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View Full Version : Was Ozzie cut by the Sox


32nd&Wallace
11-06-2005, 12:08 PM
Anyone know the circumstances in which Ozzie left the Sox AS A PLAYER. Was he cut during spring training of '98 or in the offseason of 97. Also, was Manuel the one who cut him or was it Schuler?

WestSox
11-06-2005, 12:12 PM
I think he left as an unrestricted free agent after the '97 season. IIRC, he wasn't happy about it, either.

Taliesinrk
11-06-2005, 12:25 PM
IIRC he left (as a FA) and definately wasn't happy at all.. I remember him saying something along the lines of the fact that he wanted out and he knew that Robin wasn't happy either.

EDIT: This is why I was somewhat surprised to see him come back to manage here... perhaps his problem was with Ron and not Jerry (that's more of a question than anything)

WestSox
11-06-2005, 12:32 PM
IIRC he left (as a FA) and definately wasn't happy at all.. I remember him saying something along the lines of the fact that he wanted out and he knew that Robin wasn't happy either.

EDIT: This is why I was somewhat surprised to see him come back to manage here... perhaps his problem was with Ron and not Jerry (that's more of a question than anything)

Or perhaps he was just frustrated because he knew he was in the twilight of his career at that point. I wouldn't read too closely into Ozzie's anger at the Sox front office because of that. He says whatever the hell's on his mind. We've all been angry at our bosses at one point or another, but most of us don't hold long-term grudges.

DumpJerry
11-06-2005, 01:18 PM
Come on, Schuler made nothing but ingenious moves while he was GM. After all, he was about 10 years ahead of everyone else when he proclaimed Roger Clemens was all washed up and signed the untouchable Jaime Navarro instead.

DickAllen72
11-06-2005, 01:22 PM
IIRC he left (as a FA) and definately wasn't happy at all.. I remember him saying something along the lines of the fact that he wanted out and he knew that Robin wasn't happy either.

EDIT: This is why I was somewhat surprised to see him come back to manage here... perhaps his problem was with Ron and not Jerry (that's more of a question than anything)
No, Ozzie didn't "want out." He wanted to stay so badly he begged the Sox to cut his salary just to let him stay.

After he was released he was bitter and made comments about how he feels sorry for Ventura, the organization doesn't want to win, etc. But he made those statements because he was cut even though he begged them to keep him, not because he didn't want to remain a part of the White Sox.

kevin57
11-06-2005, 01:33 PM
Ozzie's mouth is (in)famous. He loves the Sox but has also said many things that are pure emotion. I've learned to chuckle at most of this stuff.

LuvSox
11-06-2005, 01:42 PM
I thought he was pissed at Bevington, like Karkovice was.

TomBradley72
11-06-2005, 02:01 PM
Or perhaps he was just frustrated because he knew he was in the twilight of his career at that point. I wouldn't read too closely into Ozzie's anger at the Sox front office because of that. He says whatever the hell's on his mind. We've all been angry at our bosses at one point or another, but most of us don't hold long-term grudges.

I agree....I think he was "realizing" the end was near....and lashing out in frustration...my guess is that once he learned the rest of MLB felt the same way (ie. never a full time SS again)...he stopped blaming the WSox.

Deadguy
11-06-2005, 02:26 PM
It was pretty similar to the situation that the Sox have with Frank right now. Although Ozzie handled the situation very differently than Frank has.

They had a 4 million dollar option with Guillen for the 1998 season. Throughout September of 1997, Ozzie, in typical Ozzie fashion, pretty much declared that if the Sox did not give him that 4 million dollars, he would retire.

The Sox were clearly not going to give him that money, since his range and mobility as a SS had seriously declined, and of course he was almost always the worst hitter in baseball. The Sox were open to offering less money, but with the White Flag trade, they did have a fall back in Caruso, which helped their bargaining power. Ozzie, however, did not want to return for anything less than the 4 million dollars.

Of course, on the free agent market, there was little to no interest. He didn't retire, and signed with Baltimore for 500,000, and was essentially a role player for them.

I think there is some validity to the fact that Ozzie and Bevington did not get along, and that might have contributed to OG's actions in September of 1997. Bevington had really embarassed Ozzie by yelling at him in front of the entire team for regularly bringing his kids in to the clubhouse.

DSpivack
11-06-2005, 02:45 PM
Of course, on the free agent market, there was little to no interest. He didn't retire, and signed with Baltimore for 500,000, and was essentially a role player for them.

looked up quickly online:

October 31, 1997: Granted Free Agency.


