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mweflen
01-25-2005, 12:10 PM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-050124ordonez,1,6694167.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

Flush with giddiness over finally having a club with no holes (or should I say yawning chasms? I'm thinking of catcher, 2B, RF, 5th starter and leadoff last year...), the thought of facing Maggs 19 games a year on a team which gave us fits anyway was a nice cold shower.

The quotes in the linked story talk about it as though it was an impending deal. Note Boras' lack of traditional doublespeak and "wait and see" BS.

Grrr.

Thoughts?

mcfish
01-25-2005, 12:12 PM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-050124ordonez,1,6694167.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

Flush with giddiness over finally having a club with no holes, the thought of facing Maggs 19 games a year on a team which gave us fits anyway was a nice cold shower.

The quotes in the linkes story talk about it as though it was an impending deal. Note Boras' lack of traditional doublespeak and "wait and see" BS.

Grrr.No I'm not worried. Maggs can sit on whatever bench Boras tells him to.

mweflen
01-25-2005, 12:13 PM
Corollary question: which is better... Maggs on the Cubs, or Maggs on the Tigers?

SoxFan78
01-25-2005, 12:14 PM
He's just another sell out baseball player to me now. I could care less if he went to the Tigers, more chances for me too boo him. I don't care where he goes, just as long as he doesn't go to the sCrUBs.

MUsoxfan
01-25-2005, 12:14 PM
Maggs anywhere but the Cubs. That way we don't have to see a "Maggs Watch" in the Tribune everyday

jabrch
01-25-2005, 12:18 PM
Paraphrasing (and taking liberties with) what Sensei Kreese said to Bobby in Karate Kid

If he can't run - he can't play

Magglio has yet to work out - not had a single workout with a single team. Right now - if you told me I had to choose between Magglio or Bobby Higginson, I might choose Higginson. Dmitri Young...I'd take him over Magglio also. Rondell White...him too. Craig Monroe? Ok - now I gotta think about it. Magglio doesn't scare me ONE BIT - until he proves he is marginally close to stepping into a batters box. If Boras can con the Tigers into spending big bucks on a guy who has yet to get health - I'm all for it.

santo=dorf
01-25-2005, 12:21 PM
Well if anyone hits one down the first base line at Comerica, it's going to go for a triple or an inside the park homer.

mweflen
01-25-2005, 12:23 PM
Paraphrasing (and taking liberties with) what Sensei Kreese said to Bobby in Karate Kid

If he can't run - he can't play


Sweep the leg, Willie! :redneck

jabrch
01-25-2005, 12:26 PM
Sweep the leg, Willie! :redneck

But I'll get disqualified Sensei?

Do you have a problem with that?

No Sensei

No Mercy!!!!!!!

Irishsox1
01-25-2005, 12:32 PM
Magglio was never going to re-sign with the Sox and that was before his injury. So, I always thought he would end up on the Mets, now I think he might sit out MLB this year and play in a foreign league. If the Tigers are dumb enough to sign him, then go ahead. The Cubune loves to point out that the Tigers signed Ivan and he had a history of injurys, but he was coming off an amazing playoff run and his injurys were known. The only contract I would offer Maggs is $1 mill this year and a $6 mill option next year.

Jerko
01-25-2005, 12:39 PM
I hope Maggs signs with the Tigers and plays RF. Maybe this way Higginson won't hit 5 of his 9 homers against the White Sox. I guess he can always DH though, damn.

Sad
01-25-2005, 12:44 PM
man I'd have to hear it from all the Tiger people over by here...

on a side note-
I wonder how many sticks of gum Higginson packs into that craw of his? :cool:

WinningUgly!
01-25-2005, 12:51 PM
I hope Maggs signs with the Tigers and plays RF. Maybe this way Higginson won't hit 5 of his 9 homers against the White Sox. I guess he can always DH though, damn.

If the Tigers sign Ordonez (he's no longer Maggs to me), Higginson is gone.

Sad
01-25-2005, 12:54 PM
doesn't Higginson play LF?

WinningUgly!
01-25-2005, 01:03 PM
doesn't Higginson play LF?

Nope, RF.

StockdaleForVeep
01-25-2005, 01:11 PM
has anyone thrown money out at mags yet? If so how much, i wanna see how much hes supposed gonna get now since he turned down the sox contract offers when he was "healthy" and how much less he will prob get from other clubs

1917
01-25-2005, 01:12 PM
I rather see him on the Tigers because if he happens to be healthy and has a good year with the Tigers, they still won't finish better then 3rd, they have no pitching or bullpen (Percival doesn't impress me) but if he comes backs healthy with the Cubs...that could mean a real good season up North and rain on our parade....But I think he is AL bound really because he can DH if the knee acts up....I think the Rangers will make a strong bid espeically since they backed out of Delgado

gosox41
01-25-2005, 01:12 PM
http://chicagosports.chicagotribune.com/sports/baseball/whitesox/cs-050124ordonez,1,6694167.story?coll=cs-whitesox-headlines

Flush with giddiness over finally having a club with no holes (or should I say yawning chasms? I'm thinking of catcher, 2B, RF, 5th starter and leadoff last year...), the thought of facing Maggs 19 games a year on a team which gave us fits anyway was a nice cold shower.

The quotes in the linked story talk about it as though it was an impending deal. Note Boras' lack of traditional doublespeak and "wait and see" BS.

Grrr.

Thoughts?

I'd like to see Magglio on the Tigers more then the Cubs.



Bob

Ol' No. 2
01-25-2005, 01:12 PM
If the Tigers sign Ordonez (he's no longer Maggs to me), Higginson is gone.Good. Ordonez couldn't do half the damage Higginson has done to the Sox over the years. Why is it that some otherwise mediocre players can just kill you time and again?

Jjav829
01-25-2005, 01:25 PM
Worried about facing him 19 times a year? Sure, just like I'm worried about facing any other good player. But worried about him turning the Tigers into a contender? Not really.

veeter
01-25-2005, 01:58 PM
IF Mags plays it will be in the AL. The Rangers have a history of throwing money around stupidly, so they'll probably get him. The Tigers seem dubious, which they should be. Running in a gym or something is far different than playing major league outfield. Then again he hasn't run anywhere for anybody. The percentage chance of Ordonez going to the Cubs: 0%.

JoseCanseco6969
01-25-2005, 02:12 PM
He's just another sell out baseball player to me now. I could care less if he went to the Tigers, more chances for me too boo him. I don't care where he goes, just as long as he doesn't go to the sCrUBs.

I agree! I will attend as many sox vs tigers games as possible if he actually can still play. BOO MAGGS!

Unregistered
01-25-2005, 02:25 PM
I'd love to see Ordonez sign with the Rangers... we'd barely ever have to see him, and since he'd playing on the west coast (and for the Rangers, no less), we'd probably never even have to hear about him.

chaz171
01-25-2005, 02:26 PM
Ordonez will have builder's square embossed in his backside cause he's still busted up and he's not going to play this year

Bobby Thigpen
01-25-2005, 02:57 PM
Why is it that some otherwise mediocre players can just kill you time and again?

Joe Randa anyone?

Ol' No. 2
01-25-2005, 02:59 PM
Joe Randa anyone?Yeah. He's another one. :angry: What is it with these guys?

mjharrison72
01-25-2005, 03:00 PM
Corollary question: which is better... Maggs on the Cubs, or Maggs on the Tigers?
I'd rather not have to play against him, assuming he gets back to form, so by that token, I would say Kubs before any AL Central team.
I also suspect he will never be back to pre-injury form, and would love to see the Kubs waste their money gambling on him.
-M

BRDSR
01-25-2005, 03:00 PM
I agree! I will attend as many sox vs tigers games as possible if he actually can still play. BOO MAGGS!

If Ordonez(I like a previous posters commitment to not calling him Maggs anymore) does play for the Tigers, or anyone who will play at the Cell for that matter, I think it's imperitive that WSI gets a contingent to that game with an incredibly large banner asking Maggs how it feels to take an XXXXXXX number of dollars paycut(I'm assuming it will be in the millions, if not 10s of millions). I forget exactly what we offered him, but I believe it was 14 million per year. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I think that would be hillarious.

ja1022
01-25-2005, 03:02 PM
I'd have no problem if the Sox faced Magg's next team 19 times a year. I'd rather it be the Royals than any other team in the Central, but whatever. And I don't wish him bad luck, good luck, or any luck. He's gone. Get over it.

DumpJerry
01-25-2005, 03:04 PM
Sign with the Kitties, Maggs, not the Flubs. That way, when you return to Comiskey, you'll be reminded of what you gave up when you see the support we give the SOX. BTW, the Kitties are well known for making stupid deals which are great for the players, bad for the team.

s.dedalus
01-25-2005, 03:08 PM
Higginson's still got one year to go on that historically bad contract. While Detroit hasn't been above simply eating salary for a player not on the roster in the past (I think that's what happened to Damion Easley's absurd 2003 salary... they just released him and lived with it, right?), I don't that's going to fly anymore if they want fans to believe that the Tigers are actually interested in competing.

That was wordier than it had to be. Basically, Higginson's getting paid 8+mm in 2005. He's not good, so nobody else will take that money on, and he can't just disappear because Dombrowski wishes it so - unless they just eat it.

ja1022
01-25-2005, 03:14 PM
Joe Randa anyone?

Corey Koskie.

NonetheLoaiza
01-25-2005, 03:29 PM
its hard to worry about a guy that will only play half the games next year...

34 Inch Stick
01-25-2005, 04:32 PM
A 31 year old coming off a leg injury who has not reached 30 HR since 2002 and hitting in a huge ballpark. I will enjoy watching Maggs get thrown out several times a year trying to stretch hits into doubles and triples.

nccwsfan
01-25-2005, 06:42 PM
Magglio can play on any team he wants, for all I care. Won't matter much because he'll be relegated to a DH role at best. His career as we've all come to know it is kaput...


Damaged goods.

winning ugly 72
01-25-2005, 07:30 PM
i don't care where maggs plays as long as it is not with the cubs

JoseCanseco6969
01-25-2005, 11:09 PM
If Ordonez(I like a previous posters commitment to not calling him Maggs anymore) does play for the Tigers, or anyone who will play at the Cell for that matter, I think it's imperitive that WSI gets a contingent to that game with an incredibly large banner asking Maggs how it feels to take an XXXXXXX number of dollars paycut(I'm assuming it will be in the millions, if not 10s of millions). I forget exactly what we offered him, but I believe it was 14 million per year. Someone correct me if I'm wrong. I think that would be hillarious.

Sorry, I agree he shouldnt be called Maggs anymore as well. I also love you idea for a banner! I sure as hell hope he signs with an AL team, (cant see an NL team taking a chance since he should only be DH).

