PDA

View Full Version : At least one person wants Konerko back


Jjav829
10-13-2005, 06:00 PM
Ozzie.

``To me, this kid is my leader,'' Guillen said. ``This kid just does everything in his power for us to be what we are, on the field and off the field. I will do anything and (general manager) Kenny Williams will do anything to keep Konerko here. He showed up to play every day. He's a gamer. There's nothing negative to say about him.''

``People said he wasn't good in the clubhouse and was a selfish player (but) he was different then,'' Guillen said. ``I've had this job for two years and he's the best thing I have.''

We'll see. There's going to be a big market for Konerko since he's one of the top free agents available. I'm not sure we'll be able to keep him.

Link (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/otherMLB/view.bg?articleid=106833)

ode to veeck
10-13-2005, 06:05 PM
Put the Angels near the top of the list as an interested party as they have already stated they're going for more power hitting in the free agent market once the season's over

DumpJerry
10-13-2005, 06:14 PM
I had a debate this morning with a friend about this topic. I told her Paulie can leave. She wants him back. I pointed out how he is a non-clutch hitter who strikes out when runners are on base early in the game or at a critical juncture of the game and then hits a solo shot in the 9th when the game is out of reach-that is how he builds up his HR total. I pointed out that 40 homers and 100 RBIs back me up. With 40 homers, you should bring home more than 60 guys over a 162 game schedule.

He will get a 8 figure deal, probably from the Sox, and will be overpriced. I'm sure the Sox will lock him in for a few years because he is a nice guy who makes a good ambassador for the team.

FarWestChicago
10-13-2005, 06:15 PM
We'll see. There's going to be a big market for Konerko since he's one of the top free agents available. I'm not sure we'll be able to keep him.

Link (http://redsox.bostonherald.com/otherMLB/view.bg?articleid=106833)Personally, I'd like to see him increase his value by doing something in this series. I don't care if it costs the Sox more next year. :D:

RKMeibalane
10-13-2005, 06:23 PM
Personally, I'd like to see him increase his value by doing something in this series. I don't care if it costs the Sox more next year. :D:

Careful. The aPaulogists will be all over you soon.

FarWestChicago
10-13-2005, 06:29 PM
Careful. The aPaulogists will be all over you soon.I'm serious. I'd like to see him pull a Beltran. :cool:

RKMeibalane
10-13-2005, 06:31 PM
I'm serious. I'd like to see him pull a Beltran. :cool:

So, would I, but I'm more concerned about seeing the Sox run the bases without too many problems.

buehrle4cy05
10-13-2005, 06:33 PM
I'm serious. I'd like to see him pull a Beltran. :cool:

Hopefully, though, he won't suck the next year.

JB98
10-13-2005, 06:35 PM
Careful. The aPaulogists will be all over you soon.

All over him for what? I'm the biggest Konerko supporter on WSI, but the fact is Paulie hasn't done anything in this series. Crede is the only one who is swinging the bat well at this point. In this case, West is right to criticize Konerko. Paulie isn't the only one struggling, but he is our best player and we need more from him to win this series.

The guy who said all of Konerko's 40 HRs were meaningless is wrong. In fact, it's such a stupid argument that it isn't worth me taking the time to refute. Further, I'm sick of this debate. We can argue about Konerko's contract and relative worth after the season.

Hokiesox
10-13-2005, 06:45 PM
I have a hunch he's not leaving. The media is making a big deal over him not having a contract. but, if you remember, he told Kenny in Spring Training that he wouldn't discuss a contract until after the season. I hope he honors that agreement and at least allows kenny to state his case before going to get big $$$ somewhere else. I dunno, he seems like he's too upstanding to go back on that agreement to talk after the season, to me. Just my two cents.

chisoxmike
10-13-2005, 06:48 PM
Personally, I'd like to see him increase his value by doing something in this series. I don't care if it costs the Sox more next year. :D:

He has been brutal with guys on base, but so has the whole team this series.

