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View Full Version : *Official* Dustin's Back is Back--post game thread


UofCSoxFan
07-24-2005, 06:24 PM
A white sox winner....a yeeeeeeeeeeeeees

NSSoxFan
07-24-2005, 06:24 PM
Marte scared me.

Dustin is looking good.

Great game by Pods and Iguchi.

Great pitching by Jose.

:)

Madvora
07-24-2005, 06:24 PM
Anyone notice how Hawk was being a LOT more critical of Marte during this game?

He was pissed. You think he know that's Marte's already gone or something?

SABRSox
07-24-2005, 06:25 PM
Way to come back and get the split. Now let's go sweep KC!

So.ILSoxFan
07-24-2005, 06:25 PM
Pods coming up with some big D today :gulp:

soltrain21
07-24-2005, 06:25 PM
Anybody notice at the end of the game that all three of our outfielders stepped on 2nd base before high fiving anyone? That is the first time I have ever seen them do that, but I never really pay attention.


Anyways....screw Marte and screw that smug look he had when he was leaving the mound.

ChiSoxPatF
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
Big W!

NSSoxFan
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
Anyone notice how Hawk was being a LOT more critical of Marte during this game?

He was pissed. You think he know that's Marte's already gone or something?

Coop was none to happy with Marte as you might guess. It looked like he was chewing him out good on that mound visit.

Rocklive99
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
I wanted Hermy to start that inning, but he picked up Marte big time.

DickAllen72
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
Goodbye Marte!

Why did we get rid of Shingo again???

skobabe8
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
forecast for tonight: clear skies! :D:

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:26 PM
Good way to cap a good series for us. Said it in the game thread, but I consider this series a good one. We beat them solidly in 2 games, they beat us in one, and we beat ourselves in the 4th game. The vast majority of the time we don't give away that 1st game.

Anyways...I wonder if this is the type of outting that will relieve KW some if he gets rid of Marte. He's on this team to get lefties out in pressure situations and he walked 2 today. Could be a nail in the coffin from KW's perspective. (that's just my commentary...I am NOT syaing b/c of what happened today that Marte should definitely be shipped out...though I think he may be)

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:27 PM
Goodbye Marte!

Why did we get rid of Shingo again???

Because Shingo regularly did what Marte did today.

chisoxmike
07-24-2005, 06:27 PM
I was pulling out my hair there at the end.

Marte still looks off, it looked like he was lobbing the ball up there.

Good to see Contreras have a strong outing, and the 2005 Sox finally came out.
Let's get KC!

DaveIsHere
07-24-2005, 06:27 PM
No Crap, Hopefully Marte is on his way down South!!!!


Unless they saw that performance.




.

buehrle4cy05
07-24-2005, 06:27 PM
:winner :twinslose

Marte looked shaky, but it may be the last time we look at Marte in a Sox uniform, if the rumors I hear are true. Big ups to Dustin for saving this one, and even more ups to JC for holding the Red Sox to 3 runs.

elrod
07-24-2005, 06:27 PM
11.5 up. I think that might be the last time we see Marte try to save a game for this team. His fastball looked terrible. I'd love to see the Marte + BMac for AJB, and then try and trade JC to Seattle for Eddie Guardado.

Tragg
07-24-2005, 06:28 PM
Nice win.

ESPN was just drooling at the prospect of Boston winning 3/4 - so sorry, ESPN, not this time.

slobes
07-24-2005, 06:28 PM
Hermanson... yes!

Dustin we Trust in

SOXintheBURGH
07-24-2005, 06:28 PM
Score. Dustin's goat looks so amazing.

whitesoxfan
07-24-2005, 06:29 PM
very nice way to end off the series. I'll take a series split with the Red Sox anyday.

11.5 up :supernana:

UofCSoxFan
07-24-2005, 06:29 PM
You just can't walk two guys to put the tying run at the plate with Manny Ramirez up (the AL MVP imho).

If damon and ortiz hit homers I can at least live with that b/c they earned it. Walks in that situation are unacceptable.

putherawaywet
07-24-2005, 06:30 PM
Great win - I began the day skeptical of a trade that would include Marte. After this game, I'm comfortable losing him and moving Cotts into that role. And then finding some other lefty to take Cotts' role.

Yes!

Kogs35
07-24-2005, 06:31 PM
nice win today, a little shaky at the end but :bandance: :bandance: :gulp:

DaveIsHere
07-24-2005, 06:31 PM
Nice win.

ESPN was just drooling at the prospect of Boston winning 3/4 - so sorry, ESPN, not this time.

No crap that is why I wanted to win so much.

All you would have heard about is how the Red Sawz beat the "Not For Real" White Sox!!


I would puke. Hell we should have taken the series!!

owensmouth
07-24-2005, 06:32 PM
Great win - I began the day skeptical of a trade that would include Marte. After this game, I'm comfortable losing him and moving Cotts into that role. And then finding some other lefty to take Cotts' role.

Yes!
I'm not. Leave the team the way it is.

Brian26
07-24-2005, 06:32 PM
Anyone notice how Hawk was being a LOT more critical of Marte during this game?

:hawk

"Well, Hermy will come in and try to clean up Marte's mess."

Hendu
07-24-2005, 06:32 PM
This was a big W. Good thing Marte didn't blow it.

I think we did well in this 'test' series. We should have won the first game and our defense probably isn't going to collapse like that again. We were also in the 3rd game and could have won that with a couple of clutch hits. Besides, the Red Sox are the team in a tight division race so they're the ones who need to win every game possible.

illinibk
07-24-2005, 06:32 PM
No Crap, Hopefully Marte is on his way down South!!!!
Hopefully he is on his way to Philly instead, but too bad the rumors don't point that direction. Good job by Hermy to come in and close things out.

elrod
07-24-2005, 06:33 PM
BTW, anybody notice the Twins' schedule coming up? 3 at Yankee Stadium, 3 at Fenway, then 4 at home against Oakland and 3 more against the Red Sox. They get a slight reprieve with 3 at Seattle and then 3 more at Oakland before they come to the Cell on August 15. If the Twins plan on doing one of their patented late-season runs, they're going to have some stiff competition.

