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NSSoxFan
07-21-2005, 10:25 PM
Rant 'n rave here.

Hard loss to swallow.

Oh man, I wonder what the Dark Cloud's will come up with tonight.

gobears1987
07-21-2005, 10:25 PM
Trade Crede now!!!

StepsInSC
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
I really like Crede's sideburns.

Cowhead418
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
Oh no we've only picked up one game on the Twins since the All-star break! Fire Sale Now!!!

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
When Konerko was up with two on and two outs in the 7th I said to myself ďAnything but a pop-up. Because if you pop it up now in this situation, youíll do it again this October like you did all of October 2000.Ē He popped it up.


In a game in which we hit three home runs we STILL CANíT keep up with Bostonís offense. We need a stick who can hit when there is a sell out crowd. A stick who has proven he can hit in October. Anyone capable of finding out our record when there are 35,000 plus in the park over the last few years? Iíll bet itís a choking sub .500. The pucker factor was HUGE tonight.

Jurr
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
Uh oh.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
Don't need much help... crap defense loses games. We've known this since 2001.

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
No dark cloud. They just need to toughen up, this is what a playoff team looks like. We'll get 'em, Ozzie will make sure of that.

buehrle4cy05
07-21-2005, 10:26 PM
Oh no we've only picked up one game on the Twins since the All-star break! Fire Sale Now!!!

Way to make me feel better, Cowhead. Thanks!:)

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:27 PM
Oh no we've only picked up one game on the Twins since the All-star break! Fire Sale Now!!!

And lost 3 games in 3 nights.

illinibk
07-21-2005, 10:27 PM
Rant 'n rave here.

Hard loss to swallow.

Oh man, I wonder what the Dark Cloud's will come up with tonight.
wow, you had that up quickly. Did you have that all typed in and just hit enter as soon as Carl struck out? :D:

Still +30 on the season. Every team has a few games where the defense lets them down.

Cowhead418
07-21-2005, 10:27 PM
When Konerko was up with two on and two outs in the 7th I said to myself ďAnything but a pop-up. Because if you pop it up now in this situation, youíll do it again this October like you did all of October 2000.Ē He popped it up.


In a game in which we hit three home runs we STILL CANíT keep up with Bostonís offense. We need a stick who can hit when there is a sell out crowd. A stick who has proven he can hit in October. Anyone capable of finding out our record when there are 35,000 plus in the park over the last few years? Iíll bet itís a choking sub .500. The pucker factor was HUGE tonight.
We are 4-11 in that situation. Yeesh.

MushMouth
07-21-2005, 10:27 PM
Someone remind why we sent Shingo down? Does grinderball now mean playing with a short bullpen and a AAA 3rd baseman?

PAPChiSox729
07-21-2005, 10:27 PM
Oh no we've only picked up one game on the Twins since the All-star break! Fire Sale Now!!!

That just made my night. It's a tough loss, yeah. Just win tommorrow.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
Iguchi what the Hell happened? Do we need to bring his buddy Shingo back?

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
Trade Crede now!!!

Trade him because he dropped a ball? He's on his way to a Gold Glove. Blow it out your ass.

FloridaSox
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
I hate blowing 3 run leads.

Cowhead418
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
And lost 3 games in 3 nights.
And...........so?

oeo
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
Trade Crede now!!!

:tealpolice:

He put us back into the game...I understand he didn't make the catch but Vizcaino threw the ball. Vizcaino is terrible...blah!

pczarapa
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
When Konerko was up with two on and two outs in the 7th I said to myself ďAnything but a pop-up. Because if you pop it up now in this situation, youíll do it again this October like you did all of October 2000.Ē He popped it up.



That's exactly what I'm fearing, even if we make it it'll be another quick exit without another stick. Frank is hurt, Dye getting bit by bugs, Crede needs his head extracted from his a$$, etc etc

mr_genius
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
in a slump :(

c'mon sox, we haven't won anything yet...

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 10:28 PM
This is what the Sox will be going up against if they make the playoffs. They can't make stupid mistakes like today, they have to hit better, and can't get cute while trying to catch a fly ball. *cough* *cough*

I think Crede and Uribe need to be broken up in the lineup, someone needs to go between them. They're brutal.

Hendu
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
If our 2005 White Sox show up the rest of the series instead of the 2004 White Sox we should be fine. Assuming that we can still win games at home, that is.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
Trade Crede now!!!


Tell me he didn't drop a pop up from Ramirez, and then Ramirez hit it out.
Well, he did tie the game up. And buying high and selling low is a sure way to the poorhouse.


Can someone explain to me why our best reliever pitches last night, down 2 runs, pitches in the 6th tonight, while the bottom of our bullpen, Vizcaino, is handling 9th inning duty in a tie game tonight?

slobes
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
I am not the biggest fan of Luis Vizcaino

Viva Medias B's
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
Most devestating loss of the year. No doubt about it. How we play from here on out will tell us how resiliant we are.

itsnotrequired
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
Ugh. One of the most, if not the most devestating losses of the year. They just gave the thing away.

To make the losses even more annoying, I'm heading out on a camping trip tomorrow morning and won't know until late Sunday how the rest of the series is played out. Not the way I wanted to start the trip...:(:

gobears1987
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
:tealpolice:

He put us back into the game...I understand he didn't make the catch but Vizcaino threw the ball. Vizcaino is terrible...blah!
He also blew it earlier in the game when he struck out with runners in scoring position.

Jurr
07-21-2005, 10:29 PM
The Sox are not dictating the game like they have all season. The Cleveland series is looking like the exception to the rule, because all this month they've been playing unfocused and sloppy. Ozzie needs to get in some ass or this thing will get out of hand and losses will pile up.

BlackHat91
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
Tough game, but we battled to the end. All the defensive errors hurt us. Seems like everything that could have fallen our way didnt. Tough loss, but I fell good about Garland tomorrow.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
In the past two days I saw a Sox team looking ahead and then that team in awe of another. The first two times I've seen this all year.

Tomorrow is a statement game. If we can't plate 6 against Wakefield, we need to seriously reconsider the playoff roster.

WinOrDyeTrying
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
Where was our defense this game! 3 f'n errors... not good. Get 'em tomorrow boys.

illinibk
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
In a game in which we hit three home runs we STILL CANíT keep up with Bostonís offense. We need a stick who can hit when there is a sell out crowd. A stick who has proven he can hit in October. Anyone capable of finding out our record when there are 35,000 plus in the park over the last few years? Iíll bet itís a choking sub .500. The pucker factor was HUGE tonight.
:chickenlittle

ChiWhiteSox1337
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
Like Hawk said, there's a reason why Manny Ramirez makes $20 million a season. He got a 2nd chance and definitely made the White Sox pay. The Sox have the AL leader in wins going for them tomorrow, so hopefully Garland can put an end to this huge streak.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
in spite of all the things we did wrong tonight, errors and mistakes will happen, so i only have one complaint- our crowd tonight sounded weak as hell in the latter innings. just dead. everyone will pick it up tomorrow i'm sure- fans included. Let's take 3 out of 4 from these jackasses. and, as i am going to bed right now to dream sweet october dreams, i will say this to all the dark clouds that are sure to follow-

kiss my a$$. losers.

DickAllen72
07-21-2005, 10:30 PM
Iguchi needs a few days rest. He didn't look too sharp in the field.

The double off Rowand's glove should have been called an error.

Sox defense (or lack thereof) and Vizcaino's pitching cost this game.

DaveIsHere
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
One Word: Horrible


Who would have predicted, Iguchi, Rowand and crede's defense would cost us a game, all in the same game. *** is going on??

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
And...........so?

13 game lead down to 10 in 3 nights. That's comforting to you? I knew they'd squander games, but not so fast!

Jurr
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
This loss reminds me of the Jose Valentin drop against Minnesota last year. It's the game where Timo had the clutch bunt to tie the game. Valentin drops the ball in foul grounds that would've ended the inning, and J.Jones comes up and hits the go ahead base hit.

These guys need to get their acts together and start focusing, or there's going to be hell to pay and a catastrophic choke in their future.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
We are 4-11 in that situation. Yeesh.


Wow, it's THAT bad. Makes me really nervous about October. Obviouly all the crowds will be 35,000+. Oh great, and it looks like Oakland will win another one as they continue their Wild Card chase.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
You people claiming or planning on claiming that this game means anything are insane. Losing this game means nothing. This loss means jack ****. They barely outplayed us anyway. Crede had one bad play. That's all it came down to. I don't want to hear that crap about how this is an indication of the playoffs. If we would have won this game, it still wouldn't have meant jack ****. It's one loss. Deal with it.

Unregistered
07-21-2005, 10:31 PM
To make the losses even more annoying, I'm heading out on a camping trip tomorrow morning and won't know until late Sunday how the rest of the series is played out. Not the way I wanted to start the trip...:(:I think I might actually join you - not on the trip of course, but on the "vacation" from this board. The stupidity and panic is and will continue reaching all time highs for sure.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:32 PM
When Konerko was up with two on and two outs in the 7th I said to myself ďAnything but a pop-up. Because if you pop it up now in this situation, youíll do it again this October like you did all of October 2000.Ē He popped it up.


In a game in which we hit three home runs we STILL CANíT keep up with Bostonís offense. We need a stick who can hit when there is a sell out crowd. A stick who has proven he can hit in October. Anyone capable of finding out our record when there are 35,000 plus in the park over the last few years? Iíll bet itís a choking sub .500. The pucker factor was HUGE tonight.

It's not about lack of power at all. We hit our fair share of homers. The problem tonight is we played defense like absolute @#$%. If we make errors, we CANNOT WIN .

Iguchi's gotta turn that double play, not botch it. And AJ's gotta stop being such a p@#$%* behind the plate and catch that ball. He totally short armed it because he was scared of the runner coming home. Stuff like that will always cost us games. Our defense can't be on every night, but when it isn't, we're in trouble. Teams that live on one run games can't make bonehead plays in the field.

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 10:32 PM
My god, the Red Sox fans were annoying as ****! They'll be even more annoying tomorrow. Oh wait... they probably not Red Sox fans, they're probably Cubs fans wearing Red Sox stuff left over from the 2004 World Series.
:angry:

oeo
07-21-2005, 10:33 PM
He also blew it earlier in the game when he struck out with runners in scoring position.

And tell me you weren't on the Crede bandwagon when he tied the game up. You could say the same thing about a lot of guys tonight. As a matter of fact, Uribe had Crede in scoring position in the 8th only to ground out on the first pitch. This is a team game, I hate when people blame it on one guy, especially when Crede screws up. If others screw up it goes unnoticed, but Crede on the other hand gets ripped to pieces. Blame the game on the Sox, not Crede, or Vizcaino.

Viva Medias B's
07-21-2005, 10:33 PM
Look at the bags underneath Ozzie's eyes.

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 10:33 PM
This loss reminds me of the Jose Valentin drop against Minnesota last year. It's the game where Timo had the clutch bunt to tie the game. Valentin drops the ball in foul grounds that would've ended the inning, and J.Jones comes up and hits the go ahead base hit.



I was thinking the exact thing the second Crede dropped the ball. That game last year ended the Sox season too.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
Look at the bags underneath Ozzie's eyes.

A clear indication this team is screwed. :?: :rolleyes:

boiler up
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
visciano should have looked at crede and told him he'd get manny to back him up, just like how MB did with iguchi that one time when he should have thrown the double play ball.

vis. is really starting to piss me off, every time he pitches, runs score.

