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chisoxfanatic
07-14-2005, 10:35 PM
Apparently, Joe Crede's been having problems with his back. I guess it's a disc back there or something (I'm not medically inclined). Will this be a reoccurring problem, or will Crede get over it completely without losing too much (if any) time?

nordhagen
07-14-2005, 11:03 PM
Apparently, Joe Crede's been having problems with his back. I guess it's a disc back there or something (I'm not medically inclined). Will this be a reoccurring problem, or will Crede get over it completely without losing too much (if any) time?

Crede has two herniated discs in his back discovered in an MRI. He had a cortisone shot Sunday and is also taking anti-inflammatories to combat the pain. Said he felt 100 percent before the game.

soxfanreggie
07-14-2005, 11:08 PM
My dad had a few herniated discs...now he wasn't young or anything...but did require some surgery. Hopefully Joe can heal without surgery.

Ol' No. 2
07-14-2005, 11:11 PM
My dad had a few herniated discs...now he wasn't young or anything...but did require some surgery. Hopefully Joe can heal without surgery.Once they're herniated, you don't heal without surgery. If they're not too bad he may be able to play through it. Some days are worse than others.

doublem23
07-14-2005, 11:17 PM
I'll take Joe Crede with no back over Pablo Ozuna at third any day of the week. Nice not having to write, "and that was his 2nd error of the game" in the TBGR tonight. :D:

But it may be time for the Sox to seriously look into another third baseman, one who can, at worst, split time with Joe.

JB98
07-14-2005, 11:22 PM
Apparently, Joe Crede's been having problems with his back. I guess it's a disc back there or something (I'm not medically inclined). Will this be a reoccurring problem, or will Crede get over it completely without losing too much (if any) time?

We'll see how Crede is doing about 10 days from now. If it seems like he can play through it, then great. If he's struggling, KW may have to make a move to add some infield depth. One thing the Oakland series taught us is Ozuna can't handle third base day in and day out. Pablo did a good job when Uribe was out. It seems he's much more comfortable in the middle infield than at third.

NDSox12
07-14-2005, 11:25 PM
We'll see how Crede is doing about 10 days from now. If it seems like he can play through it, then great. If he's struggling, KW may have to make a move to add some infield depth. One thing the Oakland series taught us is Ozuna can't handle third base day in and day out. Pablo did a good job when Uribe was out. It seems he's much more comfortable in the middle infield than at third.

I'm not really suggesting this because I think you need your best defensive infielder at shorstop, however if Ozuna simply can't handle third they may have to think about moving Uribe over there and put Ozuna at short when Crede needs a day off. Of course, acquiring a third baseman would probably be a better alternative.

TornLabrum
07-14-2005, 11:42 PM
A herniated disc (let alone two) is not a walk in the park. Back in the day, they used to require surgery. Not sure what they can do now short of that other than cortisone.

IIRC that's the same injury that basically ended Bill Melton's productivity as a power hitter.

Lip Man 1
07-14-2005, 11:48 PM
Hal:

I remember with Bill they tried to 'shrink' the injured disk with an extract of papaya. Obviously that didn't work so well...(paging Ed Spezio...)

Only Crede can say how much pain he can tolerate but obviously this isn't a good thing...he can move a certain way, just lunging for a ball and that's it. The nerve problem to me is cause for greatest concern, that's exactly what Bill had and it simply shot down his legs and he just couldn't run anymore.

Personally I think this changes somewhat Kenny's target. This is such an 'iffy' thing...Crede may be fine the rest of the year or his back could go out in ten days. When Harris and Ozuna are all you have as insurance that's pretty serious.

Kind of makes the Joe Randa stuff a little more pertinent doesn't it? I'd assume Graffinino is available.

Lip

Nellie_Fox
07-15-2005, 12:52 AM
I remember with Bill they tried to 'shrink' the injured disk with an extract of papaya. Obviously that didn't work so well...(paging Ed Spezio...)The extract is called chymopapain. It's still used, although apparently sparingly. See http://www.medicinenet.com/chymopapain-injection/article.htm

GiveMeSox
07-15-2005, 02:27 AM
A herniated disc (let alone two) is not a walk in the park. Back in the day, they used to require surgery. Not sure what they can do now short of that other than cortisone.

IIRC that's the same injury that basically ended Bill Melton's productivity as a power hitter.

My dad had a herniated disc in his neck a few years ago. At first it just off and on pain in the area and stiffness. Eventually it turns worse as the disc pushes more and more against the nerve, causing more pain and problems. It kind of odd this happened to Joe at such a young age, my dad was 50. The problem is if left untreated it causes permanent damage to the nerves, causing numbness in limbs. My dad has two almostg numb fingers in his left hand. The cure was definatly surgery and replcement of the discs with titanium ones. The surgery is horrible and painful but absoultely worth it. My couldn't move or turn his head for years until the surgery now hes better than ever and playing softball with me again.

fquaye149
07-15-2005, 08:29 AM
Dammit, when I read the thread title, I thought this would be a much happier topic

Sad
07-15-2005, 09:10 AM
I'll take Joe Crede with no back over Pablo Ozuna at third any day of the week. Nice not having to write, "and that was his 2nd error of the game" in the TBGR tonight. :D:

But it may be time for the Sox to seriously look into another third baseman, one who can, at worst, split time with Joe.

I hear ya... Ozuna is brutal defensively... seems like he made 2 errors :o: the last game I attended on 7/9...

