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View Full Version : Any Excuse Not To Get Cora?


BRDSR
01-07-2005, 01:11 PM
I'm a little dissappointed with the Tribune's report this morning that the Sox are "nowhere near a deal" with Iguchi, but because part of the reasoning was the deal that went through with AJ, I'm not terribly upset about it either. I feel that plugging the hole at catcher was a much more pressing need than 2nd base. However, the Tribune also reported that the Sox are still interested in Cora, and that the 2 year, $4 million contract for Iguchi is still on the table. This makes me think that Reinsdorf is still okay with adding $2 million more to the payroll, and I don't think that it would take nearly that much to sign Cora.

Cora seems like a very good fit on the White Sox. 1) He's a veteran player who provides infield assistance at 2nd and short, which frees up Uribe to play 3rd if necessary. We then have a viable backup at every position without taking Valdez out of the minors where he should probably spend at least 1 more full season. 2) He can hit lefties. Harris cannot hit lefties for his life, and this was the biggest reason his BA and OBP suffered last year. 3, and least importantly) He's got a brother on the team, therefore enhancing the family atmosphere and general coziness of the clubhouse.

In short, I feel like Cora is a great fit for the White Sox. He gives us a lot of flexibility with the infield (probably even more than Iguchi would) and he's cheaper. At this point in the offseason it seems like he could be had for no more than the 1.3 million he was paid last season, and probably less. To me, there doesn't seem to be an excuse not to sign Cora, yet I haven't heard a whole lot on the subject out of the media. What do you all think?

SEALgep
01-07-2005, 01:16 PM
I'd like to have Iguchi, but I would be very satisfied with Cora.

OG4LIFE
01-07-2005, 01:18 PM
sure ive got a reason not to get cora, we've already got a player just like him on the team- wee willie

CHISOXFAN13
01-07-2005, 01:22 PM
sure ive got a reason not to get cora, we've already got a player just like him on the team- wee willie

The Sox still need top upgrade the MI position on this team. I assume you think Wilson Valdez is a betetr option that Cora, right?

WIllie Harris can't play shortstop. Cora can play short and second.

OG4LIFE
01-07-2005, 01:25 PM
The Sox still need top upgrade the MI position on this team. I assume you think Wilson Valdez is a betetr option that Cora, right?

WIllie Harris can't play shortstop. Cora can play short and second.
id just much rather see cairo or iguchi, thats all. we definitely need someone to platoon with willie vs lefties who isnt valdez or anyone else we have right now.

CHISOXFAN13
01-07-2005, 01:50 PM
id just much rather see cairo or iguchi, thats all. we definitely need someone to platoon with willie vs lefties who isnt valdez or anyone else we have right now.

I prefer Iguchi as well. Just not sure he can play short anymore.

OG4LIFE
01-07-2005, 02:00 PM
haha no its not that i dont like you, and i just saw and read your timeout thread, thats all.

PaleHoseGeorge
01-07-2005, 03:44 PM
This team definitely needs a middle infielder to spell Uribe and Harris... especially Harris. Valdez is no kind of option. Anyone who saw him at the plate last September knows what I'm talking about.

Now that A.J. is on the roster, a reserve infielder would appear to be the next-most important need to fill. Cora fills it nicely.
:thumbsup:

Lip Man 1
01-07-2005, 08:05 PM
Agreed except isn't his agent Scott Boras?

Lip

Jerry_Manuel
01-07-2005, 08:18 PM
Agreed except isn't his agent Scott Boras?

Lip
That's what the reporters have said, yes.

Lip Man 1
01-07-2005, 08:22 PM
Well we can cross another name off the wish list.

Lip

beckett21
01-07-2005, 08:27 PM
Well we can cross another name off the wish list.

Lip You know, you may be right. But I wouldn't be quite so sure on this one.

Remember big brother is with the Sox, and Alex Cora is not exactly Alex Rodriguez. Boras is a bear with the high-profile guys, but I think with little Alex there is only so much he has to work with extortion-wise.

I wouldn't cross him off the list yet.

Brian26
01-07-2005, 08:42 PM
A lot of people are very high on Valdez though- even Ozzie.

SoxFan48
01-07-2005, 08:56 PM
Yes, Ozzie is high on Valdez..he plays like Ozzie. We do not need another low OBP, low SLG on the roster.