Another ORDONEZ comment I just heard from a typical Cubs fan while playing Halo 2 on Xbox live. He noticed my screen name was "Cubkilla" and said how does it feel to know Maggs is going to the Cubs?? He said the Sox suck, who do they even have??? All i said was DO YOU FOLLOW THE OFFSEASON AT ALL??? he said, no not really. I had nothing else to say.

Viva Medias B's
01-25-2005, 11:20 PM
Maggs anywhere but the Cubs. That way we don't have to see a "Maggs Watch" in the Tribune everyday

Didn't the Tribune have one last year when before Magglio was seduced by the dark side of the force?

bc2k
01-26-2005, 12:32 AM
Well if anyone hits one down the first base line at Comerica, it's going to go for a triple or an inside the park homer.

hahha :D:. Plus you gotta think Ordonez will be a little gun shy on those shallow popups and is going to watch quite a few ducksnorts drop this year.

Maggs has done too much in a White Sox uniform and has been a great role model for so long, that I would never boo him unless he plays for the Cubs.

I'm not so sure he won't have a decent 2005. His Austrian surgeon sounded believable in the most recent Trib article on it. I think his biggest hurdles will come from playing defense.

I would get satisfaction watching him beat the Cubs on any other NL Central team. I think the Astros could be a nice match--though I don't know who is in their outfield outside of Biggio and Berkman. I do know they lost an outfielder in Beltran, and Magglio's wife always wanted Magglio to sign in a warm weather state, and I would definately watch a 'Stros game with Maggs in the lineup and Clemens on the bump. Heck, even Oswalt or Petitte pitching.

IronFisk
01-26-2005, 02:13 AM
has anyone thrown money out at mags yet? If so how much, i wanna see how much hes supposed gonna get now since he turned down the sox contract offers when he was "healthy" and how much less he will prob get from other clubs

Hey Stockdale...what's with the pic of Disraeli?

:redneck

Shorty1983
01-26-2005, 02:44 AM
http://images5.theimagehosting.com/maggs.gif

I guess when push comes to shove, you pick money over loyalty.

doublem23
01-26-2005, 02:54 AM
Worried about the Tigers with Maggs?

Did he take up pitching?

calderon
01-26-2005, 10:50 AM
I know it's possible he wasn't on anything but, with the new drug testing policy in place, does anyone think Magglio was using something. His minor league numbers seemed to jump from extremely average to awesome in one season. The problems with the knee also make me wonder, as it has taken so long to heal, and now this weight loss. A lot of question marks surround him.

Mickster
01-26-2005, 10:51 AM
I know it's possible he wasn't on anything but, with the new drug testing policy in place, does anyone think Magglio was using something. His minor league numbers seemed to jump from extremely average to awesome in one season. The problems with the knee also make me wonder, as it has taken so long to heal, and now this weight loss. A lot of question marks surround him.

Hell, anything is possible. Remember, Giambi only lost 4 lbs. last year just by cutting out junk food and eating healthy!

Iwritecode
01-26-2005, 10:52 AM
I know it's possible he wasn't on anything but, with the new drug testing policy in place, does anyone think Magglio was using something. His minor league numbers seemed to jump from extremely average to awesome in one season. The problems with the knee also make me wonder, as it has taken so long to heal, and now this weight loss. A lot of question marks surround him.

He lost 15 lbs?!? :o:

Where the hell did he lose it from? It's not like he was exactly fat. Unless he gained some weight while he was injured...

Palehose13
01-26-2005, 10:59 AM
He lost 15 lbs?!? :o:

Where the hell did he lose it from? It's not like he was exactly fat. Unless he gained some weight while he was injured...

That is what I was thinking.

Baby Fisk
01-26-2005, 11:01 AM
I heard he did a lot of wall climbing over the fall and winter. It's one of those trendy new things...

:santo
"Oh noooooo! That crazy vagrant is scaling the Wrigley wall again!"

:maggs
"Let me in! Please let me in! I will play for $20 million! [*aside*] Please Mr. Boras, can I climb down now? I can't hold on much longer."

:borass:
"[*whispers*] Hang in there, Magglio, you're doing just fine. [*Yells*] Behold! The man is in perfect physical condition! Better than ever before! Yours for only $20 million!"

:shammy
"Uh-uh! You keep that biatch away from here or I'm gonna scratch up his face!"

Tekijawa
01-26-2005, 11:03 AM
losing 15 pounds of Muscle in about 6 months is next to impossible with out some type of disease, so I'm guessing that it isn't Steroid related.

My guess is that it is mostly due to the Bone and tissue that was removed from his knee.

Clembasbal
01-26-2005, 11:13 AM
losing 15 pounds of Muscle in about 6 months is next to impossible with out some type of disease, so I'm guessing that it isn't Steroid related.

My guess is that it is mostly due to the Bone and tissue that was removed from his knee.

It's possible, muscle weights more than fat. I lost 10 pounds of muscle after I graduated college in about 4 months (no longer worked out). It is possible, especially if you are just resting and doing nothing, like recovering from an injury.

HebrewHammer
01-26-2005, 11:30 AM
How much does a knee weigh?

balke
01-26-2005, 11:49 AM
How much does a knee weigh?

Funniest thing I'll hear all day. :roflmao:

jdm2662
01-26-2005, 03:48 PM
I've dropped a few pounds when I stopped working out, but I'm not a good example. I've lost ten pounds over a summer just by not drinking and eating regular foods. Drinking beer and eating McDonalds wasn't a good diet that semester... The only excerise I got is when I was at work.
________
Easy Vape Vaporizer (http://www.vaporshop.com/easy-vape-vaporizer.html)

white sox bill
01-26-2005, 04:16 PM
It's possible, muscle weights more than fat. I lost 10 pounds of muscle after I graduated college in about 4 months (no longer worked out). It is possible, especially if you are just resting and doing nothing, like recovering from an injury.

Muscle weighing more than fat is like what weighs more, a pound of feathers or a pound of lead? The two key words here is "by volume" Then muscle weighs more:D:

cubhater
01-26-2005, 06:51 PM
How much does a knee weigh?

More than his wallet nowadays!:D:

cubhater
01-26-2005, 06:52 PM
I know it's possible he wasn't on anything but, with the new drug testing policy in place, does anyone think Magglio was using something. His minor league numbers seemed to jump from extremely average to awesome in one season. The problems with the knee also make me wonder, as it has taken so long to heal, and now this weight loss. A lot of question marks surround him.

Any link?

Nellie_Fox
01-27-2005, 12:50 AM
losing 15 pounds of Muscle in about 6 months is next to impossible with out some type of disease, so I'm guessing that it isn't Steroid related. I've seen many of our varsity football players, who were gorging themselves on food to the point of nausea to get their weight up, lose 50 pounds once their senior year football season was over. 300 pound offensive linemen went down to 250 or less in the blink of an eye.

I have no idea how many of them were using 'roids, but I do know that they were eating constantly to maintain the weight.

Soxzilla
01-27-2005, 02:15 AM
I lost 10 pounds in 2 weeks after I fractured my spine.

Anything is possible.

Mohoney
01-27-2005, 04:27 AM
I've seen many of our varsity football players, who were gorging themselves on food to the point of nausea to get their weight up, lose 50 pounds once their senior year football season was over. 300 pound offensive linemen went down to 250 or less in the blink of an eye.

I have no idea how many of them were using 'roids, but I do know that they were eating constantly to maintain the weight.

Assuming that there were at least a few who didn't take steroids, eating that much food, combined with that intense a level of physical activity over a prolonged period of time, could hypothetically jack up the metabolism to a point where suddenly cutting a large amount of calories out of the diet will result in drastic weight loss, couldn't it?

The metabolism of such a person would take a little while to come down to earth, so the body will start tapping into its reserves to make up for the calories that are suddenly not being added, right?

voodoochile
01-27-2005, 08:57 AM
Assuming that there were at least a few who didn't take steroids, eating that much food, combined with that intense a level of physical activity over a prolonged period of time, could hypothetically jack up the metabolism to a point where suddenly cutting a large amount of calories out of the diet will result in drastic weight loss, couldn't it?

The metabolism of such a person would take a little while to come down to earth, so the body will start tapping into its reserves to make up for the calories that are suddenly not being added, right?

That's true for about 3-4 weeks, but after that your body responds to the lower calorie intake by going into a "starvation mode" where it cuts down on calories burned. That's why all dieters show dramatic weight loss in the first few weeks when going from an unrestricted diet to a severely limited one.

In the above case, it would be possible for the ex-football players to lose 15-20 pounds the first week alone.

JUribe1989
01-27-2005, 09:04 AM
Because of the injury I feel that there is a strong chance that Magglio was on some form of an illegal steroid or muscle enhancement.

Vestigio
01-27-2005, 05:35 PM
http://www.detnews.com/2005/tigers/0501/27/tigers-72461.htm



Ordonez instructed his agent Scott Boras on Thursday to counter a Tigers' offer with a prosposal of his own -- and that's where matters stand. If the Tigers agree, they've landed themselves a four-time All-Star outfielder who's one of the best hitters in the majors -- when he's healthy

Mickster
01-27-2005, 05:39 PM
No Cubs and no AL Central. :whiner:

MIgrenade
01-27-2005, 05:42 PM
I cannot wait to see what kind of deal this is. The Tigers will deffinitely over pay.

1917
01-27-2005, 05:42 PM
As long as he is not wearing Cub Blue....If he is Healthy, the Tigers will still finsh no better then third, no pitching at all

batmanZoSo
01-27-2005, 05:45 PM
I miss Ordobez.

Risk
01-27-2005, 05:46 PM
Personally, I don't think any teams are going to sign Maggs to a long term deal, or even a one year incentive laden contract until they can 1) have all the doctor's info on the knee; 2) run their own tests; 3) see Maggs run dead wind sprints; 4) see Maggs run for a prolonged period of time; and 5) pass an all around physical. Perhaps I'm being naive, but I think that these are the last things that Boras will allow to happen.

If there is any truth to the rumor that the Mets, aka the "dumbest franchise in baseball" are no longer interested, it shows that most teams are probably not going to bite.

Risk

bobj4400
01-27-2005, 05:47 PM
Watching Maggs play in the cavernous Comerica outfield on a bum knee would be quite comical. I assume he would have to DH if he signs with Detroit.

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2005, 05:51 PM
Watching Maggs play in the cavernous Comerica outfield on a bum knee would be quite comical. I assume he would have to DH if he signs with Detroit.:maggs Can I get a courtesy runner?

chaz171
01-27-2005, 05:54 PM
Scenario A-Since Ordobez has been so underpaid all of his years here, I can see how his impoverished state has kept him form a good meal lately.

