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WWE Champion
05-25-2005, 02:48 PM
Hi all,

I am thinking about doing a report on the impact of Latino/Hispanic players in Major League Baseball, specifically looking at the White Sox. In the past year, the Sox have lost Maggs (Venezuelan), Caballo (Panama), Valentin (Puerto Rican), Olivo (Dominican) and Loaiza (Mexican). Definitely Maggs, Caballo and to a lesser extent Jose were stars on the South Side, and I was wondering from everyone, but especially for those of Hispanic origin, if those guys leaving had any impact on you or those you know. Did your interest in the White Sox wane at all because those guys were gone? Try to put yourself back before the season started because everyone is interested now that they have the best record in baseball.

Banix12
05-25-2005, 03:08 PM
Hi all,

I am thinking about doing a report on the impact of Latino/Hispanic players in Major League Baseball, specifically looking at the White Sox. In the past year, the Sox have lost Maggs (Venezuelan), Caballo (Panama), Valentin (Puerto Rican), Olivo (Dominican) and Loaiza (Mexican). Definitely Maggs, Caballo and to a lesser extent Jose were stars on the South Side, and I was wondering from everyone, but especially for those of Hispanic origin, if those guys leaving had any impact on you or those you know. Did your interest in the White Sox wane at all because those guys were gone? Try to put yourself back before the season started because everyone is interested now that they have the best record in baseball.

Just so you know, I'm not hispanic, but here's my take.

I'm loyal more to the uniform than the players. Before the season I was excited because I was very familiar with the players they acquired, but I was nervous because I knew the kind of production the players the sox parted with could provide. Ultimately though, those guys didn't win and the sox were annual dissapointments, so I wasn't really ranting and raving because they were gone.

mjharrison72
05-25-2005, 03:31 PM
I am also not of the ethnicity you seek, but even as these players have departed, others like El Duque, Contreras, Garcia, Vizcaino and Pablo Ozuna have arrived. I do see your point that a lot of the great hispanic players are now gone, but I think there's still clearly a great Latin presence on the team, from Ozzie to our three starters, to Uribe.

Personally, it doesn't make much difference to me where a player is from, so long as they make an impact at their position. I cheer just as hard for a guy named Jose or Juan as I do for a guy named Frank or Tadahito... all that matters is whether they're helping the Sox win!

Good luck with your project... it will be interesting to hear what people of other cultures have to say, because you rightly point out that several big-name latin players have now departed.

NorthlakeTom
05-25-2005, 03:33 PM
Being non-Latino, I'm not in a position to answer your questions, but personally, I don't look at race/nationality as having any significance at all in who I support.

Sxy Mofo
05-25-2005, 03:38 PM
As all have said, it doesn't matter to me. Though you may want to look at the impact (if any) of a latin manager on a baseball team.

maurice
05-25-2005, 04:00 PM
Off the top of my head, I can think of two Latino Sox fans who were put off by the loss of Lee and Maggs . . . mostly because they thought that KW was lying about Maggs and that JR wouldn't let KW spend the money. For obvious reasons, subsequent events have softened their anti-Sox stance. I don't know anybody who was upset by the "loss" of the 3 Puerto Ricans (Valentin, Alomar & Alomar), since they were all way past their prime. Similarly, Loaiza was a one-year wonder, who was traded for another Latino pitcher.

As a general matter, the Sox have a long history of Latino players from all over the place. Currently, the Sox have a Latino manager and a large number of Latino players.

NorthlakeTom
05-25-2005, 04:08 PM
This isn't a rip on WWE Champion as his report sounds worthwhile, but the idea that anyone would shift their loyalties based on race is repugnant to me.

Anyone who would base their support on the racial makeup of a team is no better than the filthy pigs who threatened Hank Aaron before he passed Ruth. IMO, of course.

maurice
05-25-2005, 04:13 PM
In my example, I don't think it had anything to do with "the racial makeup of the team," which remains decidedly Latin in flavor compared to other teams. Rather, the fellows I mentioned had a personal affinity for Lee and Ordonez, and were pissed to see them go. (Similarly, there will be very many PO'ed white Sox fans if KW dumps Konerko next offseason.) I'm sure that plenty of non-Latino Sox fans were equally upset to see Ordonez and Lee go.

NorthlakeTom
05-25-2005, 04:25 PM
In my example, I don't think it had anything to do with "the racial makeup of the team," which remains decidedly Latin in flavor compared to other teams. Rather, the fellows I mentioned had a personal affinity for Lee and Ordonez, and were pissed to see them go. (Similarly, there will be very many PO'ed white Sox fans if KW dumps Konerko next offseason.) I'm sure that plenty of non-Latino Sox fans were equally upset to see Ordonez and Lee go.
I wasn't responding to you, maurice. I was speaking generally. Your post was clear that the motivations were not racial, and the fact the two people you mentioned are Latino is only coincidental.

Uncle_Patrick
05-25-2005, 04:29 PM
This isn't a rip on WWE Champion as his report sounds worthwhile, but the idea that anyone would shift their loyalties based on race is repugnant to me.

Anyone who would base their support on the racial makeup of a team is no better than the filthy pigs who threatened Hank Aaron before he passed Ruth. IMO, of course.

I don't think its necessarily that people change their support of a team based on racial make up (unless, of course, you believe the b.s. coming from a San Francisco sports writer regarding Chicago fans and a certain Northside manager), but I think with certain minority groups, it brings more excitement to see players of the same ethnic origins as them. If you think about it, baseball is extremely popular in Latin America and Japan. For people coming from those countries and moving to America, to see a player of the same ethnic background playing (and succeeding) in Major Baseball Baseball, which is considered the highest plateau for any baseball player, is probably much more exciting than seeing a guy like Paul Konerko or Frank Thomas doing well (not that they don't want these players to do well, too).

doublem23
05-25-2005, 05:20 PM
I am 1/2 Hispanic, and I haven't been bothered one bit by it. In sports, I am loyal to the uniform, and since I don't believe anyone in the Sox front office to be overtly "anti-Latino," I understand why guys like Lee and Maggs had to go. We got some good players for Lee and more good ones with the money his contract freed up, and Maggs is a whiny piece of ****.

