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bartmanisgod
07-12-2005, 02:56 PM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=solomon_george&id=2105986


Pretty interesting read. I don't know if it will work, but it looks like ESPN is going to make an attempt to balance their coverage a little more. He also leaves a link in the article where you can leave feedback for him, but i suggest reading the article before you post anything.


Mods sorry if this dosen't belong here. Fell free to move this wherever you need to.

fquaye149
07-12-2005, 03:05 PM
we'll see if this has any effect. It has less to do with their bull**** east coast bias and more about journalistic integrity.

They have to fix both, but I still won't be watching the Yankees/BlowSox love fest even if it is the paragon of ethical coverage.

Tekijawa
07-12-2005, 03:08 PM
Glad to See they brought in an East Coast Guy who's son has a show on the network to right this ship!

This could be like having Ronnie Woo Woo as a Market Analyst for the Cubs...
:woo-woo

"Everything's Great Boss!"

Steakpita
07-12-2005, 03:25 PM
Very interesting. Here's what I sent the guy...



Congratulations on taking this post. ESPN's the only network that does what it does, and so I think it's great that this 'monopoly' is trying to police itself. It sounds like you have the right attitude for the job. Jumping right in...
1. The Yankees, Red Sox, and Cubs seem to get the same amount of coverage as the other 27 MLB teams combined. You may want to look into this, and try to even out the discrepancy.

2. I disagree on Bonds. Although his story is important, it is NOT the most important thing going on right now. Pedro Gomez is a self-important man (or appears so on TV, anyways) who could benefit from some quality time, say, scouting out the next great sluggers to come out of the minor leagues. Less scandal, more sports. Please.

3. Following up on the last comment - a LACK of sporting activity should always be preempted by actual sporting activity. Hockey work stoppage? I'd rather hear about a table tennis tournament in Omaha. You get the idea.

4. Congratulations once again on the job. Sports fans all over the world are counting on you. I hope you can handle the pressure.

MarySwiss
07-12-2005, 03:37 PM
Well, it probably can't hurt....

I was tempted to ask him what he thought about that Bartman piece, but I figured I'd give him some time to get his feet wet.

That part where he said some Around the Horn guys need to turn down the volume, wonder who he could have meant?

:rolleyes:

Fenway
07-12-2005, 03:39 PM
Just curious

Where was the East Coast bias when Michael Jordon was playing? The Bulls and Jordan led almost every sportscenter.

Tekijawa
07-12-2005, 03:49 PM
Just curious

Where was the East Coast bias when Michael Jordon was playing? The Bulls and Jordan led almost every sportscenter.

He was usually Dunking on Ewing or Dropping 60+ in the Playoffs against Boston in those highlights... you just couldn't see them because they were in the background.

ilsox7
07-12-2005, 04:07 PM
Just curious

Where was the East Coast bias when Michael Jordon was playing? The Bulls and Jordan led almost every sportscenter.

Jordan played on the best team in basketball so they rightfully led every Sportscenter. The White Sox are the best team in baseball, but do they lead every Sportscenter? No. ESPN has changed immensely in the last 8 or so years. You just highlited a terrific example of the current bias.

Fenway
07-12-2005, 04:55 PM
Jordan played on the best team in basketball so they rightfully led every Sportscenter. The White Sox are the best team in baseball, but do they lead every Sportscenter? No. ESPN has changed immensely in the last 8 or so years. You just highlited a terrific example of the current bias.

I think the White Sox get hurt in the SportsCenter rotation as many times their games end after 11 PM Eastern...and on SportsCenter only games that are over can they show highlites ( Baseball Tonight under contract is allowed to show games in progress)

The Cubs would be featured at the top more because many of their games are during the day.

Earlier this year The Mets were featured near the top because millions of Time Warner viewers couldn't see the games. I notice that the Nationals are featured a lot probably for the same reason. If you on a Comcast system you don't see them.

