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View Full Version : Retire Franks #?


mike squires
02-04-2005, 09:33 AM
This maybe should have been "stupid question #12 because many of you will say it is obvious. Based on what he's done up until now will the Sox retire Franks #?

And if Maggs stuck around for the majority of his career and continued to go on the pace he was going...would the Sox have retired Maggs???

I think it's going to be pretty rare for any team to retire a # due to the way the game is today. (free agency, frequent trades etc...)

Will the Cubs retire Sosa's despite the way he went out?

DaveIsHere
02-04-2005, 09:36 AM
No doubt, Frank will be the last to wear #35 in a whitesox uniform

voodoochile
02-04-2005, 09:36 AM
No way the flubbies retire ShamME*, IMO, but it would certainly be worthy of the spin they enjoy so much.

If Frank finishes his career with the Sox, I don't see how they can't retire his number. Even if he just plays a few years elsewhere, I think they will anyway.

mantis1212
02-04-2005, 09:36 AM
#35 is retired, most definitely, no question about it. Maggs might have been retired if he stuck around for another 8 years or something. Another number I can see getting retired eventually is Buerhle's, I can see him having a long career with the Sox.

jake27
02-04-2005, 09:37 AM
I think the White Sox will retire Franks # for sure. As for Mags, I don't know, even if he was with the Sox still, it would depend how he came back after his injury. The Cubs will retire Sosa's # too for sure

Uncle_Patrick
02-04-2005, 09:37 AM
I think that the Sox should definitely retire Frank's #. Maggs...its hard to say if it would have happened if he stayed with the Sox. Its not happening now.

The Cubs hardly retire any numbers. I can't see them retiring Sammy's now, although, with the Sham-me love fest that is going on now that he's gone, that could change. But hey, they haven't even retired Sandberg's number, and I'd see that happening first.

Baby Fisk
02-04-2005, 09:41 AM
Frank = no brainer

Ordoņez = not for the Sox anyway

Sosa = this is literally a "no brainer": I give it one year after he retires and he'll be the god of wrigley again and the drooling masses will eat it up. "Of course we love Sammy! We always loved Sammy! He was the Mr. Cub of our generation!"

jshanahanjr
02-04-2005, 09:42 AM
Frank 100% yes!
Maggs probably if he stayed on the same pace and with the Sox.
PK has good chance if he can stays with the Sox for another 6 years and hit 400 homers on the Southside.
Buehrle is another guy with a chance, and he wears a rare #.

If I bet on it though, I would just go with Frank.

Over By There
02-04-2005, 10:17 AM
Frank for sure. No point wondering about Maggs.

As for Sosa, I think a few years down the road, as people naturally start to forget the bad stuff, the scrubs will retire his jersey. Unless something egregious comes out about the 'roids, his numbers will be too huge to ignore.

mike squires
02-04-2005, 10:34 AM
#35 is retired, most definitely, no question about it. Maggs might have been retired if he stuck around for another 8 years or something. Another number I can see getting retired eventually is Buerhle's, I can see him having a long career with the Sox.

I wish I could agree with you about Buerhle but I can see him eventually moving on to St. Louis. I'm surprised he extended his contract to stay with the Sox. But, I hope you're right!

Gosox1917
02-04-2005, 11:34 AM
There is no doubt Frank will have his number retired, IMO. It will definately happen once he gets his 500th homerun in a couple of years.:smile: As for Maggs, his number will be passed on to many more players, unless for some reason he returns in a few years and is able to put up big numbers again, but I don't see that happening.

Soso's number won't be retired any time soon, but wait about 20 or 30 years and it will happen. Seems the way they went about retiring Santo's number after they traded him.

HITMEN OF 77
02-04-2005, 11:37 AM
Frank 100% yes!
Maggs probably if he stayed on the same pace and with the Sox.
PK has good chance if he can stays with the Sox for another 6 years and hit 400 homers on the Southside.
Buehrle is another guy with a chance, and he wears a rare #.

If I bet on it though, I would just go with Frank.

Frank is 100% for sure.

Maggs, not as Sox player.

I'd love to see PK play the rest of his career with the Sox more than anyone and have them retire is #. One problem with that though. Another great Sox hitter wore #14 as well and a lot of people feel it should be retired under his name, Bill Melton.

