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View Full Version : *Official* 6-5-05 So close, yet so far Postgame Thread


Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:18 PM
We didn't want to win this one.

CubsfansareDRUNK
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
eh

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
The game was lost in the 4th inning. With the bases loaded and two outs I knew Uribeís at bat would be crucial with CC on the mound. As soon as he had two strikes I knew a ball about two feet out of the strike zone was coming and Uribe would swing for strike three. It BOUNCED on its way home, and he still swung. I think everyone in the park but Uribe knew a pitch outside the zone was coming. Uribe has got to be our stupidest hitter at the dish. He would almost always rather swing at a pitch that bounces to home plate than take a walk. Itís so frustrating, is he capable of learning because we still need his glove out there?

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
Rant 'n' Rave in here

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
We tried as hard to lose this one as we did to win it.

CubsfansareDRUNK
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
Uribe always sucks with the bases loaded

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:19 PM
The game was lost in the 4th inning. With the bases loaded and two outs I knew Uribeís at bat would be crucial with CC on the mound. As soon as he had two strikes I knew a ball about two feet out of the strike zone was coming and Uribe would swing for strike three. It BOUNCED on its way home, and he still swung. I think everyone in the park but Uribe knew a pitch outside the zone was coming. Uribe has got to be our stupidest hitter at the dish. He would almost always rather swing at a pitch that bounces to home plate than take a walk. Itís so frustrating, is he capable of learning because we still need his glove out there

I agree. Uribe with the bases loaded and 2 outs is apparently an automatic out.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
Oh well.

Nard
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
Hey guys it's all good we still won 2 out of 3!

Who needs a sweep when you've already won the series?

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
We didn't want to win this one

uh, we came from behind twice in the late innings, just didn't need a flock of ducks let loose on the pond there in the 12th ...

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
We didn't want to win this one.And we have an early leader in the Idiot Post of the Night contest. :thumbsup:

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
Good fight... lack of bullpen depth bit us in the end. Our reliable pitchers are stretched thin right now. Need a CG from Freddy tomorrow.

RKMeibalane
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
:chunks

chisoxmike
06-05-2005, 06:20 PM
A game they should've won before the ninth and after the ninth.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:21 PM
We didn't want to win this one.

I think Frank and Tadahito did...

RKMeibalane
06-05-2005, 06:21 PM
And we have an early leader in the Idiot Post of the Night contest. :thumbsup:

I thought I was already leading that.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:21 PM
We tried as hard to lose this one as we did to win it.Another Idiot Post of the Night contender. Do you people even think about what you spew?

NSSoxFan
06-05-2005, 06:21 PM
Hey guys it's all good we still won 2 out of 3!

Who needs a sweep when you've already won the series?

Yes, let's freak out because we lost today! This team is terrible, no killer instict at all. I'm so embarassed to be a Sox fan!

:rolleyes:

TomC727
06-05-2005, 06:21 PM
Could it be that Ozzie didn't want to use anyone else out of the pen because we are going to colorado tomorrow. It seemed that he left Herm in a little longer than he should have.

gosox83
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
I also felt like Uribe's at bat was the difference. Yet I also feel like this was one of the unluckiest losses I have ever seen. I mean bullets right at people that would have drove in the winning runs!

We Cannot get to 20 games over. I don't know what it is??????!!!!

ugghhhghgh

frustration!:mad:

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
uh, we came from behind twice in the late innings, just didn't need a flock of ducks let loose on the pond there in the 12th ...

I gotta agree with Brian26. We came from behind and tied it. But we had far too many opportunities to win this one. Heck, to break this one wide open and just didn't want it

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
And we have an early leader in the Idiot Post of the Night contest. :thumbsup:

Give me a break FWC. This was one of the more winnable games all year. I don't mean "literally" we didn't want to win it, but I'm saying in spirit the team only needed a base hit at two points to win it...they just couldn't do it. We didn't need to come back from a huge deficit...the game was there on a silver platter, and we didn't take it.

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
Hey guys it's all good we still won 2 out of 3!

Who needs a sweep when you've already won the series?

Glad to see one of these posts is finally in TEAL, good one. KILLER INSTINCT guys! But Frank brings some of the missing K.I. to the team. I'm so glad he is back.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
Could it be that Ozzie didn't want to use anyone else out of the pen because we are going to colorado tomorrow. It seemed that he left Herm in a little longer than he should have.

Ozzie is afraid to lose a game. There's a lot of pressure on Garcia tomorrow to go at least 7.

Mammoo
06-05-2005, 06:22 PM
Uribe always sucks with the bases loaded

Speaking of JU; does he ever try to go the other way...MY GOD!!!:angry:

Nard
06-05-2005, 06:23 PM
Could it be that Ozzie didn't want to use anyone else out of the pen because we are going to colorado tomorrow. It seemed that he left Herm in a little longer than he should have.

Yeah, we really need Dingo and Vizz the Fizz ready for Coors Field.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:23 PM
Another Idiot Post of the Night contender. Do you people even think about what you spew?

Come on. You're going a bit far there. Someone else said flat out "we didn't want to win this one."

I am saying that we had some awesome comeback homeruns.... but then when push came to shove (i.e. Uribe with the bases loaded, ducks on the pond in extra innings)..... nothing!

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:24 PM
Give me a break FWC. This was one of the more winnable games all year. I don't mean "literally" we didn't want to win it, but I'm saying in spirit the team only needed a base hit at two points to win it...they just couldn't do it. We didn't need to come back from a huge deficit...the game was there on a silver platter, and we didn't take it.No, you give me a break. You said what you said and look at all the other crap in here. And there is no we. You weren't playing. You were crying in the game thread.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:24 PM
Come on. You're going a bit far there. Someone else said flat out "we didn't want to win this one."

I am saying that we had some awesome comeback homeruns.... but then when push came to shove (i.e. Uribe with the bases loaded, ducks on the pond in extra innings)..... nothing!

It was unlucky from an offensive standpoint. A ton of frozen ropes right at people.

Mr. White Sox
06-05-2005, 06:25 PM
Tough game...the play that really sealed it was the unfortunate error in the 12th...bad bunt, bad throw, poor positioning led to that run. It's a whole different situation if you have runners on 1st and 2nd with 1 out obviously. Meh, what are you gonna do.

Twins suck.

Chisox003
06-05-2005, 06:25 PM
:chunks


Ill go ahead and second that

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:25 PM
Come on. You're going a bit far there. Someone else said flat out "we didn't want to win this one."I'm going too far? Look at the crap here and in the game thread. You tell me who is going too far. Jesus.

Huisj
06-05-2005, 06:25 PM
Ozzie is afraid to lose a game. There's a lot of pressure on Garcia tomorrow to go at least 7.

this series could be interesting in colorado with our pitching staff suddenly getting worked kind of a lot.

whitesoxfan
06-05-2005, 06:26 PM
not a good way to end the homestand. But we did take 2 of 3 from Cleveland and again did not lose any ground to the Twinkies during this series. Gotta just forget about this loss. Let's go on this west coast road trip and win both of these series.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:26 PM
this series could be interesting in colorado with our pitching staff suddenly getting worked kind of a lot.

And the Rockies have been hitting lately. This is a trap series.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:26 PM
We Cannot get to 20 games over. I don't know what it is??????!!!!

ugghhhghgh

frustration!:mad:


90-72, here we come!!

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:27 PM
No, you give me a break. You said what you said and look at all the other crap in here. And there is no we. You weren't playing. You were crying in the game thread.

"All the other crap" meaning the people who agree with me?

And I disagree with you on the "we" too. If I devote four hours of my day passionately watching my team, I can use "we". Bitch at me if I watched the last 5 minutes of the game or just hopped on the bandwagon, but not after a 4.5 hour, 12 inning game.

NSSoxFan
06-05-2005, 06:27 PM
I'm going too far? Look at the crap here and in the game thread. You tell me who is going too far. Jesus.

I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side. FWC is right 100%, idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
It was unlucky from an offensive standpoint. A ton of frozen ropes right at people.

Well, I just hate relying on the old "bad luck" excuse. Any loss can be considered bad luck. Any fly out can be considered bad luck.

I will grant you that we've had A LOT of those frozen ropes this year...

But, hey... we're the best team in the MLB... so no excuses. Every game is winnable. As we stand right now, we will never play a game against a "better" team....

So I just get frustrated at every loss.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
What's the Sox record on sleepover night? Damn, stupid promotions... you know some kid pi$$ed himself right where Crede dropped the ball.

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
I don't think Hermy threw a pitch above 86mph, did he? I wasn't watching the radar every pitch, but I didn't notice any in the 90's. I wonder if he is OK?

NSSoxFan
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
"All the other crap" meaning the people who agree with me?

And I disagree with you on the "we" too. If I devote four hours of my day passionately watching my team, I can use "we". Bitch at me if I watched the last 5 minutes of the game or just hopped on the bandwagon, but not after a 4.5 hour, 12 inning game.

So, since I am a 'fan' of Bill Gates and Microsoft, I guess *we* revolutioned the world. YES!

Foulke You
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
Uribe has looked as undisciplined at the plate as I've ever seen him since coming to the Sox. He has always had some questionable pitch selection but lately he seems to be slashing and cutting and everything. Even on pitches that are 3 feet out of the zone, he is still checking his swing! He just isn't seeing the ball well right now. Hopefully going against his former team tomorrow will light a fire under him.

Losses like this before a road trip are tough because you used up a lot of your bullpen and you didn't even get a win.

On the plus side, it was nice to see Iguchi and Thomas come through in the clutch. Buehrle once again, pitched well enough to get a win if we score some runs for him.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:28 PM
"All the other crap" meaning the people who agree with me?

And I disagree with you on the "we" too. If I devote four hours of my day passionately watching my team, I can use "we". Bitch at me if I watched the last 5 minutes of the game or just hopped on the bandwagon, but not after a 4.5 hour, 12 inning game.I'm sorry, you do not play for the Sox. You don't have the talent to play for them or even work for the team in any capacity. Get over yourself.

owensmouth
06-05-2005, 06:29 PM
I would have liked to win this one, but I'm not gonna scream at anyone. Tomorrow we play at Coors, land of the long ball. I'm not as worried as some others because our pitchers already know what it's like to pitch in a homer happy park. We need to do well in Colorado, but we'll see...

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:30 PM
I'm going too far? Look at the crap here and in the game thread. You tell me who is going too far. Jesus.

I'm not trying to argue with ya here.