Cowhead418
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
13 game lead down to 10 in 3 nights. That's comforting to you? I knew they'd squander games, but not so fast!
No it is not "comforting" but we still have a double-digit lead. If it is down to 7 at the end of the series I'll start to worry.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
I was thinking the exact thing the second Crede dropped the ball. That game last year ended the Sox season too.

Just like this one did, right?

SluggersAway
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
Granted our defense wasn't looking so hot tonight, but this was the 6th time the Red Sox faced left-handed pitching in a row. That will get any team focused, and especially a hard hitting team.

As for Viz, or actually whoever was calling Viz's pitches, you can't pitch 3 outside pitches in a row to Manny Ramirez. All Manny did was step back and take that inside pitch yard. Game over.

downstairs
07-21-2005, 10:34 PM
Hey... no problems here with a loss to the former World Champs. Detroit, Tampa... I have a big problem with those losses.

Crede should not have dropped that ball, no matter what (showboating, lost footing, whatever). Hopefully he will never do that again. You just find a way to never have that happen.

They played well, other than two rotten plays.

Heck, basically a bulk of Boston's runs were off errors. Errors can be corrected.

Hendu
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
Sox defense (or lack thereof) and Vizcaino's pitching cost this game.


I don't think this should fall on Vizcaino's pitching. He made the pitch he needed to against one of the best hitter in the game.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
I was thinking the exact thing the second Crede dropped the ball. That game last year ended the Sox season too.
I'm sorry, what exactly are you saying?

pczarapa
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
I couldn't tell from watching it on Extra Innings, but how many Red Sox fans were there? When Manny hit that dinger in the ninth it sounded like half the stadium was cheering.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
I take it Frank was unavailable tonight, because pinch-hitting for Uribe in the 8th with runners in scoring position might have been in order.

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
Just like this one did, right?

Please. Thats not what I meant.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 10:35 PM
Don't need much help... crap defense loses games. We've known this since 2001.


the defense was not that bad...the errors made were not miscues but hard plays. Regarding the crede play, the ball changed direction at least twice and iguchi got a horrible hop on ortiz hard hit ball.

The Red Sox just played better today and knocked the white sox best pitcher out.

IF the whitesox rebound with a spilt they should be happy.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:36 PM
No it is not "comforting" but we still have a double-digit lead. If it is down to 7 at the end of the series I'll start to worry.

What gets me ill is that there are no push nights. Everytime we win, they lose and vice versa. No free nights anymore... which is good and bad.

Viva Medias B's
07-21-2005, 10:36 PM
Ozzie looks worn out.

Lip Man 1
07-21-2005, 10:36 PM
I'm pretty hot right now so I'll temper my comments to the following:

1. All of a sudden it looks like this club is back to relying on the home run. Not good....

2. Anytime Kenny wants to pull the trigger and make a deal either getting help for a short bullpen that looks worn out and tired or the back end of the starting rotation is fine by me.

Oh and Rally Bowl, punctuations are your friend. If you are going to rag on someone at least let them be able to read and understand it.

Lip

MushMouth
07-21-2005, 10:36 PM
I don't think this should fall on Vizcaino's pitching. He made the pitch he needed to against one of the best hitter in the game.

Yeah, you can't put this on Viz. We only have 5 healthy guys in the pen and everyone is going to have to pitch. It's due time we make a move to strengthen things out there or things will only get worse when Duque/Contreras have to pitch this weekend.

oeo
07-21-2005, 10:37 PM
I don't think this should fall on Vizcaino's pitching. He made the pitch he needed to against one of the best hitter in the game.

Now I'm not saying it was his fault, but how do you figure. He popped him up foul and then gave up a homerun ball. That's BS...he didn't make the pitch, you pick your teammates up.

MushMouth
07-21-2005, 10:37 PM
2. Anytime Kenny wants to pull the trigger and make a deal either getting help for a short bullpen that looks worn out and tired or the back end of the starting rotation is fine by me.





AMEN

Not sure what the wait is right now.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 10:37 PM
As mad at Crede right now as I am, I am much more pissed at Rowand for dropping that ball and at Iguchi for not making that ground ball play. When you start making mistakes it becomes contagious just like good defense does.

And I'm REALLY pissed at PK for sucking. This is your playoff PK, pop-ups and groundouts. You can deny it but you know deep down that's it. Same goes for Frank, history tells me that.
Feel bad for Buerhle. The ace was out there and he gets nothing behind him.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:37 PM
No it is not "comforting" but we still have a double-digit lead. If it is down to 7 at the end of the series I'll start to worry.

You're crazy. Even if it did happen that way, it's still a SEVEN GAME LEAD. The next day it could be right back to eight, then nine. And it's not gonna happen.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:37 PM
Ozzie can't handle the pressure! trade him for la russa!

PeteWard
07-21-2005, 10:38 PM
Someone remind why we sent Shingo down? Does grinderball now mean playing with a short bullpen and a AAA 3rd baseman?

His 1st error in 49 games, an AL high at the time, and you call him triple A. Plus Sox would have lost anyway w/o his clutch double.

Unbelievable:angry:

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:38 PM
You people claiming or planning on claiming that this game means anything are insane. Losing this game means nothing. This loss means jack ****. They barely outplayed us anyway. Crede had one bad play. That's all it came down to. I don't want to hear that crap about how this is an indication of the playoffs. If we would have won this game, it still wouldn't have meant jack ****. It's one loss. Deal with it.


If we play a good game and lose 3-2, you are 100% right. But dude, we totally choked tonight. No, it's not the end of the season. But let's not say this series means nothing. I'm just pissed because the BaseBall Tonight guys tonight are all smiling and saying, "See, I told you so. They can't win outside of the AL Comedy Central." And we had BUEHRLE going, jeez.

Viva Medias B's
07-21-2005, 10:38 PM
They lost as a team tonight.

MRKARNO
07-21-2005, 10:38 PM
/Cue rant

The defensive play of late has been absolutely inexcusable. The past few days, we've been absolutely killed by defensive miscues that a team with a defense this good should not be making. It wasn't just the Crede play tonight, but also the "double error" by Iguchi and the missed catch by Rowand. Take all of those together and that far and away is the difference in this game. The pitchers pitched a great game against the Boston offense and the defense let the pitching down time after time.

The team has lost 6 of the last 7 games at home in front of very supportive crowds and they should be ashamed for their poor defensive efforts recently. You can point to defensive letdowns as a key reason for at least some of the losses.

This team needs the best defense in baseball to keep up their level of play. It has been the major reason for the White Sox being among the top teams in baseball at preventing runs.

I know they can play better defense than this, and I suspect they will, but they better get their friggin act together soon because we don't want to see the White Sox get embarrassed by an inferior Boston club at home. This was an awful loss and they better come back and win 2 of the next 3 (3 would be nice) to remedy this loss. Boston is a .500 road team and it would be somewhat of an embarrassment to lose 3 of 4 to them.

Obviously you want to keep things in perspective. They are not going to lose the division. I could care less about what Minnesota does unless they get to within 5-6 games or so. But a letdown could result in us not getting the AL No. 1 seed. I don't want to see that happen. They've played too well so far for that to happen.

I refuse to pin the blame on one player in this game, or the team's recent mediocre play, but the team has got to step it up.

Don't kid yourselves, Boston is a big test for the White Sox and this is a big series. There is a fairly good chance that they will be our first round opponent.

/end rant

oeo
07-21-2005, 10:39 PM
1. All of a sudden it looks like this club is back to relying on the home run. Not good....

That is the exact same thing I was thinking when all I saw was 4 runs from homeruns, and the same thing from nights before. After the break, they were playing that great fundamental baseball against the Indians and it got me real excited. Now...it's homerun or nothing.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 10:39 PM
AMEN

Not sure what the wait is right now.

The *wait* is to drive the asking price down as the deadline approaches.

Patience, people. Trade deadline is 10 days away. Something will happen soon.

shoota
07-21-2005, 10:39 PM
Crede tied the game with a double off of Curt Schilling in the 8th inning. Then, a half inning later, he drops an easy Manny Ramirez pop up in foul ground that hit his glove. ManRam then goes on to hit the game-winning home run.

Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook.

This really debunks the theory that Crede saves more runs with his defense than a Joe Randa contributes to with his bat. Crede's errorless play this week cost the Sox 4 runs and maybe two wins. His first unofficial error was against the Tigers where his indecision on how to field a hopper, ate him up on what should have been the third out of the inning. The Tigers went on to score their first 3 runs that inning.

And today he cost us the winning run with his missed pop up. That's 4 runs he's cost this team with his glove.

illinibk
07-21-2005, 10:39 PM
... AJ's gotta stop being such a p@#$%* behind the plate and catch that ball. He totally short armed it because he was scared of the runner coming home. Stuff like that will always cost us games. Our defense can't be on every night, but when it isn't, we're in trouble. Teams that live on one run games can't make bonehead plays in the field.
I gotta gree about AJ. When that play happened, I yelled "field the damn ball you f****** p****!!!!" I've been pissed off all day, and that play didn't help any.

Hendu
07-21-2005, 10:40 PM
Now I'm not saying it was his fault, but how do you figure. He popped him up foul and then gave up a homerun ball. That's BS...he didn't make the pitch, you pick your teammates up.

Like Hawk said, Manny makes 20 mil for a reason. You don't give a hitter like that a second chance. To the AL RBI leader and a guy who has 25 homeruns, no less.

There's a reason that run was unearned.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:40 PM
I'm pretty hot right now so I'll temper my comments to the following:

1. All of a sudden it looks like this club is back to relying on the home run. Not good....

2. Anytime Kenny wants to pull the trigger and make a deal either getting help for a short bullpen that looks worn out and tired or the back end of the starting rotation is fine by me.

Oh and Rally Bowl, punctuations are your friend. If you are going to rag on someone at least let them be able to read and understand it.

Lip
I. Don't. Understand. What. You. Mean. Sir.

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 10:40 PM
This was a collective loss. Defense and poor hitting lost the game, simple.Take away the three errors, and we probably win the game and this thread probably doesn't have as many replies. :D: Including some of mind. :redneck

Mr. White Sox
07-21-2005, 10:40 PM
http://www.nzflower.co.nz/images/gift_box_cleopatra_soap_med.jpg
Let the Red Sox cherish this gift of a game...because it's not happening again this series. Three straight games of tough D leads to three straight losses, and there's a reason why this team hasn't lost 4 in a row all season; they're resilient and they have great pitching. Get 'em tomorrow.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 10:40 PM
If we play a good game and lose 3-2, you are 100% right. But dude, we totally choked tonight. No, it's not the end of the season. But let's not say this series means nothing. I'm just pissed because the BaseBall Tonight guys tonight are all smiling and saying, "See, I told you so. They can't win outside of the AL Comedy Central." And we had BUEHRLE going, jeez.

Dude, it's totally just one game.

That's what you get anyway for watching BBTN.

EdHerman12
07-21-2005, 10:41 PM
If we don't play Charlie Brown style baseball the next 3 games I think we'll take 'em all.....this game'll tear your heart out from time to time ya know?:(:


Knuckleballer Wakefield tomorrow......GO SOX!:gulp: <---have a few and salute the boys!

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:41 PM
If we play a good game and lose 3-2, you are 100% right. But dude, we totally choked tonight. No, it's not the end of the season. But let's not say this series means nothing. I'm just pissed because the BaseBall Tonight guys tonight are all smiling and saying, "See, I told you so. They can't win outside of the AL Comedy Central." And we had BUEHRLE going, jeez.