SABRSox
07-24-2005, 06:34 PM
Great win - I began the day skeptical of a trade that would include Marte. After this game, I'm comfortable losing him and moving Cotts into that role. And then finding some other lefty to take Cotts' role.

I'd like the move if, as another poster suggested, the Sox were then able to flip Contreras over to the Mariners for Guradado. We'd get a shutdown lefty right back in the pen. But I don't know why on Earth the Mariners would want Contreras...

Brian26
07-24-2005, 06:34 PM
No Crap, Hopefully Marte is on his way down South!!!!


Unless they saw that performance.


Marte's been doing that crap since mid 2002.

DickAllen72
07-24-2005, 06:36 PM
Because Shingo regularly did what Marte did today.

Shingo was a better pitcher than Vizcaino, and was a better closer than Marte.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:37 PM
Shingo was a better pitcher than Vizcaino, and was a better closer than Marte.

Not the last couple of months. Last year? Yes. This year he did not attack the strike zone, just as Marte didn't today.

FloridaSox
07-24-2005, 06:37 PM
Yes, yippee, we won....But I am really concerned that Ozzie is burning this bullpen to a crisp--Cotts and Politte cannot pitch every day. Hermanson is back...well, yes, until his back acts up again.

Without a bullpen, our October our will be very short.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:39 PM
Yes, yippee, we won....But I am really concerned that Ozzie is burning this bullpen to a crisp--Cotts and Politte cannot pitch every day. Hermanson is back...well, yes, until his back acts up again.

Without a bullpen, our October our will be very short.

We've got our 3 innings eaters going the next 3 games. Ozzie can get away with it when you have 3 guys that consistently pitch into and beyond the 7th inning.

delben91
07-24-2005, 06:42 PM
Nice win. That right there is White Sox baseball at it's finest.

Whoever commented on all the outfielders touching 2nd base, I noticed that too, first time I've seen it happen as well.

11.5...spelndid.

:gulp:

DickAllen72
07-24-2005, 06:42 PM
Not the last couple of months. Last year? Yes. This year he did not attack the strike zone, just as Marte didn't today.

Shingo just needed to pitch more to get his control sharp. He was pitching well before that last appearance in Cleveland. Even then, he got the first two out and was ahead in the counts on his last two batters before he lost them, but the rain may have had some effect on that.

Anyway, at least Shingo was healthy and had a "rubber arm." He should have been used more instead of Vizcaino.

balke
07-24-2005, 06:42 PM
I'd like the move if, as another poster suggested, the Sox were then able to flip Contreras over to the Mariners for Guradado. We'd get a shutdown lefty right back in the pen. But I don't know why on Earth the Mariners would want Contreras...

Have you seen the mariners pitching staff? He'd be their #2.

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 06:42 PM
I agree. The wins are great but the bullpen is being burned at a pace which will prove costly come the play-offs.


Harris, Timo, & Ozuna are a waste of a Roster spot and one must be shipped or optioned in order to make room for another arm in this pen. My choice would be either Harris or Timo

Jenks role needs to be expanded also.

FloridaSox
07-24-2005, 06:44 PM
We've got our 3 innings eaters going the next 3 games. Ozzie can get away with it when you have 3 guys that consistently pitch into and beyond the 7th inning.

How many games did Marte pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Cotts pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Politte pitch the last week? 5

Case closed

chisoxmike
07-24-2005, 06:44 PM
I agree. The wins are great but the bullpen is being burned at a pace which will prove costly come the play-offs.


Harris, Timo, & Ozuna are a waste of a Roster spot and one must be shipped or optioned in order to make room for another arm in this pen. My choice would be either Harris or Timo

Jenks role needs to be expanded also.

Harris ok, Timo and Ozuna....come on. You need Ozuna to fill in one day at 3B or SS, Timo can fill in RF and can provide a cluch bat at the late innings of the game.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-24-2005, 06:46 PM
Anyone notice how Hawk was being a LOT more critical of Marte during this game?

He was pissed. You think he know that's Marte's already gone or something?

Yes, I noticed. And yes, Hawk knows Marte is likely to be traded, too. There is no way he bad mouths a Sox player this way unless he's preparing the ground for the guy's exit. We don't call Hawk the Oracle of Reinsdorphi for nothing. The man is an absolute pipeline into the chairman's office.
:cool:

As Hawk might say...

:reinsy
"Marte? He's a gone goose."

:)

PicktoCLick72
07-24-2005, 06:50 PM
This win was nice to get a split in a very intense series. Nice performance by the offense today getting a couple big hits. JC made his case for staying with the team. AS for everyone saying the bullpen is getting taxed, I think that is why KW will be focusing on acquiring bullpen help in the next week. Once again, you cannot complain with a split here. Let's take it to KC now.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:50 PM
How many games did Marte pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Cotts pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Politte pitch the last week? 5

Case closed

Now go take a look at how much they actually pitched (an inning or less per appearance essentially). Again, there will be weeks when your bullpen gets used...especially with Hermy unavailable for most of the week. But with FG, MB, and JG going the next 3 days, the pen should be able to get its proper rest in. If Jenks emerges as a reliable arm out of the pen, no one will get overused. This is also a big advantage of having such a big lead. If in September we are up 10 games, you'll see a lot of the call-ups in the late innings to keep the pen fresh for October. That's a BIG reason why putting away the division is so important.