Scenario B- That Austrian Doctor Removed more than a expected out of his left knee

Scanario C- Since his departure from US Comiskular has cut back on his daily intake of Churros

Scenario D- When Tony Girldarich held out in Green Bay in 1989, he lost 20 lbs and gained 5% in body fat. that can happen only one way,pal

Tekijawa
01-27-2005, 05:55 PM
Hope it happens... there are still great seats available in Boo-ing distance for all the detriot games... Might have to add 19 games to my 14 game package!

samram
01-27-2005, 05:58 PM
Hope it happens... there are still great seats available in Boo-ing distance for all the detriot games... Might have to add 19 games to my 14 game package!

I wish they were playing all games against Detroit at the Cell, but they'll only play 9 or 10. The Sox always seem listless when they play at Comerica.

SOXintheBURGH
01-27-2005, 05:59 PM
Hope it happens... there are still great seats available in Boo-ing distance for all the detriot games... Might have to add 19 games to my 14 game package!

lol...

I seriously hope he signs with Detroit now for some reason.

samram
01-27-2005, 06:02 PM
Personally, I don't think any teams are going to sign Maggs to a long term deal, or even a one year incentive laden contract until they can 1) have all the doctor's info on the knee; 2) run their own tests; 3) see Maggs run dead wind sprints; 4) see Maggs run for a prolonged period of time; and 5) pass an all around physical. Perhaps I'm being naive, but I think that these are the last things that Boras will allow to happen.

If there is any truth to the rumor that the Mets, aka the "dumbest franchise in baseball" are no longer interested, it shows that most teams are probably not going to bite.

Risk

Well, something will have to give- either some team will be desperate enough to take a big chance on him or Boras will cave and release some information. A team like the Tigers, which has failed to improve much at all (injured Troy Percival is not a great improvement), despite being mentioned as suitors for a lot of FAs this offseason, may be the type of team that is desperate enough to take a short-term chance on him.

The Mets are busy printing up playoff tickets after acquiring Doug Mientkiewicz- difference maker.

LongLiveFisk
01-27-2005, 06:28 PM
I heard on the Score (you know, that reliable source) that Boras is talking only to AL teams about Ordonez. If this is true (and that's a big if) then you know what that says about his knee...

:maggs
"Permanent DH, here I come!" (Or perhaps "Permanent DL, here I come" ?)

veeter
01-27-2005, 06:41 PM
Boy, it will be sad to see him another uniform. The AL thing makes sense. The little kid in me would love to see him come back to the Sox as their DH when Frank is through. I wonder if he'll really be able to play at all. It is funny though, another player the Cubs were "looking at" signs elsewhere.

rmusacch
01-27-2005, 06:41 PM
I heard on the Score (you know, that reliable source) that Boras is talking only to AL teams about Ordonez. If this is true (and that's a big if) then you know what that says about his knee...

:maggs
"Permanent DH, here I come!" (Or perhaps "Permanent DL, here I come" ?)

Who knows what to believe? The Fort Worth Star Telegram said that Ordonez would not play DH for the Rangers. Boras is an ass.

mdep524
01-27-2005, 06:49 PM
I wish they were playing all games against Detroit at the Cell, but they'll only play 9 or 10. The Sox always seem listless when they play at Comerica.
LOL, good point. Maybe if Maggs signs with Detroit it will give the Sox extra motivation vs. the stinking Tigers, a team the Sox have looked horrible against for the past two years.

chaz171
01-27-2005, 06:53 PM
Unless Maggs can hit while on Crutches, he will not play this year.

Ron Kittle
Harold Baines
Frank Thomas
Magglio Ordonez.

an abbreviated list of Career DH's before they were 30.


The Chicago White Sox -The Breeding Ground for Career DH's

Clembasbal
01-27-2005, 07:38 PM
Who knows what to believe? The Fort Worth Star Telegram said that Ordonez would not play DH for the Rangers. Boras is an ass.

ESPN (Another reliable source) said the Tigers were only interested in Magglio to DH...this was about a week ago when Trammel and their GM missed some(??) kind of meetings to go see him in Miami perform.

NSSoxFan
01-27-2005, 07:46 PM
ESPN (Another reliable source) said the Tigers were only interested in Magglio to DH...this was about a week ago when Trammel and their GM missed some(??) kind of meetings to go see him in Miami perform.

One Maggs To Live continues...

Ol' No. 2
01-27-2005, 09:14 PM
One Maggs To Live continues...As the knee turns?:(:

DVsoxfan
01-27-2005, 09:39 PM
As the knee turns?:(:

Vienna General Hospital

munchman33
01-27-2005, 10:46 PM
Vienna General Hospital

That's the clincher.

Clement's beard
01-27-2005, 11:13 PM
You've got to be kidding me:o: . If this is true, it's obvious he has worked out for Detroit.

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/10752346.htm?1c

Brian26
01-27-2005, 11:17 PM
You've got to be kidding me:o: . If this is true, it's obvious he has worked out for Detroit.

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/10752346.htm?1c

That's just absolutely insane for a guy coming off major knee surgery. Unbelievable.

Clement's beard
01-27-2005, 11:21 PM
That's just absolutely insane for a guy coming off major knee surgery. Unbelievable.

I agree. That is why I say he has worked out privately for Detroit. No team in their right mind would give him Vlad territory type of money if they did not know he was healthy. Detroit couldn't be THAT stupid, could they?

samram
01-27-2005, 11:22 PM
That's just absolutely insane for a guy coming off major knee surgery. Unbelievable.

No kidding. I would think this means he has worked out for them, but maybe they're just desperate enough to hope he'll be ok seeing as they have no farm system from which to expect any help. Still, if he's unable to play or that injury gets worse, this could be an Albert-Belle-in-Baltimore situation where he's deadweight on their books and handcuffs them financially for years.

HebrewHammer
01-27-2005, 11:24 PM
:roflmao: :rolling: :kukoo:

Typically guys get hurt after they sign deals like this.

I guess the Tigers wanted to stay ahead of the curve. Desperation is a stinky cologne.

NonetheLoaiza
01-27-2005, 11:27 PM
I've got to think some of that offer is because the Tigers have failed to lure anyone else to Detroit. So, I think they are desperate to get SOMEONE, ANYONE. For their sake, I hope they got a private workout, and I hope he signs. I wanna see him 19 games a year. Although, he will probably play 6 of them.

balke
01-27-2005, 11:30 PM
Good for him. Great for us. I hope he has to play his first 2 years free, and the rest is deferred with a diminished skills clause.

JUribe1989
01-27-2005, 11:37 PM
Say this is true

Detroit Tigers = Dumbest team in the league!

doublem23
01-27-2005, 11:37 PM
Didn't the Sox offer 5 years, $70 miilion?

Hokiesox
01-27-2005, 11:45 PM
Didn't the Sox offer 5 years, $70 miilion?

Something like that. But that was before Maggli-who? got desperate. Now he'll probably gladly sign for what he must consider chump-change

balke
01-27-2005, 11:45 PM
Didn't the Sox offer 5 years, $70 miilion?

Something like that. Pre-injury. Left it on the table for 2 days after his injury. Even for healthy maggs, that was too much money. The mention of this guy just gets my blood boiling, turning his back on Chicago. I really hope there's no sentimental cheer or anything if we see him this season. THis was not a graceful polite exit. The majority of this town loved him, it's really a shame.

Viva Medias B's
01-27-2005, 11:48 PM
Dave Dombrowski, who used to work for us under Roland Hemond, is one of the better baseball minds out there. I cannot believe he would do something like this.

Kogs35
01-28-2005, 12:34 AM
Dave Dombrowski, who used to work for us under Roland Hemond, is one of the better baseball minds out there. I cannot believe he would do something like this.

1 they have the all star game and need a allstar. they have more money this cuase of it. 2 Dombrowski lay off the :smokin:

FightingBillini
01-28-2005, 12:59 AM
1 they have the all star game and need a allstar.

Other than Pudge and possibly Guillen?

wsoxfan
01-28-2005, 01:14 AM
Boras is looking for a 7 year deal for Ordonez....!!!??:?: Even a 5 year deal is long for a player w/that sort of injury. Yeah if this is true it has Albert Belle/Baltimore type fiasco written all over it.

FightingBillini
01-28-2005, 01:15 AM
Boras is looking for a 7 year deal for Ordonez....!!!??:?: Even a 5 year deal is long for a player w/that sort of injury. Yeah if this is true it has Albert Belle/Baltimore type fiasco written all over it.

A seven year deal would make Belle look like a non-roster invitee.

mjmcend
01-28-2005, 01:31 AM
If you read the rest of the article, its says that the contract would include a protection clause for Detroit if the previous knee injury prevents him from playing. This is the same deal the IRod got from the Tigers. So it is not a crapshoot to see if his knee is healthy, if it is not, they don't have to pay him. This isn't the dumbest idea I have ever heard, although it still seems high even for a healthy Maggs.

StillMissOzzie
01-28-2005, 01:39 AM
If you read the rest of the article, its says that the contract would include a protection clause for Detroit if the previous knee injury prevents him from playing. This is the same deal the IRod got from the Tigers. So it is not a crapshoot to see if his knee is healthy, if it is not, they don't have to pay him. This isn't the dumbest idea I have ever heard, although it still seems high even for a healthy Maggs.

You beat me to the punch, mjmcend. IIRC, IRod has a 4 year deal, but the last two are voided if he goes down with a back injury and misses a certain # of games. This cuts their risk in half. In Maggs' case, I would still think that he has to demonstrate that he can play before they'd even START a contract like that. If it's 5 years, I would speculate that the last 3 or 4 are voidable if he misses x number of games in 2005.

SMO
:gulp:

StillMissOzzie
01-28-2005, 01:46 AM
1 they have the all star game and need a allstar. they have more money this cuase of it. 2 Dombrowski lay off the :smokin:

Their owner also owns the Red Wings, and they haven't cost him one red cent, so he's got THAT cash burning a hole in his pocket too.

SMO
:gulp:

OurBitchinMinny
01-28-2005, 01:58 AM
That's just absolutely insane for a guy coming off major knee surgery. Unbelievable.

Guys have recovered fine from knee surgery many times. If this is true, then he is good to go or else the tigers can see he will be fine. This guy is going to just kill us 19 times a year. I know it. Damn it. Dye better be damn good. Still better than him signing with the cubs

MUsoxfan
01-28-2005, 02:05 AM
I can't blame the Tigers. They're desperate to be contenders and they're taking a big chance. It's likely to pay off, although I naturally hope it won't

Unregistered
01-28-2005, 02:22 AM
It's likely to pay off, although I naturally hope it won't I wouldn't say a player coming off career-threatening knee surgery (that may be a degenerative condition) would be "likely to pay off," but then again, I'm not the Tigers... :cool:

MUsoxfan
01-28-2005, 02:27 AM
His career probably isn't over and he'll have a few years of solid play. Not great play, but solid play. I haven't been the biggest fan of his since BEFORE his injury, but I'm realistic

SOX ADDICT '73
01-28-2005, 04:00 AM
I'm conflicted about this. On one hand, I appreciate what Maggs has done for this team over the years, and would hate to see a great career ended short by a freak injury. On the other hand, I'm really ticked off at how he treated the Sox when they made him a pretty generous offer last year (could that have been Darth Boras whispering in his ear?). And on another hand (wait...that's three hands. Oh well.), I couldn't stand it if he went to a division rival like the Tigers and had any kind of success, especially against us. I suppose in the end I'd like a healthy Maggs to sign with the Mets where he can do a little damage to the Flubs every now and then.

doublem23
01-28-2005, 04:03 AM
Guys have recovered fine from knee surgery many times. If this is true, then he is good to go or else the tigers can see he will be fine. This guy is going to just kill us 19 times a year. I know it. Damn it. Dye better be damn good. Still better than him signing with the cubs

You're underestimating the severity of this injury. This is not a run-of-the-mill knee injury. For poor comparison's sake, Albert Belle had a degenerative hip condition and went from having one of the greatest offensive seasons ever in 1998 to being completely out of baseball 2 years later.

