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View Full Version : Brandon, I'm extremely irrational with my expectations


RallyBowl
06-29-2005, 08:57 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

Baby Fisk
06-29-2005, 09:05 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.
Chillax! Don't get ahead of yourself. We need to end the Crede Experiment first. :cool:

ChicagoHoosier
06-29-2005, 09:08 AM
I'm very interested to see how he fares tonight in a big ballpark against an inferior team. If we can get him some run support early, maybe we'll bring back the guy we saw in spring training.

Let's not forget, though, in his three starts in the majors, he still looked great in one of them. I'm not impatient at all. Curious is a better word.

1951Campbell
06-29-2005, 09:11 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

I had given up on Garland before this season.

Perhaps there's a lesson there.

MeanFish
06-29-2005, 09:12 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

You're being extremely unreasonable. Brandon has demonstrated the ability to pitch to major leaguers even in his worst outings. He has the stuff and the location to run with the big dogs. However, his approach is lacking somewhat and he's trying too hard to make the big pitch. How often do you see him get two quick outs, only to struggle with the third?

Stop being exclusively reliant on results and start just appreciating the good things about his outings, of which there are more good than bad by a large margin.

Don't let pennant paranoia take hold of you. You can't seriously expect him to pitch like an all-star right out of the gate.

:rolleyes:

daveeym
06-29-2005, 09:13 AM
:threadsucksMAJORLY. It sucks donkey balls. This is exactly why all you morons that wanted him starting the season with the team were morons back then and even bigger morons now for bitching. The guy is what 21, almost 21? Look at how long it took Garland to figure it out. Look at the expectations put on this guy. Consider in spring training veterans and everyone else are working on something while this is a raw young kid that they just cut loose and said GO THROW, IMPRESS US. I seriously can't believe there's a ****ing thread like this, i'm seriously ****ing pissed off. :angry: :angry:


edit: I'm not done yet either. He hasn't pitched all that ****ing poorly either. Then you throw him into the best rotation in baseball and you have the nerve to question and rip him for not ****ing equalling these other guys where anything average is gonna look bad in comparison. Go into hiatus with the other dark clouds please.

BeviBall!
06-29-2005, 09:18 AM
I'm very interested to see how he fares tonight in a big ballpark against an inferior team.

Almost everyone on the Tigers is above .300 or right there. This is one of the better hitting teams we've seen all year.

Goose
06-29-2005, 09:18 AM
I can't believe that there are people out on this board that actually think that having a young pitcher come out for 3-4 starts can actually determine his career. If we give up on this kid simply because he is not ready for the Bigs at this moment is ludicrous! The BMac experiment?!? *****! Those who want to trade him now will be the same ones bitching about why we traded him 2-3 years form now when he has developed. Someone, please stop the insanity!

Cowhead418
06-29-2005, 09:20 AM
:threadsucksMAJORLY. It sucks donkey balls. This is exactly why all you morons that wanted him starting the season with the team were morons back then and even bigger morons now for bitching. The guy is what 21, almost 21? Look at how long it took Garland to figure it out. Look at the expectations put on this guy. Consider in spring training veterans and everyone else are working on something while this is a raw young kid that they just cut loose and said GO THROW, IMPRESS US. I seriously can't believe there's a ****ing thread like this, i'm seriously ****ing pissed off. :angry: :angry:


edit: I'm not done yet either. He hasn't pitched all that ****ing poorly either. Then you throw him into the best rotation in baseball and you have the nerve to question and rip him for not ****ing equalling these other guys where anything average is gonna look bad in comparison. Go into hiatus with the other dark clouds please.
You hit the nail on the head. He is only 21!!! Give him a break you can't expect him to pitch great right when his career is starting. Not every pitcher is a Mark Buehrle or Mark Prior. **** and give him time to prove himself.

jhill36
06-29-2005, 09:33 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

It's amazing how a phenomenal start like ours skews expectations. We want BMac to be Garland, like, yesterday. Not gonna happen. Trade him? C'mon. The kid stays in the picture. Just be glad...be ecstatic, really...that this kid is on the best rotation in the majors. Read the Trib article today about him learning how to pace himself during a major league game.

"Some of us are losing our patience..." That's what you said, right? You don't speak for me.

wdelaney72
06-29-2005, 09:37 AM
Melty broke this down a few days ago and he was right on. Brandon is having difficlulty throwing his breaking pitches for strikes. When those don't happen, he's down to a fast ball and a change-up. Makes thing a bit easier for the hitter.

