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socko82
08-01-2005, 11:16 AM
More E(astCoast) SPN nonsense. This morning on Mike & Mike they spent a great deal of time talking about the great July Jason Giambi has had. Best month by a Yankee since Mickey Mantle and how you have to give him credit for admitting his mistakes, toughing it out and coming back. They continued to rave how everyone can see now that he wasn't just a chemically produced freak because these stats are obviously clean. Sorry, I know ESPN has become a mouthpiece for the YES network but why does he deserve any credit? There's no proof he's clean. They still don't test for HGH, he lied and cheated before so why should anyone believe him now and just coincidentally his whole turnound started around the same time the Yanks went to Oakland and he was able to make a quick run to BALCO. The same dopes who were booing him out of town a month ago are now begging him for curtain calls. Once a liar, cheat and freak always a liar, cheat and freak and he deserves ZERO credit.

A_ROW33
08-01-2005, 11:19 AM
Also... It's one month. So he got hot, how does one hot streak legitimize a career?

DuckSnort
08-01-2005, 11:19 AM
I think he's due for some "random testing"

LuvSox
08-01-2005, 11:30 AM
If he's such a great guy he can prove it by giving back the 2000 mvp award.

balke
08-01-2005, 11:35 AM
"Giam-bino" is the most blasphemous nickname in the history of sports.

Even if he's "Back" for good, the guy is a non-story. Its not something special that means he's overcome something. All it is is a cheat learning he could've been good legally all along. I hope he's gone from baseball next year.

fquaye149
08-01-2005, 12:17 PM
"Giam-bino" is the most blasphemous nickname in the history of sports.

Even if he's "Back" for good, the guy is a non-story. Its not something special that means he's overcome something. All it is is a cheat learning he could've been good legally all along. I hope he's gone from baseball next year.
Blasphemic nicknames?

What about Mark "Son of God" Prior?

rowand33
08-01-2005, 12:56 PM
I'm pulling for Giambi.

I was very happy to see him hit his 300th homer.

This guy at least owned up to his steroid use.

Palmeiro got caught and still denied it.

And because of Giambi's honesty, he took the fall for everybody. Bonds, Sosa... these guys didn't feel the heat too much. Giambi felt it all this winter.

I hope he hits 30 homers and is comeback player of the year.

fquaye149
08-01-2005, 12:59 PM
I'm pulling for Giambi.

I was very happy to see him hit his 300th homer.

This guy at least owned up to his steroid use.

Palmeiro got caught and still denied it.

And because of Giambi's honesty, he took the fall for everybody. Bonds, Sosa... these guys didn't feel the heat too much. Giambi felt it all this winter.

I hope he hits 30 homers and is comeback player of the year.

He didn't admit ****. He campaigned for his 2000 MVP.

I hope he tears a hamstring in half. (no I don't).

But I sure don't hope he hits 30 homers

chuckn98229
08-01-2005, 12:59 PM
ESPN needs to relocate their facilities to somewhere in Kansas and require that their genius analysts live there. Maybe it would help the mediots get a better perspective on everything.

socko82
08-01-2005, 01:07 PM
I'm pulling for Giambi.

I was very happy to see him hit his 300th homer.

This guy at least owned up to his steroid use.

Palmeiro got caught and still denied it.

And because of Giambi's honesty, he took the fall for everybody. Bonds, Sosa... these guys didn't feel the heat too much. Giambi felt it all this winter.

I hope he hits 30 homers and is comeback player of the year.

He owned up to nothing! He apologized but didn't say for what. He never would have admitted to anything if he wasn't under oath in front of a grand jury. He stole the 2000 MVP award and spent the first 2 months of this year crying. As long as they don't test for Human Growth Hormone there is no reason to believe he's suddenly seen the light and is clean.

DrGiggles
08-01-2005, 01:11 PM
He's doing a great job, how do you blame people for praising him. If it was Konerko doing this or even Thomas our reporters would do the same.

Lip Man 1
08-01-2005, 01:20 PM
Who cares what they say?