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 11:42 AM
Frank's number will be retired. The only question is when. If the Sox really wanted to make a statement about how much they appreciate Frank and what he has done, they should retire the number while he is still playing. I've always thought it was interesting whenever an athlete knew that once his career was over, no other player playing for his team would wear his number again.

Another player whom I think should have his number retired is Robin Ventura. He was Frank's right-hand man on the South Side for a number of years, and I always thought he symbolized the way someone wearing a Sox uniform should play.

I don't see Maggs' number being retired at any point. He had a good career with the Sox, but the way he left this organization is going to resonate with the ownership for several years, and the sting of his betrayal may never go away completely.

tacosalbarojas
02-04-2005, 12:21 PM
I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the chances of the SOX retiring #30 for Magglio. Let's remember this is the same organization that retired #3 after trading Harold (granted JR had a lot more love for HB than he does for Maggs). But...the guy is the number four HR hitter in the organization's history and put up big, big numbers for the length of his stay here. I say it's a better chance than some on this thread have suggested. And time has a way of healing the temporary wounds and bad feelings caused by a departure like Maggs'.

HITMEN OF 77
02-04-2005, 12:38 PM
I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss the chances of the SOX retiring #30 for Magglio. Let's remember this is the same organization that retired #3 after trading Harold (granted JR had a lot more love for HB than he does for Maggs). But...the guy is the number four HR hitter in the organization's history and put up big, big numbers for the length of his stay here. I say it's a better chance than some on this thread have suggested. And time has a way of healing the temporary wounds and bad feelings caused by a departure like Maggs'.

Baines also played 13 season for the Sox compared to Maggs 6 or 7.

JKryl
02-04-2005, 12:47 PM
Let's wait a couple of years after Frank retires for everyone to sober up. His number may get retired, but Magglio's certainly shouldn't. Just playing for a team for a certain number of years shouldn't be a qualifier for retirement.

Baby Fisk
02-04-2005, 01:02 PM
Just playing for a team for a certain number of years shouldn't be a qualifier for retirement.
No kidding. Some teams can't even use that as a reason.

Wade Boggs: played 2 seasons (213 games) for Tampa Bay, and they retired his number. :rolleyes:

tacosalbarojas
02-04-2005, 01:04 PM
Baines also played 13 season for the Sox compared to Maggs 6 or 7. You know, I don't know how many guys the SOX have had that have played 1000 games in their career for us with a batting average of over .300, but I'll bet it's a pretty short list. I'll bet it gets even shorter when you throw in a qualifier that you should be in the top five all-time home runs in SOX history. Either way, I bet it's a long time before the SOX give the number out just considering the possibility. I loved Robin too, but Maggs was a much better hitter for us.

wilburaga
02-04-2005, 01:48 PM
I would love to see JR make the following announcement tomorrow.

'It's impossible to see into the future and know with certainty what the relationship between a particular player and team will be. But one thing I can say right now with absolute certainty - no player besides Frank Thomas will ever again wear # 35 for the Chicago White Sox.'

As per Maggs, the fact that he bolted the organization at the first opportunity I think precludes a retirement ceremony for # 30. The only way I can see it happening is if he were not to play again.

Tangentially, I still remember steaming every time I saw a post-Butkus # 51 on the field for the Bears. That was outrageous. (Morrissey?)

W

HITMEN OF 77
02-04-2005, 01:48 PM
You know, I don't know how many guys the SOX have had that have played 1000 games in their career for us with a batting average of over .300, but I'll bet it's a pretty short list. I'll bet it gets even shorter when you throw in a qualifier that you should be in the top five all-time home runs in SOX history. Either way, I bet it's a long time before the SOX give the number out just considering the possibility. I loved Robin too, but Maggs was a much better hitter for us.

Robin's # will be retired before Maggs would ever be.

I want Mags back
02-04-2005, 01:57 PM
I think theyll name the street after him.

Thomas 35 street

can u imagine it

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 02:56 PM
I think theyll name the street after him.

