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View Full Version : How are those trades looking now???


DaleJRFan
04-29-2005, 03:03 PM
gave up:

Carlos Lee .226 AVG, .298 OBP, 3 HR, 14 RBI
Jeremy Reed .246 AVG, .350 OBP, 0 HR, 6 RBI
Miguel Olivo .189 AVG, .232 OBP, 0 HR, 9 RBI

got:

Freddy Garcia 2-1, 2.83 ERA
Scott Podsednik .279 AVG, .348 OBP, 9 SB, 10 runs scored 11 K in 69 AB
Luis Vizcaino 2-1, 7.30 ERA (due to taking one for the team against Cleveland)

...and some argue these guys were signed because of $$$ freed up in the CLee trade, so I'll include them:

AJ Pierzynski .250 AVG, .297 OBP, 1 HR, 2 RBI (yea, 2 RBI is pretty BAD)
Orlando Hernandez 2-1, 2.35 ERA
Tadahito Iguchi .304 AVG

Where's the Jeremy Reed watch???

Go Kenny, Go.

Jerome
04-29-2005, 03:09 PM
Don't forget Jon Rauch.

billnahorodny
04-29-2005, 03:11 PM
Don't forget about Crazy Carl.

Gave up:
http://sports.espn.go.com/espn/wire?section=mlb&id=2048273

Unless Jon Rauch ends up winning the Cy Young this year, I think we're all glad we have Carl.

DumpJerry
04-29-2005, 03:15 PM
Reed's OPB is better than Pods.

DaleJRFan
04-29-2005, 03:17 PM
How could I forget Carl Everett and Jon Rauch?? Sorry!!! I was focusing more on the "big two" trades... should have included this one.

balke
04-29-2005, 03:17 PM
\

Luis Vizcaino 2-1, 7.30 ERA (due to taking one for the team against Cleveland)



Go Kenny, Go.

Don't you mean took 8 for the team? It was like 6-8 in that inning... I could hear the runs pile up as I walked away from the stadium that day.... it was painful.

He's good though, I'm not being sarcastic. I like Vizcaino so far.

I wish dye would perform. The fact that we didn't blow our money on Maggs makes me happier than anything.

Hagan
04-29-2005, 03:18 PM
It's hard to compair reed right now to everyone because he is young and still a prospect. He will end up being a great 300 hitter with 10 homers each year. I am happy we made that trade but reed will be a great player eventually.

balke
04-29-2005, 03:19 PM
It's hard to compair reed right now to everyone because he is young and still a prospect. He will end up being a great 300 hitter with 10 homers each year. I am happy we made that trade but reed will be a great player eventually.

yah, that's the other thing. He and dye have a full season to play. I think Anderson would be better than either Reed or Dye in right... but we'll see. I'm curious to see if Reed is slumping, or if he's just not going to be the .310 batter people seem to think he is.

DaleJRFan
04-29-2005, 03:20 PM
Don't you mean took 8 for the team? It was like 6-8 in that inning... I could hear the runs pile up as I walked away from the stadium that day.... it was painful.

He's good though, I'm not being sarcastic. I like Vizcaino so far.

I wish dye would perform. The fact that we didn't blow our money on Maggs makes me happier than anything.

Vizzy is a one-inning pitcher. He was in there for 3 innings. He got out of the ninth relatively painlessly, then went back in for the 10th & 11th to get rocked so that Widger didn't have to pitch. From what he has shown this year, he's as good as they come for a one inning guy, in my opinion.

Hangar18
04-29-2005, 04:22 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4

soxrme
04-29-2005, 04:33 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4
Dye has been horrible, is not a good fielder at all, Pods has shown no arm in the outfield. At least Lee would be a big stick threat. With Paulie hitting into those double plays again he would help. Lee also knows the pitchers in this league and would probably be hitting better. Pods could have been obtained for less.
We are playing well but this trade and letting Maggs go should not be judged until the end of the year.:bandance:

SSN721
04-29-2005, 04:35 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4

I dont know how you could possibly predict that. How does a .226 average not kill rallies as well?

Baby Fisk
04-29-2005, 04:47 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4
Come on Hangar. You fawn over CLee as if he was your cousin. CLee is the Maestro of the First Pitch Popup.

Lemme try this game:
If we still had Lee, we could easily be 10-12.
If we still had Fisk, we'd be 22-0. :cool:

Anyone else up for some wild assumptions?

santo=dorf
04-29-2005, 04:51 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4

So how many more games would we have lost if we didn't have Pods, Viz, El Duque, AJ and Iguchi? :rolleyes:

LVSoxFan
04-29-2005, 05:07 PM
Um, I was at the Cleveland game where Vizzy got rocked.