January 29, 1998: Signed as a Free Agent with the Baltimore Orioles (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BAL/1998.shtml).

May 1, 1998: Released by the Baltimore Orioles (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/BAL/1998.shtml).

May 6, 1998: Signed as a Free Agent with the Atlanta Braves (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/ATL/1998.shtml).

November 2, 1998: Granted Free Agency.

December 2, 1998: Signed as a Free Agent with the Atlanta Braves (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/ATL/1998.shtml).

April 5, 2000: Released by the Atlanta Braves (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/ATL/2000.shtml).

April 5, 2000: Signed as a Free Agent with the Tampa Bay Devil Rays (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/TBD/2000.shtml).

November 9, 2000: Granted Free Agency.
December 6, 2000: Signed as a Free Agent with the Tampa Bay Devil Rays (http://www.baseball-reference.com/teams/TBD/2000.shtml).

Brian26
11-06-2005, 07:43 PM
The Sox were open to offering less money, but with the White Flag trade, they did have a fall back in Caruso, which helped their bargaining power. Ozzie, however, did not want to return for anything less than the 4 million dollars.

At that point in time, the Sox were painted into a corner. They almost had to give the starting job to Caruso in '98 to help justify the trade and hopefully ease some of the negative public sentiment that was starting to build, but Ozzie made it clear that he didn't want to step aside and act as a mentor for Caruso and some of the younger guys on the team as a veteran bench player (I equate that role to what Sandy Alomar did with the Sox in '03 and '04 and w/ Texas this year). It was really a dark time to be a Sox fan. Everyone knew that major rebuilding was going to happen, and Ventura and Belle were sure bets to be gone after '98.

Dolly
11-06-2005, 08:00 PM
Or perhaps he was just frustrated because he knew he was in the twilight of his career at that point. I wouldn't read too closely into Ozzie's anger at the Sox front office because of that. He says whatever the hell's on his mind. We've all been angry at our bosses at one point or another, but most of us don't hold long-term grudges.


I seem to remember hearing him in an interview when he was with the Marlins, and he brought up the Sox, referrring to them as "we." That would indicate to me that he loves this team, and always has.

BeefyD
11-06-2005, 08:28 PM
Ozzie's mouth is (in)famous. He loves the Sox but has also said many things that are pure emotion. I've learned to chuckle at most of this stuff.

Yeah, if I recall correctly, this was the same guy in '94 who said that they don't need the fans (angered by the strike).

I can care less what ballplayers say. That doesn't affect my life any. Unless Paul Konerko calls me out by name. :D:

Lip Man 1
11-06-2005, 08:45 PM
Beefy D:

You need to learn your Sox history before making these type comments. Ozzie's remark about the fans came when he was interviewed after the Sox played in Toronto. Ozzie claimed (a claim backed by other Sox players) that Frank Thomas was subjected to racial remarks by the Blue Jay fans. His remark was based on those fans and their comments.

Dan Helpinstein discusses this incident in one of his excellent books on the Sox.

Lip

BeefyD
11-06-2005, 09:52 PM
Then I guess I recalled incorrectly. Again, what they say or have said really doesn't affect my life whatsoever. Don't get me wrong, I'm a total Ozzie fan.
But facts are facts. Wasn't just a racial incident in Toronto with Frank, it was a LOT of fans booing at players for being 'greedy'.

Actually, the correct quote, regarding fans booing players after the 1994 strike was:
"We're human beings," he has said. "And I don't think people have the right to act with players the way they've been acting. Right now fans are acting like we owe them something. We don't owe anybody anything."

But [Ozzie] Guillen isn't entirely wrong. The players owe the fans nothing except, as he said, "an honest effort."

Link to the Cubune archive:
http://pqasb.pqarchiver.com/chicagotribune/access/20589020.html?dids=20589020:20589020&FMT=ABS&FMTS=ABS:FT&type=current&date=May+12%2C+1995&author=Mike+Royko.&pub=Chicago+Tribune+(pre-1997+Fulltext)&desc=GUILLEN+STRIKES+OUT%2C+BUT+FANS+WILL+BE+FANS

and another quote from May 17, 1995:
"They can say whatever they want, but enough is enough," Guillen said. "If you go to the ballpark and they boo you because you miss a ball or because you don't hustle or because you stink, that's different. But when they boo you and call you names and call you greedy or something, they don't know what's going on."