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 06:51 PM
Yes, I noticed. And yes, Hawk knows Marte is likely to be traded, too. There is no way he bad mouths a Sox player this way unless he's preparing the ground for the guy's exit. We don't call Hawk the Oracle of Reinsdorphi for nothing. The man is an absolute pipeline into the chairman's office.
:cool:

As Hawk might say...

:reinsy
"Marte? He's a gone goose."

:)


I'm happy Hawk had the balls to say "Hermanson in here to clean up Marte's mess." That's the way all Sox fans felt at that moment.

chisoxmike
07-24-2005, 06:52 PM
If in September we are up 10 games, you'll see a lot of the call-ups in the late innings to keep the pen fresh for October..

:bundy

:)

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:53 PM
I'm happy Hawk had the balls to say "Hermanson in here to clean up Marte's mess." That's the way all Sox fans felt at that moment.

Yea, and PHG made a great point in that Hawk knows what is going on and wouldn't have said what he did unless he knew it was extremely likely that Marte is going. Gonna be interesting...I just hope if they do any deal it gets done soon as all the speculation is getting old.

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 06:54 PM
Now go take a look at how much they actually pitched (an inning or less per appearance essentially). Again, there will be weeks when your bullpen gets used...especially with Hermy unavailable for most of the week. But with FG, MB, and JG going the next 3 days, the pen should be able to get its proper rest in. If Jenks emerges as a reliable arm out of the pen, no one will get overused. This is also a big advantage of having such a big lead. If in September we are up 10 games, you'll see a lot of the call-ups in the late innings to keep the pen fresh for October. That's a BIG reason why putting away the division is so important.


No matter how many pitches you throw per appearance, it is still very tough and a strain to the arm just to get up every day just to warm-up if needed.


Some of these guys need to be told like Cotts and Pollite that they will absolutely have the day off tomorrow, no ifs ands or buts. Leave your cleats at the hotel boys. The rest of the guys will have to suck it up if needed.

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 06:56 PM
Yea, and PHG made a great point in that Hawk knows what is going on and wouldn't have said what he did unless he knew it was extremely likely that Marte is going. Gonna be interesting...I just hope if they do any deal it gets done soon as all the speculation is getting old.


Exactly, you would hate for Marte to continue to suck it up on the mound and then no one wants to trade for him. Get a deal done now if you can.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 06:57 PM
No matter how many pitches you throw per appearance, it is still very tough and a strain to the arm just to get up every day just to warm-up if needed.


Some of these guys need to be told like Cotts and Pollite that they will absolutely have the day off tomorrow, no ifs ands or buts. Leave your cleats at the hotel boys. The rest of the guys will have to suck it up if needed.

And that will happen plenty in September. For now, I doubt our guys are being used any more than how other teams use their guys. And this week just happened to be a particularly busy week for the pen. The Royals are just what the doctor ordered. And I GUARANTEE if Ozzie had used Viz more this series in crucial situation, people would be getting on him for that. It's a no win situation for Ozzie in terms of what the fans think there. I'll trust him...he knows our players the best.

balke
07-24-2005, 06:57 PM
Yea, and PHG made a great point in that Hawk knows what is going on and wouldn't have said what he did unless he knew it was extremely likely that Marte is going. Gonna be interesting...I just hope if they do any deal it gets done soon as all the speculation is getting old.

There was also an article earlier this season about the Sox probably trading Marte. MLB.com always seems to give things away way before it happens.

PaleHoseGeorge
07-24-2005, 06:57 PM
Exactly, you would hate for Marte to continue to suck it up on the mound and then no one wants to trade for him. Get a deal done now if you can.

Maybe Marte is flunking all his auditions on purpose?

:wink:

delben91
07-24-2005, 06:58 PM
In response to all those saying the bullpen is overused...

AL rank in IP
Buehrle - 1
Garcia - 9
Garland - 11
Contreras - 28

No other team has more than 3 in the top 30.

I don't know what else they can do to have the bullpen work less...require complete games from every starter every time out?

Seems like the Sox are doing as well as can be expected in giving the relievers limited innings.

MRKARNO
07-24-2005, 07:00 PM
We don't call Hawk the Oracle of Reinsdorphi for nothing.


LOL!

But that was just awful. The only reason that Marte is even brought on was to get the two lefties out. What does he do? Walk, not one, but BOTH in the ninth inning. The truth of the matter is that lefties have been killing him all year, to the tune of a .288 BAA, while righties have been owned by him, with a .211 BAA (abeit with more walks, but he's been walking a lot this year). His being left-handed hasnt really helped him at all against lefties. Cotts has had a similar problem, but on the whole has been a lot better. Right now, if I wanted to get out a lefty in a big situation, I would be most likely to go to Politte because our lefties aren't getting the job done. Marte is quite expendable IMO. Bring up Bajenaru, or better yet, find a way to get Wagner here. Hell, Maybe Jenks will do a lot better against lefties than Marte, the way things are going with our lefty pitchers.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 07:01 PM
LOL!

But that was just awful. The only reason that Marte is even brought on was to get the two lefties out. What does he do? Walk, not one, but BOTH in the ninth inning. The truth of the matter is that lefties have been killing him all year, to the tune of a .288 BAA, while righties have been owned by him, with a .211 BAA (abeit with more walks, but he's been walking a lot this year). His being left-handed hasnt really helped him at all against lefties. Cotts has had a similar problem, but on the whole has been a lot better. Right now, if I wanted to get out a lefty in a big situation, I would be most likely to go to Politte because our lefties aren't getting the job done. Marte is quite expendable IMO. Bring up Bajenaru, or better yet, find a way to get Wagner here. Hell, Maybe Jenks will do a lot better against lefties than Marte, the way things are going with our lefty pitchers.