LuzinskiFan
07-15-2005, 09:53 AM
I do not wanna take a chance with JC's back. We cannot screw around. KW go out and add a thirdbaseman. We cannot have Ozuna as our everyday third baseman. Here are some possibilities in no specific order:

Aubrey Huff
Joe Randa
Mike Lowell
Shea Hillenbrand
Corey Koskie
Pedro Feliz
Edgardo Alfonzo
Rich Aurilia
Tony Graffanino
Chad Tracy

Comments?

DenverSock
07-15-2005, 10:01 AM
I do not wanna take a chance with JC's back. We cannot screw around. KW go out and add a thirdbaseman. We cannot have Ozuna as our everyday third baseman. Here are some possibilities in no specific order:

Aubrey Huff
Joe Randa
Mike Lowell
Shea Hillenbrand
Corey Koskie
Pedro Feliz
Edgardo Alfonzo
Rich Aurilia
Tony Graffanino
Chad Tracy

Comments?

Whom would you trade for whom?

gobears1987
07-15-2005, 10:03 AM
I'll take Joe Crede with no back over Pablo Ozuna at third any day of the week. Nice not having to write, "and that was his 2nd error of the game" in the TBGR tonight. :D:

But it may be time for the Sox to seriously look into another third baseman, one who can, at worst, split time with Joe.
Can't Jamie Burke play 3rd?

shaunburnette
07-15-2005, 10:10 AM
Uribe showed a good glove at third while he played there last year. Maybe Crede can hang tough for the rest of the year but I would rather not take any chances with playoff implications on the line. I dont really like the 3B trade options out there so I would say go for Vizquel and platoon Uribe and Crede at third.

Then again, these are just my thoughts.....

BeviBall!
07-15-2005, 10:28 AM
Why not a Hillenbrand/Lilly package? Doesn't look promising on the Schmidt or Burnett front.

maurice
07-15-2005, 11:07 AM
This definitely adds credibility to the Vizquel and Randa rumors.

BigEdWalsh
07-15-2005, 12:37 PM
This definitely adds credibility to the Vizquel and Randa rumors.

It sure does.
I saw mentions of Jaime Burke and Graffanino as 3rd basemen. In both cases, good lord, NO.

DaleJRFan
07-15-2005, 12:41 PM
Where's Eric Chavez's name in all of this???

Half of the guys on this list are downgrades from Crede. Huff is a horrible defensive 3B, hense why he is now in the outfield. Chad Tracy is a futurestar and I doubt AZ will trade him. Hillenbrand is the only guy on that list I would want... What do you do with Crede when he comes back?

HawkISox
07-15-2005, 12:53 PM
I can't see Crede playing regularly through the rest of the year. Randa or Hillenbrand would be the best options. How much would you give up though?

shoota
07-15-2005, 02:15 PM
Once they're herniated, you don't heal without surgery. If they're not too bad he may be able to play through it. Some days are worse than others.

That's discouraging. I didn't know that, though the cortisone shot does scream it's a serious injury. His pain will be masked by the cortisone for months (assuming this is his first cortisone shot), but I worry when it wears off by the playoffs.

I didn't think too highly of a healthy Joe Crede, and an injured one is an even worse player and bigger lineup liability. Randa cannot cost much. Two weeks left Kenny. Make the move.

MisterB
07-15-2005, 02:28 PM
Once they're herniated, you don't heal without surgery. If they're not too bad he may be able to play through it. Some days are worse than others.

That's not accurate. There are non-surgical treatment options that (according to different sources) are effective in 80-90% of cases. If surgery is required though, it would be anywhere from 1-3 months before he could even do serious physical activity, so his season would be over.

http://www.back.com/causes-mechanical-herniated.html

RMSoxFan
07-15-2005, 03:19 PM
Joe Randa doesn't look too bad defensively compared to Crede:

FPCT RF ZR
Crede .980 2.57 .832
Randa .976 2.77 .799

Their career numbers tell the same story--about equal in FPCT, Crede ahead in AR, Randa ahead in RF. I know that it's hard to quantify fielding performance with statistics, but I don't think that Randa can be completely horrible, as I've heard some people say.

JB98
07-15-2005, 04:33 PM
A few points:

1. It's imperative that we have a good defensive third baseman because Garland and Buerhle (to a lesser extent) are ground-ball pitchers.

2. Jamie Burke sucks. I can't believe someone actually suggested him as a viable option to replace Crede. Burke can play third for the Charlotte Knights or Pittsburgh Pirates, but not for the best-in-baseball White Sox. We're trying to win a championship here, people. Jamie is a nice guy and a team player, so that makes people like him and want him to get a chance. However, the cold, harsh reality is that Burke is an AAA player. Always has been. Always will be.

3. Hillenbrand is an upgrade over Crede at the plate, but he is a butcher in the field (see point 1). There is a reason Boston unloaded him and acquired Mueller to play third base, and it wasn't because Hillenbrand couldn't hit. If we needed a 1B or a DH, I'd take Hillenbrand in a heartbeat. But not as a 3B.

4. Chavez is not in this discussion because he isn't on the trading block. I heard those words come out of KW's mouth, so rest assured he asked Beane about Chavez's availability and was turned down. Oakland is back in the race. Why would they consider trading Chavez to us?

5. Who says Crede can't handle the situation? Everyone here is assuming the worst. Give Joe a chance. We have another two weeks until a decision has to be made. Let's see how he plays up until then.