Daver
10-13-2005, 06:50 PM
I've said it before, I'll say it again, make it to the World Series, and the vast majority of this team will be back, Jerry Reinsdorf will spend the money for another shot at a title.

HITMEN OF 77
10-13-2005, 06:58 PM
He has been brutal with guys on base, but so has the whole team this series.

Agreed. I'd love to see Konerko back more than anyone. He has made some great plays in field this post season.

Jurr
10-13-2005, 07:03 PM
Agreed. I'd love to see Konerko back more than anyone. He has made some great plays in field this post season.
Remember the clincher (against the Tigers)? He has a glove and if he picks up his clutch hitting just a tad, he's going to be an MVP candidate. He's not worth 15-18 million, but if we can get him at 12 million per, I'm all about it.

Plus, my buddies in Memphis all call me "Konerko" as a nickname because a couple of years ago I got a Konerko jersey. I would wear it out, and they thought it was kinda random. It would suck to be called "Konerko" by a bunch of people if the guy is playing on the Angels or Red Sox. :(:

Iguana775
10-13-2005, 07:05 PM
I am of the belief that if Ozzie wants to keep him, KW will keep him.

Iguana775
10-13-2005, 07:14 PM
I've said it before, I'll say it again, make it to the World Series, and the vast majority of this team will be back, Jerry Reinsdorf will spend the money for another shot at a title.

agreed. He proved that when the Bulls that he will spend as long as the team is winning rings.

TimoPerez
10-13-2005, 08:10 PM
:walnuts

"That's nice of Ozzie. He's the forth nicest manager I have ever had."

In all seriousness, both Ozzie and Paul are the collective man. All that badmouthing of Paul Konerko was complete bull. He is great.

DumpJerry
10-13-2005, 10:29 PM
The guy who said all of Konerko's 40 HRs were meaningless is wrong. In fact, it's such a stupid argument that it isn't worth me taking the time to refute. Further, I'm sick of this debate. We can argue about Konerko's contract and relative worth after the season.
I did not say his 40 HRs were meaningless. I said he hits a lot of solo shots and missed out on a lot of opportunities to get multi-run homers as demonstrated by his poor Home Run to RBI ratio. That is why he is not mentioned as MVP material when Big Frank would get it for a similar number of homers.

This is a guy who played in almost all 162 games and he drove in 60 guys. I'm sure the statheads here can pull up the numbers on the other guys in MLB who hit 35+ homers this year and how many RBI's they had. I think you'll find Paulie is not real high on the RBI list.

Flight #24
10-13-2005, 10:36 PM
I've said it before, I'll say it again, make it to the World Series, and the vast majority of this team will be back, Jerry Reinsdorf will spend the money for another shot at a title.

IMO it's already a done deal. They'll have the extra $$ to keep everyone and add 2-3mil to Paulie's current 9mil. Especially with the almost certain buyout & cheap resigning of Frank.

The ONLY way he's going is if KW thinks he can get more of an impact player for that cash. It won't be because he can't fit it into the budget.

minastirith67
10-13-2005, 10:37 PM
agreed. He proved that when the Bulls that he will spend as long as the team is winning rings.

What!?

What happened in '98 then? I guess you could blame Jerry Krause, but if that was the case then Krause should have never been there in the first place for your 'theory'.

:rolleyes:

RKMeibalane
10-13-2005, 11:26 PM
What!?

What happened in '98 then? I guess you could blame Jerry Krause, but if that was the case then Krause should have never been there in the first place for your 'theory'.

:rolleyes:

Reinsdorf spent money in '98. He was buying donuts for Krause.

Flight #24
10-13-2005, 11:40 PM
What!?

What happened in '98 then? I guess you could blame Jerry Krause, but if that was the case then Krause should have never been there in the first place for your 'theory'.

:rolleyes:

The problem in 98 wasn't spending the money in 98 to win. It was tying up huge amounts of money in 99, 00, 01 with a high likelihood of NOT winning because Jackson would not agree to stick around, and neither would Jordan.