Who gives a **** what the BBTN guys say!!?! You're basing your opinion on a game around the potential reaction of some hacks on ESPN? No, we didn't play good. We played like ****. But in the overall scheme of things, this game means nothing. It's not an indication of future success or failure. If get swept in this series, fine, bitch and moan and I'll probably be doing the same. But we lost one freaking game. That's all. One game.

balke
07-21-2005, 10:41 PM
Why in Gods name would we be swept, and how in god's name are the Twins going to sweep? Get real people. Boston isn't going to win 4 of these games, they shouldn't have won tonight. Jon's going to shut the door on these clowns.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:41 PM
Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook

Sorry to burst your bubble, but that was a bona fide error... it counted in real life too. Proud as a peacock tonight, are we?

Lip Man 1
07-21-2005, 10:41 PM
Batman:

I can't predict the future (wish I could..LOL) but what I do know is that a brutal August schedule is coming and they need to have the largest cushion they possibly can.

As Buehrle said himself in the papers today which I applauded, nothing has been decided yet. I'm paraphrasing here but he also said the team looked a little lax the past few days and they need to stop playing that way.

Lip

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:42 PM
/Cue rant

The defensive play of late has been absolutely inexcusable. The past few days, we've been absolutely killed by defensive miscues that a team with a defense this good should not be making. It wasn't just the Crede play tonight, but also the "double error" by Iguchi and the missed catch by Rowand. Take all of those together and that far and away is the difference in this game. The pitchers pitched a great game against the Boston offense and the defense let the pitching down time after time.

The team has lost 6 of the last 7 games at home in front of very supportive crowds and they should be ashamed for their poor defensive efforts recently. You can point to defensive letdowns as a key reason for at least some of the losses.

This team needs the best defense in baseball to keep up their level of play. It has been the major reason for the White Sox being among the top teams in baseball at preventing runs.

I know they can play better defense than this, and I suspect they will, but they better get their friggin act together soon because we don't want to see the White Sox get embarrassed by an inferior Boston club at home. This was an awful loss and they better come back and win 2 of the next 3 (3 would be nice) to remedy this loss. Boston is a .500 road team and it would be somewhat of an embarrassment to lose 3 of 4 to them.

Obviously you want to keep things in perspective. They are not going to lose the division. I could care less about what Minnesota does unless they get to within 5-6 games or so. But a letdown could result in us not getting the AL No. 1 seed. I don't want to see that happen. They've played too well so far for that to happen.

I refuse to pin the blame on one player in this game, or the team's recent mediocre play, but the team has got to step it up.

Don't kid yourselves, Boston is a big test for the White Sox and this is a big series. There is a fairly good chance that they will be our first round opponent.

/end rant

Defense is paramount. Normally, we don't make those errors, but tonight we did. That's why we lost.

mike squires
07-21-2005, 10:42 PM
Ugh. One of the most, if not the most devestating losses of the year. They just gave the thing away.

To make the losses even more annoying, I'm heading out on a camping trip tomorrow morning and won't know until late Sunday how the rest of the series is played out. Not the way I wanted to start the trip...:(:


I've got some Joe Crede cards you can use to build a fire with for the hot dogs. OM me if you're interested.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 10:42 PM
This team needs the best defense in baseball to keep up their level of play. It has been the major reason for the White Sox being among the top teams in baseball at preventing runs.
Excellent point.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 10:42 PM
look stop worrying about the division lead, the white sox will win that.

The white sox need to get confidence against the yanks, red sox, orioles, and angels. Against the athletics they failed.

Even if the white sox lose i guess they are still getting experience which should serve them well for the post season.

I truly believe this whitesox team could make a run because talent wise their pitching should..but their is something that holds them back. I don't believe this team is truly confident in themselves.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 10:43 PM
If you want a positive out of what Crede did, he will never do it again and maybe Timo will stop it too.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:43 PM
Crede tied the game with a double off of Curt Schilling in the 8th inning. Then, a half inning later, he drops an easy Manny Ramirez pop up in foul ground that hit his glove. ManRam then goes on to hit the game-winning home run.

Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook.

This really debunks the theory that Crede saves more runs with his defense than a Joe Randa contributes to with his bat. Crede's errorless play this week cost the Sox 4 runs and maybe two wins. His first unofficial error was against the Tigers where his indecision on how to field a hopper, ate him up on what should have been the third out of the inning. The Tigers went on to score their first 3 runs that inning.

And today he cost us the winning run with his missed pop up. That's 4 runs he's cost this team with his glove.


*****. Why don't you go rail on Rowand for not catching an easy flyout that could have prevented a big inning. Or on Iguchi for mishandling a ground ball that could have saved a run.

He only "cost" us this game because he tied it up for us.

I bet you say there smiling knowing that you could come here and prove to us how right you are. Get over your sick obsession.

Lip Man 1
07-21-2005, 10:44 PM
Rally:

Here is your post #34 in this thread. This is an exact quote.

"in spite of all the things we did wrong tonight, errors and mistakes will happen, so i only have one complaint- our crowd tonight sounded weak as hell in the latter innings. just dead. everyone will pick it up tomorrow i'm sure- fans included. Let's take 3 out of 4 from these jackasses. and, as i am going to bed right now to dream sweet october dreams, i will say this to all the dark clouds that are sure to follow-

kiss my a$$. losers."

That's what I meant.

Lip

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:44 PM
I gotta gree about AJ. When that play happened, I yelled "field the damn ball you f****** p****!!!!" I've been pissed off all day, and that play didn't help any.

Yeah, that guy is just a butcher behind the plate. I never realized it until he came here.

mealfred13
07-21-2005, 10:44 PM
On the negative side, our defense today was BRUTAL, and I'm pretty certain at this point that Vizcaino can not pitch in pressure situations.

On the plus side, I can't recall any other time this year where errors cost us the game.

The defense needs to be there, or we're not going to win, period. Come back and get 'em tomorrow. We should have won this one. Chalk it up to the other 40.

G-Ville Sox
07-21-2005, 10:44 PM
Can someone talk me off the ledge, because with the way we played the last three nights, and the way Minnesota has played those same nights is scary. They are starting to play the way we did in the first half, wins in the final at bat and such.

Bears Football in 50 days....Bear Down!

:gulp:

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 10:45 PM
This could also be the time the white sox have their losing streak, which every team goes through.


To elaborate more on the confidence concept , my favorite team ( the yankees) are confident always and carry this aura as do the red sox. The white sox do not have this yet, it does not seem as if they are the best team on that field.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 10:45 PM
2. Anytime Kenny wants to pull the trigger and make a deal either getting help for a short bullpen that looks worn out and tired or the back end of the starting rotation is fine by me.
Lip
But please avoid the national league middle reliever with deceptively good ERA - that's what we have in Vizcaino.

itsnotrequired
07-21-2005, 10:45 PM
Who gives a **** what the BBTN guys say!!?! You're basing your opinion on a game around the potential reaction of some hacks on ESPN? No, we didn't play good. We played like ****. But in the overall scheme of things, this game means nothing. It's not an indication of future success or failure. If get swept in this series, fine, bitch and moan and I'll probably be doing the same. But we lost one freaking game. That's all. One game.

I think it has less to do with the fact that they lost but more the manner in which they lost. Losing due to the other team having superior pitching is fine but three errors and three unearned runs is tough to swallow, especially at home. Yeah, in the grand scheme of things it is just one loss and anyone thinking the team is doomed is off their rocker but it was still an annoying loss.

Oh, and the BBTN guys can go jump in the lake.

SpammySosa
07-21-2005, 10:46 PM
Crede tied the game with a double off of Curt Schilling in the 8th inning. Then, a half inning later, he drops an easy Manny Ramirez pop up in foul ground that hit his glove. ManRam then goes on to hit the game-winning home run.

Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook.

This really debunks the theory that Crede saves more runs with his defense than a Joe Randa contributes to with his bat. Crede's errorless play this week cost the Sox 4 runs and maybe two wins. His first unofficial error was against the Tigers where his indecision on how to field a hopper, ate him up on what should have been the third out of the inning. The Tigers went on to score their first 3 runs that inning.

And today he cost us the winning run with his missed pop up. That's 4 runs he's cost this team with his glove.


If it wasn't for Crede's shortcomings and perceived shortcomings,you would be a really lonely person wouldn't you Ms. Close?

balke
07-21-2005, 10:46 PM
The sun will come out tomorrow.

illinibk
07-21-2005, 10:46 PM
Crede tied the game with a double off of Curt Schilling in the 8th inning. Then, a half inning later, he drops an easy Manny Ramirez pop up in foul ground that hit his glove. ManRam then goes on to hit the game-winning home run.

Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook.

This really debunks the theory that Crede saves more runs with his defense than a Joe Randa contributes to with his bat. Crede's errorless play this week cost the Sox 4 runs and maybe two wins. His first unofficial error was against the Tigers where his indecision on how to field a hopper, ate him up on what should have been the third out of the inning. The Tigers went on to score their first 3 runs that inning.

And today he cost us the winning run with his missed pop up. That's 4 runs he's cost this team with his glove.

:whoflungpoo

What's next? Are you going to blame the errors Ozuna makes or the balls in the hole Uribe can't get to on Joe? Give it a rest.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 10:46 PM
my favorite team ( the yankees)

Well that explains a lot...

greenpeach
07-21-2005, 10:47 PM
His 1st error in 49 games, an AL high at the time, and you call him triple A. Plus Sox would have lost anyway w/o his clutch double.

Unbelievable:angry:

Exactly !! And don't forget he's playing with two herniated disks in his back. Crede isn't going to be 100% until after the seasons over. So he isn't the second coming of Brooks Robinson. Who is ??

Injuries & a tougher schedule are the main culprits for the Sox struggles right now. Kenny needs to pull the trigger on a trade for some bullpen help & possibly a left-handed hitter.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:47 PM
Crede's play is going to happen. DJ doesn't help with his stupid ass "hopefully it won't hurt us" comments as a belt high fastball rolls its way to the plate. But that's another story. To me the Iguchi play was what did us in, that could've been a DP and probably a scoreless inning. Instead they came out with the lead.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:47 PM
Lip- I don't mean to be a moron, but I'm still not sure what you're getting at. However, if I have upset you with a grammatical or punctuation error, I am truly sorry that I have upset your fragile ego. The end.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:47 PM
This could also be the time the white sox have their losing streak, which every team goes through.


To elaborate more on the confidence concept , my favorite team ( the yankees) are confident always and carry this aura as do the red sox. The white sox do not have this yet, it does not seem as if they are the best team on that field.

Here you go. Enjoy. (http://www.nyyfans.com)

GregoryEtc
07-21-2005, 10:48 PM
How about ARow on that long Timo at bat? Give that guy some love for some major league hustle! 12 or 13 pitches and he was off with the pitch on at least 7 of them. Also avoided the tag in the pickle to get back to first. That guy has HEART!!!!

Rowand plays baseball like a football player. He's a classic fit for South Side fans, and he should play his entire career with the White Sox.
- Richard Roeper

Heffalump
07-21-2005, 10:48 PM
I'm too pissed off to write much.

After Ramirez killed that ball, I collapsed on the floor and yelled at the top of my lungs....my neighbors probably thought someone just died.

All I gotta say is the Sox better come out at full power tomorrow night!!! JG is gonna be our stopper and we are gonna beat the #$%& out of Wakefield's knuckler!!!

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:48 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.

itsnotrequired
07-21-2005, 10:49 PM
The defense needs to be there, or we're not going to win, period. Come back and get 'em tomorrow. We should have won this one. Chalk it up to the other 40.

BBTN was right! Defense is this team's Achille's Heel!

