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View Full Version : Should Edgar Martinez be in the Hall of Fame?


ChiSoxRowand
07-02-2005, 02:10 PM
Me and my friend(Mariners fan) always have arguments about Edgar Martinez and the Hall of Fame. I don't think he should be in. He was a DH HIS ENTIRE CAREER. He only played 591 games in his career where he wasn't the DH. Frank Thomas has played a lot of games at DH(I think he should be in the hall), but he has played a lot at first and played first during his prime. Edgar Martinez has also never finished higher than third in the MVP voting. Just wanted to see what you guys thought, here are Edgar's career stats-
http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/martied01.shtml

White Sox Josh
07-02-2005, 02:18 PM
Me and my friend(Mariners fan) always have arguments about Edgar Martinez and the Hall of Fame. I don't think he should be in. He was a DH HIS ENTIRE CAREER. He only played 591 games in his career where he wasn't the DH. Frank Thomas has played a lot of games at DH(I think he should be in the hall), but he has played a lot at first and played first during his prime. Edgar Martinez has also never finished higher than third in the MVP voting. Just wanted to see what you guys thought, here are Edgar's career stats-
http://www.baseball-reference.com/m/martied01.shtmlIf he goes than Harold Baines has to go. He would've had 3,000 hits had he not played in 2 strike years.

soxwon
07-02-2005, 02:52 PM
no

santo=dorf
07-02-2005, 02:57 PM
I want to say no, but if the HOF is going to let crappy offensive players who played great defense, like Ozzie Smith (career .262 hitter,) in, why not let great hitting, bad-fielding players in? :?:

SoxFan76
07-02-2005, 03:00 PM
After looking at his career stats.....I have to say no. Edgar was a damn good player, but who is that quote from? Something along the lines that it's the Hall Of Fame, not the Hall of Really Good? Well you get the point.

In other words....no.

SOXintheBURGH
07-02-2005, 03:40 PM
After looking at his career stats.....I have to say no. Edgar was a damn good player, but who is that quote from? Something along the lines that it's the Hall Of Fame, not the Hall of Really Good? Well you get the point.

In other words....no.

:clueless

Skip "I always the expression on my face as if someone in the room just farted" Bayless

soxwon
07-02-2005, 06:05 PM
Will Timo Martinez make It?

SOXfnNlansing
07-02-2005, 06:24 PM
no

The Racehorse
07-02-2005, 06:37 PM
no

jake27
07-02-2005, 07:06 PM
no... i dont think it matters much, at least to me, if the guy was a dh. like someone said earlier, ozzie smith couldnt hit too well but was god with the glove.

SOXSINCE'70
07-02-2005, 07:15 PM
He was a DH HIS ENTIRE CAREER. He only played 591 games in his career where he wasn't the DH.

No,he wasn't.He was a 3B until too many knee surgeries
made him a DH.Harold Baines was an OF until he had 12
knee surgeries ( 6 on each knee),forcing him to be a DH.

But I agree with you,no,he is not an HOF.

RKMeibalane
07-02-2005, 07:23 PM
Will Timo Martinez make It?

Who is Timo Martinez?

SOXSINCE'70
07-02-2005, 07:34 PM
Who is Timo Martinez?

Brother of Freddy "Guzman" and "Chad" Hermanson.:roflmao: :roflmao:

chaerulez
07-02-2005, 08:47 PM
If Edgar had 3000 hits along with the plus .300 average, then you could make a case of it. His career is basically 7-8 "very good" years and 2-3 "great" years. He is hurt by not having a full season until the age of 27 and having 2 seasons ruined by injury. If he could've broke out at a younger age (around age 23 or 24), and had a couple more "great" years it'd be hard to argue with the stats.

Kind of the Palmerio agrument. He never appeared to be great in anything but he will have 3,000 hits and 500 HRs in his career. But I label him as a player that was on the juice, so that kind of makes it a moot point.

White Sox Josh
07-02-2005, 09:51 PM
If Edgar had 3000 hits along with the plus .300 average, then you could make a case of it. His career is basically 7-8 "very good" years and 2-3 "great" years. He is hurt by not having a full season until the age of 27 and having 2 seasons ruined by injury. If he could've broke out at a younger age (around age 23 or 24), and had a couple more "great" years it'd be hard to argue with the stats.

Kind of the Palmerio agrument. He never appeared to be great in anything but he will have 3,000 hits and 500 HRs in his career. But I label him as a player that was on the juice, so that kind of makes it a moot point.he and Big Frank were actually the only 2 players that I really believed during the Congress session. Well he was on the juice if you think Viagra is a steroid.:tongue:

Lip Man 1
07-02-2005, 11:15 PM
What happens with Edgar could have a bearing on Frank. Many writers have already stated they will never vote for any player who basically was a DH. Martinez played even less in the field then Frank.

