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View Full Version : PK gives the Ball to Reinsdorf


twinsuck1
10-28-2005, 05:50 AM
Hey! Who has the final out ball that Uribe threw to Konerko?????

KnightSox
10-28-2005, 09:05 AM
Konerko has it.

WhiteSox05Champs
10-28-2005, 10:00 AM
http://a1259.g.akamai.net/f/1259/5586/5d/images.art.com/images/-/Doug-Mientkiewicz-Celebrating---2004-World-Series--C10202517.jpeg

"I have it and you're not getting it back"

Mickster
10-28-2005, 10:27 AM
Konerko has it.

.......and AJ snatched it from him during the celebration when he got a call Doug Mientkiewicz.

But Seriously......LINK (http://sports.yahoo.com/mlb/news?slug=ap-worldseries-notebook&prov=ap&type=lgns)

:dunno:

Vernam
10-28-2005, 10:34 AM
Maybe Paulie will trade it as ransom to the guy who's Bogarting the grand slam ball. :cool:

Vernam

SouthsideFathead
10-28-2005, 10:39 AM
Maybe Paulie will trade it as ransom to the guy who's Bogarting the grand slam ball. :cool:

Vernam

Last out ball > grand slam ball....much greater...i think he will give back to the sox if they manage to resign him

Madvora
10-28-2005, 10:40 AM
Seems like there are two profitable career paths out there.


1. Left handed pitcher - no matter how good you are, you'll have a job

2. Firstbaseman on a championship team - good chance you'll have the ball last. That's a big money maker.

SouthsideFathead
10-28-2005, 10:44 AM
i can't even imagine how rich a fan would be if they caught a walk off homerun to win the series.

i wonder what an opposing player would do if there was a walk off base hit to win the series?

downstairs
10-28-2005, 02:44 PM
Well... now we know....

Cooter
10-28-2005, 02:45 PM
Unfargenbelieveable.

I may faint.

1000ml
10-28-2005, 02:45 PM
Pure Class


The whole organization.

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 02:46 PM
Well... now we know....Sweet Jesus. You're telling me after a speech like that by Konerko they're not gonna re-sign him? This has been incredible today...

Rocky Soprano
10-28-2005, 02:46 PM
I have dissed PK many times, NEVER AGAIN!

That brought tears to my eyes. And how about PK saying that they will have to just win it again next year. I was waiting for him to announce that he was staying!

This one is for you PK. :gulp:

Palehose13
10-28-2005, 02:47 PM
Class.

Madvora
10-28-2005, 02:47 PM
I was waiting for him to announce that he was staying!

This one is for you PK. :gulp:
That's what I thought he was going to say.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 02:47 PM
Unfargenbelieveable.

I may faint.I'm not the least bit surprised. These guys were schooled by Ozzie in the right way to do things. You put the team ahead of your own personal gain. This is a result. Winning the World Series is another.:smile:

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 02:47 PM
I have dissed PK many times, NEVER AGAIN!

That brought tears to my eyes. And how about PK saying that they will have to just win it again next year. I was waiting for him to announce that he was staying!

This one is for you PK. :gulp:Yeah, I definately thought he was going to announce that. If only it were that easy...

But after that incredible speech, I don't know how they don't re-sign him. This guy is the most popular player of a WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM - I don't see him leaving. Just a hunch.

SoxFanTillDeath
10-28-2005, 02:49 PM
That was absolute class by Paulie...Unbelievable. I can't even put it to words, and that's not something that happens to me often.

Wow.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 02:50 PM
Yeah, I definately thought he was going to announce that. If only it were that easy...

But after that incredible speech, I don't know how they don't re-sign him. This guy is the most popular player of a WORLD CHAMPIONSHIP TEAM - I don't see him leaving. Just a hunch.I don't think there's any question it will take a home town discount to re-sign him. KW is not going to match what other teams are going to be bidding. PK seems like the type to do that, but you never know. We thought the same thing about Ordonez.

Cooter
10-28-2005, 02:50 PM
Now I know why he wouldn't talk to anyone while boarding the bus.

I thought he was just pissed off.




I was incredibly wrong.

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 02:52 PM
I don't think there's any question it will take a home town discount to re-sign him. KW is not going to match what other teams are going to be bidding. PK seems like the type to do that, but you never know. We thought the same thing about Ordonez.True, but Magglio didn't have 1/10th of the relationship that PK has with these fans, and don't think management doesn't notice.

Lets hope PK gets really caught up in the moment and can't help but give JR and the Sox a nice hometown discount to stay...

1951Campbell
10-28-2005, 02:53 PM
Unfargenbelieveable.

I may faint.

Hopefully, it's not a going-away gift.

Uncle_Patrick
10-28-2005, 02:54 PM
Very classy.

On another topic, I don't think its a matter of the Sox trying to re-sign PK. Its a matter of them being able to compete with the other teams who want him. I hear that the Yankees, Angels, and Red Sox are all interested and they've all got deep pockets. The Yankees, I'm sure, will be willing to overspend to get him.

mcfish
10-28-2005, 02:59 PM
That was so awesome. Just seeing how incredibly happy Jerry Reinsdorf was a wonderful feeling. You could see just so much happiness in his face. Thank you Paul Konerko - for doing such a great thing and not pulling a Doug Meinkevich.

I'm happy we have Jerry Reinsdorf. He's put up with a lot of crap over the years from Sox fans (myself included), but he's always had the best of intentions. This one is for him!

Palehose13
10-28-2005, 03:03 PM
PK handing the ball the JR just may have sealed it. JR was so emotional and PK could have kept that ball. IMO, PK just ensured that JR will give him what he wants.