SluggersAway
07-21-2005, 10:49 PM
That is the exact same thing I was thinking when all I saw was 4 runs from homeruns, and the same thing from nights before. After the break, they were playing that great fundamental baseball against the Indians and it got me real excited. Now...it's homerun or nothing.

This was only a function of the pitcher the Sox were facing, Clement has been giving up the long ball lately, to the Rangers, then the Yankees, and now the Sox. The reason is that his pitches have been rising lately. Buerhle actually had the same problem early tonight, but thankfully none of them went all the way.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:49 PM
But please avoid the national league middle reliever with deceptively good ERA - that's what we have in Vizcaino.

Yeah, a good ERA two years ago. Every other year he sucked. Including and especially this one. I totally agree we need another bullpen arm. This guy will be the death of us in the playoffs, guaranteed.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 10:49 PM
I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back.

:reinsy

Do we have to pay extra for his groin, or is that part of the deal?

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:50 PM
And Buehrle didn't have it tonight either. Giving back 2 runs after going up 4-1 was a killer.

Manny and his ef ing hugs after home runs... grr.

Heffalump
07-21-2005, 10:50 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.


We don't need to upgrade the infield!!...They just need to refrain from playing sloppy baseball!!! They play Sox baseball and we win this game.

This could be a good lesson for them. Let's see how they handle it tomorrow!!

Anybody hear an offical announcement on Frank's status?

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:51 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.

:roflmao: Nomar?!?! :roflmao: Aside from the fact that he's a complete butcher in the field, he wasn't even hitting the ball. And you want to talk about a guy who can hurt team chemistry. We don't need Nomar.

shoota
07-21-2005, 10:51 PM
Now I'm not saying it was his fault, but how do you figure. He popped him up foul and then gave up a homerun ball. That's BS...he didn't make the pitch, you pick your teammates up.

You make it sound like Vizcaino had 100% control of the at bat. You do realize that Manny freaking Ramirez was at the plate, don't you? This wasn't a simulated game, Cub fan.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:52 PM
We don't need to upgrade the infield!!...They just need to refrain from playing sloppy baseball!!! They play Sox baseball and we win this game.

This could be a good lesson for them. Let's see how they handle it tomorrow!!

Anybody hear an offical announcement on Frank's status?

Ozzie was as clear as ever in the post-game.

Reporter: You going to DL Frank.

Ozzie: Dunno, meng.

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 10:52 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.

Now I've heard it all.

MUsoxfan
07-21-2005, 10:52 PM
We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.

Put down the gun. Losses happen. The world's an imperfect place

Lip Man 1
07-21-2005, 10:52 PM
Rally:

Lack of capital letters especially with the letter I (or in your case i) and a run on comment for three of four lines, makes things a little hard to understand.

Feel free to retire now and dream your sweet October dreams.

Lip

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:52 PM
Anybody hear an offical announcement on Frank's status?

I believe Ozzie said there was some swelling. They're going to see how he is tomorrow and then make a move if needed. So I guess Gload was just brought up here as a precaution. Either that or if they do know something, Ozzie isn't letting on.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:53 PM
This could also be the time the white sox have their losing streak, which every team goes through.


To elaborate more on the confidence concept , my favorite team ( the yankees) are confident always and carry this aura as do the red sox. The white sox do not have this yet, it does not seem as if they are the best team on that field.

It's like the Red Sox and Yankees KNOW HOW to win when it counts and the stadium is packed and screaming. The White Sox are still learning. I'm glad we'll get plenty of practice with the large crowds now, it will better prepare the team for October.

illinibk
07-21-2005, 10:53 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.
:tealpolice:

MRKARNO
07-21-2005, 10:53 PM
I'm not concerned about the offense. We got our five runs and that should have held up. It has almost every single time we've tallied that many this year.

I'm not concerned about the way the pitchers pitched. Very few balls were hit hard off of Buehrle. Manny took Vizcaino yard but I wouldn't have expected anything less from Luis. It's questionable whether he should have been in that long IMO, but Ozzie's been good enough with the pitching staff this year that I'll give him the benefit of the doubt.

But that defense. Ugh. Rowand's failure to catch the ball resulted in one extra run for the Red Sox. They may have only had 1 in that inning otherwise. Iguchi's play was even worse. That possibly could have been a DP ball, but instead, it lead to two runs scored when none should have scored.

Crede's play was plain awful as well. That play indirectly led to the run though, so that might have been the least costly in terms of the number of runs, but it was most costly in lowering the chance of us winning the game.

Thankfully, defense doesn't just dissapear like hitting and pitching can, so I expect this to be the last game in a while in which we have a defensive breakdown like this. We could have easily won this 5-3 or by a similar tally if it werent for uncharacteristically poor defense.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 10:53 PM
Here you go. Enjoy. (http://www.nyyfans.com/)


:D: .....are you :angry: ?



But anyway just chalk this one up...it's one of those losses that was inevitable.


The red sox baseball team has a godly like offense...so hope that your starting pitchers can go at least 6 innings and only give up 4 runs. If so then your team has put themselves in a position to win.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:53 PM
You make it sound like Vizcaino had 100% control of the at bat. You do realize that Manny freaking Ramirez was at the plate, don't you? This wasn't a simulated game, Cub fan.

He had 100% control over that BP pitch he heaved up there. Just like Prior after Bartman. Luis Prior.

As sucky as it was for Crede to drop that, to give up a tape measure shot on the next pitch is almost worse. Knock him down with the next pitch.

shoota
07-21-2005, 10:54 PM
His 1st error in 49 games, an AL high at the time, and you call him triple A. Plus Sox would have lost anyway w/o his clutch double.

Unbelievable:angry:

You can't say that. If the Sox had a major league third baseman playing, he might have had 3 home runs on the night, and could have caught ManRam's pop up.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 10:54 PM
This could also be the time the white sox have their losing streak, which every team goes through.

We had our losing streak right before the AS game - fortunately 3 against Tampa Bay in the middle made it seem not as bad as it was and the AS break came at a perfect time.

We're gonna beat this team.

Hell, we swept NY 4 straight in NY, beat them 2/3 in Chicago in 2000, and it did us so much good that we went 3 and out, so I don't buy this "confidence" stuff much either.
We're confident - we just played lousy.

chitownhawkfan
07-21-2005, 10:54 PM
Everybody breathe, it is still a ten game lead. Crede was due to eventually make an error, he had gone fifty games without one. It sucks that it happenned against Ramirez and not Tony G, but what can you do? Thems the breaks. However I cannot stand watching Uribe at the plate, sometimes it seems like he has no idea what in the hell he is supposed to be doing.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 10:55 PM
You can't say that. If the Sox had a major league third baseman playing, he might have had 3 home runs on the night, and could have caught ManRam's pop up.

Yeah, I'm sure Joe Randa would have hit 3 home runs and single-handedly won this game. And he would have rescued a kitten from a tree between innings and helped the elderly cross the street. :rolleyes: Get over yourself.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:56 PM
I cannot stand watching Uribe at the plate, sometimes it seems like he has no idea what in the hell he is supposed to be doing.

Seriously... why not PH Dye there? He was available.

Hendu
07-21-2005, 10:56 PM
Wow, I was completely t.o.'d after the loss and I was planning on coming here and venting. But then I see some of the way off-the-deep-end negativity in some of these posts and it brings me back to reality.

Everyone, take a deep breath. Would you rather see us beat ourselves like this in July when we have a double-digit lead or in October? I hope the Sox got this out of their system and now realize that they have a lot of work to do if they're going to live up to the expectations of a team with the best record in baseball.

I am a bit concerned about our problems winning games at home lately though. The same thing has happened to the Nats recently and they've gone into a major funk.

MagicNumber22
07-21-2005, 10:56 PM
Crede giveth...and Crede taketh away. Tough loss to swallow. KW needs to make a move.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
:roflmao: Nomar?!?! :roflmao: Aside from the fact that he's a complete butcher in the field, he wasn't even hitting the ball. And you want to talk about a guy who can hurt team chemistry. We don't need Nomar.

I just couldn't think of another AVAILABLE good hitting SS or 3B better than him. Man I hope there is one out there. A 3B who can catch pop ups in a big game wouldn't hurt either. And everyone quit blaming Viz, he got the guy out!

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
Rally:

Lack of capital letters especially with the letter I (or in your case i) and a run on comment for three of four lines, makes things a little hard to understand.

Feel free to retire now and dream your sweet October dreams.

Lip
Lippleasedonttakeyourdarkcloudfrustrationsoutonmei msorrythaticannotmeetyourimpeccablewritingstandard siwilltrytodobetterinthefuturethatisunlessimamtoos caredtocomebackbecauseyouhavetriedtoscaremeawaylik eiamsomenewbietroll.kissmyass. :whiner: :whiner:

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
We had our losing streak right before the AS game - fortunately 3 against Tampa Bay in the middle made it seem not as bad as it was and the AS break came at a perfect time.

We're gonna beat this team.

Hell, we swept NY 4 straight in NY, beat them 2/3 in Chicago in 2000, and they went to the WS and we went 3 and out, so I don't buy this "confidence" stuff much either.
We're confident - we just played lousy.

The Yankees are used to playing in the big game. The Sox aren't. I would love to know the Sox record with more than 30K people in the stadium.

JB98
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
And Buehrle didn't have it tonight either. Giving back 2 runs after going up 4-1 was a killer.

Manny and his ef ing hugs after home runs... grr.

Mark wasn't great tonight, but he wasn't poor either. He's a guy who relies on defense, and the defense killed him tonight. In that fifth inning, Rowand misplayed the fly by Renteria, and Crede didn't time his jump correctly on that little bloop hit by Ortiz. And Iguchi and AJ combined to butcher up that play in the seventh inning.

Honestly, I thought Mark pitched well enough to win, although he was less than his best.

Everyone is blaming Crede and Vizcaino, but there are plenty of goats tonight. This loss really, really hurts. Call me a dark cloud if you wish, but I won't be sleeping well tonight. I just hate losing so much, and I especially hate losing to the grab-ass Fake Sox.

balke
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
:D: .....are you :angry: ?



But anyway just chalk this one up...it's one of those losses that was inevitable.


The red sox baseball team has a godly like offense...so hope that your starting pitchers can go at least 6 innings and only give up 4 runs. If so then your team has put themselves in a position to win.

Hopefully "Your" team chokes to death on its 220 million dollar salary that has given them a slightly above average team this season. Kevin Brown for 18 mil... yay. Going back after Soriano are you? Good, 240 million for the Yankees. Sox will still be the best team at the end of the season. Yanks in all likelihood will be paying their players to watch the Playoffs from their respective couches.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 10:57 PM
We had our losing streak right before the AS game - fortunately 3 against Tampa Bay in the middle made it seem not as bad as it was and the AS break came at a perfect time.

We're gonna beat this team.

Hell, we swept NY 4 straight in NY, beat them 2/3 in Chicago in 2000, and they went to the WS and we went 3 and out, so I don't buy this "confidence" stuff much either.
We're confident - we just played lousy.


See why is everyone saying this? Mark buerhle was not horrible out there tonight he pitched well enough to win. The errors were not easy plays as i've already said. Vizcaino made his pitches except one (crede's play was hard to make so don't blame it on him; the ball switched direction numerous times), politte pitched extremely well and cotts as well.

Face it, the red sox just played better today.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 10:58 PM
Uribe striking out on a pitch over his head after he had a 3-1 count just killed me. We really need to upgrade the left side of the infield. I'm hoping the Cubs lose the next 7 in a row so they will trade us Nomar if he really is coming back. We need a stick like him for the left side of the infield for October. Are we going to win a World Series with Crede and Uribe on the left side? We could, but I'd rather not try.