He's 21, he'll be just fine, maybe not this year, but he'll be fine down the road. If he's not fine for this year, Kenny will address it in a trade.

Layoff of Brandon, he'll be just fine.

BeviBall!
06-29-2005, 09:43 AM
If anything, lose patience with the fact that the Sox always seem to rush kids before they're ready. B Mac will be very nice one day, but I don't think he's there now.

I just don't want this to turn into another Ruffcorn situation... of course, Brandon has 1000x the skill set Scott had.

fquaye149
06-29-2005, 09:45 AM
this is worse than the cell sorry sell thread

ondafarm
06-29-2005, 09:49 AM
BMac is missing one pitch (one fr##&&%% pitch) from his arsenal and people are losing patience with him. As soon as he's getting his changeup over for strikes, he'll be back to form. While you may think he's no longer untouchable, KW has the only vote that counts.

scottjanssens
06-29-2005, 09:58 AM
"Brandon, some of us are growing impatient"

Some of us need a little perspective.

Frater Perdurabo
06-29-2005, 10:07 AM
Even Jack McDowell spent the entire 1989 season in the minors after finishing the 1987 season 3-0 as a late September 40-man roster call up and then 5-10 in 1988. Cut McCarthy some slack already....

doublem23
06-29-2005, 10:09 AM
The kid is 21. I don't expect him to be a serviceable MLB starter until at least 2007.

harwar
06-29-2005, 10:22 AM
And one of the big reasons for not being able to completely control his soft stuff is because he was(and will be) extemely hyped up and nervous.
He may look like a quiet mountaintop but hes' seething like an active vocano inside.
He has said as much,almost in passing during some interview.
He said that he is having difficulty relaxing and composing himself.
I think he will calm down,by-and-by.
Anyway he is really impressive and some people just need to cut the kid some slack.

spiffie
06-29-2005, 10:25 AM
I'm not impatient with McCarthy. I am impatient with the mindset that seems to allow for him to engage in long-term on the job training during this season. He does have excellent stuff, and he might be a hell of a pitcher some day. Or he might be Jon Rauch/Danny Wright/Scott Ruffcorn/any of the dozens of other hot prospects who fizzle out. And if we were being our normal bumbling along just over .500 selves that would be fine. But this is not the year to be giving extended looks to prospects or being overly judicious in trade talks. I don't expect B-Mac to come up and be even a decent 5th starter at this point in time. Which is not something we can afford right now.

So I'm not impatient with McCarthy. I'm impatient with the folks who want to keep throwing him out there hoping he'll get it, and with those who would rather gamble on him becoming what he might become years from now instead of using him to get something that can help us in this unexpected and amazing year.

SOXintheBURGH
06-29-2005, 10:27 AM
BMac is missing one pitch (one fr##&&%% pitch) from his arsenal and people are losing patience with him. As soon as he's getting his changeup over for strikes, he'll be back to form. While you may think he's no longer untouchable, KW has the only vote that counts.

What he said.

SOXSINCE'70
06-29-2005, 10:32 AM
It took Garland 5 years to bcome an effective pitcher.

Give McCarthy a little time.Hell,he's only 21.Garland was 20
when he made his debut in KC in 2000.Hold off your judgement
for now.It's far too early to make judgements.:rolleyes:

Ol' No. 2
06-29-2005, 10:34 AM
I'm not impatient with McCarthy. I am impatient with the mindset that seems to allow for him to engage in long-term on the job training during this season. He does have excellent stuff, and he might be a hell of a pitcher some day. Or he might be Jon Rauch/Danny Wright/Scott Ruffcorn/any of the dozens of other hot prospects who fizzle out. And if we were being our normal bumbling along just over .500 selves that would be fine. But this is not the year to be giving extended looks to prospects or being overly judicious in trade talks. I don't expect B-Mac to come up and be even a decent 5th starter at this point in time. Which is not something we can afford right now.

So I'm not impatient with McCarthy. I'm impatient with the folks who want to keep throwing him out there hoping he'll get it, and with those who would rather gamble on him becoming what he might become years from now instead of using him to get something that can help us in this unexpected and amazing year.I don't think anyone in Sox management expects him to be a reliable starter this year. What they seem to be looking for is for him to be able to handle a small number of starts here and there so they can give Hernandez some rest during the season. The alternative is a trade. I'd rather see McCarthy in that role, even if he's only .500, instead of giving up top prospects for those small number of games.

scottjanssens
06-29-2005, 10:39 AM
I'd rather see McCarthy in that role, even if he's only .500, instead of giving up top prospects for those small number of games.

