PDA

View Full Version : Valentin to start at 3rd


Jerry_Manuel
12-02-2001, 11:32 AM
From Gammons:
Williams looks at his White Sox and asks, "Is getting Frank Thomas, Antonio Osuna, Jim Parque, Lorenzo Barcelo and Bobby Howry completely healthy enough to add 10 games to the standings? If so, we're over 90 wins."


The Chicago GM is looking to trade some right-handed power to get a little better left-handed balance. He wants to find a veteran starting pitcher. Other GMs say he'd like a center fielder and some think he'd discuss a deal for 2002 free agent Ray Durham. "We do not want to move Jose Valentin around as much as we did last season," says Williams. Right now, the plan is for Valentin to play third until Joe Crede is ready. If Durham were moved, Valentin could play second, but that is the smoke of a distant fire.


"Ideally, we'd like to be able to shut down teams in the late innings, and we might want to add yet another arm down there," says Williams, knowing his offense can be as productive as the one that helped produce a league-high 95 wins in 2000. With Mark Buehrle and a healthy Parque, he has two lefties, and hopes for Jon Garland, Gary Glover, Kip Wells, Rocky Biddle and all the young right-handers to come through. Buehrle was their only pitcher to start more than 21 games.

Spiff
12-02-2001, 11:41 AM
Haha that's great jerry but why didn't you just put it in the Gammon's Latest thread?

Jerry_Manuel
12-02-2001, 11:44 AM
Originally posted by Wh1teSox00
Haha that's great jerry but why didn't you just put it in the Gammon's Latest thread?

Because it wouldn't get as much attention. And no it's not great, I'm tired of seeing Crede in the minors.

KempersRS
12-02-2001, 11:55 AM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
From Gammons:

The Chicago GM is looking to trade some right-handed power to get a little better left-handed balance. He wants to find a veteran starting pitcher. Other GMs say he'd like a center fielder and some think he'd discuss a deal for 2002 free agent Ray Durham. "We do not want to move Jose Valentin around as much as we did last season," says Williams. Right now, the plan is for Valentin to play third until Joe Crede is ready. If Durham were moved, Valentin could play second, but that is the smoke of a distant fire.



If Crede isn't ready this year, kiss his career as a Major League Baseball player goodbye.

czalgosz
12-02-2001, 11:55 AM
Well, if Valentin is on the Sox next season, he deserves to play every day, and I don't see where else he's going to play. And besides, it's Gammons, and he has been wrong many, many times in the past.

:boston

"I have my sources"

Jerry_Manuel
12-02-2001, 11:59 AM
Originally posted by czalgosz
Well, if Valentin is on the Sox next season, he deserves to play every day, and I don't see where else he's going to play. And besides, it's Gammons, and he has been wrong many, many times in the past.


Considering he talked to Williams I'll believe him.

FarWestChicago
12-02-2001, 12:18 PM
:KW

I have a plan!

:reinsy

And it doesn't involve spending money!

PaleHoseGeorge
12-02-2001, 12:49 PM
Originally posted by KempersRS
If Crede isn't ready this year, kiss his career as a Major League Baseball player goodbye.

IMO, it has already happened. If the Sox were serious about Crede, he would have been playing last September after Cleveland wiped out our season.

Crede = the next Tony Graffanino.

His best hope is to get traded. Even then, he'll probably be nothing but a utilityman.

Had Crede made the show in 1999 or 2000, the story would be entirely different. But now it's 2002 and his ship has sailed.

Crede knows it, too. He would probably love a trade.

GASHWOUND
12-02-2001, 05:37 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge

Crede = the next Tony Graffanino.

Ohh, now that harsh. But I think he'll be better than Graffy. Crede put up huge #'s in the minors and thats all I can go on right now. Graffy never had seasons like Crede had in the minors. Now that I'm thinking of it, was Graffy ever a minor league guy? I don't know the baseball hsitory of the Graff man. But I'm sure he'll become a better player than Graffy. Just my opinion

Chisox_cali
12-02-2001, 05:53 PM
Hopefully the Dodgers will take Royce off our hands and it will all work out Valentin at his real position and Crede finally getting his well-deserved shot

PaleHoseGeorge
12-02-2001, 06:37 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali
Hopefully the Dodgers will take Royce off our hands and it will all work out Valentin at his real position and Crede finally getting his well-deserved shot

Isn't it amazing how one totally f***ed up trade screws up a dozen other things, too?

:KW
"If you think I was an idiot because I traded for Royce Clayton, I agree."

Chisox_cali
12-02-2001, 06:49 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


Isn't it amazing how one totally f***ed up trade screws up a dozen other things, too?

:KW
"If you think I was an idiot because I traded for Royce Clayton, I agree."

If we could get off a trade with the dodgers honest to god I would not care who the hell we got in return

doublem23
12-02-2001, 07:12 PM
Originally posted by Chisox_cali
If we could get off a trade with the dodgers honest to god I would not care who the hell we got in return

I'd be happy with a box of used baseballs and some old Los Angeles Raider T-shirts.

Chisox_cali
12-02-2001, 07:37 PM
Originally posted by doublem23


I'd be happy with a box of used baseballs and some old Los Angeles Raider T-shirts.


http://dodgers.mlb.com/la/photo/62x75/evans.jpg
"I think that can be arranged, we alreay got a few of you anyways"

http://dodgers.mlb.com/la/photo/ph_play_mugshot_150316.jpg
http://espn.go.com/i/mlb/profiles/players/5344.jpg
"Follow the light Royce"

RedPinStripes
12-02-2001, 11:01 PM
Originally posted by PaleHoseGeorge


Isn't it amazing how one totally f***ed up trade screws up a dozen other things, too?