Iwritecode
10-28-2005, 03:06 PM
PK handing the ball the JR just may have sealed it. JR was so emotional and PK could have kept that ball. IMO, PK just ensured that JR will give him what he wants.

I'm almost thinking that JR is going to give him a blank check and say "fill in the amount and tell me the number of years".

Palehose13
10-28-2005, 03:10 PM
I'm almost thinking that JR is going to give him a blank check and say "fill in the amount and tell me the number of years".

Yeah. Seriously...Reinsdorf seems like a sentimental and emotional guy. Konerko could have been a huge jerk and held on to the ball for the highest bidder, etc. Reinsdorf got all choked up and emotional, i meant so much to him, I can't see him getting outbid by anyone for Paul.

nccwsfan
10-28-2005, 03:12 PM
PK handing the ball the JR just may have sealed it. JR was so emotional and PK could have kept that ball. IMO, PK just ensured that JR will give him what he wants.

Exactly what I was thinking as that happened. No matter what happens Pauly, you're a White Sox hero!

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 03:13 PM
Yeah. Seriously...Reinsdorf seems like a sentimental and emotional guy. Konerko could have been a huge jerk and held on to the ball for the highest bidder, etc. Reinsdorf got all choked up and emotional, i meant so much to him, I can't see him getting outbid by anyone for Paul.If that's the case, I know it sounds naive, but I hope Paul does the right thing and doesn't take advantage of the situation by getting them to pay him $15+ million a year, cause it'll obviously hurt the team as a whole...

Madvora
10-28-2005, 03:14 PM
Wouldn't it be nice to see two first baseman retire as long time White Sox?
We got the World Series, now lets have both of these guys finish out their careers with us.

SouthSide_HitMen
10-28-2005, 03:15 PM
Yeah. Seriously...Reinsdorf seems like a sentimental and emotional guy. Konerko could have been a huge jerk and held on to the ball for the highest bidder, etc. Reinsdorf got all choked up and emotional, i meant so much to him, I can't see him getting outbid by anyone for Paul.


http://images.art.com/images/products/shdws/regular/10202000/10202517.jpg

"You mean like me?"

SoxFan76
10-28-2005, 03:16 PM
Unbelievable. I had tears in my eyes when Paul handed that ball over.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I love this team.

Palehose13
10-28-2005, 03:20 PM
http://images.art.com/images/products/shdws/regular/10202000/10202517.jpg

"You mean like me?"

That is absolutely who I was writing about.

Unbelievable. I had tears in my eyes when Paul handed that ball over.

I've said it before, and I'll say it again. I love this team.

Tears? I was absolutely balling. :whiner:

nccwsfan
10-28-2005, 03:24 PM
Unbelievable moment. Pure class by PK!

Chrisaway
10-28-2005, 03:24 PM
"Id give my left nut for this team"-PK circa 2003


Guess he kept his word (sorta).:redneck

SouthSide_HitMen
10-28-2005, 03:27 PM
Tears? I was absolutely balling. :whiner:

No crying in baseball. - Almost though. I felt great for Jerry Reinsdorf today and I bet Paul feels good about himself as well.

I hope both can sit down in a few weeks and come to some agreement for a long term deal but if not I am grateful for Paul's time in Chicago and hope Jermaine Dye (rumored first base replacement if necessary) is giving Jerry a ball next season.

SOXPHILE
10-28-2005, 03:28 PM
Tommorow's Trbune Headline: "Defiant move by classless Sox 1st baseman: Konerko throws ball at Reinsdorf. Free agent 1st piece to go in already crumbling team."

nlentz88
10-28-2005, 03:31 PM
I like the symbolism of this exchange. PK talks about winning one more championship with the Sox and then hands the ball to Jerry. With this gesture, could PK have been saying, "The ball is in your hands now, Jerry. I'm willing to come back, but it's up to you to bring me back for a shot at another championship."

Iguana775
10-28-2005, 03:33 PM
Good. I was thinking that he should give it to Jerry.

Dolly
10-28-2005, 03:42 PM
I don't think there's any question it will take a home town discount to re-sign him. KW is not going to match what other teams are going to be bidding. PK seems like the type to do that, but you never know. We thought the same thing about Ordonez.

True, but maybe if Ordonez had a World Series ring he would have stayed. Maybe I'm just naive, but I think Paulie's better than that. And giving that ball to Jerry is proof.

DAllen15
10-28-2005, 03:46 PM
I don't think there's any question it will take a home town discount to re-sign him. KW is not going to match what other teams are going to be bidding. PK seems like the type to do that, but you never know. We thought the same thing about Ordonez.

Don't you think with the profits from this years post season along with a potential attendance of 3million plus next year that they could pay 13-15 million for him and still have surplus in what should be an expanded budget in '06?

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 04:00 PM
Don't you think with the profits from this years post season along with a potential attendance of 3million plus next year that they could pay 13-15 million for him and still have surplus in what should be an expanded budget in '06?I think 3M+ next year is pushing it. One thing in their favor is that they don't have a lot of other holes that they need to spend big $$$ to fill. But Garland and AJ are going to get big raises, plus most other players have increases in their contract for next year. IMO, $13-15M is a bit high.

TomBradley72
10-28-2005, 04:08 PM
Money saved by not picking up Frank's option + increased revenue from '05 + increased revenue in '06 from expanded fan base + PK's value to the team and to the fans = Resigning Paul Konerko to a 5 year deal at his market value (no need to beg or ask for a "home team discount").

Book it.

WSoxFanForever
10-28-2005, 04:13 PM
I had tears in my eyes for most of the rally, but that just about did me in. And when Paul said, "We'll just have to do this again" it made me think that maybe he's not so anxious to leave Chicago. He's going to be rich no matter where he signs. I wonder if his pep talk to Chicago was a sign that he really wants to stay. Maybe JR can compromise with him.

