PDA

View Full Version : Epstein turns down Red Sox offer


Fenway
10-26-2005, 11:30 AM
Epstein rejects upgraded offer from Red Sox (http://www.boston.com/sports/baseball/redsox/articles/2005/10/26/epstein_rejects_upgraded_offer_from_sox)
(By Gordon Edes and Chris Snow, Globe Staff)

With just five days left before Red Sox general manager Theo Epstein's three-year contract expires, negotiations between team CEO Larry Lucchino and his protege remain strained, as Epstein yesterday met with Lucchino and rejected an offer of $1.2 million a year for at least three years, according to a major league executive with knowledge of the negotiations.

Unregistered
10-26-2005, 11:35 AM
Wow, is he holding out for more money from the Red Sox or does Epstein really think he's better off on a team with a much lower payroll and higher chance of failure?

Talk about delusions of grandeur...

SoxFan64
10-26-2005, 11:39 AM
There is always the Shankees job once Cashman turns down the $5 million per from Steinbrenner (sp?).

ilsox7
10-26-2005, 11:39 AM
Theo's a young guy. Can he ever really top what he did for Boston last year? I would not blame him at all if he went out and took big bank from another team and attempted to tackle the challenge of winning on a budget. He already proved he can win it with unlimited funds, so why not go for the challenge?

I dunno, that's about the only reason I could see him leaving. This is all probably posturing on his part to get something like 1.75 million a year.

ilsox7
10-26-2005, 11:40 AM
There is always the Shankees job once Cashman turns down the $5 million per from Steinbrenner (sp?).

His offer is $5 Million over 3 years, not per year.

Tekijawa
10-26-2005, 11:40 AM
I heard Gammons is offering 2.5 Million per year to Epstein to walk around his house on the weekends oiled up with his shirt off.

Unregistered
10-26-2005, 11:50 AM
I heard Gammons is offering 2.5 Million per year to Epstein to walk around his house on the weekends oiled up with his shirt off. :rolling:

Fenway
10-26-2005, 11:50 AM
According to the Daily News, Cashman is waiting to see what happens to Theo



Craziest rumor out of NY If Cashman leaves DAN DUQUETTE would be offered the Yankees job

Cashman tries double play
Bill Madden's World Series Confidential: If you believe the scuttlebutt from the GMs at the World Series, Brian Cashman's prolonged negotiation with Yankees general partner Steve Swindal is directly related to Theo Epstein's holdout in Boston.
FULL STORY (http://www.nydailynews.com/sports/baseball/story/359377p-306181c.html)

mjharrison72
10-26-2005, 11:59 AM
Theo's a young guy. Can he ever really top what he did for Boston last year? I would not blame him at all if he went out and took big bank from another team and attempted to tackle the challenge of winning on a budget. He already proved he can win it with unlimited funds, so why not go for the challenge?

I dunno, that's about the only reason I could see him leaving. This is all probably posturing on his part to get something like 1.75 million a year.
The way I look at it, expectations are too high with the Red Sox now... if he take a team like the Orioles to the playoffs, he'll look like a genius, but Boston expects nothing less than another World Series ring... in that sense, he's been a miserable failure this year.:cool:

34 Inch Stick
10-26-2005, 12:30 PM
Am I missing something about the "genius" of Theo Epstein?

antitwins13
10-26-2005, 01:28 PM
I think it's rediculus that Epstein is holding out. My little sister could be the Red Sox GM with that payroll.

Flight #24
10-26-2005, 01:32 PM
Rumors are that both Cashman & Theo were holding out to enhance each other's negotiating positions. Cashman's now supposedly agreed to stay and is deciding between a 3 and 4 year deal. No word on whether or not Theo's just playing chicken or will actually leave.

Fenway
10-26-2005, 02:11 PM
Boston Dirt Dogs is brutal this afternoon

07:27 AM, Oct 26, 2005:

THEGO SAYS NO

Epstein Rejects Upgraded Offer from Sox

http://bostondirtdogs.boston.com/Headline_Archives/theo2004.gif

(BDD Illustration / Nicholas Brown)

Fenway
10-27-2005, 10:54 AM
The Boston Herald beat writer unloads on Red Sox ownership
over Theogate


Smear campaign stinks (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004)
By Tony Massarotti

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/images/redSox/theomug10272005.jpg
HOUSTON Ė And so, just three short years after celebrating Theo Epstein as their shining baby boy, the Red Sox are smearing... [more (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004)]


In the interest of disclosure, let us rewind for a moment. In the last few days, most recently in the Globe (which has more invested in the Red Sox than anyone but John Henry), it has been reported that Epstein rejected the Sox' latest contract offer, though the sides continue to talk and are expected to have some resolution in the next day or so. The latest proposal was for three years at $1.2 million per, which is the kind of information that comes out when real negotiations have given way to mud-slinging and damage control.