Bobby Jenks may be the key piece to this team over the next 3 months. If he proves to be effective, our bullpen has the absolute possibility of being completely lights out.

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 07:02 PM
In response to all those saying the bullpen is overused...

AL rank in IP
Buehrle - 1
Garcia - 9
Garland - 11
Contreras - 28

No other team has more than 3 in the top 30.

I don't know what else they can do to have the bullpen work less...require complete games from every starter every time out?

Seems like the Sox are doing as well as can be expected in giving the relievers limited innings.


Yes something can be done.

Have guys pitch complete innings. No more 1/3 & 2/3 outings. Screw going by the book and creating match ups lefty/righty. Also, have guys pitch into that 110 - 120 pitch count. It's a five man rotation for crying out loud!

KnightSox
07-24-2005, 07:05 PM
I was listening to Ozzie on the post game show,He said he was going to sit Iguchi for todays game.We would have been in trouble if He did,the team seems to be having trouble in the clutch.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 07:06 PM
OK, so far we've got people justifiably taking Marte to task and people saying our starters don't pitch enough innings (which has been proven false).

What other complaints will be drummed up here after a relatively good series for the Sox?

BanditJimmy
07-24-2005, 07:08 PM
Billy Wagner should cure all Bullpen problems.

Tragg
07-24-2005, 07:11 PM
How many games did Marte pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Cotts pitch the last week? 5
How many games did Politte pitch the last week? 5

Case closed

I agree - the failings of the pen is directly due to the starters not getting us deep into games.

nedlug
07-24-2005, 07:12 PM
Billy Wagner should cure all Bullpen problems.

http://www.rose-hulman.edu/~guldenrk/pinkpatrol.bmp

RadioheadRocks
07-24-2005, 07:17 PM
:bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance: (banana split) :bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance: :bandance:

eastchicagosoxfan
07-24-2005, 07:26 PM
A real good win today. The Sox are 7-4 after the break. After I heard Hawk's comment about Hermanson " cleaning up Marte's mess " I figure he's a goner. You gotta throw strikes. He's not doing it, nor was Shingo. I wonder how much more effective a pitcher is when he's 0-1, as oppossed to 1-0?

downstairs
07-24-2005, 07:31 PM
BTW, anybody notice the Twins' schedule coming up? 3 at Yankee Stadium, 3 at Fenway, then 4 at home against Oakland and 3 more against the Red Sox. They get a slight reprieve with 3 at Seattle and then 3 more at Oakland before they come to the Cell on August 15. If the Twins plan on doing one of their patented late-season runs, they're going to have some stiff competition.

Sounds like a recipie for a third place finish in '05 to me!

Though I'll be torn between rooting against them and the Yankees in those series'.

tebman
07-24-2005, 07:40 PM
Marte's been doing that crap since mid 2002.
I was thinking the same thing. Marte always scares the hell out of me when he's in there, as much as Shingo did over the last few weeks he was here.

Not only did he walk two, but his fastball looked terrible. I'm worried that it'll tougher for KW to make a trade after other teams saw Marte's performance today.

But in the end, great win! :bandance:

chisox06
07-24-2005, 07:54 PM
Hats off to Cotts and Pollitte as well, you can focus on Marte and his performance all you want. The only reason Marte had a game to blow is because Cotts and Pollitte came in and shut the Red Sox down.

How big have these two guys been??

TornLabrum
07-24-2005, 07:58 PM
Yes, yippee, we won....But I am really concerned that Ozzie is burning this bullpen to a crisp--Cotts and Politte cannot pitch every day. Hermanson is back...well, yes, until his back acts up again.

Without a bullpen, our October our will be very short.

Then, by gum, he'd better tell his starters to go at least 7 innings no matter what!

UofCSoxFan
07-24-2005, 08:07 PM
Yes something can be done.

Have guys pitch complete innings. No more 1/3 & 2/3 outings. Screw going by the book and creating match ups lefty/righty. Also, have guys pitch into that 110 - 120 pitch count. It's a five man rotation for crying out loud!

Uh Contreras went 116 today over 5 and 2/3 innings (meaning a lot per inning which is more strenuous) in freaking 102 degree heat. Are you kidding me in saying that he should have been left in longer?

Anyone else remember when Dusty Baker pitched the Cubs starters to death and they ran out of gas in the playoffs, not to mention have been injury prone ever since?

I mean seriously...soon you guys will be complaining that Ozzie is overusing the starters.

:chickenlittle

cheeses_h_rice
07-24-2005, 08:28 PM
Just got back from the Cell, and now that I've cleaned out the mudpile in my drawers, let me say how awesome it was to hear the chirping Red Sox fans that invaded the Cell like a plague of locusts leave the park as quiet as doormice.

The pitching today was a bit of a disappointment, even though we won. Contreras did fine, but labored a bit, and I thought Cotts was MVP of the pitching staff today, but the way the Sox pitchers failed to attack the hitters in the last 2 innings was so frustrating. I think Hermanson finally got one first-pitch strike over the plate in the 9th, otherwise it was 1-0/nibble city. Marte had an uncharacteristically crappy appearance, when all you need to do is attack the hitters and get 3 damn outs WITHOUT putting 2 guys on to let the Boston sluggers tie it up or take the lead. When Hermie came in and gave up that tough seeing-eye single to Manny, I started thinking dark clouds were a-loomin'. Kudos to him for pitching out of it, and for getting one tough veteran in Olerud to ground out weakly to end the game.

Offensively, have to give it up to Tadahito especially -- basically won the game for them -- without forgetting PK's clutch 2-run double in the first and O-E-O Gload's RBI double in the third for that all-important insurance run. It's amazing how much difference just playing ahead of the other team that it makes.