TheOldRoman
10-14-2005, 12:18 AM
The problem in 98 wasn't spending the money in 98 to win. It was tying up huge amounts of money in 99, 00, 01 with a high likelihood of NOT winning because Jackson would not agree to stick around, and neither would Jordan.
Yep. And since Ministry jacked this thread, I will go on. I remember biting my nails during the seven game series against the Pacers in the conference finals. The Bulls were a very good team, but they were also a very old team. They dealt with the Jazz much more easily than the Pacers, but that didn't mask the truth. During the conference finals, I had the feeling that this was our last run. The Bulls really showed their age during that series. With the age of the team, I am not sure we would have been able to win it all in 99. I just dont think they had anything left.

Flight #24
10-14-2005, 01:02 AM
Back on point, keeping this team together will likely require a payroll increase on the order of $10-12mil. Given the increase in attendance, the playoff revenues, and the likelihood of strong attendance next year because of the playoff run (especially if they keep the team together or add to it), I think that's extremely likely.

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 07:44 AM
Ozzie.
We'll see. There's going to be a big market for Konerko since he's one of the top free agents available. I'm not sure we'll be able to keep him.



I said this in spring training ........ this is konerkos last hurrah here. The SOX knew darn well he was a FA to be, and that there were NO OTHER options on the market to replace him. Inexplicably, they chose to enter the season without a new contract for him, realizing that a good year by him was ironically going to COST THE SOX MORE in the long run. They never learn. We need a #3 hitter and a #5 hitter to surround Konerko. If he leaves .......We'll need a 3, a 4 and a 5 hitter. Nice.

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 07:53 AM
Back on point, keeping this team together will likely require a payroll increase on the order of $10-12mil. Given the increase in attendance, the playoff revenues, and the likelihood of strong attendance next year because of the playoff run (especially if they keep the team together or add to it), I think that's extremely likely.

:reinsy
" WHOAH WHOAH WHOAH !!!!!! GUYS GUYS! Lets not get ahead of ourselves here. Listen I know were all giddy and happy and everything, and I think you guys think I did say something about if the team was in contention at the allstar break, I was going to spend to get us over the top, and I think you guys think that if we won this year, I was going to spend to keep everyone together, but lets think for a moment and not be rash. We lowered the payroll from what it wouldve been, right? Lets just keep our options open here people, we dont necessarily have to spend $$$$$ to win, this year proves that, dont you agree? I think Ross Gload will be an excellent replacement for Konerko. Look at all the money we'd be saving! We could use that money to get what we really need.
Hitting!"

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 07:56 AM
I've said it before, I'll say it again, make it to the World Series, and the vast majority of this team will be back, Jerry Reinsdorf will spend the money for another shot at a title.

:reinsy " Heh heh. You think so huh? You buying?"

The Dude
10-14-2005, 08:13 AM
I did not say his 40 HRs were meaningless. I said he hits a lot of solo shots and missed out on a lot of opportunities to get multi-run homers as demonstrated by his poor Home Run to RBI ratio. That is why he is not mentioned as MVP material when Big Frank would get it for a similar number of homers.

This is a guy who played in almost all 162 games and he drove in 60 guys. I'm sure the statheads here can pull up the numbers on the other guys in MLB who hit 35+ homers this year and how many RBI's they had. I think you'll find Paulie is not real high on the RBI list.

Did you consider the fact that we have NO #3 hitter for the bulk of the past 2 years in front of him as a possible reason for the lower RBI numbers???
I guarantee you if Frank was playing #3 for the last 2 full seasons, PK would have at least 120-130 RBIS.