I'm a fan of the best team in the MLB. I think I have a right not to ever accept excuses.

If we lose, its all on the Sox.

Especially this game. People stranded all over the place. If any one of them were knocked in at their respective points, we're talking a White Sox winner.

But now we're talking a measly 3.5 game lead in our division.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:30 PM
Every game is winnable. As we stand right now, we will never play a game against a "better" team....

So I just get frustrated at every loss.

That's an enviable feeling to fans of 30 other teams. Did you ever think a team could be in almost every game after 1/3 of a season?

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:31 PM
I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side. FWC is right 100%, idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.

Granted there are a lot of stupid posts. But all the Kool Aid drinkers who think this team or a game are BEYOND criticism are just as annoying. We have a great record, but there are some issues worthy of pointing out. Please step away from the Kool Aid.

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:31 PM
So, since I am a 'fan' of Bill Gates and Microsoft, I guess *we* revolutioned the world. YES!

Completely ridiculous point. The entire focus of professional sporting events is based on the fan.

NSSoxFan
06-05-2005, 06:32 PM
.

But now we're talking a measly 3.5 game lead in our division.

Do you know how ridiculous you sound?

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:32 PM
Completely ridiculous point. The entire focus of professional sporting events is based on the fan.No, he pointed out the absurd flaw in your non-logic.

bluestar
06-05-2005, 06:32 PM
I just don't understand anyone thinking the Sox didn't want to win today. I think everyone out there gave it all they had; Cleveland was just a little better today. You can't expect people to produce in every single clutch situation, and you can't expect any team to play error-free baseball. A marathon game like today is tough on everyone. The Sox still hung in and came back twice. Please give the guys some credit.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:33 PM
Scolding someone for using "we" when talking about their team is so played. Like we all haven't done it.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 06:33 PM
I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side.

on a galaxy far, far away ...

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:34 PM
I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side. FWC is right 100%, idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.


Fine, you win. A loss is a loss. Bad luck. Oh well. We'll get them next time.

What the heck does knowledge have to do with this? We've been on a tear and are only 3.5 games up. A bad streak by us and a good streak by the Twinkies puts us in 2nd place.

If we're 10 games up... then I agree with you- its silly to fret over a loss.

But right now we're still in a race...

And the game I was watching had Uribe go down with the bases loaded. Our "best closer" get hammered for the 3rd straight time. Man on 3rd in extra innings and nothing to show for it.

I'm not saying the sky is falling, I never said the "season is over" or anything. But when the race is this tight, I think I have a right to expect that one extra step.

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:34 PM
idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.

I said "we didn't want to win this one." Meaning, we had a shot several times to win the game toward the end with a single. AJ had a shot to win it and so did Uribe. It's a phrase that's used all the time. We just couldn't get the hit we needed to put us over the top. How that translates to me being an "idiot" or "freaking out" is beyond me.

Lip Man 1
06-05-2005, 06:34 PM
Colorado will be interesting because of the effect it has on pitchers. I don't mean with the pitches themselves (i.e. high altitude results in less break on a breaking ball...) but the 'physicality' of it.

Everything that I've heard and read about pitching there says that you 'physically' feel the effects for days afterwards. The high altitude forces you to work harder just to breath let alone play. Pitchers are sore longer then 'normal.'

I agree that Ozzie has to be careful not to screw up his pitchers for two weeks stretching them. I'd rather piss away a game with Shingo or Luis if I have to rather then risk the starters in conditions they are not accustomed to.

And yes, Sunday was a very tough loss.

Lip

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
Scolding someone for using "we" when talking about their team is so played. Like we all haven't done it.

I always use "we". I don't consider myself part of the team, but it just comes naturally to include yourself as being part of the team. Is it wrong to do so?

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
Granted there are a lot of stupid posts. But all the Kool Aid drinkers who think this team or a game are BEYOND criticism are just as annoying. We have a great record, but there are some issues worthy of pointing out. Please step away from the Kool Aid.Why so black and white? You know there is something between "everybody on the team tried to lose and fire everybody" and "nothing could be better". The team is not perfect. We have weaknesses. Nobody minds discussion on that. Mindless raging is another issue.

SoxSpeed22
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
You win as a team you lose as a team. That's what I hate about losing close because you know you had a ton of chances to win. But lets just get 'em tomorrow.

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
I just don't understand anyone thinking the Sox didn't want to win today. I think everyone out there gave it all they had; Cleveland was just a little better today. You can't expect people to produce in every single clutch situation, and you can't expect any team to play error-free baseball. A marathon game like today is tough on everyone. The Sox still hung in and came back twice. Please give the guys some credit.

Cleveland before us played the Twins in games just as tough or tougher. They are playing well, 2 of 3 against them is good. They aren't going to fade away.

NSSoxFan
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
What the heck does knowledge have to do with this? We've been on a tear and are only 3.5 games up. A bad streak by us and a good streak by the Twinkies puts us in 2nd place.



Pop quiz, who is the second best team in the AL?

SomebodyToldMe
06-05-2005, 06:35 PM
If I devote four hours of my day passionately watching my team, I can use "we".

I agree with ya, Brian. I say "we" everytime I talk about the Sox:

"We're in first."
"We blew that one."
"We got our #### handed to us."
"We need to pick up the bats."

When you're one devoted fan, you feel you are as part of the team. That's how I feel anyway.

TaylorStSox
06-05-2005, 06:36 PM
Scolding someone for using "we" when talking about their team is so played. Like we all haven't done it.



Being a chicken little and crying after every loss is more "played."


Tough outing for Hermanson. He needs a couple days rest. The Indians bullpen outlasted ours. It's time to move on to the next series.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:36 PM
That's an enviable feeling to fans of 30 other teams. Did you ever think a team could be in almost every game after 1/3 of a season?


I've been a Sox fan my whole life. I'm sick of being happy "being in" a game.

Sorry, this year I expect everything. I'm rather happy that I can say that somewhat realistically.

If you're happy merely being in a game, fine... you'll enjoy things more than I. I'm just not this season.

There will be games where we lose 11-3, and its just useless, and that's fine. But THIS game... THIS game was winnable.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:37 PM
I always use "we". I don't consider myself part of the team, but it just comes naturally to include yourself as being part of the team. Is it wrong to do so?

I don't think so... I do it more than not.

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:37 PM
I'm sorry, you do not play for the Sox. You don't have the talent to play for them or even work for the team in any capacity. Get over yourself.

How, what an irrational thought. You're basically saying anyone who follows the team passionately can't say "we" because they were never good enough to play ball at the major league level? That goes for women too? You're talking down to a lot of peope when you say that. I guess I should feel like a schmuck for even going to the games or spending money on them or going to Soxfest. And who the hell says I want to work for the Sox? I could never make the money I make now working for the Sox, and to be honest, if I worked for them I wouldn't probably have the same passion for the game that I do now as a fan.

Why are you in such a bad mood today, West?

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:38 PM
Our "best closer" get hammered for the 3rd straight time. Man on 3rd in extra innings and nothing to show for it.

I don't consider having a ball lost in the sun to go for a triple and then having a double bouncing down the first base line to be a hammering.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:39 PM
Pop quiz, who is the second best team in the AL?

I meant 2nd place in the division.

If we lost 5-of-6 and the indians won 5-of-6 (or whatever), we'd be in 2nd place. I don't expect that... but we're also not 10 games up or anything...

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 06:39 PM
This was a HORRIBLE loss. The Indians are a very bad team, and we should have swept them. No excuses. I hang this loss on three players.
1. Uribe for once again swining at a ball in the dirt and ending a rally.
2. Konerko for watching strike three sail down the middle of the plate in the 10th after Frank's homer. That helped kill the rally. He needed to at least foul it off.
3. Crede. Brought in to pinch hit and did nothing. Thats ok. But his "bad" was not catching Hermanson's throw. The ball hit his glove, and looked very catchable. Even if it wasnt, he HAS to get off the base and make sure the ball doesn't get by him. That is fundamental baeball.

This is a hard loss to take, especially with the team getting on a flight to Colorado in a few hours. I would not be at all surprised if there is a huge letdown tomorrow and Kim looks like Cy Young against us.

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:39 PM
I always use "we". I don't consider myself part of the team, but it just comes naturally to include yourself as being part of the team. Is it wrong to do so?

If you're a passionate fan, no.

Cubbiesuck13
06-05-2005, 06:40 PM
What the heck does knowledge have to do with this?

Apparently, nothing.

The SOX are going to be in a race the whole season and I am looking forward to it. Part of the great thing about baseball is the penant race. Granted, the wild card prohibits a true penant race to happen but this is going to be a great year for baseball.
The way the people freak out here though, you would think that we had the flubs record. Good series win! again. Tough game loss. We are playing a terrible team next. Time to stay hot.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:40 PM
Why are you in such a bad mood today, West?I'm not in a bad mood at all. You are just used to me letting my board be abused. I stayed out of my own forums for over two years. I have decided, since they are mine, to use them again. And when I see people posting crap and abusing them, I will take them to task. I guess you could say there is a new, old sherriff in town.

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:41 PM
Let's get back to talking about the GAME, shall we? What did you all think about Rowand batting 7th? I guess it could help get the bottom of the order guys going, more hit and run opportunites and such. At first I thought it was odd, but I kind of got OK with it.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:41 PM
Tough outing for Hermanson. He needs a couple days rest. The Indians bullpen outlasted ours. It's time to move on to the next series.

Herm was due for a stinker. At least it wasn't an error that opened the flood gates.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:42 PM
To everyone so forgiving of this loss:

If we miss the playoffs by 1, 2, 3, 4 games.... will you be happy to "just have been so close?"

What games will you look back on and say "damn, that one was ours!" ??

owensmouth
06-05-2005, 06:42 PM
I don't consider having a ball lost in the sun to go for a triple and then having a double bouncing down the first base line to be a hammering.He didn't get hammerred. He did give up runs in his past three appearances.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:43 PM
I've been a Sox fan my whole life. I'm sick of being happy "being in" a game.

Sorry, this year I expect everything. I'm rather happy that I can say that somewhat realistically.

If you're happy merely being in a game, fine... you'll enjoy things more than I. I'm just not this season.

There will be games where we lose 11-3, and its just useless, and that's fine. But THIS game... THIS game was winnable.

Well, when you go into a season praying for 80 wins, I'll enjoy the ride a bit more.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:44 PM
To everyone so forgiving of this loss:

If we miss the playoffs by 1, 2, 3, 4 games.... will you be happy to "just have been so close?"