Personally I don't understand that reasoning. It's not their fault that the DH is a legit position. Blame the owners if you must blame someone.

Lip

RKMeibalane
07-02-2005, 11:22 PM
What happens with Edgar could have a bearing on Frank. Many writers have already stated they will never vote for any player who basically was a DH. Martinez played even less in the field then Frank.

Personally I don't understand that reasoning. It's not their fault that the DH is a legit position. Blame the owners if you must blame someone.

Lip

Agreed. Besides, these same sports writers vote for pitchers even though most of them can't hit. What's the difference?

White Sox Josh
07-02-2005, 11:24 PM
The way i look at it with Frank is that it wasn't his fault that Jerry Manual refused to play him at 1st base.

soltrain21
07-02-2005, 11:32 PM
The way i look at it with Frank is that it wasn't his fault that Jerry Manual refused to play him at 1st base.



Um...Did you WANT Frank out there? You do remember why he missed a lot of time in 2002 and 2003, don't you?

White Sox Josh
07-02-2005, 11:37 PM
Um...Did you WANT Frank out there? You do remember why he missed a lot of time in 2002 and 2003, don't you?I'm talking 98, 99, and 2000.

RKMeibalane
07-02-2005, 11:46 PM
Um...Did you WANT Frank out there? You do remember why he missed a lot of time in 2002 and 2003, don't you?

2001 and 2004.

RKMeibalane
07-02-2005, 11:47 PM
The way i look at it with Frank is that it wasn't his fault that Jerry Manual refused to play him at 1st base.

Because it wasn't an emergency.

:jerry

"I can't imagine any reason short of an emergency for playing Frank at 1B."

Stroker Ace
07-03-2005, 11:11 AM
Love it or hate it, the DH is a position and DH's should be let into the HOF. No, I don't think Edgar Martinez should be inducted into the HOF.

Parrothead
07-03-2005, 11:27 AM
No question, yes ! Baseball created the DH position and he performed that role to perfection. He should not be punished for playing DH. Along that line so should Harold Baines and Frank Thomas (932 at DH and 971 1st base as of 2004). Edgar was dominate as a DH during his time.

ondafarm
07-03-2005, 04:47 PM
What happens with Edgar could have a bearing on Frank. Many writers have already stated they will never vote for any player who basically was a DH. Martinez played even less in the field then Frank.

Personally I don't understand that reasoning. It's not their fault that the DH is a legit position. Blame the owners if you must blame someone.

Lip

I agree. If Martinez is elected then Frank Thomas is a shoe in. Frank has better numbers pretty much everywhere compared Martinez.

I don't think that Martinez belongs but he may get there.

Frater Perdurabo
07-03-2005, 07:42 PM
Personally I don't understand that reasoning. It's not their fault that the DH is a legit position. Blame the owners if you must blame someone.

Lip

I agree 100%. If the DH didn't exist, Frank Thomas would be playing first base right now, because his bat is too valuable to not have in the lineup.

Likewise, I think if the DH didn't exist, Edgar Martinez probably would have played his entire career at first or third base.

The fact that a player plays DH for most or even all of his career should have no bearing on his status as a Hall of Famer.

Consequently, a DH should have the same standards of admission of another player who gets in solely for his offense. The "gold standards" for a pure hitter have been 3000 hits or 500 HR. Martinez doesn't have either. So the question is, are some other stats like OBP, slugging percentage or OPS more relevant to today's game. If those stats are to become new "gold standards," then perhaps one could make a case for him.

The other think to consider is this: would he be more likely to get voted in if he played for the New York Yankees or Boston Red Sox? I for one think the team for which a player plays should have ZERO bearing on his HOF candidacy. But we all know there is a decided pro-Yankees and pro-Red Sox bias to the sports writers and therefore to the HOF. Hmmm.

I don't think he's a lock or a first-ballot inductee, but it's possible he might get inducted.

ChiSoxRowand
07-03-2005, 09:17 PM
The thing is, people who aren't good fielders will have that held against them when being talked about for the HOF. Usually when a person is a DH their entire career, there is a reason.

doublem23
07-04-2005, 01:43 AM
Ozzie Smith and Roy Campanella?

:thud::kukoo: :smokin: :nuts:

mealfred13
07-04-2005, 07:42 PM
Neither of the two in my Hall of Fame. You must be using Shoota-rules Hall of Fame voting...