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View Full Version : It's the pitching, stupid!


FoulkeFan
06-08-2005, 10:35 AM
After reading the thread about the Sox finishing below .500 because of Scott Podsednik's slugging percentage, listening to Hawk & DJ talk about this team's great offensive balance and great "attitude", I just had to get this off my chest. It's the pitching, stupid!

The Sox are where they are right now because of their pitching. Their starters have been off the charts and the bullpen has been pretty darn good. I love watching Podsednik as much as anybody and I'd rather have him out in LF than anbody else, but I hardly think he's the main reason that the Sox are where they are today. The Sox have enough offense to win games with the pitching that they have (although for the last week or so the offense has been turning it up).

I just find all this talk about the offense infuriating. If the pitchers keep pitching well, the offense just needs to be average and the Sox run away with the division, IMHO.

jhill36
06-08-2005, 10:50 AM
No question that this Sox team is built on solid pitching. There's no doubt about that. I feel the same about the offense. I was cool to all this Chavez trade talk because I knew getting Frank back would change the whole dynamic of this offense.

You notice no one's talking about it anymore.

I get the same way when I hear talk about Konerko. Look...the guy drives in runs, and his slugging has picked up. Hey, not everyone can slug .567 and have a .429 OBP. We look too much at his average. The fact is he's been hitting the ball hard with high pop outs, advancing the runners, sac flies, all of which lowers his BA and make his power look deceptively anemic. That's all I have to say.

balke
06-08-2005, 11:56 AM
I say its balance. The pitching has been lights out, but there's been decent steady run production, and great Defense as well. That's balance.

Cowhead418
06-08-2005, 12:06 PM
No question that this Sox team is built on solid pitching. There's no doubt about that. I feel the same about the offense. I was cool to all this Chavez trade talk because I knew getting Frank back would change the whole dynamic of this offense.

You notice no one's talking about it anymore.

I get the same way when I hear talk about Konerko. Look...the guy drives in runs, and his slugging has picked up. Hey, not everyone can slug .567 and have a .429 OBP. We look too much at his average. The fact is he's been hitting the ball hard with high pop outs, advancing the runners, sac flies, all of which lowers his BA and make his power look deceptively anemic. That's all I have to say.
And Konerko has the second highest OBP on the team at .350 behind Pods so he has drawn a lot of walks and is still getting on base at a good rate despite his poor .236 AVG.

kevingrt
06-08-2005, 12:08 PM
Kenny and Ozzie created what seems to be the perfect team right now. They brought in a very solid pitching staff with capable relievers both lefty and righty. The defense this year has also been very stellar. We have had only a couple errors that cost us a game, but for the most part we are playing way above average in the field.

And despite what the media is saying about our batting, it gets the job done. If our pitching staff only lets up one run, then all the hitters have to do is score two. It's pretty simple and the hitters are getting the job done. Who cares about individual stats as long as the Sox are winning games.

ShoelessJoeS
06-08-2005, 12:09 PM
I say its balance. The pitching has been lights out, but there's been decent steady run production, and great Defense as well. That's balance.
id have to agree, the pitching has been stellar, for the most part. the hitting has definitely stuggled, sort of. what hasnt stuggled however is our timely hitting. is it just me or does it seem like the sox score all their runs with two outs? good pitching + timely hitting (not consistent hitting) = 20 games above .500

hawkjt
06-08-2005, 12:11 PM
I am convinced that with this pitching staff we would have won the last three years. It has always been the pitching; not too many homers,not enough defense ect.

I luv Pods and gooch; they are classic leadoff guys. But the whole running game as a key is overrated. How many times have we run ourselves out of innings? We have to lead the league in pickoffs/caught stealing. Last nite was a game where Dyes steal was huge. We must improve our caught stealing #'s cuz we do not hit enough for average to keep getting thrown out.

If Paulie had 1 more hit /week he would be around .280 and having a great year. 7-8 more hits in 58 games and he is having a great season. So does that mean he sucks. NO!!!

FloridaSox
06-08-2005, 03:40 PM
After reading the thread about the Sox finishing below .500 because of Scott Podsednik's slugging percentage, listening to Hawk & DJ talk about this team's great offensive balance and great "attitude", I just had to get this off my chest. It's the pitching, stupid!

The Sox are where they are right now because of their pitching. Their starters have been off the charts and the bullpen has been pretty darn good. I love watching Podsednik as much as anybody and I'd rather have him out in LF than anbody else, but I hardly think he's the main reason that the Sox are where they are today. The Sox have enough offense to win games with the pitching that they have (although for the last week or so the offense has been turning it up).

I just find all this talk about the offense infuriating. If the pitchers keep pitching well, the offense just needs to be average and the Sox run away with the division, IMHO.

Our defensive efficiency is the best in the American League. This means that batted balls (minus HRs) are being converted into outs at a higher rate than any other team in the league. So, we can have Garland with a low K ratio per 9 innings and Hermanson with a low K ratio for a closer pitching very effectively because the defense behind them is for now the best.