Flight #24
10-28-2005, 04:18 PM
Without completely rehashing the #s, if Garland gets $7M/yr, AJ gets $5M/yr, Konerko gets $13M/yr & Crede gets $3M/yr then the releases of Frank/Carl/ Timo/Shingo will require a payroll will get it done with a payroll bum of approx $10-13M.

Trib had playoff revenues at $13-18M, and attendance was up 400k and should be up by around that next year (assuming resigning Konerko and no 2000-2001 like falloff in performance).

That makes the payroll bump fairly feasible, IMO. in fact, $15M/yr wouldn't be out of reach from a budget perspective. But we shall see.

kevin57
10-28-2005, 04:23 PM
Paulie did a first-class PR move in giving that ball to the Chairman. I don't mean to imply that it was done for cynical, self-serving reasons. It was--consciously or unconsciously, a brilliant way to soften up the Old Man.

I do think that Paul will give the Sox a Hometown Discount. I would hope that that means the Sox would not have to exceed $15 M/year for more than 5 years. Besides the $$$, it would behoove Konerko to remember how the press and fans can be in those ESPN market cities, so to say.

nccwsfan
10-28-2005, 04:26 PM
But Garland and AJ are going to get big raises, plus most other players have increases in their contract for next year.

Joe Crede is also arbitration eligible, plus you're looking at (hopefully) resigning Everett and/or Big Hurt to a new deal.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 04:28 PM
Without completely rehashing the #s, if Garland gets $7M/yr, AJ gets $5M/yr, Konerko gets $13M/yr & Crede gets $3M/yr then the releases of Frank/Carl/ Timo/Shingo will require a payroll will get it done with a payroll bum of approx $10-13M.

Trib had playoff revenues at $13-18M, and attendance was up 400k and should be up by around that next year (assuming resigning Konerko and no 2000-2001 like falloff in performance).

That makes the payroll bump fairly feasible, IMO. in fact, $15M/yr wouldn't be out of reach from a budget perspective. But we shall see.They've also raised ticket prices 11% for next year which should bring in another $4-5M. But you've still got to replace Carl and Timo, and they need another lefty in the BP instead of Marte. Other players are due raises. Playoff revenues are nice, but they're not guaranteed for next year. There's still a lot of uncertainty in the numbers.

Sxy Mofo
10-28-2005, 04:33 PM
I heard a lot of the interviews on whitesox.com (the paulie one got to me)... does anyone have a link to the guys singing believin?

gf2020
10-28-2005, 04:37 PM
they need another lefty in the BP instead of Marte.
Why? Who is better on the market? Eyre? Watch someone completely go out and overspend for him. In fact, every half decent relief pitcher in the market will make great coin with this weak class. Marte had a down year, but how many teams have the luxury of even an average second lefthander in the pen? Unless there is a clear cut improvement at a reasonable price, I am more than confident with Marte backing up Cotts next year. And imagine how sick we will be next year if he can return to form, which isn't really out of the realm of possibility given the flashes he showed in game three and in the Cleveland series at the end of the regular season. Ozzie and the team forgave him and still had his back even what happened in Boston. There is no reason he shouldn't return.

Enough of that talk though. Beautiful speech by Paulie.

Flight #24
10-28-2005, 04:46 PM
They've also raised ticket prices 11% for next year which should bring in another $4-5M. But you've still got to replace Carl and Timo, and they need another lefty in the BP instead of Marte. Other players are due raises. Playoff revenues are nice, but they're not guaranteed for next year. There's still a lot of uncertainty in the numbers.

There's Anderson who's supposedly "ready". And I'd bet you can find a DH somewhere (plus, in terms of a choice - replacing Carl is a lot easier than replacing Konerko).

If you factor in an attendance boost of say 300k next year, that would be 700k total from 2004. At $20/head, which is conservative for concessions, parking, ticket revenue, you're at $14M right there. Use even a couple of mil from the playoff revenues and you have no problem finding another DH and a reliever.

ssviland
10-28-2005, 04:47 PM
As a forever Reinsdorf defender, I want to say: "Take that, Reinsdorf haters!" No, I didn't like that the '94 season ended. No, I didn't like his comments after the "White Flag trade," although I liked the trade.

But... As a kid in the 70s I was a fan of the Sox AND Cubs. I wore hats for both team. I would come home from school and turn on WGN in the Spring and Fall, then, after dinner, flip on WMAQ to listen to the greatest broadcast team ever, Caray and Piersall. My family was split, but each year I grew to be more and more a Sox fan. 1977 was exciting for both teams. As the decade came to a close and I was becoming more aware of the politics of baseball, it didn't seem as if either team was committed to winning. The Cubs made so many boneheaded moves I had become a Sox fan by 1980.

Then JR bought the team. We brought in players like Fisk (who was one of my favorites already), LeFlore, Floyd Bannister and Luzinski. We had young players like Baines, Lemon, Britt Burns and Greg Walker. The Cubs had Ken Reitz and brought back Ken Holtzman. Buckner was jetizoned in favor of Leon Durham. Nice move. Go Sox!

After Reinsdorf and Einhorn bought the team sports in Chicago changed forever! We were a joke in the 70s. We were about cheering for individual players like Banks, Minoso, Dick Allen, Kingman, Payton, Van Lier, etc. The Sox were for real in the 80s. They have been contenders, however remote, nearly every season since, while the Cubs didn't have back-to-back winning seasons for 30 years!

The Sox even outdrew the Cubs many seasons up until the strike in 1994, despite the advantage of the Cubs broadcasting their games on the WGN Superstation and being owned by the Trib. They were a better team, and were recognized for trying to win.