Lip

rowand33
08-01-2005, 02:09 PM
He owned up to nothing! He apologized but didn't say for what. He never would have admitted to anything if he wasn't under oath in front of a grand jury. He stole the 2000 MVP award and spent the first 2 months of this year crying. As long as they don't test for Human Growth Hormone there is no reason to believe he's suddenly seen the light and is clean.

considering the guy is still being treated for his health problems last year, I find it a little hard to believe he'd be doing HGH.

He apologized, but really couldn't say what it was for. At least it was an apology. Look at guys like Raffy, Rincon, Sanchez.

deny, deny, deny.

you guys are all just still bitter aobut the 2000 MVP. let it go. hating jason won't get Frank another MVP.

balke
08-01-2005, 02:14 PM
considering the guy is still being treated for his health problems last year, I find it a little hard to believe he'd be doing HGH.

He apologized, but really couldn't say what it was for. At least it was an apology. Look at guys like Raffy, Rincon, Sanchez.

deny, deny, deny.

you guys are all just still bitter aobut the 2000 MVP. let it go. hating jason won't get Frank another MVP.


I don't know how you can defend this jag. HE USED BALCO. HE NEVER APOLOGIZED FOR USING STEROIDS. All he did was apologize in general, with no specifics. IF you want someone who admitted it, look to Sheffield. He said he used it on accident, but at least he fessed up. He's the only one to confess to anything.

Giambi is a roid monster, nothing more, nothing less. He's also a sellout to all of Oakland. I forgive him for nothing, and hate him regardless of the 2000 season.

Irishsox1
08-01-2005, 02:37 PM
Giambi is a scumbag and he should and will be viewed as a cheater for the rest of his career.

ChiSoxRowand
08-01-2005, 03:28 PM
Here is the reason Giambi is doing so well. That stupidass home run porch in right field at Yankee Stadium. If he played at most other parks he would have half the home runs(if that).

PaulDrake
08-01-2005, 03:43 PM
I'm pulling for Giambi.

I was very happy to see him hit his 300th homer.

This guy at least owned up to his steroid use.

Palmeiro got caught and still denied it.

And because of Giambi's honesty, he took the fall for everybody. Bonds, Sosa... these guys didn't feel the heat too much. Giambi felt it all this winter.

I hope he hits 30 homers and is comeback player of the year. Why not Joe Crede or Scott Podsednik or El Duque comeback player of the year? Your support of this guy mystifies me.

jackbrohamer
08-01-2005, 03:44 PM
He apologized, but really couldn't say what it was for. At least it was an apology.

He certainly could have said what he was talking about. It was a pathetic non-apology so fans would quit booing him. He's a dirty ballplayer and unless they urine test him every week there's no reason for me to assume that he is clean.

rowand33
08-01-2005, 03:48 PM
Why not Joe Crede or Scott Podsednik or El Duque comeback player of the year? Your support of this guy mystifies me.

what? what are they coming back from?

El Duque was 8-2 last year. he came back last yaer. Pods wasn't good last year, but is a guy that stole 70 bases last year having a come back? Crede was never there how could he come back?

Those three aren't eligible for this award. A guy like Widger is more likely to win than any of those guys. He was out of baseball.

the home team bias on this thread is amazing.

soltrain21
08-01-2005, 03:56 PM
what? what are they coming back from?

El Duque was 8-2 last year. he came back last yaer. Pods wasn't good last year, but is a guy that stole 70 bases last year having a come back? Crede was never there how could he come back?

Those three aren't eligible for this award. A guy like Widger is more likely to win than any of those guys. He was out of baseball.

the home team bias on this thread is amazing.


Your blind loyality to the drillrod known as Giambi is the thing that is amazing. Hope he gets to 300 homeruns? Why? How many of those homeruns are "clean" homeruns? NONE.


Giambi isn't "coming back" from anything, either. He had a tumor, and that sucks...BUT MAYBE HE SHOULDN'T HAVE TAKEN ILLEGAL SUBSTANCES TO GIVE HIM ONE IN THE FIRST PLACE.

socko82
08-01-2005, 03:59 PM
what? what are they coming back from?

El Duque was 8-2 last year. he came back last yaer. Pods wasn't good last year, but is a guy that stole 70 bases last year having a come back? Crede was never there how could he come back?