Even if he goes winless I'd be pleased if he finished his stint in the majors this year with an ERA under 4.5.

Sxy Mofo
06-29-2005, 10:41 AM
How is this even a thread?

RallyBowl
06-29-2005, 10:54 AM
:threadsucksMAJORLY. It sucks donkey balls. This is exactly why all you morons that wanted him starting the season with the team were morons back then and even bigger morons now for bitching. The guy is what 21, almost 21? Look at how long it took Garland to figure it out. Look at the expectations put on this guy. Consider in spring training veterans and everyone else are working on something while this is a raw young kid that they just cut loose and said GO THROW, IMPRESS US. I seriously can't believe there's a ****ing thread like this, i'm seriously ****ing pissed off. :angry: :angry:


edit: I'm not done yet either. He hasn't pitched all that ****ing poorly either. Then you throw him into the best rotation in baseball and you have the nerve to question and rip him for not ****ing equalling these other guys where anything average is gonna look bad in comparison. Go into hiatus with the other dark clouds please.Wow. I have finally recieved a hugely negative response for a thread or post! I surely didn't expect it out of this thread, though. I'm not sure I said anything that bad- I know I didn't "rip" him, just basically questioning when we can expect an outing like the many we saw in ST. Also, I'm sure that I did say I have not given up on him. I realize that he is young, and many people gave up on JG (BTW, not me) only to see him dominate this year. And lastly, RallyBowl, a dark cloud? You sir, should check the archives. I seem to remember someone calling me the "anti-HomeFish". Give me the "This thread sucks", that is fine- it may be well deserved. But otherwise, please relax, and learn something about the attackee before you attack. Oh well, I guess it's good that BMac has a lot of support still. That is obvious due to all the "cut him some slack" posts. I guess I have no choice but to, in the words of BabyFisk, Chillax. Sorry, fellas.

daveeym
06-29-2005, 10:54 AM
I don't think anyone in Sox management expects him to be a reliable starter this year. What they seem to be looking for is for him to be able to handle a small number of starts here and there so they can give Hernandez some rest during the season. The alternative is a trade. I'd rather see McCarthy in that role, even if he's only .500, instead of giving up top prospects for those small number of games. Yeah, as long as he gets regular starts I have no problem with him being brought up to fill holes. If he's brought up and stuck in the pen that's a problem. He's gone out and done his job in every start and he's getting work in and experience in.

DaleJRFan
06-29-2005, 11:09 AM
This thread should read:

"Brandon, some of us are growing impatient with WSI members who insist the 21 year-old #6 starter perform like a 30 year-old Cy Young award winner."

RKMeibalane
06-29-2005, 11:12 AM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

:whoflungpoo

ode to veeck
06-29-2005, 11:17 AM
I nominate this one for the "what's the score" board. It's worse than a "Brandon to yanks for RJ" rumor mill thread

Irishsox1
06-29-2005, 11:32 AM
All McCarthy has to do is cut down on the walks, mixed up speeds, have pin point control and pitch like a veteran and he'll be fine.

Actually, what I'm looking from Brandon tonight is more confidence in his stuff. If they hit it, fine, but cut down on the walks.

TDog
06-29-2005, 11:44 AM
It's amazing how a phenomenal start like ours skews expectations. We want BMac to be Garland, like, yesterday. Not gonna happen. Trade him? C'mon. ...

On May 12, 2001, I went to see Garland pitch for the Sox against the Rangers in what the local sports media people reported was a huge game for his career. We've heard a lot about this kid, they said. Sure he was 21, but he was a first-round draft pick and had great minor league success. He hasn't done anything in the big leagues, and it's time for him to step up or it may be time for the team to give up on him, they said. Some called it a "make or break" game for him. The defending division champion Sox were 13-20 and needed to get back on track. Garland was 1-1 in two starts, but had an ERA over 7. The crowd for the Saturday night game was over 31,000. I didn't leave for the game early enough to deal with the parking challenges, and Garland was already behind the first Texas hitter by the time I got to my seat.