It took a season like this for many Sox fans to forgive JR for 1994. Although many of us have continued coming to the park (perhaps the same who will still watch the Blackhawks,) we hadn't topped 2M fans since 1993 and the nation has percieved Chicago as being a Cubs town. I have friends who have been Cubs fans for 50 or 60 years who tell about how much Chicago was dominated by the Sox in the 50s and 60s while the Sox were a dominant team, only to be beaten back by an even more dominant Yankees team year after year, but still the team dominating Chicago. Then again, in the 80s and early 90s, the Sox led Chicago in attendance 6 times from 1981 through 1992, and were only slightly under the Cubs in 93 and 94.

Reinsdorf has time and again proven he will do just about anything to try to win. He went after Arod. He signed Belle and Colon. One thing he has not done is sign a bunch of over-rated players and finish below .500 like the Mets and Dodgers have often done. Yes, we have so often in the past 55 seasons been JUST good enough to finish second or third, but at least we usually have a winning record, including the third longest consecutive winning seasons from 1951 through 1967. How many winning seasons for the Sox and Cubs since 1951? Sox: 34-19 (& two years at .500); Cubs: 15-38 (& two years at .500). The Cubs had no winning seasons in 16 years from 1947 thru 1962, and again from 1973 throuigh 1983, although they finished .500 in 1952 and 1977. Only from 1967-72 and in 2003 & 2004 have the Cubs had consecutive winning seasons since 1947!

So, finally Reinsdorf gets his Trophy and the respect due him. He has made some mistakes (SoxVision and Ken Harrelson as GM at the top,) but he has never veered away from the goal to bring a winner to Chicago. (Oh year, remember 6 NBA Championships? And several millionaire players who stabbed JR in the back?)

Thanks, JR.

kevin57
10-28-2005, 04:51 PM
As a forever Reinsdorf defender, I want to say: "Take that, Reinsdorf haters!" No, I didn't like that the '94 season ended. No, I didn't like his comments after the "White Flag trade," although I liked the trade.

But... As a kid in the 70s I was a fan of the Sox AND Cubs. I wore hats for both team. I would come home from school and turn on WGN in the Spring and Fall, then, after dinner, flip on WMAQ to listen to the greatest broadcast team ever, Caray and Piersall. My family was split, but each year I grew to be more and more a Sox fan. 1977 was exciting for both teams. As the decade came to a close and I was becoming more aware of the politics of baseball, it didn't seem as if either team was committed to winning. The Cubs made so many boneheaded moves I had become a Sox fan by 1980.

Then JR bought the team. We brought in players like Fisk (who was one of my favorites already), LeFlore, Floyd Bannister and Luzinski. We had young players like Baines, Lemon, Britt Burns and Greg Walker. The Cubs had Ken Reitz and brought back Ken Holtzman. Buckner was jetizoned in favor of Leon Durham. Nice move. Go Sox!

After Reinsdorf and Einhorn bought the team sports in Chicago changed forever! We were a joke in the 70s. We were about cheering for individual players like Banks, Minoso, Dick Allen, Kingman, Payton, Van Lier, etc. The Sox were for real in the 80s. They have been contenders, however remote, nearly every season since, while the Cubs didn't have back-to-back winning seasons for 30 years!

The Sox even outdrew the Cubs many seasons up until the strike in 1994, despite the advantage of the Cubs broadcasting their games on the WGN Superstation and being owned by the Trib. They were a better team, and were recognized for trying to win.

It took a season like this for many Sox fans to forgive JR for 1994. Although many of us have continued coming to the park (perhaps the same who will still watch the Blackhawks,) we hadn't topped 2M fans since 1993 and the nation has percieved Chicago as being a Cubs town. I have friends who have been Cubs fans for 50 or 60 years who tell about how much Chicago was dominated by the Sox in the 50s and 60s while the Sox were a dominant team, only to be beaten back by an even more dominant Yankees team year after year, but still the team dominating Chicago. Then again, in the 80s and early 90s, the Sox led Chicago in attendance 6 times from 1981 through 1992, and were only slightly under the Cubs in 93 and 94.

Reinsdorf has time and again proven he will do just about anything to try to win. He went after Arod. He signed Belle and Colon. One thing he has not done is sign a bunch of over-rated players and finish below .500 like the Mets and Dodgers have often done. Yes, we have so often in the past 55 seasons been JUST good enough to finish second or third, but at least we usually have a winning record, including the third longest consecutive winning seasons from 1951 through 1967. How many winning seasons for the Sox and Cubs since 1951? Sox: 34-19 (& two years at .500); Cubs: 15-38 (& two years at .500). The Cubs had no winning seasons in 16 years from 1947 thru 1962, and again from 1973 throuigh 1983, although they finished .500 in 1952 and 1977. Only from 1967-72 and in 2003 & 2004 have the Cubs had consecutive winning seasons since 1947!

So, finally Reinsdorf gets his Trophy and the respect due him. He has made some mistakes (SoxVision and Ken Harrelson as GM at the top,) but he has never veered away from the goal to bring a winner to Chicago. (Oh year, remember 6 NBA Championships? And several millionaire players who stabbed JR in the back?)

Thanks, JR.

Thanks for giving props to JR. I too was embittered about the '94 season, but I didn't blame JR exclusively for that. It was greed and stupidity on the part of both owners and the players union.

hose
10-28-2005, 04:54 PM
Ozzie and Kenny have let their true feelings about Jerry be known , now Paulie.

wow just wow !!!


SOX PRIDE

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 05:03 PM
There's Anderson who's supposedly "ready". And I'd bet you can find a DH somewhere (plus, in terms of a choice - replacing Carl is a lot easier than replacing Konerko).