Those three aren't eligible for this award. A guy like Widger is more likely to win than any of those guys. He was out of baseball.

the home team bias on this thread is amazing.

So a guy juices up, drags baseball through the mud, screws over all the clean players who continually had lie and cover for his cheating ass, lies and cons his way into a hundred million dollar contract where he demands no steroid clauses and now you want to give him an award for that? I guess Sammy deserved an award for coming back from corking his bat too.

That's a real home team bias.

fquaye149
08-01-2005, 04:05 PM
what? what are they coming back from?

El Duque was 8-2 last year. he came back last yaer. Pods wasn't good last year, but is a guy that stole 70 bases last year having a come back? Crede was never there how could he come back?

Those three aren't eligible for this award. A guy like Widger is more likely to win than any of those guys. He was out of baseball.

the home team bias on this thread is amazing.

They're coming back from not being douchebags.

Giambi is trash. He is equal to Bonds, Palmeiro, Sosa, McGwire, Canseco, Caminiti and all the other dirtbag cheaters in baseball. Choose your heroes more carefully.

rowand33
08-01-2005, 04:17 PM
They're coming back from not being douchebags.

Giambi is trash. He is equal to Bonds, Palmeiro, Sosa, McGwire, Canseco, Caminiti and all the other dirtbag cheaters in baseball. Choose your heroes more carefully.

Giambi is FAR from being a hero of mine.

It's not blind loyalty guys, it's sympathy and compassion. And forgiveness. He is a class above the guys that just ignored their problem like Bonds and Sosa, and the way the media treated him earlier this year was ridiculous. Bonds should have been the story. Not Giambi.

So yeah, I hope the guy does well. Sorry.

And the home team bias comes in from the fact that a) I am certain that you guys would not hate this guy so much if it wasn't for the 2000 MVP.
b) and then there's PaulDrake's post, which is just a dumb comment. it's like if this was a cub board and somebody said "Wait, what about Derrek Lee for comeback player of the year?"

just because people are doing better than a year ago, doesn't mean they're a "comeback player"

breaking out and coming back=2 different things.

anyways, enough of that tangent

the bottom line is, I pity the guy. nothing anybody can say will change the fact that, despite the fact he took steroids, I feel bad for him.
You guys speak of him as if he's Hitler.
I can't believe I'm alone on this. Just about everybody I know in "real" life feels the same way I do.

oh, and FWI, he hit his 300th HR yesterday, socko

balke
08-01-2005, 04:21 PM
I can't believe I'm alone on this. Just about everybody I know in "real" life feels the same way I do.

oh, and FWI, he hit his 300th HR yesterday, socko


I don't know anyone who feels sorry for Giambi. You must live in New York or something. What's he a hero of? Look at that Degree commercial he's in for god's sakes, he looks like his shirt is going to rip. That's not natural muscle, there's nothing natural about him. Like someone already mentioned, its most likely all his health problems are connected with steroid use. You're entitled to like whoever you want, it just doesn't make sense to a lot of people. There's nothing that I can see personally to feel sorry about, he was getting what he deserved when he was playing horribly IMO.

socko82
08-01-2005, 04:34 PM
I don't know anyone who feels sorry for Giambi. You must live in New York or something. .


Not New York, Bristol.

chaerulez
08-01-2005, 04:36 PM
Giambi never flat out admitted that he took steroids. He said he was sorry, but he wouldn't say what he was sorry for. There's no reason to feel sorry for him. Support him if you want, but your supporting a tool that ranks up in the dochue bag region of Bonds and Sosa. And yes, if he's truly sorry he can hand over the 2000 MVP to Frank Thomas.

PaulDrake
08-01-2005, 04:57 PM
Ah woan post any mo heah cuz I'm kinda dum. Still doan care much for that feller Gee am bee.

SOXPHILE
08-01-2005, 05:22 PM
Hey Einstein, Giambi apologized because he was caught. If he hadn't been caught, he would never have apologized. Besides, this piece of crap hasn't admitted to ANYTHING. When he "apologized", he never said what it was for.