That wasn't his fault; when Shingo had his now-infamous meltdown, the game was lost. Vizzy was already tired going in... it was just elemental that he was the loser. He was essentially cannon fodder that day. Somebody had to finish.

And who says Pods doesn't have an arm? I've seen him make some great throws...

MIgrenade
04-29-2005, 05:12 PM
I wish dye would perform. The fact that we didn't blow our money on Maggs makes me happier than anything.

Absolutely right, things can always be worse.

balke
04-29-2005, 05:16 PM
Um, I was at the Cleveland game where Vizzy got rocked.

That wasn't his fault; when Shingo had his now-infamous meltdown, the game was lost. Vizzy was already tired going in... it was just elemental that he was the loser. He was essentially cannon fodder that day. Somebody had to finish.

And who says Pods doesn't have an arm? I've seen him make some great throws...


Maybe people are misunderstanding me. He had one bad outing that inflated his ERA. I know it wasn't his fault, I was at that game too. He had too many innings in, and was forced to take the beating in the end. It was painful, like watching a torture or something.

I think Pods is fine in left. He looked kinda silly on a play Thursday, but overall he's at least been sufficient, which is really all Carlos was.

RedPinStripes
04-29-2005, 05:23 PM
Personally, Carlos Lees .226 would definitely have WON us a few more
games compared to Jermaine Dyes Rally-Killing .170 right now ........
With Lee, We could easily be 18-4

I would say that Pod's 9 sb's have helped a lot.

LVSoxFan
04-29-2005, 05:26 PM
Maybe people are misunderstanding me. He had one bad outing that inflated his ERA. I know it wasn't his fault, I was at that game too. He had too many innings in, and was forced to take the beating in the end. It was painful, like watching a torture or something.

I think Pods is fine in left. He looked kinda silly on a play Thursday, but overall he's at least been sufficient, which is really all Carlos was.

LOL you are so right. That game WAS torture. It seemed like we had it in the bag, then it's Shingo Time, then... ugh.

At least the Oakland losses were a circus from the get-go; the Cleveland loss was like an unexpected gut punch. Ouch.

I think Pods is the best acquisition we've made--the dude stole THREE bases in one game last week. Love it! And seeing him up close (in Detroit)--the guy plays with intensity; I can verify that!

lowesox
04-29-2005, 06:46 PM
I was listening to a Toronto MLB.com broadcast the other day and the announcers were drooling over Reed. It's way to early to tell, since he's just starting his carer. Even with Olivo and Rauch, I think it's too soon.

PAPChiSox729
04-29-2005, 06:47 PM
Well, right now these trades look like steals. But over the course of the season, things will even out. It is way too early judge whether these were good trades. But right now, they ain't lookin' too bad...

:cool:

gosox41
04-30-2005, 10:33 AM
gave up:

Carlos Lee .226 AVG, .298 OBP, 3 HR, 14 RBI
Jeremy Reed .246 AVG, .350 OBP, 0 HR, 6 RBI
Miguel Olivo .189 AVG, .232 OBP, 0 HR, 9 RBI

got:

Freddy Garcia 2-1, 2.83 ERA
Scott Podsednik .279 AVG, .348 OBP, 9 SB, 10 runs scored 11 K in 69 AB
Luis Vizcaino 2-1, 7.30 ERA (due to taking one for the team against Cleveland)

...and some argue these guys were signed because of $$$ freed up in the CLee trade, so I'll include them:

AJ Pierzynski .250 AVG, .297 OBP, 1 HR, 2 RBI (yea, 2 RBI is pretty BAD)
Orlando Hernandez 2-1, 2.35 ERA
Tadahito Iguchi .304 AVG

Where's the Jeremy Reed watch???

Go Kenny, Go.

It's early but things are looking good now.



Bob

Hangar18
04-30-2005, 10:55 AM
I dont know how you could possibly predict that. How does a .226 average not kill rallies as well?

Good question, and Im glad you asked that. Carlos Lee was swinging the bat
really well and seeing the ball in spring training. Once the season starts though, as we all know, things change. Pitchers in the NL are pitching around him and of course, hes trying to do to much. Carlos Lee is one of the most prolific COMPLEMENTARY hitters in baseball. That is, you put him in a good hitting lineup and the guy will shine. We saw that he alone cannot carry a team, as was the case last season. Hes not that kind of hitter. Hes a dangerous #5 or #6 hitter. If your facing our lineup, wouldnt you want to just pitch around Everett and Konerko? Konerko AGAIN is simply trying to do too much. He knows there isnt a real hitting threat behind him, and that is the problem with giving away all of your offense under the guise of "getting better defensively blah blah blah".