What games will you look back on and say "damn, that one was ours!" ??Mr. Black and White, who is so forgiving. You mean unless we post "we tried to lose this game" whe don't care if they lost. You couldn't be more mistaken.

TaylorStSox
06-05-2005, 06:44 PM
This was a HORRIBLE loss. The Indians are a very bad team, and we should have swept them. No excuses. I hang this loss on three players.
1. Uribe for once again swining at a ball in the dirt and ending a rally.
2. Konerko for watching strike three sail down the middle of the plate in the 10th after Frank's homer. That helped kill the rally. He needed to at least foul it off.
3. Crede. Brought in to pinch hit and did nothing. Thats ok. But his "bad" was not catching Hermanson's throw. The ball hit his glove, and looked very catchable. Even if it wasnt, he HAS to get off the base and make sure the ball doesn't get by him. That is fundamental baeball.

This is a hard loss to take, especially with the team getting on a flight to Colorado in a few hours. I would not be at all surprised if there is a huge letdown tomorrow and Kim looks like Cy Young against us.

Hermanson isn't to blame for walking 2 and making a bad decision and throw to 3rd? These posts blaming individual players for losses are getting out of control.

I'm considering taking a break from the site for a while. I'll wait until people get back to being good rational baseball fans. It pains me. I love the site.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:45 PM
Apparently, nothing.

The SOX are going to be in a race the whole season and I am looking forward to it. Part of the great thing about baseball is the penant race. Granted, the wild card prohibits a true penant race to happen but this is going to be a great year for baseball.
The way the people freak out here though, you would think that we had the flubs record. Good series win! again. Tough game loss. We are playing a terrible team next. Time to stay hot.


Of course. I just can't believe people think its crazy that some of us think this was a winnable game. And in that case, if the result is an "L", we get on the team a bit.

Like I said.... if we lost 11-3 and this game was just not meant to be, fine. But we had this one.

And, if this is going to be a race, and someone is going to win by only a handful of games... it comes down to games like this.

Patrick134
06-05-2005, 06:45 PM
It wasn't a bad decision to throw to third. A good throw ( or catch) and they had him out easily.

Mohoney
06-05-2005, 06:46 PM
The only thing I kind of disagreed with was running Hermanson out there for a 2nd inning of work. I would have just taken my chances with Shingo or Vizcaino in the 12th with a fresh frame, but I can't really fault Ozzie for using Hermanson, since he does give you the best chance to keep the game tied. I just don't like using relievers for more than one inning this early in the season if I can help it.

This was only our 5th loss against a division opponent, against 20 wins. It took a very taxing 12 inning game for the Indians to avoid the broom.

I saw some very encouraging things in this 4-2 homestand that makes me think that our offense can really come alive this summer and compliment our very solid rotation.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:46 PM
Hermanson isn't to blame for walking 2 and making a bad decision and throw to 3rd? These posts blaming individual players for losses are getting out of control.

I'm considering taking a break from the site for a while. I'll wait until people get back to being good rational baseball fans. It pains me. I love the site.I'd hate to see you go, but I can't blame you. We've lost several of our best posters over the years because of the psychos and ragers that dominate this place. Hell, like I said, I stayed out of most of the forums for a couple years. I would like to say come back in a while and it will be better, but I doubt it will be.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:47 PM
He didn't get hammerred. He did give up runs in his past three appearances.

I know, I was responding to the following:

Our "best closer" get hammered for the third straight time.

Cubbiesuck13
06-05-2005, 06:48 PM
Let's get back to talking about the GAME, shall we? What did you all think about Rowand batting 7th? I guess it could help get the bottom of the order guys going, more hit and run opportunites and such. At first I thought it was odd, but I kind of got OK with it.

I liked it. I think when you have a guy as interchangable as Rowand you can plug him in anywhere to see what happens. I would like to see him have a spot all to his own so he can get his numbers but no one on this team is going to have career year numbers when they are giving up an at-bat to move a runner along. Rowand's number in the batting order is just another example of how this team is going to do what it needs to do to win at the end of the day and year.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:49 PM
Mr. Black and White, who is so forgiving. You mean unless we post "we tried to lose this game" whe don't care if they lost. You couldn't be more mistaken.

Well now, "we tried to lose this game" is not supposed to be taken literally. Come on. I don't think that Uribe, when up with the bases loaded, said to himself "wow, I want to screw this one up".

That phrase is supposed to be translated as "we could have won, we should have won, and we didn't, and its could come back and bite us in the butt down the road".

I mean... why even have a postgame thread? We don't have ANY effect on the game. We're just venting, analyzing, etc.

owensmouth
06-05-2005, 06:49 PM
I know, I was responding to the following:


I know. I was agreeing with you

balke
06-05-2005, 06:49 PM
I just want to remind everyone who thinks you pull Hermanson that 1) he was brought to the Sox with the original idea of being a long relief pitcher and 2) Shingo and Vizcaino were due to come in for relief. See: Shingo and Vizcaino's record against the indians this season.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:51 PM
I mean... why even have a postgame thread? We don't have ANY effect on the game. We're just venting, analyzing, etc.As a matter of fact, the postgame thread is to keep the whole forum from being inundated with crazed posts. It keeps it all in one place. :redneck

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:51 PM
Message board breakdown:

Rose-colored glasses
Moral high ground
Trolls
Reactionary fans
People who wait until the game is over before they put anything on the line
Naysayers

Check, check, check, check, check, check! Let's take 2 of the next 3 and forget about this one. It's not like we sweep anyone anyway.

Patrick134
06-05-2005, 06:51 PM
It's not like Hermanson got hit hard. They had no hits in the inning. You don't walk the first 2 guys of an inning and expect good things. I'm sure Hermanson blames himself for what happened.

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 06:51 PM
This was a HORRIBLE loss. The Indians are a very bad team, and we should have swept them. No excuses. I hang this loss on three players.
1. Uribe for once again swining at a ball in the dirt and ending a rally.
2. Konerko for watching strike three sail down the middle of the plate in the 10th after Frank's homer. That helped kill the rally. He needed to at least foul it off.
3. Crede. Brought in to pinch hit and did nothing. Thats ok. But his "bad" was not catching Hermanson's throw. The ball hit his glove, and looked very catchable. Even if it wasnt, he HAS to get off the base and make sure the ball doesn't get by him. That is fundamental baeball.

This is a hard loss to take, especially with the team getting on a flight to Colorado in a few hours. I would not be at all surprised if there is a huge letdown tomorrow and Kim looks like Cy Young against us.You forgot Cotts. Isn't he one of everybody's favorite whipping boys? And Willie Harris and Timo Perez must also be responsible somehow. And if it wasn't for Ozzie's bad managing they could have won this one. Did I forget anybody?

Jesus, people. Get over it. ALL of them are "winnable". You're not going to win them all. Sometimes the breaks just don't go your way.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 06:51 PM
Hermanson isn't to blame for walking 2 and making a bad decision and throw to 3rd? These posts blaming individual players for losses are getting out of control.

I'm considering taking a break from the site for a while. I'll wait until people get back to being good rational baseball fans. It pains me. I love the site.

No, Hermanson sucked today. He isnt above blame. He walked 2 guys and made the bad throw. However, that ball has to be caught 100% of the time. That is fundamental baseball. It must be caught, you have to keep it in front of you. That may not have changed a whole lot, but it still might have been a little different if Crede came off the bag to catch the ball or at least knock it down.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:52 PM
I just want to remind everyone who thinks you pull Hermanson that 1) he was brought to the Sox with the original idea of being a long relief pitcher and 2) Shingo and Vizcaino were due to come in for relief. See: Shingo and Vizcaino's record against the indians this season.Well, having two relievers struggling as much as Shingo and Vizcaino makes a whole lot of things more difficult. :(:

Jurr
06-05-2005, 06:52 PM
I'd hate to see you go, but I can't blame you. We've lost several of our best posters over the years because of the psychos and ragers that dominate this place. Hell, like I said, I stayed out of most of the forums for a couple years. I would like to say come back in a while and it will be better, but I doubt it will be.
Nope. You've just gotta hold your breath and hope the ragers calm down. 2 of 3 wins ONCE AGAIN. Like DJ said, " 2 of 3...see you in the playoffs"

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:53 PM
I just want to remind everyone who thinks you pull Hermanson that 1) he was brought to the Sox with the original idea of being a long relief pitcher and 2) Shingo and Vizcaino were due to come in for relief. See: Shingo and Vizcaino's record against the indians this season.

Valid points but you do have to throw Shingo back into the fire at some point. I had no problem with Herm being left in. He just got wild at the wrong time.

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 06:53 PM
No, Hermanson sucked today. He isnt above blame. He walked 2 guys and made the bad throw. However, that ball has to be caught 100% of the time. That is fundamental baseball. It must be caught, you have to keep it in front of you. That may not have changed a whole lot, but it still might have been a little different if Crede came off the bag to catch the ball or at least knock it down.Did you even SEE the game?

Brian26
06-05-2005, 06:53 PM
Well now, "we tried to lose this game" is not supposed to be taken literally. Come on. I don't think that Uribe, when up with the bases loaded, said to himself "wow, I want to screw this one up".

That phrase is supposed to be translated as "we could have won, we should have won, and we didn't, and its could come back and bite us in the butt down the road".

I mean... why even have a postgame thread? We don't have ANY effect on the game. We're just venting, analyzing, etc.

I've already tried to explain that 18 times. Apparently somebody is concerned that the 2005 White Sox=1919 Black Sox and we (I mean they) are on the take.

balke
06-05-2005, 06:54 PM
ANYWAYS! How bout that Pods, Tads, Hurt 1-2-3 punch at the top of the order? Way to go with your first clutch hr of the season Frank! Thanks for the clutch hr Gooch! We'll get them next time, as we have the majority of the season. :supernana:

Jurr
06-05-2005, 06:55 PM
You forgot Cotts. Isn't he one of everybody's favorite whipping boys? And Willie Harris and Timo Perez must also be responsible somehow. And if it wasn't for Ozzie's bad managing they could have won this one. Did I forget anybody?

Jesus, people. Get over it. ALL of them are "winnable". You're not going to win them all. Sometimes the breaks just don't go your way.
#2.....Ignorance abounds. Nothing we can do about it, brother. This was a getaway lineup against the Indians' front line. The boys battled hard, gave everyone an entertaining game, and came up a little short. The bats are in good shape going into Colorado (as long as they don't overswing), and we should see some fun ball played the next couple of weeks.