Ol' No. 2
06-08-2005, 04:05 PM
No question that pitching is, and always has been, the key to winning baseball. But I'd like to chime in with another element. This team is more than just the sum of its parts. If you want to see the antithesis, look at the Yankees, a team that is far less than the sum of its parts. Call it chemistry. Call it teamwork. Call it whatever you want. But the Sox have it.

elrod
06-08-2005, 04:17 PM
This stat should tell you something. In games the White Sox have scored 3 runs or less, they are 9-9. In games the Twins score 3 runs or less, they are 3-14. In games the Yankees score 3 runs or less, they are 0-22. A team that can win games where the offense scores no more than 3 runs is a team that knows how to win. It's also a team with damn good pitching. Even more impressive, the White Sox are 6-8 in games where they score 2 runs or less. The Twins? 1-12.

Sxy Mofo
06-08-2005, 04:46 PM
Pitching wins baseball games, no question. However, I'll reiterate what an usher told me on monday. He said it's the first time in his 5 years at coors that he's ever seen a team come out and stretch together on the field.

balke
06-08-2005, 05:08 PM
Without solid play at the corners, and solid play up the middle... as well as some Gold glove like pitchers, and the range we have in Left and Center, we would've lost about 10 more games than we have this season. Defense is an extension to the pitching. And if the Offense puts up donuts, one run games mean nothing. Being shut-out only once so far, you have to give credit to the offense as well.


B-A-L-A-N-C-E

FoulkeFan
06-08-2005, 05:48 PM
This stat should tell you something. In games the White Sox have scored 3 runs or less, they are 9-9. In games the Twins score 3 runs or less, they are 3-14. In games the Yankees score 3 runs or less, they are 0-22. A team that can win games where the offense scores no more than 3 runs is a team that knows how to win. It's also a team with damn good pitching. Even more impressive, the White Sox are 6-8 in games where they score 2 runs or less. The Twins? 1-12.

Wow - that's amazing!

And I do agree that the defense has been great this year and certainly has helped out the pitching staff a lot. I was just sick of hearing how we don't have enough offense! Don't these people watch the games????

SoxSpeed22
06-08-2005, 06:36 PM
Wow - that's amazing!

And I do agree that the defense has been great this year and certainly has helped out the pitching staff a lot. I was just sick of hearing how we don't have enough offense! Don't these people watch the games????They just look for the stats in the wrong places and forget about the most important one.
39 WINS

chisox59
06-08-2005, 07:41 PM
Wow - that's amazing!

And I do agree that the defense has been great this year and certainly has helped out the pitching staff a lot. I was just sick of hearing how we don't have enough offense! Don't these people watch the games????

Too many people have fallen in love with offense in all sports. They've never learned to appreciate that defense wins games a greater percentage of the time. It's gotten really bad since the steroid boys had their home run race a few years ago. I think many fans still have the mindset that we need to win games with double-digit numbers. They got used to Valentin, Lee, Konerko, Thomas and the rest going back to back to back but they seem to forget that other than Buehrle the other teams were doing the same thing to our pitching staff. Whenever Mark would pitch our hitters would pick that day to go in the tank. It is so much more enjoyable to watch a balanced offense go to work and pick each other up day in and day out not only with the bat but with the gloves and the legs as well. Let's enjoy the ride!

CubsSuckSoBad
06-08-2005, 07:49 PM
We could just as easily have this record with El Caballo rather than Podsednik.

I say we trade for Carlos Lee at the all star break...


Yep...

MeanFish
06-08-2005, 08:02 PM
We could just as easily have this record with El Caballo rather than Podsednik.

I say we trade for Carlos Lee at the all star break...


Yep...

You would be wrong to think that. We'd have more total runs scored, but we'd have less wins because our offense would be much less consistent.

batmanZoSo
06-08-2005, 09:07 PM
After reading the thread about the Sox finishing below .500 because of Scott Podsednik's slugging percentage, listening to Hawk & DJ talk about this team's great offensive balance and great "attitude", I just had to get this off my chest. It's the pitching, stupid!

The Sox are where they are right now because of their pitching. Their starters have been off the charts and the bullpen has been pretty darn good. I love watching Podsednik as much as anybody and I'd rather have him out in LF than anbody else, but I hardly think he's the main reason that the Sox are where they are today. The Sox have enough offense to win games with the pitching that they have (although for the last week or so the offense has been turning it up).

I just find all this talk about the offense infuriating. If the pitchers keep pitching well, the offense just needs to be average and the Sox run away with the division, IMHO.

There's no doubt about it, pitching is the reason we're number one in baseball thus far. And like you said, the offense just needs to be average and if the pitching is great, we'll win. The offense has actually been below average and we've still got the best record in the game. If Thomas comes back strong and I feel KW has an offensive upgrade coming some time, we'll really be tough to beat.

The offense does deserve a little bit of credit, though. We haven't been winning despite the poor offense completely. They've been much better than previous years at getting that one big run they need to win at the right time. And much of that is because of our superior top of the order in Pods and Iguchi--one stealing bases like a mad man and the other batting a consistent .300 and driving in clutch run after clutch run.

ode to veeck
06-08-2005, 09:24 PM
Call it whatever you want. But the Sox have it

Call it Mojo The Sox got it for sure. I like the tight D in the infield as well; lot's of DPs sure help the pitching stats.