Jjav829
10-14-2005, 08:15 AM
I'm serious. I'd like to see him pull a Beltran. :cool:

That's exactly what I said I wanted to see Konerko do. I'd love to see him go on a run with 6 homers in 8 games or something like that. Then Konerko can go get his big money contract wherever he wants, although I'd guess that if he got that hot the Sox would be more willing to pay him.

jabrch
10-14-2005, 08:15 AM
There are loads of 1B out there who we can get for 10mm. I'm not worried about that at all. There was no way JR/KW should have committed long term money to PK before this year. He hit .277/.359/.535 with 41 HRs last year, after .235/.304/.399 with 18 the (137 games) season before that. His career, even with this year included, is .279/.348/.488. No sir - paying 10m per for 4 years for that at 1B would be horrendously moronic. There is talk that Dunn will be available. There is talk that Helton will be traded. Overbay's name is being tossed around. Huff...Klesko, etc. Howard/Thome has to be somehow resolved.

4/40mm for PK now? Maybe...before this season? NO FREAKING WAY.

Only the revisionist history, and the anti JR crowd can complain about not doing this.

Ol' No. 2
10-14-2005, 08:44 AM
:reinsy
" WHOAH WHOAH WHOAH !!!!!! GUYS GUYS! Lets not get ahead of ourselves here. Listen I know were all giddy and happy and everything, and I think you guys think I did say something about if the team was in contention at the allstar break, I was going to spend to get us over the top, and I think you guys think that if we won this year, I was going to spend to keep everyone together, but lets think for a moment and not be rash. We lowered the payroll from what it wouldve been, right? Lets just keep our options open here people, we dont necessarily have to spend $$$$$ to win, this year proves that, dont you agree? I think Ross Gload will be an excellent replacement for Konerko. Look at all the money we'd be saving! We could use that money to get what we really need.
Hitting!"What color is the sky on the planet where you live, Hangar?

maurice
10-14-2005, 12:36 PM
I'd love to see him go on a run with 6 homers in 8 games or something like that. Then Konerko can go get his big money contract wherever he wants.

:thumbsup:

Here's hoping that JR authorizes a payroll increase to $85+ mil., making the whole thing a non-issue. (No, I don't think this post requires deeppink.)

Chicken Dinner
10-14-2005, 01:01 PM
PK just built a huge house in Scottsdale AZ so that means he will not go anywhere that doesn't spring train in AZ. Sox will probably resign him.

Rocky Soprano
10-14-2005, 01:15 PM
I said this in spring training ........ this is konerkos last hurrah here. The SOX knew darn well he was a FA to be, and that there were NO OTHER options on the market to replace him. Inexplicably, they chose to enter the season without a new contract for him, realizing that a good year by him was ironically going to COST THE SOX MORE in the long run. They never learn. We need a #3 hitter and a #5 hitter to surround Konerko. If he leaves .......We'll need a 3, a 4 and a 5 hitter. Nice.

I swear you never think before you post.

I vividly remember reading that KW tried to contact Konerko's agent to get a deal done before the season and during the season and I believe there might of been a third time. Konerko himself said the Sox had tried but that HE wanted to wait until the end of the season so it would NOT be a distraction.

And again, we have a #3 hitter, his name is Frank Thomas, but he got hurt.

Now I'm sure you will go on about Magglio or Carlos or how the Sox didn't trade for anyone, and I'm sure it will be fascinating.

maurice
10-14-2005, 01:21 PM
IIRC, KW told Konerko before the season started that they wouldn't offer him a contract until after the season. Konerko said that he was open to any offers at any time and really wanted to re-sign, but KW wasn't making any offers. There's probably a link somewhere on this site.

Edit: A search will show a series of articles beginning wiith Sox Fest where Konerko and his agent keep saying essentially: "We want an extension right now, but the ball is in their court."

voodoochile
10-14-2005, 01:39 PM
Glad he is a leader. Glad Ozzie likes him. I'd prefer he hit more consistently especially with RISP.

Leadership does not equal money in any sport unless you got the stats to back it up.