2 of 3. All that matters.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:55 PM
Nope. You've just gotta hold your breath and hope the ragers calm down. 2 of 3 wins ONCE AGAIN. Like DJ said, " 2 of 3...see you in the playoffs"

The only thing DJ has ever said that makes sense. Although, I thought the same thing about Ozzie shaving. How much you want to bet he has a full-fledged goatee by SD?

downstairs
06-05-2005, 06:55 PM
As a matter of fact, the postgame thread is to keep the whole forum from being inundated with crazed posts. It keeps it all in one place. :redneck

Heh. Fair enough. There's nothing wrong with a little crazy, though. We're fans, not players or GMs.

My only question to everyone who is getting on me is... when is it fair to criticize a loss by the best team in the MLB? Never? I mean... no matter what happens for the next 3 games, we're still the best team in the AL.

Lip Man 1
06-05-2005, 06:55 PM
Another interesting little note is the fact that Crisp now has six home runs this season...three versus the Sox. Maybe they need to change the pitching pattern on him a little.

Lip

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 06:56 PM
Did you even SEE the game?
All 4+ hours of it. What does that have to do with anything?
I didnt say Hermanson's error changed the game, or it would have been any different if Crede came off the bag to catch it. There is no excuse for letting the ball get by you at that point of the game.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 06:56 PM
What games will you look back on and say "damn, that one was ours!" ??

I can think of much tougher losses, like opening day for example. We lost a close game today; we didn't try to lose it. It actually was a pretty good game other than the top of the 12th. Frank's HR in the 10th was one of the most exciting plays of the year, even with the L at the end of the day.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
My only question to everyone who is getting on me is... when is it fair to criticize a loss by the best team in the MLB? Never? I mean... no matter what happens for the next 3 games, we're still the best team in the AL.Criticize away. But, if you say the Sox tried to lose or blame somebody who didn't even play, hopefully, somebody will get after you. :D:

Jurr
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
Heh. Fair enough. There's nothing wrong with a little crazy, though. We're fans, not players or GMs.

My only question to everyone who is getting on me is... when is it fair to criticize a loss by the best team in the MLB? Never? I mean... no matter what happens for the next 3 games, we're still the best team in the MLB.
Criticize a body of work. If a team goes out and beats another team 2 of 3 and wins both series in a homestand, you don't get all panicky and weird. **** happens. It happened today. We're not spoiled on this board. We've been here a while and seen losses pile up and frustration abound. We know that this loss isn't that important.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
:tomatoaward

Let's see how long this one goes for...

owensmouth
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
As far as "games we could have won", this is one of the few losses that the Sox were never in the lead. Most of the losses were pretty close, so we could have won some of those. We didn't, so let's move on.

Lip Man 1
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
The Sox won opening day...unless you are talking about the opening day meltdown in the 9th inning at KC to start 2004.

Lip

dcb33
06-05-2005, 06:57 PM
This was a HORRIBLE loss. The Indians are a very bad team, and we should have swept them. No excuses.

The Indians are a decent team as they've picked themselves up after their slow start. Their ERA is 3rd in the league behind the Sox and Minnesota, and if they can ever get their hitting figured out they will be dangerous.

Although today's game was winnable, they still took 2 of 3 from the Indians (and 4 of 6 on the homestand) to improve their very bad record against the AL Central to 20-5. Not half bad in my book.

starboy0
06-05-2005, 06:58 PM
This was only our 5th loss against a division opponent, against 20 wins. It took a very taxing 12 inning game for the Indians to avoid the broom.

I saw some very encouraging things in this 4-2 homestand that makes me think that our offense can really come alive this summer and compliment our very solid rotation.

Two good points. Also it was great to see Frank produce.

Fake Chet Lemon
06-05-2005, 06:59 PM
Valid points but you do have to throw Shingo back into the fire at some point. I had no problem with Herm being left in. He just got wild at the wrong time.

I think Ozzie is saving Shingo for the NL. Maybe since they haven't seen him he could have some success and gain some confidence.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 06:59 PM
I can think of much tougher losses, like opening day for example. We lost a close game today; we didn't try to lose it. It actually was a pretty good game other than the top of the 12th. Frank's HR in the 10th was one of the most exciting plays of the year, even with the L at the end of the day.

Not opening day, but the opening series. I think the Shingo debacle was game three?

I take comfort that we battled back all game. This team usually loses leads and haven't had to play catch up at all this season. Gonna have to learn how to come back if we're to win 100 and stay ahead of Minny.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 07:00 PM
The Indians are a decent team as they've picked themselves up after their slow start. Their ERA is 3rd in the league behind the Sox and Minnesota, and if they can ever get their hitting figured out they will be dangerous.

Although today's game was winnable, they still took 2 of 3 from the Indians (and 4 of 6 on the homestand) to improve their very bad record against the AL Central to 20-5. Not half bad in my book.

I didnt say the Sox or their record are "very bad", I just said this is a bad loss. Its cliche to say "this is a game you have to win", but its true, the Sox should have won this. Its only 1 game, its not the end of the world, and the Sox will play again tomorrow. I just hope their isnt a letdown after a loss like this.

downstairs
06-05-2005, 07:00 PM
Criticize a body of work. If a team goes out and beats another team 2 of 3 and wins both series in a homestand, you don't get all panicky and weird. **** happens. It happened today. We're not spoiled on this board. We've been here a while and seen losses pile up and frustration abound. We know that this loss isn't that important.

I don't necessarily disagree with you. I just know the Twins are a very good team. I think there is a chance for us to be 8, 9, 10 games up here soon (enough). I want to see that happen.... THEN I'll accept losses where we had the winning run on 2nd or 3rd many, many times in a game.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 07:00 PM
I think Ozzie is saving Shingo for the NL. Maybe since they haven't seen him he could have some success and gain some confidence.If he can find the plate. :o:

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:01 PM
All 4+ hours of it. What does that have to do with anything?
I didnt say Hermanson's error changed the game, or it would have been any different if Crede came off the bag to catch it. There is no excuse for letting the ball get by you at that point of the game.For Crede to make that play or even manage to stop the ball from going by would have been a SPECTACULAR play. He was in on the grass covering the bunt and trying to keep an eye on the runner at second at the same time. In a split second he's got to get back to the bag to try to accept the throw. And you're ragging on him because he didn't stop a throw that was way wide? Brooks Robinson probably wouldn't have made that play.

dcb33
06-05-2005, 07:01 PM
As far as "games we could have won", this is one of the few losses that the Sox were never in the lead. Most of the losses were pretty close, so we could have won some of those. We didn't, so let's move on.

Had Iguchi not jacked that ball in the 7th, this discussion wouldn't be happening. I'm glad the Sox were able to hang around and put themselves in a position to steal the game away.

TaylorStSox
06-05-2005, 07:01 PM
I'd hate to see you go, but I can't blame you. We've lost several of our best posters over the years because of the psychos and ragers that dominate this place. Hell, like I said, I stayed out of most of the forums for a couple years. I would like to say come back in a while and it will be better, but I doubt it will be.

:redneck I probably won't go anywhere. This is the best place for my Sox fix. I need somewhere to kill time as I mend my leg. I just need to stay out of post game threads.

There's just more and more n00b posters who think this place is sports radio. That's where you go to vent your irrational frustrations and make no sense in the process. It's why guys like Mike North have a job.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 07:02 PM
Also it was great to see Frank produce.

Today, Frank really encouraged me. I thought there would be a 1-2 week period where Frank would try to be comfortable in the box again. He's been hitting balls hard ever since he got up here. I am glad he is back!

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:02 PM
To everyone so forgiving of this loss:

If we miss the playoffs by 1, 2, 3, 4 games.... will you be happy to "just have been so close?"

What games will you look back on and say "damn, that one was ours!" ??Every single one of them.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 07:02 PM
I take comfort that we battled back all game.You know, I think that's the whole point. For the last few years we watched Sox teams quit when they got behind. This year they always seem to battle to the end, even if they lose. I think that's what makes the "they tried to lose" posts so ridiculous.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 07:03 PM
I'd be more worried if we blew a 5 run lead in the 9th rather than tie the game, late, twice. This is as good of a loss as you can have. Watch Herm go another 20 scoreless after this because you know he's ticked.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 07:03 PM
For Crede to make that play or even manage to stop the ball from going by would have been a SPECTACULAR play. He was in on the grass covering the bunt and trying to keep an eye on the runner at second at the same time. In a split second he's got to get back to the bag to try to accept the throw. And you're ragging on him because he didn't stop a throw that was way wide? Brooks Robinson probably wouldn't have made that play.
He got his glove on the ball while keeping his foot on the bag. I dont think it was that hard of a play to knock it down.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:04 PM
There is no excuse for letting the ball get by you at that point of the game.

I happen to be one to think people are way too critical of Crede around here. On the play in the 12th, Joe was way in for the bunt, moved towards the ball, then did a great job to get back and in position at 3rd for what woulda been a key force out. "No excuse" on a very difficult (at best) play on a horrible throw is really going overboard, sorry.

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:04 PM
Today, Frank really encouraged me. I thought there would be a 1-2 week period where Frank would try to be comfortable in the box again. He's been hitting balls hard ever since he got up here. I am glad he is back!Does it look to you like he's not really hitting off his front foot like he used to? Not that it isn't understandable, but it may still take a while before he's hitting like he's capable of hitting.

Chicago83
06-05-2005, 07:05 PM
Uribe always sucks with the bases loaded

I think you need to lay down the crack pipe and check his stats with the bases loaded.

Career .360 with a GS. 26 RBI in 25 AB's.

Actually Juan is one of the better players on the team with bases juiced.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 07:05 PM
There's just more and more n00b posters who think this place is sports radio. That's where you go to vent your irrational frustrations and make no sense in the process.LOL, that's a good way to put it. Of course, they arean't all n00bs. :D:

Jurr
06-05-2005, 07:06 PM
You know, I think that's the whole point. For the last few years we watched Sox teams quit when they got behind. This year they always seem to battle to the end, even if they lose. I think that's what makes the "they tried to lose" posts so ridiculous.
And that's the difference right there. You've been around here a while, and you have been watching games a while. You know what we're used to seeing. These are the losses where you feel pretty good about things afterwards.

We've had our fill of Foulke's big blown saves against Minnesota, Koch's crap, Mike Jackson, etc. etc. etc. OR watching Manuel's teams fold up as soon as the other team takes a lead. This season is fun, and we're not getting bent out of shape about 1 of 60+ losses.