Lip Man 1
07-12-2005, 10:44 PM
For what it's worth here is what I sent the guy:

George:

Congratulations on your new position.

You asked for my thoughts...here they are. First some background. I have watched ESPN grow from infancy into what it is today. I have watched it personally as a fan and watched it professionally since I was in TV for fifteen years. I started watching it in the Summer of 1979 and the first thing I ever watched on ESPN was the CFL in Lexington, Kentucky.

What I would do are the following (in no particular order...)

1. Eliminate that annoying continuous crawl on the bottom of your programming. It is annoying, it is repetitive, it takes away from what the telecast is trying to do because it divides the attention of the viewer and it ruins the highlights because often it tells the final score while your anchors are talking about the game! Fantasy geeks may like it but they are the only ones.

2. ESPN is supposed to be about sports and journalism. Goofy entertainment programming like ‘Stump the Schawb,’ ‘Teammates’ and your made for TV movies is ENTERTAINMENT. It blurs the line between reality and fantasy, it compromises the integrity of your sports anchors since often they are a part of that programming. It needs to be eliminated with maximum prejudice.

3. Ditto for your attempts to grab the non traditional viewer. Stop pandering to the teen age generation of both sexes, stop trying to ‘reach out to the twenty something’s’ who have an attention span of maybe two minutes. (I realize this is a generalization, just trying to make a point!) ESPN used to be about solid, journalistic stories without ‘flash’ without ‘fluff’ without ‘song and dance.’ ESPN needs more of the style of journalism that Bob Ley, Linda Cohn and Karl Ravitch (sorry if I mis spelled his name) preach and less of the goofballs like Stuart Scott and Kenny Mayne (and in the past Craig Kilborn.) This is sports journalism, not entertainment (despite what ABC / Cap Cities wants you to think.) I don’t need ‘street talk’ in the highlights, I don’t need ‘the Ultimate Highlight’ cranking out disjointed highlights simply because someone wants to try to hook an Ozzie Osbourn fan by blasting out music. I don’t need ‘the Budweiser Hot Seat’ with ridiculous questions simply because you are trying to fill time or reach a niche audience. It you can’t fill an hour with sports highlights, sports news and solid journalistic features then go to a half hour.

4. The sports world does not revolve around the East Coast, contrary to what some may think. Most of the rest of the U.S. couldn’t give a damn about the Red Sox / Yankees for example. Stop constantly shoving that down their throats. They and the East Coast teams need to be reported on but NOT at the expense of the teams in the Central, Mountain West and West Coast.

Hope this gives you some insight into what I think. ESPN used to set the standard for sports excellence both on the field and in the studio... now it’s becoming a parody, a farce of what it used to be. Again it’s journalism...it’s not entertainment!

Mark Liptak

fquaye149
07-12-2005, 10:54 PM
For what it's worth here is what I sent the guy:

George:

Congratulations on your new position.

You asked for my thoughts...here they are. First some background. I have watched ESPN grow from infancy into what it is today. I have watched it personally as a fan and watched it professionally since I was in TV for fifteen years. I started watching it in the Summer of 1979 and the first thing I ever watched on ESPN was the CFL in Lexington, Kentucky.

What I would do are the following (in no particular order...)

1. Eliminate that annoying continuous crawl on the bottom of your programming. It is annoying, it is repetitive, it takes away from what the telecast is trying to do because it divides the attention of the viewer and it ruins the highlights because often it tells the final score while your anchors are talking about the game! Fantasy geeks may like it but they are the only ones.

2. ESPN is supposed to be about sports and journalism. Goofy entertainment programming like ‘Stump the Schawb,’ ‘Teammates’ and your made for TV movies is ENTERTAINMENT. It blurs the line between reality and fantasy, it compromises the integrity of your sports anchors since often they are a part of that programming. It needs to be eliminated with maximum prejudice.