OEO Magglio
01-07-2005, 08:59 PM
A lot of people are very high on Valdez though- even Ozzie.
I wouldn't be surprised to Valdez as the utility man on the roster and I really have no problem with that. We already got a couple good bats on the bench why not have a defensive win who can play 2b, ss and 3b. I like the idea of Wilson being the utility man but we'll see what happens.

johnny_mostil
01-07-2005, 09:42 PM
2) He can hit lefties. Harris cannot hit lefties for his life, and this was the biggest reason his BA and OBP suffered last year
Nobody knows if Cora can hit lefties because he's seen them 10% of the time over the last 3 years. I just don't see him as making any sense at all.

johnny_mostil
01-07-2005, 09:48 PM
Yes, Ozzie is high on Valdez..he plays like Ozzie. We do not need another low OBP, low SLG on the roster.
Valdez is fast, a good middle infielder, and he hit lefties solidly in limited at bats last year. Didn't hit RHP at all.

tsamdog
01-07-2005, 09:53 PM
Nobody knows if Cora can hit lefties because he's seen them 10% of the time over the last 3 years. I just don't see him as making any sense at all.
We're probably looking at the same numbers, but it looks like he still hit .286 over the past three years v. lefties (OBP .351 SLG .421). I would consider those numbers respectable, but why the limited duty (last year in particular)?

Milkman43
01-07-2005, 10:00 PM
Even though Cora would be a good fit, I think Willie will be fine.

johnny_mostil
01-07-2005, 10:19 PM
We're probably looking at the same numbers, but it looks like he still hit .286 over the past three years v. lefties (OBP .351 SLG .421). I would consider those numbers respectable, but why the limited duty (last year in particular)?
Just guessing, but I would suspect Cora was kept away from the Randy Johnsons of the world. At any rate, a lefty banjo hitter doesn't add to the mix. A righty banjo hitter with something to prove? That would be different.

Earl Weaver proved that you can cobble together good "virtual" ballplayers from defective part-time players if you spot them well. Ozzie's not really a dummy, he talks a lot but his actual management style is nowhere near as weird as his explanations. He'll manage it if he's got the right defective part-time players.

DickAllen72
01-07-2005, 10:46 PM
Any Excuse Not To Get Cora?


He's not that good. :dunno:

PaleHoseGeorge
01-08-2005, 08:47 AM
Valdez is fast, a good middle infielder, and he hit lefties solidly in limited at bats last year. Didn't hit RHP at all.
Reading stats off the internet back in The Lone Star state is no way to evaluate Valdez's potential at the plate, vs. lefties or righties.

You have to *see* this guy's swing. He aspires to be Chris Singleton.
:o:

:slowswing
"How many #9 hitters can we put in the line up?"

:jerry
"No problem... as long as you're versatile!"

:versatile
"How many times can I make the third out sliding into third base?"

johnny_mostil
01-08-2005, 09:04 AM
Reading stats off the internet back in The Lone Star state is no way to evaluate Valdez's potential at the plate, vs. lefties or righties.

You have to *see* this guy's swing. He aspires to be Chris Singleton.
Yeah, but Chris Singleton would still be around if he were a utility infielder, George.

Ah, the joy of the Internet! Having access to MLB's video archives through my ISP, I can see his swing. Looks like a normal middle infielder, nothing special, but nothing unusual, either.

PaleHoseGeorge
01-08-2005, 09:06 AM
Ah, the joy of the Internet! Having access to MLB's video archives through my ISP, I can see his swing. Looks like a normal middle infielder, nothing special, but nothing unusual, either.
That was his good swing. No wonder they archived it.
:redneck

johnny_mostil
01-08-2005, 09:21 AM
That was his good swing. No wonder they archived it.
:redneck
Really.

My point is, why spend two million bucks on a player (Cora) who won't get to play all that much, who isn't significantly better than Harris if at all, and who has a lot of the same weaknesses? Because the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence?

PaleHoseGeorge
01-08-2005, 09:32 AM
Really.

My point is, why spend two million bucks on a player (Cora) who won't get to play all that much, who isn't significantly better than Harris if at all, and who has a lot of the same weaknesses? Because the grass is always greener on the other side of the fence?
If the worst thing we have to argue about is whether Valdez or Cora is the more incompetent reserve infielder, I would say Kenny Williams has done quite nicely filling holes this winter.