:KW
"If you think I was an idiot because I traded for Royce Clayton, I agree."

Damn right phg. It's a toss up between who screws things up more. Valentine, or Clayton. I'm not a fan of Clayton, but Valentine is terrrible at any defensive postition. Clayton plays good SS, but I really think he's bad for the team.

Crede is really getting the shaft here because Valentine has to play somewhere no matter what. Valentine should be at 2b. His worse position is third and it really pisses me off to see Valentine making errors at 3rd while Crede rotts on the bench.

This is White Sox management though. They know what they're doing.

:KW
"I was a terrible 3rd baseman, but I know what we need at 3b. Joe will get his time. After Jose makes 40 errors at 3b and Liefer forgets how to play the game."

MarqSox
12-02-2001, 11:14 PM
Originally posted by ComiskeyBum


Damn right phg. It's a toss up between who screws things up more. Valentine, or Clayton. I'm not a fan of Clayton, but Valentine is terrrible at any defensive postition.

:manos
It's Valentin gosh darnit. Valentine is 1) the bum in a Mets jersey, or 2) one of those Elmo cards 4th grade kids give each other.

Valentin makes a whole lot of errors, but it's because he gets to a whole lot of balls up the middle. It has been well documented in this forum that of the 90 or so errors Manos has made the last two seasons, only about 4 or 5 have really had an impact on the game. Considering how many times he's come through in the clutch at the plate, I'd say he's a fine leader for this team.

:hitless
I am a fool.

RedPinStripes
12-02-2001, 11:40 PM
Originally posted by MarqSox


:manos
It's Valentin gosh darnit. Valentine is 1) the bum in a Mets jersey, or 2) one of those Elmo cards 4th grade kids give each other.

Valentin makes a whole lot of errors, but it's because he gets to a whole lot of balls up the middle. It has been well documented in this forum that of the 90 or so errors Manos has made the last two seasons, only about 4 or 5 have really had an impact on the game. Considering how many times he's come through in the clutch at the plate, I'd say he's a fine leader for this team.

:hitless
I am a fool.


No matter how you spell his name he still sucks at SS. Yeah, he gets the deep balls in the hole, but boots routine balls. As far as how many errors effect the game is pure luck. Errors are never good and can go either way. I don't know about you, but I don't want Jose at SS in the ALCS vs. the yanks up by a run in the 9th with 2 on and 1 out.

Jerry_Manuel
12-02-2001, 11:59 PM
Originally posted by ComiskeyBum
I don't know about you, but I don't want Jose at SS in the ALCS vs. the yanks up by a run in the 9th with 2 on and 1 out.

We won't have to worry about that.

doublem23
12-03-2001, 12:21 AM
Originally posted by ComiskeyBum
I don't know about you, but I don't want Jose at SS in the ALCS vs. the yanks up by a run in the 9th with 2 on and 1 out.

I'd rather have him at the plate in the ALCS than most other shortstops... especially The Choice.

Nellie_Fox
12-03-2001, 12:55 AM
Originally posted by doublem23
I'd rather have him at the plate in the ALCS than most other shortstops... especially The Choice.

Shortstop isn't about what you do at the plate. I'm always amazed at how much emphasis is put on offense by posters here. Championships are won with pitching and defense. It has always been that way and always will be. About the only places you can really put up with defensive limitations are left field and first base (and the problem at first had better only be range, not being able to catch what's thrown your way.)

I like Jose's guts, and he's a great clutch hitter, but he has kicked way too many ground balls that were hit right at him. I'm tired of hearing the lame "he makes a lot of those errors on balls most shortstops don't get to." I'll admit I don't get to see as many games as you guys, but I rarely miss a WGN game, and most of the boots I've seen him make are not on hard chances. The Sox have too many designated hitters.

Mathew
12-03-2001, 03:06 AM
Originally posted by Nellie_Fox


Shortstop isn't about what you do at the plate. I'm always amazed at how much emphasis is put on offense by posters here. Championships are won with pitching and defense. It has always been that way and always will be. About the only places you can really put up with defensive limitations are left field and first base (and the problem at first had better only be range, not being able to catch what's thrown your way.)

I like Jose's guts, and he's a great clutch hitter, but he has kicked way too many ground balls that were hit right at him. I'm tired of hearing the lame "he makes a lot of those errors on balls most shortstops don't get to." I'll admit I don't get to see as many games as you guys, but I rarely miss a WGN game, and most of the boots I've seen him make are not on hard chances. The Sox have too many designated hitters.

Is Derek Jeter winning championships with his Defence? I actually think baseball is won with speed. So every fan and coach values it differently and there is evidence to support any argument. I've been to the table on this argument before and feel that on any given day opposing teams would rather see Clayton in our line up than Valentin, whom I have aligned myself with. I will never consider Clayton as anything other than a steaming pile of pigschit. If Clayton is better, why does nobody want him? I think other teams would take Valentin.

Kilroy
12-03-2001, 09:40 AM
Originally posted by Mathew
Is Derek Jeter winning championships with his Defence?

It doesn't matter if his D wins it. But it damn sure isn't contributing to losing. Nellie's got it right. Pitching and defense.
It doesn't matter how much we mash the ball if we can't get the other team out.

RedPinStripes
12-03-2001, 10:51 AM
Originally posted by Kilroy


It doesn't matter if his D wins it. But it damn sure isn't contributing to losing. Nellie's got it right. Pitching and defense.
It doesn't matter how much we mash the ball if we can't get the other team out.


Thank you.

duke of dorwood
12-03-2001, 10:57 AM
:hitless

I truly am the gift that keeps on giving