Mohoney
06-05-2005, 07:06 PM
For the last few years we watched Sox teams quit when they got behind.

The lack of use of this tag

:corpseball

Is definitely the most encouraging thing so far this season.

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:07 PM
He got his glove on the ball while keeping his foot on the bag. I dont think it was that hard of a play to knock it down.The ball just barely touched the edge of the fingers on his glove. At the time he was moving TOWARD THE BAG to try to get back to accept the throw. And you think he should change direction just like that and block the ball? *****.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:07 PM
You know, I think that's the whole point. For the last few years we watched Sox teams quit when they got behind. This year they always seem to battle to the end, even if they lose. I think that's what makes the "they tried to lose" posts so ridiculous.

That's exactly what's great about the Sox this year, no corpse ball, even when they're down, they just calmly go about their business, and almost take this one back. Other than the Herme 12th meltdown, they'da done it too. And I'll give Herme some slack too, he's pitched pretty darn well so far.

Let's go tear up some Rockies!

samram
06-05-2005, 07:07 PM
Way I see it: If the thing we're worried about is the Sox struggling to get to 20 games over on June 5th, I would say there's not much to worry about.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 07:08 PM
It's why guys like Mike North have a job.


I thought he got the job because Tommy Schaer loved his polish's? :rolleyes: Only in America can you go from weiner vendor to weiner of the airwaves. Whatacountry!

Chicago83
06-05-2005, 07:08 PM
I just got back from the game and I must say it was a good game overall. Both teams played really well, but the Indians deserved to win. I loved to see Frank hit that clutch home run, it was a line shot. That alone made sitting at the hot game worth it. It's too bad we couldn't get the sweep, but no reason to freak out. Iguchi and Cotts continue to imprees, another good outing by Buerhle. I think we lost our chance in the 10th with Wickman pitching. After Thomas' homer with no outs we should have been able to produce something with Konerko, Dye, and Everett. Oh well, off to Coors, lets keep swinging those bats.

Jurr
06-05-2005, 07:10 PM
I also felt like Uribe's at bat was the difference. Yet I also feel like this was one of the unluckiest losses I have ever seen. I mean bullets right at people that would have drove in the winning runs!

We Cannot get to 20 games over. I don't know what it is??????!!!!

ugghhhghgh

frustration!:mad:
Remember in 2002 when the team couldn't seem to get over that .500 hump??
Now we're pissed about not getting 20 games over!! That's why I love this season.

Mark'sBrokenFoot
06-05-2005, 07:11 PM
I don't see what everybody is getting all worked up about. The entire point of a post game thread is to break down the good and the bad. Just because we have the best record in baseball doesn't mean there isn't some bad.

It's good to see Frank putting one out of the park this early. He's usually a slow starter, so I take this as a good sign. Iguchi's average has dropped off, but he's still getting big hits and driving in big runs.

On the downside, Dustin has come back to earth. You can't let lefties hit .325 against you all year and expect to be a lights out closer. He was still a great pickup, but I think closer is a need still coming towards the trading deadline. Also, either Crede or Uribe needs to pick it up at the plate. It's hard to carry 2 terrible bats all season long.

PAPChiSox729
06-05-2005, 07:11 PM
Does it look to you like he's not really hitting off his front foot like he used to? Not that it isn't understandable, but it may still take a while before he's hitting like he's capable of hitting.

Well I would hope that he is a little cautious with his ankle until he is fully comfortable. But hey, I'll take this "cautious" Frank's hitting over any other DH we've had's hitting any day.

:D:

dcb33
06-05-2005, 07:11 PM
I didnt say the Sox or their record are "very bad", I just said this is a bad loss. Its cliche to say "this is a game you have to win", but its true, the Sox should have won this. Its only 1 game, its not the end of the world, and the Sox will play again tomorrow. I just hope their isnt a letdown after a loss like this.

It's not a terrible loss because they battled back late with a chance to steal it. The Sox could've easily laid down and died the way CC was dominating, but they hung in there, Ozuna got on base, Iguchi got the clutch jack and they were right back in it. Again in the 10th the Indians went up on Hafner's home run, then the Sox came right back when Thomas had his first home run, and nearly won it after that. It's a shame they didn't execute to win, but at least they didn't roll over to get on the plane faster. Had I told you going into the bottom of the 7th the Sox would battle back and nearly take the game I'm sure you probably woulnd't have believed me. The longest losing streak of the year for this team is 3 games, so even when they do lose it doesn't get in their heads the way it has in the past when they would start playing Corpseball and go on extended losing streaks.

Tomorrow is a new day against an awful team. I can't wait to see what the Sox will do.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:11 PM
I'm considering taking a break from the site for a while. I'll wait until people get back to being good rational baseball fans. It pains me. I love the site.

TaylorStSox, stick around, there's still a lot more rational fans around here than you think, i.e., there's usually three good wheels for every squeaky, noisey, cranky one on a good Sox-mobile.

Iguana775
06-05-2005, 07:12 PM
Scolding someone for using "we" when talking about their team is so played. Like we all haven't done it.

Exactly. Who hasnt said 'We' or 'Us" when refering to their favorite team? almost every one I talk to does. I have a hard time believing those who are bitching about it have never use 'we' or 'us' when taking about their respected favorite team. I call bull**** on anyone who says different.

Jurr
06-05-2005, 07:14 PM
I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side. FWC is right 100%, idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.

This post deserves a :bandance: .

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 07:15 PM
Remember in 2002 when the team couldn't seem to get over that .500 hump??
Now we're pissed about not getting 20 games over!! That's why I love this season.

It's the 2000 season coming back. No one wants to see this team coast for 3 months after such a hot start.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 07:15 PM
It's not a terrible loss because they battled back late with a chance to steal it. The Sox could've easily laid down and died the way CC was dominating, but they hung in there, Ozuna got on base, Iguchi got the clutch jack and they were right back in it. Again in the 10th the Indians went up on Hafner's home run, then the Sox came right back when Thomas had his first home run, and nearly won it after that. It's a shame they didn't execute to win, but at least they didn't go into Corpseball mode to get on the plane faster. Had I told you going into the bottom of the 7th the Sox would battle back and nearly take the game I'm sure you probably woulnd't have believed me.
It's not a letdown loss becuase they went down fighting. The longest losing streak of the year for this team is 3 games, so even when they do lose it doesn't get in their heads the way it has in the past when they would start playing Corpseball and go on extended losing streaks.

Tomorrow is a new day against an awful team. I can't wait to see what the Sox will do.
Im just sayind it has the makings of a letdown tomorrow because they lost a tight game that took them nearly 5 hours to play, and have to get on the airplane in a few hours. You have points about the Sox keeping it close. They have a lot of heart, and they will never give up in any game. I just hope they play good tomorrow.

Jurr
06-05-2005, 07:16 PM
Exactly. Who hasnt said 'We' or 'Us" when refering to their favorite team? almost every one I talk to does. I have a hard time believing those who are bitching about it have never use 'we' or 'us' when taking about their respected favorite team. I call bull**** on anyone who says different.
Yeah...it's an emotional investment that a fan has with a team. If a person is a long time fan of a team (and not an bandwagon "every year--new team" type), they have put a long emotional investment into that club. The fan also pays money to the team with ticket purchases and merchandise.

You're damn right it's a WE thing.

dcb33
06-05-2005, 07:17 PM
Im just sayind it has the makings of a letdown tomorrow because they lost a tight game that took them nearly 5 hours to play, and have to get on the airplane in a few hours. You have points about the Sox keeping it close. They have a lot of heart, and they will never give up in any game. I just hope they play good tomorrow.

Knowing this team, I'm sure they'll give it their all.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:17 PM
It's the 2000 season coming back. No one wants to see this team coast for 3 months after such a hot start.

:chickenlittle

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:20 PM
Im just sayind it has the makings of a letdown tomorrow because they lost a tight game that took them nearly 5 hours to play, and have to get on the airplane in a few hours. You have points about the Sox keeping it close. They have a lot of heart, and they will never give up in any game. I just hope they play good tomorrow.They battled back more than once and were in it all the way against one of the dominant starters in the AL. They lost because of a series of flukey plays. Two runs on NO HITS. Those are not the kind of games that lead to a letdown.

Jurr
06-05-2005, 07:21 PM
It's the 2000 season coming back. No one wants to see this team coast for 3 months after such a hot start.
Yeah...which is another reason why I don't mind losses like this. It keeps things nice and close. I honestly don't give a damn if the Twins take over the Sox in the Central as long as the the Sox keep up their winning ways and bring home a wild card. I'm not one of those fans that's all about just making the playoffs. When your team has good pitching, you're wanting to get there to advance. 2000 was a nice, feel good, "glad we got there" type of year. This team has a chance to do something special, and pulling out to some 15 game lead in the Central isn't the way to do it.
I want this thing close...I want both the Twins and Sox to be fighting it out all the way through, and I want the Sox to be playing longer in the year than the Twins, and God willing, everybody else. Period. The only way that's going to happen is if the Sox have a dogfight all year. I care only about end, not the means.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 07:23 PM
They battled back more than once and were in it all the way against one of the dominant starters in the AL. They lost because of a series of flukey plays. Two runs on NO HITS. Those are not the kind of games that lead to a letdown.
Im just saying that long, exhausting, tight games like that often lead to a letdown, I'm not saying we played bad. I would be just as worried about a letdown if the Sox would have won in 12 today.

dcb33
06-05-2005, 07:25 PM
Im just saying that long, exhausting, tight games like that often lead to a letdown, I'm not saying we played bad. I would be just as worried about a letdown if the Sox would have won in 12 today.

During the opening series this year, the Sox took a brutal loss on getaway day and came right back and dominated the Twins the first two games in the Baggie Dome. That sure wasn't a letdown.

Tomorrow the Sox get a terrible Rockies team. I'm sure they'll be fine.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:26 PM
Im just sayind it has the makings of a letdown tomorrow [...]

We should just have "Huff" from "Secondhand Lions" (great film btw) come in to the post game thread to give his "what it is to be a man" speech ... then we might be rid of a few of the negative soothsayers around here.

TheOldRoman
06-05-2005, 07:27 PM
Tomorrow we get a terrible Rockies team. I'm sure the Sox will be fine.
I sure hope so.