Thomas 35 street

can u imagine it

That's not a bad idea. The 'Cell is located at 35th and Shields. Changing it to "Frank Thomas and Shields" sounds about right.

nccwsfan
02-04-2005, 03:14 PM
#35 WILL be retired- no doubt about it! He is the most prolific hitter in White Sox history, he holds several of the key team records, and he is a future HOF.


#35

Never to be worn by another White Sox player again

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 03:19 PM
Taking this a step further, does anyone here think that Frank deserves a statue? He's not Michael Jordan, but he is the face the Chicago White Sox. I'd like to see a combined statue of Frank Thomas, Nellie Fox, and Carlton Fisk.

PAPChiSox729
02-04-2005, 03:28 PM
Frank's number 35 is going to be retired. No doubt about it.

Baby Fisk
02-04-2005, 03:29 PM
I'd like to see a combined statue of Frank Thomas, Nellie Fox, and Carlton Fisk.
Too bad Salvador Dali is dead. Would that statue include some melting baseball bats? :cool:

Jjav829
02-04-2005, 03:37 PM
I think it's pretty obvious that Frank's number will be retired. Magglio's may have been if he stayed healthy and a White Sox, but that's over now.

The Cubs are definitely going to retire Sammy's number, too.

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 03:44 PM
I think it's pretty obvious that Frank's number will be retired. Magglio's may have been if he stayed healthy and a White Sox, but that's over now.

The Cubs are definitely going to retire Sammy's number, too.

Just out of curiosity, are the Bulls going to retire Kirk's number? Had to ask.

Jjav829
02-04-2005, 03:50 PM
Just out of curiosity, are the Bulls going to retire Kirk's number? Had to ask.

They better! :D:

Who knows, I certainly hope Kirk has a long and illustrious career and makes the Bulls retire his number.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-04-2005, 03:53 PM
Magglio's may have been if he stayed healthy and a White Sox, but that's over now.

Magglio really blew it by lashing out. It was just bad luck to wind up on the DL, a calculated risk Magglio was taking by not accepting the offer the Sox made him last spring. He rolled the dice looking for even bigger money and it came up snake eyes. Sucks to be him.

Ripping the Sox and then alienating Sox Fans by playing footsie with the Flubs seals his fate. Magglio won't ever play on the South Side again unless he is a broken down and washed up has-been. Whether that happens sooner or later or never at all, there is no way #30 gets retired for that crybaby.

Jjav829
02-04-2005, 03:58 PM
Magglio really blew it by lashing out. It was just bad luck to wind up on the DL, a calculated risk Magglio was taking by not accepting the offer the Sox made him last spring. He rolled the dice looking for even bigger money and it came up snake eyes. Sucks to be him.

Ripping the Sox and then alienating Sox Fans by playing footsie with the Flubs seals his fate. Magglio won't ever play on the South Side again unless he is a broken down and washed up has-been. Whether that happens sooner or later or never at all, there is no way #30 gets retired for that crybaby.

I don't think he did enough to deserve getting his number retired. That is why I said he needed to stay healthy and re-sign with the Sox. I think he still needed to put up some more years like he was putting up to have a chance.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-04-2005, 04:02 PM
I don't think he did enough to deserve getting his number retired. That is why I said he needed to stay healthy and re-sign with the Sox. I think he still needed to put up some more years like he was putting up to have a chance.

I agree. In fact I would think Magglio could still have gotten his number retired if he put up some more good numbers with another team and then came back to the Sox, either in trade or via free agency, later in his career.

Instead he lashed out. That's why #30 won't be retired for that crybaby. He definitely doesn't deserve the honor any longer no matter what happens.

santo=dorf
02-04-2005, 04:09 PM
Taking this a step further, does anyone here think that Frank deserves a statue? He's not Michael Jordan, but he is the face the Chicago White Sox. I'd like to see a combined statue of Frank Thomas, Nellie Fox, and Carlton Fisk.

Play Frank at first and you'll have your Frank Thomas statue. :D:

Seriously, I think they will give him a statue the year he plans on retiring.

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 04:15 PM
Play Frank at first and you'll have your Frank Thomas statue. :D:

Seriously, I think they will give him a statue the year he plans on retiring.

