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View Full Version : Iguchi's BA slide - Scouts catching on?


Fake Chet Lemon
07-04-2005, 12:59 AM
Tadahito's average has been on a steady decline over the last month or so. Nobody expected him to hit .330, but do you think the league is catching up to him some? The scouting in MLB is just unbelievable, and if you have a weakness they WILL find it. Bottom line, I'm still thrilled with his ability to help the team. He's still giving outs away while hitting the ball to the right with a man on and his defense is superb. Maybe he will simply settle in as a .280 hitter and he's back to his level? If so, that's still very good production overall.

balke
07-04-2005, 01:01 AM
He has looked pretty bad up at the plate lately. His glove is always there though. On this team, we need his bat. We can't have him and Uribe and Crede, JUST for D. Someone has to produce .300 or so at the plate.

Chisox003
07-04-2005, 01:03 AM
Tadahito's average has been on a steady decline over the last month or so. Nobody expected him to hit .330, but do you think the league is catching up to him some? The scouting in MLB is just unbelievable, and if you have a weakness they WILL find it. Bottom line, I'm still thrilled with his ability to help the team. He's still giving outs away while hitting the ball to the right with a man on and his defense is superb. Maybe he will simply settle in as a .280 hitter and he's back to his level? If so, that's still very good production overall.

I dont think its the league catching on to him as much as it is Tadahito is finally suffering from never seeing any of these pitchers...

The fact that he was hitting .330 at one point is pretty amazing, but I think Tadahito is doing great in that #2 hole, and Ill take the Pods, Gooch 1,2 punch against most 1,2 hitters in the game

Next year, I bet Iguchi has a monster season...He's a lot better than most of us, me included, originally thought

JB98
07-04-2005, 01:05 AM
Tadahito's average has been on a steady decline over the last month or so. Nobody expected him to hit .330, but do you think the league is catching up to him some? The scouting in MLB is just unbelievable, and if you have a weakness they WILL find it. Bottom line, I'm still thrilled with his ability to help the team. He's still giving outs away while hitting the ball to the right with a man on and his defense is superb. Maybe he will simply settle in as a .280 hitter and he's back to his level? If so, that's still very good production overall.

He was a career .270 hitter over in Japan, so that's about what I expect. He's definitely struggling right now. Is the league catching up with him? Sure. The league catches up with every rookie, and then that player needs to adjust back. I think Tadahito is capable of doing that.

Fake Chet Lemon
07-04-2005, 01:05 AM
He has looked pretty bad up at the plate lately. His glove is always there though. On this team, we need his bat. We can't have him and Uribe and Crede, JUST for D. Someone has to produce .300 or so at the plate.

The right side of the infield has been pretty weak at the plate as of late. Hopefully they both pick it up at home this week. We need more consitency from the right side, as the offense from our left side is always very inconsistent.

shoota
07-04-2005, 02:21 AM
We can't have him and Uribe and Crede, JUST for D. Someone has to produce .300 or so at the plate.

That's a really good point. And if the Sox were to acquire a .300 hitter, it'd be ideal for him to fill in one of those defensive-only positions. Joe Randa is hitting a shade under .300, and his career average is .287.

Randa pluses:

1) The Sox will receive an upgrade in offense over their current third baseman: clutch hitting, quality at bats, situational hitting.

2) He's very affordable both in salary and in cost to acquire. His contract expires after this season, so the Sox won't be saddled with an expensive, long-term contract after he's traded for.

3) Team Chemistry will improve, though not so much for Randa's personality, but as a result of addition by subtraction of the Sox's current, antisocial, introverted, mumbling third baseman.

Randa minuses:
none

doublem23
07-04-2005, 02:28 AM
Randa minuses:
none

We'd have to lose a prospect to acquire garbage. I'm not for getting sentimental about prospects, and I won't care if the Sox trade McCarthy, Anderson, Sweeney, Honel, Fields, Jenks, Bajenaru, etc. all this year, but not for Joe Randa. Anyone we give up for a minor (and I mean minor) upgrade in Joe Randa is one player less we can use to make a major acquisition, and considering the payroll constraints Kenny generally finds himself in, you probably have to be willling to part with more personnel to avoid taking on too much salary.

P.S., I hate caps lock. :tongue:

Go Go Everetts
07-04-2005, 02:30 AM
Iguchi has been doing the little things all season like his sacrifice bunt with Ozuna on second today.

patbooyah
07-04-2005, 02:31 AM
as far as tadahito goes- hasn't his decline in average coincided with him getting about 2 games off per week?