Vernam
08-01-2005, 05:27 PM
"Giam-bino" is the most blasphemous nickname in the history of sports.Yeah, I wanted to gag when I heard some ESPN hack say that. Here's a scary thought: How many HRs would Babe have had if he'd been juiced?

VC

fquaye149
08-01-2005, 05:43 PM
Giambi is FAR from being a hero of mine.

It's not blind loyalty guys, it's sympathy and compassion. And forgiveness. He is a class above the guys that just ignored their problem like Bonds and Sosa, and the way the media treated him earlier this year was ridiculous. Bonds should have been the story. Not Giambi.

So yeah, I hope the guy does well. Sorry.

And the home team bias comes in from the fact that a) I am certain that you guys would not hate this guy so much if it wasn't for the 2000 MVP.
b) and then there's PaulDrake's post, which is just a dumb comment. it's like if this was a cub board and somebody said "Wait, what about Derrek Lee for comeback player of the year?"

just because people are doing better than a year ago, doesn't mean they're a "comeback player"

breaking out and coming back=2 different things.

anyways, enough of that tangent

the bottom line is, I pity the guy. nothing anybody can say will change the fact that, despite the fact he took steroids, I feel bad for him.
You guys speak of him as if he's Hitler.
I can't believe I'm alone on this. Just about everybody I know in "real" life feels the same way I do.

oh, and FWI, he hit his 300th HR yesterday, socko

forgive Rose first. At least he admitted he did something wrong instead of apologizing in case he might have once did something wrong.

Yeah Giambi's a fall-guy...but guess what: fall-guys usually were just as wrong as the guys who got covered up for.

:whiner: 96 tears for giambino

fquaye149
08-01-2005, 05:46 PM
Yeah, I wanted to gag when I heard some ESPN hack say that. Here's a scary thought: How many HRs would Babe have had if he'd been juiced?

VC

I don't know. Once you subtract the home runs he wouldn't have hit if he had been

a.) facing pitchers who could hit mid 90's on the gun
b.) facing pitchers who could throw more than two pitches
c.) facing pitchers who threw a sinker, a slider, a knuckler, a split-finger
d.) facing black pitchers

I think you're about even.

Before you discount point c.) and say Bambino would have adjusted keep in mind that Carl Hubbel OWNED Ruth for the duration of his career. The screwball had him baffled. I'm sure the slider and the sinker would have owned him just as much.

chaerulez
08-01-2005, 06:42 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/columns/story?columnist=olney_buster&id=2121915

Interesting take from Buster Olney, on espn.com today:

(Along the same lines: Now that the BALCO case is resolved, we'd love to hear from Jason Giambi (http://sports.espn.go.com/mlb/players/profile?statsId=5386) about his steroid use. Remember how he said the ongoing court proceeding was the reason -- wink-wink -- he couldn't talk about steroids? Or he could simply come out and say he can't talk about it because of his existing contract, rather than referring to his civic responsibility.)

At least someone in ESPN has common sense...

wxkid23
08-01-2005, 06:52 PM
Has anyone else noticed (maybe it's my imagination) that Giambi has seemed to get "bigger" the last couple of months? At the beginning of the year he looked very skinny and was hitting very few hr's. Over a month ago I mentioned to a friend he was looking bigger and questioned if he had gone back on the juice (or HGH) .. sure enough a month later he is hitting hr's like crazy. I don't know how the steroid use (if he is doing it again) would affect his ongoing health problems. It is just in my observation he seems to have grown larger the last several weeks again.

seanpmurphy
08-01-2005, 06:54 PM
Guys I am sorry. So sorry. I can't tell you how sorry I am. Sorry for what? Doesn't matter. I'm sorry.

That's not an apology, that's BS. A Big BS Cake that ESPN and Rowand33 ate up with a side of ice cream. Giambi is a loser. Feeling sorry for his health problems is equal to feeling sorry for the heroin addict who is 15 pound underweight, has suffered all types of hepatitis and AIDs from sharing needles, and whatever else comes with going down that road. An illegal substance is an illegal substance. He's not even a man. A man would have just came out and said STEROIDS at least once in his endless apologies. In fact, a real man wouldn't stoop to doping himself up just to hit a ball farther.