The only negative about the Frank statue is that some stupid Cubs fan will probably vandalize it.

santo=dorf
02-04-2005, 04:24 PM
The only negative about the Frank statue is that some stupid Cubs fan will probably vandalize it.

I was thinking Frank's statue would go on the concourse. In fact, they should put it where he that homer he hit off of Johan Santana landed.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-04-2005, 04:27 PM
The only negative about the Frank statue is that some stupid Cubs fan will probably vandalize it.

I'm sure all the statues are inside the ballpark precisely to prevent this sort of thing from happening.

Milwaukee had the right idea when they tore down old County Stadium for new Miller Field. They turned the old diamond into a little league park. All the nostalgia resides right there where Aaron, Spahn and Mathews played. The site is fenced and secured so vandalism isn't a major concern.

Meanwhile the Sox had no clue. They paved over the whole ballpark. Yeah because parking your car on top of Ted Lyons' pitching mound or Luke Appling's shortstop position was just sooooo important to the new ballpark.

Idiots... absolute idiots.
:mad:

misty60481
02-04-2005, 04:30 PM
Be nice if they retired his # now while he is still playing--didnt they retire Baines before he retired--Make it Frank Thomas day on a Sunday---also what about retiring Ventura his nos. werent to far off Baines plus he was golden-glove fielder---

mantis1212
02-04-2005, 04:48 PM
I was thinking Frank's statue would go on the concourse. In fact, they should put it where he that homer he hit off of Johan Santana landed.

I would love to see the statue of Big Hurt halfway through his swing, with his back foot completely off the ground. That would be classic...

jortafan
02-04-2005, 04:52 PM
That's not a bad idea. The 'Cell is located at 35th and Shields. Changing it to "Frank Thomas and Shields" sounds about right.

Don't forget that Shields already contains the honorary name of "Bill Veeck Drive."

So actually, we'd be talking about the corner of Thomas and Veeck.

RKMeibalane
02-04-2005, 04:54 PM
I would love to see the statue of Big Hurt halfway through his swing, with his back foot completely off the ground. That would be classic...

You mean like this?

http://sportsillustrated.cnn.com/fantasy/baseball/news/2003/08/07/grey_matter/t1_thomas_ap.jpg

zach074
02-04-2005, 05:23 PM
You cant retire it untill hes done playing! Wait a few years and then talk about this again.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-04-2005, 05:27 PM
You cant retire it untill hes done playing! Wait a few years and then talk about this again.

:harold
"Whatchoo talkin' bout, Zach?"

jerry myers
02-04-2005, 05:43 PM
Frank is white sox 100% Thank you Frank for years past and years to come! May god bless you. retire his number without a doubt. Hopefull he can get a world championship in Chicago. Also Frank is steriod free. Standing ovation are due him for years of faithfulness.Do I HERE A AMEN!

zach074
02-04-2005, 06:41 PM
:harold
"Whatchoo talkin' bout, Zach?"

Ok so I was wrong, thats not that uncommon.:redneck

SpammySosa
02-04-2005, 09:50 PM
But hey, they haven't even retired Sandberg's number, and I'd see that happening first.

They are this season.

SpammySosa
02-04-2005, 09:55 PM
No kidding. Some teams can't even use that as a reason.

Wade Boggs: played 2 seasons (213 games) for Tampa Bay, and they retired his number. :rolleyes:

:ralomar:
"So I have a chance!"

StillMissOzzie
02-04-2005, 10:45 PM
I've got a way to kill two birds with one stone:

1) Have a Frank Thomas Day where the Sox announce that Frank will be the last White Sox player to wear #35

2) Have that day on one of the days that the Orioles are in town in May.

Coincidence? Hardly.
I don't have Brook's e-mail address handy, but give me credit for the idea if you send it off to him and he likes it.

SMO
:gulp:

PS
Harold came and went 2 or 3 times and his number is still retired. However, Robin played more years for other teams than he did for the Sox, so I don't think that's gonna happen.

owensmouth
02-05-2005, 12:43 AM
Since this will be Frank's last season as a member of the White Sox, I am all for retiring his number. No one player has done what he's done as a member of this team.

However, KW will be announcing in early November that the White Sox have bought out Franks's option to save the team seven million dollars nest year.

Nellie_Fox
02-05-2005, 12:57 AM
Since this will be Frank's last season as a member of the White Sox, I am all for retiring his number. No one player has done what he's done as a member of this team.

However, KW will be announcing in early November that the White Sox have bought out Franks's option to save the team seven million dollars nest year.Don't you think that might depend on what kind of year Frank has?

fquaye149
02-05-2005, 05:35 AM
Magglio really blew it by lashing out. It was just bad luck to wind up on the DL, a calculated risk Magglio was taking by not accepting the offer the Sox made him last spring. He rolled the dice looking for even bigger money and it came up snake eyes. Sucks to be him.

Ripping the Sox and then alienating Sox Fans by playing footsie with the Flubs seals his fate. Magglio won't ever play on the South Side again unless he is a broken down and washed up has-been. Whether that happens sooner or later or never at all, there is no way #30 gets retired for that crybaby.

what a slut!!!

Deadguy
02-05-2005, 09:13 AM
Don't you think that might depend on what kind of year Frank has?

Considering the Sox weren't going to pay Thomas 8 million after his 2003 campaign, there is very little doubt that they won't pay Thomas 10 million in 2006, when he will be 38. Thomas will be playing in an injury shortened season, and is unlikely to approach the overall numbers from that season, and the Sox will buy out Thomas at 3.5 million. THe only thing that might change this is if Thomas is instrumental in leading the Sox to the World Series, or at least deep into the playoffs. Anything short of that, this will be Thomas' last season as a White Sox.

Frank has mentioned before that Camden Yards is his favorite place to play on the road, so I wouldn't be surprised if he ends up there in 2006. I was surprised that he didn't end up there after the DSC was invoked. He is also very good friends with Sammy.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-05-2005, 09:25 AM
Considering the Sox weren't going to pay Thomas 8 million after his 2003 campaign, there is very little doubt that they won't pay Thomas 10 million in 2006, when he will be 38. Thomas will be playing in an injury shortened season, and is unlikely to approach the overall numbers from that season, and the Sox will buy out Thomas at 3.5 million.

The circular logic is fascinating. So the Sox are going to flush away $3.5 million for absolutely nothing except the great opportunity to get rid of Frank Thomas, the greatest hitter in franchise history?

Contracts are written and renegotiated precisely to address the sort of small-minded nonsense that apparently you believe makes the world go around.

:kukoo:

If the Sox want Frank back they can get him back. Furthermore they would be idiots not to want him back, especially now that our line up has been neutered.

Deadguy
02-05-2005, 09:43 AM
The circular logic is fascinating. So the Sox are going to flush away $3.5 million for absolutely nothing except the great opportunity to get rid of Frank Thomas, the greatest hitter in franchise history?

Contracts are written and renegotiated precisely to address the sort of small-minded nonsense that apparently you believe makes the world go around.



True, but on the flip side of this, Thomas isn't going to throw away 3.5 million dollars.

He can sign a one year deal elsewhere at 5 million, and end up making 8.5 million in 2006.

The Sox would have to restructure his contract in a way that guarantees Thomas some money in 2007 and possibly 2008.

Thomas gave up 19.5 million dollars in deferred future payments when signing the current contract that was offered to him during the 2002 offseason, when taking into consideration the guaranteed money involved in the contract. Thomas' need for money upfront outweighed the importance of receiving longterm deferral payments, and the Sox obliged to appease a fallen slugger, to tidy up a rather messy situation, and to save themselves some money in the process.

The situation is abit different now, since neither side is tied down by a contract that forces both sides to negotiate since they are forced to coexist for a future 3 or 4 years. Frank and JR aren't as close as they once were, as a result of the incident during ST of 2001, and Thomas no longer lives in the city of Chicago, so there is really no sentimental need on either side for Frank to remain on the SS. This is quite different from the sentiment that Barry feels for the city of Cincinatti and the Reds, since Barry grew up in Cincinatti, and can't imagine playing elsewhere. It was just a twist of fate that landed Frank in Chicago, and I don't foresee Thomas playing for the White Sox in 2006.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-05-2005, 10:05 AM
True, but on the flip side of this, Thomas isn't going to throw away 3.5 million dollars.