3. Ditto for your attempts to grab the non traditional viewer. Stop pandering to the teen age generation of both sexes, stop trying to ‘reach out to the twenty something’s’ who have an attention span of maybe two minutes. (I realize this is a generalization, just trying to make a point!) ESPN used to be about solid, journalistic stories without ‘flash’ without ‘fluff’ without ‘song and dance.’ ESPN needs more of the style of journalism that Bob Ley, Linda Cohn and Karl Ravitch (sorry if I mis spelled his name) preach and less of the goofballs like Stuart Scott and Kenny Mayne (and in the past Craig Kilborn.) This is sports journalism, not entertainment (despite what ABC / Cap Cities wants you to think.) I don’t need ‘street talk’ in the highlights, I don’t need ‘the Ultimate Highlight’ cranking out disjointed highlights simply because someone wants to try to hook an Ozzie Osbourn fan by blasting out music. I don’t need ‘the Budweiser Hot Seat’ with ridiculous questions simply because you are trying to fill time or reach a niche audience. It you can’t fill an hour with sports highlights, sports news and solid journalistic features then go to a half hour.

4. The sports world does not revolve around the East Coast, contrary to what some may think. Most of the rest of the U.S. couldn’t give a damn about the Red Sox / Yankees for example. Stop constantly shoving that down their throats. They and the East Coast teams need to be reported on but NOT at the expense of the teams in the Central, Mountain West and West Coast.

Hope this gives you some insight into what I think. ESPN used to set the standard for sports excellence both on the field and in the studio... now it’s becoming a parody, a farce of what it used to be. Again it’s journalism...it’s not entertainment!

Mark Liptak

If you were in charge of ESPN, I'd watch it again.

chitownhawkfan
07-12-2005, 11:18 PM
For what it's worth here is what I sent the guy:

George:

Congratulations on your new position.

You asked for my thoughts...here they are. First some background. I have watched ESPN grow from infancy into what it is today. I have watched it personally as a fan and watched it professionally since I was in TV for fifteen years. I started watching it in the Summer of 1979 and the first thing I ever watched on ESPN was the CFL in Lexington, Kentucky.

What I would do are the following (in no particular order...)

1. Eliminate that annoying continuous crawl on the bottom of your programming. It is annoying, it is repetitive, it takes away from what the telecast is trying to do because it divides the attention of the viewer and it ruins the highlights because often it tells the final score while your anchors are talking about the game! Fantasy geeks may like it but they are the only ones.

2. ESPN is supposed to be about sports and journalism. Goofy entertainment programming like ‘Stump the Schawb,’ ‘Teammates’ and your made for TV movies is ENTERTAINMENT. It blurs the line between reality and fantasy, it compromises the integrity of your sports anchors since often they are a part of that programming. It needs to be eliminated with maximum prejudice.

3. Ditto for your attempts to grab the non traditional viewer. Stop pandering to the teen age generation of both sexes, stop trying to ‘reach out to the twenty something’s’ who have an attention span of maybe two minutes. (I realize this is a generalization, just trying to make a point!) ESPN used to be about solid, journalistic stories without ‘flash’ without ‘fluff’ without ‘song and dance.’ ESPN needs more of the style of journalism that Bob Ley, Linda Cohn and Karl Ravitch (sorry if I mis spelled his name) preach and less of the goofballs like Stuart Scott and Kenny Mayne (and in the past Craig Kilborn.) This is sports journalism, not entertainment (despite what ABC / Cap Cities wants you to think.) I don’t need ‘street talk’ in the highlights, I don’t need ‘the Ultimate Highlight’ cranking out disjointed highlights simply because someone wants to try to hook an Ozzie Osbourn fan by blasting out music. I don’t need ‘the Budweiser Hot Seat’ with ridiculous questions simply because you are trying to fill time or reach a niche audience. It you can’t fill an hour with sports highlights, sports news and solid journalistic features then go to a half hour.