If you factor in an attendance boost of say 300k next year, that would be 700k total from 2004. At $20/head, which is conservative for concessions, parking, ticket revenue, you're at $14M right there. Use even a couple of mil from the playoff revenues and you have no problem finding another DH and a reliever.The ticket price increase alone will be enough to pay a sizable increase for PK. Season ticket prices are up 11% for 2006. If the average ticket is $20, that's an extra $2 each times 2.5M+ people. It depends on what else KW has planned. But given JR's history, I don't think another million or two one way or the other will be an issue. And if they can defer some, that makes it more affordable. I'd give it a better than even chance we'll see PK at 1B on opening day next year.

ssviland
10-28-2005, 05:04 PM
There's Anderson who's supposedly "ready". And I'd bet you can find a DH somewhere (plus, in terms of a choice - replacing Carl is a lot easier than replacing Konerko).

If you factor in an attendance boost of say 300k next year, that would be 700k total from 2004. At $20/head, which is conservative for concessions, parking, ticket revenue, you're at $14M right there. Use even a couple of mil from the playoff revenues and you have no problem finding another DH and a reliever.

We aren't going to find a DH or replacement for PK for anything Williams is willing to spend. I hope we can bring Paulie back, but a team like the Angels or Yankees will probably pay a lot more than he's worth, and more than the Sox are willing to spend. Durazo may be out there, but the slim market this year drives his price tag up too much as well.

The only option is to trade for a bat. How does that work? Who will give up a hitter the caliiber of Konerko?

The most likely scenario is that Dye goes to first and Brian Anderson to RF. That leaves us without a true cleanup hitter, and without a true #3 hitter.

Konerko's song in the World Series Players' list on iTunes is "Walk On" by U2. His dad said they blew it by not signing him before 2005, and he will take the best offer. The Sox will offer a fair deal, maybe even a deal that is more than Konerko's worth because of his value to the team chemistry and to the marketability of the Sox, but the Angels or Yankees will offer more. PK will get something like $17M, and the Sox top offer will probably be around $14M. PK will take the best offer and our pitchers will have a lot of no decisions next season.

Flight #24
10-28-2005, 05:08 PM
PK will get something like $17M, and the Sox top offer will probably be around $14M. PK will take the best offer and our pitchers will have a lot of no decisions next season.

Carlols Beltran got $17M (with a lot of deferrals) last year, after a postseason run that bettered Konerko's. He was a younger, good hitting, good defending player at a far tougher position to find stars at. I don't think Konerko gets a Beltran deal from anyone. Plus, the only 2 teams that would make that kind of offer (BOS, NYY) have far greater needs (pitching, CF).

IMO he'll get offered $12M by the Sox on a 5-year deal, the market will bear $14/5, and they'll settle somewhere in the middle.

DAllen15
10-28-2005, 05:10 PM
We aren't going to find a DH or replacement for PK for anything Williams is willing to spend. I hope we can bring Paulie back, but a team like the Angels or Yankees will probably pay a lot more than he's worth, and more than the Sox are willing to spend. Durazo may be out there, but the slim market this year drives his price tag up too much as well.

The only option is to trade for a bat. How does that work? Who will give up a hitter the caliiber of Konerko?

The most likely scenario is that Dye goes to first and Brian Anderson to RF. That leaves us without a true cleanup hitter, and without a true #3 hitter.

Konerko's song in the World Series Players' list on iTunes is "Walk On" by U2. His dad said they blew it by not signing him before 2005, and he will take the best offer. The Sox will offer a fair deal, maybe even a deal that is more than Konerko's worth because of his value to the team chemistry and to the marketability of the Sox, but the Angels or Yankees will offer more. PK will get something like $17M, and the Sox top offer will probably be around $14M. PK will take the best offer and our pitchers will have a lot of no decisions next season.

I'm assuming his Dad said that before this years run? If so, I think that statement may be outdated by know in light of the last couple of weeks. I also think as we saw in the free agency markets last year, the teams with the deepest pockets are cooling off on overpaying to grab a star. I think PK's market value is at an all time high right now, but I don't think he could command $17m. I think $15m would be the high water mark for him.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 05:11 PM
Carlols Beltran got $17M (with a lot of deferrals) last year, after a postseason run that bettered Konerko's. He was a younger, good hitting, good defending player at a far tougher position to find stars at. I don't think Konerko gets a Beltran deal from anyone. Plus, the only 2 teams that would make that kind of offer (BOS, NYY) have far greater needs (pitching, CF).

IMO he'll get offered $12M by the Sox on a 5-year deal, the market will bear $14/5, and they'll settle somewhere in the middle.That sounds about right to me, too. Could be higher overall if they back-load it somewhat and add deferrals.

Lip Man 1
10-28-2005, 05:12 PM
Flight:

I read today in one of the papers that it's expected the Sox will announce next week a 4 year offer worth 12 million per season. Apparently Konerko wants a five year deal.

We will see what happens.

I'm concerned over that 'extra year' issue since that seems to have been the major stumbling block in the past with Sox free agents. They usually don't seem to be able to overcome that.

Lip

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 05:13 PM
PK will get something like $17M, and the Sox top offer will probably be around $14M. PK will take the best offer and our pitchers will have a lot of no decisions next season.
If some team is stupid enough to offer Paul Konerko $17 million/year, then so be it. After having him on the Sox for years now, most of us know he's just not the type of player that deserves ELITE money, and some team is going to be VERY unhappy with that contract once the season starts. Personally, I don't see that happening. As great as Paul was for us, there were definately times this season where no one was looking forward to him coming up, cause it just meant a pop-up or double play.