He can sign a one year deal elsewhere at 5 million, and end up making 8.5 million in 2006.

The Sox would have to restructure his contract in a way that guarantees Thomas some money in 2007 and possibly 2008.

BINGO! If the Sox want Frank, they only need to talk to him about long-term security. This is JR's strong suit. He's always willing to offer deferred money because he knows it costs him less to offer it than non-deferred money. It's silly to think this is going to be a stumbling block for either Frank or the Sox.

Thomas gave up 19.5 million dollars in deferred future payments when signing the current contract that was offered to him during the 2002 offseason, when taking into consideration the guaranteed money involved in the contract. Thomas' need for money upfront outweighed the importance of receiving longterm deferral payments, and the Sox obliged to appease a fallen slugger, to tidy up a rather messy situation, and to save themselves some money in the process.

The Sox had Frank by the financial windpipe because of the Diminished Skills clause. It would appear Frank has lots more leverage to negotiate a more favorable deal for himself going forward.

So where's the beef? It's not like the Sox have a whole lot of options for replacing Frank at a more favorable price... especially with the core of the line up already gutted.
:o:


The situation is abit different now, since neither side is tied down by a contract that forces both sides to negotiate since they are forced to coexist for a future 3 or 4 years. Frank and JR aren't as close as they once were, as a result of the incident during ST of 2001, and Thomas no longer lives in the city of Chicago, so there is really no sentimental need on either side for Frank to remain on the SS. This is quite different from the sentiment that Barry feels for the city of Cincinatti and the Reds, since Barry grew up in Cincinatti, and can't imagine playing elsewhere. It was just a twist of fate that landed Frank in Chicago, and I don't foresee Thomas playing for the White Sox in 2006.

I'm really not sure what point you're trying to make here. I can only say when negotiating a deal with as many zeroes as the Sox and Frank are discussing, money talks and bull**** walks. All this soap opera bull**** you think quashes the deal couldn't be further from the truth.

The Sox and Frank will cut a deal that makes sense for both of them. There is plenty of room for Frank on the South Side for reasons that benefit both Frank and the Sox.

Brian26
02-05-2005, 10:12 AM
and Thomas no longer lives in the city of Chicago, so there is really no sentimental need on either side for Frank to remain on the SS.

Frank still has a place up in Lincoln Park.

SpammySosa
02-05-2005, 10:54 AM
However, Robin played more years for other teams than he did for the Sox, so I don't think that's gonna happen.

Untrue. He played 10 seasons for the Sox,6 years divided amongst the Mets,Yankees and Dodgers.

TheTwinsMustDie
02-05-2005, 11:15 AM
I've got a way to kill two birds with one stone:

1) Have a Frank Thomas Day where the Sox announce that Frank will be the last White Sox player to wear #35

2) Have that day on one of the days that the Orioles are in town in May.

Coincidence? Hardly.
I don't have Brook's e-mail address handy, but give me credit for the idea if you send it off to him and he likes it.

SMO
:gulp:

PS
Harold came and went 2 or 3 times and his number is still retired. However, Robin played more years for other teams than he did for the Sox, so I don't think that's gonna happen.


Frankie's #35 will eventually be retired as the greatest Sox hitter of all time.......I highly doubt it will happen this year though.

tacosalbarojas
02-06-2005, 09:54 PM
back to Magglio, and whether or not his number should be retired. The guy is in the SOX all-time top ten in batting average, home runs (fourth), RBI (ninth), extra base hits, OPS (second), slugging percentage (second), and 20 + home run seasons. Add in four all-star appearances in seven seasons. 20 years from now if Magglio is displaced on many of these top ten lists, then I'd say, yeah, we've had many more deserving players. Forget the mistakes he made in the deal last year - yeah, he should have signed before the Harris incident, and he definitely shouldn't have signed Boras - his on field performance should not be dismissed so casually.