I hope Maggs is OK and I wish him the best of luck (as long as it doesn't cost the Sox anything), but the way this has been handled by Ordonez and Boras makes me think that he may be good to go for now, but 1 or 2 years down the line, maybe not.

I also think the Tigers are just desperate to get somebody.

doublem23
01-28-2005, 04:04 AM
I wouldn't say a player coming off career-threatening knee surgery (that may be a degenerative condition) would be "likely to pay off"

Especially for 5 years.

NSSoxFan
01-28-2005, 04:05 AM
Something like that. Pre-injury. Left it on the table for 2 days after his injury. Even for healthy maggs, that was too much money. The mention of this guy just gets my blood boiling, turning his back on Chicago. I really hope there's no sentimental cheer or anything if we see him this season. THis was not a graceful polite exit. The majority of this town loved him, it's really a shame.

I think it is safe to say that USCF will not be a friendly place for Maggli-who for years to come. I know I'm getting ready to buy all nine games against the Tigers.

Fredsox
01-28-2005, 06:14 AM
Here's the Detroit Free Press take on it.
http://www.detnews.com/2005/tigers/0501/28/H01-73204.htm

The writer makes it sound like nothing is really close, but they are definitely talking money at this point. Apparently Boras has told them he wants $70 million but no one has agreed to that figure. Additionally it cautions that the Tiger's will want to manage the risk of injury appropriately. There will undoubtedly be an insurance policy here, and one subject for discussion will be if the amount premium gets deducted from the contract value (my feeling, not the article's).

In any case, the author is saying that his is far from a done deal.

cubhater
01-28-2005, 06:49 AM
I agree. That is why I say he has worked out privately for Detroit. No team in their right mind would give him Vlad territory type of money if they did not know he was healthy. Detroit couldn't be THAT stupid, could they?

There's a sucker born every minute!:cool:

samram
01-28-2005, 08:40 AM
Guys have recovered fine from knee surgery many times. If this is true, then he is good to go or else the tigers can see he will be fine. This guy is going to just kill us 19 times a year. I know it. Damn it. Dye better be damn good. Still better than him signing with the cubs

This is not just knee surgery. This is "I'm'-going-to-Vienna-because-they're-the-only-ones-who-know-what-they're-doing-with-this" knee surgery. I don't know the specifics or the amount of risk relief the Tigers are pushing for, but if they're not smart about this and he can't play, the Tigers are done until 2008.

SOXSINCE'70
01-28-2005, 08:43 AM
PT Barnum was right.There is a sucker born every minute.
His name is Dave Dombrowski,if this report is true.:rolling: :rolling:

gosox41
01-28-2005, 09:26 AM
You've got to be kidding me:o: . If this is true, it's obvious he has worked out for Detroit.

http://www.mercurynews.com/mld/mercurynews/sports/10752346.htm?1c

I'm sure it's contingent on him passing a physical.


Bob

gosox41
01-28-2005, 09:28 AM
Something like that. Pre-injury. Left it on the table for 2 days after his injury. Even for healthy maggs, that was too much money. The mention of this guy just gets my blood boiling, turning his back on Chicago. I really hope there's no sentimental cheer or anything if we see him this season. THis was not a graceful polite exit. The majority of this town loved him, it's really a shame.

It is. And baed on what Beltran got, even if Magglio were 100% healthy and tested FA he probably wouldn't have gotten more then an extra $1-2 mill per year. Still a lot of money. But is it worth an extra $5 mill over 5 years to leave a place that you allegedly love?


Bob

Ol' No. 2
01-28-2005, 10:03 AM
I'm sure it's contingent on him passing a physical.


BobAnd I'm sure there are provisions similar to Rodriguez' contract that allows the Tigers to void it if he can't play. If so, this isn't a bad deal.

MRKARNO
01-28-2005, 10:04 AM
:rolling: :rolling: :rolling: :rolling:

I read this in the paper this morning and I couldnt believe it. Maggs wasnt worth this much when healthy. He especially isnt worth that much after the knee injury and subsequent surgery which might shorten his career. After 5 years he will be 36, and for someone who's unhealthy, that's pretty old. If I were Maggs, I would take that offer immediately. I can't believe the Tigers are so stupid. This is a deal that's going to seriously hinder their efforts to turn things around because Maggs is no superstar and is not worth that kind of money, nor was he ever, though the contract would have at least made sense before the injury.

:maggs
"I told you I was right to sign Boras"

:KW

"Well you are still making it easier for us to win the division."

Nick@Nite
01-28-2005, 10:13 AM
... hope you have a kick-ass Friday! ... Happy 31st Birthday, Jermaine.

:happybday


... and here's to many more... :gulp:

:supernana:

Hangar18
01-28-2005, 10:32 AM
Jermaine, heres to a .320, 28 HR season .........

Clembasbal
01-28-2005, 10:34 AM
I will drink a few for his birthday, and only for his birthday (My doctor says I need a reason):gulp:

SoxFanTillDeath
01-28-2005, 10:37 AM
It's mine too. I also heard on the radio that it's Magglio's birthday as well. No proof to back that up though...

MIgrenade
01-28-2005, 10:37 AM
I wonder how many fake offers Boras used to run up the price this time.

Church Turtle
01-28-2005, 10:40 AM
Happy Birthday! :happybday We'll see you at work in less than a month!

Tekijawa
01-28-2005, 10:50 AM
Between Maggs at that money and Higgenson in the outfield they'll be paying abotu 28 Million dollars for about 40 Rbi between the two...

Tekijawa
01-28-2005, 10:52 AM
Is there any way I can rent Boras for a day when yearly reviews come up at work?

jdm2662
01-28-2005, 11:04 AM
As far as we know, this is all speculation, or another BorASS ploy. Wait until the contract is signed before believing anything. I find it hard to believe there are other bidders out there...
________
CANNABIS COLLECTIVE (http://dispensaries.org/)

Mickster
01-28-2005, 11:14 AM
As far as we know, this is all speculation, or another BorASS ploy. Wait until the contract is signed before believing anything. I find it hard to believe there are other bidders out there...

I am certain that there are other bidders out there. They are all just sitting back, looking for the "bargain" of the off-season hoping to sign him to an incentive-laiden deal before ST starts.

bobj4400
01-28-2005, 11:25 AM
The trend continues: High profile star hires Scott Bor-ASS, high profile star signs with bottom feeder that has no chance to win b/c they offer the most money.

For examples see: Rodriguez, Alex and Beltran, Carlos...

If he signs for 5 years, he will be crying to get traded within 2 b/c 'the team isnt committed to winning.'

chisox2005
01-28-2005, 11:28 AM
It's mine too. I also heard on the radio that it's Magglio's birthday as well. No proof to back that up though...

It is also Mag's birthday, ironically them both being 31 and play right field. Spooky. :dtroll:

veeter
01-28-2005, 11:38 AM
I'll take Dye at 1/3 of the price.

chisoxmike
01-28-2005, 11:57 AM
Isn't Maggs making a counteroffer to the Tigers, so wouldn't that be even MORE than what they offered?:o:

Flight #24
01-28-2005, 11:58 AM
Couple of interesting points:

1) ESPN msg boards report a detroit rdio citing a 3-yr offer to Maggs: 8mil, 11mil guaranteed then 14mil option based on ABs. Thats a lot less than 5/70.

2) MLB's article says At this point, Boras said, the bone marrow edema has been the only question teams have asked about, and those have been answered to doctors' satisfaction. The fact that negotiations have reached this point without a workout reinforces that notion.

That just boggles the mind, unless they've got some serious contingency clauses in the contract. Unless there's a new face hanging around the Tigers offices lately....

:dumbash
"Not to worry, I had my guys personally look him over......he's fine."

infohawk
01-28-2005, 12:20 PM
Short of the knee injury ending his career, Maggs is still likely to be a very good player. The question, really, is whether he will be a star player. He should still hit as well as he did. His fielding and baserunning will be the real question. His range and speed might be diminished, but if he still hits for power, average and maintains an exceptional .OBP, he would be a good signing for a team in need of offense. That said, $14 million a year is too much for a player who might not be able to play rightfield every day. It would be essential, however, for a team to include some kind of performance clause.

I'm not angry with Maggs. He was my favorite player for several years, and I wish him well. Players come and players go. I will have a new favorite player, and someday that player will probably move on as well. The team is my constant. I do think that Magg's involvement with Boras hurt his relationship with the Sox organization and Sox fans generally. As much as I hated to see him go, it was a blessing in disguise. The Sox had too much money tied into too few players and they were a perennial second-place team. The organization has done a supurb job in spreading around the payroll and filling holes. I'm looking forward to the upcoming season.

chaz171
01-28-2005, 12:36 PM
Dave Dombrowski, who used to work for us under Roland Hemond, is one of the better baseball minds out there. I cannot believe he would do something like this.

There is a reason Dealin' Dave is on his 4th Team.

Detroit is offering what we offered 'Ordobez' 8 months Ago and he quickly declined. Something tells me he signs for that amount. I think Detroit is bidding against themselves in this one if this is is their offer.......

Hangar18
01-28-2005, 12:40 PM
Well, the Dumbest Team in Baseball is the NY Mets, something
tells me that Maggs is better, otherwise they wouldnt make this offer....

mweflen
01-28-2005, 12:43 PM
It is also Mag's birthday, ironically them both being 31 and play right field. Spooky. :dtroll:

Hey, and they're both chronically injured, too! I need my blankie and nightlight now...

Brian26
01-28-2005, 12:45 PM
Make a wish. Hopefully the knee doesn't blow out again as easily as your birthday candles.

mweflen
01-28-2005, 12:48 PM
We'll see if he has a Tiger-themed birthday cake.

My present: 19 games of booing.

Brian26
01-28-2005, 12:49 PM
Well, the Dumbest Team in Baseball is the NY Mets, something
tells me that Maggs is better, otherwise they wouldnt make this offer....