Flight #24
10-14-2005, 01:44 PM
"We lowered the payroll from what it wouldve been, right? Lets just keep our options open here people, we dont necessarily have to spend $$$$$ to win, this year proves that, dont you agree? I think Ross Gload will be an excellent replacement for Konerko. Look at all the money we'd be saving! We could use that money to get what we really need.
Hitting!"

Opening day payroll 2003: $51M
Opening day payroll 2004: $65M
Opening day payroll 2005: $75M

Yes, Hangar - the payroll is lower than it would have been had the Sox signed Clement, Pavano, Beltran, and Delgado. The cheap bastards!!!

Here, I think this is yours....:smokin:

(Salary data per USA Today MLB Salary database)

Flight #24
10-14-2005, 01:46 PM
IIRC, KW told Konerko before the season started that they wouldn't offer him a contract until after the season. Konerko said that he was open to any offers at any time and really wanted to re-sign, but KW wasn't making any offers. There's probably a link somewhere on this site.

Edit: A search will show a series of articles beginning wiith Sox Fest where Konerko and his agent keep saying essentially: "We want an extension right now, but the ball is in their court."

True, but coming into 2004, had Konerko proven he was worth $10-12M? He was 1 year removed from a horrible year, and had yet to string together 2 very good years in a row.

That is no longer the case.

Randar68
10-14-2005, 01:56 PM
We'll see. There's going to be a big market for Konerko since he's one of the top free agents available. I'm not sure we'll be able to keep him.

People keep saying that, and also that these playoffs are raising his market... I don't get it, he's hittin .200 with no walks in 5 games so far... how is that increasing his value?

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 01:57 PM
Opening day payroll 2003: $51M
Opening day payroll 2004: $65M
Opening day payroll 2005: $75M


The 2004 payroll was helped a great deal by not keeping key Bullpen pitchers
and keeping the increase to a minimum.
The 2005 payroll, had it increased on its own due to player raises ......wouldve been in the $95 Million range. They got "rid" of players due raises and wisely acquired/filled holes they had in the team since 2002 and kept it at $75Million.
Of course, the SOX are the first to tell us that they "increased" the payroll,
which on paper they indeed did. What is Konerko making this year? They wanted badly to unload him, and had they done that, the Payroll wouldve been SIXTY SEVEN MILLION. NOt much of an increase Im thinking.

What will happen with players that are due raises or are free agents? Theres a very good chance this payroll may not raise much higher, despite the Winning, and the Playoffs,
and the Higher Attendance.

voodoochile
10-14-2005, 02:02 PM
The 2004 payroll was helped a great deal by not keeping key Bullpen pitchers
and keeping the increase to a minimum.
The 2005 payroll, had it increased on its own due to player raises ......wouldve been in the $95 Million range. They got "rid" of players due raises and wisely acquired/filled holes they had in the team since 2002 and kept it at $75Million.
Of course, the SOX are the first to tell us that they "increased" the payroll,
which on paper they indeed did. What is Konerko making this year? They wanted badly to unload him, and had they done that, the Payroll wouldve been SIXTY SEVEN MILLION. NOt much of an increase Im thinking.

What will happen with players that are due raises or are free agents? Theres a very good chance this payroll may not raise much higher, despite the Winning, and the Playoffs,
and the Higher Attendance.

Man you are like a brok...brok...brok...en record...

Give it up Hangar. you know damned well why those changes happend. Do you really want Maggs back at that price? What did he do this year that makes you think the Sox would be in a better position right now?

Where is the credit for turning Lee into AJ, Gooch and Pods?

You are going to have to put it down. Let it go. Take a deep breath and walk away. At least admit the Sox have been better of late and let's see where it is going.

Besides, right now there are bigger fish to fry than worrying about the payroll. You know... like the ALCS? :rolleyes:

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 02:09 PM
Where is the credit for turning Lee into AJ, Gooch and Pods?

You are going to have to put it down. Let it go. Take a deep breath and walk away. At least admit the Sox have been better of late and let's see where it is going.