As bad as Uribe is at the plate, he's a gold glover in my opinion. I don't really care what he hits. Crede, however is not. He's good, not a wizard.

Uribe's the kind of shortstop you want out there in October. It's not a critical offensive position like third base is. But there's no one viable out there to replace Crede, so it's moot. We need bullpen help and I'd like Burnett or someone of that caliber as well. What is one bat gonna do for this team? It's not like Mike Schmidt is on the block. No third baseman out there is going to get us a World Series. We need to fine tune our strengths. Tonight's defensive brain fart was an exception. That's not gonna happen teamwide like that but once in a blue moon. Adding pitching improves our ability to win these close one-run, two-run games that we've won ALL YEAR. That's what we need. If we can get a nice bench bat along with our starter or reliever that would help.

skobabe8
07-21-2005, 10:59 PM
You make it sound like Vizcaino had 100% control of the at bat. You do realize that Manny freaking Ramirez was at the plate, don't you? This wasn't a simulated game, Cub fan.

I dont think Viz knew it was Manny. Or else maybe he would have thrown him something outside the zone instead of in the exact same spot as the previous pitch. NEWSFLASH: HE WONT MISS IT TWICE!

Stop being a baby and actually battle for a change.

GregoryEtc
07-21-2005, 10:59 PM
Aren't we still 30 games over .500? Let me check....


Yep. 30 games over. On pace for 107 wins. Let's friggin trade everyone!

WhiteSox = Life
07-21-2005, 10:59 PM
Wow, I've never seen such end-of-the-world histrionics crammed in with vitriolic fervor worthy of personal vendetta upstaging.

Please, whoever you are Ė and whether you know you are or not, and even if you're not Ė take it easy. Let's try to be a bit calmer and more rational.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 10:59 PM
I am a concerned about our problems winning games at home lately though. The same thing has happened to the Nats recently and they've gone into a major funk.

Not being able to win in front of big, home crowds is extremely discouraging.

A good goal now, is to split this series and take 2 of 3 in KC. El Duque has to step up and we need the good JC to show up as well. This is the time for the Cohiba twins to show and prove.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 11:00 PM
I just couldn't think of another AVAILABLE good hitting SS or 3B better than him. Man I hope there is one out there. A 3B who can catch pop ups in a big game wouldn't hurt either. And everyone quit blaming Viz, he got the guy out!

No...he did not. Did you see that pitch he threw to Ramirez? Give ME 3 of those and I will drill one somewhere. He sucks.

itsnotrequired
07-21-2005, 11:01 PM
The Yankees are used to playing in the big game. The Sox aren't. I would love to know the Sox record with more than 30K people in the stadium.

I believe it is 8-11. 2-8 over the last 10 games with 30K+.

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:01 PM
Lippleasedonttakeyourdarkcloudfrustrationsoutonmei msorrythaticannotmeetyourimpeccablewritingstandard siwilltrytodobetterinthefuturethatisunlessimamtoos caredtocomebackbecauseyouhavetriedtoscaremeawaylik eiamsomenewbietroll.kissmyass. :whiner: :whiner:

It's been a tough night for all Sox fans. So please, let's act like adults.

MUsoxfan
07-21-2005, 11:01 PM
Aren't we still 30 games over .500? Let me check....


Yep. 30 games over. On pace for 107 wins. Let's friggin trade everyone!

I second your post

Tragg
07-21-2005, 11:01 PM
See why is everyone saying this? Mark buerhle was not horrible out there tonight he pitched well enough to win. The errors were not easy plays as i've already said. Vizcaino made his pitches except one (crede's play was hard to make so don't blame it on him; the ball switched direction numerous times), politte pitched extremely well and cotts as well.

Face it, the red sox just played better today.

Hell, you said it yourself - the Red Sox played better - and they did because we didn't play well. The Red Sox aren't going anywhere this year, except home after their 162.

We aren't going to win playing Clayton ball - making only easy plays. As someone said above, we MUST play great defense to win. So they're tough plays - we need to make them and we have been. Tonight we didn't and, thus, we played lousy.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 11:01 PM
Hopefully "Your" team chokes to death on its 220 million dollar salary that has given them a slightly above average team this season. Kevin Brown for 18 mil... yay. Going back after Soriano are you? Good, 240 million for the Yankees. Sox will still be the best team at the end of the season. Yanks in all likelihood will be paying their players to watch the Playoffs from their respective couches.

Why are you so pissed off at the Yankees fan? I know you hate the Yankees, but this guy is trying to talk you off the ledge and you are hatin on him for it. Some days are just odd and this is one of them. Thank God this day is over.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 11:02 PM
Kevin Brown for 18 mil... yay.


:mad:

Sox will still be the best team at the end of the season.

LOL after this game some people would ask you which sox team are you talking about? I also hope you mean the whole season because being the best @ the end of the regular season, means nothing at al..

Again, i think they have the talent but not the confidence and yes my yankees will be a team to reckon with.

balke
07-21-2005, 11:02 PM
Aren't we still 30 games over .500? Let me check....


Yep. 30 games over. On pace for 107 wins. Let's friggin trade everyone!



Totally, if I hear one more person say "Kenny's gotta make a move"... good lord.

Do what makes sense, don't do something stupid out of panic. I would love a Guardado or Wagner by the Deadline on the team. I would not love losing Marte and Mccarthy or Anderson in the acquisition.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 11:02 PM
Put down the gun. Losses happen. The world's an imperfect place

It's not loaded though, I don't think.

Let's hope Frank is available soon. And Hermy's back is OK. Oh, and the Twins and Oakland won again. And Iguchi misses Shingo. Man I hope it's not loaded.

GREAT THROW BY TIMO THOUGH! That was cool.

GregoryEtc
07-21-2005, 11:03 PM
It's been a tough night for all Sox fans. So please, let's act like adults.

Whatever, Poopieface! :smile:

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 11:04 PM
Manny hit that homer in the ninth... but the Sox went out with a whimper in the bottom of that same inning. Wish is was the Farns out there instead of My Right Foot.

Pods has to stop bunting in those situations... he also has to start thinking about swinging at the first pitch. Every team has gone after him from the start since the Oakland series. Time for Walker to earn his keep and make some adjustments.

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 11:05 PM
GREAT THROW BY TIMO THOUGH! That was cool.

Timo's a smart ball player, maybe not the most talented guy out there, but he knows what to do.

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 11:05 PM
:mad:



LOL after this game some people would ask you which sox team are you talking about? I also hope you mean the whole season because being the best @ the end of the regular season, means nothing at al..

Again, i think they have the talent but not the confidence and yes my yankees will be a team to reckon with.

Then go talk about your Yankees. Your borderline trolling isn't needed here. We don't give a flying **** about "your yankees." Go worry about "your yankees" finding a 3rd starter.

MUsoxfan
07-21-2005, 11:06 PM
Pods has to stop bunting in those situations... he also has to start thinking about swinging at the first pitch. Every team has gone after him from the start since the Oakland series. Time for Walker to earn his keep and make some adjustments.

Funny how nobody says that when he bunts for a hit or goes 1-0

beckett21
07-21-2005, 11:06 PM
LOL after this game some people would ask you which sox team are you talking about? I also hope you mean the whole season because being the best @ the end of the regular season, means nothing at al..

Again, i think they have the talent but not the confidence and yes my yankees will be a team to reckon with.

Take note of the little guy in the pinstripes closest to the door...


:deadtrolls

PAPChiSox729
07-21-2005, 11:06 PM
GREAT THROW BY TIMO THOUGH! That was cool.

That was a great peg. Very impressive.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 11:07 PM
Totally, if I hear one more person say "Kenny's gotta make a move"... good lord.

Do what makes sense, don't do something stupid out of panic.

Thank you.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 11:07 PM
Totally, if I hear one more person say "Kenny's gotta make a move"... good lord.

Do what makes sense, don't do something stupid out of panic. I would love a Guardado or Wagner by the Deadline on the team. I would not love losing Marte and Mccarthy or Anderson in the acquisition.

I wouldn't want to lose Marte, but who gives a rat's ass about McCarthy and Anderson? These guys are not that great of prospects, let's be serious here. They're just typically overhyped Sox farmhands. They have talent, but come on. No one in our farm system is going to keep me from going for the World Series right now. Because believe me when I tell you: You put this same team on the field next year and we're not 30 games over .500.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 11:07 PM
Go worry about "your yankees" finding a 3rd starter.

And a fourth, and a fifth...:roflmao:

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 11:07 PM
Then go talk about your Yankees. Your borderline trolling isn't needed here. We don't give a flying **** about "your yankees." Go worry about "your yankees" finding a 3rd starter.

*** did i say man? How am i trolling? Did I not say good things about the sox team? *** man...someone attacks my team after i say good stuff about the sox.

I don't understand.

balke
07-21-2005, 11:07 PM
Why are you so pissed off at the Yankees fan? I know you hate the Yankees, but this guy is trying to talk you off the ledge and you are hatin on him for it. Some days are just odd and this is one of them. Thank God this day is over.


I'm not on a ledge, you are. There's a Yankee fan in the postgame thread talking about big crowds and how bad the White Sox are. Last I checked, this was one game we should've won, and we have the best record in baseball. We'll win tomorrow. Right now, the Yanks are blowing a 3 run lead in the 7th because their Bullpen and Pitching is terrible. Must be the crowds fault.

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:08 PM
See why is everyone saying this? Mark buerhle was not horrible out there tonight he pitched well enough to win. The errors were not easy plays as i've already said. Vizcaino made his pitches except one (crede's play was hard to make so don't blame it on him; the ball switched direction numerous times), politte pitched extremely well and cotts as well.

Face it, the red sox just played better today.

Thanks for the newsflash. The White Sox played poorly today, so it doesn't take a lot of genius to say the Red Sox played better. That fact is pretty damn obvious, don't you think?

I don't care if those errors were "not easy plays" or not. This is the big leagues. Make the damn play. That's what our guys have done all year, and that's why they are 62-32. They just didn't do it tonight.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 11:08 PM
Why are you so pissed off at the Yankees fan? I know you hate the Yankees, but this guy is trying to talk you off the ledge and you are hatin on him for it.
BS he is.
He's doing a latent troll act.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 11:08 PM
It's been a tough night for all Sox fans. So please, let's act like adults.
I agree. Just because i didn't capitalize all my "I's" and what-not doesn't mean I should be treated like a jerk because someone can't handle 1 loss. And I don't believe I was "ripping" (or whatever Lip said) anyone except dark clouds. Did that hit a little to close to home?

starboy0
07-21-2005, 11:09 PM
I couldn't tell from watching it on Extra Innings, but how many Red Sox fans were there? When Manny hit that dinger in the ninth it sounded like half the stadium was cheering.

It sure did. I had to look again thinking Carl had actually gotten a hit hearing the crowd roar. Makes me sick. All those people did not travel from Boston.

shoota
07-21-2005, 11:09 PM
*****. Why don't you go rail on Rowand for not catching an easy flyout that could have prevented a big inning. Or on Iguchi for mishandling a ground ball that could have saved a run.

He only "cost" us this game because he tied it up for us.

I bet you say there smiling knowing that you could come here and prove to us how right you are. Get over your sick obsession.

Rowand's got to catch that ball. The one hit at Iguchi was hit really hard and had one of those tough-to-field hops right in front of him. AJ has got to make that out at the plate, or at least stop it from going to the backstop and letting two baserunners move up. But what all three of those plays have in common is that they were tough plays. Crede's play was easy.