That being said, I hope PK gets nostalgic, signs for a reasonable but fair contract with the Sox, and helps lead us to another Championship.

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 05:14 PM
I'm assuming his Dad said that before this years run? If so, I think that statement may be outdated by know in light of the last couple of weeks...Nope. He actually said it about a week ago.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 05:16 PM
Flight:

I read today in one of the papers that it's expected the Sox will announce next week a 4 year offer worth 12 million per season. Apparently Konerko wants a five year deal.

We will see what happens.

I'm concerned over that 'extra year' issue since that seems to have been the major stumbling block in the past with Sox free agents. They usually don't seem to be able to overcome that.

LipThey had a 5-yr offer on the table to Ordonez in 2004 and he was a year older than PK is now.

ChicagoHoosier
10-28-2005, 05:20 PM
The most likely scenario is that Dye goes to first...

I still find it entertaining that everyone thinks of Dye as a 1B when he made one play. I guess he could play if he played there a whole spring training.

Flight #24
10-28-2005, 05:24 PM
Flight:

I read today in one of the papers that it's expected the Sox will announce next week a 4 year offer worth 12 million per season. Apparently Konerko wants a five year deal.

We will see what happens.

I'm concerned over that 'extra year' issue since that seems to have been the major stumbling block in the past with Sox free agents. They usually don't seem to be able to overcome that.

Lip

Well in the past it's primarily been pitchers or fairly old vets (Vizquel). I wouldn't think either would apply here unless they're really worried about his hips.

Plus, I can see JR wanting to give him the "Frank" treatment and keep him here throughout his career if possible.

DAllen15
10-28-2005, 05:33 PM
Nope. He actually said it about a week ago.

I wasn't aware of that. Along with the some other opinions on this thread, I also agree if he leaves for big money then that's better than signing him to an overpriced long term deal that could hamstring us in the future.

Many were upset last year when mags left, I know my brother thought they didn't have a chance when they traded C Lee as well. I even remember one of our tribal elders on this website posted that he was going to ask for JR's resignation at last years Sox Fest because of the last years winter's deal making.

There was a lot of concern that the lineup couldn't get the run production to win in the postseason, especially during the late season "slump". But if Kenny and JR showed us one thing in building this team with the budget they did, is that no one player is irreplaceable, and that you will lose top players to free agency. So if we're going to start a run of winning seasons, they'll have to be prepared for that shuffle. And after this season, they'll have my vote of confidence on the personnel decisions that they make.

Vernam
10-28-2005, 06:30 PM
Nope. He actually said it about a week ago.On Comcast's postgame Wednesday, JR was being interviewed on the field when he called Paulie's dad over. They shook hands and were very cordial, though it was slightly awkward somehow, too. Mr. Konerko didn't look too comfortable being on-camera, though his comments were gracious. He must be a class act to have raised the kind of son he did.

Vernam

JB98
10-28-2005, 06:47 PM
Flight:

I read today in one of the papers that it's expected the Sox will announce next week a 4 year offer worth 12 million per season. Apparently Konerko wants a five year deal.

We will see what happens.

I'm concerned over that 'extra year' issue since that seems to have been the major stumbling block in the past with Sox free agents. They usually don't seem to be able to overcome that.

Lip

I have no idea why a fifth year would be a problem. Five years from now, Konerko will be 34. It's reasonable to think he'll still be a productive player then.

I'm mainly worried about the Angels or Yankees coming in and offering him $17 or $18 million a year. He isn't worth that much.

The money issue scares me more than the length of the contract.

Frank the Tank
10-28-2005, 08:18 PM
I think Paulie is looking for a nice paycheck, but I don't think he'll auction himself to the highest bidder like Magglio did. I think if JR puts something respectable on the table, I'm confident PK will be our 1st baseman for some time.

Dolly
10-28-2005, 08:24 PM
On Comcast's postgame Wednesday, JR was being interviewed on the field when he called Paulie's dad over. They shook hands and were very cordial, though it was slightly awkward somehow, too. Mr. Konerko didn't look too comfortable being on-camera, though his comments were gracious. He must be a class act to have raised the kind of son he did.

Vernam

My impression was that the awkwardness was due to Mr. Konerko's being on TV, not expecting it, and being uncomfortable with it. I didn't think it had anything to do with his comments. Jerry's been a businessman for a long time; I'm sure he's used to people saying things like that.

Theanticub
10-28-2005, 08:41 PM
Was I the only one that got teary eyed (besides JR) when Paulie gave him that ball? Did ANYONE else view Paulie's speech as a promising indication of him being signed next year?

"I'm not sure what we will have to do, but maybe come back and win it again next year."

Gave me goosebumps.

SIGN PK.

RallyBowl
10-28-2005, 08:42 PM
I think Paulie is looking for a nice paycheck, but I don't think he'll auction himself to the highest bidder like Magglio did. I think if JR puts something respectable on the table, I'm confident PK will be our 1st baseman for some time.

That sums it all up right there. Paulie isn't a whore. Pro sports, especially Baseball, are full of examples of guys who took the money, then weren't happy and wanted out. Paulie is not that type of person. The classy move he made today proves that. IMO he'll be back, he'll be happy, and we'll be happy. And primed for a minimum 5-Peat.

johnny bench
10-28-2005, 09:52 PM
Flight:

I read today in one of the papers that it's expected the Sox will announce next week a 4 year offer worth 12 million per season. Apparently Konerko wants a five year deal.

We will see what happens.

I'm concerned over that 'extra year' issue since that seems to have been the major stumbling block in the past with Sox free agents. They usually don't seem to be able to overcome that.

Lip

This is exactly the issue that stands in front of a new agreement.

