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View Full Version : Who to choose, the benefits of hindsight


DumpJerry
07-24-2005, 07:05 PM
I read today where when the first amateur draft was held in 1965, the Sox had the 17th pick overall. Available before and after the Sox pick were, among others, Nolan Ryan and Johnny Bench. The guy the Sox picked up went nowhere with baseball (career BA was under .200).

So, let's go back in time. Who do you chose, Ryan or Bench? I'm inclined to take Bench. A great catcher can make the pitching staff rise to the occasion while a stud pitcher can stop a losing streak, but otherwise be a rose in an onion field. Since this was before free agency, you can't use the argument that we could have signed stud players with the lure of playing with Nolan Ryan.

Finally, Johnny Bench never threw a punch at Robin Ventura.

Who would you have chosen?

SOXintheBURGH
07-24-2005, 07:27 PM
I read today where when the first amateur draft was held in 1965, the Sox had the 17th pick overall. Available before and after the Sox pick were, among others, Nolan Ryan and Johnny Bench. The guy the Sox picked up went nowhere with baseball (career BA was under .200).

So, let's go back in time. Who do you chose, Ryan or Bench? I'm inclined to take Bench. A great catcher can make the pitching staff rise to the occasion while a stud pitcher can stop a losing streak, but otherwise be a rose in an onion field. Since this was before free agency, you can't use the argument that we could have signed stud players with the lure of playing with Nolan Ryan.

Finally, Johnny Bench never threw a punch at Robin Ventura.

Who would you have chosen?

Jonny Bench.

Ryan is a career .500 pitcher.

DumpJerry
07-24-2005, 07:38 PM
Jonny Bench.

Ryan is a career .500 pitcher.
Ryan played on some less-than desirable teams. Bench was on The Big Red Machine. But then, maybe that proves my point about how valuable a great catcher can be.

Chips
07-24-2005, 07:51 PM
NOLAN RYAN

TaylorStSox
07-24-2005, 08:00 PM
No question about it. You take Bench in that situation. Ryan struck guys out but IIRC he's just above .500 in his career, walked a ton of guys, never won a Cy Young and only won 20 games once.

ChiSoxPatF
07-24-2005, 08:04 PM
Using hindsight as it is, you'd have to go with Bench. While I'm always inclined to argue for pitching those Sox teams could have really used Bench's bat.

D. TODD
07-24-2005, 08:14 PM
Johnny Bench without a doubt!!!!!!!

owensmouth
07-24-2005, 08:30 PM
Remember all those homers that Bench hit? He wouldn't have at old Comiskey.

Daver
07-24-2005, 08:34 PM
Remember all those homers that Bench hit? He wouldn't have at old Comiskey.

And this matters why?

Catcher is a defensive position.

mr_genius
07-24-2005, 08:46 PM
And this matters why?

Catcher is a defensive position.

having a player that has good offensive production at a defensive position is always a huge bonus (assuming he can field his position)


:fireshoop


had to add a picture of shoop for good measure

kojak
07-24-2005, 08:52 PM
How many championships did Ryan win? Zero

Bench and it isn't even close

akingamongstmen
07-24-2005, 09:53 PM
How many championships did Ryan win? Zero

Bench and it isn't even close

What he said.

Frater Perdurabo
07-24-2005, 10:01 PM
In hindsight, you take Ryan. He may have had a near .500 career record, but that's more a reflection of the teams for which he toiled. Many of the home runs he did surrender would have been long flyouts in Comiskey Park. His 3.19 career ERA might have been even lower if he had played, say, ten years for the White Sox. Sigh....

Chips
07-24-2005, 10:48 PM
How many championships did Ryan win? Zero

Bench and it isn't even close

Not to say he was an integral part, but Nolan Ryan did have a save and a 0.00 ERA in 2 and a third innings in the 1969 New York Mets World Championship season.

elrod
07-24-2005, 10:58 PM
Ryan struggled with his control for the first few years of his career. He didn't really take off until he was traded by the Mets. He played on some solid Mets teams (1969-1971) but couldn't really fill out the rotation with Koos, Seaver and Gentry the way people thought. Then he went to the Angels and became a stud.

soxwon
07-24-2005, 11:02 PM
I hated the Big Red machine-Bench rose perez pleaseeeeeeeeeeeeeeeeee

ThatGuyOnTheL
07-24-2005, 11:20 PM
Bench, and the reasons why have already been stated far better (by multiple WSI members) than I could hope to do in a single post.

Tragg
07-24-2005, 11:42 PM
Ryan played on some less-than desirable teams.

He didn't play on that bad of teams. Certainly better Burt Blyleven and Gaylord Perry played for. Only a few of the teams he played for were really terrible (below 70 wins) and during the latter half of his career (1978 on) he played primarily for winning and playoff teams.

Ryan's a longevity and a highlight reel hall of famer. But even on those good Astros teams, he wasn't the real ace: James Rodney Richard was the ace in 1980 and Mike Scott was the ace in 1986.

DumpJerry
07-24-2005, 11:55 PM
Sounds like Bench is the concensus choice here. Of course, drafting one or two studs does not mean you will win it all. After all, the Bears got Butkus and Sayers in the same draft and look at those teams they played on............

Then there is the fact that Joe Montana was drafted by the Niner's in the THIRD ROUND. Everyone passed on him. Chumps.