rather, I am saying you should have a veteran backup plan in place, in case the rookie falls on his face, possibly screwing up your title chances by providing an automatic out or a loose canon in the outfield.

WestSideWhiteSox
12-05-2005, 05:26 PM
Anderson is the man until proven otherwise. At this point Borchard has more value as trade bait then on the parent club, and should be dealt for some mutch-needed utility help, maybe a guy like Mark DeRosa (INF-Texas) or Frankie Menechino (INF-Toronto).

caulfield12
12-05-2005, 07:20 PM
Anderson is the man until proven otherwise. At this point Borchard has more value as trade bait then on the parent club, and should be dealt for some mutch-needed utility help, maybe a guy like Mark DeRosa (INF-Texas) or Frankie Menechino (INF-Toronto).

Why would any of those teams give up a major league player when Borchard will be available to anyone for free when we have to waive him if he does not make the team in the Spring?

It would have to be a deal like Jerry Owens for Escobar, we are not going to get a major league player in return for Joe, as much as it pains me to say it.

TheVulture
12-05-2005, 07:41 PM
I think expecting him to match Rowand's 2005 numbers as a rookie might be overly optimistic, but he's not going to hit .176 and strike out 200 times.

Yeah, but he could hit .176 and strike out 50 times and get sent to the minors

TheVulture
12-05-2005, 07:53 PM
.

If the Sox never trusted rookies, McCarthy would be toiling in AAA, and Jenks would be the Southern League saves leader. Every once in a while you just have to take a chance on a young player.

Jenks and McCarthy are perfect examples for the counter-argument. They got their chance when vet players went down with injury or were not performing at a high level. The way I see it, that's the perfect way to break in rookies. Sooner or later, you'll need to call someone up in the middle of the season when something breaks down and if they're good enough they'll stick, if not maybe they'll get another chance later. Same thing happened with Rowand. In my opinion, unless you're a can't miss prospect like Baines and Thomas were, you should have to force your way in, not just have the job handed to you, unless the team's in rebuilding mode. I don't think Anderson is that level. Maybe Young will be in '07.

Also, if I recall correctly the Yanks didn't just hand Cano the job - he had to earn it midseason after the vets they signed didn't pan out.

Lprof
12-05-2005, 07:58 PM
Jenks and McCarthy are perfect examples for the counter-argument. They got their chance when vet players went down with injury or were not performing at a high level. The way I see it, that's the perfect way to break in rookies. Sooner or later, you'll need to call someone up in the middle of the season when something breaks down and if they're good enough they'll stick, if not maybe they'll get another chance later. Same thing happened with Rowand. In my opinion, unless you're a can't miss prospect like Baines and Thomas were, you should have to force your way in, not just have the job handed to you, unless the team's in rebuilding mode. I don't think Anderson is that level. Maybe Young will be in '07.

Also, if I recall correctly the Yanks didn't just hand Cano the job - he had to earn it midseason after the vets they signed didn't pan out.

Nice one. I can't imagine Kenny will go into this season with nothing but rookies as centerfield options. Meanwhile, I am worried about a DH backup in the event Thome goes down. If he does, then our offense is far worse off than it was last year, when at least we had Everett--our second biggest offensive producer. That is why it is so important to sign Mueller.

salty99
12-05-2005, 07:59 PM
I just talked with Anderson at an autograph signing and he said he wants to play center since he is a natural center fielder, but that Podsednik has seniority.

ChiSoxLifer
12-12-2005, 06:53 PM
Well, beat the drum and hold the phone
the sun came out today!
We're born again, there's new grass on the field.
A-roundin' third and headed for home,
it's a brown-eyed handsome man
Anyone can understand the way I feel.

Oh, put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today!
Put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today;
Look at me, I can be Centerfield.

Well, I spent some time in the Mudville Nine,
watchin' it from the bench.
You know I took some lumps when the Mighty "Case" struck out.
So, say Hey Willie, Tell Ty Cobb and Joe DiMaggio;
Don't say "It ain't so", you know the time is now.

Oh, put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today!
Put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today;
Look at me, I can be Centerfield.

Yeah! I got it! I got it!!

Got a beat-up glove, and a homemade bat,
and a brand new pair of shoes;
You know I think it's time to give this game a ride.
Just to hit the ball and touch 'em all ~
a moment in the sun: {POP!}
It's gone and you can tell that one good-bye!

Oh, put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today!
Put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today;
Look at me, I can be Centerfield.

Oh, put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today!
Put me in, Coach ~ I'm ready to play today;
Look at me, I can be Centerfield.