Hot as **** day today, but fortunately my seats were in the shaded part of the UD all game. As the game wore on, huge swaths of the outfield seats emptied out, and just walking back to our cars was grueling.

Anyway, before this series started, I told myself I'd be satisfied with a split and happy with 3 out of 4. We could've gone 3/4 easily, but whatever, at least the Sox didn't lose ground to the Twins, we took 4 more days off the calendar, and the chirpy Cubs-East fans had to eat a nice bowl of **** today.

:gulp:

Chips
07-24-2005, 08:35 PM
Contreas control is getting better, 74 strikes in 116 pitches. I think he did a great job. Two bad pitches with 2 outs. Only walked 2 and struck out 6. I do not want to see him go. And its about time we scored some runs for him.

Madvora
07-24-2005, 08:47 PM
After I heard Hawk's comment about Hermanson "cleaning up Marte's mess " I figure he's a goner.
You know it man, you could tell what Hawk was thinking. Just a week ago he was paising the hell out of him. Maybe the Marlin's GM was watching on TV then. But, if Hawk knows something already, then why did Marte pitch in the game today and why would a done deal not be annouced yet?
Maybe KW has two options and Marte is gone for sure, one way or another?

captain54
07-24-2005, 08:58 PM
I was at the Cell today in the left field bleachers, behind the Sox pen and it was like sitting in an oven...it was amazing how the sun drenched seats emptied out and the shaded seats were filled practically the whole game....there were a few Boston fans around me but they seemed pretty cool...

Contreras really showed me something today.....struck out Manny twice, and battled the whole way....he kept the best offense in the AL at bay....

I'm sure Ozzie knows what he's doing, but what is it about having to sit Iguchi?? I thought I read somewhere where Tadahito says he wants to play every day....Aaron Rowand seems like he's in an offensive funk, he looks real weak at the plate....

I liked the lineup today.....Ross Gload had a key RBI and looks good at first...

after Marte's second walk, I was ready to run out there and kick his ass personally...he looked awful, and scared....when Hermanson ran out to the mound every body around me was cheering like crazy.....

the stars today were Iguchi, the Sox pen (minus Vizcaino and Marte), and Contreras....

BearSox
07-24-2005, 08:59 PM
Is todays game the best JC has had against the Red Sox? It seemed like the Yankees were very anxious to trade him to us because of his history against the Red Sox.

ilsox7
07-24-2005, 09:08 PM
I was at the Cell today in the left field bleachers, behind the Sox pen and it was like sitting in an oven...it was amazing how the sun drenched seats emptied out and the shaded seats were filled practically the whole game....there were a few Boston fans around me but they seemed pretty cool...

Contreras really showed me something today.....struck out Manny twice, and battled the whole way....he kept the best offense in the AL at bay....

I'm sure Ozzie knows what he's doing, but what is it about having to sit Iguchi?? I thought I read somewhere where Tadahito says he wants to play every day....Aaron Rowand seems like he's in an offensive funk, he looks real weak at the plate....

I liked the lineup today.....Ross Gload had a key RBI and looks good at first...

after Marte's second walk, I was ready to run out there and kick his ass personally...he looked awful, and scared....when Hermanson ran out to the mound every body around me was cheering like crazy.....

the stars today were Iguchi, the Sox pen (minus Vizcaino and Marte), and Contreras....

Lots of good analysis, except Aaron may be the hottest hitter on this team since the break. He had about 8 hits in the Cleveland series and over the last week is hitting .360 with 2 homers and 4 RBI's.

mccoydp
07-24-2005, 09:13 PM
I really wanted a win for the White Sox today...my wife and I had both TVs going in the house today to make sure we could watch the game wherever we were.
I think Contreras threw pretty well; he didn't make me really nervous like he usually does.
Cotts has been amazing, and it's good to see Dustin back out there getting saves.
It may have been just me, but it looked like the Red Sox were really having a rough time with the heat. If so, that's fine with me.
3 of 4 would have been great, but 2 out of four is OK.
At least KC is coming up!

starboy0
07-24-2005, 09:25 PM
I was pulling out my hair there at the end.

Marte still looks off, it looked like he was lobbing the ball up there....

Marte just doesn't seem to have that domination he had in 2003. Opening game in KC last year was emblematic of that.

Lip Man 1
07-24-2005, 09:57 PM
Nice win today...whew!

Regarding the pitching...Hernandez stepped up and threw well yesterday...Contreras? Eight hits and two walks in a little over five innings.

Give the man credit for getting out of the stuff he started but he's not going to be able to do that all the time. Boston constantly had guys on base.

At this point I don't have a preference regarding another starter or another relief pitcher. I think the Sox need both...I'll settle for either one.

Make the move Kenny.

Lip

hose
07-24-2005, 10:00 PM
I lasted 10 minutes in my seat and then I went up to the Upper Deck and sat in the shade.

It was quite pleasent with a steady breeze, I didn't even break a bead of sweat.

Big day for Contreras and Tadahito:bandance::bandance:

pczarapa
07-24-2005, 10:02 PM
I was pulling out my hair there at the end.

Marte still looks off, it looked like he was lobbing the ball up there.

Good to see Contreras have a strong outing, and the 2005 Sox finally came out.
Let's get KC!



Ditto hear, I was really sweating that last out

peeonwrigley
07-24-2005, 10:20 PM
Anyway, before this series started, I told myself I'd be satisfied with a split and happy with 3 out of 4. We could've gone 3/4 easily, but whatever, at least the Sox didn't lose ground to the Twins, we took 4 more days off the calendar, and the chirpy Cubs-East fans had to eat a nice bowl of **** today.

:gulp:

Amen to that.