That said, some things need to be made clear. The first is that the media is a very dirty business; on some level, we are all compromised. The second, as one longtime observer once pointed out, is that Lucchino is a political animal. The Globe owns the Red Sox which means the Red Sox own the Globe, which is not a criticism as much as it is a statement of fact. The same is true of WEEI, or at least parts of it, which is currently in negotiations for Red Sox broadcast rights and compensates Lucchino for a weekly radio segment.

So, for an assortment of reasons, the two most powerful media outlets in New England are not about to challenge the words or methods of Lucchino and the Red Sox. (Not really.) And that is OK so long as we recognize there are conflicts of interest everywhere now and the truth will be distorted as a result of it.
That is why, as much as ever, we should hope this remains a two-newspaper town.




http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004

HotelWhiteSox
10-27-2005, 11:12 AM
ESPN reported that Cashman was staying with the Yankees yesterday afternoon, is it not official?

soxfan26
10-27-2005, 11:35 AM
Am I missing something about the "genius" of Theo Epstein?

I thought I was the only one.

Fenway
10-28-2005, 02:00 PM
Curt Schilling adds his 2 cents :o:

10/28/05 Curt Schilling (http://eod.liquidviewer.com/weei-od/Schilling10-28-05.wma) (audio)

SouthSide_HitMen
10-28-2005, 02:12 PM
The Boston Herald beat writer unloads on Red Sox ownership
over Theogate


Smear campaign stinks (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004)
By Tony Massarotti

http://redsox.bostonherald.com/images/redSox/theomug10272005.jpg
HOUSTON Ė And so, just three short years after celebrating Theo Epstein as their shining baby boy, the Red Sox are smearing... [more (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004)]




http://redsox.bostonherald.com/redSox/view.bg?articleid=109004



No matter the ownership, in the often petty and sometimes tactless history of the Red Sox, this is a new low.

I love it when they analyze!!!

The Boston Herald - The ONLY paper in Boston worth reading.

Fenway
10-28-2005, 02:14 PM
The Boston Herald - The ONLY paper in Boston worth reading.

They just lost Howard Bryant to the Washington Post :(:

Herald on life support now

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 02:15 PM
Curt Schilling adds his 2 cents :o:

10/28/05 Curt Schilling (http://eod.liquidviewer.com/weei-od/Schilling10-28-05.wma) (audio)Right off the bat, this radio guy is a jag.

"How bout that World Series - what a snoozer, eh?"
"Uh, not really..."
"Yeah, but you know - I bet you'd love to pitch to that Astros lineup.."
"Maybe, but their starting pitching is incredible, that's how they got there."
"Yeah, but..."

Shut up, stupid.

Fenway
10-28-2005, 02:16 PM
Right off the bat, this radio guy is a jag. "How bout that World Series - what a snoozer, eh?" "Uh, not really..."

Dennis and Callahan are idiots:angry:

but very highly ranked idiots :(:

Unregistered
10-28-2005, 02:18 PM
Dennis and Callahan are idiots:angry:

but very highly ranked idiots :(:Fenway, what's the gist of this interview? With respect, all I'm hearing is "blah, blah, blah..."

Fenway
10-28-2005, 02:22 PM
Fenway, what's the gist of this interview? With respect, all I'm hearing is "blah, blah, blah..."


Red Sox starter Curt Schilling called in to Boston sports radio station WEEIís Dennis and Callahan program today and offered his perspective on Theo Epstein's situation.



