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View Full Version : Jayson Stark gets whiplash doing a 180 on the Sox


Flight #24
06-24-2005, 10:34 AM
Stark on AM1000 with Silvy & Carmen this AM. Among his tidbits:

- No team has had a 10+game lead in June and not made the playoffs (although some have flopped after a 10game lead after June)

- He thought this team didn't have enough offense, but they're first in steals and 4th in HR, so he thinks they DO have enough. Only team last year in top 5 in both of those was the Cardinals

- Add the pitching staff and "there's no reason to think they won't be playing in October"

- CLee deal was good for both sides because the Sox didn't just get Podsednik, they also got Iguchi, Hernandez, etc. (Where have I heard that before?)

- This team is more consistent offensively, teams of the past were much more variable, scoring 12 one day and 1 the next. (Another original bit o'thinking)

- No team can match up 1-12 with the Sox in pitching

- The only possible "team need" is 3B and he doesn't see any great options out there. Chavez ain't going anywhere. The market is shaping up such that there aren't any big moves to be made anywhere. But he thinks "Kenny will do something".

PAPChiSox729
06-24-2005, 10:41 AM
Stark on AM1000 with Silvy & Carmen this AM. Among his tidbits:

- No team has had a 10+game lead in June and not made the playoffs (although some have flopped after a 10game lead after June)

- He thought this team didn't have enough offense, but they're first in steals and 4th in HR, so he thinks they DO have enough. Only team last year in top 5 in both of those was the Cardinals

- Add the pitching staff and "there's no reason to think they won't be playing in October"

- CLee deal was good for both sides because the Sox didn't just get Podsednik, they also got Iguchi, Hernandez, etc. (Where have I heard that before?)

- This team is more consistent offensively, teams of the past were much more variable, scoring 12 one day and 1 the next. (Another original bit o'thinking)

- No team can match up 1-12 with the Sox in pitching

- The only possible "team need" is 3B and he doesn't see any great options out there. Chavez ain't going anywhere. The market is shaping up such that there aren't any big moves to be made anywhere. But he thinks "Kenny will do something".

Get that man a neckbrace! Well, it isn't surprising the experts now think we are such a great team because it is so obvious that we are for real. I ignored these guys in the offseason, during ST, and at the begginning of the season. And I think I am going to ignore them now too.
:cool:

Irishsox1
06-24-2005, 10:43 AM
What, no mention of attendance?

fquaye149
06-24-2005, 10:48 AM
Stark on AM1000 with Silvy & Carmen this AM. Among his tidbits:

- No team has had a 10+game lead in June and not made the playoffs (although some have flopped after a 10game lead after June)

- He thought this team didn't have enough offense, but they're first in steals and 4th in HR, so he thinks they DO have enough. Only team last year in top 5 in both of those was the Cardinals

- Add the pitching staff and "there's no reason to think they won't be playing in October"

- CLee deal was good for both sides because the Sox didn't just get Podsednik, they also got Iguchi, Hernandez, etc. (Where have I heard that before?)

- This team is more consistent offensively, teams of the past were much more variable, scoring 12 one day and 1 the next. (Another original bit o'thinking)

- No team can match up 1-12 with the Sox in pitching

- The only possible "team need" is 3B and he doesn't see any great options out there. Chavez ain't going anywhere. The market is shaping up such that there aren't any big moves to be made anywhere. But he thinks "Kenny will do something".

from what you posted, this seems like a respectable 180. That is, at least he admits his mistakes and says why he was wrong with a well researched, well thought out segment.

Of course, what's the use? We don't need his telling us why - everything he said he could have read before the season on WSI:)

doublem23
06-24-2005, 10:50 AM
1-12 in pitching? Wow, that is some high praise. Nice to see Stark lurks around here. Hi, Jayson!

:welcome:

Heffalump
06-24-2005, 11:06 AM
from what you posted, this seems like a respectable 180. That is, at least he admits his mistakes and says why he was wrong with a well researched, well thought out segment.

Of course, what's the use? We don't need his telling us why - everything he said he could have read before the season on WSI:)

Where does he admit all his mistakes? He lightly mentions "i thought they wouldn't have enough offense", but this was one of the guys that thought the SOx would be horrible and the C Lee trade was idiotic.

For once, I just like to see one of these hacks say "boy, did I f-up! I was completely wrong about the Sox". ....Also, you do realize that this now opens the door for his jumping on the sox bandwagon for the rest of the year.

I would actually prefer that all of these suckers stick with their slathering of love for the Cubs, Yankees, and Red Sox. We can and should win it all without them.

elrod
06-24-2005, 11:23 AM
Does that mean he likes Luis Vizcaino? If Viz pitched like he did last year I'd agree about the 1-12 bit, especially with Shingo getting into his groove again.

Flight #24
06-24-2005, 11:24 AM
For once, I just like to see one of these hacks say "boy, did I f-up! I was completely wrong about the Sox". ....Also, you do realize that this now opens the door for his jumping on the sox bandwagon for the rest of the year.