Foulke You
07-24-2005, 10:47 PM
Nice win today. Anyone else wondering if Marte may be hurt again? His fastball had no life on it and it looked like he was just slinging it up there with no idea where his ball was going to go. Very scary there in the 9th inning with Manny up as the tying run. I'm satisfied with the split in the "battle of the hose" considering what we had going against us in this series. No Dye, no Thomas, Hermy not 100%, etc. I think our team responded pretty well. Now, no letdowns in KC please!

PeteWard
07-24-2005, 11:14 PM
Nice win today. Anyone else wondering if Marte may be hurt again? His fastball had no life on it and it looked like he was just slinging it up there with no idea where his ball was going to go. Very scary there in the 9th inning with Manny up as the tying run. I'm satisfied with the split in the "battle of the hose" considering what we had going against us in this series. No Dye, no Thomas, Hermy not 100%, etc. I think our team responded pretty well. Now, no letdowns in KC please!

Despite the frustrations of Game 1, I'm OK with the split too, considering the Sox wins were more one-sided than theirs. Maybe we can get 2/3 at Fenway next month.

I will be happy with 2 of 3 in KC because the law of averages says we don't go to 12-0 on them, even if it is KC. But then I want 3/4 at Baltimore who I think is getting ready to fade away for good.

Greedy? Absolutely.

voodoochile
07-24-2005, 11:20 PM
pitching got it dome today, regardless of how you look at it. The reason relievers are re;ievers is they aren't good enough to be starters. Sox bullpen is one of the best in baseball and Contreras looked better than in a while,

Whatever...

:winner

:twinslose

:supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :bandance:

Frater Perdurabo
07-24-2005, 11:23 PM
pitching got it done today, regardless of how you look at it. The reason relievers are relievers is they aren't good enough to be starters. Sox bullpen is one of the best in baseball and Contreras looked better than in a while,

Whatever...

:winner

:twinslose

:supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :bandance:

Amen to that. All of it.

tacosalbarojas
07-24-2005, 11:42 PM
:hawk

"Well, Hermy will come in and try to clean up Marte's mess."
Wow. Three outings ago, Hawk had Marte penciled in as a big part of the bullpen's success down the stretch. Maybe he really does know Damaso's on his way out. He did look pretty bad out there today.

Vernam
07-24-2005, 11:52 PM
OK, so far we've got people justifiably taking Marte to task and people saying our starters don't pitch enough innings (which has been proven false).

What other complaints will be drummed up here after a relatively good series for the Sox?
Sure was hot! :redneck

Some random impressions . . . Arroyo's leg kick is borrowed from the Ministry of Silly Walks . . . Contreras was big -- high pitch count and all -- but Iguchi was bigger . . . Cotts was also key, picking up Vizcaino who couldn't do the one thing he was brought in for . . . Substitute "Hermanson" for "Cotts" and "Marte" for Vizcaino in the preceding sentence . . . Everett needs a rest . . . Smart play by Gload (I think) to get caught in a pickle rather than risk being tagged for out 3 before Paulie crossed home, though it would've been smarter to stay at second . . . Nice to see Gload, though it's odd having a player wear Chico's 17 when it's next to the dugout in mourning . . . I may hate Red Sox fans now more than the Cubs' . . . Lady Boston fan behind us w/ 3-2 count on Iguchi: "He's almost out. Let's get a hot dog." She missed the homer.

We won 2 of 4 from the champs, never a bad thing. It's a good sign that no one is content with it.

VC

DaleJRFan
07-25-2005, 12:13 AM
Sure was hot! :redneck

Some random impressions . . . Arroyo's leg kick is borrowed from the Ministry of Silly Walks . . . Contreras was big -- high pitch count and all -- but Iguchi was bigger . . . Cotts was also key, picking up Vizcaino who couldn't do the one thing he was brought in for . . . Substitute "Hermanson" for "Cotts" and "Marte" for Vizcaino in the preceding sentence . . . Everett needs a rest . . . Smart play by Gload (I think) to get caught in a pickle rather than risk being tagged for out 3 before Paulie crossed home, though it would've been smarter to stay at second . . . Nice to see Gload, though it's odd having a player wear Chico's 17 when it's next to the dugout in mourning . . . I may hate Red Sox fans now more than the Cubs' . . . Lady Boston fan behind us w/ 3-2 count on Iguchi: "He's almost out. Let's get a hot dog." She missed the homer.

We won 2 of 4 from the champs, never a bad thing. It's a good sign that no one is content with it.

VC


I was at the game and have a few things to say. First of all, holy crap was it hot. Even my knees are sunburned. Secondly, Sox fans rule. Seriously. I haven't had that much fun at a baseball game in a long time. Taunting Johnny Damon with my patented "Get a haircut hippie" lines and yelling at the thirdbase umpire (eat another cheeseburger!)... man, too much fun.

The DoucheSox fans up in the suite on the third base side yelling ALL freakin game about drove me nuts... I'm with ya Vernam.

Ok, so that Gload double... I watched that play unfold and it didn't really hit me until the guy next to me pointed out how smart of a play it was. He hesitated rounding second base, looked at Slowerko rounding third, looked to Cora and took off for third base. It was such a smart play. Had the relay throw gone home, Konerko would have been out, by a mile. So, Gload drew the throw at third. Smart. Stopping short of third to allow Konerko to score before he was tagged, even smarter play. Way to go Ross.

Contreras was throwing 95mph laserbeam strikes all game. He looked amazing. Manny was all crossed up swinging for the fences on JC's heater. Marte and Vizcaino looked horrid. Nothing even close to a strike. Cotts was his usual self. Same goes for Politte. Throw strikes, get outs. Hermanson was pumped after getting the final out. Can the Sox rely on the same 3 guys all year and post season? KW needs to get another arm... Villone? Wagner?