EDIT: nevermind- i see now that he has always gotten a game off at least once a series or so.

bludupree
07-04-2005, 02:38 AM
Iguchi has been doing the little things all season like his sacrifice bunt with Ozuna on second today.

The worst part about little things is that they get completely overlooked in the stats. Tadahito has been great when it comes to taking pitches and hitting the ball to the right to move a guy over. I honestly think he is one of our most important players. He has worked with pods to create a lot of offense. Defenseively he has been awesome.

shoota
07-04-2005, 02:52 AM
The worst part about little things is that they get completely overlooked in the stats.

I agree, it is a shame. It's undetectable to the stat sheet. Though, part of its mystique is that a player knowingly sacrifices without getting statistical credit for one--only from his teammates as he returns to the dugout. And since it doesn't show up on the stat sheet, it's most likely not going to show up in his pocketbook, either. I respect it because a man who routinely does it, proves that he values winning more than extra money.

Ed Farmer made a comment that I mostly forgot, but I think he said that he puts a star or an asterisk on his scorecard to identify productive outs.

If he is doing that, I'd love to see the end-of-year statistic for each player on the team.

fquaye149
07-04-2005, 03:13 AM
That's a really good point. And if the Sox were to acquire a .300 hitter, it'd be ideal for him to fill in one of those defensive-only positions. Joe Randa is hitting a shade under .300, and his career average is .287.

Randa pluses:

1) The Sox will receive an upgrade in offense over their current third baseman: clutch hitting, quality at bats, situational hitting.

2) He's very affordable both in salary and in cost to acquire. His contract expires after this season, so the Sox won't be saddled with an expensive, long-term contract after he's traded for.

3) Team Chemistry will improve, though not so much for Randa's personality, but as a result of addition by subtraction of the Sox's current, antisocial, introverted, mumbling third baseman.

Randa minuses:
none

a.)just curious...in what language does "none" translate to substantial defensive downgrade.

b.)how does one figure that team chemistry will improve by introducing a new player to the best team in baseball to take the place of a starting player on the best team in baseball, and that player is a player from one of the worst teams in baseball, not exactly setting the house ablaze and not renowned for his leadership/chemistry attributes?


good God, can we ever stop hearing about RANDA?

shoota
07-04-2005, 03:21 AM
b.)how does one figure that team chemistry will improve by introducing a new player to the best team in baseball to take the place of a starting player on the best team in baseball, and that player is a player from one of the worst teams in baseball, not exactly setting the house ablaze and not renowned for his leadership/chemistry attributes?

My comment about chemistry was simply trying to stir the pot on the subject. We fans don't have any idea what each player brings to clubhouse chemistry. It's speculation, and at best, educated guesses.

And even if Crede were a great teammate, the other 24 players could still be hoping for an on-field upgrade at third because they want a better chance at winning.

lostletters
07-04-2005, 03:31 AM
Actually I think this is directly related to Pods not playing as much lately or getting on base as much as he did earlier. I know this may sound odd, but Pods and Iguchi performance is directly related. If Pods gets on base alot Iguchi seems to be better, if Pods Iguchi seems to slump. It is as if Iguchi needs to help Pods out. These two players are so related in thier performance it is not even funny. I think both Pods and Iguchi are having a mini-slump...it was bound to happen.

As far as bringing in another bat...sorry I do not like the idea of that. Even with regards to Crede, I am begining to like him in the lineup.

I also think all this "need another bat" stuff is directly related to a hard trip in Oakland.

As it stands I think things are fine the way they are right now. Personally I cannot agree with it at all. Largely because it is completely unnecessary. The way the team is actually GOOD right now, because most of the players on the team know thier roles and do the little things to win...ESPECIALLY IGUCHI. The man is willing to sacrafice so much for the team and is fundimentally sound. The team works because it is built around a philosophy, I am not sure how getting a .300 hitter with an ego is going to help that philosophy.


Also this Randa obsession is out of control. He is not worth it...period. There is minuses...one is losing one of the best fielding 3rd baseman in the league for a team that is dependant on defense.

fquaye149
07-04-2005, 09:10 AM
My comment about chemistry was simply trying to stir the pot on the subject. We fans don't have any idea what each player brings to clubhouse chemistry. It's speculation, and at best, educated guesses.

And even if Crede were a great teammate, the other 24 players could still be hoping for an on-field upgrade at third because they want a better chance at winning.

then they are probably hoping for an actual upgrade

Frater Perdurabo
07-04-2005, 09:59 AM
Actually I think this is directly related to Pods not playing as much lately or getting on base as much as he did earlier. I know this may sound odd, but Pods and Iguchi performance is directly related. If Pods gets on base alot Iguchi seems to be better, if Pods Iguchi seems to slump. It is as if Iguchi needs to help Pods out. These two players are so related in thier performance it is not even funny. I think both Pods and Iguchi are having a mini-slump...it was bound to happen.

