PDA

View Full Version : Sox Idaho State Journal Column


Lip Man 1
05-14-2005, 12:59 PM
Well gang....looks like I've hit the 'big' time. LOL. The Sox have made the Idaho State Journal! Seriously Brady Slater, sports editor, baseball nut and friend (despite the fact that he's a Twins fan from Minnesota...) interviewed me Friday night about the team. This is his Saturday column for your amusement. (Sorry there wasn't any links to it...) Used with permission from the Idaho State Journal.

Idaho State Journal

Saturday, May 14, 2005

ONE MAN AND HIS SOX

Brady Slater / Sports Editor

There are fans and then there are the Mark Liptaks of the world.

I’d write that Liptak bleeds black, but the Chicago White Sox broke his heart so many times I’m not sure it beats.

Best guess is that he’s living on borrowed time.

It’s plausible that Liptak, also a science fiction junkie, is kept alive by some clever Darth Vader cyborging. In which case he is bleeding black – motor oil.

Nevertheless...

"They may well fall apart and finish in fourth place," says the Chubbuck resident of his beloved White Sox. "But, you know what? I’m enjoying the moment."

After Friday’s come from behind win, the White Sox improved to 27-9, a record that includes one impressive, if not funky, statistic – they’ve led in all 36 games this season.

"My interpretation of that is the White Sox come to play hard every day," Liptak says. "They’re ready to go from the first pitch of the game. It doesn’t mean they’re going to win, but they’re in the game. There haven’t been any 19-0 blowouts like in Anaheim in 2002."

He came up with that 19-0 loss off the top of his head. No research. No hitch in the delivery. Simply a humiliation that resonates with Liptak like everything else White Sox.

"I’ve been a Sox fan for 45 years," he says. "I’m something of an amateur historian."

A regular contributor to White Sox Interactive (www.whitesoxinteractive.com (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/)), the sport’s world’s die hardest fan Web site, Liptak keeps in regular contact with former players, Chicago columnists and beat writers. Ken Rosenthal, a new generation’s Peter Gammons, trusts Liptak’s takes so much that he’s not afraid to regurgitate them in his own material.

Liptak says the feeling among White Sox fans is it’s 50/50 as to whether or not this year’s ballclub is for real. Odds makers just set the Sox at 12 to 1 - from a season opening 50-1 - to win the World Series, something the South Siders haven’t done since 1917 - a drought longer than Boston’s before last season’s title.

Liptak is known to lament how the national media, particularly ESPN folks like Rob Neyer and Jeff Brantley, have yet to give the Sox their due. Still, he understands the serial snubs of the hottest team since the 1984 Detroit Tigers.

"Nobody talks about the poor White Sox," he says, "because White Sox fans, unlike Cub fans and Red Sox fans, don’t think losing is ‘lovable.’ We don’t rhapsodize mellifluously about curses. All White Sox fans care about are wins and losses, not a Billy Goat, the ghost of Babe Ruth or Steve Bartman. Our teams were bad. The field managers were lousy, the general managers worse and the owners worst of all."

Liptak is hardly private in his thoughts. He doesn’t believe in jinxes, though he will mention fate from time to time. He likes the Sox chances from here on out because of a deep, veteran pitching staff – the one common thread among history’s best Sox teams.

He mention’s the ‘Hitless Wonders,’ of 1906 – which beat the Cubs in the World Series – despite hitting .198 over the course of six games – and a handful of other pitching rich White Sox teams from the late 1950's, 1964, 1967, 1983 and 1993-94.

"Pitching wins pennants," he says, "you know that."

Nobody though, knows it better then Mark Liptak.

For that, "May the Force be with you, Mark."


Lip
mliptak1@ida.net (mliptak1@ida.net)

Ol' No. 2
05-14-2005, 01:04 PM
...the Chicago White Sox broke his heart so many times I’m not sure it beats.Sounds like this guy knows you pretty well.:wink:

Unregistered
05-14-2005, 01:09 PM
He doesn’t believe in jinxes, though he will mention fate from time to time. Except, of course, for the dreaded "Starting a Twins Game Thread while their game is still going on" jinx... :cool:

hose
05-14-2005, 01:18 PM
Lip you are making the big time.:rolleyes:... just teasing , nice article.

I noticed the part about Las Vegas changing the odds down from 50-1 to 12-1., proving the odds are based on the team's performace.

This isn't some mutual odds track betting like some people think.

patbooyah
05-14-2005, 01:19 PM
We don’t rhapsodize mellifluously about curses.


speak for yourself. i'm always rhapsodizing mellifluously.

Ol' No. 2
05-14-2005, 01:23 PM
Lip you are making the big time.:rolleyes:... just teasing , nice article.