Glad to see the Sox escape the heat with a W. Good way to jump into the roadtrip.

Here's to another White Sox winner.... :gulp:

DaleJRFan
07-25-2005, 12:18 AM
Oh, and in case anyone wanted to know as if there were any doubts, Jason Veritek is really freakin' good.

WhiteSox16K
07-25-2005, 12:24 AM
Bobby Jenks may be the key piece to this team over the next 3 months. If he proves to be effective, our bullpen has the absolute possibility of being completely lights out.

Much like Fransico Rodriguez was for the 2002 Angels? I guess you never know.


Is todays game the best JC has had against the Red Sox? It seemed like the Yankees were very anxious to trade him to us because of his history against the Red Sox.

If they only knew that his next start against Boston would be decent, maybe they wouldn't have been so quick to dump him last year. Hindsight...Brown/Vazquez in game 7 just didn't work for them. Although I doubt he EVER would have gotten the chance to show them how much of a battler he was today - then again, in much different circumstances (Game 7, ALCS), today's outcome would have been unlikely.

JB98
07-25-2005, 12:52 AM
I was at the Cell today, and it was the hottest game I've experienced at our park in awhile. Great to shut the Red Sox fans and ESPN up. I truly despise those people with every ounce of my being.

I'm happy Iguchi got some big hits. He endeared himself to us with some clutch hitting early in the season, but we haven't seen that from him the last month or so. Even when he's struggling, he still helps us by moving Pods over and playing good defense. However, I know he's capable of more than that. He hit the ball hard and sprayed it to all fields today. That's the Iguchi I saw early in the season, and I was delighted to see it again today.

Konerko finally came through with men on base in the first to get us started, and Ross Gload (aka "The People's Choice") got back in the mix with a clutch double to bring Paulie around in the third.

Contreras: Very solid today. He was in trouble in a few innings, but he didn't break. That's the key against Boston. They are a good hitting team, and they will get some guys on base. You have to stay away from that big inning and minimize the damage. Our pitching staff did a good job of that this whole series.

Marte's performance was terrible. Walks are NEVER acceptable when we have the lead. Politte and Cotts are being used quite a bit, but contrary to posts on this board, it has nothing to do with starters not going deep enough into games. Our starters are doing their jobs. The problem is Hermanson has been hurt. Marte and Vizcaino are throwing poorly. Jenks is just a kid. Who can we trust to eat up those middle innings other than Politte and Cotts? I'd like to see Ozzie put Jenks is a pressure situation in the seventh or eighth inning sometime soon. I want to see how he handles it. If he's going to be with us, he needs to take some of the burden off of Cliff.

DaleJRFan
07-25-2005, 12:58 AM
Jenks is just a kid. Who can we trust to eat up those middle innings other than Politte and Cotts? I'd like to see Ozzie put Jenks is a pressure situation in the seventh or eighth inning sometime soon. I want to see how he handles it. If he's going to be with us, he needs to take some of the burden off of Cliff.

I think Ozzie did just that. July 19th against the Tigers. ave up three singles in a row, bases loaded, no outs. Got out of it unscathed...

I don't know if it counts or not, since the Sox lost 7-1...

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/wrap.jsp?ymd=20050719&content_id=1137549&vkey=wrapup2005&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

I agree though, I'd like to see a bit more of big Bobby.

scottjanssens
07-25-2005, 01:03 AM
Taunting Johnny Damon with my patented "Get a haircut hippie" lines and yelling at the thirdbase umpire (eat another cheeseburger!)... man, too much fun.

I ponied up for scout seats today and me and a few other fans taunted Damon at close range. I have to give the guy credit. He laughed at some of the good zingers. He was the only guy who gave any reaction.

I was hoping to see a 100mph Jenks fastball from where I was sitting, but instead I got Marte. Bleh.

JGarlandrules20
07-25-2005, 01:08 AM
I was at the game and have a few things to say. First of all, holy crap was it hot. Even my knees are sunburned. Secondly, Sox fans rule. Seriously. I haven't had that much fun at a baseball game in a long time. Taunting Johnny Damon with my patented "Get a haircut hippie" lines and yelling at the thirdbase umpire (eat another cheeseburger!)... man, too much fun.

The DoucheSox fans up in the suite on the third base side yelling ALL freakin game about drove me nuts... I'm with ya Vernam.
Those little girls were driving me insane with their stupid/pointless "Let's Go Red Sox"

Is that what people were yelling at the third base ump? I saw someone get ejected and he got like a standing ovation. It was funny.

Fun game...I had really good seats. It was way too hot but the great game made up for that. I got Paulie's autograph too! And almost Damaso's..I was next in line then the National Anthem came on and he left. Blah.

JB98
07-25-2005, 01:09 AM
I think Ozzie did just that. July 19th against the Tigers. ave up three singles in a row, bases loaded, no outs. Got out of it unscathed...

I don't know if it counts or not, since the Sox lost 7-1...

http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/wrap.jsp?ymd=20050719&content_id=1137549&vkey=wrapup2005&fext=.jsp&c_id=mlb

I agree though, I'd like to see a bit more of big Bobby.

The situation you mention was impressive pitching, but as you say, the score was 7-1. If Jenks fails in that situation, so what? We still lose. There is really no pressure there. Next time we have a one-run lead in the seventh or eighth inning, I want Ozzie to call upon Jenks. Let's find out if this guy can do the job when it matters most. If he can, it would be a huge plus. Ozzie has had to go to Politte an awful lot lately. Cliff has been money all year, but I do worry about him wearing down. He can't pitch every day.

scottjanssens
07-25-2005, 01:09 AM
On the Score they wanted to know from Sox fans if the fans were less optimistic about performance in the playoff as they were a week ago or about the same. I didn't call in but my take is we'll be fine. There I two points I take away from this series.