There may be something to that. Oakland excepted (West Coast travel will do that), the Sox offense seemed anemic in Detroit and even before that on Saturday and Sunday against the Cubs. Maybe it's a function of facing good pitching. I would have thought, though, that Pods and Iguchi would have thrived against Detroit in spacious Comerica (even as the power hitters might struggle).

Early on, Pods was walking a whole lot. After opposing pitchers realized that to walk him was to invite disaster because of his base-stealing prowess, and with Iguchi hitting over .300, they started to throw Pods good pitches, and he brought his average up to almost .300.

I think Pods and Iguchi need to play every day, with perhaps one day off per week (or even less). Also, I think Frank Thomas needs to start at least five games per week, and Ozzie shouldn't pinch hit Timo for him late in games. Now, if Frank should walk or get a base hit or a double late in a game, then Ozzie ought to put in a pinch runner.

It seems like the Sox are scoring a lot of runs on solo homers. While homers are nice, it seems they've gotten away from manufacturing runs like they did in April and May. Also, although Ozzie's strategy to give all the guys at-bats generally is a good one, the regulars need to play often enough to understand their roles in the lineup.

That being said, I think Rowand should bat third, with Frank at cleanup and Konerko fifth. That gets more speed and average at the top to manufacture runs, with still plenty of power in the middle. With his performance right now, Frank is more of a slugger than a OBP guy, anyway. With the lineup below, only Everett and Ozuna would have to hit at multiple spots within the lineup, even though they would play different positions:

Pods (Ozuna) - Iguchi (Harris) - Rowand (Carl) - Frank (Carl) - PK (Gload) - Dye (Carl) - AJ (Widger) - Crede (Ozuna) - Uribe (Ozuna)

Dan H
07-04-2005, 12:07 PM
The thing that bothers me about Iguchi is the strikeouts. He is on pace to get over 100. That is acceptable for a free-swinging power hitter, not for a guy second in the lineup. I didn't expect a .300 season from him, I would like to see him put the bat on the ball.

TheOldRoman
07-04-2005, 12:11 PM
The thing that bothers me about Iguchi is the strikeouts. He is on pace to get over 100. That is acceptable for a free-swinging power hitter, not for a guy second in the lineup. I didn't expect a .300 season from him, I would like to see him put the bat on the ball.
Same with Big Frank.:angry:

illinibk
07-04-2005, 12:36 PM
And even if Crede were a great teammate, the other 24 players could still be hoping for an on-field upgrade at third because they want a better chance at winning.
Yes, I am sure the pitching staff just hates that Crede makes defensive plays that 25 other MLB thirdbasemen can't make. They would much rather have Roger Dorn playing defense out there.

mdep524
07-04-2005, 12:39 PM
It seems like the Sox are scoring a lot of runs on solo homers. While homers are nice, it seems they've gotten away from manufacturing runs like they did in April and May. Also, although Ozzie's strategy to give all the guys at-bats generally is a good one, the regulars need to play often enough to understand their roles in the lineup. Good point Frater. Ever since game 2 of the Cubs series the Sox have hit quite a bit of solo HRs. I hope they get back to manufacturing runs more, and I agree that Pods needs to play almost everyday. Lately Ozzie has been giving him too many days off, especially against lefties. The thing is, Pods hits lefties pretty well- he's hitting .315 off lefties this year.

Palehose13
07-04-2005, 02:17 PM
3) Team Chemistry will improve, though not so much for Randa's personality, but as a result of addition by subtraction of the Sox's current, antisocial, introverted, mumbling third baseman.


And how do you know this about Joe Crede?

White Sox Josh
07-04-2005, 02:26 PM
Anyone who thought Iguchi would hit .300-.320 was probably crazy. He is not Ichiro and shouldn't be considered Ichiro. Hideki Matsui's numbers were very human in his 1st season and that is the reason he lost the ROY. He hit .287 with 17HR and 90 RBI. That might be similar to what Tad will hit. That is also fine with me. Expect a .280-.290AVG, 10-15 HR, 75-80 RBI, 15-20 SB, and Solid defense and fundamentals.

peeonwrigley
07-04-2005, 02:36 PM
Randa minuses:

That stupid perma-smile he has etched into his face.

White Sox Josh
07-04-2005, 02:37 PM
Randa minuses:

That stupid perma-smile he has etched into his face.As long as Crede hits .250 i'm fine with him. It's when he goes into these 1 for 30 slumps that i have a problem with him.