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View Full Version : Clean House (long)


Viva Magglio
07-27-2001, 07:02 PM
I have had it. The 7-spot put up by the Red Sox is only the spark that set me off. I have had it with Ken Williams. I have had it with Jerry Manuel. I have had it with Jerry Reinsdorf.

You know, all of the White Sox co-investors bitch about the franchise losing money. Has it occurred to them that they are losing money because of Reinsdorf's poor management and ailenation of the fan base? Has the idea of buying Reinsdorf out or something and replacing him with someone who WANTS to win occurred to them? You know, the way to make money is to win in sports.

My dream is to see this franchise turned over to Pat Ryan or the Pritzker family. Hell, I'll even take that pompous brat in Washington, Daniel Snyder who owns the Washington NFL team. In business, those guys know what we really want in our White Sox. That is, consistent success. Oh yeah, someone like this would pay Keith Foulke. He would pay Mágglio Ordóńez. He would get a Roberto Alomar. He would get a Mike Hampton.

I realize that we're stuck with Reinsdorf until God knows when, but I am all for a total front office cleaining. The hiring of Ken Williams at the expense of Dan Evans was a gross mistake. Evans had a much more impressive résumé than Williams as a front office man, yet Jerry went with Kenny the ass kisser. He will go down as one of the worst general managers not only in Sox history but Chicago sports history.

His faux pax in the James Baldwin trade was the final straw for me. That is just plain blatant incompetence. Williams is too young, too inexperienced, and too hotheaded to be a general manager. If I were the owner, Williams would have been canned last night and Roland Hemond would be my interim GM tonight. Come season's end, I want the White Sox to send Ken Williams to Venezuela to scout 12-year-old shortstops and hire an experienced general manager from another team. How about Dave Dombrowski? What about John Schuerholz? Or what about lame duck Cleveland GM John Hart? Kenny has go to go, and I do not want another Reinsdorf ass kisser replacing him.

I like Jerry Manuel. He is a nice guy, but so is Dave Wannstedt. Once we have our new GM in place, he ought to immediately relieve Manuel of his managerial duties and replaced him with an experienced field manager with a proven track record. Jerry doesn't defend his players too much. Jerry uses too many different lineups, a Wannstedtian trait. Jerry plays the percentages too much. Jerry doesn't have the proverbial red ass and lets his players go through the motions too much. I like Buck Showalter. Jim Leyland is out there too. You know, we could try to pry a manager from another team. Other teams do.

It is this the obligation of this franchise to provide us a winner. Our brass from Jerry Reinsdorf on down has been a failure at that. This is the 21st season of the Reinsdorf regime. And what do we have to show for it? Three divisional titles out of those 21 seasons with first round playoff exits each time. Oh, I forgot about 1994. Well, maybe we would have gotten that World Series hadn't Reinsdorf made beating Donald Fehr more important than beating Cleveland the five following seasons.

You know I cannot stand that Jay Moronetti, but do any of us really have a problem with the stuff he says about Reinsdorf?

NUKE_CLEVELAND
07-27-2001, 07:19 PM
I say that not because he won't spend any money, but because he surrounds himself with a bunch of spineless "yes men" who will agree with anything he says even if he insults their mothers. Just another pathetic example of an owner killing a Chicago sports team.

Jerry_Manuel
07-27-2001, 07:31 PM
I realize that we're stuck with Reinsdorf until God knows when, but I am all for a total front office cleaining. The hiring of Ken Williams at the expense of Dan Evans was a gross mistake. Evans had a much more impressive résumé than Williams as a front office man, yet Jerry went with Kenny the ass kisser. He will go down as one of the worst general managers not only in Sox history but Chicago sports history.

Do you think Evans would have put up with Reinsdorf's crap about how much money he can spend or when to dump payroll? No he wouldn't, granted Evans would do a much better job as General Manager but with Reisndorf and his penny pinching friends lurking would Evans be free to do what he wants? That is why you won't see a big time name GM come here because they wouldn't put up with this crap. Have the Sox in the past 20 years ever had a Manager who had success else where? Being only 17 I know LaRussa but I don't know where he was before. Like the Bears they have NEVER had a head coach who had ever coached an NFL game.


I say that not because he won't spend any money, but because he surrounds himself with a bunch of spineless "yes men" who will agree with anything he says even if he insults their mothers. Just another pathetic example of an owner killing a Chicago sports team.

Nuke brings up a good point this is like the Hawks because the GM experienced or not has to deal with an owner who won't go all out to win. Reisndorf will spend the money as long as he gets it back but Wirtz is a total putz.

Mathew
07-27-2001, 08:16 PM
The best Banch Manager in the world (espcially for young players) is currently available. If we don't have Manuel back the only one I would rather have is Philipe Alou. Alou is the best manager in the league in 1994 the Expos were 1st overall and we say we got screwed. Randy Johnson Pedro Martinez Moises Alou Will Cordero Delino DeShields Brad Fullmer Gallaraga Grisom Grudzielanek Hermanson Segui Jeff Shaw Larry Walker Rondell White John Wettland and that's what I can think of? Many of these players left in their prime. With the Sox he could not help but churn out talent! I good manager can make a bad GM look great!

Tragg
07-27-2001, 08:17 PM
Alou never took a team to the playoffs. It's hard for me to objectively concur that he is a great manager. He has great reputation and hype, yes.
I think JM is cut in the same mold.