4. The sports world does not revolve around the East Coast, contrary to what some may think. Most of the rest of the U.S. couldn’t give a damn about the Red Sox / Yankees for example. Stop constantly shoving that down their throats. They and the East Coast teams need to be reported on but NOT at the expense of the teams in the Central, Mountain West and West Coast.

Hope this gives you some insight into what I think. ESPN used to set the standard for sports excellence both on the field and in the studio... now it’s becoming a parody, a farce of what it used to be. Again it’s journalism...it’s not entertainment!

Mark Liptak

Preach Brother, especially point number 4.
:andy
Boston Rubs

PeteWard
07-13-2005, 03:30 AM
Maybe he can work on this::angry:

2005 MLB Schedule on ESPN & ESPN2

Please note: Games will be added as they become available
Games are subject to local blackout

DateTime (ET)NetworkTeams

July 14 7 p.m. ESPN2 New York Yankees at Boston

July 15 2:15 p.m. ESPN Pittsburgh at Chicago Cubs

July 17 6 p.m. ESPN New York Yankees at Boston

July 18 8 p.m. ESPN New York Yankees at Texas

July 20 1 p.m. ESPN Baltimore at Minnesota

July 20 7 p.m. ESPN New York Yankees atTexas

July 20 10 p.m. ESPN2 Oakland at Angels

July 24 8 p.m. ESPN Chicago Cubs at St. Louis



Only 2 games of 8 do not involve the Holy Trinity: NY.Bos, Cubs. This is especially hard to swallow for those of us overseas in July who rely solely on ESPN International which shows two or three games a week and ,to my knowledge, has not shown THE Sox once. They never answere my emails either.

SOXSINCE'70
07-13-2005, 10:55 AM
For what it's worth here is what I sent the guy:

George:

Congratulations on your new position.

You asked for my thoughts...here they are. First some background. I have watched ESPN grow from infancy into what it is today. I have watched it personally as a fan and watched it professionally since I was in TV for fifteen years. I started watching it in the Summer of 1979 and the first thing I ever watched on ESPN was the CFL in Lexington, Kentucky.

What I would do are the following (in no particular order...)

1. Eliminate that annoying continuous crawl on the bottom of your programming. It is annoying, it is repetitive, it takes away from what the telecast is trying to do because it divides the attention of the viewer and it ruins the highlights because often it tells the final score while your anchors are talking about the game! Fantasy geeks may like it but they are the only ones.

2. ESPN is supposed to be about sports and journalism. Goofy entertainment programming like ‘Stump the Schawb,’ ‘Teammates’ and your made for TV movies is ENTERTAINMENT. It blurs the line between reality and fantasy, it compromises the integrity of your sports anchors since often they are a part of that programming. It needs to be eliminated with maximum prejudice.

3. Ditto for your attempts to grab the non traditional viewer. Stop pandering to the teen age generation of both sexes, stop trying to ‘reach out to the twenty something’s’ who have an attention span of maybe two minutes. (I realize this is a generalization, just trying to make a point!) ESPN used to be about solid, journalistic stories without ‘flash’ without ‘fluff’ without ‘song and dance.’ ESPN needs more of the style of journalism that Bob Ley, Linda Cohn and Karl Ravitch (sorry if I mis spelled his name) preach and less of the goofballs like Stuart Scott and Kenny Mayne (and in the past Craig Kilborn.) This is sports journalism, not entertainment (despite what ABC / Cap Cities wants you to think.) I don’t need ‘street talk’ in the highlights, I don’t need ‘the Ultimate Highlight’ cranking out disjointed highlights simply because someone wants to try to hook an Ozzie Osbourn fan by blasting out music. I don’t need ‘the Budweiser Hot Seat’ with ridiculous questions simply because you are trying to fill time or reach a niche audience. It you can’t fill an hour with sports highlights, sports news and solid journalistic features then go to a half hour.