Rowand was running full speed for a ball near the wall, Iguchi had to field a hard hit ball, AJP had tried to field a one-hopper with a man barrelling down on him. Crede's was a clear error on a pop up in foul territory! Huge difference, even though the other three men have to do better too.

Bruce Levine said Sean Burroughs is available. Speizio available, Mackowiak, and Randa. Either of those will work.

And no, I'm not smiling. Though I was when Crede's gapper tied the game.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 11:09 PM
Funny how nobody says that when he bunts for a hit or goes 1-0

Bottom nine... you need to get on. Schilling is throwing nothing but 88-90 mph fastballs down the middle. Pick one and drive it.

I have no problem with him doing it early and getting a lead. But when Mueller is 3 feet away from home plate, you have to go to plan B.

balke
07-21-2005, 11:09 PM
I wouldn't want to lose Marte, but who gives a rat's ass about McCarthy and Anderson? These guys are not that great of prospects, let's be serious here. They're just typically overhyped Sox farmhands. They have talent, but come on. No one in our farm system is going to keep me from going for the World Series right now. Because believe me when I tell you: You put this same team on the field next year and we're not 30 games over .500.


I don't care about moving the Prospects, but Marte with them would be stupid. If Mccarthy brings a solid Closer, so be it at this point. Marte is too much to throw in the equation.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 11:09 PM
Timo's a smart ball player, maybe not the most talented guy out there, but he knows what to do.

that really was one of the best plays all year by any player. Timo suprised me, i knew he was a sound player but not that SOUND!

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 11:10 PM
*** did i say man? How am i trolling? Did I not say good things about the sox team? *** man...someone attacks my team after i say good stuff about the sox.

I don't understand.

This isn't a Yankees board. We don't care about the Yankees. We don't want to hear about how "your Yankees" are going to be a force. You want to talk about the Sox? Talk about the Sox. That's it. Don't make comparisons to your Yankees and talk crap about how your Yankees have been there before. We don't care about your Yankees. I don't know how much clearer I have to be.

beckett21
07-21-2005, 11:10 PM
*** did i say man? How am i trolling? Did I not say good things about the sox team? *** man...someone attacks my team after i say good stuff about the sox.

I don't understand.

31-25... is that what you mean by saying *good stuff* ?

:dtroll:

chitownhawkfan
07-21-2005, 11:10 PM
Wow, those guys on BBTN are such good analysts they can predict the future. All it took was for Harold Reynolds to mention how defense was our Achilles Heel and look what happens. It just goes to show, Harold Reynolds, Botox faced Campbell, and Krukkie the pig really know what they are talking about. I hope they dont predict us to blow our double digit lead.

Vernam
07-21-2005, 11:10 PM
Here are a few reasons tonight's loss won't cost me any sleep:

Crede, Rowand, and Iguchi won't commit errors in the same game again if they all play together 'til they're 50.

Giving up a homer to ManRam doesn't qualify Vizcaino for the waiver list.

Billy Koch is still collecting unemployment, and we have roughly 4 or 5 choices at closer who are better than him.

Ozzie will do everything humanly possible to keep the team from a.) declaring premature victory in the pennant race or b.) panicking because they've hit a rough patch. (Is it possible to do both at once?! :redneck)

Kenny will not fail to fill any of the obvious gaps and will have a much clearer idea which are the most pressing needs by Monday morning.

VC

balke
07-21-2005, 11:11 PM
Rowand's got to catch that ball. The one hit at Iguchi was hit really hard and had one of those tough-to-field hops right in front of him. AJ has got to make that out at the plate, or at least stop it from going to the backstop and letting two baserunners move up. But what all three of those plays have in common is that they were tough plays. Crede's play was easy.



Wow, do you even listen to yourself? The wind Caught Crede's ball. But regardless, Aaron's ball fell in his glove, Iguchi's ball fell in his glove. They were all easy plays. Get over it.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 11:11 PM
Here are a few reasons tonight's loss won't cost me any sleep:

Crede, Rowand, and Iguchi won't commit errors in the same game again if they all play together 'til they're 50.

Giving up a homer to ManRam doesn't qualify Vizcaino for the waiver list.

Billy Koch is still collecting unemployment, and we have roughly 4 or 5 choices at closer who are better than him.

Ozzie will do everything humanly possible to keep the team from a.) declaring premature victory in the pennant race or b.) panicking because they've hit a rough patch. (Is it possible to do both at once?! :redneck)

Kenny will not fail to fill any of the obvious gaps and will have a much clearer idea which are the most pressing needs by Monday morning.

VC
Good post. The voice of reason.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 11:11 PM
I'm not on a ledge, you are.

Good come back.

Personally I don't care what the guy says, it really has no bearing on anything. The Yankees suck and, if he's smart, he should want the White Sox to win this series. Otherwise he's a retard.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 11:11 PM
I wouldn't want to lose Marte, but who gives a rat's ass about McCarthy and Anderson? These guys are not that great of prospects, let's be serious here. They're just typically overhyped Sox farmhands. They have talent, but come on. No one in our farm system is going to keep me from going for the World Series right now. Because believe me when I tell you: .500.
Who that we could trade for is going to get us to a WS?

mikesouthside
07-21-2005, 11:11 PM
For as mad as I am/was...after reading some of these posts...PEOPLE RELAX...It's good to read the passion.....I hate the loss, but tomorrow is a new day. Keep your heads up people.


GO SOX......

Jjav829
07-21-2005, 11:12 PM
Bruce Levine said Sean Burroughs is available. Speizio available, Mackowiak, and Randa. Either of those will work.


You gotta be kidding me. You think Crede's offense is bad and yet you want Sean Burroughs. Go check out Sean Burroughs numbers. And Burroughs is nowhere near the defensive 3B Crede is. Same for Spiezio. I can't believe you'd actually bring up these crappy names as alternates.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-21-2005, 11:12 PM
Not being able to win in front of big, home crowds is extremely discouraging.

A good goal now, is to split this series and take 2 of 3 in KC.


I'm really trying not to be negative here, but everybody don't panic if we don't play well in Kansas City. I've seen it too many times, after playing a big series if the next team is terrible, there is a let down and you usually blow that next series. Hopefully that doesn't happen to us but I wouldn't be shocked. Speaking of KC, couldn't we have used TonyG?

NSSoxFan
07-21-2005, 11:13 PM
Bruce Levine said Sean Burroughs is available. Speizio available, Mackowiak, and Randa. Either of those will work.

And no, I'm not smiling. Though I was when Crede's gapper tied the game.

Shoota, it's time to ****. I am not the only one that has grown tired of your moronic bull****. Until you can lace up some cleats and go do ANYTHING in a Major League uniform, SHUT UP.

Would you have the guts to tell Joe Crede anything like this to his face? Something give me a sneaking suspicion that you would curl up in a little ball and start shaking if the situation ever arose. Who are you? You are a rediculous self-loathing person.

RallyBowl
07-21-2005, 11:13 PM
Bottom line- my 3 out of 4 prediction still stands. Rally out.

Tragg
07-21-2005, 11:14 PM
Bruce Levine said Sean Burroughs is available. Speizio available, Mackowiak, and Randa. Either of those will work.
Work for what? For food? That's about what they're worth.

Paid Santiago
07-21-2005, 11:14 PM
Thanks for the newsflash. The White Sox played poorly today, so it doesn't take a lot of genius to say the Red Sox played better. That fact is pretty damn obvious, don't you think?

I don't care if those errors were "not easy plays" or not. This is the big leagues. Make the damn play. That's what our guys have done all year, and that's why they are 62-32. They just didn't do it tonight.


you expect them to make the hard plays all year? That's crazy. The whitesox are in 1st place because they've made every single routine play and have not messed up on those. There are far more routine plays to make then spectacular plays. If you lose games due to spectacular plays then just tip your cap. The errors didnt help them win but they were not great atrocities.

Again the white sox can take solace in that this is a good chance to collect playoff like experience throughout the season. The red sox offense is amazing and does this to everybody so don't be shocked that buerhle and co were not immune.

The white sox can still come out with a spilt and i believe they will.

balke
07-21-2005, 11:15 PM
Why are people talking about KC? This was the first game of a 4-game set. I'm not looking forward to anything, but winning the next 3 games outright.

BeviBall!
07-21-2005, 11:15 PM
Keep Frank off the DL until after tomorrow's game. We need him to hit those knuckleballs.

They're throwing Wakefield, Miller and Arroyo next. We have an advantage in every game there. Miller worries me a little, but we should start hitting. As weird as it may seem with MB on the hill, this was the one even start on paper.

balke
07-21-2005, 11:17 PM
Keep Frank off the DL until after tomorrow's game. We need him to hit those knuckleballs.

They're throwing Wakefield, Miller and Arroyo next. We have an advantage in every game there. Miller worries me a little, but we should start hitting. As weird as it may seem with MB on the hill, this was the one even start on paper.


Sweet, I can't wait to see Wakefield. T-ball anyone? Pods is going to own him hard.

shoota
07-21-2005, 11:18 PM
Lippleasedonttakeyourdarkcloudfrustrationsoutonmei msorrythaticannotmeetyourimpeccablewritingstandard siwilltrytodobetterinthefuturethatisunlessimamtoos caredtocomebackbecauseyouhavetriedtoscaremeawaylik eiamsomenewbietroll.kissmyass. :whiner: :whiner:

:rolling:

thatwasverynicelydonerallybowl

Sonik22
07-21-2005, 11:19 PM
Once again were looking our first 4 -game loosing streak straight in the face lets go get em tomorrow boys.:angry:

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:20 PM
I agree. Just because i didn't capitalize all my "I's" and what-not doesn't mean I should be treated like a jerk because someone can't handle 1 loss. And I don't believe I was "ripping" (or whatever Lip said) anyone except dark clouds. Did that hit a little to close to home?

After a loss like this, I don't want to read posts about punctuation. And I don't want to read posts where Sox fans are accusing other Sox fans of being dark clouds or what have you. We're all on the same side here, and I'm just tired of the name-calling that seems to go on each time we lose a game. That's all.

Yes, tonight's loss has me a little down. So sue me.

Blueprint1
07-21-2005, 11:20 PM
Crede tied the game with a double off of Curt Schilling in the 8th inning. Then, a half inning later, he drops an easy Manny Ramirez pop up in foul ground that hit his glove. ManRam then goes on to hit the game-winning home run.

Chalk up another unofficial Crede error in the shoota scorebook.

This really debunks the theory that Crede saves more runs with his defense than a Joe Randa contributes to with his bat. Crede's errorless play this week cost the Sox 4 runs and maybe two wins. His first unofficial error was against the Tigers where his indecision on how to field a hopper, ate him up on what should have been the third out of the inning. The Tigers went on to score their first 3 runs that inning.

And today he cost us the winning run with his missed pop up. That's 4 runs he's cost this team with his glove.


shutup

NSSoxFan
07-21-2005, 11:20 PM
:rolling:

thatwasverynicelydonerallybowl

shootapleaseleavewsiandnevercomeback

shoota
07-21-2005, 11:21 PM
See why is everyone saying this? Mark buerhle was not horrible out there tonight he pitched well enough to win. The errors were not easy plays as i've already said. Vizcaino made his pitches except one (crede's play was hard to make so don't blame it on him; the ball switched direction numerous times), politte pitched extremely well and cotts as well.

Face it, the red sox just played better today.

Why do you keep saying that? It's a pop up, not pong.

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 11:21 PM
Once again were looking our first 4 -game loosing streak straight in the face lets go get em tomorrow boys.:angry:

HAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHAHA

Yeah, might wanna consider a new sig.