Mathew
07-27-2001, 08:36 PM
The point I was making was he did not make the play-offs because of that strike and bad management. Jose Vidro was a very poor hitter when he came up and now is the best in the league at his position. That is a good manager not trading for all the best players being dumped at the deadline because your team has money.

By The Way I just saw Bevington coaching third for Toronto against the Yanks on my T.V.

No-Neck
07-27-2001, 09:15 PM
I agree, JR should sell the team, but the Pritzker family? LOL

Their Superior bank has just been shut down by the feds this afternoon, the first failed thrift in Chicago in a while.

We don't need more pure business people owning the team. After all, JR was quite successful with BalCor Inc. This does not necessarily translate into successful ownership of a baseball franchise.

What we need is a Steinbrenner, a guy with a big ego that wants to win, and the bottom-line is an afterthought. he puts his money where his mouth is, and goes for the Rings.

Penny Pritzker as GM. Now there's a thought. LOL

But I agree that JR and KW should go, the faster the better! If I could afford to buy the team, I'd make all the guys on this forum proud

It's hell being a Sox fan in these trying times, I tell ya!

captain54
07-28-2001, 12:29 AM
Its been a comedy of errors and its only getting worse...

the goofiest part of it is that when Reinsdorf has spent money, he threw it away to a clubhouse cancer (Albert Belle) and a bust out (Navarro)......it gets thrown back in the fans faces that "money doesnt win pennants"....NO DILL ROD!!! NOT IF YOU SPEND IT ON THE WRONG GUYS!!!

I was one of those who was not that optimistic about the Sox coming back in 2001, even without the injuries....too many holes in the pitching staff, shaky bullpen, inconsistency of a lot of the starters, shoddy defense.....these were all the the issues coming into 2001, and they were mildly addressed....for example, I thought we needed David Wells AND Sirotka to really think about October baseball...

Reinsdorf & Co are the first owners of the White Sox who have had the full benefit of divisional playoffs, then wild card....this was designed to let teams stay in the race longer, then have a chance to get hot in the playoffs......under Reiney, we cant even get that right....

As far as Manuel and Kenny Williams, they are Reinsdorf puppets who were hired to fall on the sword when Comiskey is empty and the team is going nowhere......in typical Reinsdorf fashion, if the mediocrity continues, they will eventually be gone......

i ate canada
07-28-2001, 12:55 AM
How about Mark Cuban the Mavericks owner? Someone give him a call for me and tell him to buy out uncle jerry ok?

But you're right, the management from top to bottom is awful. Kenny"hooked on phonics didn't work for me"Williams is the biggest problem(obviously), but who knows how far it goes? JM proved himself as nothing more than a yes man yesterday with his comments about JB. But what can we do besides bitch about it? Personally, i'm getting a little sick of watching the cycle repeat itself...

captain54
07-28-2001, 01:25 AM
Im hoping the Baseball Gods will shine down on White Sox fans and provide a way out of this, reward us for the loving the Sox....

There is a glimmer of hope for 2002..(provided we have baseball).....A whole bunch of guys coming back from the DL might just be incentive enough for those who have season tickets to renew, provided Maggs and Foulke stay....

but theres not a lot of margin for error.......there will be similiar expectations going into 2002 as there was in 2001.....if we come out of the gate slow, and hover around mediocrity through May, June and July, Comiskey will be a ghost town, and I dont believe Reinsdorf can survice another "kids can play" campaign....

I personally do not think Kenny Williams and Manuel will survive...
and Reinsdorf will be scrambling if things go down the tubes next year to maintain some crediblity, not only amongst the fans, but amongst the investors...

The bottom line is, the investors will tire of an empty ballpark and Reinsdorf terrible relationship with the fans, and then the time will be ripe for fresh blood to wipe the slate clean and there will be dancing in the streets in Chicago amongst White Sox fans....

Bmr31
07-28-2001, 01:32 AM
CONGRATS! That was an excellent post and i agree with everything you said......

NUKE_CLEVELAND
07-28-2001, 02:04 AM
n/m

chisoxt
07-28-2001, 06:03 AM
The double edge sword is this....Since the new Comiskey was reinsdord's baby, I've always believed that the Sox will stay here as long as HE owns the team. But, once he sells the team, do you think that the new owner will stay long in that dungeon?

captain54
07-28-2001, 11:56 AM
:reinsy



Consider this:

I am Chairman of the Board with shared ownership.....I could be bought out, and a new Chairman would then be found....

And besides, what cities are available and willing to support a MLB franchise???

Procol Harum
07-28-2001, 12:42 PM
Amen and amen to almost everything that's been said in this thread!! Reinsdorf is the planter's wart beneath our beloved Pale Hose's frustrations and disasters. I was never a big fan but after '94 and the miserable job Reinsdorf and crew did in preparing for the '95 season (which I will always believe they thought wasn't going to happen) and then firing Gene LaMont for the cretin Terry Bevington I have known that only an accident or an act of God would make this team succeed. This guy is the Simon LeGree of professional sports.

There is one point I would disagree with--Reinsdorf is fierecely loyal to his "Yes Men" (actually, I think they're all folks cut from the same defensive, paranoid, circle-the-wagons cut of cloth that dovetail with JR's own warped personality. Consider: Jerry Kraus, Kenny Williams, Ron Schueler, Rob Gallas, etc., etc.)--they REALLY have to screw up big-time and when it comes to defending a club "building" program and personnel decisions they have a total fortress mentality. Ever notice how almost anybody who has ever played here--Sox or Bulls--has nothing but bad things to say about management?