4. The sports world does not revolve around the East Coast, contrary to what some may think. Most of the rest of the U.S. couldn’t give a damn about the Red Sox / Yankees for example. Stop constantly shoving that down their throats. They and the East Coast teams need to be reported on but NOT at the expense of the teams in the Central, Mountain West and West Coast.

Hope this gives you some insight into what I think. ESPN used to set the standard for sports excellence both on the field and in the studio... now it’s becoming a parody, a farce of what it used to be. Again it’s journalism...it’s not entertainment!

Mark Liptak

If you were in charge of ESPN,i'd work for you in a heartbeat.:cool:

1951Campbell
07-13-2005, 11:40 AM
Lip, I agree with your opinions on ESPN. However, in regard to too much entertainment and not enough sports journalism, well, I'm pretty sure the ombudsman will just say "hey, it's Entertainment and Sports Programming Network."

Not that I particularly enjoy the entertainment, I don't. But they've left themselves an out to accusations of too much entertaining fluff.

chitownhawkfan
07-13-2005, 12:24 PM
Lip, I agree with your opinions on ESPN. However, in regard to too much entertainment and not enough sports journalism, well, I'm pretty sure the ombudsman will just say "hey, it's Entertainment and Sports Programming Network."

Not that I particularly enjoy the entertainment, I don't. But they've left themselves an out to accusations of too much entertaining fluff.

Not to be picky but it is no longer the Entertainment and Sports Programming Network, they dropped that and it is now just ESPN. They supposedly did this to put the focus back on sports.

1951Campbell
07-13-2005, 01:10 PM
Not to be picky but it is no longer the Entertainment and Sports Programming Network, they dropped that and it is now just ESPN. They supposedly did this to put the focus back on sports.

Well, if that's the case, Lip and others are right, and ESPN has no excuse for a lot of their lame quiz shows and whatnot. And the poker. Don't get me started on the poker.

ilsox7
07-13-2005, 01:15 PM
Well, if that's the case, Lip and others are right, and ESPN has no excuse for a lot of their lame quiz shows and whatnot. And the poker. Don't get me started on the poker.

With the numerous ESPN Networks there are these days, the quiz shows and poker are a necessity. I think people who ask for them to be removed will not be taken seriously. I would suggest focusing on berating the disproportionate coverage given to any teams not named Yankees, Red Sox, or Cubs (for baseball). The thing that annoys me the most (I don't watch ESPN much so I may be wrong) is that for football season, every Sunday Night on NFL Primetime, don't they, at minimum, do highlites of EVERY game from that day? The same policy should be used for baseball. And every other sport.

fquaye149
07-13-2005, 01:32 PM
With the numerous ESPN Networks there are these days, the quiz shows and poker are a necessity. I think people who ask for them to be removed will not be taken seriously. I would suggest focusing on berating the disproportionate coverage given to any teams not named Yankees, Red Sox, or Cubs (for baseball). The thing that annoys me the most (I don't watch ESPN much so I may be wrong) is that for football season, every Sunday Night on NFL Primetime, don't they, at minimum, do highlites of EVERY game from that day? The same policy should be used for baseball. And every other sport.

Put that **** on ESPN 2. That's what they used to do.

ilsox7
07-13-2005, 01:56 PM
Put that **** on ESPN 2. That's what they used to do.

First and foremost, ESPN is a business. They need ratings. If Poker gets ratings, it will be Prime Time on ESPN. All I'd like to see is a real, daily baseball highlites show. I don't care if it's on ESPN or ESPN2 or ESPN6.

Lip Man 1
07-13-2005, 02:13 PM
Campbell:

It didn't seem to be an issue (vis a vis sports journalism vs. entertainment) until ABC /Cap Cities bought the property did it? Coincidence? I don't think so...