Konerko cant do it himself.

Last nite, if Carlos Lee is batting 5th, instead of Jermaine Dye (I know, Rowand was 5th and Dye 6th), Konerko is probably going to get a really
good pitch to hit, and we probably win the game last nite. Instead,
Paulie gets hpb, Rowand comes up (another excellent Complementary hitter, but batting out of place because Dye is over-the-hill) batting in the 5th slot because we have no offense, and he made a great effort, and flew out (summer, that goes out).

The game was right there, because you knew an automatic out in Jermaine Dye was up next. We either win the game, or were gonna lose in xtra innings. That was HORRID that we leave 16 men on base, that we have the bases loaded with nobody out, and can only score 1 run. Brutal.
Were a couple hitters short right now. Quickest way to fix that?
We need a .300 type hitter who can hit for power and makes contact in RF,
a Carlos Lee type for sure ......... to take the pressure off Konerko and Everett.

Hangar18
04-30-2005, 11:02 AM
LOL you are so right. That game WAS torture. It seemed like we had it in the bag, then it's Shingo Time, then... ugh.

At least the Oakland losses were a circus from the get-go; the Cleveland loss was like an unexpected gut punch. Ouch.

I think Pods is the best acquisition we've made--the dude stole THREE bases in one game last week. Love it! And seeing him up close (in Detroit)--the guy plays with intensity; I can verify that!


this is a good post ........ We were in LF, and when we went to extra innings, some fans began yelling to Neil Cotts to get up and start warming up. Seeing how anemic our offense has been, this wouldve been a PERFECT time to get him some work. If we manage to play Corpseball for a couple more innings, at least Cotts can stay in the game and we dont do an Ozz-burn-thru-bullpen job. Shingo instead got up .......and started to warm up. Shingo is only good for 1 inning. I would never have brought him up right there. Im really liking Podsednik. Hes gives us a baserunning threat, something we havnt had since the Durham-is-gonna-be-too-expensive-we-better-give-him-away-hurry deal for Jon Adkins. But seeing
how much offense we were losing, you have to keep Carlos Lee. Players like that are too hard to come by, and we dont like to pay for them on the open market. Lee in LF, Pods in CF, and Rowand in RF is a decent outfield.

A. Cavatica
04-30-2005, 12:35 PM
yah, that's the other thing. He and dye have a full season to play. I think Anderson would be better than either Reed or Dye in right... but we'll see. I'm curious to see if Reed is slumping, or if he's just not going to be the .310 batter people seem to think he is.

Reed is as much a .243 hitter as Dye is a .175 hitter!

Include his numbers from September, and he has a career .311 average, with a .397 on-base percentage, in 132 at-bats. His slugging percentage is only .379, but that could just be the way he adjusts to a new level. (He brought his average up for Charlotte last year before he turned the power on.) And he's 23. That .397 OBP is tremendous for anyone, let alone a 23-year-old rookie.

So I still think he'll have a stellar ML career, and right now I'd much rather have him than Dye. Even so, the trade is looking good for the Sox, because Garcia's been as good as expected (if not as good as hoped) and because Olivo's been horrendous.

RKMeibalane
04-30-2005, 12:44 PM
Careful. Jeremyb1 might come back here and throw a fit. :D:

Lip Man 1
04-30-2005, 01:14 PM
Hangar:

The problem is the White Sox felt they couldn't afford to pay Carlos Lee eight million dollars and still have enough left to improve the other badly needed areas.

That's the reality of the situation. The Sox aren't the Yankees or Red Sox or Angels.

Lip

A. Cavatica
04-30-2005, 06:45 PM
Careful. Jeremyb1 might come back here and throw a fit. :D:

We need a tag for "I'm sorry, I didn't mean to turn this into a Reed thread." :smile:

Fake Chet Lemon
05-01-2005, 12:47 AM
Wow, wonderboy Reed isn't hitting .400? Shocking.

Steelrod
05-01-2005, 05:29 AM
I dont know how you could possibly predict that. How does a .226 average not kill rallies as well?
I agree!
Now .216, leaving 5 men on base. Why do people think what we got sucked, and those we trade away and are struggling will get back to old form
Anyone want to try to be positive about our guys returning to form, and then maybe, just maybe, you will have something positive to say.
Hitting is suffering now, but I have no problem being in first!

WhteSox725
05-02-2005, 09:16 AM
Wow, wonderboy Reed isn't hitting .400? Shocking.

Don't worry he was 3-3 yesterday with a triple. We are really starting to look bad trading him away.