Nuff said.
:cool:

johnny_mostil
01-08-2005, 10:18 AM
If the worst thing we have to argue about is whether Valdez or Cora is the more incompetent reserve infielder, I would say Kenny Williams has done quite nicely filling holes this winter.

Ordinarily I'd be very unhappy at the thought of the team bringing in a truckload of veterans to block minor league players, but, as we both know, there aren't any pret-a-porter players in the high minors at this point. He's built a competitive bridge to the next Clump-O-Prospects (R) far more effectively than I though possible six months ago.

FarWestChicago
01-08-2005, 10:23 AM
You have to *see* this guy's swing. He aspires to be Chris Singleton.
:o:I wonder if CLR would start a new Sloooooowswing fan club? http://www.flyingsock.com/vbulletin/images/smilies/redneck.gif

Mohoney
01-08-2005, 02:21 PM
Ordinarily I'd be very unhappy at the thought of the team bringing in a truckload of veterans to block minor league players, but, as we both know, there aren't any pret-a-porter players in the high minors at this point. He's built a competitive bridge to the next Clump-O-Prospects (R) far more effectively than I though possible six months ago.
I wholeheartedly agree with this. Our 5 outfielders are solid (I think Everett will see some outfield duty, so I'm counting him), our bullpen has been significantly revamped, and we added a legitimate starter to end the "5th starter du jour" madness. McCarthy, Sweeney, Fields, and the rest of last year's impressive Warthogs can grow in Birmingham and Charlotte and not be rushed, and guys like Diaz and Munoz won't be pressed into roles that they're not ready for.

tsamdog
01-08-2005, 02:51 PM
Just guessing, but I would suspect Cora was kept away from the Randy Johnsons of the world. At any rate, a lefty banjo hitter doesn't add to the mix. A righty banjo hitter with something to prove? That would be different.

Earl Weaver proved that you can cobble together good "virtual" ballplayers from defective part-time players if you spot them well. Ozzie's not really a dummy, he talks a lot but his actual management style is nowhere near as weird as his explanations. He'll manage it if he's got the right defective part-time players.
Interesting comment about Ozzie's managerial style. "Ozzie Ball" will have to be more than a catch phrase in 2005. Runs will have to be manufatured; pitching and defense paramount for success. IMO, the Cell will be a fun place to be. I sense a number of one run games.

johnny_mostil
01-08-2005, 03:07 PM
Interesting comment about Ozzie's managerial style. "Ozzie Ball" will have to be more than a catch phrase in 2005. Runs will have to be manufatured; pitching and defense paramount for success. IMO, the Cell will be a fun place to be. I sense a number of one run games.
I don't. I think the Sox play the way they do because their ball park makes homers. I'm hoping for a more mentally tough outfit that understands that.

tsamdog
01-08-2005, 03:39 PM
I don't. I think the Sox play the way they do because their ball park makes homers. I'm hoping for a more mentally tough outfit that understands that.I agree about the park, in general; however, I truly think that the Sox will need to manufacture more runs than in the past. Granted, in place of 3-4 35+ homer generators (Mags, PK, CLee, Frank) , the Sox have put together 6-7 20+ hitters. IMHO, I am not sold on a Frank return; foot fractures are fickle injuries, especially with a man of Frank's size and weight. I try to be optimistic, but I have my doubts. That being said, maybe we won't have as many 10 run games (followed by drought) ,but hopefully more consistent 5-6 run affairs. Consequently, with improved pitching (especially the pen) and agreeing with your Cell appraisal, the team could see a slew of 5-4, 6-5 contests. Your comment about mental toughness will be a necessity; close games require just that.

White Sox Randy
01-08-2005, 03:54 PM
The Sox are not "high" on Valdez. He is nothing - barely a major leaguer.

Alex Cora can't hit and can't steal. Other than that he's fair.

Iguchi is a big risk, hasn't played ss since 2000. He is way too expensive.

The Sox missed out on a bunch of really good utility men. I hope KW has something up his sleeve.