Besides, right now there are bigger fish to fry than worrying about the payroll. You know... like the ALCS? :rolleyes:

Believe me, our biggest fish is the ALCS I agree. Im simply commenting that the SOX shouldve gotten down, and offered Paulie a decent contract BEFORE his price went up, and we know it did because the Yanks and RedSox have already tampered and want him badly. We cant compete in a bidding war for him. The SOX badly wanted to unload Konerko, but had no takers.
IF they did, our payroll would be nearly Identical to the 2004 payroll. Thats No Lie. AJ Pods and Gooch are awesome pickups, and we lucked out that there wasnt a bidding war for AJ, and Pods is making the Minimum.
Im hoping Pods isnt arbitration eligible, then suddenly were going to hear about how bad he in the clubhouse, hes selfish, his onbase % is brutal, lets dump him now hes too expensive etc etc. OK. Backing away, deep breath ........ LETS GO SOX

Flight #24
10-14-2005, 02:11 PM
The 2004 payroll was helped a great deal by not keeping key Bullpen pitchers
and keeping the increase to a minimum.
The 2005 payroll, had it increased on its own due to player raises ......wouldve been in the $95 Million range. They got "rid" of players due raises and wisely acquired/filled holes they had in the team since 2002 and kept it at $75Million.
Of course, the SOX are the first to tell us that they "increased" the payroll,
which on paper they indeed did. What is Konerko making this year? They wanted badly to unload him, and had they done that, the Payroll wouldve been SIXTY SEVEN MILLION. NOt much of an increase Im thinking.

What will happen with players that are due raises or are free agents? Theres a very good chance this payroll may not raise much higher, despite the Winning, and the Playoffs,
and the Higher Attendance.

Bottom line: Payroll increased, and significantly. Coincidentally, so did attendance/revenues. We see that increase again this year. But you feel free to be convinced that that means they're going to cut salaries because you're convinced that somehow they did it in the past because of some complex construct in your head.

As for the 2005 payroll "on its own", it would NOT have increased to the $95mil range, it would have been......$75mil. Why? Because you'd have Carlos Lee and not Duque/AJ/Iguchi. Those are offsetting salaries. Only in a ganja-clouded world is it a payroll decrease because they didn't keep Lee AND sign the other 3.

And had they unloaded Konerko, they would have kept Lee. Net salary differential: $.25M. Cheap bastards!!!

This is beyond ludicrous, and on par with the "Carlos Lee is a #3 hitter, Jermaine Dye is a chump - don't confuse me with the facts involved" argument.

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 02:37 PM
I swear you never think before you post.




As Maurice and others have noted ............ KONERKO WANTED a contract,
and wants to stay in Chicago. the SOX were the ones who said Wait til after the season, which I know to mean "we dont want you, your too expensive".
How do I know? They wanted badly to unload him last offseason, and werent able to. The SOX gambled he'd have a bad year and would be cheap. Dont you remember his comments in the Sun-Times just a couple weeks ago ......
in which he said he hasnt heard from the SOX since Spring Training, and assumes he wont be here next year?

Flight #24
10-14-2005, 02:40 PM
As Maurice and others have noted ............ KONERKO WANTED a contract,
and wants to stay in Chicago. the SOX were the ones who said Wait til after the season, which I know to mean "we dont want you, your too expensive".
How do I know? They wanted badly to unload him last offseason, and werent able to. The SOX gambled he'd have a bad year and would be cheap. Dont you remember his comments in the Sun-Times just a couple weeks ago ......
in which he said he hasnt heard from the SOX since Spring Training, and assumes he wont be here next year?

Please provide a link/quote, because that's not IIRC what he said. He said he hasn't heard from the Sox, but that they'd agreed to talk about it AFTER the season. Nothing about assuming he'd be gone.

Hangar18
10-14-2005, 02:42 PM
Please provide a link/quote, because that's not IIRC what he said. He said he hasn't heard from the Sox, but that they'd agreed to talk about it AFTER the season. Nothing about assuming he'd be gone.

can someone help? :wink: