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View Full Version : "Win....or die trying" White Sox 2005 Slogan


WhiteSoxFan84
03-07-2005, 02:03 PM
I just saw an ad for it on CSN. I like it.

Kuzman
03-07-2005, 02:25 PM
Perhaps Brooks checked out the thread we had when we acquired Jermaine. :D:

SpammySosa
03-07-2005, 04:27 PM
Not to ruffle any feathers,but I think it is lame. Just one opinion though. :wink:

Brian26
03-07-2005, 04:28 PM
I like it...its similar to "Do or Die", my own personal slogan for the 2nd half of 2003.

SoxxoS
03-07-2005, 04:38 PM
That's not a great slogan by any stretch.

ChiWhiteSox1337
03-07-2005, 04:41 PM
Not exactly original, but I still like it. The commercial was what made the slogan great IMO.

JUribe1989
03-07-2005, 04:55 PM
I absolutely love that Shingo commercial!

ChicagoHoosier
03-07-2005, 05:13 PM
I think the slogans in the other thread are better. This is a pretty cool ad, but not sure I'm a fan of the slogan itself.

crazyozzie02
03-07-2005, 05:25 PM
http://chicago.whitesox.mlb.com/NASApp/mlb/news/press_releases/press_release.jsp?ymd=20050307&content_id=959136&vkey=pr_cws&fext=.jsp&c_id=cws

Here is the link. It is an press release from the sox. Anyway like another thread that was started, i saw the Arron Rowand Ad with the "Win--Or die trying" slogan. They said that there is a lot more out there including ones with an airplane being warned about white sox home run balls being hit (wont be too many warings like that) and another one is Shingo. Anyone seen these. Just a thought. Let me know.

SoxxoS
03-07-2005, 05:33 PM
Not that it's a big deal, but the more I think about it, the worse it is. Brooks said he didn't like "Power Thrills...Speed Kills" because of the word "kills." Is "die" any better? Definitely not.

Infallible
03-07-2005, 05:46 PM
I like Homer Simpsons rendition better:

Marge: "Homie stop you're going to kill us all!!"
Homer: "Or Die Trying......"

B M l o t 7
03-07-2005, 05:52 PM
yea i think its pretty lame too

MIgrenade
03-07-2005, 06:00 PM
Yeah it's not good, and I think the reason is I think the "die trying" part really leaves an opening for disappointment. If it were just "Win" I actually think that would be better (perhaps not good, but better). And how is saying "die trying" better than saying "speed kills"? My guess is there's a Spinal Tap mentality happening here because dying happens to us while kill happens to them, but I find it odd.

MUsoxfan
03-07-2005, 06:01 PM
To quote Billy Bob Thornton from Bad Santa: "Well kid, they can't all be winners."

There will be hits and misses with the team's marketing. So far there have been MANY more hits than misses. I don't even really dislike the new slogan. My vote would have been to revive the "Good Guys Wear Black" slogan, which was just fantastic and everyone loved it.

Rocklive99
03-07-2005, 06:07 PM
The commercial is sweet, it has a "Good Guys Wear Black" feel

D. TODD
03-07-2005, 08:11 PM
I don't like it at all. The die trying just leaves way too much open for ridicule if we don't win. Could have been worded mucher better in my opinion.

jenmcm76
03-07-2005, 08:15 PM
I don't like it at all. The die trying just leaves way too much open for ridicule if we don't win. Could have been worded mucher better in my opinion.

Wait - someone who says "mucher better" has an issue with the wording?!?

CPditka
03-07-2005, 08:30 PM
Its bad when the White Sox slogan reminds me of a 50 cent album.


For those of you living under a rock, I am refrencing 50's, 11 million copies sold: "Get Rich or Die Trying"


Grrr, this one is going to bug me.... QUICK SOMEONE E-MAIL BROOKS!!

OG4LIFE
03-07-2005, 08:32 PM
rofl...


i made my troll post, refreshed a minute later and he was banned... that was quick!!

SOXSINCE'70
03-07-2005, 08:56 PM
I like WSI's "Under The Radar" campaign better.

WhiteSoxFan84
03-07-2005, 09:05 PM
Not that it's a big deal, but the more I think about it, the worse it is. Brooks said he didn't like "Power Thrills...Speed Kills" because of the word "kills." Is "die" any better? Definitely not.

I see the difference and to be honest with you, Power Thrills Speed Kills is not a good slogan at all. First of all, it doesn't look good. Second, what if Podsednik, Iguchi, Uribe, Rowand, and all of our speed demons have about 30 SBs combined at the break? Time to drop or change the slogan again (ala IT'S TIME)?

"Win...or die trying" is pretty decent. All we need to complete this idea is 50 Cent to make a song for the White Sox and throw out the first pitch at the Home Opener (for those who don't know, 50 Cents first album is titled, "Get Rich... or Die Trying").

I still like my idea, "New Faces Lead to New (1st) Places" :D:

zach074
03-07-2005, 09:12 PM
I think they are still going to use Sox Pride also. I would have rather seen under the radar but you never know they still may use it.

SoxxoS
03-07-2005, 09:29 PM
I see the difference and to be honest with you, Power Thrills Speed Kills is not a good slogan at all. First of all, it doesn't look good. Second, what if Podsednik, Iguchi, Uribe, Rowand, and all of our speed demons have about 30 SBs combined at the break? Time to drop or change the slogan again (ala IT'S TIME)?


I am not going to get into a slogan war here, but why doesn't it "look good?"

Second, you don't need to have stolen bases to have speed...it's a state of mind and a way of playing baseball.

WhiteSoxFan84
03-07-2005, 10:17 PM
I am not going to get into a slogan war here, but why doesn't it "look good?"

Second, you don't need to have stolen bases to have speed...it's a state of mind and a way of playing baseball.

I don't intend to turn this into a war of any kind, but let me explain myself.

It doesn't LOOK good because it's just..... I don't know how to explain it. It's just not White Sox I guess. I'm used to "The Kids Can Play", "Good Guys Wear Black", etc. "Win... or die trying" is a lot more White Sox than "Power Thrills, Speed Kills". That also goes totally against,the "Chicks Dig The Long Ball" MLB campaign. I can hear the fools at ESPN now mocking us during a losing streak...


:boston
"The White Sox slogan for this year is 'Power Thrills, Speed Kills'. They traded Magglio Ordonez and Carlos Lee and picked up Scott Podsednik and Tadahito Iguchi, exchanging power for speed. How's that working out for the 4th place White Sox?"


Harold Reynolds: "hahah, yeh, I don't know what they were thinking"

:blockhead
"hahaha, I don't know what I'm thinking...."


And about speed being a state of mind and a way of playing baseball, let's be honest with ourselves, Thomas/Konerko/Dye is still a 3-5 that can produce 3 hits (singles) in a row but no runs.

SouthBendSox
03-07-2005, 11:06 PM
big BOOOOOOOOOOOOOOO to that slogan

Brooks, I expect better from an ND grad

Two By Four
03-07-2005, 11:13 PM
Didn't expect everyone to love the slogan at first...and that's the thing with slogans, you'll never have one that everyone loves. And no matter what slogan we do, it all depends on the team...if we win it will be great, if we lose no slogan makes that better.

But what I like about it is that it assumes we are going to win or at the very least we are going to give everything we can to try and win. Sets a nice "bleed for the team" tone. Also makes me think this team is a hell of a lot tougher than that other Chicago team.

What I also love about this slogan, is that it fits the team: tough, hard-nosed, run out every play, advance the runner at all costs, team baseball. And we have some really cool stuff coming soon to support it. Listen for the radio starting next Monday, the voice is the actor that plays "Red Foreman" from the 70s show. In one of the spots he explains the idea behind Win or Die trying. The outdoor will be all over the city and the brand television, which we are shooting soon, will further bring the idea to life in a funny, tough way.

All of the work will eventually be posted at our site (after next week), that's all the print, tv, radio, and outdoor.

indysoxfan
03-07-2005, 11:23 PM
I like it....:smile:

OzzieBall2004
03-08-2005, 01:08 AM
Didn't expect everyone to love the slogan at first...and that's the thing with slogans, you'll never have one that everyone loves. And no matter what slogan we do, it all depends on the team...if we win it will be great, if we lose no slogan makes that better.

But what I like about it is...............

Not to interrupt your personal horn tooting, but I thought the opinions in this thread were generally mixed....You work in the advertising/marketing industry, so I would think you would hold off more than 9 hours before deeming the campaign a huge success.

And don't get me wrong, the design is crisp and the clips are well chosen, but the TV ads are far from perfect. Please allow a few criticisms....

#1: The whole low flying objects theme is clever, but outdated. We've moved away from that, and while this team still has potential to finish in the top 10 or so in homeruns, this spot would have been better used to stress the ideals of this years team; namely, speed, defense, and fundamentally sound baseball.

#2: The "grinders" ad's speak to the base, and I don't see them attracting attention from individuals who wouldn't otherwise consider attending White Sox games.

#3: If the team gets off to a slow start and struggles, the ads will need an overhaul. You can't stress stellar pitching, timely hitting, and big plays when the team isn't making them, and all the ads are.

#4: At least one ad should have been dedicated to the overall experience of attending a White Sox game. Show why it is fun, and why you can have a good time, win or lose. Obviously don't state that in the ad, but remind the audience of all the fun there is to be had by attending a game.
I don't know if these 4 are all you are doing, but it might be nice to get some actual day of game footage once the weather is nice of a packed house, kids playing on the new FUNdamentals deck, kosher dogs on the grill, fans roaming the concourse, fan deck parties, patio parties, bullpen bar, theme nights, etc.....


Don't take this as a slam because it isn't. I think all the print ads have been great except the soxfest one, and I support the job you're doing overall and prefer your work to last seasons campaign. However, much can be done to generate interest from a wider audience, so heres to hoping you achieve that. :gulp:

SoxWillWin
03-08-2005, 01:25 AM
It doesn't LOOK good because it's just..... I don't know how to explain it. It's just not White Sox I guess. I'm used to "The Kids Can Play", "Good Guys Wear Black", etc. .

These slogans you mentioned WERE the white sox. It's quite a different team now, with a different approach to the game. Not saying I completely like it, but it's nice to see someone in the organization put thier a** on the line. We are going to sit here and talk about being ridiculed if we don't win? WHO CARES!!!!!! The sox have been ridiculed for years from almost every media source imagineable. I personally would like to make a bigger deal over things like, When will Frank be ready? Who's going to be our utility infielder? Can Iguchi adapt quickly to major league pitching? I'm not gonna let my head spin in circles over "WIN...or die Trying"

edit: And BTW if this thread happens to reach a hundred posts remind me to slam my head in a car door a thousand times

SomebodyToldMe
03-08-2005, 02:59 AM
Its bad when the White Sox slogan reminds me of a 50 cent album.


For those of you living under a rock, I am refrencing 50's, 11 million copies sold: "Get Rich or Die Trying"


Grrr, this one is going to bug me.... QUICK SOMEONE E-MAIL BROOKS!!

Damn...I didn't even think of that. That's pretty darn funny.

FARMEO
03-08-2005, 05:27 AM
I don't like the new slogan. I don't care for ideas that are not original either, the slogan was probably borrowed from the rap album. Also, everytime I hear the word grinder I get hungry for a sandwich, I don't think about baseball. Of course, the new slogan won't have any impact on whether or not anyone here goes to games.

Spicoli
03-08-2005, 06:59 AM
I think they should just have Ozzie talking in his usual incomprehensible speech, then afterwards have the following caption(s):


"Need a translator? You're obviously not a Sox fan."
"They can try to steal our signs, but they can't break the Ozz's coded language."
"He said: 'There's only one baseball team in this town...on the South Side.'"
"While you were listening to Ozzie, Podesnik stole two bases and is standing on third base looking toward home."
"When you're the manager of a team of international players, you have to speak a universal language: Winning matters."

Any other suggestions?

shbart
03-08-2005, 09:49 AM
I like it Spicoli, but I assuming it's too late to wander from the slogan.
2x4 I think it's great your checking in for feedback. Unfortunately, I have to side with the thumbs down group. The main reason is the message isn't believable.
If the slogan were, "Win or die trying to improve personal stats going into free agency" that might be more accurate. We have nothing that tells us this team of accumulated parts will have a win or die trying attitude. Hopefully it does and maybe it will even promote that a bit, but the first time a player gives up on a ball this season, you've written your own epitaph. When I heard the baseball fans in my office groaning and saying, "gimme a break" when the first spot came on yesterday, I knew that wasn't good. That wasn't the reaction for Sox Pride or Good Guys Wear Black.
My one suggestion would be not to take the slogan too seriously. A spot later in the season with Jermaine Dye saying, "I'm trying, I'm trying" in some funny scenario and then the graphic comes on, but with the i in die changing to the y, might be neat. Good luck 2x4. I will outwardly support the slogan and defend it to all non-Sox fans...but I hope u appreciate the feedback.

Baby Fisk
03-08-2005, 09:53 AM
"Win or die trying." No sir, I don't like it. :mad:

Spicoli's ideas are cool. They reminded me of that Shingo-Konerko commercial from last year. :nod:

CPditka
03-08-2005, 09:57 AM
in honor of the new (gag) slogan I have changed my signature....

Sox-on-TV44
03-08-2005, 10:01 AM
Guess they didn't like my "Speed Racer"-theme idea:D: .
But I think it's a good slogan.The TV Ads gives it much attitude.

SpammySosa
03-08-2005, 12:07 PM
I will outwardly support the slogan and defend it to all non-Sox fans...but I hope u appreciate the feedback.

I will defend the White Sox, but not the slogan.That is akin to sCrUBS fans defending their team as lovable losers(at least they're half right). I will never turn my back on the Sox,but if there is something I disagree with,whether that is Uncle Jerry's spending habits(or lack there of),manager strategy,or the aforementioned new slogan,I will be objective whether I am talking to Sox or non-Sox fans. If I am amongst Sox brethren,my comments might be more candid,but if a sCrUBs fan told me the slogan stinks, I would have to agree with them and then quickly change the subject or give them a laundry list of reasons I don't like their team.:wink:

flo-B-flo
03-08-2005, 12:21 PM
I like WSI's "Under The Radar" campaign better. Whats wrong with this?

Fake Chet Lemon
03-08-2005, 12:49 PM
Put my vote in the mildly lame column. But in the grand scheme of things, who cares? If we win big, it won't matter. If we lose big, it won't matter.

Two By Four
03-08-2005, 03:14 PM
Not to interrupt your personal horn tooting, ... Wasn't horn tooting, the title of my post was meant to be a tongue in cheek bit of sarcasm BECAUSE it has only been one day after the campaign broke. That's why I mentioned that there is a lot more work to be seen and that it will make more sense to everyone as the season progresses...

#1: The whole low flying objects theme is clever, but outdated. We've moved away from that, and while this team still has potential to finish in the top 10 or so in homeruns, this spot would have been better used to stress the ideals of this years team; namely, speed, defense, and fundamentally sound baseball. I agree, but the Sox never want people to think they can't hit for power (even though the makeup of the team indicates otherwise). The point is, this is just one spot of about 20 we're doing. We needed a hitting spot and because of all of the power footage from last year, it made sense to make one of the first ones the hitting spot.

#2: The "grinders" ad's speak to the base, and I don't see them attracting attention from individuals who wouldn't otherwise consider attending White Sox games. That's why you don't see the word GRINDER in the TV ads. We are only using that in outdoor and lightly in radio. But we will always market to our core fan. The Sox core fan IS one of the most defining differences between the Sox and the Cubs. Most of our fans know a hell of a lot more about baseball and the way it should be played. We want new fans to know that is what is expected of them when they become loyalist.

#3: If the team gets off to a slow start and struggles, the ads will need an overhaul. No kidding. But that would be true of just about any campaign. The only campaigns that aren't affected by losing are ones like the Bulls, "Through thick or Thin." And for my money, that's about the most unmotivating thing a team can do. I prefer to say right up front that the bar is set pretty high and we are demanding wins. If that doesn't happen then we will change course.

#4: At least one ad should have been dedicated to the overall experience of attending a White Sox game. Like I said, there is a ton of other stuff coming. Next week the radio covers everything from further explaining the "Win or Die Trying" mantra to Elvis Night to the new Fundamental area for kids to the New Scout seats to eating too many hot dogs to why Sox fans don't throw the opposing team's home runs back onto the field (an idea I got from one of the WSI regulars).


Don't take this as a slam because it isn't. If you have followed my posts, you should know that I never take criticism as a slam. As a matter of fact that is exactly why I am here. We want to portray the best of what makes the Sox great. Part of that is the opinions of the hard core fans here. Part of that is the many hours we have spent researching the attitudes of the organization, the players themselves, and Chicagoans in general. And part of it is just putting yourself out there and trying to cut through the crap with an idea people can get excited about. That's what the "Win or Die Tryin" theme is intended to do.

I have heard a lot of people trying to sell the "Under the Radar" theme. But for me that is almost apologetic, like people shouldn't be concerned about the Sox. I think, win or lose, going to a Sox game is one of the most entertaining things you can do in this city. Why would I want to under sell that? I want people to think that we will do whatever it takes to entertain and delight them. And committment to winning is the first step.