He gave up 8 runs in 1 1/3 innings, according to the box score. Only four runs were earned, but there was no doubt about the three home runs he surrendered. A man sitting near me commented when the Rangers continued to hit him hard in the second that it was "pad your stats night at Comiskey."

The Sox lost 16-6.

The Sox didn't give up on Garland.

VeeckAsInWreck
06-29-2005, 11:47 AM
This thread should read:

"Brandon, some of us are growing impatient with WSI members who insist the 21 year-old #6 starter perform like a 30 year-old Cy Young award winner."

That's an appropriate translation.

balke
06-29-2005, 11:48 AM
What a terrible thread.

Lip Man 1
06-29-2005, 11:55 AM
I don't see how anyone can make a claim one way or another after a handful of spring training starts as well as three big league ones.

Plus it's been hard for McCarthy to get into any kind of rhythm going up and down to Charlotte twice and not pitching on a regular basis.

It's to early to make a call on this kid.

That being said I agree with Ozzie when he said (paraphrasing) 'We're here to win not be a developmental league.'

If Hernandez is a concern or if the Sox are trying to save wear and tear on his arm by limiting his starts in the second half, then they need to go out and get a pitcher. It doesn't have to be a 'superstar' or an 'All-Star' just someone who knows his way around the big leagues and can keep the Sox in the games that he starts.

I don't think honestly, that the Sox want to force feed McCarthy into a situation he's not ready to handle yet.

Lip

Ron Karkovice
06-29-2005, 12:00 PM
After witnessing that game against the KC Royals, I was even missing Jon Rauch:angry:

rdivaldi
06-29-2005, 12:04 PM
All McCarthy has to do is cut down on the walks, mixed up speeds, have pin point control and pitch like a veteran and he'll be fine.


:tealpolice:

Ahhhhh, my eyes!

slavko
06-29-2005, 12:06 PM
He doesn't belong here, not now, not yet. Find another starter, let the kid learn his craft, gain some confidence in the minors. All this is going to do is mess with the kid's mind.

balke
06-29-2005, 12:12 PM
After witnessing that game against the KC Royals, I was even missing Jon Rauch:angry:

Good lord, Brandon is 21 and has been pulled up and down leagues all season. He probably needs another pitch, something he doesn't have time to learn in the big leagues. From what I've seen, he's been good enough through 5 innings. Maybe he shouldn't be going 6 yet, we have a good enough bullpen to bail him out for a couple starts. Let Shingo try to go 2 innings, then vizz one, and Cotts one.

JB98
06-29-2005, 12:17 PM
I think McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time in this thread. I don't care if the kid is only 21. This is not 1999. We are not trying to develop players for the future. We are trying to win a championship, and we cannot afford to give away games waiting for a rookie to figure things out.

Brandon has a start tonight against Detroit and another one next week against Tampa Bay. If he gets it done, great. If he doesn't get it done, he needs to go back to the minors, and we need to trade for an insurance policy in the event El Duque continues to battle injuries.

I don't want to trade McCarthy. I want him to succeed tonight and stick in the big leagues. However, we can't afford to sit around and watch him blow 4-run leads against inferior competition like he did against Kansas City. Brandon is getting an opportunity. This is the big leagues, and he has to either sink or swim. If he sinks, the Sox have an obligation to the other 24 guys on the roster to get him the hell out of there.

balke
06-29-2005, 12:21 PM
I think McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time in this thread. I don't care if the kid is only 21. This is not 1999. We are not trying to develop players for the future. We are trying to win a championship, and we cannot afford to give away games waiting for a rookie to figure things out.

Brandon has a start tonight against Detroit and another one next week against Tampa Bay. If he gets it done, great. If he doesn't get it done, he needs to go back to the minors, and we need to trade for an insurance policy in the event El Duque continues to battle injuries.

I don't want to trade McCarthy. I want him to succeed tonight and stick in the big leagues. However, we can't afford to sit around and watch him blow 4-run leads against inferior competition like he did against Kansas City. Brandon is getting an opportunity. This is the big leagues, and he has to either sink or swim. If he sinks, the Sox have an obligation to the other 24 guys on the roster to get him the hell out of there.


This thread starts out by asking why he's not Jack Mcdowell yet basically, making it officially suck. I don't think he should be up here if he can't win for us either, but I don't think that means you give up on the kid. And I don't even think one lights out outing tonight means you stop looking for a starting pitcher to fill in for El Duque. The Sox either way could use a starter if El Duque is going to be hurt, and possibly come back and get hurt again. Mccarthy is a good fill in until the Sox make a move IMO.

Ol' No. 2
06-29-2005, 12:23 PM
This thread starts out by asking why he's not Jack Mcdowell yet basically, making it officially suck. I don't think he should be up here if he can't win for us either, but I don't think that means you give up on the kid. And I don't even think one lights out outing tonight means you stop looking for a starting pitcher to fill in for El Duque. The Sox either way could use a starter if El Duque is going to be hurt, and possibly come back and get hurt again. Mccarthy is a good fill in until the Sox make a move IMO.Just wait until tomorrow after McCarthy throws 6 innings of shutout ball and someone will start a thread on how he should be kept in the rotation and [insert name here] should be dumped.:rolleyes:

fquaye149
06-29-2005, 12:25 PM
Wow. I have finally recieved a hugely negative response for a thread or post! I surely didn't expect it out of this thread, though. I'm not sure I said anything that bad- I know I didn't "rip" him, just basically questioning when we can expect an outing like the many we saw in ST. Also, I'm sure that I did say I have not given up on him. I realize that he is young, and many people gave up on JG (BTW, not me) only to see him dominate this year. And lastly, RallyBowl, a dark cloud? You sir, should check the archives. I seem to remember someone calling me the "anti-HomeFish". Give me the "This thread sucks", that is fine- it may be well deserved. But otherwise, please relax, and learn something about the attackee before you attack. Oh well, I guess it's good that BMac has a lot of support still. That is obvious due to all the "cut him some slack" posts. I guess I have no choice but to, in the words of BabyFisk, Chillax. Sorry, fellas.

If he had pitched more than 3 major league games and was older than 21 this might not have been a retarded thread. However, that was not the case and so it is. That's the negative feedback

Baby Fisk
06-29-2005, 12:28 PM
I think McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time in this thread. I don't care if the kid is only 21. This is not 1999. We are not trying to develop players for the future. We are trying to win a championship, and we cannot afford to give away games waiting for a rookie to figure things out.

Brandon has a start tonight against Detroit and another one next week against Tampa Bay. If he gets it done, great. If he doesn't get it done, he needs to go back to the minors, and we need to trade for an insurance policy in the event El Duque continues to battle injuries.

I don't want to trade McCarthy. I want him to succeed tonight and stick in the big leagues. However, we can't afford to sit around and watch him blow 4-run leads against inferior competition like he did against Kansas City. Brandon is getting an opportunity. This is the big leagues, and he has to either sink or swim. If he sinks, the Sox have an obligation to the other 24 guys on the roster to get him the hell out of there.
I think the attackers of McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time. One thing we can all agree on is that McCarthy is an interim stopgap at the moment and not part of the long-term post-season strategy. Kenny needs to find another arm for the rotation and one for the pen. He got us this far, he won't slack off now.

daveeym
06-29-2005, 12:30 PM
I think McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time in this thread. I don't care if the kid is only 21. This is not 1999. We are not trying to develop players for the future. We are trying to win a championship, and we cannot afford to give away games waiting for a rookie to figure things out.

Brandon has a start tonight against Detroit and another one next week against Tampa Bay. If he gets it done, great. If he doesn't get it done, he needs to go back to the minors, and we need to trade for an insurance policy in the event El Duque continues to battle injuries.

I don't want to trade McCarthy. I want him to succeed tonight and stick in the big leagues. However, we can't afford to sit around and watch him blow 4-run leads against inferior competition like he did against Kansas City. Brandon is getting an opportunity. This is the big leagues, and he has to either sink or swim. If he sinks, the Sox have an obligation to the other 24 guys on the roster to get him the hell out of there. You missed the whole point of the thread. I think all his "defenders" would love to see him in the minors. The original poster flat out implied that he's a bust and if he doesn't perform well in his next start should be given the heave ho.

You're thoughts would be a valid question about this team and this season and what management is going to do. However that's totally not the point of this thread.

Jjav829
06-29-2005, 12:42 PM
Surely some must be wondering where the animal we saw most of spring training has gone. I definitely wouldn't say I've given up on him, and I know he's young and it is early, but where is the "young Black Jack" we were all promised? Not too long ago, anyone who dared mention his name in trade talks was immeadiately branded a damned fool. Now, I'm sure if a proposal was made, most would listen. Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

He's made 3 career starts. 3.....3 career starts. 3. 1 of them was good. Two of them were awful. He's a 21-year-old rookie. What are you expecting? You want him to come up and be Pedro Martinez right away?

And FWIW, I'd be perfectly happy if he went 5 innings tonight giving up 3 or fewer runs.

I'm also re-naming this thread to something more appropriate.

Soxrockhead2BANNEDagain
06-29-2005, 12:44 PM
:rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

He's made 3 career starts. 3.....3 career starts. 3. 1 of them was good. Two of them were awful. He's a 21-year-old rookie. What are you expecting? You want him to come up and be Pedro Martinez right away?

And FWIW, I'd be perfectly happy if he went 5 innings tonight giving up 3 or fewer runs.

I'm also re-naming this thread to something more appropriate.
Just leave the name alone man let us have an opinion don't just have us like a posting camp. were not slaves just let it be man, c'mon. Its crap that people can take credit for ur thread or pole.

Jjav829
06-29-2005, 12:52 PM
I think McCarthy's defenders are overreacting big time in this thread. I don't care if the kid is only 21. This is not 1999. We are not trying to develop players for the future. We are trying to win a championship, and we cannot afford to give away games waiting for a rookie to figure things out.

Brandon has a start tonight against Detroit and another one next week against Tampa Bay. If he gets it done, great. If he doesn't get it done, he needs to go back to the minors, and we need to trade for an insurance policy in the event El Duque continues to battle injuries.

I don't want to trade McCarthy. I want him to succeed tonight and stick in the big leagues. However, we can't afford to sit around and watch him blow 4-run leads against inferior competition like he did against Kansas City. Brandon is getting an opportunity. This is the big leagues, and he has to either sink or swim. If he sinks, the Sox have an obligation to the other 24 guys on the roster to get him the hell out of there.

You're completely missing the point of the original post. The original post was suggesting that because of 3 (or 4 after tonight) starts, we should determine that McCarthy isn't a major league pitcher because he hasn't pitched like Cy Young. No one is saying that McCarthy should be kept in the rotation all year. If he pitches poorly in the next two starts, then it's clear that he needs to be replaced in the rotation for this year. But to expect him to suddenly come up and pitch great right away is very unreasonable.

I suppose KW and Ozzie deserve a lot of blame for this. They talked McCarthy up so much as if he could come to the majors and be an impact player right away. They are largely responsible for the unreasonable expectations that some have.

FWIW, my thoughts on McCarthy haven't changed one bit after 3 starts. I still think he will become a good major league pitcher. I still would be open to trading him in the right deal.

Baby Fisk
06-29-2005, 01:02 PM
Just leave the name alone man let us have an opinion don't just have us like a posting camp. were not slaves just let it be man, c'mon. Its crap that people can take credit for ur thread or pole.
The Mods bust their asses for this site. Their hard work earned it among the top three rankings (http://damn,%20i%20guess%20the%20link%20is%20broken%20and %20we'll%20never%20know%20exactly%20who%20the%20to p%203%20are..../) of all sports sites on earth.

ilsox7
06-29-2005, 01:03 PM
Just leave the name alone man let us have an opinion don't just have us like a posting camp. were not slaves just let it be man, c'mon. Its crap that people can take credit for ur thread or pole.

English translation please?

And it's poll.

mccoydp
06-29-2005, 01:04 PM
MAJORLY. It sucks donkey balls.

That's the best statement I've read today (no teal required).

RallyBowl
06-29-2005, 01:11 PM
You missed the whole point of the thread. I think all his "defenders" would love to see him in the minors. The original poster flat out implied that he's a bust and if he doesn't perform well in his next start should be given the heave ho.

You're thoughts would be a valid question about this team and this season and what management is going to do. However that's totally not the point of this thread.Exactly where in my post did I imply he was a bust or demand he be given the heave ho? And I'm not sure if anyone other than me can say what the point of this thread was. I didn't bash the kid- I merely made a few Mild statements in an attemp to gauge what fellow WSIers thought about a subject that I didn't realize would be so overreacted to. Again- I don't beleive I said anything that terrible. He has pitched ok. I want him to be a stud, dominate, or at least get a decision. I think he can do it and be a key part of this years championship team. All I am guilty of is wondering when this will become a reality. Sorry I made the Worst post ever.I'll try not to let it happen again.

ilsox7
06-29-2005, 01:13 PM
Well, anyway I still think he's got the stuff, and he needs to show it tonight. Another 5 inning outing, and I won't be sure what to think.