BeviBall!
10-28-2005, 10:12 PM
I like the symbolism of this exchange. PK talks about winning one more championship with the Sox and then hands the ball to Jerry. With this gesture, could PK have been saying, "The ball is in your hands now, Jerry. I'm willing to come back, but it's up to you to bring me back for a shot at another championship."

Looks like we've found Mark Suppelsa's biggest fan.

wdelaney72
10-28-2005, 10:51 PM
I don't think Paulie is going to make Beltran and Vlad money. While Paulie's bat is equal to theirs, he doesn't have a fraction of their speed. The Yankees and Angels may be stupid enough to offer him $15 a year, but not more. I thin he'll stay here for $11-12 million.

Yesterday, Jurko gave a very interesting former player's perspective on this. Not that he's a consistent credible source, but I think he was on the mark this time. He brought up the fact that Paulie has a definite comfort here with the Sox. The ballpark is a good match for his hitting and both sides know what to expect. All of that changes with him going to a new team. It is unlikely that the difference in money will be great enough to make him want to take on that uncertainty.

As far as Ordonez goes, let's not compare Paulie to Magglio until he acts like him... which should hopefully be never.

I used to think Paulie was replaceable, but his playoff performance change that.

Ol' No. 2
10-28-2005, 11:13 PM
Was I the only one that got teary eyed (besides JR) when Paulie gave him that ball? Did ANYONE else view Paulie's speech as a promising indication of him being signed next year?

"I'm not sure what we will have to do, but maybe come back and win it again next year."

Gave me goosebumps.

SIGN PK.I just finished watching the replay of this. Those remarks by PK were not off-the-cuff. They were planned. He was clearly sending a message that he wanted to return. As long as they don't low-ball him, he'll be back next year.

MarySwiss
10-28-2005, 11:18 PM
I just finished watching the replay of this. Those remarks by PK were not off-the-cuff. They were planned. He was clearly sending a message that he wanted to return. As long as they don't low-ball him, he'll be back next year.
Amen!

CJLove23
10-28-2005, 11:29 PM
:walnuts + http://img.photobucket.com/albums/v293/CJLOVE/baseball.jpg + :reinsy = me :whiner:

:thumbsup: Tears of happiness

itsnotrequired
10-28-2005, 11:33 PM
I just finished watching the replay of this. Those remarks by PK were not off-the-cuff. They were planned. He was clearly sending a message that he wanted to return. As long as they don't low-ball him, he'll be back next year.

Man, I hope so.

Throw a respectable offer out there and I say Konerko takes it. Throw an "insult" out there, a Paulie will take his bat and World Series ring to another team.

JB98
10-28-2005, 11:44 PM
That sums it all up right there. Paulie isn't a whore. Pro sports, especially Baseball, are full of examples of guys who took the money, then weren't happy and wanted out. Paulie is not that type of person. The classy move he made today proves that. IMO he'll be back, he'll be happy, and we'll be happy. And primed for a minimum 5-Peat.

I think you're right. I hope you're right.

But I'm keeping my guard up because players have disappointed me before with the "take-the-money-and-run" approach.

Nyls Nyman
10-29-2005, 12:06 AM
This is how I'd structure it:

- 4 years/50M guaranteed
- a player option at the end of year 3 to void year 4
- reasonable performance incentives (stay in the top 5 AL 1B) to add a fifth year at $15M
- tougher incentives (be one of the top 7 hitters in AL) in years 4-5 to add a club option for a sixth year at $20M or a $5M buyout
- a partial no trade clause, can only be traded to teams in 1st or 2nd place in their division from the 6/1-8/31, or to playoff teams from 11/1-3/15.

It's a shame that the MLB union contract does not appear to allow incentives such as "fifth year vests if we make the ALCS again."

Ol' No. 2
10-29-2005, 12:18 AM
This is how I'd structure it:

- 4 years/50M guaranteed
- a player option at the end of year 3 to void year 4
- reasonable performance incentives (stay in the top 5 AL 1B) to add a fifth year at $15M
- tougher incentives (be one of the top 7 hitters in AL) in years 4-5 to add a club option for a sixth year at $20M or a $5M buyout
- a partial no trade clause, can only be traded to teams in 1st or 2nd place in their division from the 6/1-8/31, or to playoff teams from 11/1-3/15.

It's a shame that the MLB union contract does not appear to allow incentives such as "fifth year vests if we make the ALCS again."The incentives you've listed won't pass muster. They don't allow performance incentives except for bonuses for making the All-Star team, MVP and that kind of stuff.

Nyls Nyman
10-29-2005, 12:26 AM
The incentives you've listed won't pass muster. They don't allow performance incentives except for bonuses for making the All-Star team, MVP and that kind of stuff.
But they do allow vesting based on some basic metrics such as plate appearances, innings pitched, etc.

I've never understood why performance measurements are not allowed in MLB. I knew that team-based measurements weren't allowed, but I didn't realize that you can't tell a guy: "you want $15M, then hit .280 with at least 35HR and less than 125 strikeouts."

Ol' No. 2
10-29-2005, 12:36 AM
But they do allow vesting based on some basic metrics such as plate appearances, innings pitched, etc.

I've never understood why performance measurements are not allowed in MLB. I knew that team-based measurements weren't allowed, but I didn't realize that you can't tell a guy: "you want $15M, then hit .280 with at least 35HR and less than 125 strikeouts."I could make a good argument against those types of incentives. Do you really want players swinging for the fences trying to make a bonus for hitting 35 HR?

gobears1987
10-29-2005, 12:42 AM
Having a kid recently may also keep him here. With children now it will be a much harder to move. I think we will keep him after hearing his comments today.

nasox
10-29-2005, 12:47 AM
Having a kid recently may also keep him here. With children now it will be a much harder to move. I think we will keep him after hearing his comments today.