1) Our pitching staff can handle one of the best offensive lineups in the league.
2) We're good enough to split a series with the Red Sox without Frank, Dye, and also when starting Willie and Ozuna in a game each.

Bonus point) We're not good enough to beat the Red Sox when we spot them three runs.

SoxSpeed22
07-25-2005, 01:12 AM
On the Score they wanted to know from Sox fans if the fans were less optimistic about performance in the playoff as they were a week ago or about the same. I didn't call in but my take is we'll be fine. There I two points I take away from this series.

1) Our pitching staff can handle one of the best offensive lineups in the league.
2) We're good enough to split a series with the Red Sox without Frank, Dye, and also when starting Willie and Ozuna in a game each.

Bonus point) We're not good enough to beat the Red Sox when we spot them three runs.Don't forget that we played terrible in that first game. No Dark Clouds tonight.

DaleJRFan
07-25-2005, 01:19 AM
Is that what people were yelling at the third base ump? I saw someone get ejected and he got like a standing ovation. It was funny.

I have no idea what the dude who got the boot was yelling, but the first time the ump summoned security, they pretty much told him "Tough, deal with it." Whatever the guy said the second time around had to be borderline verbal assult to get shuffled out. Two security guards sat in our section for the rest of the game. I guess he is sensitive to fat jokes.

:gulp:

nut_stock
07-25-2005, 01:27 AM
I was sitting in the bleachers today, and thought it was odd that Marte ran from the bullpen to the dugout in about the 3rd inning only to return to the bullpen 3 or 4 innings later.....

When we saw him leave the bullpen and go to the dugout, all of us thought that he'd just been traded...

DaleJRFan
07-25-2005, 01:29 AM
I was sitting in the bleachers today, and thought it was odd that Marte ran from the bullpen to the dugout in about the 3rd inning only to return to the bullpen 3 or 4 innings later.....

When we saw him leave the bullpen and go to the dugout, all of us thought that he'd just been traded...

When I got to the park, he was on the field throwing long toss... looked like his side work for the day, so I assumed he had the day off. Maybe he wasn't ready, but he didn't look to great out there.

SOXfnNlansing
07-25-2005, 02:52 AM
:tomatoaward

SOXfnNlansing
07-25-2005, 02:55 AM
Anyone notice how Hawk was being a LOT more critical of Marte during this game?

He was pissed. You think he know that's Marte's already gone or something? I hate when a pitcher comes in and walks people with the game on the line. I actually had the feeling that I was watching a flubs game. Thank God Hermie worked out of that mess! 31 over:bandance:

TornLabrum
07-25-2005, 10:02 AM
I have no idea what the dude who got the boot was yelling, but the first time the ump summoned security, they pretty much told him "Tough, deal with it." Whatever the guy said the second time around had to be borderline verbal assult to get shuffled out. Two security guards sat in our section for the rest of the game. I guess he is sensitive to fat jokes.

:gulp:

I don't think Sox security has the right to say to an ump, "Tough, deal with it." My guess is that the umpire told them that if it happens again, they should give the guy the boot. The umpire is in charge of that kind of thing, not team security.

Mark'sBrokenFoot
07-25-2005, 11:20 AM
Yes, yippee, we won....But I am really concerned that Ozzie is burning this bullpen to a crisp--Cotts and Politte cannot pitch every day. Hermanson is back...well, yes, until his back acts up again.

Without a bullpen, our October our will be very short.

Then, by gum, he'd better tell his starters to go at least 7 innings no matter what!

The problem with the bullpen is the offense. Most teams have a few mop up guys in the bullpen that eat up innings during lopsided games. We've had those guys, too, but the problem is, every game is close. So the main guys, Herm, Politte, Cotts and the like get used way too often. If we want to save the pen down the stretch, we either need to replace the weak links so Ozzie doesn't fear going to any of them in a close game, or start blowing people out. If Burnett is dealt to us, Contreras in the pen eliminates the Viz factor. If not, I'd like Eddie Guardado. Either way, no more Vizcaino is a good thing.

tacosalbarojas
07-25-2005, 01:48 PM
Sure was hot! :redneck

Some random impressions . Nice to see Gload, though it's odd having a player wear Chico's 17 when it's next to the dugout in mourning .
VCGood stuff throughout your post, but the Gload thing and #17...yeah, I've had a weird feeling about that since they put it up. Glad I'm not the only one that noticed!

wdelaney72
07-25-2005, 02:44 PM
Marte's been doing that crap since mid 2002.

Thank you, I'm glad I'm not the only one who remembers who inconsistent Marte has been over the last year and a half.

wdelaney72
07-25-2005, 02:48 PM
Am I the only one that felt JC had shrunken strike zone?

UofCSoxFan
07-25-2005, 02:56 PM
[b]



The problem with the bullpen is the offense. Most teams have a few mop up guys in the bullpen that eat up innings during lopsided games. We've had those guys, too, but the problem is, every game is close. So the main guys, Herm, Politte, Cotts and the like get used way too often. If we want to save the pen down the stretch, we either need to replace the weak links so Ozzie doesn't fear going to any of them in a close game, or start blowing people out. If Burnett is dealt to us, Contreras in the pen eliminates the Viz factor. If not, I'd like Eddie Guardado. Either way, no more Vizcaino is a good thing.

I mean to a certain extent I agree...most teams have more lopsided games, and those are the games that you use the b-list bullpen guys in. However, a lot of teams have blowouts in both directions. Our team was like this last year. We'd win one day by 11 and lose the next by 9. I wouldn't trade this team for that would you?

I guess these are the luxuries you can complain about when 31 games over .500. "We aren't winning by enough."