I noticed the part about Las Vegas changing the odds down from 50-1 to 12-1., proving the odds are based on the team's performace.

This isn't some mutual odds track betting like some people think.Odds have nothing at all to do with a team's performance. They have everything to do with the bettor's expectations of their performance, or more specifically, the amount of money being bet on either side. Books set odds to try to attract equal betting on both sides to minimize their risk. It's not a pari-mutual system.

munchman33
05-14-2005, 01:28 PM
Lip you are making the big time.:rolleyes:... just teasing , nice article.

I noticed the part about Las Vegas changing the odds down from 50-1 to 12-1., proving the odds are based on the team's performace.

This isn't some mutual odds track betting like some people think.

It was 50-1 to enter the season? Glad I got my bet locked in in January. 60-1!

FarWestChicago
05-14-2005, 01:40 PM
"They may well fall apart and finish in fourth place," says the Chubbuck resident of his beloved White Sox. "But, you know what? I’m enjoying the moment."OK all you cheap FOLIP imitators. This is your mentor, the master, and he is enjoying this run while it lasts. Pay attention to your shaman. Shut the hell up and keep your chronic depressive crap to yourselves. You can break it out when you get the chance, hopefully some other season. :cool:

Well done, Lip. :thumbsup:

NorthlakeTom
05-14-2005, 01:49 PM
Odds have nothing at all to do with a team's performance. They have everything to do with the bettor's expectations of their performance, or more specifically, the amount of money being bet on either side. Books set odds to try to attract equal betting on both sides to minimize their risk. It's not a pari-mutual system.

Yes, this is exactly correct.

The sports books here in Reno typically receive an inordinate amount of bets on San Francisco teams (due to the number of tourists from the Bay Area), especially the 49ers during their heyday.

It wasn't unusual to see Reno odds on the 49ers at even money while Vegas odds would be 3-2.

SpammySosa
05-14-2005, 01:50 PM
Shut the hell up and keep your chronic depressive crap to yourselves. You can break it out when you get the chance, hopefully some other season. :cool:


As a mod I thought you would know WSI has a PM feature so you could message Homefish directly.:wink:

Daver
05-14-2005, 01:53 PM
As a mod I thought you would know WSI has a PM feature so you could message Homefish directly.:wink:

A little more than a mod.

Board God.


:bandance:

FarWestChicago
05-14-2005, 02:10 PM
As a mod I thought you would know WSI has a PM feature so you could message Homefish directly.:wink: Lip deserved some public props. :redneck

And I wish Homefish was the only psycho around here. :nod:

fquaye149
05-14-2005, 02:41 PM
OK all you cheap FOLIP imitators. This is your mentor, the master, and he is enjoying this run while it lasts. Pay attention to your shaman. Shut the hell up and keep your chronic depressive crap to yourselves. You can break it out when you get the chance, hopefully some other season. :cool:

Well done, Lip. :thumbsup:

you have gone from hero to superhero, west.

i love the dressings down (even when it's to me :redface: )

hose
05-14-2005, 06:06 PM
Odds have nothing at all to do with a team's performance. They have everything to do with the bettor's expectations of their performance, or more specifically, the amount of money being bet on either side. Books set odds to try to attract equal betting on both sides to minimize their risk. It's not a pari-mutual system.


So then if enough money comes in on Kansas City then the odds will be as low as 12-1 like the Sox?.....gmab

Ol' No. 2
05-14-2005, 06:11 PM
So then if enough money comes in on Kansas City then the odds will be as low as 12-1 like the Sox?.....gmabActually, yes. These guys are not gamblers. Only the people who give them money are.

rwcescato
05-14-2005, 06:15 PM
Well gang....looks like I've hit the 'big' time. LOL. The Sox have made the Idaho State Journal! Seriously Brady Slater, sports editor, baseball nut and friend (despite the fact that he's a Twins fan from Minnesota...) interviewed me Friday night about the team. This is his Saturday column for your amusement. (Sorry there wasn't any links to it...) Used with permission from the Idaho State Journal.

Idaho State Journal

Saturday, May 14, 2005

ONE MAN AND HIS SOX

Brady Slater / Sports Editor

There are fans and then there are the Mark Liptaks of the world.

I’d write that Liptak bleeds black, but the Chicago White Sox broke his heart so many times I’m not sure it beats.

Best guess is that he’s living on borrowed time.

It’s plausible that Liptak, also a science fiction junkie, is kept alive by some clever Darth Vader cyborging. In which case he is bleeding black – motor oil.

Nevertheless...

"They may well fall apart and finish in fourth place," says the Chubbuck resident of his beloved White Sox. "But, you know what? I’m enjoying the moment."

After Friday’s come from behind win, the White Sox improved to 27-9, a record that includes one impressive, if not funky, statistic – they’ve led in all 36 games this season.

"My interpretation of that is the White Sox come to play hard every day," Liptak says. "They’re ready to go from the first pitch of the game. It doesn’t mean they’re going to win, but they’re in the game. There haven’t been any 19-0 blowouts like in Anaheim in 2002."

He came up with that 19-0 loss off the top of his head. No research. No hitch in the delivery. Simply a humiliation that resonates with Liptak like everything else White Sox.

"I’ve been a Sox fan for 45 years," he says. "I’m something of an amateur historian."

A regular contributor to White Sox Interactive (www.whitesoxinteractive.com (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/)), the sport’s world’s die hardest fan Web site, Liptak keeps in regular contact with former players, Chicago columnists and beat writers. Ken Rosenthal, a new generation’s Peter Gammons, trusts Liptak’s takes so much that he’s not afraid to regurgitate them in his own material.

Liptak says the feeling among White Sox fans is it’s 50/50 as to whether or not this year’s ballclub is for real. Odds makers just set the Sox at 12 to 1 - from a season opening 50-1 - to win the World Series, something the South Siders haven’t done since 1917 - a drought longer than Boston’s before last season’s title.

Liptak is known to lament how the national media, particularly ESPN folks like Rob Neyer and Jeff Brantley, have yet to give the Sox their due. Still, he understands the serial snubs of the hottest team since the 1984 Detroit Tigers.

"Nobody talks about the poor White Sox," he says, "because White Sox fans, unlike Cub fans and Red Sox fans, don’t think losing is ‘lovable.’ We don’t rhapsodize mellifluously about curses. All White Sox fans care about are wins and losses, not a Billy Goat, the ghost of Babe Ruth or Steve Bartman. Our teams were bad. The field managers were lousy, the general managers worse and the owners worst of all."

Liptak is hardly private in his thoughts. He doesn’t believe in jinxes, though he will mention fate from time to time. He likes the Sox chances from here on out because of a deep, veteran pitching staff – the one common thread among history’s best Sox teams.

He mention’s the ‘Hitless Wonders,’ of 1906 – which beat the Cubs in the World Series – despite hitting .198 over the course of six games – and a handful of other pitching rich White Sox teams from the late 1950's, 1964, 1967, 1983 and 1993-94.

"Pitching wins pennants," he says, "you know that."

Nobody though, knows it better then Mark Liptak.

For that, "May the Force be with you, Mark."


Lip
mliptak1@ida.net (Lipmliptak1@ida.net)

Nice article lip. I am glad that we are being noticed by more and more people. Even our own city will have to take notice if this keeps up.

Rich

hose
05-14-2005, 06:23 PM
Actually, yes. These guys are not gamblers. Only the people who give them money are.

KC at 12-1......:kukoo:

it shoots holes in your argument

Ol' No. 2
05-14-2005, 06:31 PM
KC at 12-1......:kukoo:

it shoots holes in your argumentOh, well, darn. You put that little kukoo guy there so you must know what you're talking about.

Wsoxmike59
05-14-2005, 06:43 PM
Congrats Mark. I remember the very first time I met Mark online via the Internet. It was back in 1998 and he emailed me from a comment I made on a White Sox message board. (it was either on AOL or CBS Sportsline)

It was the height of the Jaime Navarro experiment (uugggh, I hate to bring that time frame up) and Navarro had just had his brains beaten in again by some no name weak sister team in the AL Central, and some guy posted on the board that at least the bullpen came in and did a nice job the rest of the way.

I rebutted that Navarro had routinely gotten knocked out in the 3rd inning (or thereabouts) so we'd have to use the bullpen so often, that in actuality Navarro cripples the teams chances to win the following games as well by taxing the bullpen so badly.

Lip liked my comments and emailed me as such, and I told Mrs. Wsoxmick that "Wow, I've heard of this Liptak guy, he writes in some sports publications from time to time and gets mentioned in the Sun Times and Sporting News. "

It felt good to get a little recognition from him, and now I offer some recognition in return. Good article Lip, and I always enjoy your Interviews on the front page of WSI. I find them informative and always well written.

Keep up the good work! Go Sox!!

Flight #24
05-14-2005, 11:20 PM
A regular contributor to White Sox Interactive (www.whitesoxinteractive.com (http://www.whitesoxinteractive.com/)), the sport’s world’s die hardest fan Web site,

Truer words were never spoken....or, um....written. Thanks again to all the mods & longtime contributors like Lip.

Lip Man 1
05-14-2005, 11:27 PM
Thank you for the kind words...
:redface:

Lip

hose
05-15-2005, 07:52 AM
Oh, well, darn. You put that little kukoo guy there so you must know what you're talking about.

Just going by what you are saying , do I have this scenario correct:

Lets say a billionaire from the Middle East places $50 million on KC to win the WS this weekend, now the odds will be down to even money?

Better yet 2 billionaires from the Middle East both place $50 million, so now $100 million comes in on KC to win the WS this weekend . Does Vegas have the Royals as favorites to win the WS?

That does sound kooky to me.

hose
05-15-2005, 08:54 AM
At Arlington Park the final odds are set strictly and only by how the money comes in on the horses. There are no other factors, the betting audience determines the odds after the track takes it's cut off the top. The odds are posted and the race is started, nothing outside of a foul will change after the horses take off.

I believe other factors come into play by the oddsmakers at Vegas besides the total amount of money. The audience is betting on a race in progress with MLB. If enough money came in on a mule to win the Kentucky Derby the mule would be the favorite at Churchhill Downs. No amount of money will make the present KC baseball team favorites by Vegas to win the WS this season.

bigfoot
05-15-2005, 09:11 AM
"...... In which case he is bleeding black
– motor oil."....

"May the Force be with you, Mark."

The "cure for the oil crisis" has been found! Way to go Lip! :wink:

Kudos, for a fine article and a lifetime of Soxfan angst.

This time, for sure!!:bandance:

Ol' No. 2
05-15-2005, 09:52 AM
At Arlington Park the final odds are set strictly and only by how the money comes in on the horses. There are no other factors, the betting audience determines the odds after the track takes it's cut off the top. The odds are posted and the race is started, nothing outside of a foul will change after the horses take off.

I believe other factors come into play by the oddsmakers at Vegas besides the total amount of money. The audience is betting on a race in progress with MLB. If enough money came in on a mule to win the Kentucky Derby the mule would be the favorite at Churchhill Downs. No amount of money will make the present KC baseball team favorites by Vegas to win the WS this season.Horse racing is pari-mutual, and not relevant. You are operating on the assumption that the house is gambling. They're not. They set the odds to attract an equal amount of betting on both sides. If a lot of money comes in on one side, they'll adjust the odds to try to attract more money on the other to balance it off. That way they cannot lose. (Remember, if they lower the odds from 50-1 to 12-1, they pay out less money, not more.) But they take the push, in which case the house wins both sides. That's how they make their money.

This has really gotten off topic. If you want more information, there are plenty of other places to get it.

hose
05-15-2005, 11:09 AM
Horse racing is pari-mutual, and not relevant. You are operating on the assumption that the house is gambling. They're not. They set the odds to attract an equal amount of betting on both sides. If a lot of money comes in on one side, they'll adjust the odds to try to attract more money on the other to balance it off. That way they cannot lose. (Remember, if they lower the odds from 50-1 to 12-1, they pay out less money, not more.) But they take the push, in which case the house wins both sides. That's how they make their money.

This has really gotten off topic. If you want more information, there are plenty of other places to get it.

Vegas just gets $100 million dollars from 2 Middle East billionaires on the Royals at 200-1 and now Vegas trys to attract more betting by lowering the odds on the Royals to 12-1.

What gambler is going to jump on these lowered odds?

Am I wrong in believing the odds are locked into the day you placed the bet?

hose
05-15-2005, 02:50 PM
Horse racing is pari-mutual, and not relevant. You are operating on the assumption that the house is gambling. They're not. They set the odds to attract an equal amount of betting on both sides. If a lot of money comes in on one side, they'll adjust the odds to try to attract more money on the other to balance it off. That way they cannot lose. (Remember, if they lower the odds from 50-1 to 12-1, they pay out less money, not more.) But they take the push, in which case the house wins both sides. That's how they make their money.

This has really gotten off topic. If you want more information, there are plenty of other places to get it.

Lets keep it in the forum where everybody can read your comments.

PaleHoseGeorge
05-15-2005, 03:02 PM
Lip is almost single-handedly moving the peanut forward on behalf of Sox Fandom in Idaho. He's in charge of the entire state.

Well done, you!

:wink:

voodoochile
05-15-2005, 03:06 PM
Vegas just gets $100 million dollars from 2 Middle East billionaires on the Royals at 200-1 and now Vegas trys to attract more betting by lowering the odds on the Royals to 12-1.

What gambler is going to jump on these lowered odds?

Am I wrong in believing the odds are locked into the day you placed the bet?

Man it must be nice to have so much money that you can flush $100M down the toilet like that...

:stupidbillionaire#1:
"You see? There are only 30 teams. 200-1 is a steal. We must get a piece of this action."

:stupidbillionaire#2:
"How right you are. Perhaps if they continue to struggle, we can buy the team and then spend enough money to buy the championship."

:stupidbillionaire#1:
"Brilliant...We can even bribe the umpires if necessary..."