FWIW, I also heard Steve Phillips this AM and he said (paraphrasing)"people have been doubting them, heck - I've been doubting them, but I'm now a believer and the White Sox will win the Central".

Which basically qualifies as beating someone with an aluminum bat and after about 15 whacks them finally admitting "hey, that hurts".

California Sox
06-24-2005, 11:52 AM
- No team can match up 1-12 with the Sox in pitching


The Sox only have 11 pitchers. Except for the brief Kevin Walker flirtation it's been that way all year. One of the advantages we've had over previous years is that our starters have gone so long that we've been able to a) avoid having a 12th pitcher b) avoid having the 10th and 11th pitchers on the staff throw any critical innings c) carry an extra bat.

The Dude
06-24-2005, 11:58 AM
What, no mention of attendance?

Well, to add a tidbit on attendance.....When a team doesnt average 80% attendance, that team fails to make the playoffs 6 out of 10 times. The empty seats tend to reflect into the eyes of the home team causing them to drop fly balls, strike out, give up cookie HRs, and ultimately lose ballgames. The Sox better start raising attendance because this could happen to them!

nedlug
06-24-2005, 02:59 PM
Does that mean he likes Luis Vizcaino? If Viz pitched like he did last year I'd agree about the 1-12 bit, especially with Shingo getting into his groove again.

I don't know an 11th pitcher in the majors better than Viz.

spanishwhite
06-24-2005, 03:12 PM
Steve Phillips recently did his 180 a week ago as well.

I remember that he would deny that the Sox had a chance as long as they had Minnesota in the division. No team could lose that much power and have a pitching staff like ours and beat Minny.

Then he had a epiphany, Sox keep on winning even "when they are not supposed to" and they made a believer out of him.

santo=dorf
06-24-2005, 03:18 PM
I recall someone posting how Jayson Stark was on KC radio earlier in the week saying how few teams in the MLB would want Ozzie Guillen as their manager. He supposedly said he could count how many teams would want Guillen as a manager on one hand and have fingers leftover. I guess it's easier to bash the best team in the bigs than make positive comments about the Royals. :rolleyes:

santo=dorf
06-24-2005, 03:19 PM
Steve Phillips recently did his 180 a week ago as well.

I remember that he would deny that the Sox had a chance as long as they had Minnesota in the division. No team could lose that much power and have a pitching staff like ours and beat Minny.

Then he had a epiphany, Sox keep on winning even "when they are not supposed to" and they made a believer out of him.

I can't wait to e-mail him once the Sox win their 70th game.(Some time in July) :cool:

Flight #24
06-24-2005, 03:58 PM
I recall someone posting how Jayson Stark was on KC radio earlier in the week saying how few teams in the MLB would want Ozzie Guillen as their manager. He supposedly said he could count how many teams would want Guillen as a manager on one hand and have fingers leftover. I guess it's easier to bash the best team in the bigs than make positive comments about the Royals. :rolleyes:

I think Jayson Stark should get a look at this (http://nwitimes.com/articles/2005/04/22/sports/top_sports/a574bf6ce97b663e86256fea007fb2da.prt)article on managers.


But is a team's performance in one-run games a good way to judge a young manager? There is certainly evidence that would suggest so.

New York's Joe Torre and Atlanta's Bobby Cox are the two most accomplished managers in the game today. They both began their managerial careers in the late 1970s, guiding less-than-mediocre ball clubs to also-ran seasons.

But something telling was happening beneath the mounting losses. Through 54 one-run decisions, the same number Guillen has now, they were both over .500. Meanwhile, overall, their teams were well below .500.

When margins were wide, the talent deficit of their teams was evident -- they usually lost. But when games were tight the two young managers seemed to be able to exert their will on the outcome, be it via late-game strategic maneuvering, the force of their personalities on their players or, most likely, some combination thereof.

GregoryEtc
06-24-2005, 04:11 PM
So which is it? Do we want columnists to acknowledge us or don't we?

Does every positive sox comment have to be included with a 'mea culpa' for 'misunderestimating' the sox in the first place?

There's just no pleasing some people.

voodoochile
06-24-2005, 10:22 PM
1-12 in pitching? Wow, that is some high praise. Nice to see Stark lurks around here. Hi, Jayson!

:welcome:

:jasonstark:
"Where the heck do I get some good info on this team the wit soz?.. White Sox? Is that how you pronounce it? Okay, whatever.. just tell me where to go... I look like an idiot here.. WWW.Whitesoxinteractiive.com? can someone write that down for me. I'll never remember it by myself..."

flo-B-flo
06-25-2005, 01:39 PM
I ignored these guys in the offseason, during ST, and at the begginning of the season. And I think I am going to ignore them now too.
:cool: This has been my plan all year. I really don't give a **** what any of these guys think. I watch the BBTN replays, listen for some complimentary talk, then change the channel. Most of these talking heads will waffle and hem and haw until somehow it becomes clear: the Sox are good.