BlackHat91
06-05-2005, 07:28 PM
The SOX played hard today. They battled back to tie the game twice in late innings. It was a good game up until the end against a team that was just playing a little better today. Our record against the AL Central is still damn impressive.

duke of dorwood
06-05-2005, 07:29 PM
Well, having two relievers struggling as much as Shingo and Vizcaino makes a whole lot of things more difficult. :(:

Playing some NL teams that havent seen him makes Shingo very important the next couple of weeks

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 07:31 PM
:chickenlittle

Well, that's exactly what happened in 10/00.

BeviBall!
06-05-2005, 07:34 PM
Yeah...which is another reason why I don't mind losses like this. It keeps things nice and close. I honestly don't give a damn if the Twins take over the Sox in the Central as long as the the Sox keep up their winning ways and bring home a wild card. I'm not one of those fans that's all about just making the playoffs. When your team has good pitching, you're wanting to get there to advance. 2000 was a nice, feel good, "glad we got there" type of year. This team has a chance to do something special, and pulling out to some 15 game lead in the Central isn't the way to do it.
I want this thing close...I want both the Twins and Sox to be fighting it out all the way through, and I want the Sox to be playing longer in the year than the Twins, and God willing, everybody else. Period. The only way that's going to happen is if the Sox have a dogfight all year. I care only about end, not the means.

There is no substitution for playing meaningful games. The more you're in, the more you win.

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:35 PM
Well, that's exactly what happened in 10/00

thanks for the soothsaying...

:cleo

"I can always use an assistant to help dish out those bad tarot cards!"

ode to veeck
06-05-2005, 07:36 PM
There is no substitution for playing meaningful games. The more you're in, the more you win. absolutely, and that was one for sure this afternoon, just didn't work out

CubsSuckSoBad
06-05-2005, 07:42 PM
Stop crying.....Damn....

After EVERY loss, there is a complaint regarding some ish....

The complaints that come up a good portion of the time aren't even good ones....

Yes, Uribe swings at everything white coming at him...he would swing at the moon if he was an astronaut....

Crede jags at times...Konerko jags at times...remember this is baseball people....getting a hit 30% of the time is considered great hitting....any other sport in which success only happens 30% of the time for an individual, that individual is a failure at that aspect of the game....

We beat the indians the two previous games and went deep into this one...we fought through it and we lost...thats why baseball is played everyday...losing is ALRIGHT every now and then....wow

Someone said "We're only 3.5 up on the twins"....:whiner: ....well boooo freakin hoooo....give me a break

The twins are a half game back of baltimore as of 8:30 eastern for second place in the entire league...Whats wrong with being in a race with a team that good?

We have the best record in baseball 56 games through the season...in BASEBALL...not just the division....BASEBALL....relax....

Damn..Go have a drink:gulp:

Tekk
06-05-2005, 07:44 PM
You can't win em all. Nice clutch homeruns by Iguchi and Frank, it was also good to see Viz not give up a hit in the inning he worked. (w/ the bases loaded) surrendering just the sac fly to right. That inning could of been alot worse.

SluggersAway
06-05-2005, 07:44 PM
Uh, Jurr...there is only one mean to that end: win.

PicktoCLick72
06-05-2005, 07:47 PM
Some people here need to calm down and realize the sox fought hard on this one and just came up short. THe Sox O is coming around and hopefully still make strides on the West Coast.

South Side
06-05-2005, 07:53 PM
I remember a time long ago when Post-Game threads here on WSI were, dare I say, on the knowledgeable side. FWC is right 100%, idiots come on here and start freaking out about a L, and some even go as far as making us think they actually know what they are talking about.

So then why correct them after every single post game thread? You all know the manic depressives are going to be out in full force and to add to the insanity we've got them same people posting right after screaming at them. If you are easily annoyed by exaggerated posts after losses... don't read them!! At this point I don't know which is more annoying the "We lost one game, we have no desire to win anymore, we might never win again" or the "What the hell is wrong with you??? Go take some Prozac. You're ruining this board... how dare you show concern for your team" blah blah blah...

Ol' No. 2
06-05-2005, 07:57 PM
Playing some NL teams that havent seen him makes Shingo very important the next couple of weeksIf he doesn't start throwing strikes, it won't matter if they've seen him or not.

voodoochile
06-05-2005, 08:11 PM
I refuse to read this entire thread...

Last Sunday the lead was 3.5 this Sunday the lead is 3.5...

One more week gone from the schedule...

Keep winning those series...

Dance little dude... dance...

:supernana: :supernana: :supernana: :bandance:

Brian26
06-05-2005, 08:15 PM
I think that's what makes the "they tried to lose" posts so ridiculous.

Nobody posted "they tried to lose", West. I posted "they didn't want to win it", which is equivalent to "they gave it away." For some reason, you're twisting words and making this equivalent to me accusing them of throwing the game, which is far more irrational than anything in my original post. Nobody accused the team of losing on purpose.

elrod
06-05-2005, 08:19 PM
I just got back from the game. It was a very exciting game to be at because you knew Sabathia would be tough. He's unbeatable at the Cell so give some credit to the guys for working deep counts and getting him out of the game in the 7th. Also, tons of two-out hitting - sort of like all the two-strike hits yesterday. This team played clutch all day - who could possibly say the White Sox "didn't want it", or "gave it away". Ridiculous. The Indians nearly gave it away twice. The Indians didn't "want it" - that's why we kept bouncing back. Only when Dustin lost his control in the 12th and threw the ball away did the Indians win. Heck, we should have lost 3-1, but Iguchi hit an absolute bomb off Betancourt. Then we should have lost after Hafner's HR but Frank hit a laser off the top of the yellow wall and into the bulllpen. Folks, that's about as clutch as you can get. Two late-inning come-from-behind HRs. The best chance to win was AJ's line drive to 1B in the 10th. Of course if Widger hadn't been ruled HBP then Dye would have scored on the wild pitch in the 4th (and there'd be no discussion of Uribe). Overall, this would have been a STEAL had the Sox pulled it out. We almost did. Nothing to hang our heads about. Keep up the long balls in Colorado.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 08:22 PM
Nobody posted "they tried to lose", West. I posted "they didn't want to win it", which is equivalent to "they gave it away." For some reason, you're twisting words and making this equivalent to me accusing them of throwing the game, which is far more irrational than anything in my original post. Nobody accused the team of losing on purpose.If "they didn't want to win", what did they want? Did they want to tie? There are no ties in baseball (except for one thanks to The Tool). So, if "they didn't want to win", the implication is they wanted to lose. I'm not twisting anything. You are just tap dancing.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 08:24 PM
So then why correct them after every single post game thread? You all know the manic depressives are going to be out in full force and to add to the insanity we've got them same people posting right after screaming at them. If you are easily annoyed by exaggerated posts after losses... don't read them!! At this point I don't know which is more annoying the "We lost one game, we have no desire to win anymore, we might never win again" or the "What the hell is wrong with you??? Go take some Prozac. You're ruining this board... how dare you show concern for your team" blah blah blah...I've considered your suggestions on how to run our board and I've decided to reject them. Thank you for your input, though.

MRKARNO
06-05-2005, 08:24 PM
I just got back from the game. It was one that we easily could have one, but one that we easily could have lost just as well. We came back from a 3-1 deficit against a good pitching staff and the Tribe had bases loaded one out with a 2 run lead the inning before. We also came back from a 4-3 hole in the bottom of the ninth to re-tie the game. They didn't execute, but you can't always do that. Defensive miscues (read: Widger not challenging that SB when the Tribe scored their third run and Crede's throw in the 12th) hurt our cause and the double leadoff walks finally did the Sox in (it would have been exceptionally good at that point to get out of that, but understandable that it didn't happen.

It is frustrating that the Sox failed again to complete a sweep that could have been easily completed, but at least they are getting themselves in so many situations.

infohawk
06-05-2005, 08:25 PM
I thought that generally it was a pretty well-played game by both teams. I know it has been said a million times, but it is very hard to sweep a team.

The biggest difference to me was that Sabathia outpitched Buerhle by just enough. Sabathia gave up one earned run. Buerhle gave up three earned runs, and but for the bullpen (Cotts), it could have been much worse. Cleveland's bullpen gave up three earned runs, and I think ours gave up just one or two earned runs over 5+ innings. Hermanson had a little control trouble during his second inning of relief, but, hey, he's not always going to be perfect. On the flipside, Cotts did an outstanding job in keeping the Indians from scoring any runs when he came into a very bad situation a few innings earlier. Vizcaino pitched pretty well too. The only run off him came on a sacrifice fly, and it wasn't even his runner.

Big homers by Iguchi and Thomas, and A.J. ripped a ball that would have won the game but for the fact that it was hit right at the first baseman. Game of inches.

infohawk
06-05-2005, 08:30 PM
I didnt say the Sox or their record are "very bad", I just said this is a bad loss. Its cliche to say "this is a game you have to win", but its true, the Sox should have won this. Its only 1 game, its not the end of the world, and the Sox will play again tomorrow. I just hope their isnt a letdown after a loss like this.

Its not like they had a lead and let it get away in the ninth inning. That is the kind of loss that really hurts. I would have preferred a win, but at least they really did "die trying."

elrod
06-05-2005, 08:42 PM
Its not like they had a lead and let it get away in the ninth inning. That is the kind of loss that really hurts. I would have preferred a win, but at least they really did "die trying."

Exactly. Riding the EL home I had a feeling of disappointment but still pride that they kept coming back. Had they blew an actual lead late in the game I would have been downright nauseous.

Hendu
06-05-2005, 08:46 PM
The leadoff walk can kill you. Give up 2 walks to start the inning and it will kill you every time. 2 runs without a hit. Hermanson should've gone to first on that bunt...even if Crede had caught the throw, the runner would have been safe.

Nice to see big Frank with the clutch bomb. Too bad nobody else could come through with a big hit afterwards.

bafiarocks03
06-05-2005, 08:46 PM
Well i was at the game! It was a good game!! I was in 125 row 32, then since i have the in with the usher, moved down to row 7! and i was cheering for grady sizmore and coco crisp, and people were looking at me funny! but at the end of the game...i got Coco to wave to me!! and i hugged willie harris!! and i got on the jumbotron! yea!! my friend's 'In DUSTIN we're TRUSTIN sign got on there! but it was a great game!! even though we lost! that's ok! and omg..today was Tony Fedichi (the batboy)'s last day! i was so sad!! and no bafia today! well i did see him! but yea! :D:

JGarlandrules20
06-05-2005, 09:15 PM
and i was cheering for grady sizmore and coco crisp, and people were looking at me funny! but at the end of the game...i got Coco to wave to me!! and i hugged willie harris!!
I like -a lot- of non white sox players. But I would never root for them and against the sox. :(:

Reminds me of 83
06-05-2005, 09:26 PM
I could not agree more. I felt OK after this game. Some very good moments that kept the game winnable. That is what this team does so well. Sometimes you do not get the breaks and you lose. The Sox have had many close games break their way. This one did not.