ďFrom what Iím hearing, Iím excited. I really honestly thought that this was not going to happen. I thought Theo was going to be gone and I was upset and disappointed with the thought of that happening but my impressions of everything that happened was that if he was coming back he was going to have a lot more latitude to do the things he wants to do as the general manager and I wasnít sure that that was necessarily going to happen but Iím guessing it is now, and thatís a good thing.Ē



ďI think money had something to do with it (the snag in negotiations). Theo wanted to be, and I think in a sense rightly deserved to be, one of the better paid GMs in the game. I look at his situation and I see a general manager that is equivalent to an arbitration eligible player. Itís after his third year. Heís put a club together thatís gone out there and gone to the postseason three times, won a World Series, and heís certainly deserving of whatever he can get financially.Ē



ďI think the most important thing for me is Theoís a good person first and foremost and I think that has a lot to with it. Heís not deceitful, at least not to me, and I think if the situation called for it he could be. But heís an honest guy. Heís a good guy ... thereís a lot more to this thing than being a job to him. Being born and raised here and having the Red Sox be as important to him as they are, it gives him a little different look at his job than other general managers have ... but I think above all else is he understands and heís a compromiser. A lot of teams that Iíve been on donít even want to see the general manager, much less have them in the clubhouse. And Theo understands that the clubhouse is our home and he doesnít invade that privacy often, but when he does he doesnít make you uncomfortable. And that says as much about him as anything.Ē



ďI donít know that I was led to believe he was out of here (based on some information he had) ... I was under the impression it probably wasnít going to happen based on what I had heard because the obvious point of this is Theo and Larry (Lucchino) have been together a long time and I think everybody sees the relationship as Theo riding coattails, or some people analyze it as such, and itís not. Theo has made himself into what he is and I heard some people talking about the fact that if Theo goes theyíll bring in another guy, cause itís the system and I absolutely 100 percent disagree with that.Ē



ďI think people underestimate the human element in sports a lot of times. To he (Theo) is every bit a part of the atmosphere around here as Chris Correnti (the recently released Red Sox trainer) from some viewpoints and when you take people like that away, playing in certain places becomes a lot less attractive. Theo Epstein is a draw for me to be here now. I enjoy him. I trust him and that matters. And you donít find a lot of people in that role that are as personable, and as understanding, and get it as he does.Ē



ďI think that this Theo situation is actually playing into this (the Sox possibly waiting too long on dealing with Johnny Damon). I think in a sense, and I donít mean this in a negative way, Theo is trying to handle his own personal situation and I would imagine that would take precedent over working with the current players on the roster and trying to get stuff done. I think that was interfering, it might have been, it might not have been, thatís me speculating but I donít know. I think that one of the things that I like about Theo is I believe in my heart of hearts weíre gonna have the 25 best possible players we can have on this roster. I think Johnny Damon is one of those guys. Iím hoping he comes back. I think he wants to come back. I think they want him back. And obviously if it makes financial sense, itís gonna happen. But whatís financial sense to one side is lunacy to another and when you add Scott Boras to the mix weird things happen."



ďWhy would you want to move somewhere if you thoughtÖ what you perceive to be the ultimate set-up for Theo obviously isnít. This is a different environment. I would imagine that heís one of the top two of three guys that when he walks out of his house, itís gotten real hard for him to function in society around here. Cause everybodyís got a trade for him. Everybodyís got a new lineup to run out there on Monday. Everybodyís got a new idea to pass to the manager. I donít let people tell me that stuff. I tell them to shut the hell up, but I would imagine Theo gets a lot of it."



"Part of it is principle too. I think that Theo believes he belongs on a certain rung of the ladder and Iím not sure that he doesnít. Iím not making those decisions but in my opinion, he should be up there somewhere."



"A lot of clubs are starting to infuse a lot of young quote unquote talent in out of sight places and decision making spots in clubs. Moneyball started the snowball rolling and I think itís just gotten bigger with Billy Beane and with Theo and the thing about them (the new crop of young GMs in baseball) is they havenít sucked. Theyíve been good and theyíve been at two extremes. Youíve got Billy Beane operating on an incredibly limited budget in Oakland, and youíve got Theo operating with an unlimited budget and one of the best things heís done is heís tried to show a semblance of fiscal responsibility even though he probably doesnít have to in a sense. In the context of where we play and who we play against yes (it is an unlimited budget). We can outspend everybody except the team (Yankees) that can outspend the country and us. But the thing about it is Theo tries to make every dollar he spends go the mile. And itís not a sign and fill a spot, sign and fill a spot, sign and fill a spot, itís ĎIf Iím gonna spend this money, Iím gonna make sure I get the most out of it.í Thatís a different approach than maybe the Yankees who will gather it all up, sign it all, and sort it out later. Not that thatís a bad thing but itís different."