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View Full Version : Are the White Sox an Offspeed Hitting Team?


cburns
10-25-2005, 12:39 AM
I was just watching SportsCenter, and Harold Renoylds said how Oswalt was going to have a good game because of his fastball and the fact that the Sox are an "off-speed pitch" hitting team. I believe he has said the same throughout this postseason as well. Personally I always thought they were a fastball hitting team. Does "HR" have any merit for saying that?

lumpyspun
10-25-2005, 12:42 AM
I saw that too and HR had nothing to back up that lame comment. That is why he didn't give any stats to help his argument. That is like writing a history paper with a big thesis statement and then not putting any facts or actual history in the paper. They all picked the Sox to win, so they all believe the Sox will win, especially now up 2-0...they are just trying to be fair and optimistic for the Astros.

kjhanson
10-25-2005, 12:44 AM
I was dumbfounded by his comments as well. The Sox are notorious for not being a patient hitting team and swinging at a lot of off-speed pitches. They've also been fooled by changeups time and time again. This would lead me to believe that we are a fastball hitting team (aren't all teams?). After all, I'd rather face Oswalt's fastball than Santana's changeup or Zito's curveball.

Jurr
10-25-2005, 12:44 AM
That would be a HUGE no. It hasn't been for a LONG time. This team, especially since the mashing days of 2000, has been a fastball team. Period. The addition of Iguchi has changed that only a little.

Konerko, Dye, Everett, Crede, and Uribe are all fastball hitters.

SouthSoxFan
10-25-2005, 12:46 AM
I'm not buying that unless they produce some data to back it up, meaning comparisons of Sox hitting against different pitch types vs the league avgs against those pitch types. Anyone see that anywhere? Its funny too, that ESPN had to specifically reverse that offspeed notion on Konerko last night when they were analyzing the grand slam, which happened to be a first pitch fastball.

Hawk throws this stuff out there too. For example, he'll say the Twins are a "great fastball hitting team". Huh? How can a team favor one type of pitch.

And more importantly, if you're a major league hitter, how can you not be able to hit the fastball?

elrod
10-25-2005, 12:48 AM
Note that the one pitcher that's given us fits this postseason more than any other is Paul Byrd. He of the 84 mph fastball. The White Sox are a fastball hitting team, period. Obviously, if a fireballer can hit his spots and mix it up with a change, then he can't be beaten by anybody. But speed alone will not intimidate the White Sox.

antitwins13
10-25-2005, 12:52 AM
I was just watching SportsCenter, and Harold Renoylds said how Oswalt was going to have a good game because of his fastball and the fact that the Sox are an "off-speed pitch" hitting team. I believe he has said the same throughout this postseason as well. Personally I always thought they were a fastball hitting team. Does "HR" have any merit for saying that?


HR hasn't done his research. For one I think Everett and Uribe can barley hit off-speed pitches, and I think the other Sox players are pretty much dead read fastball hitters too. Dye and Iguchi are the only real off-speed hitters we have.

TomParrish79
10-25-2005, 01:02 AM
The way Oswalt has pitched in the post season he deserves his kudos from the ESPN guys. They all think that he will dominate Tuesday night and get Houston right back in the series, and this could very well happen.

But if we light his ass up tomorrow night.....oh if we light him up...what will they say then?

Overlooked in all these discussions is one Mr. Jon "Johnny Ballgame" Garland.

I am hoping we see Jon's best pitching performance of the year tomorrow night.

GO SOX!!

Jurr
10-25-2005, 01:05 AM
The way Oswalt has pitched in the post season he deserves his kudos from the ESPN guys. They all think that he will dominate Tuesday night and get Houston right back in the series, and this could very well happen.

But if we light his ass up tomorrow night.....oh if we light him up...what will they say then?

Overlooked in all these discussions is one Mr. Jon "Johnny Ballgame" Garland.

I am hoping we see Jon's best pitching performance of the year tomorrow night.

GO SOX!!
Yeah..everybody said Jon Lackey was going to eat our asses up, and we saw how that went. Ooohhh...but the 'stros have a short porch in left. We've got 7 guys in our lineup that can pull a pitch right over that crap. I don't want to hear about an advantage until it presents itself. The Astros bullpen was also supposed to be an advantage. Ooops.:rolleyes:

TomParrish79
10-25-2005, 01:07 AM
Ooohhh...but the 'stros have a short porch in left.

I love how Mullet-Head Brantley keeps mentioning that the short porch is all for Houston's advantage. Like our players are too dumb to notice that the left field wall is right behind 3rd base.

