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maff
04-26-2005, 10:29 AM
I've been thinking about this for a couple days and was just wondering what everyone else thinks, it's a little farfetched I guess so bear with me.

As you all know over the past decade or so theres been alot of supposed steroid use helping sluggers hit more homers, making guys faster, and helping pitchers with their velocity and recuperation. Well, we also know that the higher ups of baseball weren't exactly in the dark about this. We also know that Jerry Reinsdorf, although cheap, is a baseball purist. Looking at this years team it seems as if everyone is playing with the same gusto as they're used to but around the league lots of teams with star power are trailing off (Yankees, Twins, A's). Could it be that Jerry has been one of the few stalwarts in this league not allowing his teams to cheat? If so, then the last few years don't seem as bad and this year makes me feel great.

Once again, I know it's a weird theory, but it's my theory nonetheless.

Irishsox1
04-26-2005, 10:49 AM
Those teams stunk because they didn't have great pitching. To give you an example, the Sox starting rotation in 1999 was Jamie Navarro, John Snyder, Mike Sirotka, Jim Parque and James Baldwin and the closer was Bob Howry.

My guess is that if the Sox got wind of a player using steroids, he was probably traded. But, the Sox did have Conseco on the team in 2001 and everyone knows he was using.

rdwj
04-26-2005, 10:54 AM
I doubt many (if any) owners cared what suppliments players were using - legal or not.

patbooyah
04-26-2005, 10:54 AM
which leads to my point...

.. did jerry know something about maggs? is that a small part of the reason he was set free(besides the heinous agent/knee)?

maff
04-26-2005, 10:54 AM
Man, how could I forget about Canseco. Damn, that kinda screws my whole post, thanks for pointing that out Irish.

Frater Perdurabo
04-26-2005, 11:04 AM
I've been thinking about this for a couple days and was just wondering what everyone else thinks, it's a little farfetched I guess so bear with me.

As you all know over the past decade or so theres been alot of supposed steroid use helping sluggers hit more homers, making guys faster, and helping pitchers with their velocity and recuperation. Well, we also know that the higher ups of baseball weren't exactly in the dark about this. We also know that Jerry Reinsdorf, although cheap, is a baseball purist. Looking at this years team it seems as if everyone is playing with the same gusto as they're used to but around the league lots of teams with star power are trailing off (Yankees, Twins, A's). Could it be that Jerry has been one of the few stalwarts in this league not allowing his teams to cheat? If so, then the last few years don't seem as bad and this year makes me feel great.

Once again, I know it's a weird theory, but it's my theory nonetheless.

I don't think any owners have pushed their trainers to push steroids to their players. I do think some would be more tolerant of steroid use than others.

It reminds me of the Quincy Carter situation with Dallas before the 2004 season. It was pretty obvious Carter failed a drug test. However, NFL rules prohibit a team from releasing a player who tests positive under the testing program. Consequently, Jerry Jones and Bill Parcells could not cite Carter's positive drug test as the reason for releasing him. I think what happened is that Parcells had a zero tolerance drug policy in his team rules, and Carter was released for "violating team rules." Of course, the Cowboys couldn't say that because the next question would be "What rule did he violate?"

I certainly think it is possible that Reinsdorf has a zero tolerance policy. I also think it is likely that one of the many reasons KW went with a pitching-first philosophy this year is because home-run power would become less significant in a league that now tests for steroids.

I would quibble with your identification of "star power" teams. The A's? They let most of their offensive stars leave as free agents. The Twins? Who on the Twins is a renowned HR hitter?

Otherwise you may be on to something....

maff
04-26-2005, 11:12 AM
Frater, I agree the Twins and A's aren't slugging teams, but steroids also helps with speed and pitching (velocity + recuperation time), that's why I pointed out the Twins and A's as examples.

Irishsox1
04-26-2005, 11:25 AM
which leads to my point...

.. did jerry know something about maggs? is that a small part of the reason he was set free(besides the heinous agent/knee)?

If Jerry or Kenny didn't want Maggs, then why did they keep his contract on the table after he hurt his knee, even if they knew he was or wasn't using?

My feeling is that the Sox wanted to keep Maggs, but only if he would take the deferred money, but after Maggs switched agents, then in the eyes of the Sox he was a goner and there was no reason to further negotiate. I personally don't think Maggs used steroids, but I have no proof. I think he's thinner this year, because he was rehabbing his knee and wasn't able to work out like he used to.

mweflen
04-26-2005, 11:26 AM
Much as I liked him as a player (until last season anyway...) Manos had some pretty bad acne near the end. FWIW.

Mark Buehrle
04-26-2005, 11:43 AM
I actually heard once that Magglio was a suspected steroid user, but tested negative. It wouldn't be that surprising if he was, considering how his numbers took huge leaps throughout his minor-league years.

Frater Perdurabo
04-26-2005, 11:44 AM
Frater, I agree the Twins and A's aren't slugging teams, but steroids also helps with speed and pitching (velocity + recuperation time), that's why I pointed out the Twins and A's as examples.

I think the Twins won with great team ball, while the A's won with great starting pitching. I don't necessarily see that steroids played an instrumental role in either, except for perhaps the A's offense (which, despite what the Beane-heads may say, wasn't a huge part of their success). I think that while steroids may help with pitching velocity and recovery time, they more significantly impact the offensive game, particularly power numbers.

voodoochile
04-26-2005, 12:36 PM
Those teams stunk because they didn't have great pitching. To give you an example, the Sox starting rotation in 1999 was Jamie Navarro, John Snyder, Mike Sirotka, Jim Parque and James Baldwin and the closer was Bob Howry.

My guess is that if the Sox got wind of a player using steroids, he was probably traded. But, the Sox did have Conseco on the team in 2001 and everyone knows he was using.

Doesn't his book also claim that JR actually signed for the steroids at least once?