Go Sox

___________________________________

6-2 with my lucky green hat (albeit not so lucky today)
ANYWAYS! How bout that Pods, Tads, Hurt 1-2-3 punch at the top of the order? Way to go with your first clutch hr of the season Frank! Thanks for the clutch hr Gooch! We'll get them next time, as we have the majority of the season. :supernana:

South Side
06-05-2005, 09:31 PM
I've considered your suggestions on how to run our board and I've decided to reject them. Thank you for your input, though.

I wasn't giving any advice on how to run a board. I was giving my input on how to bypass some of the drama that occurs, which would benefit the whole board not just the moderators. It's the same thing each post game. It just seems like the logical and mature thing to do would be to ignore the maniacal responses that this thread is inevitably going to attract.

FarWestChicago
06-05-2005, 09:36 PM
It just seems like the logical and mature thing to do would be to ignore the maniacal responses that this thread is inevitably going to attract.It may be easier to allow the inmates to run the asylum, but it's not more logical or more mature.

Dick Allen
06-05-2005, 10:17 PM
As far as I'm concerned, the key play in the game was that called strike by the vision-challenged umpire on Everett on a 2-0 count after PK led off with a hit in the bottom of the eighth. The pitch was shin-high and a foot outside. Everett would have walked two pitches later; first and second with nobody out, and a pefect situation to manufacture a run. That call changed the whole complexion of that inning.

Palehose13
06-05-2005, 10:20 PM
Well i was at the game! It was a good game!! I was in 125 row 32, then since i have the in with the usher, moved down to row 7! and i was cheering for grady sizmore and coco crisp, and people were looking at me funny! but at the end of the game...i got Coco to wave to me!! and i hugged willie harris!! and i got on the jumbotron! yea!! my friend's 'In DUSTIN we're TRUSTIN sign got on there! but it was a great game!! even though we lost! that's ok! and omg..today was Tony Fedichi (the batboy)'s last day! i was so sad!! and no bafia today! well i did see him! but yea! :D:

Wow. Just wow. :D:

samram
06-05-2005, 10:42 PM
Wow. Just wow. :D:

Yeah, Bafia definitely deserves a permanent peanut-gallery spot on TRL.:D:

Jjav829
06-05-2005, 11:30 PM
I have no problem with Hermanson pitching two innings. He's a former starter/long reliever. He can handle multiple innings. Hermanson just didn't make the pitches today.

Second, I can't believe some people are criticizing Crede for that play. It was a bad throw by Hermanson. That's all there is to it. The ball was close enough that Crede had a chance to catch it while keeping his foot on the bag. It was just a tad too far away for him to make the catch. But in that situation Crede has to keep his foot on the base and attempt to get that force.

CHISOXFAN13
06-06-2005, 12:46 AM
I'm not trying to argue with ya here.

I'm a fan of the best team in the MLB. I think I have a right not to ever accept excuses.

If we lose, its all on the Sox.

Especially this game. People stranded all over the place. If any one of them were knocked in at their respective points, we're talking a White Sox winner.

But now we're talking a measly 3.5 game lead in our division.

The problem with many on this site is they look at one team and one team only in a respective game. How bout the runners the Indians stranded in the seventh? Sure, the Sox stranded runners, but they also scored three of four runs with two outs. That's hardly giving a game away.

The Indians had ample opportunities, too. Nobody likes to give credit where credit is due. Sabathia pitched well, as he always does against the Sox. He's a freaking ace for crying out loud.

Blame Uribe if you want, but not many of our hitters were successful against him today.

It's amazing to me how many people can't deal with a loss. The team battled, and that's all I ask for.

Tomorrow, well tonight, is a new day.

ShoelessJoeS
06-06-2005, 12:57 AM
It's amazing to me how many people can't deal with a loss. The team battled, and that's all I ask for.
i agree. the fact that they came back to tie it, twice, shows that they have lots of heart. IMO, an essential aspect of any champion. i think todays showing of the never-say-die-til-weve-recorded-the-final-out attitude is a victory in itself. its just a shame that we couldnt pick up the W

dcb33
06-06-2005, 01:20 AM
I have no problem with Hermanson pitching two innings. He's a former starter/long reliever. He can handle multiple innings. Hermanson just didn't make the pitches today.

Second, I can't believe some people are criticizing Crede for that play. It was a bad throw by Hermanson. That's all there is to it. The ball was close enough that Crede had a chance to catch it while keeping his foot on the bag. It was just a tad too far away for him to make the catch. But in that situation Crede has to keep his foot on the base and attempt to get that force.

It seems like people are also forgetting that Crede charged in to field the ball but then had to run back to cover the bag when Hermanson got to it first. I'm sure it was all Joe could do to just get back to the bag and be in a position to catch it, so there was no margain for error with the throw. If anyone was at fault on that play it was Hermanson for not throwing accurately or just taking the out at first.


Did anyone listen to the radio broadcast of the game? Ed Farmer was on the freakin' WARPATH. In the second inning, Rooney said "Well the ESPN guys sure don't like the Sox" and Ed Farmer just went off on Steve Phillips. He said something to the effect of: I don't understand why he's saying all these things. He should come to a game and watch the Sox instead of sitting on his chair and demeaning them. All he's doing right now is proving to everyone what a terrible evaluator of talent he is. We all know he didn't do such a good job evaluating talent with the Mets, and so far he's not doing such a good job evaluating it as a broadcaster. It made me laugh so hard I almost drove off the road. Farmio was on both Phillips and Brantley's case all afternoon.

JB98
06-06-2005, 01:22 AM
Long day at the Cell for me. At least the rain stayed away. It could have been an even longer day.

Another lousy postgame thread here, guys. Arguing over whether it's acceptable to use the term "we" when referring to the Sox? Jesus. I'm going to go ahead and use "we," if that's OK...

This was a tough loss, but it was not a bad loss. I never say we should have won a game when we never had the lead. Did we leave a few opportunities out there? Sure, but so did Cleveland. When the score was 3-1, they had bases loaded in the seventh with one out. They should have ripped the game wide open there, but Cotts got us off the hook and gave us a chance. Frankly, this was Cleveland's game all the way. We almost stole it from them.

I think Hermanson ran out of gas. This was the fourth straight game he has appeared in, and it was very uncharacteristic of him to walk two straight men to lead off the 12th. I guess Ozzie trusts a tired Hermy more than a well-rested Viz or a well-rested Shingo. If that's the case, KW needs to look for a bullpen upgrade in a trade. We shouldn't have to kill our closer like that trying to win a game in June. And no, Hermanson did not get "hammered," unless you call two walks and an error getting hammered. Cleveland go no hits in the winning rally.

This is the seventh time this season the Sox have won the first two games of a series, only to drop the final game. Three times it's happened against Cleveland (also against Minnesota, Seattle, Cubs, Anaheim). I'm glad we're consistently winning series, but it would be damn nice to finish off a sweep against someone other than Kansas City.

ShoelessJoeS
06-06-2005, 01:28 AM
I guess Ozzie trusts a tired Hermy more than a well-rested Viz or a well-rested Shingo.
dont we all? (i wish that was teal) :(:

SpammySosa
06-06-2005, 01:40 AM
I've been a Sox fan my whole life. I'm sick of being happy "being in" a game.

Sorry, this year I expect everything. I'm rather happy that I can say that somewhat realistically.

If you're happy merely being in a game, fine... you'll enjoy things more than I. I'm just not this season.

There will be games where we lose 11-3, and its just useless, and that's fine. But THIS game... THIS game was winnable.

I find it baffling that you have an easier time accepting an ass-kicking loss than being proud of the team for playing tough(aka showing character) and making it a close game. NO loss is easy to swallow and I don't think any true fan is "happy merely being in a game." But certainly it is more disconcerting and reason for (slight) concern if the Sox had their cans kicked top to bottom.There were far more positives to take from this game and reason for optimism that these guys aren't going to quit. If you are happy with the blowout losses,fine...you'll enjoy things more than I.Your motto for this year's Sox:"Win...or else roll over and get your butts kicked because it is a more acceptable way to lose.":rolleyes:

JB98
06-06-2005, 01:47 AM
dont we all? (i wish that was teal) :(:

In the stands, we were talking about whether Viz should come in for the 12th. If it was Game 7 of the World Series, you definitely stick with Hermanson. Or, even if it was a regular-season game against the Twins, you stick with Hermanson. However, this was a game in June against a non-contender. The Indians had seen Hermy three straight days. He threw a handful of extra pitches yesterday because Pods lost a ball in the sun. I was worried about him when he came out for the 12th, and unfortunately, my concern was warranted.

If Viz or Shingo had started the 12th, they couldn't have done any worse. I doubt Hermanson will be available at all tomorrow, and we may have to go to Viz and Shingo, even if we have a lead. Prepare for a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth in tomorrow night's game thread. People have to understand we can't ride Hermanson and Marte every day. The other guys have to pitch at some point. I would have been tempted to let Vizcaino start the 12th today. I don't think it was a bad move by Ozzie or anything. It's never a bad move to stick with your best reliever. I'm just saying, I would have been tempted to give someone else the ball in that spot. It's a long season, and you have to use all 25 men, even if it loses you a game from time to time.

ShoelessJoeS
06-06-2005, 02:02 AM
If Viz or Shingo had started the 12th, they couldn't have done any worse.
i guess we'll never know. i understand that hermanson cant pitch everyday and im glad he doesnt. it was a matter of trust and ozzie always goes with his gut feeling

1951Campbell
06-06-2005, 07:51 AM
Did anyone listen to the radio broadcast of the game? Ed Farmer was on the freakin' WARPATH. In the second inning, Rooney said "Well the ESPN guys sure don't like the Sox" and Ed Farmer just went off on Steve Phillips. He said something to the effect of: I don't understand why he's saying all these things. He should come to a game and watch the Sox instead of sitting on his chair and demeaning them. All he's doing right now is proving to everyone what a terrible evaluator of talent he is. We all know he didn't do such a good job evaluating talent with the Mets, and so far he's not doing such a good job evaluating it as a broadcaster. It made me laugh so hard I almost drove off the road. Farmio was on both Phillips and Brantley's case all afternoon.