SOXfnNlansing
05-25-2005, 05:34 PM
Being non-Latino, I'm not in a position to answer your questions, but personally, I don't look at race/nationality as having any significance at all in who I support. amen to that, just win baby

Infallible
05-25-2005, 06:20 PM
Well I'm asian and I have to say I like them all with exception to the damn Lichtensteinians....they're taking over this sport.

Sxy Mofo
05-25-2005, 06:21 PM
I don't think its necessarily that people change their support of a team based on racial make up (unless, of course, you believe the b.s. coming from a San Francisco sports writer regarding Chicago fans and a certain Northside manager), but I think with certain minority groups, it brings more excitement to see players of the same ethnic origins as them. If you think about it, baseball is extremely popular in Latin America and Japan. For people coming from those countries and moving to America, to see a player of the same ethnic background playing (and succeeding) in Major Baseball Baseball, which is considered the highest plateau for any baseball player, is probably much more exciting than seeing a guy like Paul Konerko or Frank Thomas doing well (not that they don't want these players to do well, too).


people in this country follow teams. People in other countries generally follow players.

Lip Man 1
05-25-2005, 07:34 PM
I'm Polish so perhaps my take isn't even worth discussing but as far as I'm concerned I could give a royal damn what nationaility a player is or even if the entire team is composed of a single nationality.

The only thing that matters is winning....if those on the roster were all green Martians I could care less, as long as they won 100 games a season.

Also here's a historical fact worth noting. 'Minnie' Minoso a Cuban, was the first 'black' ballplayer to wear a Sox uniform. He began his Sox career in 1951 and was one of the first Latin players ever in MLB. He is revered today by the White Sox fan base and organization.

The line of Latin stars who wore a Sox uniform is long and glorious...Chico Carrasquel, Louie Aparicio, 'Jungle' Jim Rivera, Ozzie Guillen, Tito Francona, Juan Pizarro, Johnny Romano, Sandy Alomar Sr, Luis Alvarado, Jorge' Orta, Eddie Leon', Tony Bernazard, Julio Cruz, Luis Salazar, Ivan Calderon, Sammy Sosa, Melido Perez, Julio Franco and Dave Martinez just to name a few

Lip

ode to veeck
05-25-2005, 07:38 PM
Sammy Sosa

:tealpolice:

Banix12
05-25-2005, 08:41 PM
This has nothing to do with Latinos and the White Sox, but I will say that I can understand how having players on a team of your nationality will create a greater interest in that team. I'm 1/2 Lithuanian and I admit that I do get a bit more interested watching Olympic basketball and I do root for the many Lithuanian centers in the NBA.

TornLabrum
05-25-2005, 08:55 PM
I'm Polish so perhaps my take isn't even worth discussing but as far as I'm concerned I could give a royal damn what nationaility a player is or even if the entire team is composed of a single nationality.

The only thing that matters is winning....if those on the roster were all green Martians I could care less, as long as they won 100 games a season.

Also here's a historical fact worth noting. 'Minnie' Minoso a Cuban, was the first 'black' ballplayer to wear a Sox uniform. He began his Sox career in 1951 and was one of the first Latin players ever in MLB. He is revered today by the White Sox fan base and organization.

The line of Latin stars who wore a Sox uniform is long and glorious...Chico Carrasquel, Louie Aparicio, 'Jungle' Jim Rivera, Ozzie Guillen, Tito Francona, Juan Pizarro, Johnny Romano, Sandy Alomar Sr, Luis Alvarado, Jorge' Orta, Eddie Leon', Tony Bernazard, Julio Cruz, Luis Salazar, Ivan Calderon, Sammy Sosa, Melido Perez, Julio Franco and Dave Martinez just to name a few

Lip

One of the first Latino players I can think of was Dolf Luque (but there may have been several before him) was Dolf Luque (The Pride of Havana), who started his big league career with a cup of coffee on the Miracle Braves of 1914. His career began in earnest with the 1918 Reds. He even pitched 5 innings in the 1919 World Series.

davenicholson
05-26-2005, 09:29 AM
I'm Polish so perhaps my take isn't even worth discussing but as far as I'm concerned I could give a royal damn what nationaility a player is or even if the entire team is composed of a single nationality.


Dobry, Lip! I must say that I just returned to Sox fandom since they signed A. J. Pierzinski. I haven't been a Sox fan at all since the departure of Richie Zisk, and Big Klu before him!

Nellie_Fox
05-27-2005, 02:09 AM
I am loyal to the uniform.As Jerry Seinfeld said, "Really, we're cheering for laundry."

I never in my life gave nationality or race a second thought as far as the Sox are concerned. If you wore a Sox uniform, you were my guy.

Sleep520
05-27-2005, 03:03 PM
Interesting topic. I'm hispanic, and it's all about the team for me, but it's always a nice added bonus to see players from hispanic countries. Overall, it's the team, first and foremost.

By the way, a buddy and I had a discussion similar to this, and one of the things we wondered about was whether Paulie is popular because of ethnic background or not...I mean, we went to school 2 minutes from Comiskey, so it's not like we've never noticed that race can be an issue in the area...

Hope that doesn't sound too negative...

flo-B-flo
05-28-2005, 02:46 PM
The only thing that matters is winning....if those on the roster were all green Martians I could care less, as long as they won 100 games a season. Lip As long as they can hit bring em on.:smile: