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popilius
05-05-2005, 07:42 PM
Today, Rooney, Farmer, and Bill Melton all mentioned that KW may be interested in acquiring Tony Graffanino. He was a quality utility infielder for us, and personally I would welcome him back, especially considering all the injuries and shallow bench experience right now in the infield.

Still, he's been on-off with injuires since with the Sox.

Any thoughts on when how this might happen, or if it will?

:gulp:

SoxxoS
05-05-2005, 07:50 PM
Bring it.

JoseCanseco6969
05-05-2005, 07:51 PM
Today, Rooney, Farmer, and Bill Melton all mentioned that KW may be interested in acquiring Tony Graffanino. He was a quality utility infielder for us, and personally I would welcome him back, especially considering all the injuries and shallow bench experience right now in the infield.

Still, he's been on-off with injuires since with the Sox.

Any thoughts on when how this might happen, or if it will?

:gulp:

yeah why not? hes an improvement over the ever versatile Wee willie

gobears1987
05-05-2005, 08:22 PM
Tony G is a player I still love to watch. I'm sure he doesn't hate the Sox, but I doubt he'd want to come here. The reason has nothing to do with feelings towards the Sox but rather the fact he is a starter right now on the Royals, but if he were on the Sox he'd ride the bench. If you were a player would you rather ride the bench or start? The answer is simple. Tony wouldn't be happy here for that reason and I don't blame him.

Iguana775
05-05-2005, 08:24 PM
sweet! that would rock!

soltrain21
05-05-2005, 08:33 PM
Tony G is a player I still love to watch. I'm sure he doesn't hate the Sox, but I doubt he'd want to come here. The reason has nothing to do with feelings towards the Sox but rather the fact he is a starter right now on the Royals, but if he were on the Sox he'd ride the bench. If you were a player would you rather ride the bench or start? The answer is simple. Tony wouldn't be happy here for that reason and I don't blame him.


Tony G is a competitor and I am sure he wants to win. He would be a HUGE roleplayer for a team that is going places. I would much rather be that then a starter on a terrible team.

Chisox003
05-05-2005, 08:36 PM
Tony G is a competitor and I am sure he wants to win. He would be a HUGE roleplayer for a team that is going places. I would much rather be that then a starter on a terrible team.

Ya he's a winner no doubt about that....

I would LOVE to see Tony G be part of something special on the south side this summer!

Get er done Kenny

S05X

gobears1987
05-05-2005, 08:38 PM
Tony G is a competitor and I am sure he wants to win. He would be a HUGE roleplayer for a team that is going places. I would much rather be that then a starter on a terrible team.
I have no doubt he is a competitor and I would LOVE to have Tony G on our team as he is one of my favorite players. He wouldn't be as huge on our team as you think though. Right now he is a starter on a team. I'm sure he would like to win, but he probably wants to start more and get playing time. He wouldn't get that time so long as Uribe and Gooch do their jobs.

jabrch
05-05-2005, 08:40 PM
yeah why not? hes an improvement over the ever versatile Wee willie


Willie is hitting .310 with a .394 obp...Can you tell me how Graffy is better than that?

mr_genius
05-05-2005, 08:50 PM
i like tony g, but wasn't he always complaining about not enough playing time?

i think i remember that

kevingrt
05-05-2005, 08:52 PM
Tony G= Class Act... Get him KW, insurance is never bad

seanpmurphy
05-05-2005, 08:54 PM
Tony G is a competitor and I am sure he wants to win. He would be a HUGE roleplayer for a team that is going places. I would much rather be that then a starter on a terrible team.


Definitely. I'd rather make minor contributions to a winning team, than any kind of contributions to a last place team.

Edit: I'm not saying we should go out and get him though. I think we're fine the way we are.

Banix12
05-05-2005, 08:54 PM
Today, Rooney, Farmer, and Bill Melton all mentioned that KW may be interested in acquiring Tony Graffanino. He was a quality utility infielder for us, and personally I would welcome him back, especially considering all the injuries and shallow bench experience right now in the infield.

Still, he's been on-off with injuires since with the Sox.

Any thoughts on when how this might happen, or if it will?

:gulp:

I'm likely in the minority here but I don't really care to have him back. I mean I like him as a player and he's a useful role player on the bench but so far I have really been impressed with the way Willie has adapted to being a part time player and Ozuna has been impressive when he gets the chance. Now if Ozuna is going to be gone for an extended period of time with this wrist injury, then maybe I can see this but for now I stick with the reserves we got.

Also, If the sox wouldn't pay his high salary when he was a popular and effective role player with the sox, why would they pay it now, as well as give up a player, as he struggles to hit with the Royals?

Banix12
05-05-2005, 08:57 PM
i like tony g, but wasn't he always complaining about not enough playing time?

i think i remember that

Yeah, that's why he took the royals job if I recall, they promised him more playing time

balke
05-05-2005, 08:57 PM
Maybe we can sign him to a minor league deal. :wink:

mr_genius
05-05-2005, 09:01 PM
Yeah, that's why he took the royals job if I recall, they promised him more playing time

well if he comes back he needs to realize his role

we could use someone that can play 3 infield positions. seein willie at short was disturbing

joe_tansey2004
05-05-2005, 09:01 PM
I think he would come play for a winner. He's got a lot of friends on the Sox still. He seems like he gets along with Konerko. Everytime I see the two of them on TV together there always laughing. I would love to see Graffy come back.

Banix12
05-05-2005, 09:04 PM
Maybe we can sign him to a minor league deal. :wink:

He would have to be cut from the Royals first for that to happen, and that won't happen because they aren't gonna eat his $1 million+ salary. They'd rather trade him and get the salary off the books.

He would also likely be able to get a major league deal from other teams, so it's doubtful he'd take a minor league deal.

kojak
05-05-2005, 09:04 PM
Didn't Tony and Ozzie play together for a couple of years?

If so, Ozzie's feelings about Tony will have everything to do with whether or not he comes back. I always liked him, though I am VERY wary of messing with this team's chemistry...

TheOldRoman
05-05-2005, 09:18 PM
well if he comes back he needs to realize his role

we could use someone that can play 3 infield positions. seein willie at short was disturbing

We have one, his name is Pablo Ozuna. Besides 2B, 3B, and SS, he also plays 1B and LF. More importantly, he is much better defensively than Graf. A utility man needs to be able to play defense, offense doesnt matter (although Ozuna has been really good with the bat so far). Graf was mediocre defensively. I liked him, but we have no need for him on this team.

Garlandfan33
05-05-2005, 09:21 PM
Between him and Ray Durham I have a million autographs of the two. I would love to see both on the team however, the Durham thing isnt going to happen but I wouldnt complain in getting Mr. Graffino back in the black and white uniform. Anyone want some Ray Durham, Kelly Wunsch or Tony Graffino autographs? LOL:tongue:

Banix12
05-05-2005, 09:27 PM
Didn't Tony and Ozzie play together for a couple of years?

If so, Ozzie's feelings about Tony will have everything to do with whether or not he comes back. I always liked him, though I am VERY wary of messing with this team's chemistry...

I think they played together in Atlanta for a season or two

tacosalbarojas
05-05-2005, 09:39 PM
If we bring him back we must include a clause in the contract stating that he must not let his gramma die in the middle of the biggest series of the year right when we need him to fill in for Jose against a tough lefty (a la Minny in Sept. '03).

Ol' No. 2
05-05-2005, 10:40 PM
I'm all for it. A .211 hitter with mediocre defense and no speed is exactly what this team needs.:?:

JUribe1989
05-05-2005, 10:43 PM
I completely love Tony G. and I would love to see him back, but I really see no room for him on this team with an infield of Iguchi, Uribe, Ozuna, and Harris.

Fake Chet Lemon
05-05-2005, 10:59 PM
I'll keep Ozuna.

balke
05-05-2005, 11:10 PM
well if he comes back he needs to realize his role

we could use someone that can play 3 infield positions. seein willie at short was disturbing

Willie only had one bad game at short, when he was thrust into the position. Graffanino sucks, I don't even want him here clogging up our roster.

Iron Dragon
05-05-2005, 11:13 PM
I have to say I like the team the way it is. Ozuna is versatile, Willie is hitting .310, and Graf is only at about .220. No thanks.

Tragg
05-05-2005, 11:20 PM
Pretty soon we'll hear the clamor for joe randa again. We don't need to clog this team with lousy royals. He's a passable utility player who's overpaid. And our utility players have played okay.

guillen4life13
05-05-2005, 11:24 PM
To set the record straight, Graffy left because he wanted/needed more money. However, his case was very valid, and the Sox' reasons for letting him go were also valid. There were never any hard feelings between the two parties.

Why did Graffy want more money? His case was that, as a baseball player, career length is very limited, and it is during that career that a player needs to make and save the money he will use for the rest of his life. This was/is very valid for the roleplayer/bench type guys because they: a) generally have even shorter careers or fluctuate between the majors and minors, and b) are lucky to make $1 million/year. I was sad to see Tony go, but his reasons were sound.

samram
05-06-2005, 12:48 AM
Willie only had one bad game at short, when he was thrust into the position. Graffanino sucks, I don't even want him here clogging up our roster.

Thank you. I don't understand the Tony G/Kelly Wunsch love that exists on this site. If the Sox could use something right now, it would be a good right-handed bat off the bench, and Graffanino doesn't really fit that role, and, as has been mentioned already, he's not very good defensively.

Charno
05-06-2005, 12:52 AM
I think KW would have to trade way too much to get him. He's a lot more valuable to KC than he would be to us.

shaunburnette
05-06-2005, 12:58 AM
Thank you. I don't understand the Tony G/Kelly Wunsch love that exists on this site. If the Sox could use something right now, it would be a good right-handed bat off the bench, and Graffanino doesn't really fit that role, and, as has been mentioned already, he's not very good defensively.

how about another lefty in the pen to replace cotts?

ClaudelSleptHere
05-06-2005, 12:59 AM
Don't think we need him, and I would give up nothing to get him.........

Banix12
05-06-2005, 01:44 AM
Thank you. I don't understand the Tony G/Kelly Wunsch love that exists on this site. If the Sox could use something right now, it would be a good right-handed bat off the bench, and Graffanino doesn't really fit that role, and, as has been mentioned already, he's not very good defensively.

I liked both Tony G and Kelly Wunsch when they were here as players, they gave their all and I always hope they do well at whatever their next stop is in the majors. So I'll show them some love when the situation warrents it, just like I'll show some love for any former sox player who gave their all while they were here.

I agree with you though that there are too many people who are clamoring to have these guys back. I don't want them back because we have largely been able to fill their roles with cheaper, younger and often better players. They had nice runs here but it was time for them to move on and all of us fans should move on as well and back our current role players, who have done an amazing job so far this season.

CPditka
05-06-2005, 04:36 AM
I love Graffy, lets get that straight, but what would it take to get him. I think he could play 2b, 3b, SS, and OF in a pinch ala Pablo, but we have that. If you could get him back for dog**** then im all for it... but Give up NO ONE!! for him. Kenny keep our minors strong. You already have pablo, no need for caucasian pablo to do the same thing, Hold on to the prospects, people want them... or they willl be YOUR CHICAGO WHITE SOOOOOOOOOOOOXXXXXXXXXXXXXXX!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!! at some point. dont trade for tony unless its so cheap Jerry thinks its a good deal .

doublem23
05-06-2005, 04:42 AM
I'm all for it. A .211 hitter with mediocre defense and no speed is exactly what this team needs.:?:

No kidding. Why don't we get Charles Johnson next? He was pretty huge in '00 for us, too.

hose
05-06-2005, 07:16 AM
As much as I like Tony G. the Sox don't need him. He isn't the same player he was when he was w/ the Sox.

Mendoza Line
05-06-2005, 09:06 AM
The thing about Tony G. I'll never forget happened against the Cubs a few years ago. In a non-force out situation, Tony fielded a ground ball and stepped on 3rd instead of tagging the runner . Grr my dad and I still make jokes about it. We should have won that game...

34 Inch Stick
05-06-2005, 09:15 AM
Along with playing time, the reason the Sox did not sign Tony was because the Royals offered him more than double what the Sox would were willing to pay. I don't believe the Sox fiscal situation has changed. I think he is being overpayed as a starter. He would be far outside the market as a backup.

That said, if the Sox want him, I am sure he is available. I think he is in the last year of his contract and there is no way the Royals will be resurrecting this season. He could probably be had for nothing if the Sox picked up his salary.

nlentz88
05-06-2005, 09:22 AM
I don't really think it matters whether or not Graff would want to come to the Sox and accept a lesser role off the bench. Since when do players get a say in which teams they get traded to? It's not like he's been on the Royals for seven years or anything. He can't reject a trade, can he?

PaleHoseGeorge
05-06-2005, 09:29 AM
Graff can play SS which automatically makes him more valuable on the Sox bench than Willie Harris. However he left just one year ago for the chance to play everyday so I'm wondering if he has changed his mind? He isn't going to start for the White Sox.

The Sox have specific bench player needs. I'm not sure Graff is the ideal candidate to be added in 2005, but trading Tanyon Sturtze to Tampa for Graff in 2000 was one of the smarter moves the Sox made while winning 95 games. Picking up Herbert Perry off waivers was the other one.

crazyozzie02
05-06-2005, 09:45 AM
Just see my bottom sig and youll know my feelings on this

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 10:18 AM
Graff can play SS which automatically makes him more valuable on the Sox bench than Willie Harris. However he left just one year ago for the chance to play everyday so I'm wondering if he has changed his mind? He isn't going to start for the White Sox.

The Sox have specific bench player needs. I'm not sure Graff is the ideal candidate to be added in 2005, but trading Tanyon Sturtze to Tampa for Graff in 2000 was one of the smarter moves the Sox made while winning 95 games. Picking up Herbert Perry off waivers was the other one.Willie Harris is just keeping a roster spot warm for Frank Thomas. The choice is Tony Graffanino or Pablo Ozuna. I don't see how Graffanino is an upgrade.

daveeym
05-06-2005, 10:22 AM
Definitely. I'd rather make minor contributions to a winning team, than any kind of contributions to a last place team.

Edit: I'm not saying we should go out and get him though. I think we're fine the way we are. Sorry you guys are nuts. Bandwagonners even, definitely not competitors if you'd rather sit then play so you can "win". The only way I wouldn't think less of a guy doing this is someone nearing the end of his career and going from a regular to a bench guy just to win. For Tony he's been a bench guy most of his career, no way in hell he'd want to come back. If he did he'd be a professional about it and help a ton I'm sure.

Chez
05-06-2005, 10:56 AM
It ain't going to happen. Tony is making millions. Ozuna is making the major league minimum or close to it and Tony's not much (if any) of an upgrade.

Flight #24
05-06-2005, 10:59 AM
Willie Harris is just keeping a roster spot warm for Frank Thomas. The choice is Tony Graffanino or Pablo Ozuna. I don't see how Graffanino is an upgrade.

Agreed, at which point if I'm Kenny, I send Willie down to Charlotte with instructions that he play some SS regularly to see if he can handle it with more experience. If he can get comfortable at both MI positions, he could be a valuable reserve down the road, or at least become more valuable as trade bait.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 11:03 AM
Agreed, at which point if I'm Kenny, I send Willie down to Charlotte with instructions that he play some SS regularly to see if he can handle it with more experience. If he can get comfortable at both MI positions, he could be a valuable reserve down the road, or at least become more valuable as trade bait.I think Willie could start at 2B for a lot of teams. IMO, he's more valuable as trade bait, and that value is increased if they don't use up the last option. Might not be too easy to pull off a trade before FT comes back, though. Who needs a 2B?

PatK
05-06-2005, 11:08 AM
The thing about Tony G. I'll never forget happened against the Cubs a few years ago. In a non-force out situation, Tony fielded a ground ball and stepped on 3rd instead of tagging the runner . Grr my dad and I still make jokes about it. We should have won that game...

Didn't he also fail to lay down a bunt in the same game?

Chez
05-06-2005, 12:35 PM
I think Willie could start at 2B for a lot of teams. IMO, he's more valuable as trade bait, and that value is increased if they don't use up the last option. Might not be too easy to pull off a trade before FT comes back, though. Who needs a 2B?


This probably deserves it's own thread (who goes down when Frank is ready); but I think they will keep Willie and send down Gload. With plodders like Paulie, Crede, A.J. and Frank in the lineup, Willie is a valuable late inning pinch runner.

rmusacch
05-06-2005, 12:54 PM
Tony G is a player I still love to watch. I'm sure he doesn't hate the Sox, but I doubt he'd want to come here. The reason has nothing to do with feelings towards the Sox but rather the fact he is a starter right now on the Royals, but if he were on the Sox he'd ride the bench. If you were a player would you rather ride the bench or start? The answer is simple. Tony wouldn't be happy here for that reason and I don't blame him.

He might want to come here, for none other than the Royals have no shot while the Sox have a shot.

rmusacch
05-06-2005, 12:55 PM
This probably deserves it's own thread (who goes down when Frank is ready); but I think they will keep Willie and send down Gload. With plodders like Paulie, Crede, A.J. and Frank in the lineup, Willie is a valuable late inning pinch runner.

Who gets sent down when Gload comes back?

tstrike2000
05-06-2005, 01:02 PM
Agreed that Tony G will not come here for the multitude of reasons people in this thread have already mentioned. He left because he wanted a shot at a starting position somewhere else and more money. He's a very good utility player I really liked too, but I never saw him anymore than a utility player. His offense and defense are average. Ozuna is the man and a good role player, especially for the money.

LuvSox
05-06-2005, 01:08 PM
Definitely. I'd rather make minor contributions to a winning team, than any kind of contributions to a last place team.


What about this scenario----- Play your butt off everyday for a crappy team and have good numbers, raising your stock for free agency.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 01:14 PM
Who gets sent down when Gload comes back?Isn't Willie due back from Bereavement leave? I'd expect Lopez to be sent back down.

When Gload comes back, they'll have to make a decision. Burke is out of options, and IMO, he's a better fit for the team than Gload. Maybe they package both Gload and Willie in a trade?

TaylorStSox
05-06-2005, 02:15 PM
Isn't Willie due back from Bereavement leave? I'd expect Lopez to be sent back down.

When Gload comes back, they'll have to make a decision. Burke is out of options, and IMO, he's a better fit for the team than Gload. Maybe they package both Gload and Willie in a trade?

Burke will pass thru waivers again. He has before. I can't see anybody taking him.

Chrisaway
05-06-2005, 02:18 PM
Isn't Willie due back from Bereavement leave? I'd expect Lopez to be sent back down.

When Gload comes back, they'll have to make a decision. Burke is out of options, and IMO, he's a better fit for the team than Gload. Maybe they package both Gload and Willie in a trade?

I like Jamie Burke, but seriously I'd rather lose him than Gload.

Malgar 12
05-06-2005, 02:46 PM
Willie is hitting .310 with a .394 obp...Can you tell me how Graffy is better than that?

Tony G can play 2nd SS or 3b, and he actually hits the ball out of the infield.

Case Closed. (and please don't tell me Willie can play SS, unless you think Dye can too)

maurice
05-06-2005, 03:32 PM
Case opened.

Harris at SS has been no worse than Graffy at SS. Harris also plays an adequate OF, gets on base, and can pinch run. Meanwhile, he's younger and makes less money. ON2's right; Willie could start at 2B for a lot of teams. Graffy can't even start for the Royals.

slavko
05-06-2005, 03:44 PM
Case opened.

Harris at SS has been no worse than Graffy at SS. Harris also plays an adequate OF, gets on base, and can pinch run. Meanwhile, he's younger and makes less money. ON2's right; Willie could start at 2B for a lot of teams. Graffy can't even start for the Royals.

Correctamundo. He can't run, he's a butcher at SS (unlike the dreamers who are calling him average), and he chose to leave once. Don't touch him.

Malgar 12
05-06-2005, 03:49 PM
Case opened.

Harris at SS has been no worse than Graffy at SS. Harris also plays an adequate OF, gets on base, and can pinch run. Meanwhile, he's younger and makes less money. ON2's right; Willie could start at 2B for a lot of teams. Graffy can't even start for the Royals.

The problem is they're all in AAA.

TaylorStSox
05-06-2005, 04:53 PM
Tony G.'s a better situational hitter. That's the only plus. Harris plays better D. He gets on base at a better clip. He's a better baserunner. He doesn't steal but he gets from 1st to 3rd much better. He's cheaper. It's not contest IMO. People have sentimental attachments to Graffy and Wunsch. The truth is that they aren't very good.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 05:08 PM
Once again... Harris is irrelevant to the question of Graffanino. Harris will be gone once FT comes back. The comparison is Graffanino vs. Ozuna. And there's no comparison.

DickAllen72
05-06-2005, 05:26 PM
Harris will be gone once FT comes back.

That would be a terrible roster move.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 05:30 PM
That would be a terrible roster move.And you would prefer....

PaleHoseGeorge
05-06-2005, 05:31 PM
That would be a terrible roster move.

Sure. Frank Thomas can't play shortstop either.

:roflmao:

maurice
05-06-2005, 05:37 PM
And you would prefer....

Stick Frank in the Gload / Burke slot.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 05:40 PM
Stick Frank in the Gload / Burke slot.Who backs up 1B? And please don't say Everett. This is not the time for experiments.

maurice
05-06-2005, 05:40 PM
The problem is they're all in AAA.

That's daft. 2B is an extremely thin position in MLB.

maurice
05-06-2005, 05:44 PM
Who backs up 1B?

http://espn.go.com/i/mlb/profiles/players/6459.jpg

It's not like Gload is gonna get a bunch of starts over there anyway.

DickAllen72
05-06-2005, 05:45 PM
And you would prefer....

If Gload is back and healthy when Frank returns, the one who probably should be let go is Timo. Timo is a good guy to have around, but with Frank going in at DH, Everett gets pushed to fourth outfielder. Ozuna, Harris and even Gload can also play OF.

The Sox have a shortage of major league ready middle infielders available in the organization. As stated Harris can start for some major league teams at 2B and he can fill in at CF or SS in a pinch, as he has done. He's also got more of an upside than Timo and makes a lot less. If the Sox do plan on trading him, his value is much greater with the one option left as another poster pointed out.

And also, Frank is going to require a pinch runner in a lot of situations, and with Paulie, Crede, Pierzynski and Dye already on the team, I'd rather have a fleet footed Willie around to go from first to third or score from first on a gapper than slow footed Timo.

Again, this doesn't mean that I don't see Timo's value as a bench player, but with the Sox current personnel situation, Willie is a much wiser choice to keep around than Timo.

Now if Gload is still hurting, then Frank can take Gload's place and we have to hope someone else can play first base competently to back up Paulie.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 05:51 PM
http://espn.go.com/i/mlb/profiles/players/6459.jpg

It's not like Gload is gonna get a bunch of starts over there anyway.OK. I give up. Who's that?

Tragg
05-06-2005, 05:55 PM
Willie wouldn't bring much in return. On the other hand, he brings us depth, something we need. He can play a few positions adequately, and his offense in spot duty has been decent. Certainly a better player than tony g and a lot cheaper.

maurice
05-06-2005, 06:01 PM
OK. I give up. Who's that?

I'm not letting you off the hook that easily. I'll give you 2 hints:
- he's been on the 25-man all year
- he's played 1B for us this year

Gload, OTOH, has no role other than backup 1B. I seriously doubt that Timo's going anywhere, and Ozzie will continue to use him as lefty PH.

Nard
05-06-2005, 06:02 PM
OK. I give up. Who's that?

You don't know who that is?

It's the kid who's just brimming with pot-ten-tial according to Harold Reynolds.

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 06:04 PM
I'm not letting you off the hook that easily. I'll give you 2 hints:
- he's been on the 25-man all year
- he's played 1B for us this year

Gload, OTOH, has no role other than backup 1B. I seriously doubt that Timo's going anywhere, and Ozzie will continue to use him as lefty PH.Oh. The Rockies hat threw me. Nice touch.:redneck

TaylorStSox
05-06-2005, 06:05 PM
OK. I give up. Who's that?

Ozuna.



Harris has the most ability out of anyone on the bench. I'd probably keep him. However, he has the most value on the market. So I agree that he'll be moved.

If it's Ozuna vs. Graffanino then I'm going with Ozuna. He's a better fielder. He has more speed and he plays more positions.

I'm not sure why there's a love fest for Graffy. He didn't have good things to say when he left. Frankly, he's not very good. I don't care that Ozuana's a 30 year old AAAA player. In essence, that's all Tony G. is too. I'll take the speed and D.

PaleHoseGeorge
05-06-2005, 06:10 PM
You know what I love about these "25th man" arguments? Everybody is right and everybody is wrong all at the very same time.

Nobody gives a **** about their 25th man. They're a dime a dozen. You need one only because all the other teams have a 25th man and you don't dare give the opposition any advantage available to your team, too.

Harris sucks. Gload sucks. Ozuna and Perez suck to lesser degrees. They each suck to the exact amount they fit the "25th man" role.

Now let's have another fight about Harris vs. Jimenez, 2002's version of this exact same argument.

TaylorStSox
05-06-2005, 06:13 PM
You know what I love about these "25th man" arguments? Everybody is right and everybody is wrong all at the very same time.

Nobody gives a **** about their 25th man. They're a dime a dozen. You need one only because all the other teams have a 25th man and you don't dare give the opposition any advantage available to your team, too.

Harris sucks. Gload sucks. Ozuna and Perez suck to lesser degrees. They each suck to the exact amount they fit the "25th man" role.

Now let's have another fight about Harris vs. Jimenez, 2002's version of this exact same argument.

Jimenez > Harris :redneck

BTW, I don't think Harris "sucks." I think he's better than alot of MLB 2nd baseman, including the guy 8 miles north and one of the two playing in NYC.

Chisox003
05-06-2005, 06:17 PM
You know what I love about these "25th man" arguments? Everybody is right and everybody is wrong all at the very same time.

Nobody gives a **** about their 25th man. They're a dime a dozen. You need one only because all the other teams have a 25th man and you don't dare give the opposition any advantage available to your team, too.

Harris sucks. Gload sucks. Ozuna and Perez suck to lesser degrees. They each suck to the exact amount they fit the "25th man" role.

Now let's have another fight about Harris vs. Jimenez, 2002's version of this exact same argument.

I wish I could suck and be the 25th man on a MLB team....

I do see where youre coming from though....

Edit: I forgot to add, give me Willie over Jimenez any day

Ol' No. 2
05-06-2005, 06:18 PM
Jimenez > Harris :redneck

BTW, I don't think Harris "sucks." I think he's better than alot of MLB 2nd baseman, including the guy 8 miles north and one of the two playing in NYC.No way. Harris >> Jiminez:redneck

I don't think these guys suck, either, but PHG is just adding a little hyperbole. Arguing about who's the best 25th man really is just another version of the tallest midget contest.

PaleHoseGeorge
05-06-2005, 06:28 PM
Arguing about who's the best 25th man really is just another version of the tallest midget contest.

Exactly.

And Harris >> Jimenez. :redneck

maurice
05-06-2005, 06:34 PM
Harris >> Jimenez. :redneck

But what about Craig Grebeck! :redneck

jabrch
05-06-2005, 07:39 PM
Graff can play SS which automatically makes him more valuable on the Sox bench than Willie Harris.

Only if Uribe is hurt - and Ozuna is hurt. Harris, however, is a better hitter, offers great speed, and plays serviceable 2B and CF and below average, and tolerable SS for a THIRD/EMERGENCY SS.

Please explain to me how, for this team, Graffy is better than Harris as a 3rd SS/PH/UO/UI?

jabrch
05-06-2005, 07:40 PM
Willie Harris is just keeping a roster spot warm for Frank Thomas.

You think they are going to cut Harris when Frank gets back? Add a DH and lose a guy who can play 2B, CF and SS?

I doubt that...I'm guessing Timo is gone far sooner than Willie.

PaleHoseGeorge
05-06-2005, 07:42 PM
I doubt that...I'm guessing Timo is gone far sooner than Willie.

Yeah but how do you feel about Jerry Reinsdorf being Chicago's best sports team owner.

:wink:

balke
05-06-2005, 11:50 PM
You know what I love about these "25th man" arguments? Everybody is right and everybody is wrong all at the very same time.

Nobody gives a **** about their 25th man. They're a dime a dozen. You need one only because all the other teams have a 25th man and you don't dare give the opposition any advantage available to your team, too.

Harris sucks. Gload sucks. Ozuna and Perez suck to lesser degrees. They each suck to the exact amount they fit the "25th man" role.

Now let's have another fight about Harris vs. Jimenez, 2002's version of this exact same argument.

Post of the Thread. If the Sox are gonna make any moves, they should be REAL moves that will actually help the team win. A great lights out reliever, or a big bat with a glove. Graffanino is a +million dollar minor leaguer at best.

I have full confidence Kenny feels the same way.

swanson24
05-07-2005, 05:13 PM
Kenny should do what it takes to get Tony Grafanino back on the South Side as long as it doesn't involve trading Brandon MacCarthy! It also should be noted that I am in favor of trading minor laeguers just not BMac!

mdep524
05-07-2005, 05:25 PM
You guys need to get off the Graffanino kool aid. I liked him a lot when he was here too, but here we are, two years later, not really needing an expensive, slow footed, back up infielder who plays poor defense and is nothing special at the plate. I'm all for nostolgia, (and Italian Sox) but come on guys.

Malgar 12
05-07-2005, 06:18 PM
That's daft. 2B is an extremely thin position in MLB.

And Harris has extremely thin skills.

pczarapa
05-07-2005, 06:29 PM
Today, Rooney, Farmer, and Bill Melton all mentioned that KW may be interested in acquiring Tony Graffanino. He was a quality utility infielder for us, and personally I would welcome him back, especially considering all the injuries and shallow bench experience right now in the infield.

Still, he's been on-off with injuires since with the Sox.

Any thoughts on when how this might happen, or if it will?

:gulp:


I think it would be a welcome addition, I always liked Tony. He's a real gritty player is a great stop-gap in the infield. Wonder who we'd have to give up?

Win1ForMe
05-07-2005, 06:49 PM
Graffanino would have been perfect last year when our MIFs (Alomar, Harris, Valentin) were struggling to hit lefties. But there's really not much need for him at all this season.