Although I wish it wasn't true, having a week old kid who hasn't entered school, set down roots, etc. isn't hard to move. Just remember to change the diapers!

DaleJRFan
10-29-2005, 01:11 AM
This was unbelievable.. complete class from a guy who has proven he is the centerpiece of the championship team.

...and he's not going anywhere. He's posturing for more $$ with this "free agent" business...

California Sox
10-29-2005, 01:13 AM
I still find it entertaining that everyone thinks of Dye as a 1B when he made one play. I guess he could play if he played there a whole spring training.

Dye is a terrific athlete. I would not put it past him to be able to play third if they really needed it. That said, of course he'd need at least the entire spring training to acclimate.

I want the Sox to get Paulie done, but 14-15 mil is an awful lot for one guy who has never been an MVP-type player. Also, I think the Sox should find a way to bring Frank back. He'd be a welcome sight in the middle of the lineup if his foot heals properly.

HotelWhiteSox
10-29-2005, 02:06 AM
That was so ****ing sweet. Yesterday Sportscenter did a piece wondering where the ball went. They were zooming in on the celebration to try and see if the ball switched hands, and said that Buehrle and Konerko were keeping it hush hush. I was going to post it, and say that Konerko was keeping it as leverage for contract negotiations as a joke.

Totally didn't expect that at the rally. Pure class, especially considering what happened last year with Mientkiewicz. No matter what happens in the future or what has transpired in the past, Konerko is a Sox legend. He really emerged as a leader in 2005, had the great regular season stats, and then an awesome postseason.

Also, nice to see the Jerry recognition. No matter what, one thing that can never be changed is that he's brought 7 championships (and counting) to a town desperate for winners. And let's be realistic, Jerry and the Sox organization care about the fans. From the survey groups and all that, the park renovations show that the Sox listen. They're changing the color of the ****ing seats, they know you put money into this team

cubhater
10-29-2005, 02:14 AM
I don't think there's any question it will take a home town discount to re-sign him. KW is not going to match what other teams are going to be bidding. PK seems like the type to do that, but you never know. We thought the same thing about Ordonez.

Who's Ordonez?:tongue:

Pure class by Paulie!

IlliniSox4Life
10-29-2005, 03:51 AM
Paulie is definately pure class, and I agree with the sentiment that if KW offers him something in the ballpark of what the yankees or bosox are offering, he'll sign here. I think Jerry has shown his loyalties to past players with Ozzie, KW, Baines, etc, and who knows, if Paulie plays here another 5-10 years, he could end up being the new manager after Ozzie retires after his 10th world series title :tongue:

kevin57
10-29-2005, 09:34 AM
Having a kid recently may also keep him here. With children now it will be a much harder to move. I think we will keep him after hearing his comments today.

I understood that PK has his family in AZ, not Chicago.

Vernam
10-29-2005, 09:55 AM
I just finished watching the replay of this. Those remarks by PK were not off-the-cuff. They were planned. He was clearly sending a message that he wanted to return. As long as they don't low-ball him, he'll be back next year.And after Paulie's comment that "we'll just have to do it again next year," Kenny yelled twice to him: "I'm going to hold you to that." My second-favorite moment from the rally, next to PK giving JR the ball.

Vernam

Cooter
10-29-2005, 09:58 AM
I understood that PK has his family in AZ, not Chicago.

...he sure doesn't live here.

Jenks4Pres
10-29-2005, 10:03 AM
Paul Konerko = Class Act

tebman
10-29-2005, 11:00 AM
I heard Levine say yesterday on WMVP that Konerko is not the kind of guy who'd anxiously go looking for endoresement deals (like Damon). His personality is closer to Buehrle's in that he's a lot more comfortable competing on a winning team than he is seeking glory and gold for himself. If he went to NY or Boston or LA, he'd be under enormous pressure to be a media star.

Take it FWIW, since it came from Levine, but that squares with other stories about Konerko I've read before. I agree too with Jurko on WMVP who said that Konerko's line-drive hitting tendencies wouldn't work as well in other ballparks with different configurations, and PK knows that.

Given all that and the obvious emotion of winning the World Series and the genuine affection it appears these guys have for each other, I think the odds are good that he'll stay. KW and JR are clearly not stupid -- they're know what the market is. And JR, I'm certain, will make it clear that PK will be taken care of the rest of his life: whether setting him up in business or working in the organization like KW.

I know anything can happen, but I like the odds of PK staying in Chicago.

greenpeach
10-29-2005, 11:14 AM
I just finished watching the replay of this. Those remarks by PK were not off-the-cuff. They were planned. He was clearly sending a message that he wanted to return. As long as they don't low-ball him, he'll be back next year.

I agree. However, KW took a calculated risk not wrapping up a deal this Spring & Paulie is clearly going to go through the entire process. Can't say that I blame him.

hawkjt
10-29-2005, 02:04 PM
I just hope the sox do not hiss off PK and agent with an initial low-ball offer that does not include a 5th year and does include deferred money.

5 yr, 65 sounds right to me. PK will make 90 million over his last eight years as a sox and will be 34 at the end of that contract.

There is no reason to think he will not be productive for the next five years.

That swing- it is a gift from god.

Caduceus
10-29-2005, 05:12 PM
I'm sure someone has already said this, and I'm sorry if it's a repeat.

But, when I heard the speech and then saw PK gave that ball to Reinsdorf I looked at it two ways. Either: here lets sit down and work this out, or here's my farewell to you, thanks for the great seaon (personally, I hope it's the first one).

Like others have stated, I find it very classy that PK was able to let go of that ball. If I were in his shoes I would have a hard time letting go.