Giambi is a piece of s*** no matter where you draw the line. I hope his career ends and he is forever remembered as a joke in the annals of baseball history along with his roid buddies sosa, bonds, canseco, palmeiro, and everyone else.

-One very upset, Sean Murphy :angry:

seanpmurphy
08-01-2005, 06:56 PM
Has anyone else noticed (maybe it's my imagination) that Giambi has seemed to get "bigger" the last couple of months? At the beginning of the year he looked very skinny and was hitting very few hr's. Over a month ago I mentioned to a friend he was looking bigger and questioned if he had gone back on the juice (or HGH) .. sure enough a month later he is hitting hr's like crazy. I don't know how the steroid use (if he is doing it again) would affect his ongoing health problems. It is just in my observation he seems to have grown larger the last several weeks again.

OH MAN DUDE IT'S PROTEIN BARS AND WHEY!!! COMPLETELY NATURAL!!! MAYBE EVEN SOME GNC RIPPED FUEL!!

Yeah I agree. Giambi looked like he had shrunk(shrank?) and now he's all of a sudden a power house again? He probably waited for the dut to settle and got back on it thinking "well, they won't test me again!" cause yes, I believe he really is that big of an idiot.

wxkid23
08-01-2005, 06:59 PM
OH MAN DUDE IT'S PROTEIN BARS AND WHEY!!! COMPLETELY NATURAL!!! MAYBE EVEN SOME GNC RIPPED FUEL!!

Yeah I agree. Giambi looked like he had shrunk(shrank?) and now he's all of a sudden a power house again? He probably waited for the dut to settle and got back on it thinking "well, they won't test me again!" cause yes, I believe he really is that big of an idiot.

That and the fact that he was getting ripped apart by the NY media and fans every day. Remember back in May??? He was extremely close to being sent to AAA. It just makes me wonder if he decided the coast was clear and he just coulden't take the heat anymore.

PaulDrake
08-01-2005, 06:59 PM
Before you discount point c.) and say Bambino would have adjusted keep in mind that Carl Hubbel OWNED Ruth for the duration of his career. The screwball had him baffled. I'm sure the slider and the sinker would have owned him just as much. When did Hubbell face Ruth other than possibly in spring training, in one or more of the 28 games he played for the Braves in 1935, or that famous 1934 All Star game where Hubbell struck out Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Jimmy Foxx, Al Simmons and Joe Cronin consecutively?

Guess I lied about not posting again here. I never took illegal steroids though.

spanishwhite
08-01-2005, 07:03 PM
I don't know how you can defend this jag. HE USED BALCO. HE NEVER APOLOGIZED FOR USING STEROIDS. All he did was apologize in general, with no specifics. IF you want someone who admitted it, look to Sheffield. He said he used it on accident, but at least he fessed up. He's the only one to confess to anything.

Giambi is a roid monster, nothing more, nothing less. He's also a sellout to all of Oakland. I forgive him for nothing, and hate him regardless of the 2000 season.

He couldnt say anything because of the Balco case.

He is much lighter than previous years, so this tear is more than likely w/o roids.

But he is a sellout and it was petty for him to campaign for the MVP he won.

MRKARNO
08-01-2005, 09:01 PM
I dislike Giambi for stealing Frank's 2000 MVP award, but I am very interested in what he's doing this year. I think a lot of this controversy over steroids and their effect on the game has been overblown significantly (which isn't to say that they haven't affected the game, they have, but they probably didn't affect the game as much as lowering the pitchers mound did or the advent of smaller ballparks around baseball). I think they help out in one key area: turning a higher percentage of flyballs into HRs, which probably enabled the ultra-high HR totals that we saw. But that doesnt change a batter's eye, which is one of the more important aspects of a hitter's offensive game. I also don't think that the extra HRs of a few players totally accounts for the higher offensive numbers that we saw over the past 10 years or so.

Giambi is an interesting test case. Can he repeat his late 90's/early 2000's numbers with the exception of the HR? It appears that he can. The slugging is down a bit in this year, but his OBP is an astounding .445 and that cannot be attributed to him being pitched around with only 19 HRs.