You made a lot of good points. And I appreciate that. But please appreciate that I am here to understand what you guys need (or think you need). So, no , I don't EVER take offense.

(The work is still BRILLIANT though! See, sarcasm is hard to convey in a post.)

maurice
03-08-2005, 03:40 PM
(The work is still BRILLIANT though! See, sarcasm is hard to convey in a post.)

Actually, it's really easy here:
:tealtutor:

For example: you suck, because you didn't plug WSI in your Sun-Times quote.

mjharrison72
03-08-2005, 03:46 PM
You made a lot of good points. And I appreciate that. But please appreciate that I am here to understand what you guys need (or think you need). So, no , I don't EVER take offense.

(The work is still BRILLIANT though! See, sarcasm is hard to convey in a post.)
Thanks, 2x4... we really appreciate that you come here to bounce ideas off us, and I have to say aside from the obvious 50 Cent reference, I think the slogan captures what this team is going to go through to get the job done. Also, saw the Shingo "Knowing what pitch is coming is one thing... hitting it is another thing" ad, and think it's brilliant. And to the people who think the ads will ahve to change mid-season if we're 0-81 at the Break, there will always be some good highlights to base future ads on... these guys ARE amazing ballplayers, win or lose.
And for the record, 2x4, we use teal to denote sarcasm. It's accessed in the following way:
:tealtutor:
EDIT: Beat me to it, Maurice!

Ol' No. 2
03-08-2005, 04:11 PM
Like I said, there is a ton of other stuff coming. Next week the radio covers everything from further explaining the "Win or Die Trying" mantra to Elvis Night to the new Fundamental area for kids to the New Scout seats to eating too many hot dogs to why Sox fans don't throw the opposing team's home runs back onto the field (an idea I got from one of the WSI regulars).No churros?

oeo
03-08-2005, 04:14 PM
I don't really like it...personally I think it is lame as well. I love Power Thrills - Speed Kills, but you can't use "kills" but can use "die".

oeo
03-08-2005, 04:16 PM
I like it...its similar to "Do or Die", my own personal slogan for the 2nd half of 2003.

"Do or Die" is definately better than "Win...or die trying."

BTW, how was the commercial?

StillMissOzzie
03-08-2005, 04:18 PM
I have heard a lot of people trying to sell the "Under the Radar" theme. But for me that is almost apologetic, like people shouldn't be concerned about the Sox. I think, win or lose, going to a Sox game is one of the most entertaining things you can do in this city. Why would I want to under sell that? I want people to think that we will do whatever it takes to entertain and delight them. And committment to winning is the first step.

2x4,
I see that others have shown you the arduous process of sarcasm here. I would agree with you that the "Under the Radar" theme comes across as apologetic, but how about flipping it around? That is, if this team surges to the top of the AL Central, you could have some ads/commercials saying, "Are we on your radar screen NOW?" or just "On YOUR radar yet?"

SMO
:gulp:

Two By Four
03-14-2005, 04:42 PM
2x4,
I see that others have shown you the arduous process of sarcasm here. I would agree with you that the "Under the Radar" theme comes across as apologetic, but how about flipping it around? That is, if this team surges to the top of the AL Central, you could have some ads/commercials saying, "Are we on your radar screen NOW?" or just "On YOUR radar yet?"

SMO
:gulp:

Okay, yes, now that gives me an idea...I still don't like it as an overall tagline, but as a stand alone concept it could work. I'm gonna think about a TV spot for the radar thing...I'll let ya know what comes about. Of course, I will have to take all the credit!

paciorek1983
03-14-2005, 10:30 PM
I for one, like the slogan. As for "Good Guys Wear Black", that was fine back then, but honestly, I wish we'd get rid of black as the dominant color anyway. As for the 50 Cent reference, so what, I could care less about that crappy music. I can't wait for the (c)rapper era to end. What a bunch of junk.

Two By Four, you're doin fine.:smile:

SOX ADDICT '73
03-14-2005, 11:01 PM
I like the slogan. It tells us that these guys, unlike their neighbors to the north, aren't going to be satisfied with a loss, just as long as there are hot chicks in the stands. They're going to go balls-out, smash into the wall, break up the double play, get in the other team's face, and win at all costs. And for those who would say "We don't know a lot of these guys. How do we know they're going to play this way?", I'd say Willie Harris's comments from the last week (about breaking up the DP and generally playing tough) suggest that Ozzie is getting his message across to the players: "Get with the program or find a new team."