MRKARNO
07-21-2005, 11:23 PM
Forget the tomatoes, this thread is a double Dark Cloud thread:

http://www.hprcc.unl.edu/nebraska/ap_iowa_tornado_990517_h.jpg http://earth.rice.edu/mtpe/atmo/atmosphere/what_images/dark_clouds%28small%29.jpg

balke
07-21-2005, 11:24 PM
As mad at Crede right now as I am, I am much more pissed at Rowand for dropping that ball and at Iguchi for not making that ground ball play. When you start making mistakes it becomes contagious just like good defense does.

And I'm REALLY pissed at PK for sucking. This is your playoff PK, pop-ups and groundouts. You can deny it but you know deep down that's it. Same goes for Frank, history tells me that.
Feel bad for Buerhle. The ace was out there and he gets nothing behind him.


This is what I meant by you being on the ledge MIgrenade. It was not meant to be a snappy burn, I'm just saying I have confidence in the Sox future. Your posts sound more like you anticipate disaster, and are calling out PK... who hit a Hr and had a great basket catch that looked to be dropping into play.

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:25 PM
you expect them to make the hard plays all year? That's crazy. The whitesox are in 1st place because they've made every single routine play and have not messed up on those. There are far more routine plays to make then spectacular plays. If you lose games due to spectacular plays then just tip your cap. The errors didnt help them win but they were not great atrocities.

Again the white sox can take solace in that this is a good chance to collect playoff like experience throughout the season. The red sox offense is amazing and does this to everybody so don't be shocked that buerhle and co were not immune.

The white sox can still come out with a spilt and i believe they will.

Sorry, but the pop up by Ramirez was not a difficult play. Crede makes that play 999 times out of 1,000. Rowand normally makes that play on Renteria too. The error on Iguchi was the only one that I thought was a tough chance. On the throw to the plate, AJ has to block that ball. Period.

Chisox003
07-21-2005, 11:26 PM
Wow, going on 15 pages, 13 of which I'm sure is garbage and a whole lot of :whiner:

Tough loss, for sure...But I cant even begin to read this thread as Im sure the Dark Clouds have made this their home tonight

Someone else needs to talk these people off the ledge though...Tough, thankless job, but someone has to do it....Wait, no, nobody has to do it

Jump Dark Clouds, JUMP!!

chisoxmike
07-21-2005, 11:26 PM
Forget the tomatoes, this thread is a double Dark Cloud thread:

http://www.hprcc.unl.edu/nebraska/ap_iowa_tornado_990517_h.jpg http://earth.rice.edu/mtpe/atmo/atmosphere/what_images/dark_clouds%28small%29.jpg

We need those as a tag, because I think the Sox will lose a game or two before the end of the season :D:

Region Sox
07-21-2005, 11:27 PM
I think those bad sideburns should be called "Lamb Chops".

C'monstretch
07-21-2005, 11:27 PM
i just got home from the game and am not going to view all 14 pages of the PG thread but i do know this.... last time we lost three games, we came back for a consecutive 8game win rally. the proof is there and so is Garland tomorrow. Go Git Em White Sox!

batmanZoSo
07-21-2005, 11:28 PM
Once again were looking our first 4 -game loosing streak straight in the face lets go get em tomorrow boys.:angry:

This one isn't much better. :wink:

Sonik22
07-21-2005, 11:29 PM
Sorry, but the pop up by Ramirez was not a difficult play. Crede makes that play 999 times out of 1,000. Rowand normally makes that play on Renteria too. The error on Iguchi was the only one that I thought was a tough chance. On the throw to the plate, AJ has to block that ball. Period.
Its not that hard to block a ball when somebody is sliding spikes first into you.

SouthSide4Life
07-21-2005, 11:30 PM
i just got home from the game and am not going to view all 14 pages of the PG thread but i do know this.... last time we lost three games, we came back for a consecutive 8game win rally. the proof is there and so is Garland tomorrow. Go Git Em White Sox!C'monstretch, not only do you have an excellent username but you are a true member of the White Sox Army!

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:30 PM
You gotta be kidding me. You think Crede's offense is bad and yet you want Sean Burroughs. Go back out Sean Burroughs numbers. And Burroughs is nowhere near the defensive 3B Crede is. Same for Spiezio. I can't believe you'd actually bring up these crappy names as alternates.

Sox fans always think the grass in greener on the other side. If people on this board had to watch Burroughs or Spiezio play every day, they'd regret the comments they are making about Crede.

Burroughs has no extra-base power whatsoever. Spiezio is one of the worst fielders in the American League. Essentially, he's a DH, and not a very good one at that.

I'm a Crede supporter, although there's no denying he made a costly mistake tonight. I'll take my chances with Joe over all the available alternatives.

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 11:32 PM
I think those bad sideburns should be called "Lamb Chops".

They're not coming in very well. I think I first noticed them on July 4th. If that was me, the chops would look like Elvis already!

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:33 PM
Its not that hard to block a ball when somebody is sliding spikes first into you.

I'm not saying it's easy. I am saying it has to be done. AJ should have come out in front of the plate and caught it on the fly if he had to. I can live with the tying run scoring if we can stop the runners from taking the extra base.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 11:34 PM
This is what I meant by you being on the ledge MIgrenade. It was a snappy burn, I'm just saying I have confidence in the Sox future. Your posts sound more like you anticipate disaster, and are calling out PK... who hit a Hr and had a great basket catch that looked to be dropping into play.

Actually all I did was point out fairly obvious things. If you aren't concerned about PK in situations like that then you aren't paying attention. And, as for the defense comment, I think it's obvious this team needs to play good defense but there are a few games this season where they have 3 errors. It becomes contagious.
I know one thing for absolute sure. If the Sox win this series all of these threads and posts are old news.
To be fair, I felt like I was on the ledge right after the game ended. Then I came to WSI and I realized I'm much more calm than others.

Region Sox
07-21-2005, 11:34 PM
I worked the 4th and 5th and was out of town for the Oakland series. I first noticed at Cleveland. hideous. They are not helping his game too much.

LuvSox
07-21-2005, 11:36 PM
My money says Ozzie will put his foot in this teams ass. They are about to go on a tear. All is well people, all is well.

infohawk
07-21-2005, 11:36 PM
Eh, I'm more upset about losing the series to the Tigers than I am about losing this game.

It was a close, hard-fought game. Crede's play was a double-edged sword. You can argue that he was instrumental in blowing the game with his error, or you can argue that the Sox would have lost anyway but for his big RBI double in the 8th. I thought that Tadahito's errors were pretty tough errors. Ortiz ball looked difficult to field, and Tadahito's throw didn't sail, but couldn't be handled by A.J. because Damon clipped his leg (cleanly). I don't mean to make excuses about errors that cost the team runs, but I personally didn't think they were of the particularly "stupid" variety (like Joe's).

Speaking of Joe, he deserves very quick forgiveness for his mistake. Fact is, Joe Crede is one of the best defensive third baseman in the game. He had a very impressive errorless streak going and deserves to be cut some slack. While his offense sometimes leaves something to be desired, he is a special defensive player who has spoiled us with exceptional defensive play. How many games has he saved this year with his defense?

Looking ahead to the playoffs. Boston is dangerous because they flat-out get on base. It seemed almost every inning was draining to watch because they were a hit away from doing some damage. If this is any indication of what they would be like in the playoffs, it may be beneficial to try and acquire a strike-out pitcher for either the rotation or the pen. This is just my initial "snap" judgement. I will be interested in seeing how the rest of the series goes.

Vernam
07-21-2005, 11:36 PM
Yes, tonight's loss has me a little down. So sue me.
That's right, it's a personal thing, dealing with losses like this. My dad was a real foot-through-the-tv kind of guy, even during 90-loss seasons. (Especially!) I missed that gene, fortunately, but I don't think it means I care any less. I always remember a great quote from Jack Nicholson, who got razzed a lot when the 80s Rockets knocked the Lakers out of the playoffs. Soon after, some reporter asked him whether he'd gotten over the loss and the teasing. He said words to the effect of, "Sports is entertainment. I don't watch it to punish myself."

If they lose one like this in the post-season, though, my tv isn't safe. :wink:

VC

shoota
07-21-2005, 11:37 PM
I think those bad sideburns should be called "Lamb Chops".

:rolling:

SouthSide4Life
07-21-2005, 11:47 PM
Eh, I'm more upset about losing the series to the Tigers than I am about losing this game.

It was a close, hard-fought game. Crede's play was a double-edged sword. You can argue that he was instrumental in blowing the game with his error, or you can argue that if it weren't for his big RBI double in the 8th, the Sox would have lost anyway. I thought that Tadahito's errors were pretty tough errors. Ortiz ball looked difficult to field, and Tadahito's throw didn't sail, but couldn't be handled by A.J. because Damon clipped his leg (cleanly). I don't mean to make excuses about errors that cost the team runs, but I personally didn't think they were of the particularly "stupid" variety (like Joe's).

Speaking of Joe, he deserves very quick forgiveness for his mistake. Fact is, Joe Crede is one of the best defensive third baseman in the game. He had a very impressive errorless streak going, and deserves to be cut some slack. While his offense sometimes leaves something to be desired, he is a special defensive player who has spoiled us with exceptional defensive play. How many games has he saved this year with his defense?

Looking ahead to the playoffs. Boston is dangerous because they flat-out get on base. It seemed almost every inning was draining to watch because they were a hit away from doing some damage. If this is any indication of what they would be like in the playoffs, it may be beneficial to try and acquire a strike-out pitcher for either the rotation or the pen. This is just my initial "snap" judgement. I will be interested in seeing how the rest of the series goes.ok first off, i am tired of hearing the bitching about Credes error. was it stupid? of course. will it happen again? highly unlikely. true hes a helluva defensive 3rd baseman but i would personally take Chavez or Blalock over him. In regards to Gooch. one of the double plays was tuff and probably couldnt be turned so it was broken up, the other is inexcusable, just more to WoRk on! now Boston is the best hitting team in the AL. i thought it was dangerous to do the intentional walk. as said in espn 1000s PG, "Pick your poison with Boston hitters." their worst hitting player is battin high .270s not bad. however, Garland will kill tomorrow.

MIgrenade
07-21-2005, 11:49 PM
My money says Ozzie will put his foot in this teams ass. They are about to go on a tear. All is well people, all is well.

Totally agree. We are the only fans who would get worried about a 10 game lead. It's amazing.
I said this in another thread, the Twins will hit a bad streak soon.

FielderJones
07-21-2005, 11:50 PM
I can't believe some of the crap I'm reading here tonight. Some of you need to get a grip.

The "World Champions" need three defensive miscues to beat us, and you guys are ready to jump off the Michigan Avenue bridge?! There won't be another game this year when that kind of bad mojo happens again.

***** :angry:

markopat
07-21-2005, 11:50 PM
Most devestating loss of the year. No doubt about it. How we play from here on out will tell us how resiliant we are.

Strong word man...I believe in us! We will prevail!

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:51 PM
That's right, it's a personal thing, dealing with losses like this. My dad was a real foot-through-the-tv kind of guy, even during 90-loss seasons. (Especially!) I missed that gene, fortunately, but I don't think it means I care any less. I always remember a great quote from Jack Nicholson, who got razzed a lot when the 80s Rockets knocked the Lakers out of the playoffs. Soon after, some reporter asked him whether he'd gotten over the loss and the teasing. He said words to the effect of, "Sports is entertainment. I don't watch it to punish myself."