Damn i cant wait for the game to get here.

cburns
10-25-2005, 01:07 AM
Yeah I Oswalt definitely deserves all his props, I just think its ridiculous of ESPN to say that the Sox are an off-speed pitching team, when it's the complete opposite.

Banix12
10-25-2005, 01:22 AM
The Astros bullpen was also supposed to be an advantage. Ooops.:rolleyes:

The astros bullpen that features some pretty good fastball pitchers.

I swear I think all of HR's analysis is based on that one curveball that Iguchi hit off David Wells because I think after that game was the first time I heard the white sox called off-speed hitters.

I think I read it at SOSH during the Red Sox series that there was some research that shows the sox were far better against power pitchers but i don't feel like rummaging through their board for the thread. Having watched this team all season though, definitely they have more trouble with the soft tossers

doublem23
10-25-2005, 01:51 AM
They may be an off-speed hitting team, but they're a fastball destroying team; both homers last night were fastballs.

Iwritecode
10-25-2005, 10:03 AM
I think Steve Stone said it best when he was on the Score yesterday.

"All MLB players can hit a fastball. Otherwise they wouldn't be playing."

He also mentioned that playing in Houston with that short porch is a lot like playing in Boston. The only difference is that Houston's offense isn't nearly as powerful... :cool:

krohnjw
10-25-2005, 10:18 AM
They may be an off-speed hitting team, but they're a fastball destroying team; both homers last night were fastballs.
:roflmao:

JorgeFabregas
10-25-2005, 10:22 AM
Note that the one pitcher that's given us fits this postseason more than any other is Paul Byrd. He of the 84 mph fastball. The White Sox are a fastball hitting team, period. Obviously, if a fireballer can hit his spots and mix it up with a change, then he can't be beaten by anybody. But speed alone will not intimidate the White Sox.

That's what I was going to mention...Paul Byrd. I think Reynolds has been watching that Iguchi homerun footage a few too many times. That rolling curveball just looks like it's made for his swing...they've just got to be a team full of breaking-ball hitters, right? :rolleyes:

wdelaney72
10-25-2005, 10:23 AM
Dye and Iguchi are the only real off-speed hitters we have.

:rowand "Ah-hem!"

Also, some of Crede's biggest hits this post-season have come off of hanging split-finger pitches.

Still, I think Rowand is our best off-speed hitter.

34 Inch Stick
10-25-2005, 11:24 AM
I know I saw a DETAILED scouting report on Konerko either here or on an ALDS telecast. It showed, with statistical proof, that Paulie absolutely is looking fastball early in the count and most specifically on the first pitch. If there is a first pitch strike he is susceptible to breaking balls the rest of the count especially on the outside of the plate.

Everything about Uribe's approach to hitting screams fast ball hitter.

While I do not consider Crede a great fast ball hitter, he tends to look absolutely horrible on breaking pitches on the outside out of the stike zone.

SoxFan76
10-25-2005, 11:27 AM
Isn't every team a fastball hitting team? Usually you go up to the plate looking fastball. Unless you're facing Lidge, KRod, etc.

Lip Man 1
10-25-2005, 11:33 AM
CBurns:

Just wondering...why do you even waste your time watching ESPN in the first place? There are a number of other sports networks available off satellite and cable who do a much better job.

Who cares what Harold Reynolds thinks? He's a clown, a mediocre major league player and a mediocre broadcaster... nothing like the guys who Baseball Tonight had when they first started out, guys who actually knew about the game.

Lip

veeter
10-25-2005, 11:36 AM
If anyone bought Reynolds' instructional tapes, I'd be very cautious showing them to any kids. If there anything like his analysis, he'll screw up those youngsters for life.

lumpyspun
10-25-2005, 11:42 AM
With all this Reynolds bashing going on, including myself, I must admit that I met the guy at the 2001 World Series and he is a great guy. I also met Peter Gammons and he was cool too. I was at Yankee Stadium waiting to go on to the field to hold the flag for game 2. They both came down and shook everyones hand and talked for a bit. Chris Berman just sat up in the broadcast booth and waved down, probably stuffing his face with doughnuts and hot dogs. So, I have a soft spot for Reynolds and Gammons.

hawkjt
10-25-2005, 01:55 PM
This has been a Harold R. talking point since the Gooch homer. It is like he can only come up with one angle on the sox offense or something. It is laughable to sox fans who know that we love fastballs. everyone struggles against great fastball pitchers or great off-speed pitchers.

He might be a nice guy but he should come up with a new thought. Just one would do.