The Mets GM said yesterday that his outfield is probably set with Beltran, Cameron and Floyd. Since Mags can't DH in the NL, he'll probably go to Detroit.

pinwheels3530
01-28-2005, 12:56 PM
:happybday Go Sox!

DaleJRFan
01-28-2005, 01:04 PM
We'll see if he has a Tiger-themed birthday cake.

My present: 19 games of booing.

Agreed. I'm waiting for the official announcement off his signing before I buy my tickets in the rightfield seats so I can boooo and heckle the $%&^#(@...

But realistically, how many Sox-killing game-winning RBIs will Maggs have in 05 as a Tiger? I'm sure he'd love that nasty hanging curve of Atkins' in the ninth inning of a close game....

voodoochile
01-28-2005, 01:22 PM
Anyone else find it ironic that our old RF and our new RF share the same b-day?

WinningUgly!
01-28-2005, 01:27 PM
Anyone else find it ironic that our old RF and our new RF share the same b-day?

Ordonez was born 3 hours earlier. Obviously, age was a major factor in the Dye signing. :tongue:

Lip Man 1
01-28-2005, 01:32 PM
Chaz:

Keep in mind Dombrowski won a World series with Florida and built the Expos minor league system to incredibly high status.

Something a tad more then any Sox G.M. have been able to do since 1991.

Lip

Mickster
01-28-2005, 01:41 PM
Chaz:

Keep in mind Dombrowski won a World series with Florida and built the Expos minor league system to incredibly high status.

Something a tad more then any Sox G.M. have been able to do since 1991.

Lip

Thanks for adding your anti-Sox negative spin to the Maggs and Tiger-bashing thread, Lip.

duke of dorwood
01-28-2005, 02:34 PM
All BorA$$ Children?

chaz171
01-28-2005, 02:34 PM
Enough of the Soap Titles already......

Hangar18
01-28-2005, 02:35 PM
Chaz:

Keep in mind Dombrowski won a World series with Florida and built the Expos minor league system to incredibly high status.

Something a tad more then any Sox G.M. have been able to do since 1991.

Lip

Hard to imagine some of the success Dombrowski has had in that short
a time period. I will say this, he has a WS Ring because of $$$$$$$
and was lucky to be able to have Filled Every Hole he had that year
with Free Agent Signings

WhteSox725
01-28-2005, 02:36 PM
Which ex-White Sox player do you think will draw more boos in the upcoming season? We all know Sosa will get his share of boos but will Sox fans boo him more than former fan favorite Magglio Ordonez?

WhteSox725
01-28-2005, 02:39 PM
Which ex-White Sox player will get more boos from Sox fans this upcoming season? We all know Sosa will get his share of boos but will they outnumber boos given to former fan favorite Magglio Ordonez?

chaz171
01-28-2005, 02:42 PM
Ah,,, Call it nostagia, but I still will have to boo Shammy a bit more than Magglio. just for old times sake if not for him being a bigger jerk.....

SAVVY18
01-28-2005, 02:48 PM
I will Boo Roid Boy much more than Maggs. Maggs is an idiot for not signing the contract a few years ago and having Bore-ass as his agent, but that is nothing compared to what Sham-me is and represents.

Tekijawa
01-28-2005, 02:49 PM
Half the Cubs fans will still cheer for the guy next year... I alone will boo maggs more then they could ever boo Sammy!

MRKARNO
01-28-2005, 02:49 PM
If Maggs goes to the Tigers, Maggs will draw more boos because we play them at the Cell 7 more times than the Cubs. :)

MRKARNO
01-28-2005, 02:51 PM
Happy Birthday Jermaine!
Happy Birthday Maggs!

idseer
01-28-2005, 03:00 PM
Which ex-White Sox player do you think will draw more boos in the upcoming season? We all know Sosa will get his share of boos but will Sox fans boo him more than former fan favorite Magglio Ordonez?

magglio just disappointed all his chicago fans.

sosa is a dispicable person.

no contest!

SOXintheBURGH
01-28-2005, 03:13 PM
Today I woke up and was watching tv, forget which channel.. but they had a scrolling bar at the bottom showing Birthdays.


WHITE SOX OF - MAGGLIO ORDONEZ, 31

FightingBillini
01-28-2005, 03:16 PM
Hey, and they're both chronically injured, too! I need my blankie and nightlight now...

No, Dye is not chronically injured. He had two unrelated freak injuries.

npdempse
01-28-2005, 03:23 PM
magglio just disappointed all his chicago fans.

sosa is a dispicable person.

no contest!

Exactly. Maggs would need a complete personality makeover from his quiet, friendly self. Perhaps after some steroids and wife-beating he could be in Sammy's league.

JoseCanseco6969
01-28-2005, 03:23 PM
magglio just disappointed all his chicago fans.

sosa is a dispicable person.

no contest!

Yeah but Ordonez has potential to be more hated because Sosa didnt disappoint us, Ordonez did. All sosa did was get popular with the Cubs and yes is a jerk etc. Ordonez was our beloved star and he shoved it up our rears.
I for one will be booing Ordonez more especially since booing sosa is a Cubs fan thing to do these days.

OurBitchinMinny
01-28-2005, 03:26 PM
sosa hands down. If Im ever at comiskey when maggs is there, im cheering. sosa cheats. Maggs was the sox best player for the last 4 or 5 years. Sosa gave the sox nothing. He was crappy here and although he has put up some impressive numbers (with a little help) hes a prick

SOXintheBURGH
01-28-2005, 03:27 PM
Some people still actually like Sosa, somehow... Tough call.

idseer
01-28-2005, 03:27 PM
Yeah but Ordonez has potential to be more hated because Sosa didnt disappoint us, Ordonez did. All sosa did was get popular with the Cubs and yes is a jerk etc. Ordonez was our beloved star and he shoved it up our rears.
I for one will be booing Ordonez more especially since booing sosa is a Cubs fan thing to do these days.

i understand your point of view, but the question was who do you HATE more, not who will you BOO more. and while i don't hate either one .... if i DID i believe i would lean heavily toward sosa.

OurBitchinMinny
01-28-2005, 03:28 PM
No, Dye is not chronically injured. He had two unrelated freak injuries.

Neither is ordonez. He was fine until last year. I blame willie harris for everything. If it wasnt for willie harris maggs would have been healthy and resigned. Well ok im just kidding

JoseCanseco6969
01-28-2005, 03:38 PM
i understand your point of view, but the question was who do you HATE more, not who will you BOO more. and while i don't hate either one .... if i DID i believe i would lean heavily toward sosa.

sorry, i guess I kinda got off topic, but yeah I think Ordonez is proving to be an easier person to hate especially for me since he actually was my favorite player for the last few years. He just screwed the Sox and their fans over much more than Sosa has ever done to us. So to answer the question simply, Ordonez is more hated in my book.

Jerko
01-28-2005, 03:39 PM
I can't see this even being close. Sox fans will always, no matter what, boo Sosa more than anyone. I know a lot of Sox fans are upset with Maggs but I can't see the level of hatred anywhere near that of what we feel towards the Scammer.

Rocklive99
01-28-2005, 03:52 PM
Woah, that is pretty weird

Chrisaway
01-28-2005, 03:55 PM
Sosa easily. He's got Cubs and Sox fans booing him now. Ordonez only has some of us booing him.

JKryl
01-28-2005, 04:06 PM
Corky, oops, I mean Sammy, of course. He has 10 years of Scrubdom behind him. Plus, he likes to talk trash. I guess Mags is happy now that he never learned English.

bafiarocks03
01-28-2005, 04:21 PM
HAPPY BIRTHDAY MAGGLIO AND JERMAINE!!!

:bandance: :bandance: :happybday :bandance: :bandance:

ND_Sox_Fan
01-28-2005, 04:36 PM
Between Maggs at that money and Higgenson in the outfield they'll be paying abotu 28 Million dollars for about 40 Rbi between the two...

Don't forget that they just got Dean Palmer's enormous salary off of their payroll, so they are now looking for the next guy they can pay to go on the DL for 2-3 years.

I think they did invite Dean Palmer to ST this year as a non-roster invitee.

pinwheels3530
01-28-2005, 04:36 PM
Sammy Sosa because he wears that Cubs uniform!!

santo=dorf
01-28-2005, 04:41 PM
Sammy Sosa because he wears that Cubs uniform!!

If he's traded, I won't really care what he does, but I would rather see him play well in another uniform just to see Cubs fans flip-flop back to "I told you we should've never traded Sammy!" I can also see Sammy bad mouthing the Cubs if he has a good season too.

marlins03
01-28-2005, 04:45 PM
I cant stand that damn sosa

bigfoot
01-28-2005, 05:06 PM
With just a bit of luck, Maggs will sign with Houston and we'll be able to cheer him as he beats the Cubs, again!

Hate Sosa? Laugh maybe, but hate.... why waste the energy on such a team of losers?

chaz171
01-28-2005, 05:20 PM
Chaz:

Keep in mind Dombrowski won a World series with Florida and built the Expos minor league system to incredibly high status.

Something a tad more then any Sox G.M. have been able to do since 1991.

Lip

Well, the expos have won......nothing.


The Florida marlins with that budget could have had Hawk Harrelson as their GM and won the WS. I don't See overspending to buy a WS title as credentiality......

They couldn't sell that football stadium out that year with an allstar line up and everyone was traded away for a concotion of stiffs. so they went right back in the toilet.

StillMissOzzie
01-28-2005, 06:03 PM
Here's the Detroit Free Press take on it.
http://www.detnews.com/2005/tigers/0501/28/H01-73204.htm

There will undoubtedly be an insurance policy here, and one subject for discussion will be if the amount premium gets deducted from the contract value (my feeling, not the article's).

I'm sure that the Tigers WANT to get insurance to cover a career-threatening injury like this, so I would not be surprised if not getting it ends up being a deal-breaker here. Getting it may be a BIG problem with the pre-existing condition. I would not be surprised to learn that IRod's voidable years deal was BECAUSE it was uninsurable.

OTOH, the downside is offset by voidable years. Here's a hypothetical example:

Insured: Insurance pays 80% of contract upon career-ending injury
Voidable Years: 5 year deal, but last 3 are voidable upon career-ending injury

If we ignore the time value of money, the Insured option costs the Tigers 20% of the contract, where under Voidable Years, the Tigers pay 40% of the contract. Not entirely equivalent, but reduces the risk.

SMO
:gulp:

Ol' No. 2
01-28-2005, 06:10 PM
I'm sure that the Tigers WANT to get insurance to cover a career-threatening injury like this, so I would not be surprised if not getting it ends up being a deal-breaker here. OTOH, the downside is offset by voidable years. Here's a hypothetical example:

Insured: Insurance pays 80% of contract upon career-ending injury
Voidable Years: 5 year deal, but last 3 are voidable upon career-ending injury

If we ignore the time value of money, the Insured option costs the Tigers 20% of the contract, where under Voidable Years, the Tigers pay 40% of the contract.Except the premium on the insurance would be prohibitive (assuming anyone would be crazy enough to insure it). That doesn't sound like a viable option to me. Who knows the details of I-Rod's contract? I thought they could void everything after the first year.

StillMissOzzie
01-28-2005, 06:13 PM
Anyone else find it ironic that our old RF and our new RF share the same b-day?

The fact that they both play RF does make it extra-spooky, but IIRC, Jeff Bagwell and The Big Hurt also share the same identical date of birth.

SMO
:gulp:

Edit: Yep, 5/27/68

StillMissOzzie
01-28-2005, 06:33 PM
Except the premium on the insurance would be prohibitive (assuming anyone would be crazy enough to insure it). That doesn't sound like a viable option to me. Who knows the details of I-Rod's contract? I thought they could void everything after the first year.

I agree on the prohibitve premium, #2, especially the part about anyone being crazy enough to do it. That's why I feel that it may not be technically uninsurable, it is for all practical purposes. The value of the claim would be dangerously close to the premium!

Per dugoutdollars.blogspot.com, here's what I found out about IRod's contract:
On the DL for 35 days in '04,'05: Deal terminates after 2005 with a $5M buyout
On the DL for 35 days in '06: Deal terminates after 2006 with a $4M buyout
(I also thought that the DL stint had to involve his chronic back problems)
The Tigers hold a $13M option for 2008 (with $3M deferred to 2012), which I'm sure they'll exercise. Also interesting is that appx $3.65M is in incentives like MVP, All-Star game, Silver Slugger, post-season MVP(s).

SMO
:gulp:

Jerome
01-28-2005, 06:45 PM
:smokin::smokin::smokin::smokin::smokin::smokin:



The Tigers spent how much money on Maggs and Percival?

Was it more or less than we spent on Hernandez, Iguchi, Pierzynski, etc.?


Dombrowski = :bong:

Viva Medias B's
01-28-2005, 06:51 PM
Other than Pudge and possibly Guillen?

And Carlos Peņa.

WhiteSoxFan84
01-28-2005, 07:16 PM
I just have one thing to say....

Hollandsworth in LF
Patterson in CF
Sosa in RF.

GO TIGERS!

Fredsox
01-28-2005, 07:46 PM
Well, the expos have won......nothing.


The Florida marlins with that budget could have had Hawk Harrelson as their GM and won the WS. I don't See overspending to buy a WS title as credentiality......

They couldn't sell that football stadium out that year with an allstar line up and everyone was traded away for a concotion of stiffs. so they went right back in the toilet.

For the record, I am willing to overspend to buy a WS title.

PaleHoseGeorge
01-28-2005, 07:53 PM
For the record, I am willing to overspend to buy a WS title.

Haven't you heard? They put an asterisks next to your team's name in the record book if you overspend. Oh, wait...

voodoochile
01-28-2005, 08:25 PM
Haven't you heard? They put an asterisks next to your team's name in the record book if you overspend. Oh, wait...

You know in fairness, they should start adding asterisks to teams that are "low budget" teams that win it all. Better yet, put them in bold, italics and underlined in the record books. That way everyone could oooh and aaaahhh over the neer-do-wells who did well...

Viva Medias B's
01-28-2005, 08:33 PM
Magglio when he was with us: Anakin Skywalker
Magglio after he hired Scott Boras: Darth Vader

Paid Santiago
01-28-2005, 08:40 PM
Hard to imagine some of the success Dombrowski has had in that short
a time period. I will say this, he has a WS Ring because of $$$$$$$
and was lucky to be able to have Filled Every Hole he had that year
with Free Agent Signings

I will also say this, with alot of the trades Dombrowski made the following years in his tenure as Marlins Gm, he built a good minor league system which is evident in the team's current roster.

:o: I just sonned this kat, call me his father.

Realist
01-28-2005, 08:43 PM
If Maggs were "all better" now, wouldn't he sort of be a medical miracle to the American medical community? It seems to me that articles of his signing a long term contract for big bucks with a baseball team would be accompanied by articles describing this fabulous procedure they've come up with in Austria and how America needs to start catch up.

zach074
01-28-2005, 08:53 PM
Sammy Sosa because he wears that Cubs uniform!!

What if my worse nightmare comes true and Mags is wearing a Cubs uniform?

PaleHoseGeorge
01-28-2005, 09:14 PM
What if my worse nightmare comes true and Mags is wearing a Cubs uniform?

Personally I'll be happy when Magglio finally signs with ANYBODY just so we don't have to wade through 2000 posts about the fear he might sign with the Flubs. The "stalking Magglio" thread could easily have 500 posts if anyone on the mod staff was motivated enough to move all of them.

:o:

Brian26
01-28-2005, 09:29 PM
Between Maggs at that money and Higgenson in the outfield they'll be paying abotu 28 Million dollars for about 40 Rbi between the two...

Say what you want about Higgenson, but he had about 15 rbi against us in a one week period last July.

Lip Man 1
01-28-2005, 09:46 PM
Chaz:

How many teams have tried to buy a World Series title? How many succeeded? Answer: Very few...Dombrowski still had to convince all those guys to sign with a team that until then did nothing and proved nothing didn't he?

Montreal didn't win anything but they produced some incredible talent...they couldn't keep it because they refused to pay for it. That wasn't Dombrowski fault, he was simply the minor league director.

Mickster:

This has nothing to do with anti-Sox bashing. This has to do with defending the record of Dave Dombrowski.

Get back to me when the Sox actually win something of consequence and we'll talk OK? (Hopefully I'll still be alive...)

Lip

batmanZoSo
01-28-2005, 09:49 PM
I agree. That is why I say he has worked out privately for Detroit. No team in their right mind would give him Vlad territory type of money if they did not know he was healthy. Detroit couldn't be THAT stupid, could they?

Hm. Are we talking about the same team who's sucked hardcore year in and year out basically since they won it all 20 years ago? Then I believe they could be.

All I can say is good for Maggs. You're a lucky, lucky guy if this goes down.

Viva Medias B's
01-28-2005, 11:01 PM
If Maggs were "all better" now, wouldn't he sort of be a medical miracle to the American medical community? It seems to me that articles of his signing a long term contract for big bucks with a baseball team would be accompanied by articles describing this fabulous procedure they've come up with in Austria and how America needs to start catch up.

Maybe he saw Benny Hinn.

Fake Chet Lemon
01-29-2005, 12:17 AM
I see no reason to worry about players that don't have a knee. Maggs and Scott Boras can go to the moon for all I care. The moon, Detroit, or the Cubs. Makes no difference to me.:tongue:

bc2k
01-29-2005, 01:28 AM
does anyone think Magglio was using something.


http://ia.imdb.com/media/imdb/01/I/36/74/68m.jpg
It's Trimspa, Baby! (http://www.trimspa.com/main/anna.shtml?annaweb)

http://queerbar.com/20021210/1003.jpg
Magglio would look luxurious in Cubbie Blue. I'd "come out" to Wrigley to see him score.

HebrewHammer
01-29-2005, 03:04 AM
I miss Ordobez.

We all miss Ordobez.

SomebodyToldMe
01-29-2005, 03:08 AM
We all miss Ordobez.

And I thought I was the only one!

::brushes off custom-made Ordobez jersey::

mike squires
01-29-2005, 04:54 AM
I have a feeling it will be a mixed reaction for Maggs. I got both Maggs and Sammy's autograph on balls. Magg's is still out on my shelves. Sosa? He's in the closet...does that answer your question? :D:

Cubbiesuck13
01-29-2005, 05:21 AM
I have a feeling it will be a mixed reaction for Maggs. I got both Maggs and Sammy's autograph on balls. Magg's is still out on my shelves. Sosa? He's in the closet...does that answer your question? :D:

SoSo is in the closet! Someone should post a poll to decide if that will be the next thing to come out of SoSo's camp. Remember that rumor a while back about the gay baseball player on the east coast?

hose
01-29-2005, 07:08 AM
It will be real hard for me to ever boo Maggs . The only way I could see myself doing it is if Ordonez rips Ozzie, Sox fans or the team in the media, then the gloves come off. If he wants to rip Reinsdorf or KW then I can live with that.

Sosa's act is always boo worthy.

gosox41
01-29-2005, 09:43 AM
Half the Cubs fans will still cheer for the guy next year... I alone will boo maggs more then they could ever boo Sammy!


Half the Cubs fans will still think Sosa is on the Cubs in '05.



Bob

SpammySosa
01-29-2005, 10:51 AM
Yeah but Ordonez has potential to be more hated because Sosa didnt disappoint us, Ordonez did. All sosa did was get popular with the Cubs and yes is a jerk etc. Ordonez was our beloved star and he shoved it up our rears.
I for one will be booing Ordonez more especially since booing sosa is a Cubs fan thing to do these days.

Sosa's sins should disappoint anyone who is a fan of baseball,not just Cubs haters. By using corked bats,steroids,putting on his false humility front,etc he gave a big middle finger to the integrity of the game. Though I don't give Scrubs fans and media much credit anyway, it still amazes me that they turned blind eyes for all of those years to the aforementioned offenses because of his perceived valueto the team/city. The funny thing is the Scrubs fans/media are hanging him out to dry for leaving that game early,etc when it was clearly represenative of what kind of person he has been his whole career.
As for Ordonez,yes,I am disappointed that greed has become a high priority,but that pales in comparison to Sosa's laundry list of indiscretions. Magglio's integrity as a player can not be questioned.He showed up and played hard his whole Sox career.That won't be forgotten because of a character flaw. If we were to boo every greedy player that stepped up to the plate...

SOXintheBURGH
01-29-2005, 11:25 AM
Hey Stockdale...what's with the pic of Disraeli?

:redneck

It's from Family Guy.

chaz171
01-29-2005, 11:37 AM
I am a bit concerned about one thing.... How long will it take Magglio to adapt from Churros to Baby Pan pizzas?

http://mexico.udg.mx/cocina/panaderia/imagenes/churros.jpg


http://www.gr-littlecaesars.com/graphics/coming.gif

DumpJerry
01-29-2005, 01:01 PM
Sammy is a cheater. Always was. Always will be. Maggs was only greedy. No different from 90% of the other players in the league.

Fake Chet Lemon
01-29-2005, 01:55 PM
Sam-ME should get more boos. Maggs and Boras are greedy. But Sam-ME is a greedy, juicing, corker. But be prepared for all the north side tools who come to the cell to Cheer for sam-ME with the O's. Fortunately they'll leave disappointed when they find out that other people attend games because they love baseball, not ivy and lame yuppie neighborhood bars.

GiveMeSox
01-29-2005, 03:25 PM
This is from rotoworld.

The Tigers and agent Scott Boras continued to discuss Magglio Ordonez yesterday. The two sides are close on dollars, the Detroit Free Press reports.

While the salary might be right -- $11 million-$12 million per seasons -- the years still aren't. Boras wants seven and the Tigers are offering five. With the Sammy Sosa acquisition taking the Orioles out of the mix and the Rangers' interest cooling, five years could be enough. The Cubs could choose to get involved with Sosa out of the way, but indications are that they're going in a different direction.

MRKARNO
01-29-2005, 03:27 PM
:rolling::rolling: :rolleyes::rolleyes:

HoustonAstros967
01-29-2005, 03:27 PM
I'm glad that the cubs may not get him. Not only will the cubs loose Sammy they won't get a good replacement like maggs. The Sox are gonna reign supreme in Chicago!

HoustonAstros967
01-29-2005, 03:30 PM
Corollary question: which is better... Maggs on the Cubs, or Maggs on the Tigers?

I'm gonna say tigers just because that means that the cubs will be worse. The cubs are ditching Sammy and even tho he isn't very good he still can put up some homeruns. The cubs are definitely screwed!

shingo3
01-29-2005, 03:40 PM
It doesnt matter to me where he ends up as long as he doesnt go to the north side otherwise i will neither cheer or boo him.

ja1022
01-29-2005, 03:43 PM
I've posted this on a couple of Ordonez threads already but...Steve Phillips (former Mets GM) reported on ESPN radio this morning that the figures were five years at $55 million. He also reported that because of this, the Cubs were trying to push through the Sosa deal so they could take a shot at Maggs. Now it appears that Huff might be available to the Cubs from Tampa Bay.

RKMeibalane
01-29-2005, 06:47 PM
Well if anyone hits one down the first base line at Comerica, it's going to go for a triple or an inside the park homer.

I can see it now: Paul Konerko lines one into the rightfield corner and ends up with an inside-the-park home run. If this happens, we will know that Maggs is finished.

RKMeibalane
01-29-2005, 06:52 PM
Magglio when he was with us: Anakin Skywalker
Magglio after he hired Scott Boras: Darth Vader

That's an insult to Darth Vader. Besides, Vader hunted down and killed any remaining Jedi that he encountered. Do you really think Maggs is going to be able to hurt the Sox anywhere near as badly? I doubt it.

SOXintheBURGH
01-29-2005, 07:50 PM
That's an insult to Darth Vader. Besides, Vader hunted down and killed any remaining Jedi that he encountered. Do you really think Maggs is going to be able to hurt the Sox anywhere near as badly? I doubt it.

Well put. If anything he is Darth Maul.. looks threatening and all, but will be easily vanquished by these guys:

:burly

:hurt

Clement's beard
01-29-2005, 11:33 PM
This will garner no media attention at all. Phil Rogers wrote about it on ESPN and Mark Giangreco just mentioned the cubs are going to work him out. Good times ahead in the coming week.

santo=dorf
01-29-2005, 11:40 PM
somewhere in Detroit....

:borass:
"I don't know if you have heard the news, but the Cubs have offered Magglio 10 years, $114 million. Do you guys still need someone to market for your all-star game? It'll only cost you 8 years $132 million."

Clement's beard
01-29-2005, 11:44 PM
somewhere in Detroit....

:borass:
"I don't know if you have heard the news, but the Cubs have offered Magglio 10 years, $114 million. Do you guys still need someone to market for your all-star game? It'll only cost you 8 years $132 million."

Yup, let the Boras BS begin.

SOXSINCE'70
01-29-2005, 11:59 PM
I hope Gagglio falls flat on his huge ego.:angry: :angry: :angry:

Who knows if the loser can even walk,hit,or play the field?? :rolleyes: :rolleyes:

Hitmen77
01-30-2005, 09:45 AM
The Trib is kicking the "Maggs to the Cubs" stories in high gear again now that it looks like the Shammy trade will happen. I hope he goes anywhere but the Cubs. If he signs with the Cubs, prepare for a media/Cub fan onslaught of how great of a steal from the Sox this is.

Ol' No. 2
01-30-2005, 11:50 AM
somewhere in Detroit....

:borass:
"I don't know if you have heard the news, but the Cubs have offered Magglio 10 years, $114 million. Do you guys still need someone to market for your all-star game? It'll only cost you 8 years $132 million."That's the way I read this, too. You gotta take your hat off to the guy. He knows how to pump the market. Any Detroit offer almost certainly contains out clauses similar to the ones in Rodriguez' contract. Boras may be using the Cubs to get Dombrowski to give more guaranteed money. I don't think Hendry is dumb enough to fall for this. Somebody is going to get suckered.

Lip Man 1
01-30-2005, 01:33 PM
I found this to be interesting and significant. From Phil Rogers column in the Tribune Sunday:

"Boras reportedly is offering teams a little protection to ease concerns about the left knee that has required surgery twice in the last seven months. It's likely that Ordonez's eventual contract will include a clause offering to reduce future salaries significantly, if not void the deal altogether, if he encounters serious problems with the left knee during 2005."


That sounds very reasonable to me.

Lip

PaleHoseGeorge
01-30-2005, 02:39 PM
That sounds very reasonable to me.


LOL! It sounds reasonable to you but it sounds DESPERATE to me. That's exactly the kind of clause Magglio/Boras wouldn't even consider... until now.

:roflmao:

voodoochile
01-30-2005, 03:35 PM
LOL! It sounds reasonable to you but it sounds DESPERATE to me. That's exactly the kind of clause Magglio/Boras wouldn't even consider... until now.

:roflmao:

It's the DKC - the Diminished Knee Clause...:wink:

PaleHoseGeorge
01-30-2005, 03:49 PM
It's the DKC - the Diminished Knee Clause...:wink:

:maggs
"No tengo dinero! No No No No!"

:cool:

FarWestChicago
01-30-2005, 04:14 PM
LOL! It sounds reasonable to you but it sounds DESPERATE to me. That's exactly the kind of clause Magglio/Boras wouldn't even consider... until now.

:roflmao:Anything one of Lip's guys says sounds reasonable to him. His lack of objectivity when it comes to his boys is beyond laughable. :nod:

:windsock: :borass:

Lip's always got our back, no matter what!! :thumbsup:

SOX ADDICT '73
01-30-2005, 04:15 PM
OK. I've been stewing about this for a while. I have a confession to make: the Lord may strike me dead for saying this, but, unlike 99% of the folks who post on this site, I don't hate the Cubs. Now, before you get out the pitchforks and torches, let me explain. I don't hate the Cubs because I simply don't care about them. Not one bit. Not any more or less than I care about the Mets or Dodgers. We don't compete with the Cubs for anything other than the affection of some misguided fans and media folk here in Chicago. Too many Sox fans get caught up with the competition between the two teams, seemingly oblivious to the fact that it's completely meaningless when it comes to real, measurable success. I actually have heard friends say, "I don't care that we lost the division, as long as we beat the Cubs." What kind of attitude is that? The only teams I care about, besides my beloved White Sox, are the Twins, Indians, Tigers, and Royals. Those are the teams we compete with for our division, and we play them FAR more than just six times a season.

I also have been a Magglio Ordonez fan, and while I hate the way he treated the Sox last year, I also don't wish him any ill will. Therefore, if my desire is for Maggs to be healthy, then I'd rather not see him smack us around 19 times a year (we seem to have enough trouble with the Tigers as is). In fact, as a fan, I wouldn't mind seeing him play on the North Side where I can continue to follow his career. Remember, I DON'T CARE about the Cubs, win or lose, so it wouldn't matter to me that a healthy Maggs might help them.

There. I'm out of the closet as a "Sox fan Magglio fan non Cub hater." If this gets me flamed or banned, then so be it.

However, if Ordonez isn't healthy, I hope Detroit signs him for 7 years at $100 million, and that it handcuffs their organization for the better part of a decade.

Lip Man 1
01-30-2005, 09:55 PM
The point is Detroit can make this signing WITHOUT a large risk (assuming the comment from Rogers is true...)

They have very little to lose and a big potential upside.

Lip

PaleHoseGeorge
01-30-2005, 10:07 PM
The point is Detroit can make this signing WITHOUT a large risk (assuming the comment from Rogers is true...)

They have very little to lose and a big potential upside.



Magglio could have saved himself from sweaty palms and a lots of gastrointestinal flatulence if he had simply entertained a similar offer from the Sox two months ago. Getting DESPERATE makes people more willing to be reasonable in their negotiating stance.
:cool:

:maggs
"No ten-go di-ner-o! No-No-No-No!"

SpammySosa
01-30-2005, 10:22 PM
OK. I've been stewing about this for a while. I have a confession to make: the Lord may strike me dead for saying this, but, unlike 99% of the folks who post on this site, I don't hate the Cubs. Now, before you get out the pitchforks and torches, let me explain. I don't hate the Cubs because I simply don't care about them. Not one bit. Not any more or less than I care about the Mets or Dodgers. We don't compete with the Cubs for anything other than the affection of some misguided fans and media folk here in Chicago. Too many Sox fans get caught up with the competition between the two teams, seemingly oblivious to the fact that it's completely meaningless when it comes to real, measurable success. I actually have heard friends say, "I don't care that we lost the division, as long as we beat the Cubs." What kind of attitude is that? The only teams I care about, besides my beloved White Sox, are the Twins, Indians, Tigers, and Royals. Those are the teams we compete with for our division, and we play them FAR more than just six times a season.
I also have been a Magglio Ordonez fan, and while I hate the way he treated the Sox last year, I also don't wish him any ill will. Therefore, if my desire is for Maggs to be healthy, then I'd rather not see him smack us around 19 times a year (we seem to have enough trouble with the Tigers as is). In fact, as a fan, I wouldn't mind seeing him play on the North Side where I can continue to follow his career. Remember, I DON'T CARE about the Cubs, win or lose, so it wouldn't matter to me that a healthy Maggs might help them.
There. I'm out of the closet as a "Sox fan Magglio fan non Cub hater." If this gets me flamed or banned, then so be it.
However, if Ordonez isn't healthy, I hope Detroit signs him for 7 years at $100 million, and that it handcuffs their organization for the better part of a decade.

Put him in the Roadhouse! :wink: I respect your opinion,even if mine greatly differs. When I was growing up,if you loved the Sox,you hated the Cubs and vice versa. And if you claimed to like both,then you were a fan of neither. For me, it is a beloved Chicago baseball tradition that goes hand in hand with having a polish and a beer,singing along with Nancy when she plays "NA,NA,NA NA...",etc. First and foremost, I want the Sox to win and their divisional rivals to lose. But my 2nd favorite team is anyone who beats the Cubs. A Cubs loss is sweet, but a Sox win will always be sweeter.
As for Maggs, I loved the hard work and dedication he showed during his tenure with the Sox. I am disappointed with his greediness, but I will always appreciate what he contributed while he was here. I wish him well wherever he ends up('cept when playing the Sox),but I must admit,like some others,I would cringe to see him in a Scrubs uniform.

Baby Fisk
01-31-2005, 12:22 PM
OK. I've been stewing about this for a while. I have a confession to make: the Lord may strike me dead for saying this, but, unlike 99% of the folks who post on this site, I don't hate the Cubs. Now, before you get out the pitchforks and torches, let me explain. I don't hate the Cubs because I simply don't care about them. Not one bit. Not any more or less than I care about the Mets or Dodgers. We don't compete with the Cubs for anything other than the affection of some misguided fans and media folk here in Chicago. Too many Sox fans get caught up with the competition between the two teams, seemingly oblivious to the fact that it's completely meaningless when it comes to real, measurable success. I actually have heard friends say, "I don't care that we lost the division, as long as we beat the Cubs." What kind of attitude is that? The only teams I care about, besides my beloved White Sox, are the Twins, Indians, Tigers, and Royals. Those are the teams we compete with for our division, and we play them FAR more than just six times a season.

Appalling! :cool:

Seriously tho, a lot of the hate bred for the Cubs comes from having them shoved in Sox fans' faces by the local media and the curse-peddlers at ESPN, as well as from personal interaction with arrogant & ignorant Cub fans (or is that ignorant & arrogant Cub fans?).

As for the Tigers 5 yr/$70 M offer, that is insane. :nuts:

Just my two bits on this subject.

Palehose13
01-31-2005, 12:30 PM
OK. I've been stewing about this for a while. I have a confession to make: the Lord may strike me dead for saying this, but, unlike 99% of the folks who post on this site, I don't hate the Cubs. Now, before you get out the pitchforks and torches, let me explain. I don't hate the Cubs because I simply don't care about them. Not one bit. Not any more or less than I care about the Mets or Dodgers. We don't compete with the Cubs for anything other than the affection of some misguided fans and media folk here in Chicago. Too many Sox fans get caught up with the competition between the two teams, seemingly oblivious to the fact that it's completely meaningless when it comes to real, measurable success. I actually have heard friends say, "I don't care that we lost the division, as long as we beat the Cubs." What kind of attitude is that? The only teams I care about, besides my beloved White Sox, are the Twins, Indians, Tigers, and Royals. Those are the teams we compete with for our division, and we play them FAR more than just six times a season.

I also have been a Magglio Ordonez fan, and while I hate the way he treated the Sox last year, I also don't wish him any ill will. Therefore, if my desire is for Maggs to be healthy, then I'd rather not see him smack us around 19 times a year (we seem to have enough trouble with the Tigers as is). In fact, as a fan, I wouldn't mind seeing him play on the North Side where I can continue to follow his career. Remember, I DON'T CARE about the Cubs, win or lose, so it wouldn't matter to me that a healthy Maggs might help them.

There. I'm out of the closet as a "Sox fan Magglio fan non Cub hater." If this gets me flamed or banned, then so be it.

However, if Ordonez isn't healthy, I hope Detroit signs him for 7 years at $100 million, and that it handcuffs their organization for the better part of a decade.

Feed him to the Lions!!!

Ok, fair enough. But what's with the sig then? :cool:

Baby Fisk
01-31-2005, 12:35 PM
Ok, fair enough. But what's with the sig then? :cool:
Maybe SA73 is being ironic? How gauche... :cool:

Lip Man 1
01-31-2005, 01:26 PM
George:

Maybe because I'm poor I can't understand the difference but to me I'd have no issues with taking 55 million even if I could have had 70 million.

To me either way Maggs is rich beyond belief.

A difference which makes no difference is no difference.

Lip

Flight #24
01-31-2005, 01:33 PM
George:

Maybe because I'm poor I can't understand the difference but to me I'd have no issues with taking 55 million even if I could have had 70 million.

To me either way Maggs is rich beyond belief.

A difference which makes no difference is no difference.

Lip

And yet, back when the Sox were offering him 5/70 with deferrals, they were "cheaping out" on him because of it......I guess 55mil & 70mil is a difference that makes no difference, but 70 with deferrals DOES make a difference over 70 without?:?:

santo=dorf
01-31-2005, 01:46 PM
And yet, back when the Sox were offering him 5/70 with deferrals, they were "cheaping out" on him because of it......I guess 55mil & 70mil is a difference that makes no difference, but 70 with deferrals DOES make a difference over 70 without?:?:

Or Scott Boras is "just doing his job" by holding out for the largest contract possible or lying to owners by telling them more teams have entered the bidding for a free agent.

Rush20
01-31-2005, 02:14 PM
I have a funny feeling about this option. Why hasn't Maggs signed with Detroit already if the deal is truly that good? Apparently he has a workout scheduled for the Cubs later this week.

I know he could be using the Cubs interview to leverage a better deal out of Detroit, however "methinks" he would love the opportunity to stick it to the SOX by signing with the Cubs. The last SOX right fielder who moved to the Cubs didn't do too bad. Unless you count rabid steroid abuse, corked bats, a selfish attitude and the alienation of your teammates and fans. :D:

All that for $50M!

PaleHoseGeorge
01-31-2005, 02:17 PM
I have a funny feeling about this option. Why hasn't Maggs signed with Detroit already if the deal is truly that good? Apparently he has a workout scheduled for the Cubs later this week.

I know he could be using the Cubs interview to leverage a better deal out of Detroit, however "methinks" he would love the opportunity to stick it to the SOX by signing with the Cubs. The last SOX right fielder who moved to the Cubs didn't do too bad. Unless you count rabid steroid abuse, corked bats, a selfish attitude and the alienation of your teammates and fans. :D:

All that for $50M!

Hey dude, what's the score?

Dub25
01-31-2005, 02:17 PM
He has not signed with the Tigers yet because Boras knows the Cubs have interest now. You know he is trying to see how much the Cubs will offer before he signs with Detroit.

Ol' No. 2
01-31-2005, 02:22 PM
He has not signed with the Tigers yet because Boras knows the Cubs have interest now. You know he is trying to see how much the Cubs will offer before he signs with Detroit.Who says the Cubs are interested? Just because Boras manages to plant a few stories in an all-too-willing Cubune doesn't mean any of it's true. Ordonez is a poor fit for a NL team, and I can't see that the Cubs can or would offer more than what Detroit is offering.

Flight #24
01-31-2005, 02:27 PM
Who says the Cubs are interested? Just because Boras manages to plant a few stories in an all-too-willing Cubune doesn't mean any of it's true. Ordonez is a poor fit for a NL team, and I can't see that the Cubs can or would offer more than what Detroit is offering.

Especially since Hendry has publicy stated that he's got no plans to attend the "workout" in SoCal. Of course, he may be just playing the percentages that it gets cancelled so that it's not a "media circus".

By the way - a great bit in the ST on the value of the Maggs "workout"

A one-day workout won't be enough to see what the Cubs would be getting in Ordonez.


During the Sox' interleague trip to Miami last June, Ordonez went through three rigorous workouts to show his knee was better. Before the series finale on June 17, he surprised the Sox by telling reporters he expected to return to the lineup in a week. It was hard to doubt him after a pretty impressive round of drills.

The next morning, though, as we retrieved our bags at the Montreal airport, Ordonez was walking with a noticeable limp. I asked him again if playing the next week was realistic.

''Oh, yeah,'' he said. Ordonez didn't play again until July 9

Which is why a medical EXAM will probably be what's required for a tem to give him any long-term deal, not just records of a surgery from September and a workout that for all you know is enabled by massive doses of morphine.

gosox41
01-31-2005, 02:30 PM
Who says the Cubs are interested? Just because Boras manages to plant a few stories in an all-too-willing Cubune doesn't mean any of it's true. Ordonez is a poor fit for a NL team, and I can't see that the Cubs can or would offer more than what Detroit is offering.

I thought the Cubs would be interested from a PR perspective. They are a great marketing company. If (and that may be a big if) Magglio is ble to play 100 games or more this year it would be a PR coup for the Cubs to get him. There's no doubt he'll produce when healthy.

Personally, I don't see the Cubs offering the kind of money the Tigers did for that long period of time. On the flip side, if Magglio was going to be 100% this year, why wouldn't he sign an incentive laden contract and then make a killing after the '05 season when he would be the premier OF free agent.


Bob

Ol' No. 2
01-31-2005, 02:31 PM
Especially since Hendry has publicy stated that he's got no plans to attend the "workout" in SoCal. Of course, he may be just playing the percentages that it gets cancelled so that it's not a "media circus".

By the way - a great bit in the ST on the value of the Maggs "workout"



Which is why a medical EXAM will probably be what's required for a tem to give him any long-term deal, not just records of a surgery from September and a workout that for all you know is enabled by massive doses of morphine.You can examine him and work him out till the cows come home. You never know what several weeks of playing will do. If I were a GM, I wouldn't even CONSIDER signing him without an ironclad escape clause. And not even then if I was in the NL.

Baby Fisk
01-31-2005, 02:48 PM
I thought the Cubs would be interested from a PR perspective. They are a great marketing company. If (and that may be a big if) Magglio is ble to play 100 games or more this year it would be a PR coup for the Cubs to get him. There's no doubt he'll produce when healthy.

Personally, I don't see the Cubs offering the kind of money the Tigers did for that long period of time. On the flip side, if Magglio was going to be 100% this year, why wouldn't he sign an incentive laden contract and then make a killing after the '05 season when he would be the premier OF free agent.

Bob

I still can't get over the length of the Tigers' offer. I don't think Ordoņez will sign with the Cubs, unless they offer something just-slightly-less than what Detroit offered. That way he can claim that he took the lesser deal in order to stay in Chicago. Hendry doesn't seem stupid enough to do that, tho, hence the Aubrey Huff rumours suddenly appearing.

Hangar18
01-31-2005, 04:17 PM
...... and he will Officially have crossed the line from Being my Favorite Player,
to My newest Most Hated Player. Sure, he gambled the SOX would give him more money, and Sure the SOX shouldve made a better EFFORT to keep him around, but now looks like this bozo will become a Cub by next monday.
the "ordonez" comes off my jersey immediately ......... :angry: :angry:

Baby Fisk
01-31-2005, 04:21 PM
PHG, I change my mind. Hangar is better at channelling a jilted 16-year-old girl than you are. Just kidding, Hangar, you wounded soul you. You should just burn the jersey and start over with a new one. :cool:

OEO Magglio
01-31-2005, 04:24 PM
...... and he will Officially have crossed the line from Being my Favorite Player,
to My newest Most Hated Player. Sure, he gambled the SOX would give him more money, and Sure the SOX shouldve made a better EFFORT to keep him around, but now looks like this bozo will become a Cub by next monday.
the "ordonez" comes off my jersey immediately ......... :angry: :angry:
Woah, Woah, Woah, the sox should've made a better effort to keep him around?? Please explain that to me.