If they lose one like this in the post-season, though, my tv isn't safe. :wink:

VC

You're right, of course. Sports is not life or death, but sometimes I'm too intense of a competitor for my own good. My competitiveness served me well when I was a kid playing ball, but now that I'm older and just a fan, that same character trait often causes me to act like a fool.

Some guys are like Ditka. They start smashing things and using excessive amounts of profanity when they lose a game. Others are like Buerhle. Calm and cool in both victory and defeat. On nights like tonight, I find myself wishing I was more like Buerhle and less like Ditka. When we lose a tough one, everyone around me tends to find out what a sore loser I am.

SouthSide4Life
07-21-2005, 11:53 PM
I can't believe some of the crap I'm reading here tonight. Some of you need to get a grip.

The "World Champions" need three defensive miscues to beat us, and you guys are ready to jump off the Michigan Avenue bridge?! There won't be another game this year when that kind of bad mojo happens again.

***** :angry:we cannot blame the loss on the 3 errors, eventho costly, we still would have lost.

FielderJones
07-21-2005, 11:56 PM
we cannot blame the loss on the 3 errors, eventho costly, we still would have lost.

Um, no. Review the tape.

mdep524
07-21-2005, 11:58 PM
Here's the "good" thing about tonight's loss: it's not at all indicative of how we actually play. This isn't the kind of loss that foreshadows playoff doom- we made 3 errors in the field that led to runs, then add Aaron's drop...that's not going to happen on a regular basis with this team.

I'd like to see a cleaner, tighter game tomorrow, but this loss, while frustrating, is not really that big of a deal. I would like to see a little more consistency at the plate however...solo homers are soooo 2003-04.

SouthSide4Life
07-21-2005, 11:58 PM
Um, no. Review the tape.dont need to, iwas there. Pitching son pitching. also poor infield performance by(guess who) (which did not include errors.)

JB98
07-21-2005, 11:59 PM
we cannot blame the loss on the 3 errors, eventho costly, we still would have lost.

????????

Boston scored three unearned runs tonight. That's definitely the difference in a one-run game.

mike squires
07-22-2005, 12:02 AM
The sun will come out tomorrow.

I hope you're right. It's cloudy and rainy in Champaign right now.

FielderJones
07-22-2005, 12:03 AM
dont need to, iwas there. Pitching son pitching. also poor infield performance by(guess who) (which did not include errors.)

The pitching was fine. The extra outs are what cost three runs. Based on the bad punctuation, spelling, and sentence structure I would guess that you indulged in a few pops at the game. That may be affecting your memory and reasoning.

balke
07-22-2005, 12:04 AM
Here's the "good" thing about tonight's loss: it's not at all indicative of how we actually play. This isn't the kind of loss that foreshadows playoff doom- we made 3 errors in the field that led to runs, then add Aaron's drop...that's not going to happen on a regular basis with this team.

I'd like to see a cleaner, tighter game tomorrow, but this loss, while frustrating, is not really that big of a deal. I would like to see a little more consistency at the plate however...solo homers are soooo 2003-04.

To be fair, Everett's hr was a 2-run shot. Also, with no outs Konerko might as well swing for the fences, he's a base clogger. AND, I don't think we're as bad as the Cubs or anything when it comes to swinging away. The last run was scored on patience, and manufacturing of the run.

For the most part, the team was looking for hits and walks. When Clement gives you a cookie though (As he did several times, not just on the hr's) you gotta eat it.

SouthSide4Life
07-22-2005, 12:07 AM
The pitching was fine. The extra outs are what cost three runs. Based on the bad punctuation, spelling, and sentence structure I would guess that you indulged in a few pops at the game. That may be affecting your memory and reasoning.no lies, i did indulge. and last i checked, this is the internet and not a formal college essay where punctuation, capitalization, spelling and structure doesnt apply. stop gettin you butthair in a twist. just a friendly suggestion.

Lip Man 1
07-22-2005, 12:12 AM
South Side:

It just makes the posts harder to read and understand. Come on it's not that hard to use caps is it? :smile:

Back to the real issues now...

Personally I hope Ozzie has a 'little talk' with the team tomorrow. They don't look right, not focused at all since they got back from Cleveland. Remember Monday a no-name pitcher with no reputation made them look silly until the Tigers took him out. 'It's time...' for a little reminder Ozzie-style that nothing is locked up, the Sox haven't won dung yet and they still have 70 games to go.

Lip

FielderJones
07-22-2005, 12:14 AM
no lies, i did indulge. and last i checked, this is the internet and not a formal college essay where punctuation, capitalization, spelling and structure doesnt apply. stop gettin you butthair in a twist. just a friendly suggestion.

Here's a friendly suggestion. Try to make your point with a reasoned argument and logic. You'll find it's easier tomorrow morning when you sober up.

SoxSpeed22
07-22-2005, 12:14 AM
You play defense like that against a team like Boston, you're supposed to lose.
:chunks

SouthSide4Life
07-22-2005, 12:16 AM
South Side:

It just makes the posts harder to read and understand. Come on it's not that hard to use caps is it? :smile:

Back to the real issues now...

Personally I hope Ozzie has a 'little talk' with the team tomorrow. They don't look right, not focused at all since they got back from Cleveland. Remember Monday a no-name pitcher with no reputation made them look silly until the Tigers took him out. 'It's time...' for a little reminder Ozzie-style that nothing is locked up, the Sox haven't won dung yet and they still have 70 games to go.

Lipd o o l y noted LIP:D: i also hope OZ gives em a talk, 70 games is alot of playing time and with teams like the O's , Jays and Twinks(amongst others) the schedule doesnt get any easier.

SouthSide4Life
07-22-2005, 12:17 AM
Here's a friendly suggestion. Try to make your point with a reasoned argument and logic. You'll find it's easier tomorrow morning when you sober up.and your argument and logic is???

balke
07-22-2005, 12:19 AM
South Side:

It just makes the posts harder to read and understand. Come on it's not that hard to use caps is it? :smile:

Back to the real issues now...

Personally I hope Ozzie has a 'little talk' with the team tomorrow. They don't look right, not focused at all since they got back from Cleveland. Remember Monday a no-name pitcher with no reputation made them look silly until the Tigers took him out. 'It's time...' for a little reminder Ozzie-style that nothing is locked up, the Sox haven't won dung yet and they still have 70 games to go.

Lip


Is that no-name pitcher the guy who was throwing spitballs all game? Farmer (I think) kept saying Ozzie should've checked the ball, because his sinkers were dropping through the zone and hitting the dirt. That was a just a great pitch. He kept throwing the hard inside sinker, it was basically untouchable. Yeah, Douglass. Sox won that game. Crede's 3-run shot.

mdep524
07-22-2005, 12:19 AM
To be fair, Everett's hr was a 2-run shot. Also, with no outs Konerko might as well swing for the fences, he's a base clogger. AND, I don't think we're as bad as the Cubs or anything when it comes to swinging away. The last run was scored on patience, and manufacturing of the run.

For the most part, the team was looking for hits and walks. When Clement gives you a cookie though (As he did several times, not just on the hr's) you gotta eat it. You're right, it's far from a Cubs performance or a '03-'04 Sox performance, but we've still seen a greater reliance on solo homers lately than we had a few months ago.

Also, between Crede, Uribe, Pierzynski, Carl, Ozuna and Timo, it's like these guys will do anything possible to avoid taking a base on balls, which is frustrating. (Ironically, three of those guys had a walk tonight.)

batmanZoSo
07-22-2005, 12:22 AM
no lies, i did indulge. and last i checked, this is the internet and not a formal college essay where punctuation, capitalization, spelling and structure doesnt apply. stop gettin you butthair in a twist. just a friendly suggestion.

I love his use of language as well as general grammar. When he said "butthair," the imagery it evoked was just sublime. :roflmao:

JB98
07-22-2005, 12:23 AM
To be fair, Everett's hr was a 2-run shot. Also, with no outs Konerko might as well swing for the fences, he's a base clogger. AND, I don't think we're as bad as the Cubs or anything when it comes to swinging away. The last run was scored on patience, and manufacturing of the run.

For the most part, the team was looking for hits and walks. When Clement gives you a cookie though (As he did several times, not just on the hr's) you gotta eat it.

One other point on the Everett dinger: There was a man at third and one out. He's supposed to be trying to hit a fly ball there and he had the count in his favor. Why not swing for the fences? If you get under it and pop up, it's still a sac fly and an RBI. Sometimes a home run is the result of good situational hitting.

SouthSide4Life
07-22-2005, 12:24 AM
I love his use of language as well as general grammar. When he said "butthair," the imagery it evoked was just sublime. :roflmaobatman, this is the internet. why be so critical? do people actually get so irked by grammatical flaws that they feel obligated to post on it? i think when it all comes down to it, we're here to talk white sox and baseball. my advice to you, sir, chill out and remember what you're here to do. post game sox talk.

Lip Man 1
07-22-2005, 12:38 AM
Just read something on Reifert's 'blog,' that I didn't realize. Boston has now won seven straight game versus the Sox in Chicago. That's ludicrous.

SouthSide4Life
07-22-2005, 12:41 AM
Just read something on Reifert's 'blog,' that I didn't realize. Boston has now won seven straight game versus the Sox in Chicago. That's ludicrous.a streak which will be broken tomorrow!

TaylorStSox
07-22-2005, 12:51 AM
I haven't read the whole thread yet, but it makes me sick that this game gets so many replies. Why aren't you *******s watching the other 162? ****in fair weather fans I tell thee.

Lip Man 1
07-22-2005, 12:52 AM
I hope you are right.

I'd be very nervous if it isn't, given Contreras' 'history' against Boston (which is partially the reason the Yanks ran him out of town...) and The Duke's propensity of giving up four runs in six innings of work regularly since around late May.

Lip

Lip Man 1
07-22-2005, 12:56 AM
Taylor:

Because this was a gut wrenching loss. At least in a 9-0 blowout (either way) you know if you are the losing club you had no chance to win.

Tonight wasn't that type of case. This team has some issues right now (health being the biggest) there are still 2 1/2 months to go and they have been in a funk since Monday.

I just don't want this to get out of hand, especially with a brutal August schedule just over the horizon.

I can easily understand why the type of game played tonight drew this many replys. Like I said it was gut wrenching, reminded me of those two tough games against them in Chicago in 2003 where the Sox blew late leads in both games and Ortiz made them pay.

Lip

TaylorStSox
07-22-2005, 12:56 AM
OK. I'm pissed. Half of you post a few times a season. Now, you're here when we play the big boys. You're blaming people. You're FAIR WEATHER FANS.

Where were you *******s when we played KC? Where were you when we played Detroit? Now, everybody's a critic.

You guys can kiss my ass. You make sweeping generalizations based on 1 game.

The defense let us down. MB let us down. The clutch hitting let us down. You know what? This team has been making the right play ALL YEAR. Where were you when we were winning? KISS MY ASS.

TaylorStSox
07-22-2005, 12:57 AM
Taylor:

Because this was a gut wrenching loss. At least in a 9-0 blowout (either way) you know if you are the losing club you had no chance to win.

Tonight wasn't that type of case. This team has some issues right now (health being the biggest) there are still 2 1/2 months to go and they have been in a funk since Monday.

I just don't want this to get out of hand, especially with a brutal August schedule just over the horizon.

I can easily understand why the type of game played tonight drew this many replys. Like I said it was gut wrenching, reminded me of those two tough games against them in Chicago in 2003 where the Sox blew late leads in both games and Ortiz made them pay.

Lip

You love it. You've been waiting for this all year. Now, you can tell us we were all wrong. Now, you can tell us how much Jerry sucks. I'm waiting for it. I know it's coming.