I am happy with our 3 starters- Crede, Uribe and Harris.
I would like a utility man with qualifications in this order:

1. Must field all 3 positions well.
2. Be a base stealer or atleast a good base runner.
3. Left handed bat
4. Can hit.

I'd settle for # 1 and move on.

johnny_mostil
01-08-2005, 07:11 PM
The Sox missed out on a bunch of really good utility men. I hope KW has something up his sleeve.

I am happy with our 3 starters- Crede, Uribe and Harris.
I would like a utility man with qualifications in this order:

1. Must field all 3 positions well.
2. Be a base stealer or atleast a good base runner.
3. Left handed bat
4. Can hit.

I'd settle for # 1 and move on.
1) No, they didn't miss any utility men, they missed starters who wouldn't have signed to be UIFs, and
2) I disagree, they need a RIGHTHANDED infielder because of Willie's inability to hit lefties.

batmanZoSo
01-08-2005, 07:48 PM
I'm a little dissappointed with the Tribune's report this morning that the Sox are "nowhere near a deal" with Iguchi, but because part of the reasoning was the deal that went through with AJ, I'm not terribly upset about it either. I feel that plugging the hole at catcher was a much more pressing need than 2nd base. However, the Tribune also reported that the Sox are still interested in Cora, and that the 2 year, $4 million contract for Iguchi is still on the table. This makes me think that Reinsdorf is still okay with adding $2 million more to the payroll, and I don't think that it would take nearly that much to sign Cora.

Cora seems like a very good fit on the White Sox. 1) He's a veteran player who provides infield assistance at 2nd and short, which frees up Uribe to play 3rd if necessary. We then have a viable backup at every position without taking Valdez out of the minors where he should probably spend at least 1 more full season. 2) He can hit lefties. Harris cannot hit lefties for his life, and this was the biggest reason his BA and OBP suffered last year. 3, and least importantly) He's got a brother on the team, therefore enhancing the family atmosphere and general coziness of the clubhouse.

In short, I feel like Cora is a great fit for the White Sox. He gives us a lot of flexibility with the infield (probably even more than Iguchi would) and he's cheaper. At this point in the offseason it seems like he could be had for no more than the 1.3 million he was paid last season, and probably less. To me, there doesn't seem to be an excuse not to sign Cora, yet I haven't heard a whole lot on the subject out of the media. What do you all think?
I'm glad we spent the most money on the catcher. It was definitely a bigger need. I don't think Harris is a starter, though, we need someone to at least platoon with him. If not Iguchi full time, get Cora or someone decent to split time with him. Harris cannot handle second and hitting every day.

longshot7
01-08-2005, 07:56 PM
I've watched Cora since he came up and while his first few years weren't too spectacular, last year he was above-average. He plays great defense, can get on base, and can steal. With the rest of our lineup set, why not? I don't have faith in Harris or Valdez.

White Sox Randy
01-08-2005, 08:55 PM
1) No, they didn't miss any utility men, they missed starters who wouldn't have signed to be UIFs, and
2) I disagree, they need a RIGHTHANDED infielder because of Willie's inability to hit lefties.
Ramon Martinez is an excellent Utility player among others no longer available.

Also, I'm more concerned about filling in for Uribe not Harris. Uribe can play second. We need someone that can play ss ! Lefty would be nice but not critical. Defense is the #1 priority.

socko82
01-09-2005, 11:10 AM
Any thoughts on Jerry Hairston Jr.? He's lost his job and I think he would look good batting #9 or #2.

johnny_mostil
01-09-2005, 11:34 AM
Any thoughts on Jerry Hairston Jr.? He's lost his job and I think he would look good batting #9 or #2.
Yeah. He might be awesome, and he's got a major Sox connection, but his 2004 OBP has "fluke" written all over it and he could be a major disaster.

JUribe1989
01-09-2005, 01:20 PM
I would consider Jerry Hairston Jr. the best option that we have to acquire. I like him much more than Iguchi or Cora. He hit .303 with a .378 obp. He has played second, third, outfield, and DH.

Chisox003
01-09-2005, 01:45 PM
Any thoughts on Jerry Hairston Jr.? He's lost his job and I think he would look good batting #9 or #2.
I always liked Hairston Jr. and I thought for sure KW would go after him this winter...He'd be an ideal #2 hitter that can bunt and run, but I havent heard anything....Has anybody?