PeteWard
08-01-2005, 09:42 PM
Yeah, I wanted to gag when I heard some ESPN hack say that. Here's a scary thought: How many HRs would Babe have had if he'd been juiced?

VC

Even more if he hadn't been juiced...

on martinis!!!!!:D:

Chisox003
08-01-2005, 09:47 PM
When I first glanced at the title of this thread I thought it said "Giant Rat"

Oh sweet irony

The Racehorse
08-02-2005, 10:36 AM
I don't hate Jason Giambi... just his illegal drug using guts.

fquaye149
08-02-2005, 11:41 AM
When did Hubbell face Ruth other than possibly in spring training, in one or more of the 28 games he played for the Braves in 1935, or that famous 1934 All Star game where Hubbell struck out Babe Ruth, Lou Gehrig, Jimmy Foxx, Al Simmons and Joe Cronin consecutively?

Guess I lied about not posting again here. I never took illegal steroids though.

really, I'm not sure on it...and am not sure how to go about looking it up, but I remember reading that Ruth had about 30 at bats against Hubbell previous to that infamous all star game and have about a .220 hitter in them.

FWIW

PaulDrake
08-02-2005, 03:01 PM
really, I'm not sure on it...and am not sure how to go about looking it up, but I remember reading that Ruth had about 30 at bats against Hubbell previous to that infamous all star game and have about a .220 hitter in them.

FWIW The only time Ruth could have faced Hubbell, other than in the 1934 All Star game or in spring training would have been in his final year 1935, when he played for the Boston Braves. The Babe appeared in 28 games and had a grand total of 72 at bats in his final season. Retrosheet.org does not yet have box scores for that season, they only go back to 1960. In any case, there was no interleague play back then. Ruth was in the AL from 1914-1934 and Hubbell spent his entire career (1928-1943) with the New York Giants. Hubbell "owned" the AL lineup in that famous 1934 All Star game. To say Hubbell "owned" Ruth would only be true if he did it in spring training games.

fquaye149
08-02-2005, 03:04 PM
The only time Ruth could have faced Hubbell, other than in the 1934 All Star game or in spring training would have been in his final year 1935, when he played for the Boston Braves. The Babe appeared in 28 games and had a grand total of 72 at bats in his final season. Retrosheet.org does not yet have box scores for that season, they only go back to 1960. In any case, there was no interleague play back then. Ruth was in the AL from 1914-1934 and Hubbell spent his entire career (1928-1940) with the New York Giants. Hubbell "owned" the AL lineup in that famous 1934 All Star game. To say Hubbell "owned" Ruth would only be true if he did it in spring training games.

I don't dispute what you say. But I do remember reading what I read. At some point I will go back home where I have that book and quote it for you. Otherwise if there's a site online that would show head to head matchups like that, I'll go there and look for it if you could direct me to it.

edit: Inevitably, however, my point remains that Babe Ruth's power numbers are Babe Ruth's power numbers just as, say Frank Thomas' power numbers are Frank's. They don't quite compare across generations. If you say Ruth would have benefited from increased training and medical advancements, likewise he would have been hurt by improved pitching and playing against blacks and hispanics.

voodoochile
08-02-2005, 03:13 PM
He owned up to nothing! He apologized but didn't say for what. He never would have admitted to anything if he wasn't under oath in front of a grand jury. He stole the 2000 MVP award and spent the first 2 months of this year crying. As long as they don't test for Human Growth Hormone there is no reason to believe he's suddenly seen the light and is clean.

He didn't just steal the award, he effectively stole millions of dollars due Frank Thomas and stuffed them in his pocket...

voodoochile
08-02-2005, 03:16 PM
what? what are they coming back from?

El Duque was 8-2 last year. he came back last yaer. Pods wasn't good last year, but is a guy that stole 70 bases last year having a come back? Crede was never there how could he come back?

Those three aren't eligible for this award. A guy like Widger is more likely to win than any of those guys. He was out of baseball.

the home team bias on this thread is amazing.

NONE of those players are steroid using jackasses...

Giambi can go suck raw eggs for all I care.

I ragged some NY fan the other day, "I see someone found Giambi's needle." He responded by flipping me the bird, but he didn't try to deny it.