Ol' No. 2
02-06-2005, 10:02 PM
back to Magglio, and whether or not his number should be retired. The guy is in the SOX all-time top ten in batting average, home runs (fourth), RBI (ninth), extra base hits, OPS (second), slugging percentage (second), and 20 + home run seasons. Add in four all-star appearances in seven seasons. 20 years from now if Magglio is displaced on many of these top ten lists, then I'd say, yeah, we've had many more deserving players. Forget the mistakes he made in the deal last year - yeah, he should have signed before the Harris incident, and he definitely shouldn't have signed Boras - his on field performance should not be dismissed so casually.Longevity with the team has to be a factor, too. If Maggs played 10 years with the team and put up those kind of numbers it would be a no-brainer. But with only 7 full years, I think it falls short.

tacosalbarojas
02-06-2005, 10:12 PM
Longevity with the team has to be a factor, too. If Maggs played 10 years with the team and put up those kind of numbers it would be a no-brainer. But with only 7 full years, I think it falls short.
Maybe you're right, #2, but I think the overwhelming thought here seems to be, Magglio screwed us, so no way should we retire his number. We've got people saying Robin's should be retired here, for goodness sake, and how many years did he play? Eight, nine? I think we're talking nickles and dimes here with the years - does three more years really make that big a difference? The numbers are what they are. Put it this way: if he had passed away in an accident, his number would be immediately retired...because his numbers merited it. Like I said, 20 years down the road, if Magglio gets displaced from all these top ten lists, then let's give his number away...preferrably to a Mexican League castoff...maybe one discovered by a million year old Roland Hemond :).

Ol' No. 2
02-06-2005, 10:18 PM
Maybe you're right, #2, but I think the overwhelming thought here seems to be, Magglio screwed us, so no way should we retire his number. We've got people saying Robin's should be retired here, for goodness sake, and how many years did he play? Eight, nine? I think we're talking nickles and dimes here with the years - does three more years really make that big a difference? The numbers are what they are. Put it this way: if he had passed away in an accident, his number would be immediately retired...because his numbers merited it. Like I said, 20 years down the road, if Magglio gets displaced from all these top ten lists, then let's give his number away...preferrably to a Mexican League castoff...maybe one discovered by a million year old Roland Hemond :).As a matter of fact, I would NOT retire #23, either. Retired numbers should be reserved for those who were HOF caliber players. I don't think Ventura or Ordonez are in that category.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-07-2005, 07:56 AM
back to Magglio, and whether or not his number should be retired. The guy is in the SOX all-time top ten in batting average, home runs (fourth), RBI (ninth), extra base hits, OPS (second), slugging percentage (second), and 20 + home run seasons. Add in four all-star appearances in seven seasons. 20 years from now if Magglio is displaced on many of these top ten lists, then I'd say, yeah, we've had many more deserving players. Forget the mistakes he made in the deal last year - yeah, he should have signed before the Harris incident, and he definitely shouldn't have signed Boras - his on field performance should not be dismissed so casually.

This is all crap. He's a power hitter. If he wasn't putting up "top ten" offensive numbers, I'm willing to bet YOU would be one of the Sox Fans booing him when he ran off the field after hitting into another double play.

I would wipe **** all over #30 before I retired it for Magglio Ordonez.

A.T. Money
02-07-2005, 08:30 AM
You lose the right and honor of have your number retired when you leave the organization for selfish reasons as far as I'm concerned. Ordonez ruined a good thing.

tacosalbarojas
02-07-2005, 10:34 AM
This is all crap. He's a power hitter. If he wasn't putting up "top ten" offensive numbers, I'm willing to bet YOU would be one of the Sox Fans booing him when he ran off the field after hitting into another double play.

I would wipe **** all over #30 before I retired it for Magglio Ordonez.You know nothing about me.

PaleHoseGeorge
02-07-2005, 10:38 AM
You know nothing about me.

You wouldn't boo Maggs? Glad to hear it. Booing is the sort of behavior the Mark Giangrecos of this world enjoy shining a bright light on while scolding, "Tsk, tsk.. Sox Fans..."

I would prefer a sarcastic O-E-O chant after Magglio inevitably grounds into another double play for Detroit. He and Konerko were quite a tag team for quite a few years in that "top ten" category on the South Side.
:cool:

Baby Fisk
02-07-2005, 10:54 AM
I would prefer a sarcastic O-E-O chant after Magglio inevitably grounds into another double play for Detroit. He and Konerko were quite a tag team for quite a few years in that "top ten" category on the South Side.


The Bronx cheer is very effective.