Ilsox:

Back in the Day when Baseball Tonight (which didn't start on ESPN until they starting showing baseball in 1990) cared about the sport of baseball and not trying to 'entertain' viewers, they used to have solid, knowledgeable analysts like Jim Katt, Bill Robinson and Ray Knight. Where are those types of analysts now? If getting clowns like John Kruk and Harold Reynolds are the best they can do, or are willing to do, or are being told to do, they why do you want to watch that garbage in the first place? (and this has nothing to do with the question of whether they stiff the Sox or not. I'm looking at the issue purely from a broadcasting/journalistic point of view...)

Lip

ilsox7
07-13-2005, 02:17 PM
Ilsox:

Back in the Day when Baseball Tonight (which didn't start on ESPN until they starting showing baseball in 1990) cared about the sport of baseball and not trying to 'entertain' viewers, they used to have solid, knowledgeable analysts like Jim Katt, Bill Robinson and Ray Knight. Where are those types of analysts now? If getting clowns like John Kruk and Harold Reynolds are the best they can do, or are willing to do, or are being told to do, they why do you want to watch that garbage in the first place? (and this has nothing to do with the question of whether they stiff the Sox or not. I'm looking at the issue purely from a broadcasting/journalistic point of view...)

Lip

I completely agree with you. Unfortunately, ESPN is driven by the bottom line now more than ever, and we are stuck with what we are stuck with. I say let them have their current crappy version of Red Sox, Yankees and Cubs nightly on ESPN and give me the ESPNEWS version every night, which will bring us back closer to the days of 8 years ago, when ESPN was truly good. It won't happen, but I can dream.

I think an interesting experiment would be, for one full season, having ESPN run head-to-head shows (on ESPN and ESPN2) each night...one would be the current version of Baseball Tonight while the other would be a fair, realistic version of how the day in baseball went. I am pretty confident that the fair version would do just fine in the ratings.

fquaye149
07-13-2005, 02:57 PM
First and foremost, ESPN is a business. They need ratings. If Poker gets ratings, it will be Prime Time on ESPN. All I'd like to see is a real, daily baseball highlites show. I don't care if it's on ESPN or ESPN2 or ESPN6.

Obviously that's the case. However, we're talking about how it purports to be more about sports than entertainment (hence dropping "entertainment and sports network" or hiring an ombudsman).

If I want sports entertainment, I'll go see Vinny Mac.

ilsox7
07-13-2005, 02:58 PM
Obviously that's the case. However, we're talking about how it purports to be more about sports than entertainment (hence dropping "entertainment and sports network" or hiring an ombudsman).

If I want sports entertainment, I'll go see Vinny Mac.

They can make superficial changes in name or appoint an ombudsman, but until real changes are made, it is and always will be an entertainment medium.

Lip Man 1
07-13-2005, 04:34 PM
Which by definition it should NOT be ESPECIALLY during SportsCenter. That's sports news... not entertainment.

Another area where the line of journalism is blurred for profit sake. Any wonder the media is so disliked today?

Lip

ilsox7
07-13-2005, 04:38 PM
Which by definition it should NOT be ESPECIALLY during SportsCenter. That's sports news... not entertainment.

Another area where the line of journalism is blurred for profit sake. Any wonder the media is so disliked today?

Lip

Preachin' to the choir, man. Sadly today, whether it be the media or big business. it's all about the bottom line and not integrity of any sort. Hell I left my job b/c of this. It sucks sometimes!

gosox41
07-16-2005, 08:58 AM
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/columns/story?columnist=solomon_george&id=2105986


Pretty interesting read. I don't know if it will work, but it looks like ESPN is going to make an attempt to balance their coverage a little more. He also leaves a link in the article where you can leave feedback for him, but i suggest reading the article before you post anything.


Mods sorry if this dosen't belong here. Fell free to move this wherever you need to.


He's going to be very busy, and that's just working with the Baseball Tonight crew.


Bob

SoxFanSince67
07-16-2005, 12:58 PM
Lee Corso and Dick Vitale...I'll take ESPN far more seriously when they drop these two clowns.