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View Full Version : Gammons has some news on Contraction


Jerry_Manuel
10-27-2001, 06:37 PM
(It's Gammons so believe what you want)
Here is the big part of the story:
There are sources on both sides that insist contraction is a negotiable item. And that for an increased players share of the World Cup and international dollars, an increase in rosters to 27, a shorter spring training and other chips, it can happen.

So, the industry talk right now is that MLB is wary of the Florida attorney general's office. So Montreal would disband and owner Jeff Loria would get the Marlins and try to save them, with the possibility of moving them to Northern Virginia, while Marlins owner John Henry would buy the Angels from Disney.

Then, Carl Pohlad would sell the Twins to his fellow owners, who would disband the first American League team ever to draw 3 million fans.

(Gammons even does a mock draft)

Here is the full article (http://msn.espn.go.com/gammons/s/2001/1026/1269577.html)

LongDistanceFan
10-27-2001, 08:03 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel
(It's Gammons so believe what you want)
Here is the big part of the story:
There are sources on both sides that insist contraction is a negotiable item. And that for an increased players share of the World Cup and international dollars, an increase in rosters to 27, a shorter spring training and other chips, it can happen.

So, the industry talk right now is that MLB is wary of the Florida attorney general's office. So Montreal would disband and owner Jeff Loria would get the Marlins and try to save them, with the possibility of moving them to Northern Virginia, while Marlins owner John Henry would buy the Angels from Disney.

Then, Carl Pohlad would sell the Twins to his fellow owners, who would disband the first American League team ever to draw 3 million fans.

(Gammons even does a mock draft)

Here is the full article (http://msn.espn.go.com/gammons/s/2001/1026/1269577.html) damn, i can see a-lot of possibities out there.

dougs78
10-27-2001, 08:28 PM
i thought the mock draft was interesting. Understanding its just for fun, I liked the ideas thrown about. Although if that does come to fruition it will sort of piss me off that the sox did manage to run off some wins. I believe he had us around 15th in the draft, I'm sure those prospects he talks about are good, but man to move up about 6 slots and get Vidro sounds a heck of alot better. You would hope that they would use more than 1 year to arrange that sort of draft. Then not only would the pirates get Vlad, but also get the first pick in the amateur draft, as well as the first pick in this draft for the minor leaguers of the two folded teams. That is like a 3 for 1 deal with far-reaching consequences based on one good or bad season.

Jerry_Manuel
10-27-2001, 08:30 PM
I agree I think it is bad to do the draft by records which is just rewarding teams for playing poorly. I'm not sure of another fair way to do it though.

Jerry_Manuel
10-27-2001, 08:35 PM
I found this interesting:
"The great thing about something like this is that a team like the Pirates, Devil Rays or Royals could take a top player and turn him into three or four really good players," says another AL GM. "Pittsburgh would have the first pick. Can you imagine what Dave Littlefield could get for Vladimir Guerrero? Or what someone could get for Javier Vazquez? If you're a fan, this could be a blast and create a lot of excitement and interest."

Yeah I'm sure it's going to be real exciting for the fans in Minnesota when their team is taken away.

danman31
10-27-2001, 09:13 PM
Originally posted by dougs78
You would hope that they would use more than 1 year to arrange that sort of draft. Then not only would the pirates get Vlad, but also get the first pick in the amateur draft, as well as the first pick in this draft for the minor leaguers of the two folded teams. That is like a 3 for 1 deal with far-reaching consequences based on one good or bad season.

Here's my proposal for the despersal draft. First we have the amateur draft as normal with the 28 teams, it's too early to have a sure fire bet in the draft so I don't see a major problem there. Then for the 40 man drafts the Pirates pick 1st, and it will be a snake draft(the picks will reverse, so Pitt gets the 1st pick in round 1, and the last pick in round 2). Then, a AAA draft will occur with Pittsburgh and Tampa Bay getting the last 2 picks and every other team moving up 2 picks. AA draft same thing, Cincinnati and Baltimore fall to the bottom, every other team moves up 2 picks. A draft same again, KC and Milwaukee fall to the bottom, every other team moves up 2. This helps weaken the advantage of having a horrible record for teams like Pittsburgh and Tampa Bay. We all know the difference between the #1 and the rest in each system is enormous. With 2 teams, 2 picks. It's out there, and it may not work, but what do you guys think?

dougs78
10-27-2001, 10:03 PM
With 2 teams, 2 picks. It's out there, and it may not work, but what do you guys think?

I think this is as good a solution as I have heard yet, but i think it would be too hard separating these players by AAA, AA, A. Most players move up or down during the season and some end up on the 40 man roster anyway. I think to make a slight modification to your suggestion I would do it as follows:

1. amatuer draft: same as usual

2. 40 man roster dispersal: in ascending order of wins in the past season but with the snake feature that you discussed (a lesson learned in fantasy sports, perhaps???)

3: Minor league dispersal: A draft based on descending order of last season's win total. (so the mariners had the first pick) This would actually make some sense to me as it would reward the worst teams with major-league ready players while helping teams with strong major league clubs already maintain some of the advantage they have gained by stocking their farm system.

How does that sound?

Daver
10-27-2001, 10:19 PM
I'll beleive any of this when I see it.
Baseball is about to be attacked by Lawyers and courts from all sides as soon as they try and pull this off.

I can hear Bud "the spineless wonder"Selig on the phone right now- "Send lawyers,guns,and money,the ***** has hit the fan"

danman31
10-27-2001, 10:24 PM
Originally posted by dougs78


I think this is as good a solution as I have heard yet, but i think it would be too hard separating these players by AAA, AA, A. Most players move up or down during the season and some end up on the 40 man roster anyway. I think to make a slight modification to your suggestion I would do it as follows:

1. amatuer draft: same as usual

2. 40 man roster dispersal: in ascending order of wins in the past season but with the snake feature that you discussed (a lesson learned in fantasy sports, perhaps???)

3: Minor league dispersal: A draft based on descending order of last season's win total. (so the mariners had the first pick) This would actually make some sense to me as it would reward the worst teams with major-league ready players while helping teams with strong major league clubs already maintain some of the advantage they have gained by stocking their farm system.

How does that sound?

Fantasy is the 1st time I had heard of a snake draft, so you are right. Here is a slight modification to what you did. The minor league dispersal could be done by experience in the minors. 2 different drafts.

1. For the 40 man dispersal keep it the same as previously mentioned.

2. 3 years of experience or less in the minors would then be picked with the top 14(or top half) in the 40 man draft would be moved to the bottom. So 15, 16, 17(the Sox) would be the top 3 picks here.

3. Players with more than 3 years of minor league experience. These are more or less the garbage players. Some will be good, but not many from only 2 systems. This will be like the 40 man draft, the same order.

czalgosz
10-28-2001, 12:11 AM
If, and I do mean if this happens, the MLBPA will scream about it. Legal precedent in labor law shows that labor cannot stop management from closing/moving places of work. If they could, there'd be a hell of a lot more auto workers in Detroit right now.

What I could see happening, though, is the MLBPA successfully arguing that all players on dismantled teams should become free agents. Either way, though, the Players' union will be screwed - Either way, they lose 80 jobs, and either the players on dismantled teams have no say on where they end up, or there's a huge influx of free agents, which drives down market prices. (I don't see a roster expansion to 27, most teams have 2 or 3 guys rotting on the bench as it is.)

A dispersal draft would be fun for most fans, but it's unlikely. The most likely scenario is that Selig agrees to drop the issue, and the MLBPA makes some concessions somewhere else.

Thank god they're not talking about getting rid of the White Sox, is all I have to say... I don't want to go through what I went through in the mid-'80s, when they were talking about moving the Sox to St. Pete.

LongDistanceFan
10-28-2001, 03:22 AM
Originally posted by czalgosz
If, and I do mean if this happens, the MLBPA will scream about it. Legal precedent in labor law shows that labor cannot stop management from closing/moving places of work. If they could, there'd be a hell of a lot more auto workers in Detroit right now.

What I could see happening, though, is the MLBPA successfully arguing that all players on dismantled teams should become free agents. Either way, though, the Players' union will be screwed - Either way, they lose 80 jobs, and either the players on dismantled teams have no say on where they end up, or there's a huge influx of free agents, which drives down market prices. (I don't see a roster expansion to 27, most teams have 2 or 3 guys rotting on the bench as it is.)

A dispersal draft would be fun for most fans, but it's unlikely. The most likely scenario is that Selig agrees to drop the issue, and the MLBPA makes some concessions somewhere else.

Thank god they're not talking about getting rid of the White Sox, is all I have to say... I don't want to go through what I went through in the mid-'80s, when they were talking about moving the Sox to St. Pete. i agree with you about the sox moving........ i would really hate to cheer the sCrubs, speaking of which, anything new on their threat and about them moving.

Jerry_Manuel
10-28-2001, 09:37 AM
Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
anything new on their threat and about them moving.

Yeah I think they crapped in their pants when Daley told them to go ahead and move.

czalgosz
10-28-2001, 09:43 AM
Yeah I think they crapped in their pants when Daley told them to go ahead and move.

That "threat" to move out of Wrigley was about the stupidest thing that the Cubs ever did. The City knows that tourists come to Wrigley to see Wrigley, not to see the Cubs. They could move the Kane County Cougars into Wrigley field and they'd draw 20,000.

The Trib. Corp. has no leverage here.

Paulwny
10-28-2001, 10:20 AM
Originally posted by czalgosz
The most likely scenario is that Selig agrees to drop the issue, and the MLBPA makes some concessions somewhere else.




This is exactly what will happen.

LongDistanceFan
10-28-2001, 03:48 PM
Originally posted by czalgosz


That "threat" to move out of Wrigley was about the stupidest thing that the Cubs ever did. The City knows that tourists come to Wrigley to see Wrigley, not to see the Cubs. They could move the Kane County Cougars into Wrigley field and they'd draw 20,000.

The Trib. Corp. has no leverage here. in chi, did they get a black-eye as i hoped they will........ or is the press just dropped it.

Jerry_Manuel
10-28-2001, 03:52 PM
Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
in chi, did they get a black-eye as i hoped they will........ or is the press just dropped it.

There hasn't been much talk about it.

LongDistanceFan
10-28-2001, 03:55 PM
Originally posted by Jerry_Manuel


There hasn't been much talk about it. figures....... it would be a different story if it was the sox who said that.

FarWestChicago
10-28-2001, 03:59 PM
Originally posted by LongDistanceFan
figures....... it would be a different story if it was the sox who said that.

:moron

You got that right!! I would be all over the Smut Sox.