I think that's the statement that did you in. You are saying that a bad start tonight would make you rethink your opinion of BMac.

RallyBowl
06-29-2005, 01:17 PM
I think that's the statement that did you in. You are saying that a bad start tonight would make you rethink your opinion of BMac.You sir, are probably right. That definitely did it. Let me quote the words of a wise man-"you always hurt the ones you love the most." I'm sorry to all my bretheren for hurting you and making you get all upset. and I love you all. Very Very deeply.

daveeym
06-29-2005, 01:22 PM
Exactly where in my post did I imply he was a bust or demand he be given the heave ho? And I'm not sure if anyone other than me can say what the point of this thread was. I didn't bash the kid- I merely made a few Mild statements in an attemp to gauge what fellow WSIers thought about a subject that I didn't realize would be so overreacted to. Again- I don't beleive I said anything that terrible. He has pitched ok. I want him to be a stud, dominate, or at least get a decision. I think he can do it and be a key part of this years championship team. All I am guilty of is wondering when this will become a reality. Sorry I made the Worst post ever.I'll try not to let it happen again. Your original headline didn't help either.

mr_genius
06-29-2005, 01:28 PM
uh oh, another heated McCarthy debate... let me recap

soxfan1: McCarthy isn't that good
soxfan2: idiot! I hate you die! McCarthy rules!
soxfan1: Screw you he sucks moron!
soxfan3: c'mon now guys, he's only 21. he is obviously the next Garland
soxfan1: He can't get AAA batters out
soxfan2: F**k you ! IDIOT MORON! That AAA stadium is small thats why he has a high era (sox fan 2 says this while jerking to picture or McCarthy)
soxfan3: just give him some time, he's only 17 for gods sake!

ect, ect, ect

:dunno:


this WSI theatre presentation was brought to you by mr_genius

Jjav829
06-29-2005, 01:30 PM
Exactly where in my post did I imply he was a bust or demand he be given the heave ho? And I'm not sure if anyone other than me can say what the point of this thread was. I didn't bash the kid- I merely made a few Mild statements in an attemp to gauge what fellow WSIers thought about a subject that I didn't realize would be so overreacted to. Again- I don't beleive I said anything that terrible. He has pitched ok. I want him to be a stud, dominate, or at least get a decision. I think he can do it and be a key part of this years championship team. All I am guilty of is wondering when this will become a reality. Sorry I made the Worst post ever.I'll try not to let it happen again.

I'm sure you want McCarthy to be great like all of us. But you have to have some patience with him. Very few rookies come up right away and dominate. 3 or 4 starts as a rookie shouldn't change your opinion of him. And titling your thread as if you are speaking for a group of people who feel the same as you didn't help.

daveeym
06-29-2005, 01:30 PM
uh oh, another heated McCarthy debate... let me recap

soxfan1: McCarthy isn't that good
soxfan2: idiot! I hate you die! McCarthy rules!
soxfan1: Screw you he sucks moron!
soxfan3: c'mon now guys, he's only 21. he is obviously the next Garland
soxfan1: He can't get AAA batters out
soxfan2: F**k you ! IDIOT MORON! That AAA stadium is small thats why he has a high era (sox fan 2 says this while jerking to picture or McCarthy)
soxfan3: just give him some time, he's only 17 for gods sake!

ect, ect, ect

:dunno:


this WSI theatre presentation was brought to you by mr_genius Nope, no one's defended him to that extent and the stadium hasn't been brought up yet. Actually don't even think there was a McCarthy rules or anything similar to that. Just flat out incredulity about expectations and how a 4th questionable start gets McCarthy thrown into the "likely reject" pile.

mr_genius
06-29-2005, 01:36 PM
Nope, no one's defended him to that extent and the stadium hasn't been brought up yet. Actually don't even think there was a McCarthy rules or anything similar to that. Just flat out incredulity about expectations and how a 4th questionable start gets McCarthy thrown into the "likely reject" pile.

i know what you're saying and agree

i just think this agrument is getting as old as the attendance threads. seen too many threads about the "McCarthy good" vs "McCarthy suck" debate. but thats what message boards are for i guess.