Although I listen on XM and therefore get R&F for only half the games, it seems like they've both been on the warpath for the last couple of weeks or so, but especially Farmio. I mean, they were ripping Showalter games after the Sox left Texas. They're really cultivating an "us against the world" attitude.

LVSoxFan
06-06-2005, 10:43 AM
In the stands, we were talking about whether Viz should come in for the 12th. If it was Game 7 of the World Series, you definitely stick with Hermanson. Or, even if it was a regular-season game against the Twins, you stick with Hermanson. However, this was a game in June against a non-contender. The Indians had seen Hermy three straight days. He threw a handful of extra pitches yesterday because Pods lost a ball in the sun. I was worried about him when he came out for the 12th, and unfortunately, my concern was warranted.

If Viz or Shingo had started the 12th, they couldn't have done any worse. I doubt Hermanson will be available at all tomorrow, and we may have to go to Viz and Shingo, even if we have a lead. Prepare for a lot of wailing and gnashing of teeth in tomorrow night's game thread. People have to understand we can't ride Hermanson and Marte every day. The other guys have to pitch at some point. I would have been tempted to let Vizcaino start the 12th today. I don't think it was a bad move by Ozzie or anything. It's never a bad move to stick with your best reliever. I'm just saying, I would have been tempted to give someone else the ball in that spot. It's a long season, and you have to use all 25 men, even if it loses you a game from time to time.

I was there and what a roller coaster. First Sabathia shuts us down, frown.

Then Iguchi blasts the homer: yay! Then Marte gives up the homer, frown. Then Frank crushes his first to tie it! Yay. Then it all fell apart. I'm not going to panic (well I wouldn't anyway), so it goes sometimes. Plus we took the series. Some comments on the comments here:

-Uribe just looks awful at the plate, agreed. That guy seems to be just wildly swinging away at everything. Between him and Crede, we've got two guys who are great defensively but are offensive sandbags. Tough call--what do you do?

-Marte: isn't that like the third blown save or setup by him in a week?

-Also: why does everybody here go nuts when people criticize the Sox after a loss? "Whiners," "cryers," sky-is-falling people? Quit being so thin-skinned: that's what forums are for. If I disagree, I just move on to the next post. I'd rather hear the critics AND the praisers--not just one side.

-Last IMO there's nothing wrong about saying "we".

balke
06-06-2005, 11:04 AM
I was there and what a roller coaster. First Sabathia shuts us down, frown.

Then Iguchi blasts the homer: yay! Then Marte gives up the homer, frown. Then Frank crushes his first to tie it! Yay. Then it all fell apart. I'm not going to panic (well I wouldn't anyway), so it goes sometimes. Plus we took the series. Some comments on the comments here:

-Uribe just looks awful at the plate, agreed. That guy seems to be just wildly swinging away at everything. Between him and Crede, we've got two guys who are great defensively but are offensive sandbags. Tough call--what do you do?

-Marte: isn't that like the third blown save or setup by him in a week?

-Also: why does everybody here go nuts when people criticize the Sox after a loss? "Whiners," "cryers," sky-is-falling people? Quit being so thin-skinned: that's what forums are for. If I disagree, I just move on to the next post. I'd rather hear the critics AND the praisers--not just one side.

-Last IMO there's nothing wrong about saying "we".


People that have watched Uribe play last season know Uribe swings at everything, and he's either the teams hottest hitter, or the teams worst. The past few games he hasn't been the worst, he was just a rally killer that inning.

Marte pitched well, Cleveland had pitchers that gave up runs as well. Hermanson worked 2 innings with no inherited runners, and gave up 2, Marte gave up a solo shot in an inning of work who did worse? Relievers can't always be lights out. Marte will be fine.

Noone cares about criticism, they care about pointless criticism, and undeserved criticism. They hate people that can't wait to whine about a loss, after getting two wins. Especially losses they were dominated in for 7 innings. They fought back, they got outlasted. Let's not write the season and call for firings yet young steinbrenners.

"we" is annoying sometimes, but it happens to the best of us. The most annoying thing in the world is for a non-baseball fan to hear someone say "we". It's just weird. I think on the board its find though.

mccoydp
06-06-2005, 11:12 AM
They battled back more than once and were in it all the way against one of the dominant starters in the AL. They lost because of a series of flukey plays. Two runs on NO HITS. Those are not the kind of games that lead to a letdown.

Wise words. I thought the Sox played a heck of a game; their luck just ran out. Props to them for keeping it going through the 12th. Sabathia may look like a clown, but he's a good pitcher. Don't let his crooked hat fool you!
Time to pound the Rockies today. Look to Garcia to get the job done.

LVSoxFan
06-06-2005, 11:17 AM
Sabathia's an awesome pitcher... easily the best on Cleveland. I was watching him warm up in the pen; he's a biiiig guy, too.

mdep524
06-06-2005, 11:39 AM
-Uribe just looks awful at the plate, agreed. That guy seems to be just wildly swinging away at everything. Between him and Crede, we've got two guys who are great defensively but are offensive sandbags. Tough call--what do you do?

-Marte: isn't that like the third blown save or setup by him in a week?

-Also: why does everybody here go nuts when people criticize the Sox after a loss? "Whiners," "cryers," sky-is-falling people? Quit being so thin-skinned: that's what forums are for. If I disagree, I just move on to the next post. I'd rather hear the critics AND the praisers--not just one side.

-Last IMO there's nothing wrong about saying "we". I agree with you LVSoxFan. This was a frustrating game, but not a panic mode game. Two points about yesterday and in general:

-The Sox ability to win in extra innings would be greatly improved if they took more walks. More often than not, a lead off walk scores, especially in extra innings against tired or mop up relievers. Outside of Big Frank, Konerko and Pods, this team doesn't generate a lot of baserunners that way.

-Also, all these one and two run games are exciting, well-played and good tests for the Sox, and their success in them is awesome. But... at the same time it is really taxing on the bullpen. This is a loose team, so I'm not worried about them getting too stressed/mentally exhausted (except maybe Konerko), but the bullpen could use a 5 run lead once in a while, especially now that we're going to the NL parks.

Frater Perdurabo
06-06-2005, 12:04 PM
:tomatoaward: :tomatoaward:

JB98
06-06-2005, 12:13 PM
I agree with you LVSoxFan. This was a frustrating game, but not a panic mode game. Two points about yesterday and in general:

-The Sox ability to win in extra innings would be greatly improved if they took more walks. More often than not, a lead off walk scores, especially in extra innings against tired or mop up relievers. Outside of Big Frank, Konerko and Pods, this team doesn't generate a lot of baserunners that way.

-Also, all these one and two run games are exciting, well-played and good tests for the Sox, and their success in them is awesome. But... at the same time it is really taxing on the bullpen. This is a loose team, so I'm not worried about them getting too stressed/mentally exhausted (except maybe Konerko), but the bullpen could use a 5 run lead once in a while, especially now that we're going to the NL parks.

Your last point here is a real good one. We've praised the Sox because in their 19 losses, there have only been a couple where they didn't have a chance in the last inning. However, it's also true than in our 37 victories, there have been very few where our opponent did not have a chance in the last inning. We have 23 saves as a team among three relievers.

Wouldn't it be nice to see our offense open a can on somebody for a change? Tonight would be a good night because Hermy and Marte have to be a little tired at this point. If we have a lead late and its close, we may need Politte to close tonight.

BRDSR
06-06-2005, 03:25 PM
I think the Sox should start losing the first game of a series and then winning the last two. That way at the end of the series, everyone will be saying, "Wow, the Sox are awesome, they pulled out the series win even after getting in a hole early," as opposed to "The Sox blow, I can't believe they weren't able to sweep the Cleveland Indians. At this rate I'll be rooting for the Devil Rays by the end of the season."

Lets all get a little perspective: Two out of three is good. Three out of three is better. To discuss why the White Sox lost this game and how they could have won is rational. To hang the entire season on this game and write the Sox off because of this game is irrational. The Sox are going to lose 60 games this season, don't kid yourself. This is just one. Now, lets head to Colorado and let the Rockies take Game 1 tonight!

LVSoxFan
06-06-2005, 04:35 PM
Hey I'm all for the 2/3 argument. That game was so goofy (and long) yesterday it could have gone either way.

There is a bright side: we did come back, something we've been doing now for about a week. For a good month it seems, if we lost the lead we were done. Now we had Iguchi come through with a clutch bomb and Frank do the same. That's progress.

FarWestChicago
06-06-2005, 04:40 PM
Noone cares about criticism, they care about pointless criticism, and undeserved criticism. They hate people that can't wait to whine about a loss, after getting two wins. Especially losses they were dominated in for 7 innings. They fought back, they got outlasted. Let's not write the season and call for firings yet young steinbrenners.

"we" is annoying sometimes, but it happens to the best of us. The most annoying thing in the world is for a non-baseball fan to hear someone say "we". It's just weird. I think on the board its find though.Exactly. The ragers see the world in absolutes, there are no shades of gray. Nobody said anything about not allowing criticism or the Sox being perfect. "We tried to lose this game." "We didn't want to win today." Those are completely asinine statements that deserve to be ripped and also illustrate when the use of "we" isn't appropriate. Speak for yourself with that quitting crap. "We came up short today." "Our bullpen needs some help with Vizcaino and Shingo not contributing." "We really blew it in the 12th." "Damn, that sucked and I'm pissed off!" These are rational and fine. So, all of you who think those of us who don't want to White Flag the season on June 6th with a 3.5 game lead are demented and think the team is perfect, you are dead wrong. There is a middle ground between "The Sox suck and fire everybody!!!" and "There is no way the Sox could do or be any better."

shoota
06-06-2005, 04:42 PM
Tadahito's 2-run home run was huge.
Frank Thomas's solo home run was huge.
Nice job by Buehrle to pick up Hito after he thought there were 2 outs instead of 1 and didn't attempt the double play.

Bad job by Marte giving up the home run to Hafner.
Someone tell Crede that he's allowed to take his foot off the bag and try to catch a wild throw by Hermanson. Crede's lack of effort looked like he was didn't want fans to think he messed up, so he stayed on the bag to show people that it was Hermanson who messed up. I make that catch. The defensive specialist didn't save us any runs with that non-play.

Ol' No. 2
06-06-2005, 04:48 PM
Let's not write the season and call for firings yet young steinbrenners.I think you captured it perfectly.